What are the most significant (influential, pivotal, important, etc...) blood-lines and families/households in world history?


Not necessarily bona fide royalty, but could include feudal or even mercantile (even scientific?) house-holds.



E.g. Hapsburgs, Tudors, Takeda, Ptolemy etc..

The bloodline of Genghis Khan.

The bloodline of Genghis Khan.

From what I've read it seems that it would be proper to call them the 'khan' family though it doubles to mean 'ruler'. Kind of like if English monarch had the actual last name of 'king'. :) Going up and down Temujin's family tree and 'khan' is the only name they have in common.


I guess I'll be a boner and add the Tokugawa family to the list.

Well, they may be not so important for the world history, but for the history of their countries:
- the Fuggers (at least during the middle ages), merchants, Germany
- the Báthorys, "ruler clan", Hungary; search for Erzsébet / Elizabeth Báthory - AFAIK she is still the female mass-murderer with most victims ever according to Guiness world records book (at least I read that somewhere) and therefore she may be the best known Báthory outside Hungary (AFAIK there are more and more doubts that it is false what has been told about her, don't know details about those doubts)
- the Bush and the Kennedy clan

The bloodline of Genghis Khan.

Council bureaucrats aren't really that important, though.

Council bureaucrats aren't really that important, though.
And what might be the connection between them?

Council bureaucrats aren't really that important, though.

Temujin and his family wouldn't really fit that job description though. They were more warlords.

His line of descendants all held the system together and led invasions as Emperors of China, or the steppes.
(e.g. Ogedei, Mongke, Kublai, Hualga, and Temur)
Kublai did try to be a well-rounded emperor, not a fault though.

Any rate, a good ruler can lead from the front and rule from behind. :)
And pretty important for being able to scare their neighbors.

I was actually hinting at the study, according to which
Zerjal et al [2003] [6] identified a Y-chromosomal lineage present in about 8% of the men in a large region of Asia (about 0.5% of the men in the world). The paper suggests that the pattern of variation within the lineage is consistent with a hypothesis that it originated in Mongolia about 1,000 years ago. Such a spread would be too rapid to have occurred by genetic drift, and must therefore be the result of selection. The authors propose that the lineage is carried by likely male-line descendants of Genghis Khan and his close male relatives, and that it has spread through social selection.
A bloodline that comprises 1/200 of entire world's population should be ranked pretty high in the order of significance ;)

Funny. One wonders how they managed to be so productive. :) Guess it's in the genes!

And what might be the connection between them?

Ever read The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy? Apologies for the oblique reference, but I couldn't resist.

Fuggers is a good choice.

I'll return: Medici---banking, popes, city-state ruler, and renaissance supporter.
and maybe similar renaissance city-state ruling families Sforza and Visconti (actually had one-shot line to a King of France, and Gian Galeazzo Visconti owned Northern Italy and almost Florence---except he died. Potentially could have united Italy under a continued succession)



EDIT: and Hohenstaufen for most of early Fredericks and at least two HREs.

and Hohenzollern for the great Frederick, the later Fredericks, and 'The German Empire'

Ever read The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy? Apologies for the oblique reference, but I couldn't resist.
Sorry, no. Just seen the movie. :sad:

Well, they may be not so important for the world history, but for the history of their countries:
- the Fuggers (at least during the middle ages), merchants, Germany
- the Báthorys, "ruler clan", Hungary; search for Erzsébet / Elizabeth Báthory - AFAIK she is still the female mass-murderer with most victims ever according to Guiness world records book (at least I read that somewhere) and therefore she may be the best known Báthory outside Hungary (AFAIK there are more and more doubts that it is false what has been told about her, don't know details about those doubts)
- the Bush and the Kennedy clan

For Hungary, it seems that wherever I go in Hungarian history, I see the same last names: Bathory, Bethlen, Zapolya, etc. These are all Transylvanian families, yes? And before them, Aba.

Oh, and of course the Oxenstierna for Sweden.

The Habsburgs and Bourbons seem to be the most prolific in causing problems in Europe, at least before the 19th century.

These are all Transylvanian families, yes?
I actually can't tell you where those families are originally from, but because most of them seemed to lived in Transylvania and some even ruled it, I think so.

BTW: I forgot the Árpád dynasty. Very important for Hungary and because they ruled Hungary which was a not to underestimate power in those times (at least at Árpáds and Saint Stephens time), also important for other european countries. Again, not of worldwide importance, but this time I'd say it's fair to say they were important for europes history.

I'd say the Carolingians and Merovingians were also important in their times.

The families that imediately came to mind were mostly already mentioned: von Habsburgs, von Hohenzollerns, Bourbons... I would also add the Rothschilds, not as politically influent as the first ones but nevertherless tremendously influent in general.

What are the most significant (influential, pivotal, important, etc...) blood-lines and families/households in world history?

In world history? Too many to name, but basically the dynasties of most major empires (though I'd exclude Egypt, because it never managed to export ideas and thus leave their mark on the rest of the world). Tiglath-Pileser III of Assyria, the Achaemenids, the Shang and all the others who followed in China, etc. Until at least the Renaissance powerful and lasting families meant rulers of empires.

Individuals, that'd be another story.

In world history? Too many to name, but basically the dynasties of most major empires (though I'd exclude Egypt, because it never managed to export ideas and thus leave their mark on the rest of the world). Tiglath-Pileser III of Assyria, the Achaemenids, the Shang and all the others who followed in China, etc. Until at least the Renaissance powerful and lasting families meant rulers of empires.

Individuals, that'd be another story.

I agree regarding Egypt for the kingdom periods. I struggled to find some sense of house/family in the lineage of rulers there, but superficially there doesn't appear to be any. I wonder how important familial descent was to them in the time of the kingdoms. Post-Alexander though, there's at least the Ptolemies (though their decline/incest isn't too impressive).

I agree there are almost too many important families that were important relative to their corner of the world, but left no obvious, timeless marks. I do appreciate naming them though since I have an ulterior motive for this thread. I'm trying to get some feedback to develop a minimod for Civ4 based bloodlines, and at least one historical one per civilization is my goal.

I agree there are almost too many important families that were important relative to their corner of the world, but left no obvious, timeless marks. I do appreciate naming them though since I have an ulterior motive for this thread. I'm trying to get some feedback to develop a minimod for Civ4 based bloodlines, and at least one historical one per civilization is my goal.

One family per civilization - that's a much better question!

Well, I've already mentioned the only choice for the persians (Achaemenids).

For Egypt I'd probably use the XVIII Dynasty, just because they built the largest egyptian empire - I don't think that they had a particular family name, though.

Babylon is hard: Sargon's dynasty (he ruled from Akkad, not from Babylon), probably deserves more recognition that the better-known neo-Babylonian dynasty of Nebuchadrezzar II.

China's history I don't know well enough to pick a dynasty.

Greece... they either had too many leaders, or the native leaders who did manage to conquer it didn't last long enough to found a dynasty! But the Argead dynasty at least conquered it all for two generations (ending with the dismemberment of Alexander's empire).

Rome... the Julio-claudians, definitely. They may not have supplied the most competent of emperors, but they made one hell of a family history! :D

Carthage - the Barcids.

The Somoza family dominated Nicaragua for 43 years.

The Downer family has been part of Australian history since its beginning, although I would hesitate to call it important. First, there was John Downer, Premier of South Australia twice before Federation, and one of the original senators after Federation. His son, Alec Downer, was Minister for Immigration from 1958-1963, and later High Commissioner to London (interestingly, he was Princess Diana's brother's godfather), and then there was his son Alexander Downer, who was Opposition Leader for 8 months in 1994 and 1995, and Australia's longest serving Foreign Minister from 1996-2007. Other than that, in Australia there is also the Crean family, and the Beazley family, both of whom have had Labour Party leaders in the last ten years. To a lesser extent, there is also the Bligh family, consisting of the only ever rebelliously-deposed leader in Australia's history, NSW Governor William Bligh (1806-1808), and current Queenslnad Premier Anna Bligh.

^^^ Would impotent be a better description for the Downer family's effect on Australian history?

Genghis would have to win, and I say that because the thought of doing otherwise would cause the voices of thousands of Mongol warriors to scream in my head - Douglas Adams rules!!! - but there are other important families, such as the Habsburgs, Bourbons, etc. Savoy were also pretty important, due to re-unifying Italy.

As an interesting aside, I believe there are still people alive today that can trace themselves back to Confucius' family, in a legal sense. Whether or not they really do carry his bloodline - considering even the 'son' of Edward II didn't carry his - is another story.

^^^ Would impotent be a better description for the Downer family's effect on Australian history?

Depends. Does pretending to be important = being important?

Genghis would have to win, and I say that because the thought of doing otherwise would cause the voices of thousands of Mongol warriors to scream in my head - Douglas Adams rules!!!

I'm not the only one!

I'd say the Constantinian dynasty was pretty significant. Also, the Lee dynasty has got off to a good start, although they don't control quite such a large area...

Depends. Does pretending to be important = being important?



I'm not the only one!
Interesting question. From what I've seen on these boards, many seem to think so. I think impotent describes them better though. After all, they even had a long-serving foreign minister who was eclipsed by Dame Edna and Norman Gunston. Fishnets ftw.

I got the reference as soon as I read it, but wasn't surprised no-one else seemed to. Of course, I read the book for the first time just six weeks or so ago.

What was Alexander and Philip of Macedon's family name?

The Royal family of Sirivijaya had the honor of being 'related' to most Royal dynasties of South East Asia. Given that just about every royal family in Indonesia and Malaysia claimed and claims some sort of lineal descent from Majapahit which owes its royal family to Sirivijaya.

I'd say the Constantinian dynasty was pretty significant. Also, the Lee dynasty has got off to a good start, although they don't control quite such a large area...

I guess as in Robert E. Lee. I was surprised that they were well ingrained in the Virginia government for generations as well as descended from the British monarchy.

EDIT: USA will be hard to decide on---there's Lee, Bush, Kennedy, Roosevelt as recurring names. If I had to pick one, I'd probably go with Roosevelt (say it with a 'rue') since it's Dutch back to New Amsterdam days.


Does pretending to be important = being important?

Only if you convince all the important people that you are important. Actually, that'd be the strategy of many politicians.

For Egypt I'd probably use the XVIII Dynasty, just because they built the largest egyptian empire - I don't think that they had a particular family name, though.



I think you're right with the 18th dynasty. There is problem with naming them and there's a possible broken heredity in the chain.

Choices would be: founder: Ahmose
and the two most common names: Amenhotep and Thutmose.




What was Alexander and Philip of Macedon's family name?

From the gods! :) Heraclid (Hercules) was a favorite claim of his, apparently. Heraclid through his dad, Achilles through his mom, according to this commentary: http://www.livius.org/aj-al/alexander/alexander_z4.html
As for flesh and blood humans, Macedon was founded by the Argeid/Argead (from the city Argos) dynasty, and Alexander's grandad Amnytas III was an Argead. The founder of the Argeads was King Caranus, so the house could be called Caranid/Karanid also.

I guess as in Robert E. Lee. I was surprised that they were well ingrained in the Virginia government for generations as well as descended from the British monarchy.

Actually I meant as in Lee Kuan Yew!

Actually I meant as in Lee Kuan Yew!
I was hoping you meant Bruce Lee.

Don't forget the Capetians and their various branches guys, they're pretty important. Also the various Riurikids have lasted a long time (with their cadet branches and whatnot) so they are pretty high up there too.
From the gods! :) Heraclid (Hercules) was a favorite claim of his, apparently. Heraclid through his dad, Achilles through his mom, according to this commentary: http://www.livius.org/aj-al/alexander/alexander_z4.html
As for flesh and blood humans, Macedon was founded by the Argeid/Argead (from the city Argos) dynasty, and Alexander's grandad Amnytas III was an Argead. The founder of the Argeads was King Caranus, so the house could be called Caranid/Karanid also.
Since Heraklidai is appended to the pre-Gygian Lydians, Argeades is the usual nomenclature.

I was thinking the same as Dachs. Although the main line of Capetians died out in 1328, the houses of Valois, Bourbon and Orleans were all branches of the Capetians. The current monarchs of Spain and Luxembourg are members of the Bourbon branch of the Capetians. The family descends from Hugh Capet, of course, but his grandfather was Robert I of France and his great-uncle Odo, who was king of France from 887 to 898. (The Carolingians got the throne back after both monarchs.) These earlier kings are called "Robertians," since Odo and Robert I were sons of Robert the Strong, Count of Paris.

What about the Rothschilds, and the Kennedys, who are among the main dynasties today.

Actually I meant as in Lee Kuan Yew!

Haha! Theres a myth that if the Singapore one dollar coin is used everywhere on the island, the Lee family will remain in power

Okay. The Bourbons and Hasburgs are perhaps the most annoying branches of European Dynasties. And because they are the most annoying branches, they are the most influential.

Firstly, they are both extremely lucky and extremely stubborn. The Hasburgs, whose origins begin with castle properties in Switzerland, managed to marry themselves into the thrones of Austria, Spain, Naples, Netherlands, Bohemia, Hungary and various german and Italian lands as well as the title of Holy Roman Emperor for the last 300 years of the HRE.

The Bourbons inherited France due to the extreme luck of the deaths of two heirs to the throne. And despite being overthrown 3 times in 2 countries, the Bourbons still exist today on the throne of Spain.

Number two. The two dynasties ruled 3 influential countries, who have been at heads with each other for the last 500 Years when Charles V became HRE. I believe, their dynastic rivalries started at least 3 major wars that dragged Europe into disorder.

The Bourbons and the Hasburgs have to be the most influential Families in Europe.

In Asia Genghis Khan's dynasty and decendents who ruled the various Hordes. The Golden Horde, the Yuan, the Chagati Khanate, One of these descedents Timur the Great went on to found his own dynasty the House of Timur which went on to rule India known as the Mughals. Genghis Khan definatley had the most far spanning influence out of everyone in Asia. He and his desendents seem to have shaped much of Asia.

Even today he has 30 million desendents roughly I believe.

Does anyone know if the Manchus have any relation to the Mongols?

Does anyone know if the Manchus have any relation to the Mongols?

Wikipedia says the Manchu's originated from the steppes, but not clear if they are ethnically related (I wonder if it's not something like Bantu and Khoisan). I'd say that the early Manchu dynasty was wiped out by the Mongols, and the later Qing dynasty was a fresh, synergetic, manchu-mongol hybrid.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nurhaci

The Bourbons inherited France due to the extreme luck of the deaths of two heirs to the throne. And despite being overthrown 3 times in 2 countries, the Bourbons still exist today on the throne of Spain.

Although they would probably have inherited France even if Henry III hadn't been assassinated since he wasn't going to be fathering any children. (One of the reasons for the Wars of Religion in the first place.)

Although, come to think of it, Henri III would probably have been murdered at some point after he arranged the assassination of the Guises. He really worked at making himself unpopular.

Even today he has 30 million desendents roughly I believe.

I heard something similar about Charlemagne, and for extra points I think that all of the royal houses of europe can be traced back to him.

Although they would probably have inherited France even if Henry III hadn't been assassinated since he wasn't going to be fathering any children. (One of the reasons for the Wars of Religion in the first place.)
His wife could just have gotten pregnant to another man, and the child declared his legitimate descendant, a la Edward II, who was just as flaming as old Hank. But Henry III was an assassination waiting to happen for years.

In Asia Genghis Khan's dynasty and decendents who ruled the various Hordes. The Golden Horde, the Yuan, the Chagati Khanate, One of these descedents Timur the Great went on to found his own dynasty the House of Timur which went on to rule India known as the Mughals. Genghis Khan definatley had the most far spanning influence out of everyone in Asia. He and his desendents seem to have shaped much of Asia.

Even today he has 30 million desendents roughly I believe.

Does anyone know if the Manchus have any relation to the Mongols?

Timur's decendence from Genghis Khan is very sketchy, and probably false. However, his chief wife was directly decendent fom Genghis Khan. So through her the Mughals are decendents of Genghis Khan.

Queen Victoria of Great Britain's nickname was 'The Grandmother of Europe'. This obviously makes her family very important.

Queen Victoria of Great Britain's nickname was 'The Grandmother of Europe'. This obviously makes her family very important.

The Hanover house, and also includes George III. Final English branch renamed to the House of Windsor.

John William Friso, Prince of Orange

He is the latest common ancestor of all current Kings and Queens of Europe.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_descendants_of_John_William_Friso,_Prince_of _Orange

John William Friso, Prince of Orange

He is the latest common ancestor of all current Kings and Queens of Europe.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_descendants_of_John_William_Friso,_Prince_of _Orange

So the House of Orange-Nassau, or just Nassau.