What's your fav and why?

I didn't include Great Generals because the mechanics are different, their uses are all war related, and the methods to get them are different.

EDIT: Re-posted to include Great Engineers, moderated requested to remove the old poll.

GE-for Mining Inc. and Rushing a wonder

Great Scientist. It's just too easy to abuse them to get Liberalism. Most times I try to get exclusively GSs for quite a while. Maybe an Academy, Philo pop, Paper pop, double Education pop, maybe Liberalism pop. You can even go down the Scientific Method line, with Physics and Biology. Later on many great persons will be used simply for a golden age so I don't care what type they are.

In my opinion:

Best: Scientists, Engineers

Most Versatile: Merchant

Most Fun: Spy, General

One fun trick with a spy is use him to fully explore your continent if you know you'll eventually infiltrate and don't need to points right away.

I picked Great Prophet because you can harness them pretty well (IE farm them specifically without too much GPP pollution) and they're the most versatile. Earlier ones can be used to found religions, build the shrines. Later ones I always settle in one city (usually a solid production city which doubles as a gold city).

I mean, who can argue with +2:hammers: +5:gold: and +3:science: from each settled prophet. Once I had a shrine city that was running 8 priests and had settled 9 prophets and had Angkor Wat. Just my religious specialists/prophets were netting me 34:hammers:, 53:gold:, and 51:science: without modifiers!

Most Versatile: Merchant
Really? You think the Great Merchant is more versatile than the Prophet?

prophet is the least versatile... scientist is the most versatile...

You need at least three GS to grab liberalism, while one prophet can bulb Theology which can be converted in AP win even in tech deficit...

ver·sa·tile (vûrs-tl, -tl)
adj.
1. Capable of doing many things competently.
2. Having varied uses or serving many functions

Scientists can bulb, build academy, and settle for +9 :science:

Prophets can found religions via bulbing (for diplomacy purposes), build shrines (great for gold), and when settled bring 5 :gold: (only 1 less than settled merchants), production (2 :hammers: like an engineer), and a good portion of science (3 :science:) meaning they have more uses and serve more functions (that of science, wealth, AND production)

they give three beakers only under representation.

Granted I do not have much experience playing civ as of yet, but I have to say that the great artist is the GP I have the most fun with. I build an advance city near 2 rival cities and culture bomb. After 20-50 turns, I can usually get both of them to flip to me.

Scientists can also found religions by bulbing, see Philosophy. ;) And while one religion + shrine could be cool, there's a cost to founding and spreading many religions, so I don't see that as a net benefit.

they give three beakers only under representation.

... yeah? Why would you not want to run REP when you have it?

Ahhh,... I see. I'll edit my post about Great Scientist.

Why would you have it?! On most starts you won't have the Pyramids, so you won't run Representation until Constitution. That's quite a long period of time.

Why would you have it?! On most starts you won't have the Pyramids, so you won't run Representation until Constitution. That's quite a long period of time.

You can capture the 'mids sometimes if you can't build them. But Representation is mid game and comes right about when a boost to science is welcome. Besides, without rep, GS only give +6:science: which doesn't add to versatility. Simply the nature of the settled GP makes it more VERSATILE as per the dictionary definition of doing a variety of things well.

Honestly i do not want prophets after constitution. Well, may be as Golden Age fodder...

Wow... well. That's a personal choice. I personally have no idea why you wouldn't want a 10:gold: per turn (with buildings) boost with a 2:hammers: boost to production and a 5:science: (with buildings) boost to science every turn. Gather up enough of them and you can double your production in that city, and run an extra 10% on your sliders

Really? You think the Great Merchant is more versatile than the Prophet?

A Great Merchant can :

Found one of the :food: Corporation (Sid's Sushi or Cereal Mills)
Be settled to feed half a pop and bring you a lot of :gold: over time (yield is +1:food: +6:gold:)
Complete a trade mission that amounts to a huge amount of :gold:


1. and 2. allows more versatility than any other Great People, since what you do with your population is up to you (you can convert it to more :hammers:, :science:, :commerce:, :strength:, etc.). The :gold: obtained from 3. can allow you to :

Research at a deficit
Bribe another AI
Trade tech more efficiently
Upgrade an army


Thus, it seems to me that the Great Merchant is the most versatile (hell, they can also bulb techs ;)). The Great Prophet is not that versatile, not until Representation comes around. And no, you can't always build or capture the Pyramids. Even then, the +3:science: doesn't break the tie since it is applied to all settled specialists and super-specialists.

Simply the nature of the settled GP makes it more VERSATILE as per the dictionary definition of doing a variety of things well.

Ah, but we didn't agree that it does them well. :) Or well enough to surpass GSs. That's the problem, not the simple fact that a settled GP makes both money and production. And if you take versatility as simply "doing several different things" without the value of those things, then I'm not interested by it.

As for the Pyramids, I think the problem here is that we're not talking about a specific level or map. On Emperor and above even with stone you might want to skip the Pyramids for other objectives. Without stone or Industrious it would take a miracle for me to want to build them. And then on continents/hemisphere/big and small etc. maps chances are the Pyramids are on the other continent, so no way to capture them in time to make a difference with Constitution.

My favourite is great spies, but the best are great scientists.

Wow... well. That's a personal choice. I personally have no idea why you wouldn't want a 10:gold: per turn (with buildings) boost with a 2:hammers: boost to production and a 5:science: (with buildings) boost to science every turn. Gather up enough of them and you can double your production in that city, and run an extra 10% on your sliders

How about a 9:science: + 210% boost? Library 25% + Univ. 25% + Academy 50% + Oxford 100% + Free Religion 10%. Then you get Observatory (25%) and maybe some Monasteries (10% per building).

Not versatile. Specific to science. It isn't a versatile Great Person.

It's a strong science Great Person, and my second fav to pop and settle in the great science city as you describe. But, again, my original point was that the Great Prophet was the most versatile and that's why I like it best.

Monasteries are gone after SciMeth which is a tech I'm not willing to put off for too long as I will want oil for the late game. Not to mention you have to be in Free Religion to get that 10%. Also not usually willing to drop OrgRel or Theo unless going for a diplomatic vic. Representation is an all around great civic that can be utilized strongly all game long (with 'Mids) but strongly as well after Constitution (who couldn't use +3:) in top 5 cities and +3:science: for each specialist?

I guess you could say the Great Prophet really rounds itself up when operating a SE. The GS is always a welcome face to see no matter what kind of economy.

How about a 9:science: + 210% boost? Library 25% + Univ. 25% + Academy 50% + Oxford 100% + Free Religion 10%. Then you get Observatory (25%) and maybe some Monasteries (10% per building).

That's the problem with this kind of discussion : the game is too complex for statements like "The Great Prophet is the best hands down" or "Nah, the Great Scientist is". It all depends on the situation, difficulty level, diplomatic situation...

You're gunning for a Cultural Victory ? You're certainly happy to pop a Great Artist. If you're aiming for a Space Race though, you're surely disappointed of popping him (well you can still use him for a Golden Age, but still). This doesn't mean that the Great Artist is useless :rolleyes:.

"What is the best GP ?" is a question that has no absolute answer. However, "What is your favorite GP ?" we can still discuss while having a chance to learn something actually useful :mischief:

I, myself, hate popping Great Artists. Especially at 1-3% odds.

Not versatile. Specific to science. It isn't a versatile Great Person.

It's a strong science Great Person, and my second fav to pop and settle in the great science city as you describe. But, again, my original point was that the Great Prophet was the most versatile and that's why I like it best.

Yeah the Great Scientist is kinda one-dimensional : it's :science: and just :science:. However, read my post on the Great Merchant's versatilty. I'd really like to hear what you think.

Ah, but we didn't agree that it does them well. :) Or well enough to surpass GSs. That's the problem, not the simple fact that a settled GP makes both money and production.

Settled GP makes both money and production, but....

Settled Great Merchant makes both money and FOOD - Food is more versatile than production.

I am curious: Has anybody settled Great Merchants in a city with Wall Street and Globe Theater? I have not yet tried that and then settling Great Merchants and using the food to have more merchants - I think it might be fun.

Disclaimer: I am still new to the forums, but I am interested in reading and learning from these arguments.

Note: Great Merchant is not to be confused with GM. Great Merchant makes money. I am glad that I never had to build a Corporation and then have to send 1000's of :gold: to bail them out. :lol:

Pre liberalism, I want GS. After liberalism, I want GE and GM. GP I don't really want/need unless I have a good holy city or wonder spamming.

Settled GP makes both money and production, but....

Settled Great Merchant makes both money and FOOD - Food is more versatile than production.

My point exactly. And don't forget they can found the :food: corporations.

"What is the best GP ?" is a question that has no absolute answer. However, "What is your favorite GP ?" we can still discuss while having a chance to learn something actually useful

Uh... that's exactly what the thread says. And the poll... in fact, I've never asked what the Best Great Person is. Only what your favorite is.

The first GE for Mining Inc. I actually see Mining Inc as too powerful, unbalanced. (At least, if playing for domination on large maps, which I do). The offset is that GEs are very hard to generate reliably -- but that doesn't make Mining balanced, just randomly swingy.

After that, GSs are best for most of the game, though GMs surpass them in the late game.

You can always hold onto the first GE you get for Mining Inc. (if you can afford to pass up a wonder).

A Great Merchant can :

Found one of the :food: Corporation (Sid's Sushi or Cereal Mills)
Be settled to feed half a pop and bring you a lot of :gold: over time (yield is +1:food: +6:gold:)
Complete a trade mission that amounts to a huge amount of :gold:


1. and 2. allows more versatility than any other Great People, since what you do with your population is up to you (you can convert it to more :hammers:, :science:, :commerce:, :strength:, etc.). The :gold: obtained from 3. can allow you to :

Research at a deficit
Bribe another AI
Trade tech more efficiently
Upgrade an army


Thus, it seems to me that the Great Merchant is the most versatile (hell, they can also bulb techs ;)). The Great Prophet is not that versatile, not until Representation comes around. And no, you can't always build or capture the Pyramids. Even then, the +3:science: doesn't break the tie since it is applied to all settled specialists and super-specialists.

My thoughts on why I think merchant is the most useful is basically this: Nice post.

Prophets are certainly good with the mids and Wat to boost them. I'm still waiting to try that game with Egypt abusing Priests.

My favorite is the great spy. Is it the best in my opinion, NO. However it is my favorite and that is what I voted for. No matter what economy I always like to do a EE economy as well. You settle just one of these guys and you can steal several techs over the course of the game. One game where I emphasized these I settled 4 GSpy and Scotland yard and it was awesome. You can research other techs while stealing other techs so you don't get early WFYABTA on higher difficulties. Most of my games are never that lucky tho, but it is fun.

On the contrary to royal62184 I despise the Great Spy. He is commonly useless in most of my games. Great artists on the other hand are really cool because they'll get you that crucial tile your neighbor posesses, like a valuable resource or an extra cottage you can build.

My thoughts on why I think merchant is the most useful is basically this: Nice post.

Prophets are certainly good with the mids and Wat to boost them. I'm still waiting to try that game with Egypt abusing Priests.

Angkor Wat (as I have been informed) does not add to Gr Prophets only priests.

More population may bring you to work more tiles (more coastal or grassland non-riverside tiles) or if you max your tile population (20) then, you can utilize more specialists. Which is more versatile.

So I guess you're right! But 9 out of 10 times, I'd rather have the gold boost along with a guaranteed production boost. After all, if you're already working all the :hammers: tiles in your city cross, then that extra food won't net you any production. When stacking those Prophets (which is when they are truly more powerful), you get such ridiculous production along with the gold and Representation science that, I guess I get a little flustered :D

I don't really have a favourite, it varies as the game progresses. They are all good for one use or another except of course the GA which can only be used for a golden age. So I do have a least favourite, but no favourite.

Early in the game GS and GProphets are useful and GSpies and GE are hard to make anyway although very useful. Late in the game a GE and a GM gives access to the best types of corporations (production and food). GS are the best to lightbulb (+50% more beakers than the others) with but are less useful after Liberalism and Chemistry have been researched. I prefer GM, GE and GSpy in the late game.

Uh... that's exactly what the thread says. And the poll... in fact, I've never asked what the Best Great Person is. Only what your favorite is.

Sorry if I sounded aggressive : I just didn't want people to argue pointlessly on what is the best (Great People, World Wonder, etc.) since such arguments often end up in meaningless comparisons.

Other posts in this thread are very interesting and give valuable information (I didn't know about the 50% bonus :science: beakers on average for Great Scientists, for instance), so I guess I jumped the gun. My bad.:mischief:

Sorry if I sounded aggressive : I just didn't want people to argue pointlessly on what is the best (Great People, World Wonder, etc.) since such arguments often end up in meaningless comparisons.

Other posts in this thread are very interesting and give valuable information (I didn't know about the 50% bonus :science: beakers on average for Great Scientists, for instance), so I guess I jumped the gun. My bad.:mischief:

No doubt, man. I didn't know about the +1:food: for Great Merchants! It's a learning thing :D

My favorite use of a great person: culture bomb with that otherwise useless GA to put you over the land threshold for a domination win.

My favorite use of a great person: culture bomb with that otherwise useless GA to put you over the land threshold for a domination win.

Hell yeah. The one time I love seeing a GA pop is when I have 68% out of 69% and am waiting for a captured city's border to pop. An awesome way to win for sure.

No doubt, man. I didn't know about the +1:food: for Great Merchants! It's a learning thing :D
I tried once a "Settled Great Merchant Economy" after having read a War Academy thread. Basically, build a GP Farm, use a lot of merchant specialists, pop a GMs, settle them to feed a lot of merchants specialists and keep your :science: slider high. Tried it back when I played Noble, and damn it was fun !

Hell yeah. The one time I love seeing a GA pop is when I have 68% out of 69% and am waiting for a captured city's border to pop. An awesome way to win for sure.

Ludwig van Beethoven pwns u n ur base :lol:

My favorite Great Person is Great Merchant, but I like GS early in the game. Since it is easier for me to get more Scientist slots pre CS, I push them hard (Academy and Philo pop) to help me win Liberalism, even though I would take a GM otherwise.

I prefer GS early, then GE and GM battle in the mid game, then GM is my priority once I get a GE for Mining, Inc.

You can always hold onto the first GE you get for Mining Inc. (if you can afford to pass up a wonder).

That's the problem. You don't always get a "first GE". The options are, 1) Delay running scientists until you've got Metal Casting, built a forge, and run a lone engineer for long enough that your first great person is a GE. 2) Get the first two GSs from scientists as normal, then stop all GP production for a good long while so your lone engineer can build up enough points. 3) Generate the full number of great people, and just hope to get lucky.

I guess going for Pyramids and Hanging Gardens counts as an option, sometimes.

Basically, there's only one engineer slot before Steel (and good luck getting Ironworks built in your NE city in a reasonable timeframe). So the only ways to be sure of getting a GE involve some significant opportunity costs.

Does no one love great artists? Cant they bulb divine right or music?

Probably depend on time in game for which i prefer. Great scientists are so easy to get if you build Glib. Early game probably prefer a great priest for shrines or religions

Mid game GS or GE. GS for teching of liberalism. Ge to build key wonders or add to cities.

Late game maybe GE for corps. Even a GA gives you a certain corp. ;)

I really like different great people at different times. in the beginning of the game i REALLY like prophets! Just the money boost itself is usually enough to push my slider up when i settle one, or i might get lucky and get a shrine going!

After, around maces and trebs, i really like GS. They easily get me to Lib and onto Rifling!

Around the time i get rifling i LOVE GM! I usually use the one from Economics to found Sid's and get another one to do a trade mission and upgrade all those maces.

And in the end game GE are pretty amazing. Just so many great wonders can be rushed AND Mining Co. can be founded!

For Great artists and spies, i really don't care very much. They both are OK but i use them for more specific purposes.;)

The great spy is generally the best for settling.

Settled the base yields are:

Great Spy: +3:science: +12:espionage:
Great Artist: +3:gold: +12:culture:
Great Scientist: +1:hammers: +6:science:
Great Engineer: +3:hammers: +3:science:
Great Merchant: +1:food: +6:gold:
Great Prophet: +2:hammers: +5:gold:

Generally, it looks like the artist is the weakest to settle except when you're going for a cultural victory. Outside of future legendary cities, culture points don't add anything to your economy or victory unless it gives you your first border pop or makes the difference between having control over a tile. In that case, I say, why not declare war and take it by force? And when the AI builds cities 3 spaces apart, the instant, revolution-independent, multi-border pops aren't that big of a deal.

The way to make the settled great persons equal would be to assume that 1:hammers:=1:food:=2:gold:=2:science:=4:espionage: =4:culture:

Though even given that, the great scientist and great merchant are worse to settle than the great engineer, great prophet, or great spy.

But my next question is: Is :espionage: really worth half as much as :science: when you can get an equal or better research yield per point with :espionage:? Furthermore you can get better multipliers for :espionage: with less investment, which I suppose makes up for having to build spies. It looks to me like the great spy has the best yields.

fav.: ge... duh, mining is bordering overpowered... and a ge it's so dang hard to get.
best: obviously gs pre lib., gm post lib., but those thankfully are easy to get if you plan accordingly.

It looks to me like the great spy has the best yields.

Well technically, you have to factor in the :hammers: spent on spies and the fact that there actually are other rivals around to steal techs from. But I guess your point is valid in most cases. Moreover, as :espionage: can be spent either to hamper your rivals' progress (sabotage), to speed up your research (steal technology) or to conquer more land (city revolt), the spy can be considered fairly versatile.

Still, let's not forget that his usefulness is somewhat more dependent than other GP on the diplomatic situation (no fast techer around, isolated, etc.)

I like them all apart from artists. Great Engineer slightly more than others.

Regarding super specialists: The raw output of scientists is actually the weakest (barring that of artists if we don't need culture...). In practice they're still good because we can get the best early modifers on science.
I still prefer Engineers to settle since my city with the highest beaker output tends to be a bloated Bureaucratic capital rather than a dedicated science city.

Oh, I wasn't arguing that the settled GS has the best output. I'm arguing that it has a comparable output to the other great persons. And yes, how useful each great person is depends on the situation, but on Emperor+ I find that most of my games and most posted games include a GS-fueled run to Liberalism followed by war with Cuirassiers, Grenadiers, Cannons or Rifles. Thus I expect a lot of people to favor GSs. GEs are great, of course, but the low probability to get them makes me not very interested in them. Plus, in most games I will get them when I'm already Industrious and have wonder-boosting resources. I rarely spend the obtained GE on a wonder in that case.

Regarding super specialists: The raw output of scientists is actually the weakest (barring that of artists if we don't need culture...). In practice they're still good because we can get the best early modifers on science.
Very true : forges and markets come way after libraries (and cost 33% to 66% more in :hammers:)

I still prefer Engineers to settle since my city with the highest beaker output tends to be a bloated Bureaucratic capital rather than a dedicated science city.
I never settle Great Engineers (partly because they're hard to come by early). I use them to build that Wonder I'm after (the Great Library or the Pyramids usually). I also tend to consider their settled output a bit on the weak side, compared to, say, Great Prophets. Maybe now I will consider settling them in my Bureaucracy Capital to make their output 4 :hammers:

Plus, in most games I will get them when I'm already Industrious and have wonder-boosting resources. I rarely spend the obtained GE on a wonder in that case.
Yeah sadly, the only way to rake in Engineer :gp: is to run an Engineer... or build Wonders (the Great Pyramids, the Hanging Gardens, the Hagia Sophia, etc.). If you can build so many Wonders, chances are you don't need an Great Engineer to begin with. Talk about synergistic :crazyeye:

You know, in Warlords with the Great Wall giving Great Engineer points a GE was my favorite great person on par with the GS. I had a game with Gandhi in which I got 10+ GEs during the game. I had GW, Pyramids, forge Engineer, Hanging Gardens all in one city, it got ridiculous really fast. I'd trade for a tech that AIs had researched long time ago (from an AI who wasn't building the wonder) and puff! instant wonder with a GE. How they must have hated me! :lol:

fav.: ge... duh, mining is bordering overpowered... and a ge it's so dang hard to get.
best: obviously gs pre lib., gm post lib., but those thankfully are easy to get if you plan accordingly.

Well, what about when you're playing a domination game and really NEED to run State Property (say on large or huge maps). You're not going to be able to run corporations, so that's very specific to a certain situation.

Well, what about when you're playing a domination game and really NEED to run State Property (say on large or huge maps). You're not going to be able to run corporations, so that's very specific to a certain situation.

It is perfectly possible to invade other land masses with corporations (running FM or Mercantilism). You need to use vassals and colonies on the larger land masses. At the end of the game the colonial maintenance costs can be high if you keep a lot of cities but peanuts compared to the cost of the army and easily met.

State Property is great when invading other land masses but not essential, if you're smart (and rich) there are ways around it like moving your capital. The main advantage of SP is that it is simple and robust, you don't have to spend a lot of time on spreading corporations and building infrastructure to use food (for Sushi), instead you can just build a barracks and workshops and start making replacements.

An excellent point. I have, indeed, utilized Free Market to run corporations while invading other landmasses, however, I was on lower levels. So I assumed it was near impossible on the higher levels of play. Clearly, I'm wrong :D

you have:

- palace - 1 continent covered;
- fp - 1 continent covered; that's one of the reasons I often don't build fp fast in bts, since you can't move it, contrary to palace
- versailles - another continent covered if you didn't rush to build the fp.

and on large/huge, I assume mining is giving... 30 - 40 hammers? I got over 20 on normal. Simply by building wealth with factory/forge/plant and the bonus is sick. And besides, I don't have the machine for large/huge maps :p

Gotcha on the cpu not allowing large/huge. That sounds like smart thinking. I guess if I'm invading other continents and plan on keeping the land, then I should be holding off on Versailles and Forgotten Palace which I'm not doing. I'll try this next time I go for a huge continents domination victory.

Or, as I prefer to do, build the FP in the middle of your original continent and then when you capture cities on another major landmass move your capital there. That has an advantage if you're using spies as they return to the capital after their mission. By that time you won't be using Bureaucracy so the capital position is not important.

Versaillies is a wonder I never build, so find out where it is and make it an objective to capture its city. That continent is set up for a large number of your cities now.

But frankly if you are smart about how you use vassals and making a colony on a landmass (needs 2 cities) you can avoid most of these costs by gifting cities you don't want to them and just keeping the 3 or 4 best cities maximum. Colonial costs are not too bad if you only have a few cities per landmass. Once you're on you late game Domination run you don't have much time to do a lot with captured cities anyway so they may as well be gifted to your vassals so you can move on to the next target.

Vassals, eh? I guess I'm addicted to seeing my CIV's cultural color cover the map :D

For me it's entirely dependent upon the circumstances and timing.

Early in the game I love popping a prophet if I also have a holy city. That's free money, baby.

Later on, I love popping GSes to build academies in my science cities and just race away from the competition, tech-wise.

Sometimes I love popping a GE if I can use him to finish a wonder I need or grab a tech I want.


Great Spies I usually haven't found all that helpful, but I'm still getting used to really pushing espionage. Now that I know it can be used both for warfare (IE: no more need to bombard!) and research (IE: steal techs non-stop), I'll be putting more emphasis on it.

GAs are great for culture bombing, of course.

Great Artist.

Two words: CULTURE BOMB! :)

@Solo4114What's your favorite, though? Which one did you vote for?

As I have become addicted to the Great wall, I have also become addicted to Great Spies. With an early great spy you can steal more techs with an infiltration than you can trade for with a bulbed tech. You also get to steal them at a fair price instead of the blackmail rates the Ai charges for trades. I now play with tech brokering off to avoid the temptation to trade stolen techs. That is just too abusive. There is no "WFYABTA" in the espionage game. And don't give me that "we're not ready to start sharing this technology yet" crap. You'll give me that tech when i want it. "We will never trade with you, our worst enemy".....hey buddy a trade implies you are getting something in return....which you aren't.
And due to the nature of espionage costs being affected by the total number of EP generated per turn each successive infiltration is more effective. I try for three by the time jails/intellagencies/security bureaus are available. By that time my discount is incredible and the EP's generated by those buildings and a single spy specialist in each city is more than enough to do the job.
I used to think settling and SY was the way to go until I realised that more espionage early is better than the long term benefits of settling. And while a scotland yard gives a great boost to a cities EP. The reduced cost from an infiltration benefits the EP from every other city you will ever have.
And lastly, upping your beaker rate, gold rate or culture rate does not lower the effectiveness of the enemies similar rates. Espionage does. The more you generate the less effective theirs become. Not only that by the Ai seems to realise this and take steps to try and close the gap. Thus taking away vital commerce from their research and gold to aim towards espionage.

I love Great Merchants. They can give me a big sum of gold, make me specialise a gold city even more and get some free food to boot or I can grab a tech with them!

The money can be used to run a deficit for a long time, upgrade troops, rush-buy things and or to buy techs/other stuff from other AI's. While I rarely generate them by focusing lots of cities on merchants, I'm doing so now more often :)

*Fugazi is a devoted REX-maniac*

I like the spy, esp. if it comes early with the great wall. The espionage boost that comes with it can lead to stealing several techs, which is like a triple+ lightbulb.

I love Great Merchants. They can give me a big sum of gold, make me specialise a gold city even more and get some free food to boot or I can grab a tech with them!

The money can be used to run a deficit for a long time, upgrade troops, rush-buy things and or to buy techs/other stuff from other AI's. While I rarely generate them by focusing lots of cities on merchants, I'm doing so now more often :)

*Fugazi is a devoted REX-maniac*

I used to run 2 GP farms in my SE. 1 Great Scientist Farm(the bigger of the 2) and 1 Great Merchant Farm.

Now, I'll look at my cities and if I'm lacking a second or third solid unit production city, I'll run a GS farm and a Great Prophet farm and settle all my GPs in my second or third best production city. Turns it into a production/gold mecca.

Just like everything else in Civ IV, it depends on the game and on the map in particular.

If someone else builds the Temple of Artemis in their coastal capital, there's not much that can beat a Great Merchant.

If you've founded an early religion, there's not much that can beat a Great Priest. Running at 100% science for the entire game regardless of the number of cities you built is a lot of fun.

I used to absolutely salivate when I popped a Great Engineer. Now, not so much. If I can build the wonder myself, I'll do it. If not, I'll be happy to take it from the AI later in the game.

Great Scientists are simply amazing on smaller maps. On huge maps, they're pretty much only good for bulbing techs.

Great Artists are wonderful. If you want to start a Golden Age. Other than that, they're worthless.

Great Spies are extremely powerful, but I don't have a whole lot of fun with them just because of the odd play style you have to adopt to make them worthwhile. I don't like to build spies so much, so a settled Great Spy is not as important for me.

I can see a case for the Great Artist being better than just for starting a golden age. Cultural wins utilizing a Great Artist farm instead of GS might be one. Or rocking back and forth between GS and GA for your GP farm.

All of them. MOAR MOAR MOAR!!! LOL...

Probably Great Spies are a close second to Great Engineers (never any such thing as too many GEs). But Great Scientists are a very close third to that.

Merchants, if I only get one for Sushi I'm good, really.

Prophets, if I get any (and I usually don't), they're good for a shrine, but, meh.

Artists, Golden Age or border management.

They're all good, but I guess I have a slight pref for engineers and spies.

Great Engineers because they are so hard to create. Great Scientists and Merchants may be as useful, but it's much easier to create one when you need it.

Great Engineers because they are so hard to create. Great Scientists and Merchants may be as useful, but it's much easier to create one when you need it.

Which is exactly why I like the Great Prophet. You can create an almost pure GrProph farm right from the start of the game. I guess with a civ like Egypt, it's almost too easy. But you can really get them to pump out. Since they contribute to both :gold: and :hammers: and will never go obsolete, if I pop nothing but Great Prophets all game I'm happy. And if I'm using a cottage economy, I can keep the science slider much higher from the gold from the prophets and a few merchant specialist cities for that gold.

@Solo4114What's your favorite, though? Which one did you vote for?

I didn't. I don't really have a favorite. It's all about which one is most useful to me at a given moment. Least favorite is probably Great Merchant or Great Spy, though. They have their uses, but I find that once you have one or two great spies who've built Scotland Yard in a few cities, they aren't really worth it. They get used up on any mission they run, they can't pop techs, etc.

Great Merchants are similar although they can still pop techs and can found corporations. But the trade mission thing? Useless mostly, unless you're in DIRE need of cash. E ven then, you can usually sell soemthing to the AI.

But the trade mission thing? Useless mostly, unless you're in DIRE need of cash. E ven then, you can usually sell soemthing to the AI.

I think trade missions can actually be pretty useful as a means of raising funds for an army upgrade.

:agree:

I usually LOVE a great merchant around the time i get rifling. Helps get all those nice CR3 maces to CR3 rifles. The money can also be used to upgrade siege weapons to cannons.

Which is exactly why I like the Great Prophet. You can create an almost pure GrProph farm right from the start of the game. I guess with a civ like Egypt, it's almost too easy. But you can really get them to pump out. Since they contribute to both :gold: and :hammers: and will never go obsolete, if I pop nothing but Great Prophets all game I'm happy. And if I'm using a cottage economy, I can keep the science slider much higher from the gold from the prophets and a few merchant specialist cities for that gold.

I'm not a big fan of Great Prophets, as settling Great Persons is really not that worth it anymore once you get to the Renaissance. And they can't lightbulb/create a special building past Divine Right or found a Corporation.

Depending on the map, for me it's either a GM or a GE. Whether I want Sid's Sushi or Mining Inc/Crative Constructions more.

I don't really care about corporations. By the time the good ones are available, I'm usually close to winning. Once I step up my difficulty again, they might become more useful.

Settling past the Renaissance Era isn't worth settling? Really? That's when settling nets you the largest bonuses all game. In the capital (my usual GP settling point), each Great Prophet provides +10:gold: +4.5:science: (university/library/rep) and +4:hammers: (bureaucracy/forge/orgRel) for buildings or +4.5:hammers: for units (bureaucracy/forge/MilAcademy).

It's game specific, of course, but usually my games end before corporations can even be fully utilized.

settling past renaissance of course gives huge bonuses, but the # of turns to benefit from them is now much shorter, whereas benefit from GA increases greatly.
I find GProphets useful for GA post-renaissance, second GA (combined with someone you pop regularly) particularly, or 3rd when combined with GE from fusion & someone else.

settling past renaissance of course gives huge bonuses, but the # of turns to benefit from them is now much shorter, whereas benefit from GA increases greatly.
I find GProphets useful for GA post-renaissance, second GA (combined with someone you pop regularly) particularly, or 3rd when combined with GE from fusion & someone else.

I see what you mean. On the other hand, the faster I can win is sometimes the more desirable (if I'm not looking for the epic feel of the game). So, honestly, the less turns I benefit anything right from the start is better. Since less turns benefiting means less turns until victory ;)