my question is a simple one: better build your first settlement with the soldier or the pioneer?

could it also depend on the nation

for spain the soldier would be better to decimate the indians for example - do build with the pioneer? - the others should then build with the soldier?

i want to hear your opinions what is best ... cause i have no clue so far ...

9 times out of 10, settle the soldier. (at least on the middle levels and below)

Always, I repeat, always settle the pioneer.
Take the war to the other Europeans. Free colonists and they don't compete for founding fathers. They don't fight back, and a free map is much easier than a map filled with foreign scum. (Though this might be considered an exploit of the very weak AI)
Don't attack the natives until you have a few cannons and a backup dragoon.

i usually settle both, and sell 50 tools and guns to the natives for a huge profit. And then build missionaries for the money i get.
6 men after 2 trips since i sell the natives horses as well.
usually that makes all the natives so happy that they do not attack me.
PS i have yet to be attacked by natives. conquistador difficulty.

i think dutch is the best colony to play because that early merchantman really does speed up your settling by an abyssmal amount.

Always, I repeat, always settle the pioneer.
Take the war to the other Europeans. Free colonists and they don't compete for founding fathers. They don't fight back, and a free map is much easier than a map filled with foreign scum. (Though this might be considered an exploit of the very weak AI)
Don't attack the natives until you have a few cannons and a backup dragoon.

They reseed.

They reseed.

Emm, no.

They get one, maybe two extra units (more if they were able to get some stuff to the homeland or natives). But without crosses or money, they can't get back into the game.
Dunno if difficulty have an influence here.

Edit: Well, it's not quite true that they don't reseed. I believe they do automatically produce 1 cross each turn. But given how that scale, you can easily take them out. And when they come back, you should be able to take out their caravel, thus banning them effectively from the new world.

Emm, no.

They get one, maybe two extra units (more if they were able to get some stuff to the homeland or natives). But without crosses or money, they can't get back into the game.
Dunno if difficulty have an influence here.

Edit: Well, it's not quite true that they don't reseed. I believe they do automatically produce 1 cross each turn. But given how that scale, you can easily take them out. And when they come back, you should be able to take out their caravel, thus banning them effectively from the new world.

They do reseed. Start a new game and press CTRL+Z to view map. Go into CTRL+W (worldbuilder) and place a frigate next to someone else. Blow them up. They reseed. Repeat every turn. I gave up after 10 turns.

They do reseed. Start a new game and press CTRL+Z to view map. Go into CTRL+W (worldbuilder) and place a frigate next to someone else. Blow them up. They reseed. Repeat every turn. I gave up after 10 turns.

How come that in five game so far, I've killed off all Europeans then?
And they didn't come back in any of them until I was done with the WoI.

Dunno, just saying what I've seen.

I'm guessing that the ships reseed, but the colonists don't. As long as you kill off all their colonists (and missions), they stay away.

It doesn't matter that they come back, they're completely crippled by the wars.

In answering the original question, I'd suggest you settle with the soldier, then the pioneer. Though if you see an easy early land grab, settle the pioneer THEN go for the loot money/new colony/free colonist with 50 tools. I did this on my Dutch run (which I won the WoI with one turn to spare!) when I saw competition by the Spanish. I had a jesuit priest on the docks, so I immediately armed him as a dragoon and conquered Isabella without a fight. It turns out the Veteran soldiers was INSIDE the settlement. >_> Afterwards, the pioneer I captured afterwards was put into teh colony, the Veteran soldier I captured became my garrison, and the Jesuit moved on to the native settlement to preach like nothing happened.

Of course, if you're playing the French, both go on the same spot so you can start improving the land immediately. But that's just me.

Don't attack the natives until you have a few cannons and a backup dragoon.

At that point did it really matter which one you settled? The guns and/or tools are stored for later and you can pull either one out once you get someone else in the colony.

The real options are:
Settle both
Settle the soldier, have the pioneer improve land
Settle the pioneer and have the other drop off weapons and go exploring

Settling the pioneer and having the colonist go explore (without weapons) lets you take advantage of any teaching opportunities that may present themselves.

With a good base food tile the settle both lets you setup a lumberjack/carpenter to get production ramped up.

Improving the land is going to be situational but I would have to say this is the least likely option, the 1 extra resource is just not the useful early game unless you really need a farm for food.

ups - double post

Best is to settle with pioneer on a spot close to a indian village to access a res u could not acces otherwise (like a silvermine at a indian village)

with soldier either go explore - exploring and talking to those tribesman give u way more gold then everything even working a sivermine i guess.
or go wipe out some other civ - but thats really kind of cheese and could be seen as exploiting poor game mechanics - or do both conquer and keep on exploring.

Ship should be sailing back and worth like 10 times without a stop investing all the money u get from natives and ruins into cheap man

How come that in five game so far, I've killed off all Europeans then?
And they didn't come back in any of them until I was done with the WoI.

They come back eventually. I think their Caravels respawn pretty quickly after you sink them, but they have to rack up crosses for colonists, so it may take a while before they can resettle. Last game I wiped out the English when they started interfering with my expansion plans and took over all four of their towns. A great many turns later they turned up again in a single settlement on the western side of the map and never grew from there.

They come back eventually. I think their Caravels respawn pretty quickly after you sink them, but they have to rack up crosses for colonists, so it may take a while before they can resettle. Last game I wiped out the English when they started interfering with my expansion plans and took over all four of their towns. A great many turns later they turned up again in a single settlement on the western side of the map and never grew from there.


Well, you did give them time to rack up some gold, that way they can buy new colonists.
If you kill them before they can settle, they wont recover.

The best you can do is to settle both at different places. This requires at least one spot untouched by indian culture (not always possible).

i think dutch is the best colony to play because that early merchantman really does speed up your settling by an abyssmal amount.
abyssmal = abysmal
1. of or like an abyss; immeasurably deep or great.
2. extremely or hopelessly bad or severe: abysmal ignorance; abysmal poverty.

When you us it metaphorically you are using in the second sense, when you really want to say "huge" or "enormous" or "immense."

I like to settle beside a valuable resource to get my economy off to an early start. So I land the Pioneer on the resource to improve it and the Soldier beside it to found my first colony. My aim is to buy 100 horses and send two scouts out as soon as possible.

abyssmal = abysmal
1. of or like an abyss; immeasurably deep or great.
2. extremely or hopelessly bad or severe: abysmal ignorance; abysmal poverty.

When you us it metaphorically you are using in the second sense, when you really want to say "huge" or "enormous" or "immense."

us = use :lol:

Always, I repeat, always settle the pioneer.
Take the war to the other Europeans...


Yes it is very easy to take out the Europeans, but do you want to?

They always seem to start in dumb places, typically right next to a native village, and you can’t seem to raze them. So you get stuck with a city in a place you really don’t want it, plus you usually get another free colonist, which is nice.

Also there is always the chance things will go bad, for instance the natives might declare war – (-2 You declared war on a friend, -2 you stole our land).

Not saying its wrong to take out the Europeans, just not as obvious as it might first appear.

There really ought to be some game mechanic that makes it difficult to eliminate the other Europeans. Like the warriors +25% city defend. Maybe an enforced peace for the first few moves.

Yes it is very easy to take out the Europeans, but do you want to?

They always seem to start in dumb places, typically right next to a native village, and you can’t seem to raze them. So you get stuck with a city in a place you really don’t want it, plus you usually get another free colonist, which is nice.

Also there is always the chance things will go bad, for instance the natives might declare war – (-2 You declared war on a friend, -2 you stole our land).

Not saying its wrong to take out the Europeans, just not as obvious as it might first appear.

There really ought to be some game mechanic that makes it difficult to eliminate the other Europeans. Like the warriors +25% city defend. Maybe an enforced peace for the first few moves.



Emm, of course you can raze them...
The native problem is valid, and I did get DOW'ed by the Incas twice because I razed a city of English next to them (there is a bug in the game, if you raze a European city, and they have stolen the land instead of buying it, the natives think you also stole the land).

To answer the first question, I tend to settle both asap, often with one inland. I'm working up the difficulty levels from Pioneer currently, so I still have things to learn.'

One time in Pioneer mode I squashed both of the Dutch AI's original settlers and they never recovered, but usually after the first ten turns or so, they're able to bounce back. I've seen the Spanish pick fights with Indians and lose every colony, but they eventually reseed and resettle elsewhere.