The game is pretty linear as it is so i have been going around thinking about some alternative ways of winning.

The only way atm is throgh a military win. If you have enough colonists to survive you win.

But independance has been won in alternative ways through the year, heck even the other countries in the new world (in the old colo) got their independance for free, their king simply granted it.

In the BTS scenario "Charles Magne" (i think that was the name) a concept called "papal" favour was introduced. If you pleased the "papal" he would grant you various gift and ultimately victory.

This concept shouldnt be that big of a rethink to work in Colonization.
The king could issue a set of quests or requests you could choose to do. One could be to send home troops to help in a war, send a specific good back home during a shortage. Theres a lot of options really. Overall goal could be to get the king to "friendly" and simply ask for independance. This could even be something like Australia where your still apart of your old country (granting certain bonuses, more later) or completely free (other bonuses)

Or the whole concept of independance could be moved as a part goal to win. Even after you gain independance you still have those pesky neighbours. Final goal could be to found XX Colonies or eradicate/consume/whatever the other european nations. Another great BTS mod introduced historical goals. For the english that could be to win a military independance victory and to colonize 2 colonies is east, west and middle north america.

Spanish could be to ship XXXXX gold pieces back home, killing (or absorbing) all natives from south america and through that earning your independance (again more than 1 goal)

Dutch could be something around trade, maybe even something conflicting with the Spanish goals. Trading with the natives (thus emptying their reserves leaving less for the spanish?)

Frensh goal could again conflict with the English (something like colonizing north america and gaining "papal" favour)

Each goal you meat gives you bonus choice (like the "civics" you choose for your constitution (which presently is pretty useless))

im sure you guys have some inputs aswell. Goals as simple as "make sure no foreign nations are in southamerica by 1720" will do wonders for an otherwise linear game.

Starting years that are a bit more realistic could be cool aswell. The English could start out with their colony already placed in a truly location making it hard to get things running. The other nations comming a few year later at different locations.

I would say that there should be three means of gaining independence:

War (already in)
Purchase - raise enough money to buy your independence. This would mean you would also have to be powerful enough that the crown would just assume take the cash and avoid a war they'll probably lose anyway. Historical examples: Brazil.
Politics - get very chummy with the king. Contribute troops to his wars. Show him respect, and get to a point where your independence will not cause him to invade. Historical examples: Canada and Australia.

What might be a good idea is to somehow be able to make a post-independence scenario. You can win your independence, and then, if someone could mod it, you have to become the dominant force in the Western Hemisphere. You could 1) conquer the natives, 2) conquer the other Europeans, 3) achieve your other colonists' independence, 4) make your way into European diplomacy by making good relations with all the Royals. There are many other ways you could do it, but I don't even know this is possible with the current game mechanic. You'd certainly have to extend the time frame.

What might be a good idea is to somehow be able to make a post-independence scenario. You can win your independence, and then, if someone could mod it, you have to become the dominant force in the Western Hemisphere. You could 1) conquer the natives, 2) conquer the other Europeans, 3) achieve your other colonists' independence, 4) make your way into European diplomacy by making good relations with all the Royals. There are many other ways you could do it, but I don't even know this is possible with the current game mechanic. You'd certainly have to extend the time frame.
which raises the question to me what exactly a "Europe" victory in plain vanilla Civ 4 Col?

in that you cannot see the homeland you cannot invade it. apparently a "Europe" victory justs means the King's REF wipes you out???

how is this different than you winning the WoI? doesn't achieving one of these victories by definition exclude the other???

Actually, a Europe victory is not just the REF wiping you out, but any unit of the REF existing at the end of the game.

Actually, a Europe victory is not just the REF wiping you out, but any unit of the REF existing at the end of the game.
if that is true, it must be any LAND BASED REF left. I did not sink a single one of the 65 REF warships which opposed me in the game of C4C I just finished (with a victory over all the land based REF units)

a more descriptive victory condition title would be "REF alive at time limit". but that is still a victory for the REF, not you, and nobody plays the King in C4C, even in multiplayer

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does anyone have a simple mod that enables the addition of "defeating all the New World Europeans" (conquest) as a victory condition? such a mod would have to disable the default Pilgrim difficulty setting of respawning ships in Europe even though bankrupt

or domination of the New World land masses?

if that is true, it must be any LAND BASED REF left.

It is.


About the "wipe europeans out America" proposal, beside not allowing caravel and colonist respawn, it would also need the AI to be improved. As it is by now, an early strike, even with limited forces, can easily kick non-player colonies out.

How about some type of 'Support' victory condition where you get other Royals and possibly even natives on your side (possibly by quests mentioned above) and eventually through shows of power by you and your allies can scare the REF into allowing your DoI without war. Or they will invade but your allies help you (Like france helped the US in its WoI). There can be many possibilities.

Possibly, you could have some sort of 'Integration' victory where you slowly influence nearby natives/Euros so much that you join up with some of them to form and independent country and the REF might not bother attacking or send a smaller force since only part of the country is their ex-colony.

If anyone can improve these and maybe even manage to create them it woulld make the game more interesting.

JB

It is.


About the "wipe europeans out America" proposal, beside not allowing caravel and colonist respawn, it would also need the AI to be improved. As it is by now, an early strike, even with limited forces, can easily kick non-player colonies out.
Maybe there can be some kind of middle ground between Europeans respawning and just dying. Maybe they only respawn a certain number of times, or maybe you have to take some kind of action to prevent them from respawning. Maybe instead of killing them we could add Vassal States to the game and vassalise them.

I wholeheartedly support alternate paths to victory. Especially one like sucking up to the King that actually gives you a reason to kiss his ring.