Okay, looking through Planetfall's graphics made me realise that there are a lot of graphics that are a bit odd. But perhaps it is possible to fix that - or is even intended, what do I know?

Right now, there are two things that stand out to me:

1) Mines:
In the expansion era, you get the modern era mines from CivIV, which is nice, but when you go into your proper faction era, you suddenly get the ancient mines from CivIV - I don't think that's intended, right?

Furthermore, the borehole uses the graphics of the original mines from SMAC - I think it's a fine fit, but I'm curious - is it because of a lack of better borehole graphics or because boreholes and mines would look too similar, otherwise?
2) Farms/Outpost/Eden:
Right now, the farm building looks... odd:
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f237/Lord_Tirian/Planetfall/futurefarm.jpg

You can see through the back wall! After working on the fungal tower, I realise that probably wasn't intended by hrochland (see the original file (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=5462)), but is rather a problem with the node order in the nif-file.

Now, I can fix that in, like 5 minutes, making it look like the screenshot in the original download - question is: Do you want it fixed? Or is this one of the things, where a wholesale replacement is somewhere down the line?

Also: I think the dome looks... a bit small, compared to the other buildings, as it seems to be the centre of the farm, shouldn't it be a bit bigger? Also, the improvements (Outpost/Eden) look so... similar, it's hard to distinguish them in-game (because the only difference is basically the addition of some small faction-style houses).
Cheers, LT.

In the expansion era, you get the modern era mines from CivIV, which is nice, but when you go into your proper faction era, you suddenly get the ancient mines from CivIV - I don't think that's intended, right?

Nope. Hadn't noticed it myself. My knowledge of the PlotLSystem is insufficient to fix this however. Do you have experience with that file?

Furthermore, the borehole uses the graphics of the original mines from SMAC - I think it's a fine fit, but I'm curious - is it because of a lack of better borehole graphics or because boreholes and mines would look too similar, otherwise?

The reason I assigned the graphics to the borehole is because there's no other decent borehole graphic available.

Thinking about it now though, that graphic probably wouldn't fit for mines. Mines can be built on ridges, and unlike the vanilla mine graphics, the borehole graphic AFAIK wouldn't really look well on top of a 'peak'/ridge.

2) Farms/Outpost/Eden: question is: Do you want it fixed? Or is this one of the things, where a wholesale replacement is somewhere down the line?

I don't really have a vision myself for the farm + upgrades graphics. Obviously I don't like the dome in its current state. Even it were fixed though, the dome has a rather poor texture. I wouldn't mind ditching it entirely, or only keeping it for the initial farm graphic, and/or replace it with the pressure/sea base graphic in the building art folders, or one of those NextWar domes.

Also, the improvements (Outpost/Eden) look so... similar, it's hard to distinguish them in-game (because the only difference is basically the addition of some small faction-style houses).

Do you have ideas how to make them more distinguishable?

Nope. Hadn't noticed it myself. My knowledge of the PlotLSystem is insufficient to fix this however. Do you have experience with that file?Sadly, the LSystem in general is more a less a mystery to me - but a quick look into the file (thanks for the pointer), allowed me to determine the reason - the mine entry is:
<ArtRef Name="goal:IMPROVEMENT_MINE">
<Attribute Class="Improvement">IMPROVEMENT_MINE</Attribute>
<Attribute Class="Era">ERA_ANCIENT,ERA_ARRIVAL,ERA_EXPANSION,ERA_CROSSFIR E</Attribute>
<Attribute Class="Scalar">bIsPartOfImprovement:1</Attribute>
<Attribute Class="Scalar">bApplyRotation:1</Attribute>
<Attribute Class="Scalar">NIF:Art/Structures/Improvements/Mine/Mine_Modern.nif</Attribute>
<Attribute Class="Scalar">KFM:Art/Structures/Improvements/Mine/Mine_Modern.kfm</Attribute>
</ArtRef>As you see, the eras are not covering the faction-specific eras, so for non-covered eras, the game uses the default mine. Adding the faction-eras or changing it to "ERA_ALL" would solve the problem (I tested the former and it works).
Thinking about it now though, that graphic probably wouldn't fit for mines. Mines can be built on ridges, and unlike the vanilla mine graphics, the borehole graphic AFAIK wouldn't really look well on top of a 'peak'/ridge.Yeah, I'm thinking the same - and it's actually a pretty cool graphic right now.
Do you have ideas how to make them more distinguishable?Hmmm... no real hard and solid ideas right now, but I imagine the Eden-stage as a big indoor-area, so people could work without breather equipment. I'll think about it, perhaps I can come up with something. Provided I get somewhere with animating the fungal tower first... or give up in frustration. :D

Cheers, LT.

One of the ideas of terraformation and Farm->Eden is that Planet gets transformed so that people wouldn't need any breathers anymore to walk outside. So no indoor areas. That's the theme of 'Enclosed Biosphere'.

One of the ideas of terraformation and Farm->Eden is that Planet gets transformed so that people wouldn't need any breathers anymore to walk outside. So no indoor areas. That's the theme of 'Enclosed Biosphere'.Well, sure, but changing the entire atmosphere!? That's some massive terraforming! Plus, farms work just fine with the "Enclosed Biosphere" civic"! ;)

But I get the theme Eden/Terraformation/Edenism - so yeah, indoors wouldn't fit - probably rather something along the lines of the SMAC farms (these dome-shaped silos) as a start...

Cheers, LT.

Plus, farms work just fine with the "Enclosed Biosphere" civic"! ;)

But they upgrade much slower than under the Terraformed civic. So perhaps the Farm itself could have a dome building, but it doesn't really fit for the upgraded improvements.

But they upgrade much slower than under the Terraformed civic. So perhaps the Farm itself could have a dome building, but it doesn't really fit for the upgraded improvements.Okay, I went ahead with this idea and drew some inspiration from the original SMAC farm buildings. So far, I have a first attempt the farm, outpost and the settlement. I'm pretty happy with the farm, but not quite so with the rest - feedback, anybody?

Cheers, LT.

I like it, I think the dome graphic is key to telling it's Enclosed Biosphere - maybe you can just take off the "lid" to show Terraformed, like in the Settlement graphic you attached. To make the progression more visible, maybe use just one of the small domes at Farm, the current 1 small + 1 medium at Outpost, and 1 large + 1 small at Settlement, etc.

I like it, I think the dome graphic is key to telling it's Enclosed Biosphere - maybe you can just take off the "lid" to show Terraformed, like in the Settlement graphic you attached.This... is probably going to be hard - graphics trigger off era - and the current system already uses one era per faction. To make this possible, Maniac would need to add an entire set of eras again, just to represent the enclosed biosphere - that's probably a lot of work without a lot of gain. However, that's in the end Maniac's call.
To make the progression more visible, maybe use just one of the small domes at Farm, the current 1 small + 1 medium at Outpost, and 1 large + 1 small at Settlement, etc.That's a nice idea - I'm currently wrestling a bit with the LSystem (the underlying system for placement of models, controlling their position and number and so forth), but I think I could do that.

Any ideas how the Eden should look like? I thought of extending the settlement to eschew the silos and making it sort of a full-blown park.

Cheers, LT.

I like the dome graphic!

As for ideas to better distinguish the farm upgrades, another option is:
No buildings at all for Farms
Only the domes for Outpost
A couple of the faction-specific buildings for Settlement
Lots more of the faction-specific buildings for Eden?

As for ideas to better distinguish the farm upgrades, another option is:
No buildings at all for Farms
Only the domes for Outpost
A couple of the faction-specific buildings for Settlement
Lots more of the faction-specific buildings for Eden?I went ahead with the idea, but the "no-buildings-at-all" didn't look so good - so I added a central dome.

After a bit more confusion due to the way the LSystem works, I got results (though I still don't know how it really works :crazyeye: ), as you can see in the attached image.

Performance-wise, it should be fine as well - the farm buildings have from ~160 to ~320 polygons (the undomed one is the most lightweight one), the average faction building has ~200. The early stages have a lot less buildings - meaning apart from the Eden, they should be about the same as before - the Eden is a bit heavier, polygon-wise, but not much more than before (and considering that in Civ4 cottage spamming is more viable than in Planetfall, I guess we're still better off than default Civ4, or at least not worse).

So give me some feedback! If Maniac is happy with it, I'll post the models + required files.

Cheers, LT.

Beauty! I like! I like a lot!

The eden looks really developed. The progression looks nice as well, good stages. I'm not sure if I'll be able to tell each stage with a glance though (but still, if I could, that'd be better than Civ 4's villages, that's for sure).

I went ahead with the idea, but the "no-buildings-at-all" didn't look so good - so I added a central dome.

After a bit more confusion due to the way the LSystem works, I got results (though I still don't know how it really works :crazyeye: ), as you can see in the attached image.

Performance-wise, it should be fine as well - the farm buildings have from ~160 to ~320 polygons (the undomed one is the most lightweight one), the average faction building has ~200. The early stages have a lot less buildings - meaning apart from the Eden, they should be about the same as before - the Eden is a bit heavier, polygon-wise, but not much more than before (and considering that in Civ4 cottage spamming is more viable than in Planetfall, I guess we're still better off than default Civ4, or at least not worse).

So give me some feedback! If Maniac is happy with it, I'll post the models + required files.

Cheers, LT.

Hmm, I would like to have more differences between the development stages to recognize the improvement level with a quick glance...the first 3 you have posted appear all a bit "empty" for my taste; however, I have to admit that this is probably hard to achieve, as my desire for clearly distinction isn't fulfilled by the currently used ones as well (they are even worse) - they have more buildings and stuff on them, but the confuse me as much ;) I have attached a screenshot to illustrate the problem - one is the outpost at the river. Its buildings near the tree get swallowed for my eye and the empty space makes me think this must be a farm (despite the farm has the tower in the middle). The diagonal arrow shows Eden vs. Settlement and I have a hard time to tell the difference...and that problem is solved by your graphics, because Eden is easily recognizeable.

So I think your graphics are a clearly improvement :)

Edit: At a second glance, I think the differences in your graphics are already enough. In the game, I think less will be more. The confusion comes likely out of that "too much" on the little space of a tile.

I'm not sure if I'll be able to tell each stage with a glance thoughHint: Count the number of round yellow buildings in a tile! ;)

Unless a building is swallowed up by a hill/elevation or so (like in one of the Edens in the screenshot), that should always tell you the stage. However, I'm not familiar enough with the LSystem to avoid the occasional placement of buildings inside hills or on a weird part of an elevation or so.

Cheers, LT.

Hint: if I have to count the buildings, it's not a glance now, is it?

It's a minor quibble, not a huge deal. Pfeffersack already said it's an improvement over the other model, and he's right. And, as I said, I wasn't sure it would be a problem.

And yeah...arguing with criticism seldom works. Take it from someone who's tried himself...it's a bad habit of mine as well. :lol:

Hint: if I have to count the buildings, it's not a glance now, is it?We-ell, most up to four or five, people don't really have to count but rather distinguish the number on a glance - for example if you see three apples, you just know that without actual counting. Only after five or six that ability usually breaks down (depending on the person).
It's a minor quibble, not a huge deal. Pfeffersack already said it's an improvement over the other model, and he's right. And, as I said, I wasn't sure it would be a problem.Yeah, of course it's just a minor quibble - and as long as the buildings look similar, there will be confusion - but if they don't look similar, they don't look like a progression - and the latter is sort of important.

This said, I deliberately threw in a couple of clues to help distinguishing them, apart from the exact number: For example, faction-specific buildings only appear on "grown" versions. Edens don't have domes. Only settlements have domes and undomed ones. If you only see domed, it's one of the two early stages.

While these things are slightly obscure, I hoped that by adding these clues one would, after time, help to get a feel for these stages after some playing.
And yeah...arguing with criticism seldom works. Take it from someone who's tried himself...it's a bad habit of mine as well. :lol:Arguing doesn't work, nor does reasoning... but I have to admit it's fun. And it's fun to use the opportunity to show why you did it the way you did! ;)

Cheers, LT.

So give me some feedback! If Maniac is happy with it, I'll post the models + required files.

I too am unsure at this point if it will be possible to see at a glance what's the upgrade level of the improvement. However your screenshot certainly looks good. Please do attach the required files. I'll include them in the next patch.

I too am unsure at this point if it will be possible to see at a glance what's the upgrade level of the improvement. However your screenshot certainly looks good. Please do attach the required files. I'll include them in the next patch.*ding*

I don't think I've missed anything and included the correction for the later era mine graphic as well (they're simply in the same file) - so should work better than the missing sounds of the fungal tower, I hope!

EDIT: By the way, Maniac, how current is your "graphics tasklist" in the main thread? Do you still need the submarine carrier model? Or the greenhouse graphics (as the algae are much bigger now)?

Cheers, LT.

I love landmarks - they're great and fun in FfH2, but they were also a very cool thing in SMAC. It's one of the things I miss most in plain, unmodded Civ 4.

So, I whipped up a landmark that's not in Planetfall yet - the Garland Crater! It was a small and easy, but also fun model to make - so I just drop it here, hoping somebody will find an use for it.

If it gets used, I recommend a fScale of 5.5 and a fInterfaceScale of 0.8. It looks good on all arid land types, as well as rocky moist terrain. It will always look good on lowlands, good on highlands - except next to some cliffs, always bad on ridges. Hence I recommend to make it appear only on arid lowland, that should make it always look in place and fitting!

Cheers, LT.

Nope. Hadn't noticed it myself. My knowledge of the PlotLSystem is insufficient to fix this however. Do you have experience with that file?

Sorry, I kept on forgetting to fix this.

Lord Tirian, you did a good job on the farm improvement. :cooool:

Sorry, I kept on forgetting to fix this.Hey, as you're around right now: I've sort of found out why the sea bases don't have any art: The BuildingLSystem part that keeps land cities from ending up in water also keeps buildings of sea bases out of water (best illustrated if you set a sea base in the world builder on a coast tile). I also found out that one can override that for individual buildings completely (with the tag to ignore water and ignore the contour) - but I didn't get any further.

Since you're more familiar with the LSystem in general (seeing you doing all the ethnic city art, which is great! :goodjob: ) - do you have any idea how to go from there to finally get sea bases with buildings?

Cheers, LT.

Hey, as you're around right now: I've sort of found out why the sea bases don't have any art: The BuildingLSystem part that keeps land cities from ending up in water also keeps buildings of sea bases out of water (best illustrated if you set a sea base in the world builder on a coast tile). I also found out that one can override that for individual buildings completely (with the tag to ignore water and ignore the contour) - but I didn't get any further.

Since you're more familiar with the LSystem in general (seeing you doing all the ethnic city art, which is great! :goodjob: ) - do you have any idea how to go from there to finally get sea bases with buildings?

Cheers, LT.

If you could show me the xml code which causes that I could try to figure out a way from there. The furthest I found out about visible seabases was how to put city facilities (network nodes, rec commons, biolabs,...) on seaplots, and my first idea several months ago was to create separate art with some cityset buildings/faction around it and have separate xml tags for land facilities and sea facilities. But Maniac didn't want to go this way (can't blame him, it would double the xml and probably .dll work).
So just link me to an xml example of how you found this out so I'm sure we're talking about the same thing, and I'll try to work from there once my vacation starts (a guy needs to do something on those long boring evenings in a foreign country... ;) ).

So, I whipped up a landmark that's not in Planetfall yet - the Garland Crater! It was a small and easy, but also fun model to make - so I just drop it here, hoping somebody will find an use for it.

Awesome! :goodjob: I'll definitely include it. I haven't put it in the 319 compatibility patch yet though, as I need to think a while about what effects the landmark could give - I'd prefer something in addition to the obvious mineral bonus.

My current thought is it could provide an Iridium bonus even before you have the Antimatter technology. Revealing and enabling the Iridium resource there right from game start would require a minor SDK modification though.

That Garland Crater screenshot will also be awesome for marketing. :D

do you have any idea how to go from there to finally get sea bases with buildings?

Each sea base starts with a Pressure Dome, so one idea I had was to make the Pressure Dome graphic appear on water.

Each sea base starts with a Pressure Dome, so one idea I had was to make the Pressure Dome graphic appear on water.

That's easy enough.

...I'm sure we're talking about the same thing, and I'll try to work from there once my vacation starts.Uh, I think we're talking about the same thing - the problem is: The behaviour seems to be implicit, i.e. everything follows it. The "<Attribute Class="Scalar">bNoContour:1</Attribute>" in combination with the "<Attribute Class="Scalar">bNoWaterTest:1</Attribute>" tag seems to place buildings straight on water. From the tags, I figured that the bNoWaterTest avoids checking for water, whereas the bNoContour disables the checking for the terrain contours, i.e. following coastlines, hills and so forth.

But that's as far as I got, I couldn't follow that trail into the DLL so far. On the other hand, I got an idea for a possible "workaround". Once could copy-&-paste several buildings from a city set nif together into a small city (as single nif) and use it as a graphic for an unique building that only and always appears in water bases. Then there would be at least some approximation of a city. This "compiled" nif could then also include some platform or things like that to make it look more in place.

Cheers, LT.

Uh, I think we're talking about the same thing - the problem is: The behaviour seems to be implicit, i.e. everything follows it. The "<Attribute Class="Scalar">bNoContour:1</Attribute>" in combination with the "<Attribute Class="Scalar">bNoWaterTest:1</Attribute>" tag seems to place buildings straight on water. From the tags, I figured that the bNoWaterTest avoids checking for water, whereas the bNoContour disables the checking for the terrain contours, i.e. following coastlines, hills and so forth.

Okay, I followed your explanation then.

But that's as far as I got, I couldn't follow that trail into the DLL so far. On the other hand, I got an idea for a possible "workaround". Once could copy-&-paste several buildings from a city set nif together into a small city (as single nif) and use it as a graphic for an unique building that only and always appears in water bases. Then there would be at least some approximation of a city. This "compiled" nif could then also include some platform or things like that to make it look more in place.

Yeah, I had the same idea. :)

Me three. :)

Okay, generally, I'm busy with experimenting with unit art and stuff - but in the main thread, there was a mix-up of special abilities and promotions (here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8190820&postcount=796)). I think his idea of distinguishing them by different icons isn't a bad one, so I tried to whip up an alternative icon - as most special abilities are technical (and also in SMAC), I tried to make it look a bit technical, hence the cool metallic colours. So, I attached two quick attempts on Silksteel and Plasma Shard - what do you think?

Suggested tweaks?

Cheers, LT.

Okay, generally, I'm busy with experimenting with unit art and stuff - but in the main thread, there was a mix-up of special abilities and promotions (here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8190820&postcount=796)). I think his idea of distinguishing them by different icons isn't a bad one, so I tried to whip up an alternative icon - as most special abilities are technical (and also in SMAC), I tried to make it look a bit technical, hence the cool metallic colours. So, I attached two quick attempts on Silksteel and Plasma Shard - what do you think?

Suggested tweaks?

Cheers, LT.

I like the idea of different colours for promotions and special abilities and I also think the metal colour tone fits nicely :goodjob:

Okay, generally, I'm busy with experimenting with unit art and stuff - but in the main thread, there was a mix-up of special abilities and promotions (here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8190820&postcount=796)). I think his idea of distinguishing them by different icons isn't a bad one, so I tried to whip up an alternative icon - as most special abilities are technical (and also in SMAC), I tried to make it look a bit technical, hence the cool metallic colours. So, I attached two quick attempts on Silksteel and Plasma Shard - what do you think?

Suggested tweaks?

Cheers, LT.

:goodjob:

The only other problem with ability and promotion icons is that a couple aren't unique yet. I can't recall which off the top of my head, and hopefully separating the ability and promo icon colors like this will help that problem too.

I'm not 100% sure yet, but I intend to simplify the promotion line to a mere Combat I to VI (or Disciplined to Elite). So it would be much less work to give the few Combat promotions a different background than all the special abilities.

Where did you get the icon for Plasma Shard btw? I'd love to have the source file for that.

I'm not 100% sure yet, but I intend to simplify the promotion line to a mere Combat I to VI (or Disciplined to Elite). So it would be much less work to give the few Combat promotions a different background than all the special abilities.


As it is now, the 'elite' button is also used for the two next promotions in that line (Legendary and Alpha).

I'm not 100% sure yet, but I intend to simplify the promotion line to a mere Combat I to VI (or Disciplined to Elite). So it would be much less work to give the few Combat promotions a different background than all the special abilities.So... you think of changing the promotion background instead of the special ability background? I think that might cause confusion, because the gold-on-blue promotions are just so familiar from vanilla civ. Even FfH2 sticks to that colouring scheme - for the same reason, I guess.

Of course, one could also go along the FfH2 route and give (similar to the spells) each special ability an actual picture instead of a symbol, but I don't think that's fitting with the symbol-driven SMAC-theme.
Where did you get the icon for Plasma Shard btw? I'd love to have the source file for that.It's part of this psd-file (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=7686653&postcount=4).

By the way, a minor quibble (since this is a quibble-thread, after all): Unique features (on the map) in FfH2 have that nice big label (just the standard Civ4 label for the map), so you can see their name without hovering over the actual feature - would it be possible to get the same labelling for the unique features in Planetfall?

Cheers, LT.

Of course, one could also go along the FfH2 route and give (similar to the spells) each special ability an actual picture instead of a symbol, but I don't think that's fitting with the symbol-driven SMAC-theme.

I have nothing against using pictures, but I wouldn't have an idea what picture to use for most special abilities - it may be hard to find a fitting picture for everything. And if you use that theme for one spec ab, one should use it for all spec abs to stay consistent.

It's part of this psd-file (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=7686653&postcount=4).

Crap. I don't have Photoshop. :(

So... you think of changing the promotion background instead of the special ability background? I think that might cause confusion, because the gold-on-blue promotions are just so familiar from vanilla civ. Even FfH2 sticks to that colouring scheme - for the same reason, I guess.

Some considerations:

If I were to simplify promotions for non-psi units to a simple Combat I to VI, I could also give units the latest promotion automatically upon reaching the required XP. Then no confusion would be possible, and the colour of the promotions wouldn't really matter anyway.

A bigger more 'project management'-orientated reason to choose the implementation which requires the least change: so far no one except GeoModder has contributed to Planetfall for longer than six months or so. While I of course hope you will stick around for a much longer time :) I should not rely on that hope. If I need another special ability button in seven months, I should be able to make one myself. So unless you could write a guide similar to the tech/fac button creation guide, one which works for a freely available program like GIMP, it is best not to start using another style for special ability buttons.

By the way, a minor quibble (since this is a quibble-thread, after all): Unique features (on the map) in FfH2 have that nice big label (just the standard Civ4 label for the map), so you can see their name without hovering over the actual feature - would it be possible to get the same labelling for the unique features in Planetfall?

I've put it on the to-do list, but I probably won't get to it for a long time.

Crap. I don't have Photoshop. :(I pulled it out the file and attached it as a PNG file - that keeps the transparency and makes re-use easy-peasy, I hope.
Then no confusion would be possible, and the colour of the promotions wouldn't really matter anyway.Ah, I see. Though I have to say I'd miss the ability to further customise units through promotions, especially after the last promo of the line is received - but let's keep this thread about the graphics.
So unless you could write a guide similar to the tech/fac button creation guide, one which works for a freely available program like GIMP, it is best not to start using another style for special ability buttons.Hmmm... I could produce a photoshop template that could be used pretty easily, but I'm not experienced with GIMP. However, the template for this particular style is *very* similar to the standard promotion button - if you can create Civ4-style promotion buttons, I could supply you with the background and give you the colour values for the raised part - that should result in near identical buttons.
I've put it on the to-do list, but I probably won't get to it for a long time.Okay, nice to hear... do you take bribes? ;)

If so, here is one (joking, labels are very minor, focus on important issues): I adapted Deliverator's spice resource (with his permission, of course) and created a trench feature.

It has some issues - the edge looks harder than the old trench, but I cannot change that without getting a lot of flickering between the tiles. It can sometimes look a bit cut-off close to land, but I cannot change that without moving it closer to the surface, in which case submarines/carriers completely vanish below the texture if they fortify.

Apart from that, it looks very similar to the current trenches, though a little bit darker. If you use it on a transition between shelf and ocean, put it on the ocean tile, not on the shelf tile, it usually looks better that way.

Included the XML-code and a button as well.

Cheers, LT.

I pulled it out the file and attached it as a PNG file - that keeps the transparency and makes re-use easy-peasy, I hope.

Thanks!

Ah, I see. Though I have to say I'd miss the ability to further customise units through promotions, especially after the last promo of the line is received

The problem is more or less I don't have enough cool ideas to make both an interesting list of promotions AND special abilities for each unit. But as said, I'm not sure yet what to do. One possibility is to let special abilities enable certain promotions. Eg Barrage I would be a special ability. Barrage II & III would be promotions, further increasing the effect of the special ability.

Hmmm... I could produce a photoshop template that could be used pretty easily, but I'm not experienced with GIMP. However, the template for this particular style is *very* similar to the standard promotion button - if you can create Civ4-style promotion buttons, I could supply you with the background and give you the colour values for the raised part - that should result in near identical buttons.

Thanks - I could give it a try. :D

I adapted Deliverator's spice resource (with his permission, of course) and created a trench feature.

:woohoo: :goodjob:

Apart from that, it looks very similar to the current trenches, though a little bit darker. If you use it on a transition between shelf and ocean, put it on the ocean tile, not on the shelf tile, it usually looks better that way.

Ah, I'm afraid the trench feature is meant to be used on Coast terrain. :scared: I'll see how it looks.

Thanks - I could give it a try. :DOkay, I've attached the background I've used (in PNG, because it's lossless). The RGB value for the colour of the raised part is 150 (red) 173 (green) 214 (blue). Apart from that, it's basically the same as the Vanilla promotion button the light/dark part are layer effects in PS, but I guess GIMP has something similar, producing the bevelled look in a similar fashion.
Ah, I'm afraid the trench feature is meant to be used on Coast terrain. :scared: I'll see how it looks.If it doesn't work out, give me a response (preferably with screenshots and arrows), I may still be able to fiddle around with it, depending on what exactly you need.

And oh, I was looking through the request list - about the Psi Gate building: I can add a glow to that... but I always imagined a Gate to be, well ,more gate-shaped - more like a ground-based version of the bulk matter transmitter. Not like the "ascent to transcendence" building... so, do you just want a glow added, otherwise I would like to try my hand at an actual gate.

Cheers, LT.

And oh, I was looking through the request list - about the Psi Gate building: I can add a glow to that... but I always imagined a Gate to be, well ,more gate-shaped - more like a ground-based version of the bulk matter transmitter. Not like the "ascent to transcendence" building... so, do you just want a glow added, otherwise I would like to try my hand at an actual gate.

I'd say go ahead with it. After all, both the Dimensional Gate and the Psi Gate use the same graphic now. It won't hurt to have an extra graphic so both look different.

I think a Gate would work for the Dimensional Gate, but for the Psi Gate it would look too technical. The Psi Gate is using Psi after all, not some advanced physics.

For the record, in the past we have stumbled upon some building which, with some modifications, would work perfectly for a Dimensional Gate. It was from EE2 IIRC. Unfortunately I can't find it back. :( GeoModder, do you still have it or know where to find it somewhere?

Edit: It's the gate of the Herc Factory in this post:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=7462057&postcount=45

What about the barracks here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=319030)?
The look like a gate, and not technical.
Again, maybe not the most fitting, but also not bad imho.

I think a Gate would work for the Dimensional Gate, but for the Psi Gate it would look too technical. The Psi Gate is using Psi after all, not some advanced physics.Huh, IIRC, it came with the same tech in SMAC as the bulk matter transmitter, no? Considering the secret project video (Mirian about detached souls) and some note I vaguely remember, that the ascent to transcendence was also sort of "transmitted" by the Psi Gates, I always assumed that it was some sort of Psi/Tech-hybridisation - using some sort of teleportation device to transmit your body, while the psionic part tethered your consciousness to your body during the transmission - whereas the secret project represented some sort of large scale psi-less teleporter - mostly used for transporting large amounts of lifeless matter.
For the record, in the past we have stumbled upon some building which, with some modifications, would work perfectly for a Dimensional Gate. It was from EE2 IIRC.For a highly technical gate, this is definitely a great choice! I'd like to see that! ::goodjob:

Cheers, LT.

GeoModder, do you still have it or know where to find it somewhere?

I'll let you know once my desktop computer has a graphics card installed again. I downloaded it some months ago, so if I had it prior before I had a restore made and later on tried reverting to a restore point to fix my graphics card problem, it should still be on the harddrive.

Eh, creativity is a weird thing, so I ended up finishing my gate - but since it's probably not that fitting, I put it out for other people to use. For the current Planetfall Psi Gate... I took the model and replaced the floating ball with a glowing orb of light - I hope it's what Maniac had in mind with the glow!:)

Cheers, LT.

I think your own Psionic Gate model looks good.
I'll use it for the Dimensional Gate now. If that one gets another model, I'll move the graphic to the Psi Gate, and move the current Psi Gate graphic to another Planet-related building - some share the same graphic now IIRC.

I'll use it for the Dimensional Gate now. If that one gets another model, I'll move the graphic to the Psi Gate, and move the current Psi Gate graphic to another Planet-related building - some share the same graphic now IIRC.Ah, cool. Here's a little something, that kept me busy the last two days - too bad I didn't finish it in time for the patch today, but I tried to recreate the Subspace Generator (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=325761). The big shot from the side has similarities with the original shot (sans mountains), but as it was the only view, I had to improvise a bit - using the arched theme of the progenitors as well as the green glow from the victory film.

All around, I'm pretty happy how it turned out, though I don't like the beige colours (but I tried to keep to the original picture).

Also: Flavour-wise - how do the humans win using the Beacon? :confused:

Cheers, LT.

Thanks!
I recently had the idea to change the Dimensional Gate into a national building of which you can build five. The Subspace Generator would then require 5 Gates, and would be the final step to victory.

In this case you'd never actually see the Subspace Generator graphics in-game, so I think I'll use this graphics for both the Dimensional Gate and Subspace Generator.

I can then move the current Gate graphics around as mentioned before.

Also: Flavour-wise - how do the humans win using the Beacon? :confused:

The Subspace Generator creates a wormgate. The Progenitors use it to call home and summon a fleet. Humans can use it to start an era of galactic expansion. Or they could open tiny temporary wormholes above the capitals of their opponents and send through a planet buster. There would not yet be a defense against a generator of such power, so the first to complete a subspace generator calls the shots.

Of course that's just fluff to justify adding a hi-tech non-Transcendence victory condition for everyone.

Humans can use it to start an era of galactic expansion.Sure, just flavour - the gameplay is solid and nice and much better than the original Transcendence victory (build a big wonder and win? Laaaaame - at least from the gameplay perspective, from the flavour, it's awesome!) I like this idea a lot! It's basically humans going to becoming Stargate (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stargate_(device))-builders - and becoming independent of a single planet, meaning humanity is wouldn't even go extinct in the case of a global cataclysm. I like that positive spin on it a lot more than seeing it as weaponised system - of course, it's just personal preference. I can only assume that Miriam would use it slightly differently! :lol:

Cheers, LT.

Oh, I don't like to double-post... but with just an edit, Maniac would probably overlook this post... so:

1) Actual graphics quibble (after all, that was the point of the thread, originally! ;)): Could asioasioasio's wide citybar (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=6762) be included in Planetfall? Most names - of units and base names alike - are a bit longer than in plain CivIV, hence the issue crops up way more often - including this would make stuff look neater.

2) Since the material supplies still have an untextured model, I whipped up a new one - it's just a quick thing, an unity pod on treads - it's not animated, but it will be animated once I have an idea what to put inside the pod (then the activation animation would be opening the pod, a bit like a clamshell), screenshot and model attached, used fScale = 0.75; fInterfaceScale = 1.5 (should be close to the size of the current unity pods).

3) Flamethrowers are everywhere in the early game! Which is cool, because they're a cool unit... but I thought a bit of variety couldn't hurt, so I replaced the yellow stripes with teamcolour-stripes - see screenshot and attachment (just a couple of replacement files to overwrite the original model/texture).

Cheers, LT.

Haha, I love #2. #3 is great too.

Related to #1, is there a reason why I'm restricted to 15 characters or less for new city names? I assume it's not just me.

1)

I'll check it out.

2)

Thanks! :D
May I make some suggestions though?
Would it be possible to add a driver cabin? The pod could be partially resting on its roof. I also don't think the pod in the unit graphics per se needs to be of the same size as the pod improvement.

3)

Cool thanks! I always felt those yellow stripes made the flamethrower look a little too clean, civilian and civilized for my tastes. They look better now IMO.

Related to #1, is there a reason why I'm restricted to 15 characters or less for new city names? I assume it's not just me.

Is this a Planetfall thing or a vanilla Civ4 thing?

Is this a Planetfall thing or a vanilla Civ4 thing?

Also the case in unmodded Civ4.


@ Lord Tirian

Cool ( ;) ) new flame throwers!

2) Since the material supplies still have an untextured model, I whipped up a new one - it's just a quick thing, an unity pod on treads - it's not animated, but it will be animated once I have an idea what to put inside the pod (then the activation animation would be opening the pod, a bit like a clamshell), screenshot and model attached, used fScale = 0.75; fInterfaceScale = 1.5 (should be close to the size of the current unity pods).

Idea for an animation both for the unity pod improvement and supply pod unit: two little flashing red lights, positioned as you can see on supply_sm.pcx

I have some bad news.

Since Lord Tirian told me how I can see how much triangles a model has, I had a look at how many polygons the graphics currently in Planetfall use. And I discovered a lot of the graphics have much more polygons than I'd expect from glancing at the wireframe of the model. This includes ALL of woodelf's graphics. :(

If I understand correctly from previous cases, a model can be converted to a nif in an inefficient manner which creates lots of triangles. But when converted right, the nif can have much less triangles without any loss of quality at all.

The good news is that if these models were processed correctly, Planetfall would probably run much smoother, less lag when scrolling over the map etc. So I'm wondering if it's possible to process the existing nifs to reduce their polygon count. Or is that impossible without the source file before it got converted to nif? :(
I realize fixing old stuff is probably much more boring than creating models for new stuff, but doing it would improve Planetfall a lot.

Lord Tirian (or anyone else), interested in taking a look at what can be done?

These are the things that stood out to me during my review of the files in the Pak0.fpk:

Some stuff I put between brackets because at first glance their # of triangles seems to match the model's complexity. But because they were made by the same author who made extremely high polygon models, I assume my first glance could be wrong, and their poly count could be significantly reduced as well.

Stuff from woodelf:

Buildings:

Academy
(Alpha Prime)
Atmospheric Processor
Hologram Theatre
Sea Base/Pressure Dome
Sea Wall (currently found in the 'test facility' folder)
Temple of Planet
Biology Lab
Arrival Era Headquarters/Landing Pods: the legs are complex, but 10000+ polygons???
Cloning Vats
(Energy Bank)
Fission/Unity Reactor (same stuff in both folders)
Maintenance Bay
Network Node

This list is not complete. There are a couple other simple buildings as well, with still a higher than expected poly count. But because the model is so simple the poly count still only is 100 or so. Eg the rec commons, rec tanks...

Citysets:

caretakers_cityset.nif
spartans_cityset.nif
believers_cityset.nif

Improvements:

(Field Lab)
Landworked
(Tidal Harness)

Units:

(Foil)
(Needlejet)
Rover (a model by keldath which uses woodelf's rover as base)
Unity Rover (in the 'Tank' folder)
Transport Foil
Unity Foil

Stuff from other creators, or the creators are unknown to me because GeoModder found the model

Buildings:

- Aerospace Complex: As far as I can tell, this model may have a normal amount of triangles for how detailed it is, but I don't think it *needs* to be as detailed. For instance there are lots of half-spheres made of many sides (=faces?). At the scale these buildings are displayed in-game, these spheres could be made of much less faces and you wouldn't notice the difference.
- Antimatter Reactor: Scene Viewer crashes when I try to open this one. Can someone tell me how much triangles this one has?
- (Energy Nexus)
- Nuclear Reactor
- (Observation Bay)
- (Subsea Trunkline)
- Supercollider

Improvements:

- Solar Collector: Scene Viewer crashes when I try to open this one. Can someone tell me how much triangles this one has?
- Unity Pod

Resources

- Alien Artifact: 5000+ polygons! By The_Reckoning.

Units

- Sea Colony Pod: The_Reckoning
- Unity Supplies: The_Reckoning
- Supply Crawler: err, don't remember the author - could be The_Reckoning as well

Planetfall also includes a couple buildings which AFAIK come from Empire Earth 2. They have many triangles, but they are also more detailed than the average civ4 building, so perhaps that poly count is normal. Still judging from The_Coyote's unit conversion it seems possible to seriously reduce polycount with hardly any negative effect on the looks. Perhaps the same is possible with these buildings? For instance it's pointless to keep those small windows in the Military Academy. Might as well remove them and add some black rectangles for windows to the dds texture instead. The models are:

- hydroplant.nif
- Skunkworks
- Assembly Hall
- Military Academy

If I understand correctly from previous cases, a model can be converted to a nif in an inefficient manner which creates lots of triangles. But when converted right, the nif can have much less triangles without any loss of quality at all.Not quite - you need to look out whether it's a TriShape or a TriStrips in Nifskope.

TriShapes (which the majority of Firaxis models use) have less polygons, but they are less efficiently rendered. TriStrips (these seem to be the culprit for the high poly models in Planetfall) have a lot more polygons, but are faster to render per polygon (for example if both had the same number of polys, the Strips one would be better) - however, if the difference is massive, then the Shapes will win out - simply because the Strips have so many more polygons, that even increased efficiency doesn't help (I don't exactly know where the cut-off point is, though I'm pretty sure that stuff with several 1000s of polygons is definitely bad).

However, looking through Planetfall's models now, a lot of models not only suffer from that problem, but they are also overly complex. There is a lot that can be achieved with texture alone instead of actual modelling (especially on a CivIV-scale). Also, several of them also have extraneous sides (like at the bottom and so forth) - the Alien artefact is a prime example - it's a great model you could probably put in a film - for the map, it's overkill.

For the conversion from Strips to Shapes: That's relatively easy, one can do that in Nifskope (right-click on the model, Mesh>Triangulate) - but it doesn't work all the time. And for cutting of polygons and actual trimming, one has to go to Blender (or 3DSMax, I guess, but I don't have/use that). And there's definitely stuff to be done, I guess.

I'd like to help with that, but it's a lot - and some seem to be fiddly and not just straightforward conversions (some textures are also weirdly mapped), meaning some are close to from-scratch recreations - so don't expect miracles. And, I have to admit, some models simply don't appeal to me - there are some I'd like to redesign from scratch at some point. Anyway, I'll see what I can do, and perhaps somebody else will also help out (though most graphics guys around seem to have found their own mod they're dedicated to, like Deliverator to Dune, SeZ to FfH and so forth).

On another note (that's why I actually went into the thread in the first place!) - I tried to tweak the material supplies, and simply attaching a driver cabin didn't look good, so I decided to create a basic industrial vehicle first (and with crates instead of the pod, it could work as the initial supply unit) - what do you think, Maniac? (see attached screenshot)

Cheers, LT.

unfortunally it´s exactly like Lord Tirian posted - if there are no parts which can be removed easily from the model it will be hard (sometimes removing doubles in Blender does wonders). Also the transformation can be done easlily

Also in most case it´s almost faster to create a new model instead of trying to fix the old one (and the first is for a modeller also the bigger fun ;) - btw i started with a kind of scout rover - no idea if it will be ever finished - and really nice transport vehicles Lord Tirian) even sometimes part can be used (as i did to create the seaformer)

considering the Strips / Shape problem, after today seeing this: http://niftools.sourceforge.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=2274 i´m mo longer sure that there can be found a border that easy - i thought something about 20 - 40% more poly is the tolerance area, but now, how shall we know if civs displays this degenaret polys ... :confused: - so i think i will use my old borders until we will know more.

And than there is also the difference between shader (up to 18 bones per partition) and non shader (4 bones per partition, atm skin partition can´t be created) models and number of objects to drawn (i think i saw something like that the number of partitions is the number of objects needed to draw the model - but i´m absolutly unsure here [no partition could mean 18 objects following this logic]) which shall have an impact

Not quite - you need to look out whether it's a TriShape or a TriStrips in Nifskope.

Wow, that's a relief. Then the situation is not as bad as I thought.
Still, following The_Coyote's rule of thumb, even if many of the models had a third less polygons, they would still have way more than one would expect.

And, I have to admit, some models simply don't appeal to me - there are some I'd like to redesign from scratch at some point.

Feel free to redesign to your heart's content. ;) There are some models I don't really like either. Re buildings for instance, in some cases GeoModder just used whatever was available in the downloads database. Also I feel buildings sometimes don't match with the faction's cityset style and colours. Though in that case giving the same models a different texture for each faction is probably enough.

For the record, if I had to assign priority to some stuff to fix or redesign, I'd suggest the following:

- spartans_cityset.nif
- believers_cityset.nif

These are displayed most often of the models in the list, so making these models more efficient or making more efficient models, would free most graphical memory.

- Alien Artifact
- Sea Colony Pod

These still need textures anyway, and unlike the polygon record holder the HQs/Landing Pods for instance, these two still appear in the later game when there's plenty of other stuff to be displayed on the screen, so they're more likely to slow down the game.

Deliverator to Dune

Yeah, he creates cool stuff. I was thinking I could use his sandstorm to represent the Great Dunes. Now just figure out what special effect the Great Dunes landmark could give...

On another note (that's why I actually went into the thread in the first place!) - I tried to tweak the material supplies, and simply attaching a driver cabin didn't look good, so I decided to create a basic industrial vehicle first (and with crates instead of the pod, it could work as the initial supply unit) - what do you think, Maniac? (see attached screenshot)

I like it very much! Crates on the back sounds good for the initial Supply Pod.

An idea for the Material Supplies unit: perhaps there a landing pod graphic could lie sideways on the back instead of crates? Those units can be used to hurry one of the early Unity Bay secret projects, so it seems fitting.

An idea for the Material Supplies unit: perhaps there a landing pod graphic could lie sideways on the back instead of crates? Those units can be used to hurry one of the early Unity Bay secret projects, so it seems fitting.I finished the supply pod with crates, but I'm still working on the material supplies. The problem is that the headquarter/landing pod graphic is a polygon monster! I tried to cut it down... but had no success so far - I'm afraid I need to do it from scratch - but I'm confident that I can produce a less heavy model. On the upside, this should also yield a slimmer HQ graphics together with the material supplies - it will just take a bit more time.

But I finished something I started before that - I added the flashing lights to the unity pod. And also converted it to TriShapes, so it went down to 344 polygons, which sounds pretty acceptable. It's attached, should work, I tested it in-game and it looked fine.

Cheers, LT.

Okay, finished with the revision of the landing pods/HQs - though I haven't put a pod on a crawler yet - because that would require me to come up with a bottom of a pod first... can't be bothered with that right now, I'm just happy to have the HQs finished!

My model used the monument picture from SMAC as original, so the legs are thinner than the current model, as I tried to stay close to the picture. And oh, the screenshot is with the university model, the coloured stripe and banner of other factions is more visible on the other models, as they don't have colours almost identical to the rest of the hull.

They're a bit heavier than I hoped - the HQ has 1352 polygons. I could only get lower by making the legs ugly. But 1352 polygons isn't that bad, considering that they're unique buildings that only exist during the early game - so I hope it can pass. It's still better than the 10000+ polygons before, I guess.

As always, stuff is attached; use fScale = 2.25 and fInterfaceScale = 0.72, or it will look tiny.

Cheers, LT.

- spartans_cityset.nif


gave it a try, no idea how fitting it is [the cityset nif is already game ready (18 buildings, used the existing nif as base) - in the other nif are all buildings i made (24) - perhaps you can use them or a better cityset is created with them]

Weeeee! Thanks for all the graphics guys!

I'll ask GeoModder if he can enable the new 24-building cityset.

Lord Tirian, where did you get those faction icons without scanlines from? Do you also have those for the SMAX factions?

Lord Tirian, where did you get those faction icons without scanlines from? Do you also have those for the SMAX factions?I got them from the faction files - the ones for the victory monument, where the faction symbol floats above the planet. I cropped them and cleaned them up a bit - if you need them, I could do the same for the SMAX factions (either as files for the landing pods or as normal PNG so you can use them for something else).

Cheers, LT.

That would be great!

I'd need them to create faction icon buttons for the five SMAX factions to be included. They're used in the datalinks, the dawn of man screen etc.

Though Rubin seems to have used some special graphical tricks on the original seven faction icon buttons - probably won't be able to replicate it. :scared:

I'd need them to create faction icon buttons for the five SMAX factions to be included. They're used in the datalinks, the dawn of man screen etc.Okay, I'll see what I can do - I probably need to clean them up a little more in that case - a bit of sloppiness was okay for the small headquarters icons...
Though Rubin seems to have used some special graphical tricks on the original seven faction icon buttons - probably won't be able to replicate it. :scared:Hmmm... from a cursory glance, it looks a lot like the way the tech buttons are created, just with the actual faction logo instead of the marbled fill as base. I wouldn't bet on it though.

Additionally, I finished the revision of the alien artefact - new version has 528 polygons and should look pretty similar, just with texture now. I left out the socket, because it's not part of the artefact anyway.

I used fScale = 1.5; fInterfaceScale = 1.66 for the screenshot.

Cheers, LT.

I'll ask GeoModder if he can enable the new 24-building cityset;

Sure mate. Just drop me a PM or email when you have a version/patch done I can work on. :)

That would be great!Done and attached.
Sure mate. Just drop me a PM or email when you have a version/patch done I can work on. :)I noticed something about the 24-building set: The buildings are really dark, so you might want to copy the material settings from the 18-building set.

Cheers, LT.

wow :eek: changed the value there and didn´t save the nif - here the buildings with changed material setting

wow :eek: changed the value there and didn´t save the nif - here the buildings with changed material setting

I already started copying buildings from the 24 building file to the 18 building file (the 24 building file doesn't have NiNode's for the separate buildings so to my knowledge isn't usable to show a cityset ingame). Do copied/pasted buildings automatically inherit this material setting thingie of the 18 building file, or do they take this with them from their original file?

the models use the material setting before you copy them (in other words, you also copy the setting, also your # 2) - in the 24 building nif the all use the same so you can change all with one change)
was not sure which information are needed for cityset (and what must be done in the xml), the reason why i only copied some buildings in the existing 18 building sparta cityset

Thanks for the info. I'll probably need to copy 3 buildings again then.
But in general I used your spartans_cityset file to paste 5 more buildings in them and used the biggest one as the Spartan HQ (it was too big in size to fit in any of the cityset leafnodes).

In any case, it looks marvelous, as you can see on the screenshot. :goodjob:

In any case, it looks marvelous, as you can see on the screenshot. :goodjob:Cool, it does look good! :goodjob:

But since we're talking about city sets already... I have the feeling that most city sets are scaled a bit... small. The best looking sets - university and peacekeepers - buildings that are a notch larger than the others (ditto for Morgan, but it uses reskinned vanilla art - which also seems to be a bit bigger).

Do you think one could improve the look of the cities a bit by fiddling with the scale? Especially for the Gaians, I think. If their tower-like rock structures (like on their diplomacy landscape shot) would be closer to the university structures in scale, I think they would look a lot more convincing and less like little rocks.

Cheers, LT.

Do you think one could improve the look of the cities a bit by fiddling with the scale? Especially for the Gaians, I think. If their tower-like rock structures (like on their diplomacy landscape shot) would be closer to the university structures in scale, I think they would look a lot more convincing and less like little rocks.

Easy enough. One just needs to increase the <Scale> parameter of the cityset entries in the Civ4CityLSystem file. In case of the Spartan cityset I've put the 1x1 buildings on scale 0.9, and the buildings from the larger nodes on scale 0.85. For about half the buildings it wouldn't be a problem, but those with support walls angling out of the main body, those would likely crop into other buildings. But I think a general 0.05 increase wouldn't do harm at all.

It's usually possible in nifskope or Sceneviewer to increase the size in only one axis, but that's more tricky. If you want more towerlike appearances for the Gaians, that would be the thing to do I suppose. But that will also stretch the textures on them vertically.

Improvements:
(Field Lab)
Landworked
(Tidal Harness)Okay, I tried to slim these down a bit, mostly with success:

Field Lab: Went from 940 to 844 polys - not so much (but absolutely no quality loss!), but I was able to remap parts of textures, so you can lose the moonera1.dds texture - it's all in one texture now, meaning less loading required (also did some minor tweaking of the texture so it's not so glaring white, but still looks "clean", but that's probably something most people won't even notice... :lol: ).
Landworked: Just edited the nif a bit... and went from 728 to 396 polys! No new texture and the model is a bit simplified and looks less good - but this model isn't visible in the Datalinks and it's pretty small on the map as well, so I assume that you won't really notice the loss of some details.
Tidal Harness: A shame that half the model is underwater! I lifted it up a bit, so you can see a bit more of it and cut some parts that are still under the waterline anyway: Went from 448 to 344 polys and retouched the texture a bit to make it look less like a grey box.

No screenshots, because that's just tweaking, nothing to show off...
If you want more towerlike appearances for the Gaians, that would be the thing to do I suppose. But that will also stretch the textures on them vertically.By the way, I played around a bit - for some structures, the scale can be increased without any problems or major clipping issues (mainly the rather slim brown towers - for the stone-grey buildings however - not so easy), however some would need some actual tweaking.

But I still have enough to do before I tackle this, I guess... (not that I mind!)

Cheers, LT.

I'm trying to clean up the Civ4ArtDefines_Building file, but for the Dimensional Gate, Subspace Generator, Psi Gate and Empath Guild its difficult to figure out which building uses what graphic. I assume the Subspace Generator uses LT's Subspace Generator graphic (the square building with the rotating ball), the Psi Gate uses the archlike structure with the platform and blue gate graphic, the Empath Guild uses JustATourist's (IIRC) round graphic with the glowing ball floating over it? That leaves the Dimensional gate, which is linked to the Subspace Generator's graphic too in that file...

Thanks!
I recently had the idea to change the Dimensional Gate into a national building of which you can build five. The Subspace Generator would then require 5 Gates, and would be the final step to victory.

In this case you'd never actually see the Subspace Generator graphics in-game, so I think I'll use this graphics for both the Dimensional Gate and Subspace Generator.

I can then move the current Gate graphics around as mentioned before.

Ah, here I have an explanation. I gather the Gate-like structure is then for the Psigate, and the cirkel structure with the glowing orb above for the Empath Guild?

Done and attached.

Thanks! I'll ask Rubin if he used the same method to create both the faction and tech buttons.

But since we're talking about city sets already... I have the feeling that most city sets are scaled a bit... small. The best looking sets - university and peacekeepers - buildings that are a notch larger than the others (ditto for Morgan, but it uses reskinned vanilla art - which also seems to be a bit bigger).

The Landing Pods could certainly use an increase in scale. (see attachment)
Anyone else seeing that white stuff around the HQ btw? :confused:

For about half the buildings it wouldn't be a problem, but those with support walls angling out of the main body, those would likely crop into other buildings. But I think a general 0.05 increase wouldn't do harm at all.

Would it work to put a couple of them in a bigger node? (see attachment)

Okay, I tried to slim these down a bit, mostly with success: Field Lab: Landworked: Tidal Harness:

Thanks! Included in patch f.

Ah, here I have an explanation. I gather the Gate-like structure is then for the Psigate, and the cirkel structure with the glowing orb above for the Empath Guild?

Yep. The graphics they currently have are intended.
I didn't feel like changing the names at the time, as that would have meant delaying the patch.

Anyone else seeing that white stuff around the HQ btw? :confused:Isn't that the endpiece of the Magtube in the centre of the base? Because every base always gets the earliest road improvement on its tile automatically (since you can't build it with a worker/former) - and the magtube is Planetfall's earliest road.

Cheers, LT.

The Landing Pods could certainly use an increase in scale. (see attachment)
Anyone else seeing that white stuff around the HQ btw? :confused:

I've done the scale increase. Those landing pods now fill their node nicely.
The "white stuff" is indeed the magtube network central node. You can avoid it only if you link the arrival era to another kind of road. I think you see it now because the magnetwork is already active in the first era, even though magtubes cannot be build.

Would it work to put a couple of them in a bigger node? (see attachment)

Yes of course. But then you'll have a higher number of blank spots in a base plot, because the computer doesn't find enough graphics to fill the 1x2 node. :)
In any case, I already increased the size by 0.05. Let me know what you think once I sent the files over.

Yep. The graphics they currently have are intended.
I didn't feel like changing the names at the time, as that would have meant delaying the patch.

Well, it delays future work because things all need to be sorted out again on my end. :scan:

The "white stuff" is indeed the magtube network central node. You can avoid it only if you link the arrival era to another kind of road. I think you see it now because the magnetwork is already active in the first era, even though magtubes cannot be build.

Ah thanks.
Is the magtube still so visible if the landing pod is increased in size? No need to invent another solution if that might already solve the issue.

Yes of course. But then you'll have a higher number of blank spots in a base plot, because the computer doesn't find enough graphics to fill the 1x2 node. :)

I don't understand. As far as I can tell from the other citysets, there is no fixed number of 1x2 or whatever nodes required. :confused:

If there are, what are the required numbers?

Ah thanks.
Is the magtube still so visible if the landing pod is increased in size? No need to invent another solution if that might already solve the issue.

It's covered more, but you can see for yourself in the upload I just made in my thread of the team forum.

I don't understand. As far as I can tell from the other citysets, there is no fixed number of 1x2 or whatever nodes required. :confused:

In my experience there are more "gaps" in a base plot if the computer doesn't find nodes from the smaller sizes (1x1, 1x2, 2x1) in xml. Or if only a single one is linked in say the 1x2 node, that graphic will be used ovet and over again to cover a 1x2 node with a building.
It's just a "fashion" thing, nothing else. :)

Okay... new model time. Finished the transport crawlers - one unloaded (205 polys; you might find an use), one with crates (643 polys; for the initial unity supplies) and one hauling around a landing pod - a crashed one (543 polys; for material supplies).

Make sure to read the readme-file, I noted down the scales there and also where to put the textures (because they share the base texture). Screenshot and files attached.

Cheers, LT.

Heheh, those are nice looking, Lord Tirian. :D

Very cool!

I like them a lot as well :)

Thanks for the units Lord Tirian! :goodjob:

As I was looking through the units... I was looking at the datalinks a lot - and something bothered me: The backgrounds for units are Earth backgrounds. For water units, that's okay, oceans are oceans... but for land units? So I changed the land background a bit, it should look more fitting now. Also a bit for the air background - instead of a bright beach, there's now a arid coast below!

Furthermore, I didn't like the magtube graphics, so I reskinned the warplane graphics from FF to blue - I think they look more "route"-ish than the jumplanes (mainly because it's not a single blue energy beam, but something wider). Added bonus: The connectors are smaller and hence the connector that appears in bases will be less obtrusive than the big white something from the jumplane.

Finally, I wanted to make the plasma thrower plasma more... plasma-like. Now it's glowing and bright! I like it, but it's pretty bright, so people may think that I've overdone it - if so, tell me and I'll turn it down a bit.

The zip contains all three tweaks, but they're pretty easy to sort out, in case you don't want to use all of them (I guess the route change may be something that's more a matter of taste - and maybe ditto for the plasma). Also attached are screenshots.

Of course, if something is "not quite right", tell me and I will fiddle around, like changing textures a bit or changing colours etc.)

Cheers, LT.

Nice tweaks there, Lord Tirian. :goodjob:
Although I'd like to see the plasma effect in motion first. :scan:

Although I'd like to see the plasma effect in motion first. :scan:Hey, if it does turn out to be too bright, I made a second version that's less bright, more like a bluish flame - I've attached a screenshot. Also, I discovered that the particle system can produce hilarious overkill effects - I've made a second screenshot showing a short test of what the Helion could use as "flamethrower" (looks more like a "sunthrower!" :lol: ).

Cheers, LT.

...I've made a second screenshot showing a short test of what the Helion could use as "flamethrower" (looks more like a "sunthrower!" :lol: )...

Preliminary analysis indicates that our rivals have developed a safe and reliable
method to simulate conditions existing on the interior of a stellar mass.
The fabrication and transmutation of materials possible in such an environment
guarantees significant industrial and military applications.

Probe Team Operations Directorate,
Top Secret Report

:mischief:

Not to be left behind, this is what you might find in Planetfall next update with Maniac's consent.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=220839&d=1247432361

I discovered that the particle system can produce hilarious overkill effects

Particle systems seem to be something that no one has really investigated. Changing the colour is pretty straightforward, but everything else seems to be unknown. If you have discovered anything about how they work it would be great to know it... ;)

As I was looking through the units... I was looking at the datalinks a lot - and something bothered me: The backgrounds for units are Earth backgrounds. For water units, that's okay, oceans are oceans... but for land units? So I changed the land background a bit, it should look more fitting now. Also a bit for the air background - instead of a bright beach, there's now a arid coast below!

Thanks! :D This has long bothered me too, but I didn't know where to change it.

Finally, I wanted to make the plasma thrower plasma more... plasma-like. Now it's glowing and bright! I like it, but it's pretty bright, so people may think that I've overdone it - if so, tell me and I'll turn it down a bit.

Thanks, this was in fact bothering me too. :mischief:
I don't really have an opinion (or see any difference :blush: ) between the two varieties of flame brightness you posted.

Furthermore, I didn't like the magtube graphics, so I reskinned the warplane graphics from FF to blue - I think they look more "route"-ish than the jumplanes (mainly because it's not a single blue energy beam, but something wider). Added bonus: The connectors are smaller and hence the connector that appears in bases will be less obtrusive than the big white something from the jumplane.

I don't really have an opinion on this one - all the available magtube graphics look good to me. So I might as well follow your preference. I didn't include this one in the just released patch though. Reason: I had a look at the CvPlot::checkLateEra which was added by Firaxis in patch 3.19, and this makes it possible to change when roads change to their late era graphics (instead of the current # of eras / 2). So we can have two different sets of magtubes: I'd let them change graphics upon research of Gravitonics. I figured I'd ask you guys which graphics you would like to use for the pre- and post-Gravitonics magtubes.

One hurdle before I can implement this though: while it's possible to change the code that decides when the 'late era' kicks in, I haven't got a clue (or have forgotten) how the game knows what graphics it should use for the late era roads. I don't see anything in the XML. :confused: Furthermore, all the faction-specific eras (except the PKs) are in the second half of the list of Eras in CIV4EraInfos.xml, so under the current code I would expect the magtubes to already start with modern road graphics instead of the jumplane graphics. Yet they don't.

GeoModder, can you shed some light on this? IIRC you had some previous experience on this matter? Or at least I remember us talking about it.

Btw, could you please put the Morgan Industries image between spoilers or turn it into a thumbnail? It's screwing up the thread layout.

Thanks, this was in fact bothering me too. :mischief:
I don't really have an opinion (or see any difference :blush: ) between the two varieties of flame brightness you posted.The first one is more translucent - sort of re-colours everything behind it to bright blue tones. The second one is more like a glowing material - after testing the both of them in tandem, I now prefer the second one because it feels like it has "more volume" or is more tangible. Also, I fixed the plasmathrower's animations, so you don't hear the machine gun when he fires, just the fiery kawoosh. The revised effect and the animation fix are both attached - you might want to test both plasma flames, but my preference is now with the second version.
I'd let them change graphics upon research of Gravitonics. I figured I'd ask you guys which graphics you would like to use for the pre- and post-Gravitonics magtubes.Oh, that's cool! I'd love to see the current beam graphic as post-Gravitonics graphics! I only fiddled around with it, because I felt an energy beam looks too advanced for a magtube you get mid-game. As sort of super-advanced technology (like Gravitonics), the beam is a great fit, however!

Cheers, LT.

Thanks for the plasma thrower update!

For the earlier magtube graphics, I assume you prefer your recoloured blueish over the unmodded orangeish?

One hurdle before I can implement this though: while it's possible to change the code that decides when the 'late era' kicks in, I haven't got a clue (or have forgotten) how the game knows what graphics it should use for the late era roads. I don't see anything in the XML. :confused: Furthermore, all the faction-specific eras (except the PKs) are in the second half of the list of Eras in CIV4EraInfos.xml, so under the current code I would expect the magtubes to already start with modern road graphics instead of the jumplane graphics. Yet they don't.

GeoModder, can you shed some light on this? IIRC you had some previous experience on this matter? Or at least I remember us talking about it.

IIRC it's in the SDK directly linked to the number of era's. in Vanilla game the 7 era's are divided in 3 downwards which results in a Ancient/Classical, Medieval/Renaissance and Industrial/Modern/Future block. Since your mod started with 3 era's that made things easy, but I have no idea how those faction-specific era's would influence it. In worst case, every faction is down to two era's. If that is the case, adding a new era for each faction would solve it.
We can test it actually. Just put 3 graphics on the same building for each era (arrival, expansion and crossfire), and see if despite that a faction switches to its own era after arrival, the graphic changes according to era. If it does, magtubes should do the same.


Btw, could you please put the Morgan Industries image between spoilers or turn it into a thumbnail? It's screwing up the thread layout.

Done. Sorry.

In worst case, every faction is down to two era's. If that is the case, adding a new era for each faction would solve it.At that point, it's adding at least 7 eras (not counting the SMAX factions) - wouldn't it be easier to just use four eras (Arrival/Expansion/Alien Crossfire) and make the art difference an ArtStyle-thing, just like the different artstyles (European, Asian, etc.) are handled in vanilla civ?

Or is there anything that would prohibit that from working? (note: I'm not saying it should be done that way or anything - it's more scholarly interest in the matter, because the eras + artstyles-thing sounds simpler to me, as implementing additional eras would add a lot of work anyway - meaning reworking it to artstyles wouldn't be much more work and perhaps cleaner to implement as well)

Cheers, LT.

Geo, you're confusing lots of things.

The division of eras in three groups is for unit graphics only. It has nothing to do with building graphics, nor with road graphics. I already know from the SDK the trigger that makes the road change graphics. What I don't know is how the game knows what graphics to use for modern road graphics.

Anyway, I'll take that to mean you don't know the answer either.

Ugh never mind. I somehow managed to overlook the following in CIV4RouteModelInfos.xml:

<ModelFile>Art/Terrain/Routes/WarpandJumpLanes/JumpLaneD02.nif</ModelFile>
<LateModelFile>Art/Terrain/Routes/WarpandJumpLanes/JumpLaneD02.nif</LateModelFile>

I did a search for 'modern roads' with Windows Grep, but that didn't give any results in the XML. Reason for that simply is that IIRC Firaxis disabled the use of different graphics for modern roads in one of the patches.

Geo, you're confusing lots of things.

The division of eras in three groups is for unit graphics only. It has nothing to do with building graphics, nor with road graphics. I already know from the SDK the trigger that makes the road change graphics. What I don't know is how the game knows what graphics to use for modern road graphics.

Anyway, I'll take that to mean you don't know the answer either.

However confusing I am, I just did figure out that a graphic won't change in the Crossfire era. The faction specific era is appearantly paramount.
However, a way to let a graphic change how you want it is to rename de jumplane nifs to the modern road nifs.
So if you changed warplanea00.nif to RailroadA00.nif, the game should show the jumplane graphic instead of the railroad graphic.
Of course, since Planetfall seems based on Final Frontier graphicswise, I'm not sure if that would hinder it.

Edit: ah, the file I forget each time. Glad to see you found a more elegant answer. :D

For the earlier magtube graphics, I assume you prefer your recoloured blueish over the unmodded orangeish?Actually, I don't care either way - I just made it bluish to match the current colour scheme (I just assumed you preferred something blue, because you used the jumplanes) - and because SMAC also had bluish tinted graphics. Plus, changing the colour is quickly done - so take the original colour or tell me what colour you want - you get it.

Just make sure to use my nif-files, because I adjusted the height to place the connectors exactly on the ground (and I made the connectors a bit smaller, because I really don't like huge pods standing around in the landscape) - that was the really tedious bit to modify all of them!

Cheers, LT.

Hey, just a little update: Fiddled around with the maintenance bay and the energy nexus.

The maintenance bay is now down to 232 polys (before: 1231 polys, though with TriStrips - but even with The_Coyote's 1.5x rule, that's a vast improvement) - mainly gained by removing hidden faces and the overly complex pipe. As last finishing touch, I made the walls inside the bay a bit darker that the outside walls.

The energy nexus went down to 498 polys (before: 1710, though again TriStrips) - it's more of a redesign - I took the basic shape, but made it six barrels (because of the six-city prerequisite; also, I was able to cut a lot of polys there), made the central monolith larger and six-sided and made a new texture, though it's very reminiscent of the old one.

Both models use the old scale and file names, so just put them in and replace the old ones.

Cheers, LT.

Nice work, LT.
I was wondering, since on the Energy Nexus such a barrel represent the energy bank themself, if a single barrel shouldn't replace the current energybank model? That's a TriStrips model too with almost 1900 polygons.

Any thoughts about that, Maniac? It would free this HothGenerator model for a secret project or a late-tech facility like the singularity inductor or somesuch which can't be expected to be build a lot that late in the game.

Thanks for the models Lord Tirian! :D

Any thoughts about that, Maniac? It would free this HothGenerator model for a secret project or a late-tech facility like the singularity inductor or somesuch which can't be expected to be build a lot that late in the game.

I'd rather first ask Lord Tirian if he would be interested in revising the Energy Bank/Hoth Generator some time. :)

I'd rather first ask Lord Tirian if he would be interested in revising the Energy Bank/Hoth Generator some time. :)It's going to be the next thing I'm working on (the other thing that I'm working on is a new Network Node). I'll run with the basic shape from the Hoth Generator, but I think it will need a bit of work to get the polycount down and perhaps there are other things I'll tweak.

Today, I tried the barrel idea - but doesn't look good, it keeps looking like some generic industry tank/silo/whatever - it only works for the nexus because the monolith with the clear classic shapes is a nice contrast and changes the overall feel away from "tank" (and that's the reason why I kept the idea of using the monolith instead of some sci-fi building - for Planetfall, a mix of "tech" with strong clean cut shapes seems to be a good overall look and feel - at least for the human buildings, that's a theme I want to use repeatedly).

@GeoModder: Little question: Planetfall has a waterworked graphic that is also used (occasionally) as a landworked graphic - is it possible to implement different graphics and make the landworked graphic appear on all worked tiles? As far as I know, it should be possible, as vanilla Civ has the different boats and I think - but I'm not sure - also has a landworked graphic that appears, in case there isn't a specifically animated improvement (like the mines etc.). Furthermore, how much can you control that landworked graphic to avoid it clipping into improvements - i.e. can you make a model appear close to the edge of a plot or would one need to make the nif in a fashion to include that offset? I just had a neat little idea what could be a general landworked (and waterworked) model for Planetfall.

Cheers, LT.

@GeoModder: Little question: Planetfall has a waterworked graphic that is also used (occasionally) as a landworked graphic - is it possible to implement different graphics and make the landworked graphic appear on all worked tiles? As far as I know, it should be possible, as vanilla Civ has the different boats and I think - but I'm not sure - also has a landworked graphic that appears, in case there isn't a specifically animated improvement (like the mines etc.). Furthermore, how much can you control that landworked graphic to avoid it clipping into improvements - i.e. can you make a model appear close to the edge of a plot or would one need to make the nif in a fashion to include that offset? I just had a neat little idea what could be a general landworked (and waterworked) model for Planetfall.

Cheers, LT.

IIRC the Planetfall waterworked graphic showing sometimes on land is a graphic glitch, but I'll check to be sure.
Now on your main question: it is possible to let the landworked graphic appear on both improved and non-improved plots. In the case of improved plots, in most cases you'd need to add the landworked graphic to the nif itself (which means it will show whether the plot has a citizen on it or not), in other cases (farms and cottages in civ4 terms) you can add it through the xml. But it will also show whether or not the plot is worked by a citizen.
When you add it in the nif to the improvement model, you can give it a fixed spot on the improved plot. Just needs a little tinkering with the xy coordinates in NifSkope. But I suppose you already knew that. When you add it in xml, it appears on a random spot on the improved plot. I think that's because the graphic engine gives it a location then. Clipping depends on the size of the object(s). In my experience you're better of with 1x1 and 1x2 profiled models, and don't scale them larger then 0.5 if the model was made on a normal size in whatever model building program you use.

I never tried it, but wonder if improvements like mines could alse be put in a xml system like cottages. Or have extra art in them like the farms do. The latter should be possible I think. That's basically a standard model with extra art attached to it.

EDIT: or did you mean that the landworked graphic should show ONLY when a plot is worked by a citizen, whether or not there's an improvement on it? I think that sort of thing is covered with the animation files.

EDIT: or did you mean that the landworked graphic should show ONLY when a plot is worked by a citizen, whether or not there's an improvement on it? I think that sort of thing is covered with the animation files.Yeah, meant this - should've been clearer. I just hoped you might know a way without reworking all animations - which is quite cumbersome.

Personally, I like seeing at a glance whether a tile is worked or not - and I had an idea for a pretty universal graphic for that (on land): a tiny 1x1-node sized supply crawler! Would be a nice homage to them and their ability to crawl plots (which was horrible micromanagement!).

Anyway, finished stuff for Planetfall as well:

A new, slimmer network node (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=328192), which design I really like!
A reworked, slimmed down energy bank - captures the old look, added a more interesting texture... and it's only 490 polys heavy. Came out a bit more industrial-looking than I intended - but I liked the orange bits on it too much, because it fits the orange energy icon... fits neatly into a 4x2-node if you use a fScale = 3.0, fInterfaceScale = 0.5; file is attached.


Cheers, LT.

Thanks for the models! :D Haven't looked at the Energy Bank yet, but the Network Node looks awesome!

One question about the scale though: is that as tested in Planetfall, and are those the values put in the ArtDefines?

The reason I ask: in the CityLSystem the Network Node is currently defined as 1.5. So I wonder if that was why you said the scale should be 1.5, or if I should also put 1.5 in the Artdefines, meaning the actual intended scale for the model is 1.5*1.5 = 2.25.

Same with Energy Bank. That one has a 0.5 scale in the CityLSystem.

One question about the scale though: is that as tested in Planetfall, and are those the values put in the ArtDefines?Oh, I never test things with the CityLSystem, I always quickly add them as generic buildings (because if I like a model enough and it's entirely by me, I'd like to release it in the main forums - generic scales are more useful then). My scales are always assuming that you put them directly into the ArtDefines-file without further modification afterwards (i.e. assuming a scale of 1.0 in the CityLSystem) - so yeah, you have to adjust them a bit - I suggest modifying the entry in the CityLSystem, because the Datalinks model scale (fInterfaceScale) is also applied after fScale - meaning you would need to modify that one as well, if you change the fScale).

Cheers, LT.

Thanks for the models! :D Haven't looked at the Energy Bank yet, but the Network Node looks awesome!

One question about the scale though: is that as tested in Planetfall, and are those the values put in the ArtDefines?

The reason I ask: in the CityLSystem the Network Node is currently defined as 1.5. So I wonder if that was why you said the scale should be 1.5, or if I should also put 1.5 in the Artdefines, meaning the actual intended scale for the model is 1.5*1.5 = 2.25.

Same with Energy Bank. That one has a 0.5 scale in the CityLSystem.

There's a reason I put scale 1.0 in Civ4ArtDefines on buildingclasses which will be used by multiple factions and multiple graphics, meaning that I need to make entries in Civ4CityLSystem too several times. ;)
For starters, Datalinks shows the model linked in Civ4ArtDefines, and the interfacescale is easier to have a grip on if a standard scale is used.
Also, in Civ4CityLSystem the scale of the other graphics from the same buildingclass are directly derived from the value in Civ4ArtDefines. Again, easier to have a feel on how much a graphic's size has to be increased or decreased according to the base value.

Love the new graphics, LT. :cooool:

Personally, I like seeing at a glance whether a tile is worked or not - and I had an idea for a pretty universal graphic for that (on land): a tiny 1x1-node sized supply crawler! Would be a nice homage to them and their ability to crawl plots (which was horrible micromanagement!).

Now that I think of it, in Planetfall when a landunit moves over territorial waters the game depicts a transport foil unit underneath the landunit.
Maniac, is this something you coded/xml'd or is it an automatic side-effect of land units moving over waterplots?
If the former, perhaps it can be coded that this supply crawler shows up when a plot is worked?

I recycled the siege tower animation for that.
What Lord Tirian wants, is only possible by changing improvement animations.

I recycled the siege tower animation for that.

How'd you manage to let it change from being added to an attacking land unit to a unit walking over sea? If you've done it in xml, in what file(s)?

Just asking because I wanted to let a landingcraft graphic accompany a marine unit when it attacks from the sea in another mod.

Alas, it requires SDK. Should be easy though. But I guess you don't want a modified DLL?

Also, then the siege tower animation won't show anymore. That siege tower animation is kinda a unique thing. I can change when the existing one shows up, but I can't add new animations myself.

Ah, new patch - and happy to see the naval improvements! :D

But here I go... there's some graphics quibbling: Why don't you use the awesome Sea Archer (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8120355&postcount=26) as carrier model? Instead of the Final Frontier model... a futuristic carrier would fit better than a spaceship, IMHO.

Furthermore: Had you any luck using the background I supplied earlier to create special ability-promo buttons? Because they could still need a bit of an overhaul (as there are a couple of duplicate special ability/promo buttons) - and once you're able to do the style for yourself I could start working on them.

Cheers, LT.

Alas, it requires SDK. Should be easy though. But I guess you don't want a modified DLL?

Also, then the siege tower animation won't show anymore. That siege tower animation is kinda a unique thing. I can change when the existing one shows up, but I can't add new animations myself.

Mmm... there is an xml file (CIV4FormationInfos) where the attached position of the great general and the siege tower on a unit formation is written down. Would adding a position there be of help?
Since the siege engine isn't used anymore after the melee era's, would it be possible to link it to the siege tower in the first era's, but to the marine unit in the later era's?
On the modified .dll thing, I have a BtS 3.19 version which allows the use of another unit graphic in every era of the vanilla game (7 era's thus). I plan to work with that one once the building graphics part of my mod is done. If that siege animation can be split over 2 graphics in different era's of the game, would you be willing to compile the code in that .dll?

But here I go... there's some graphics quibbling: Why don't you use the awesome Sea Archer (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8120355&postcount=26) as carrier model? Instead of the Final Frontier model... a futuristic carrier would fit better than a spaceship, IMHO.

Because the Sea Archer doesn't look futuristic to me. I don't know anything about carriers, but it looks like a contemporary one. :confused:

The justification why carriers aren't available as soon as factions have built up their industry (at Industrial Automation or Doctrine; Initiative for instance), is that advances in submarine warfare have turned large aircraft carriers into sitting ducks. As people think is already the case today should a big power war ever break out.

The reason why Carriers become feasible again with Mass Drivers, is that with that technology aircraft can be succesfully launched while needing a much smaller launching lane/tube/deck/whatever. So smaller carrier ships can be used which could more easily avoid submarines.

The EE2 submarine graphic currently used for submarine carriers, I can imagine to use mass drivers to launch craft. It has those groves/tubes in the model.

The Sea Archer just has an ordinary flight deck. Seems like a huge ship that doesn't use mass drivers.

The Final Frontier has this hangar in the back. I guess one could imagine there's a mass driver there which can launch aircraft.

I know the model is far from perfect. I was thinking perhaps it could pass if its lowered on the Z-axis, so it actually is in the water instead of floating just above it?

Furthermore: Had you any luck using the background I supplied earlier to create special ability-promo buttons? Because they could still need a bit of an overhaul (as there are a couple of duplicate special ability/promo buttons) - and once you're able to do the style for yourself I could start working on them.

Err, I haven't tried. :blush:
But I guess it shouldn't be that hard. From the looks of it, you don't use any lighting effects or something like the marble texture, as described in the button guide?
So go ahead as you see fit I'd say. :)

Mmm... there is an xml file (CIV4FormationInfos) where the attached position of the great general and the siege tower on a unit formation is written down. Would adding a position there be of help?
Since the siege engine isn't used anymore after the melee era's, would it be possible to link it to the siege tower in the first era's, but to the marine unit in the later era's?

No point in going into explanations about the SDK I guess, so I'll just say a short "no".

On the modified .dll thing, I have a BtS 3.19 version which allows the use of another unit graphic in every era of the vanilla game (7 era's thus). I plan to work with that one once the building graphics part of my mod is done. If that siege animation can be split over 2 graphics in different era's of the game, would you be willing to compile the code in that .dll?

Yes, but the graphic can't be split. The siege tower animation uses ART_DEF_UNIT_SIEGE_TOWER, which I modified for Planetfall, but that art_def is referenced nowhere in the SDK. So it must be hardcoded in the executable. So we're stuck with that one artdefine. Okay, that was the somewhat longer version of "no".

I see. Well, thanks for explaining.
I have such a nagging improvement too which is hardcoded: the watermill. Whatever I try, there's no way I can let it switch graphics according to era's or artstyles. :mad:

Lord Tirian, a graphical question.

GeoModder suggested the Extraction Facility (BtS Art\structures\improvements\ExtractionFacility) could be used as the sea borehole improvement (or any other naval building really). However for some reason that graphic is simply invisible for me both in the SceneViewer and in-game. And being selfish I don't want to use graphics I can't see in the game. Do you have any idea what the problem could be? (my computer doesn't use shadernifs for the record) Do you know if this could be fixed somehow?

I installed the new patch h) and browsed as usually the Datalinks for the new stuff and when I came to the Energy Nexus page I received this python error instead of a new graphic:

Do you know if this could be fixed somehow?Huh, that's a rather peculiar problem... quick questions: Do you play with animations? Does it show up for you in the Final Frontier mod? That might give me some pointers towards the "why"...
I installed the new patch h) and browsed as usually the Datalinks for the new stuff and when I came to the Energy Nexus page I received this python error instead of a new graphic:
Crap. Mea culpa. The only one I didn't test in-game, because I didn't touch the scale, so this had to happen. Not sure why it happened, but I think I messed up an export setting (was playing around with them lately). I've attached a version that works for me in-game - just the nif-file, because the rest is fine. Sorry for that, should've tested it in-game before. :blush:

Cheers, LT.

Huh, that's a rather peculiar problem... quick questions: Do you play with animations? Does it show up for you in the Final Frontier mod? That might give me some pointers towards the "why"...

It's invisible both with Animations On and Off. The improvement is always invisible in-game, such as in Final Frontier.
I have the same problems with Asteroids by the way.

It's invisible both with Animations On and Off. The improvement is always invisible in-game, such as in Final Frontier.
I have the same problems with Asteroids by the way.Hmmm... there's either a problem with space environment gloss or with the way the skin partitions are done. I've attached a zip with two versions of the extraction facility - could you test them to see whether it shows up?

Another thing: I'm going through the special ability buttons now... and I've found a couple of special abilities that are a bit "bland" - Precision, Accuracy, Anti-Personnel, Anti-Tank. Other special abilities are more descriptive (Empath Song, Deep Radar, Anti-Grav Struts, Storage Bay), which makes finding fitting symbols a bit easier and, frankly, I think they have way more flavour. So... are these names there to stay or do you have any other ideas to name them?

Cheers, LT.

Hmmm... there's either a problem with space environment gloss or with the way the skin partitions are done. I've attached a zip with two versions of the extraction facility - could you test them to see whether it shows up?

Thanks!

The test nif is still invisible everywhere.
The noanim is visible in SceneViewer (hurray! :)), but it crashes the game when placed on the map, and gives a python exception in the pedia. Looks like the same problem as with the Energy Nexus?

Another thing: I'm going through the special ability buttons now... and I've found a couple of special abilities that are a bit "bland" - Precision, Accuracy, Anti-Personnel, Anti-Tank. Other special abilities are more descriptive (Empath Song, Deep Radar, Anti-Grav Struts, Storage Bay), which makes finding fitting symbols a bit easier and, frankly, I think they have way more flavour. So... are these names there to stay or do you have any other ideas to name them?

I don't have any other ideas, but if you have, do tell!

Btw, as said before I'm not 100% sure yet what things to make promotions, and which special abilities. Another reason why I'm not strongly encouraging making promotion buttons.
Basically I want special abilities to give qualitative benefits, and promotions quantitative benefits, ie you can do the same with unpromoted units by just throwing more of them at the problem.
Anti-Tank and Anti-Personnel are quantitative benefits, so I think one day I'll turn them back into promotions. The only reason why I made them special abilities earlier in development was because I needed some special abilities to be available for each unit which didn't require any technology. Since there's now the Light special ability, this requirement has fallen away.

The test nif is still invisible everywhere.
The noanim is visible in SceneViewer (hurray! :)), but it crashes the game when placed on the map, and gives a python exception in the pedia. Looks like the same problem as with the Energy Nexus?I think I've pinned down the problem - you graphics card seems to have problems with the way the animation (and the skinpartition and boning required for that) is done (and the Final Frontier asteroids are animated in the same way). The crash for the last nif came from me just plucking stuff out and looking at it in SceneViewer - was just a rough test, after all.

I cleaned the nif up, now it should work without crashing (at least it shows up without problems in the game for me, this time I've tested it! :blush: ) - the bad news is just that this process killed the animation the model had before (because it caused your problem, after all). I've attached the model, it uses the original texture.Another reason why I'm not strongly encouraging making promotion buttons.Oops. To get a feel for it, I made buttons for every currently available special ability today! :lol:

I kept the buttons for the ones with the generic names generic as well - but most buttons should remind you of stuff, because I pillaged the SMAC icons and kitbashed them into new shapes. The thing I like is that they still look distinct when zoomed down (like in the unit display, civilopedia and so on). Not sure whether you want to use them, but I just attached them (including a XML - and tested in-game as well!), so you can try them for yourself, if you want to. Of course, I can change stuff, make more etc.

In case you like them, they're pretty easy to recreate - no special tricks or anything on them, just the way normal promo buttons are made, just with slightly different background and colours (I described that somewhere upthread, IIRC).

Cheers, LT.

Maniac, get a better comp. :lol:

Thanks!

the bad news is just that this process killed the animation the model had before (because it caused your problem, after all).

Do you have any idea why the Extraction Facility animations would cause problems, and all other animations not?

In case you like them, they're pretty easy to recreate - no special tricks or anything on them, just the way normal promo buttons are made, just with slightly different background and colours (I described that somewhere upthread, IIRC).

Do you have the source files for the icons before any special effects were applied on them? Would be useful if/when Anti-Tank/Personnal was turned into promotions.

Maniac, get a better comp. :lol:

When Civ6 is released, I promise. :)

Do you have any idea why the Extraction Facility animations would cause problems, and all other animations not?
Not 100% sure, but I think it's the way the animation is done. Most Civ Models have a model and the animation in an extra file - this seems work fine for you. There are simple models with in-built animation, which also work for you (or you would've complained about some of my models before, like the psionic gate or the subspace generator). But the Final Frontier models add a layer of extra complexity on that - these models also have bones and skin partition data like full-blown unit models (these skin partitions are used to associate not only the mesh, but also the "skin" to the bones), which seems to trouble your PC.

Not too surprising, as skin partitions have some association with shaders (you can have skin partition without shaders, but to have shaders you must have skin partition data), which is a weak spot of your PC anyway - while they're still models without shaders... they still seem to trouble it - how old is your PC/graphics card? (I just assume that you have up-to-date drivers, as that would be another problematic point)
Do you have the source files for the icons before any special effects were applied on them? Would be useful if/when Anti-Tank/Personnal was turned into promotions.Not as source files per se, as it's .psd (which is useless to you), but I copied the shapes for you as .pngs, so you can play around with them - and I've also thrown in a classic promotion version (since I only had to revert the colours to the original ones), in case you need it.

Cheers, LT.

Not too surprising, as skin partitions have some association with shaders (you can have skin partition without shaders, but to have shaders you must have skin partition data)
:wallbash: - the problem was waaaaay simpler - the supposedly "shaderless" model actually uses a shader. I just didn't suspect that, because I didn't think something that stupid could be going on. :crazyeye:

Cheers, LT.

Ah, triple-posting... anyway, who cares... here's stuff. One quibble I had was xenofungus: 1) when you scrolled over the map, it flickered; 2) next to jungles, it just flickered all the time.

1) was due to a lack of mipmaps in the fungus texture - I think I know why, to avoid the fungus edges to get blurry when you zoom. I put back the mipmaps and edited them by hand to preserve the sharp edges. Result: No more flickering during movement, yet the fungus doesn't get blurry.

2) this was due to the fact that fungus uses the jungle model as a base - and next to actual jungle, the shapes overlapped perfectly, so the game just oscillated between both - because they were in the same place. I resolved that by shifting the position of the fungus minimally. Not enough to be noticed by the human eye (I couldn't even see the shift in NifSkope!) - but enough for the game to resolve the issue.

Attached is the fixed texture and the fixed fungus models - just plug them into your assets and you should get flicker-free fungus! :)

Cheers, LT.

A delight for my eyes, LT. :goodjob:

Not as source files per se, as it's .psd (which is useless to you), but I copied the shapes for you as .pngs, so you can play around with them - and I've also thrown in a classic promotion version (since I only had to revert the colours to the original ones), in case you need it.

Thanks!

:wallbash: - the problem was waaaaay simpler - the supposedly "shaderless" model actually uses a shader. I just didn't suspect that, because I didn't think something that stupid could be going on. :crazyeye:

Does that mean it would actually be easy to make a shaderless version that uses the animations?

Ah, triple-posting... anyway, who cares... here's stuff. One quibble I had was xenofungus: 1) when you scrolled over the map, it flickered; 2) next to jungles, it just flickered all the time.

Thanks I'll check it out!

Does that mean it would actually be easy to make a shaderless version that uses the animations?Not sure - I never went that way - I always just added shaders, I never removed them, so I don't know. I'll try it, however (it's not exactly an exciting animation anyway - it's just the cylinders on the end of the "feet" going up and down).

Additional stuff: Worked on the Temple of Planet model (yes, today seems to be a prolific day for me!) - it's still complex (917 polys), but that's due to the shape with the little towers and all the roofs. It's the same scale as before - and this time I checked it in game, I'm getting paranoid after the Energy Nexus! :blush: On the plus side, this means you always get screenshots of my tests! ;)

Since the model is among the more complex ones with 917 polys - I could cut the little towers and parts of the base for a "light" version that can be used as temple of planet - and the big thing here could remain the VoP shrine - what do you think? (for shrine and/or temple)

Cheers, LT.

Since the model is among the more complex ones with 917 polys - I could cut the little towers and parts of the base for a "light" version that can be used as temple of planet - and the big thing here could remain the VoP shrine - what do you think? (for shrine and/or temple)

I discussed with Maniac before to strip this model of its towers to have a second model for a facility. Personally I'm all for it. :D

I discussed with Maniac before to strip this model of its towers to have a second model for a facility. Personally I'm all for it. :DWell, I just went ahead and did it - not a lot of work since I had the model in Blender already - main work as adding a new building shadow. This version only has 287 polys - and I think it still looks nice and "VoP-ish". It uses the same texture as the big temple. The screenshot used the same scale as before - and I think it fits, though you might want to put it into a smaller node as it takes up less space than before. And perhaps bump up the fInterfaceScale by a little bit (to 0.5 or 0.55 or so), but that's a matter of taste.

Cheers, LT.

Thanks! :D Love your two Temples of Planet, and your suggestions on how to use them.

Does that mean it would actually be easy to make a shaderless version that uses the animations?Okay, I think I've done it. It doesn't have shaders and... I can see it in the civilopedia and it moves. Wasn't as straightforward as I hoped for, though. There's a subtle difference to the FF model - the FF model is slightly rotated in the x-plane, this model isn't - but I preferred it that way, so I left it as it is (if you really feel the need to rotate it, I think you could do that in the LSystem anyway). Just to let you know, because if you use it, you want to use it as the only model (as fx-entry as well) to keep it consistent for Planetfall.

However, you definitely should try it out yourself first - my PC showed it, but mine shows shaders as well. No clue how it looks on yours.

Also, a little question: Why is the interface SMAX-style green? Your preference or because Rubin did it like that back then for C4:AC? Just asking, because I always felt the green tint for SMAX was a bit silly, like "hey, we have aliens, now everything must be ALIEN-GREEN" - and I always changed it back to the original SMAC interface!

Cheers, LT.

Oh, more posting! Did some more stuff...

1) Did a spawning spot model for land and sea. I used the CoP wallpaper as starting point, but made it look a bit more "organic" - it fits nicely into the fungus. If you think it's too easy to overlook, you may want to bump up the size a bit. Bot are 300ish in polycount.

2) I didn't like the banana nutrients (I really don't like too much things from vanilla popping up, especially if re-purposed, it sort of breaks the feel), so I took the tobacco resource (from the Crossroads scenario) and recoloured it in the style of the SMAC nutrients (also fiddled with it a bit to get a nice patch of plants together). It's small and lightweight - 87 polys and crops fungus/woods around it, so it should be noticeable.

3) When I modified the fungus (see above), I saw that it not only used the jungle as base, but that it still had all the trees in it, just totally transparent, which is - of course - a heap of unnecessary polygons. I removed these invisible elements and used a bit of the fungus texture, that wasn't used before (a yellowish patch), though I darkened it a bit. The new fungus models have only around 2/3rds of the original polygons - and even the file size was halved. And since fungus is so prevalent, it reduced lag on the map during scrolling noticeably!
However, there's one bit I couldn't work out: The sea fungus version has orange stalks sticking out of the water - during the change, they darkened (because something seems to cast a shadow) strangely enough, it doesn't happen with the land version. I don't understand why, so I can't fix that - you have decide whether to use it, but the reduction in polygons is quite a bit.

For all three things: If you want changes, tell me, then I'll work on it.

And to end off, another little question: I figured out how to modify stuff so it conforms to the shape of the terrain, which is nice for improvements - meaning the borehole model (SMAC mine) can now look pretty good on all terrains, including peaks. Which means one could use it as a mine (for nostalgia reasons, of course) - once there's a new borehole graphic. Interested in it? Because then I might tackle that at some point... (just to let me know whether it would be helpful to try it at all - I still want to keep fixing the older models first).

Cheers, LT.

Again great work :goodjob:

For the spawning spot...I think you cought the style shown on the wallpaper very well and it looks now a lot more credible. The old rice graphics only positive thing was that is was graphically so disturbing (red fungus - green spawning point) that you cannot overlook it. So increasing size might be a good idea, as spotting spawning points easy and reliable is critical.

The Nutrients graphic is fine. Ok, some leafs don't imply food as much as a banana does, but OTOH bananas are clearly too much "earth" to fit in Alpha Centauri.

So increasing size might be a good idea, as spotting spawning points easy and reliable is critical.True, but the texture should hold up to that - making it bigger might also allows you to see the little icky tendrils coming out of the caves! (right now that detail is only visible in the datalinks) I just lean towards keeping things a bit smaller, because I don't want to make them "THIS BIG!" ;)
The Nutrients graphic is fine. Ok, some leafs don't imply food as much as a banana does, but OTOH bananas are clearly too much "earth" to fit in Alpha Centauri.I might redo it at some point - the SMAC graphic actually has long bulby things (a bit like unopened sweetcorn) sticking out of the ground with some scattered round seeds or so. However, I want to keep it low poly (less than ~100) - and to it with cleverly arranged textures like the vanilla Civ plant resources - but couldn't get it to look nice and visible in-game. If I - or somebody else - can whip up a nice looking nutrient bonus at some point, one can still re-use my leafs - could be used as all sorts of herbs or so (as a replacement for Fungicides, for example).

Cheers, LT.

Okay, I think I've done it.
...
1) Did a spawning spot model for land and sea.
2) I didn't like the banana nutrients
3) When I modified the fungus ...

Thanks I'll try it out! :)

Also, a little question: Why is the interface SMAX-style green? Your preference or because Rubin did it like that back then for C4:AC? Just asking, because I always felt the green tint for SMAX was a bit silly, like "hey, we have aliens, now everything must be ALIEN-GREEN" - and I always changed it back to the original SMAC interface!

Rubin made the interface. I don't have a vision or strong opinion about the interface, except of course that it is much better than the vanilla one.

For all three things: If you want changes, tell me, then I'll work on it.

Could you do the same thing for hybrid forest as for fungus?? Since that has both forest and jungle trees, that's even heavier on polygons. I don't know if it would still look good, but besides removing invisible trees perhaps some experimenting could alo be done by reducing both the amount of fungus and forest trees.

And to end off, another little question: I figured out how to modify stuff so it conforms to the shape of the terrain, which is nice for improvements - meaning the borehole model (SMAC mine) can now look pretty good on all terrains, including peaks. Which means one could use it as a mine (for nostalgia reasons, of course) - once there's a new borehole graphic. Interested in it? Because then I might tackle that at some point... (just to let me know whether it would be helpful to try it at all - I still want to keep fixing the older models first).

I don't understand what you mean, how boreholes could appear on a non-flat ridge terrain. :confused:

Rubin made the interface. I don't have a vision or strong opinion about the interface, except of course that it is much better than the vanilla one.Yeah, it is pretty cool - but I noticed some vanilla icons around (in the city screen and the map), showing the bread/hammer/gold icons and wanted to change these - but when I'm on the interface anyway, I thought I might end up wanting to change other stuff - so I figured out it would be better to ask first to know what your stance is on it.
Could you do the same thing for hybrid forest as for fungus?? Since that has both forest and jungle trees, that's even heavier on polygons. I don't know if it would still look good, but besides removing invisible trees perhaps some experimenting could alo be done by reducing both the amount of fungus and forest trees.Right, I'll take a look at it!
I don't understand what you mean, how boreholes could appear on a non-flat ridge terrain. :confused:Ah, sorry - I didn't meant boreholes, just the model they currently have, because it's the original SMAC mine. But earlier - first page of this thread - you said that it wouldn't work that well as mine, because it didn't look good on peaks - and because you lacked a decent borehole model.

Cheers, LT.

Yeah, it is pretty cool - but I noticed some vanilla icons around (in the city screen and the map), showing the bread/hammer/gold icons and wanted to change these - but when I'm on the interface anyway, I thought I might end up wanting to change other stuff - so I figured out it would be better to ask first to know what your stance is on it.

Go ahead I'd say. Everything else you lay your hands on turns golden. :D

Ah, sorry - I didn't meant boreholes, just the model they currently have, because it's the original SMAC mine.

I know. I just don't understand how the graphic could be made to look well on ridges. :confused:

I know. I just don't understand how the graphic could be made to look well on ridges. :confused:Ah, well, I found a little thing in the nif-files that allows models to "adhere" to the ground and mimic the contour.

I've attached a quick screenshot with the setting enabled in the nif. It's a bit rough, because the model wasn't made for that use - but it might be possible to tweak it a bit. But I sort of like how it just looks like somebody has drilled a huge gaping hole into a mountain, just to grab some resources.

(I admit, this is mostly the product of exploring the possibilities of the graphics engine - so it might not be the best idea, it's a bit of the "shiny new toy! must use it!"-syndrome! :lol: - also that would be the reason why I'd only do it way later... once I have fixed some more stuff.)

Cheers, LT.

@ Lord Tirian

do you also know the "must know how it works" syndrome :crazyeye: ;)

@ Lord Tirian

do you also know the "must know how it works" syndrome :crazyeye: ;)
Sure! :lol:

Attach to the "NiTriShape"-Node a "NiStringExtraData"-extra data, name it "UserPropBuffer" and for the string data, use "ContourGeometry". For reference, I originally found it in the mod_city_lot.nif and ren_city_lot.nof for the ground textures of modern and renaissance vanilla Civ cities.

I have only tested it with improvements, so far - so don't ask me what happens if you stick it onto an unit or something that's actually deformed by an animation! :crazyeye: Also note that it only deforms the geometry, plain nodes aren't affected, as far as I can tell - though it's kinda hard to tell in-game, as I can only tell from the origin of effects (I assume because their position is relative to the parent node, whereas the mesh vertices have a z-component that can be changed).

If you find out more stuff you can do with it, tell us! :)

Cheers, LT.

I've attached a quick screenshot with the setting enabled in the nif.

The borehole in the northern plot looks kinda stretched. My first impression would be not to use this setting for boreholes.

Is this the setting which allows features or farms to adapt to terrain elevation?
Features don't adapt to terrain height on my computer (so without some ugly hack I used fungus would be invisible for me for instance). Farms do adapt of course.
I wonder what would happen if this trick was used on a feature graphic such as fungus, forest or jungle.

Btw, since you mentioned orange fungus, I've uploaded something from a distant past which may be of interest to you: a texture which makes all the fungus orange!
Come to think of it, this may be useful for a resource graphic: Brilliance or a Pholus Mutagen landmark-resource comes to mind.

For the Pholus Ridge landmark I had in mind it could be an exception to the rule that fungus cannot appear on ridges. What has restrained me from doing so is the inability of my comp to display fungus correctly on ridges. Perhaps the setting you discovered could help solve that problem: create a nif to be used as a resource and/or improvement and which adapts to height.

Oh btw, these last couple models look even more awesome than usual! :D

I still want to keep fixing the older models first

That list I drew up a while ago has already thinned out considerably by the way. :eek:

Stuff from woodelf:

Buildings:

- Alpha Prime
- Assembly Hall
- Hologram Theatre
- Sea Base/Pressure Dome
- Sea Wall (currently found in the 'Pressure Dome' folder)
-Atmospheric Processor (could use Lord Tirian's windtrap instead)
- Cloning Vats
- Subsea Trunkline
- Aerospace Complex: As far as I can tell, this model may have a normal amount of triangles for how detailed it is, but I don't think it *needs* to be as detailed. For instance there are lots of half-spheres made of many sides (=faces?). At the scale these buildings are displayed in-game, these spheres could be made of much less faces and you wouldn't notice the difference. Though I would be content to just keep the current apollo program graphic which was used as a placeholder after discovering the polygon count of woodelf's model.

This list is not complete. There are a couple other simple buildings as well, with still a higher than expected poly count. But because the model is so simple the poly count still only is 100 or so. Eg the rec commons, rec tanks...

Citysets:

caretakers_cityset.nif
believers_cityset.nif

Units:

(Foil)
(Needlejet)
Rover (a model by keldath which uses woodelf's rover as base)
Unity Rover (in the 'Tank' folder)
Transport Foil
Unity Foil

Stuff from other creators, or the creators are unknown to me because GeoModder found the model

Buildings:

- Antimatter Reactor: Scene Viewer crashes when I try to open this one. Can someone tell me how much triangles this one has?
- Nuclear Reactor
- (Observation Bay)
- Supercollider

Improvements:

- Solar Collector: Scene Viewer crashes when I try to open this one. Can someone tell me how much triangles this one has?

Units

- Sea Colony Pod: The_Reckoning

Planetfall also includes a couple buildings which AFAIK come from Empire Earth 2. They have many triangles, but they are also more detailed than the average civ4 building, so perhaps that poly count is normal. Still judging from The_Coyote's unit conversion it seems possible to seriously reduce polycount with hardly any negative effect on the looks. Perhaps the same is possible with these buildings? For instance it's pointless to keep those small windows in the Military Academy. Might as well remove them and add some black rectangles for windows to the dds texture instead. The models are:

- hydroplant.nif
- Skunkworks
- Military Academy

I wonder what would happen if this trick was used on a feature graphic such as fungus, forest or jungle.I just tested it... and it only works partially. :(

It works with single models, but once you activate the fancy tiling stuff (to make adjacent fungus tiles connect and to avoid resources, rivers and so forth), it uses the sea level as height. Once I set it to deactivate the tiling/connections and use a single model (like for a single improvement etc.), it works again.

On the other hand, resources *are* single models, so this will be a workable route for the Pholus Ridge/Brilliance. Also, the low graphics xml you use, AFAIK, also restricts itself to a single model, right? In this case, it would work for that as well, so I made a special fungus model for low graphics (based on the poly-reduced fungus model). That way it might at least look a little bit better for you! :)

EDIT: What sort of benefit would the Pholus Ridge give? Because I had the idea of using orange fungus as a base for the ridge (as you've said above - and orange sounds energy-ish), some sort of pink-purple fungus as the base for brilliance (sort of a super-psychoactive fungus) and maybe brown-black fungus as a base for fungicide (sort of a dead fungus - fungus cancer? I don't fully get the idea of naturally occurring fungicide).

Cheers, LT.

For all three things: If you want changes, tell me, then I'll work on it.

I've been looking some more at the various new graphics in-game. The sea spawning spot stands out (yet still fits in) sufficiently because the spawning spot red is different than the sea fungus mixed-with-water red. Land spawning spots I find almost impossible to see though. That's why I was wondering, could you please making a modified land spawning spot texture with orange fungus on top? Let's see how that looks.

I am amazed how you make all those awesome textures btw. :eek:

That way it might at least look a little bit better for you! :)

Wow, a massive thanks! :goodjob:

What sort of benefit would the Pholus Ridge give?

I've now implemented the Pholus Ridge as two to four Pholus Ridge improvements on a ridge. Each Pholus Ridge improvement gives +2 Planet to nearby bases. In addition a Pholus Mutagen resource appears on each Pholus Ridge plot. That gives +1 Planet in each base, but it's only enabled with the Pholus Mutagen tech.

I'm using the lowfungus you made as the resource and improvement's model. There is one problem though: I placed the orange fungus texture in the pholus ridge folde, but the orange fungus texture doesn't show up. It seems that the game gives higher priority to files in the shared folder than in the resource folder itself! So for the Pholus Ridge to be orange, there would need to be a lowfungus nif which uses some unique name for the dds texture. Would you be interested in making one?

Pink-purple fungus sounds good for Brilliance!

(sort of a dead fungus - fungus cancer? I don't fully get the idea of naturally occurring fungicide).

I just assume some plants have developed a biochemistry to resist being infected by fungus. (as an aside, there are plenty of fungi in nature who feed on other fungi - nothing strange about a fungus cancer)
Further using the idea of retexturing feature graphics for resources, I had the idea to use a jungle nif with the texture from Blue Marble as Fungicide. It suffers from the same problem though: the trees_1024.dds in the shared folder is used. So I was wondering if you would want to create a jungle01_01.nif with a unique texture name?

Edit: this also means Hybrid Forest has never used the modified texture made for it. :-s

So for the Pholus Ridge to be orange, there would need to be a lowfungus nif which uses some unique name for the dds texture. Would you be interested in making one?

Or you could link the Pholus Ridge to a renamed texture. At least, if your orange fungus texture uses similar dispositions as the normal fungus texture.
Same for your other .nif/.dds troubles.

EDIT: Infact, I'm doing that now, but are those jungle trees supposed to look green or green/orangeish?

Okay, I'm totally confused now.
Maniac, if you want one of us to relink a renamed texture to a feature, you better give us a download with the nifs+texture in the proper named folder.

Edit: this also means Hybrid Forest has never used the modified texture made for it. :-sWell... I'm currently doing the hybrid forest, so... soon you'll get it! :)

By the way, the attached file only contains the model... not the texture, no biggie though, I have blue marble installed myself (by the way, the model actually only fills the quarter of a square, it's a NW connection piece).
Or you could link the Pholus Ridge to a renamed texture. At least, if your orange fungus texture uses similar dispositions as the normal fungus texture.By the way, I just finished with that - after the removal of the unused transparent parts in the fungus nif, the texture had tons of empty, unused black space in it. I filled it with the orange and purple fungus, so one still only uses one texture file (since the size doesn't actually change a lot - and the game has to load the entire file anyway).

Also, I tweaked the nifs a bit to make them not look like square-shaped blobs of fungus (mainly the brilliance), see the attached screenshots. I'm not uploading it now, because the Hybrid forest uses the shared texture as well, but still has the invisible jungle bits in it - that would make the hybrid forest a mess with the combined fungus texture! So, I'm going to finish the hybrid forest first!

Also... give feedback on the colours... do you like the purple one? (pink was a bit too close to the current fungus)

Cheers, LT

Or you could link the Pholus Ridge to a renamed texture.

That's what I mean. :)

EDIT: Infact, I'm doing that now, but are those jungle trees supposed to look green or green/orangeish?

The fungicide trees should look dark green, using the texture from Blue Marble. As it has the same size and graphic positions as the vanilla dds, there's no need to have the blue marble texture to be able to make a nif linking to a renamed texture.

you better give us a download with the nifs+texture in the proper named folder.

lowfungusnif for Pholus Ridge in post #147
Orange fungus dds in #145

Fungicide Jungle in #148
Blue Marble Jungle attached. (at least I think that's Blue Marble - I found it somewhere deep in my archives)

Good I stopped then. :)
Btw, Maniac, on my screen the hybrid forest shows like I thought it should?

Edit: and you can remove your attachment in the previous post. LT said he'd done it.

Good I stopped then. :)
Btw, Maniac, on my screen the hybrid forest shows like I thought it should?Well, I think it's supposed to look like that, it pretty much looks like the included texture. Plus, the override over the shared folder worked for me, when I tested a blue sea fungus texture... strange that the overriding didn't work for Maniac.

Anyway, I'm finished with everything fungus for the moment, I hope! In the attached file, you'll find...

New fungus texture for the shared folder (almost the same as before - it adds the orange texture and the purple stuff, also the brownish part of the normal texture is tinted slightly pinkish, because it looked better that way for the hybrid forest).
The poly-reduced models for the fungus and sea-fungus (same as above, just packed in here for convenience)
Hybrid forest models (with invisible parts cut, as well as some trees removed to make it lighter), also fiddled a bit with the texture, made the red fungus bits more prominent.
The Pholus Ridge feature (see screenshot above), just the fungus model, using the orange bits of the texture.
The purple Brilliance model (also screenshot above) - after seeing it a bit, I'm pretty happy how it looks. Has the right otherworldly feel for something called "Brilliance" - looks also quite nice on water.


I'm fairly happy that all this stuff basically only uses two textures - the one big fungus texture and the hybrid forest texture for the trees. I'll finish and clean up the fungicide and spawning spot tomorrow. :)

Cheers, LT.

Thanks!

I'm fairly happy that all this stuff basically only uses two textures

Me too. :D

I'll finish and clean up the fungicide and spawning spot tomorrow. :)

I'll wait for it, and then release v11.

I'll wait for it, and then release v11.Sorry for the wait, was a busy day today (I saw cosmic rays today, yay!)... and I had to tweak the fungicide texture a bit more than expected (also made it a smaller one, by cutting away the other tree bits) - the Blue Marble texture looked a bit too normal - it had almost the same colour as the rainy terrain and was also a bit dark. I brightened it a bit and added a bluish tint - now it still looks like jungle, but also like some exotic plant (and not as blue as DNA, so you can still tell them apart easily).

Since I was on it, I made little changes to the DNA models - they cut jungle/trees/fungus now, you see it on the screenshot as well. Not a big change, but looks more "polished", I think.

Finally, the spawning spot - I made the texture a bit brighter in general - the rock was too red as well. And made the top more orange. Since both models use the same texture, you need to put them in separate folders now, or the sea spawning spot will also become orange - on the other hand, you might like it orange - so screenshot shows both, so you can see it. You decide - but I don't like it a lot (the land one, however, is fine, due to the recently added orange spots in the fungus it doesn't look totally strange - on the water, it just looks out of place). Also: On the screenshot, I upped the scale to fScale = 1.25 - definitively much better, I think - you might even go up to 1.3 or so, since I tend to be a bit conservative - but around 1.5 it starts looking a bit too huge in my opinion (for both, land and sea spawning spots).

Cheers, LT.

Thanks for everything!

So... this time just some little things:

1) Took the hydro plant (which was an EE2 whopper with loads of polys) and remade the entire model on a detail level that fits its size and Civ4 more. It doesn't look as good as before, because I cut all sorts of stuff (mainly the tanks - now they're just cylinders)... but you only see that if you look from above (which you rarely do in the Datalinks) and on the map it's too small to see anyway. I think for a Civ4 scale, it's more than sufficient - and now it only has 602 polys. Uses the same scale as before and most of the original texture (though I modified it a bit, to make it look less rusty)... which was a really nice one (for something like that, wouldn't put it into my living room!).

EDIT: I noticed that the hydro plant doesn't seem show up past the arrival era... is this on purpose?

2) Redid the subsea trunkline from scratch - was easier that way. But it's now a 356 poly model that I rather like - I tried to re-use colours from the tidal harness and the industrial yellow-orange theme of the transport crawler - it's a small thing, but I think it helps a bit with a consistent look. This one uses a fScale of 1.0, fInterfaceScale 0.5 and a scale of 1.25 in the CityLSystem.xml (by the way... why can you build it in non-coastal cities?).

Screenshots and models attached.

Cheers, LT.

Awesome! :goodjob: I especially love the Subsea Trunkline.

I think I might use this Hydro Plant model for the Recycling Tanks instead. There's also some pipeline model which can be used for the Hydro Plant.

I also just noticed that issue with the Hydro Plant post Arrival. Will fix it.

The reason for allowing the Subsea Trunkline for non-coastal cities is in case a non-coastal base has a trench plot in its radius.

Awesome! :goodjob: I especially love the Subsea Trunkline.

Seconded!
Thanks for those models, LT. :thumbsup:

Lord Tirian, I figured to use the attached model as Solar Power Transmitter, because it has much less polygons. Its texture sucks though. Would you be interesting in creating a new one?

Lord Tirian, I figured to use the attached model as Solar Power Transmitter, because it has much less polygons. Its texture sucks though. Would you be interesting in creating a new one?Interested? I'll see what I can do. By the way, I'm going to be slower for the next couple of days - I'm visiting my parents... and their computer (and my netbook) have rather small screens - not ideal for doing graphics. And I'm visiting friends and stuff, so don't be surprised if I'm not as zippy and fast in doing stuff as before.

Cheers, LT.

Enjoy your vacation!

Okay... it took me a while, but I retextured the satellite, fiddled around with some bits and added a (simple) attack animation - now it shoots lasers at its poor targets! :D

It also has team colour and is 450 polys in weight, scales are in the readme-file. And I aimed for something that looked less sci-fi-esque and a bit more contemporary, after all it's the first combat satellite you get - the gravity lens later can get a more fanciful look. Though, after looking over it, I think the air units will need a bit of overhaul at some point (for example, the solar power transmitter can't pick promos...). And can we change the name a bit? Solar Power Transmitter just sounds so civilian, what about something like Solar Cannon or something like that?

Cheers, LT.

Awesome unit! :goodjob:

I was thinking I could make the Solar Power Transmitter into an immobile unit which you get for free in a base when building the Solar Power Transmitter building. Like Bunkers and Perimeter Defenses. Perhaps in that case I could keep the Solar Power Transmitter name for the building and use Orbital Defense Pod for the unit?

Air units are automatically placed higher than other units. So when turning the Solar Power Transmitter into an immobile unit, its flying dangerously close to the building roofs. ;) Therefore, could you please also make a version of the unit placed at a greater height?

Therefore, could you please also make a version of the unit placed at a greater height?Yup, but this means I need to tweak the animation as well. The air unit animation actually takes care of the unit moving around as well, just like it controls the height... so if I just place it higher, it will still hover motionless over the city and shoot straight down! I don't think the people in the base would like that! :lol:

Cheers, LT.

I'm a bit confused here. We have a Solar Power Transmitter building AND a Solar Power Transmitter unit?
But if you use this graphic for the unit, what are you going to use for the building then?

Okay, I've attached a version of the satellite that's floating higher, about as high as it was as an air unit. There are also animations for an immobile version of the unit (in the zip as well) - it's not shooting straight down, but at an angle towards the adjacent plot.

If you want to use it as a building, you can still do so, of course (since nifs don't really care that much).

Cheers, LT.

Thanks! :)

Another building from the big list - I slimmed down the military academy by making all the little windows texture-only. It's still a bit heavy (~850ish polys), but I can't cut anything without affecting the look in a bad fashion. I hope it's still passable, as it's not a terribly common building.

Scales and stuff are in the attached file... you might want to bump the size up and put it into a 3x3 node, the current 2x2 node seems to be a little small for it (if you compare it in scale to the other buildings).

Cheers, LT.

Thanks! :D

Okay, I wasn't happy with the Gaian cityset - while it's pretty nice, it always felt a bit "small" to me, compared to the wallpaper and the base graphics in SMAC. And as I'm trying the get some more experience with citysets anyway - I took the plunge and fiddled with it - and I'm happy with the result. The main change was the texture, I wanted to tint it with more green tones to make it look closer to the old base graphic (and the gaian faction colour as well).

Additionally, I tweaked the models a bit and made them taller. I was able to simplify most of them a bit, but I also added some discs to the rocks - so the polygon count hasn't changed significantly.

So take a look at the screenshots and if you like it, you'll find it in the attached file - or I can change it a bit more, if you want it more rock-coloured again.

Furthermore, a couple of things, regarding graphics and stuff:

-> Why the change from solar collectors to windmills?
-> Why were the ground textures of bases removed?
-> For the next full version (i.e. v12), could you update the install script (see phungus420's thread), as the current one still has problems with the icon (yeah, v12 is probably not coming too fast, but I wanted to mention it now, before I forget it again)?

Cheers, LT.

Okay, I wasn't happy with the Gaian cityset

IMO both your and asio's texture look good. Which means I'll use yours of course. I do like the taller models.

What has always bothered me about the Gaian cityset, are the two buildings indicated with an arrow in the screenshot. Those seem out of place to all the others. Do you know what those are supposed to represent? :confused:

-> Why the change from solar collectors to windmills?

1) Rotating windmills look cooler than solar collectors.
2) I guess I felt the need to have an early energy-providing terrain improvement available for polar terrain. Solar collectors, unlike windmills, don't make sense on polar terrain.
3) Related to 2, there only needs to be one early energy-providing improvement. It's easier to explain away Solar Collectors until Photonics (solar technology not yet developed enough in MY 2100) than to explain away Windmills.
4) Err... I forgot.

-> Why were the ground textures of bases removed?

I'd like to know that as well. ;)
IIRC I once asked GeoModder how to renable ground textures, but I knew enough of the matter myself that his reply was incorrect. :(
Asio made a ground texture specifically for the Gaians btw: all_an_lots.dds

-> For the next full version (i.e. v12), could you update the install script?

Ok. :)

I do like the taller models.

Me three!

What has always bothered me about the Gaian cityset, are the two buildings indicated with an arrow in the screenshot. Those seem out of place to all the others. Do you know what those are supposed to represent? :confused:

I thought I'd put those for facilities use in cityLsystem? I need to check to be sure, but normally they shouldn't pop up as part of the cityset buildings. Only as replacement art for facilities like HQ, Academy and such.

I'd like to know that as well. ;)
IIRC I once asked GeoModder how to renable ground textures, but I knew enough of the matter myself that his reply was incorrect. :(
Asio made a ground texture specifically for the Gaians btw: all_an_lots.dds

I thought I introduced that several versions ago? In any case, I don't find any reference to all_an_lots.dds in cityLsystem. Thus you must have forgotten to take over the entries for it. I'll try to find the time to do it next week. This weekend CC 0.55 is scheduled, already running a week late...
Btw, was there a ground texture you'd like to use for other factions? I suppose the modern ground texture by Garret (illuminated streets) for the Morgans, but that's all I can remember. In CC, I also have a 'dirt' ground texture I use for the ancient/classical era. Might work during the Arrival era for all factions.

Btw, was there a ground texture you'd like to use for other factions? I suppose the modern ground texture by Garret (illuminated streets) for the Morgans, but that's all I can remember. In CC, I also have a 'dirt' ground texture I use for the ancient/classical era. Might work during the Arrival era for all factions.

Sounds good. (I don't really have inspiration myself other than for the Gaians and Morganites.)

I1) Rotating windmills look cooler than solar collectors.
2) I guess I felt the need to have an early energy-providing terrain improvement available for polar terrain. Solar collectors, unlike windmills, don't make sense on polar terrain.Ah, I see... was just a bout of nostalgia, I miss my solar collectors a bit (and it was a bit weird seeing them that late). :)I'll try to find the time to do it next week. This weekend CC 0.55 is scheduled, already running a week late...
Btw, was there a ground texture you'd like to use for other factions? I suppose the modern ground texture by Garret (illuminated streets) for the Morgans, but that's all I can remember. In CC, I also have a 'dirt' ground texture I use for the ancient/classical era. Might work during the Arrival era for all factions.If you don't mind, I could do that this weekend - I put in the entries for the Gaians already (because I found it in the folder and wanted to see it), adding it for the other factions is rather trivial - could also try to find some more textures for the other factions - for example the Hive could either get some sand (like in the big faction HQ picture) or some rough earth/rock (from digging of the bunkers).

Cheers, LT.

If you don't mind, I could do that this weekend

Go ahead, I don't mind.
I'll attach some "sand" texture with the nif for it. Perhaps it is of use.

Go ahead, I don't mind.
I'll attach some "sand" texture with the nif for it. Perhaps it is of use.Thanks, was pretty useful - I used it as a base for the several textures! :)

So, I'm more or less finished:

Arrival: A basic dirt texture, based on GeoModder's attachment, just some rough earth and dirt.
Gaians: Asioasioasio's texture, just made a bit more visible (as the towers are bigger now) and some colour-tweaking to get a hint towards the Gaian green.
Hive: Sand, also based on GeoModder's, just sand-coloured.
Morgan: Based on the modern ground texture, but made more squarish and some yellow (Morgan-coloured) and blue deco on it (think of the blue ones as pools or solar collectors ;) )
Peacekeepers: Based on the modern ground texture, coloured a bit bluish to complement the cityset and more PK-coloured and cut the round streets around it (always hated these, even for vanilla Civ4).
Spartans: Further tweaking of the arrival texture with added roads/ways (for the rovers!) - somehow I can't imagine Spartans using anything else - real soldiers wade through mud every day! Also keeps the dark colours of the Spartan cityset and provides a nice contrast to the lighter, orange-ish parts.
University: Completely from scratch - it's something angular and sci-fi-esque, a bit inspired by Atlantis (from Stargate) and circuit boards. Made it rather bright, as the university colour is white.

I skipped the Believers on purpose - I put in a transparent version, so the XML changes are done already. The Believer set needs to be redone anyway - it doesn't look that great (esp. compared to the other city sets) and has a couple of superfluous polys, so I thought it would be better to skip this for now and just put in the XML-changes to make life easier once they get a revised city set (and matching ground texture).

Cheers, LT.

Cool! They look great.
Except one: I'm doubtful about the Hive. Perhaps that one might look better after all without a ground tewture? But that's just my initial impression.

Cool! They look great.
Except one: I'm doubtful about the Hive. Perhaps that one might look better after all without a ground tewture? But that's just my initial impression.Well, the hive texture was the most difficult one (it often looked out of place or didn't provide enough contrast with the buildings). I'm happy with it now, but it took a bit of time to get there - I probably need to look at it again tomorrow, through fresh eyes, so to speak.

Cheers, LT.

Looks pretty neath, LT. I might 'steal' the Uni one for use in the CC mod... ;)

Well, the hive texture was the most difficult one (it often looked out of place or didn't provide enough contrast with the buildings). I'm happy with it now, but it took a bit of time to get there - I probably need to look at it again tomorrow, through fresh eyes, so to speak.

Cheers, LT.I fiddled a bit more with it... and came to the conclusion that sometimes less is more. The hive has underground bunkers, nobody of the hive should be on the surface anyway... so why spoil that feel/theme with a ground texture? Attached the XML with the hive entries removed. You might also want to delete the texture + nif from the art folder to save some file size (the filenames should give it away ;) ).

Cheers, LT.

Yeah, I share your conclusion. Thanks for the file!

I was mainly doing buttons and stuff the last couple of weeks, so for a change another building, this time the hologram theatre (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=334007). It has 244 polys, which is okay, I think - and for the the setup Planetfall uses, you need these scales: fScale = 1.0, fInterfaceScale = 2.5, scale in LSystem = 4.0.

Cheers, LT.

It's a good graphic, LT.

Indeed. Thanks Lord Tirian!

Glad you guys like it! :)

Just a quick model for the solar collector (click here!) (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=334052), not too fancy, but it's a improvement that pops up fairly often, so I kept it simple with less than 200 polys. The arrangement of four panels is a bit of a throwback to the old SMAC collectors! ;)

It does use a bit of gloss (it just looks soo much better), similar to the way the old one did as well - it should show up for you Maniac (since it doesn't use shaders) and shouldn't hinder performance (Firaxis uses it all over the place as well), but if you encounter problems, let me know.

The scale is the same as for the old one (which had 802 polys!) and I attached a big screenshot of it on flat moist terrain for you Maniac, so you can make a button out of it! :)

Cheers, LT.

Thanks.
I made a cloe-up button, similar to the bunker and tidal harness, only showing part of the improvement. If you prefer zoomed out, like the current borehole button, I can always do that as well.

Thanks.
I made a cloe-up button, similar to the bunker and tidal harness, only showing part of the improvement. If you prefer zoomed out, like the current borehole button, I can always do that as well.
By the way, I like the close-ups better than the zoomed out views.

From the graphics to-do-list - the sea mill. Just the plain old model sans dirt and house. Attached two big screenshots of the sea mill as well.

Cheers, LT.

Thanks! :D

Where is the Former texture?

I unpacked the fpk, and looked in art/units/former. There's only the nif and boundshape there. no .dds
The nif points to "Tracked_treads-Terraformer.dds" which isn't there

Where is the Former texture?

I unpacked the fpk, and looked in art/units/former. There's only the nif and boundshape there. no .dds
The nif points to "Tracked_treads-Terraformer.dds" which isn't thereIn Art\Shared\

Cheers, LT.

I'd like to use Deliverator's sandstorm graphics for a Great Dunes landmark. However I can't figure out what files of Dune Wars I need to copy for that. Lord Tirian, do you perhaps know this?

http://forums.civfanatics.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=219154&stc=1&d=1246097937

How does this look ?

Nice. :D
Now, do you know someone who might be able to animate the arm? :mischief:

How does this look ?I'd push it a bit more towards yellow in colour - the SMAC formers were more yellowish than green, IIRC. And check out my texture for the material supplies, where I reworked the tread texture a bit (of course, this makes me a wee bit biased towards it! :lol: ).

Are you only going for texture changes or for actual model changes/animations as well?

@Maniac: I'll take a look at the sand storm. Do you want it to be animated or just a static cloud?

Cheers, LT.

I'd push it a bit more towards yellow in colour - the SMAC formers were more yellowish than green, IIRC.


I used this as a reference for the color:
http://fidgit.com/five_virtual_places/alpha_centauri.jpg

I think it's fine, personally. Although as is so often mentioned, planetfall is not an exact clone. The originals didn't have dirt marks. Possibly because they didn;t really have a texture at all. So why exactly replicate the old art when we can improve on it ? :)

Are you only going for texture changes or for actual model changes/animations as well?

For this particular one, only a texture change. I'm fully aware of how to do model work though. My skills are texturing, shaders, uv mapping, rigging, kfm editing, modelling. I've not yet tried making new animations for Civ, though.

How does this look ?

Looks great! :D

@Maniac: I'll take a look at the sand storm. Do you want it to be animated or just a static cloud?

I'd say animated.
I'd implement it as a Feature.

I think it's fine, personally. Although as is so often mentioned, planetfall is not an exact clone. The originals didn't have dirt marks. Possibly because they didn;t really have a texture at all. So why exactly replicate the old art when we can improve on it ? :)Oh, I totally agree on that, I like the dirt marks. I'd just use this as reference shot:
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/9636/monbig4.th.jpg (http://img98.imageshack.us/i/monbig4.jpg/)
(it's a thumbnail, click it)

The in-game artworks often show units and stuff in their full original glory - I see that particular image as a better reference for that reason. :)

Cheers, LT.

Texture attached in a .zip to this post. I made the arm a bit darker, and touched up the treads too.

Found the sandstorm, it's in the effects folder... I also attached it and added a separate version without the animation (lightning bolts), so you can try out both, if you want to.

The storm is hovering above the plot - if this turns out not looking good, I can lower it, if you want to.

Cheers, LT.

How does this look ?

I like it. But is the play/pause button on the side still colored to your faction?

Texture attached in a .zip to this post. I made the arm a bit darker, and touched up the treads too.

Thanks! :)

Found the sandstorm, it's in the effects folder... I also attached it and added a separate version without the animation (lightning bolts), so you can try out both, if you want to.

The storm is hovering above the plot - if this turns out not looking good, I can lower it, if you want to.

Thanks!
Yeah, I would prefer if the storm was hanging lower. I know those clouds being so high annoyed me a lot in the Age of Ice scenario.

Btw Lord Tirian, would you like to make a blue promotion style button of the Plasma Shard button? It's for the Flamethrower unitcombattype.

Btw Lord Tirian, would you like to make a blue promotion style button of the Plasma Shard button? It's for the Flamethrower unitcombattype.Do you want blue promo-style buttons for all unit types (except native life)? Because then I'd try make them in one go.

Cheers, LT.

Ideas for some needed icons, cuz Lord Tirian's previous work is top notch.

Bioenhancement promotion - the head from the memetics tech icon.

Troop Transport ability - head from social psych replace the current center diamond structure.

Scavenger ability - ok, but needs the ability background instead of the promo background.

And maybe something could be done to bring the City Defender promo icons more in line with the enabling Nerve Staplers ability icon.

Do you want blue promo-style buttons for all unit types (except native life)?

Certainly if you have inspiration on how they would look. (I don't.)


Btw, the new former texture looks much darker in game than on the screenshots here. :confused: Perhaps just a problem at my side, I don't know. You'll be able to see for yourself when I release the next patch.

oh. I never tested it ingame.

Shall I brighten it up a bit? I still have the .psd

ok, new new former texture here.

I made it a bit brighter, and also tweaked the hue a little more towards yellow. I'm proud of it :3

Is there any particular design plan on the Hyperian?

I'm currently thinking a sort of semi-exposed look for the head. Something like:
http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii197/EliteF50/ELITE.jpg
http://news.gotgame.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/darth-malak.jpg

Generally, bald, exposed crania, gasmask/breathing apparatus covering the lower half of face only. Given the free Empath Song ability, they strike me as creepy, disturbed guys who've probably had a lot of encounters with mindworms, and too much time playing with fire. Or maybe their guns spray fungicide or something, I don't know. They're kind of lacking in visible flavour.

I think, you should take a look at the Dune Wars Art Thread (especially this post (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8346255&postcount=267)). I guess, the unit looks similar.

Generally, bald, exposed crania, gasmask/breathing apparatus covering the lower half of face only. Given the free Empath Song ability, they strike me as creepy, disturbed guys who've probably had a lot of encounters with mindworms, and too much time playing with fire. Or maybe their guns spray fungicide or something, I don't know. They're kind of lacking in visible flavour.I think that would be a perfect fit - look at the button for the Helion, which is the next unit in the line - it fits your description. I could see the model, with two distinct textures and perhaps a minor weapon swap or so, used for the helion as well.

And regarding the weapon: Helions are derived from "helios", greek for sun, so it's implied that they shoot something hot and flame-y at their enemies. Since the Hyperian is between the plasmathrower and the helion and a flamethrower unit as well, I guess it should shoot something fiery, too (a couple of months ago, I played with a biiiigger flamethrower effect, it's somewhere on the previous pages, but I'm crappy at making human units, so it never found a home - if you want it for the unit, I can attach it here :) ).

@Maniac: I attached another version of the sandstorm, it should be the same, just much closer to the ground than before. If you use this one, I recommend using the non-animated version, because the lightning flashes look a bit strange, if they're not coming from a higher cloud.

Cheers, LT.

With regards to the sandstorm, the Unit version I did which swirled around (the one in Maniac's post) was much nicer that the current Effect version we have in Dune Wars IMO. That can easily be converted to an animated feature which would probably give the best result. The sandstorm unit may still be in the Dune Wars units folder - if not I can post the files.

The sandstorm unit may still be in the Dune Wars units folder - if not I can post the files.Huh, couldn't find it there (of course, this may just be a case of being blind... again!).

Cheers, LT.

No you're not blind. I had to go back to Dune Wars 1.3 to dig this out. See attached. I can't test it right now, but hopefully all is there.

No you're not blind. I had to go back to Dune Wars 1.3 to dig this out. See attached. I can't test it right now, but hopefully all is there.Thanks, downloaded. Now I have to find out how to get the animation working for an improvement... The included kfm- and kf-file is a bit weird! :crazyeye:

Cheers, LT.

ok, new new former texture here.

Thanks! Looks better with me indeed.

Is there any particular design plan on the Hyperian?

You mean graphics or "lore"?
What Lord Tirian said basically. Hyperian refers to Hyperion, which is a Sun-related Titan in Greek mythology.

Your plan for the unit sounds great. :goodjob:
What polygon count are you aiming for, by the way?

Thanks, downloaded. Now I have to find out how to get the animation working for an improvement... The included kfm- and kf-file is a bit weird! :crazyeye:

Would be great if you could get it to work. :D It's for a feature though, not an improvement.

Now I have to find out how to get the animation working for an improvement... The included kfm- and kf-file is a bit weird! :crazyeye:

I'm fairly sure that if you use Attach KF in NifSkope to merge the animation into the NIF then that will work. I made the Hawk bonus resource graphic for Dune Wars using the FFH2 hawk unit with this technique.

I'm fairly sure that if you use Attach KF in NifSkope to merge the animation into the NIF then that will work. I made the Hawk bonus resource graphic for Dune Wars using the FFH2 hawk unit with this technique.First thing I've tried (because that's the way I usually check animations) - and I end up with a "couldn't find the animation's root node ()".

Cheers, LT.

Ah, I remember getting that issue now. It's a weird one, you're right. I only managed to change the animation by hacking away at the KF in NifSkope. It may be possible to copy the Controllers manually from the KF into the NIF.

Ah, I remember getting that issue now. It's a weird one, you're right. I only managed to change the animation by hacking away at the KF in NifSkope. It may be possible to copy the Controllers manually from the KF into the NIF.Yeah, this one was a bit of an "Argh!". I ended up creating the appropriate nodes using nifskope directly. Love that program!

Anyway, after the "Argh!" subsided, I was able to create a gently moving graphic. I halved the speed of the rotation to make it look less like an active storm that's blowing right now, but more like a persistent phenomenon. Also, look at the second screenshot - I got it (more or less) confined to a single square without looking too flat or anything, I think it's pretty clear which square this graphic belongs to. :)

For the screenshots, I used a fScale = 0.15 and a fInterfaceScale = 0.5.

Cheers, LT.

The Plasmathrower/Hyperian model won't import in blender. This is rather inconvenient since I was going to use it as a base.

The Plasmathrower/Hyperian model won't import in blender. This is rather inconvenient since I was going to use it as a base.AFAIK, it's just the clone worker model from next war with a new texture and rigged to the paratrooper skeleton. You could use the clone worker as base and rig it to a suited skeleton (and it doesn't need to be the paratrooper one, really, just any that's point its gun at something while shooting, so the flames can come out correctly)... of course, that's the fiddly part of the work that I hate.

Cheers, LT.

On that subject actually, do you know of any animation set which fires a gun from the hip ? Holding a flamethrower up to eye level like a rifle seems so strange, not to mention extremely difficult due to weight.

On that subject actually, do you know of any animation set which fires a gun from the hip ? Holding a flamethrower up to eye level like a rifle seems so strange, not to mention extremely difficult due to weight.Yeah, there are a couple of animations that could work:

Chinese Cho-Ku-Nu - but there's a bit of weird arm movement for the crossbow reload
Next War Cyborg - he fires a shotgun held a bit above hip level, should be pretty good, I think, plus his animations are way underused

Thanks for the Great Dunes, guys! :D

Looking forward to the flameplasmahyperian. :)

Not really a graphical issue per se, but aesthetic nevertheless. I think "Windmill" and "Sea Mill" should be renamed to "Turbine" and "Sea Turbine". Or maybe "Wind Turbine" for the first one. I used to live near a wind farm, and I'm pretty sure that's what they're supposed to be actually called. Also, it sounds cooler and more futuristic. Windmills in the present day don't "mill" anything. They produce power, and turbine is a correct name.

What polygon count are you aiming for, by the way?


Going to be below 1200 at any rate. I'm using the Nextwar Cyborg as a base, which seems to be sort of moderate polycount

Ok, I'm mostly done. Total Polycount, 950

I now have a fully rigged guy, but I'm not sure how to do the flamethrower aspect. ie, the fire effects and sounds. I'm using a new animation set and skeleton, so I can't just paste it in over the old nif. What parts am I going to need to copy over from one of the existing flame units? Particles are something I don't have a lot of expertise with yet. Is this going to take kf editing ?

Ok, I'm mostly done. Total Polycount, 950

I now have a fully rigged guy, but I'm not sure how to do the flamethrower aspect. ie, the fire effects and sounds. I'm using a new animation set and skeleton, so I can't just paste it in over the old nif. What parts am I going to need to copy over from one of the existing flame units? Particles are something I don't have a lot of expertise with yet. Is this going to take kf editing ?Look at the kf of the plasmathrower or flamethrower. The NiTextKeyExtraData-node contains the information, there is an effect (the flames) and origin node (from the nif) specified. Just replicate it using nifskope.

The flames are an effect from the CIV4EffectInfos.xml-file (the sound is done in a similar way). If you don't feel like it, I can do the flame-y bit, perhaps even in a new colour or changed effect (perhaps biiiiigger? Or reddish flames?).

Cheers, LT.

Not really a graphical issue per se, but aesthetic nevertheless. I think "Windmill" and "Sea Mill" should be renamed to "Turbine" and "Sea Turbine". Or maybe "Wind Turbine" for the first one. I used to live near a wind farm, and I'm pretty sure that's what they're supposed to be actually called. Also, it sounds cooler and more futuristic. Windmills in the present day don't "mill" anything. They produce power, and turbine is a correct name.

I think this is a case of "Everyone has a different background, so there will always be something that bugs anyone." like I said to Lord Tirian. In Belgium we do call them windmills. Also Tidal Harnesses could probably be called Turbines as well. Sea Mills seems more clear what it's about. Plus the name is shorter.

Total Polycount, 950

Awesome. :D That's low enough to use in the mid- or end-game.

I've found the mentioned node, but I can't see anywhere in it that specifies an origin node/coords. Could you maybe take a screenshot of where that data is

The offer to do it for me is appreciated, but I'll never learn that way :)
Hopefully after this is sorted, I can retroactively correct the animations for the flamethrower and plasmathrower. May eventually do Helion art too.

Also, will I need to modify any kfs other than rangedstrike ?

I've found the mentioned node, but I can't see anywhere in it that specifies an origin node/coords. Could you maybe take a screenshot of where that data isAyup, I circled it in red.

The upper entry "Num Text Keys" just specifies how many entries are there, if you need more, just increase the number and hit the green refresh button below it. Make sure that the first and last entry are as they are before the edit (with the start animation code and the end).

The entries between the start and end entry all have the same structure, first the time (in sec.) when they occur and then the entry what happens. Effect entries have the following syntax: EFFECT:name_of_the_node:effect_defined_in_the_XML

In this case, the node (of the plasmathrower, see 2nd screenshot) is fx_dummy_rifleblast_modern - you'll find that bone in the nif of the plasmathrower at the muzzle of the gun, where it's supposed to shoot from, also note that the scale of the node is applied to the size of the effect. The effect is EFFECT_RIFLEBLAST_FLAMES2, this one is a custom one from Planetfall specified in the CIV4EffectInfos.xml (in which a nif-file is referred, namely the one containing the blue fire effect, by modifying that nif, you can change the effect).

Sound effects are similar, they have the same structure but don't specify an origin node, but you'll find out quickly by just looking at them.

Also, will I need to modify any kfs other than rangedstrike ?Unless you want to attach other funky effects while it's not attacking, no - AFAIK gun units only have the rangedstrike-kf as attack animation. You could, however, attach (in the same manner as above) an explosion to the death animation to make them go "BOOM"! ;)

By the way, these things are why I find nifskope so ridiculously use- and powerful. Apart from modelling, you could do almost everything else with it, somebody should really write an in-depth tutorial, but I'm never sufficiently motivated to do so...

Cheers, LT.

This should be all the info I need, then.

But I noticed, the plasmathrower and flamethrower units have animations in their folders, obviously the ones they use. I've got a fair bit of experience here, and I usually prefer to make KFMs in a seperate, centrally acessible folder. Much like you're doing with the textures in art/shared. Any objection to me making a seperate flamethrower kfm, rather than sticking animations in the hyperian's folder? I'll do it with proper animation/kfm names, too.

I've use Konverter before, and I'm also well aware of issues with custom kfms, and how to solve them. This is mainly a question of a slight change in planetfall's organisational structure. In FF, I store them in the directory art/animations/KFMNameHere .Could do a similar thing here ?

Picture and file attached. There are two subfolders within the zip. one containing the hyperian nif and texture, the other containing the kfm/animations.

they don't have to be anywhere near each other in the file structure at all.
Flames work perfectly, clothing is teamcolored, everything seems good to go, unless someone feels like adding a gloss map.

I think this firing animation is far better suited to a flamethrower.

Picture and file attached. There are two subfolders within the zip. one containing the hyperian nif and texture, the other containing the kfm/animations.

they don't have to be anywhere near each other in the file structure at all.
Flames work perfectly, clothing is teamcolored, everything seems good to go, unless someone feels like adding a gloss map.

I think this firing animation is far better suited to a flamethrower.

Thanks awesome! :D

I'm wondering, what does the flamethrower.nif do? I've never seen anyone include a nif with the animations before.

Also, despite the naming, the included animations are only for the Hyperian, correct?

But I noticed, the plasmathrower and flamethrower units have animations in their folders, obviously the ones they use. I've got a fair bit of experience here, and I usually prefer to make KFMs in a seperate, centrally acessible folder. Much like you're doing with the textures in art/shared. Any objection to me making a seperate flamethrower kfm, rather than sticking animations in the hyperian's folder? I'll do it with proper animation/kfm names, too.

I've use Konverter before, and I'm also well aware of issues with custom kfms, and how to solve them. This is mainly a question of a slight change in planetfall's organisational structure. In FF, I store them in the directory art/animations/KFMNameHere .Could do a similar thing here ?

My experience, and the reason for the current organizational structure, is that for graphics to work correctly even with Animations turned off, the animation files need to be in the same folder as the nif, and the kfm file has to have the exact same name as the nif. Do the FF graphics work correctly even with animations turned off?

I'm wondering, what does the flamethrower.nif do? I've never seen anyone include a nif with the animations before.

My experience, and the reason for the current organizational structure, is that for graphics to work correctly even with Animations turned off, the animation files need to be in the same folder as the nif

The answer to these two questions is the same, so I'll answer both at once.

As mentioned, I have a fair bit of experience with this. Mostly through trial and error (AKA: Experience), I have discoverered that, for animations to work, the following must be true

1. The folder containing the kfm must also contain a nif, to which the skeleton defined in the animation matches.

2. The folder containing the kfm must also contain a nif which has the same base name as the kfm (ie, flamethrower.kfm must be in the same folder as flamethrower.nif)

3. There must be an appropriately named and skeletoned (is that even a verb?) nif for every .kf which is referenced in the kfm.

The above reasoning is why the existing flamethrower unit is named "paratrooper.nif" and includes the paratrooper animations within it's kfm. I found this solution unsatisfactory, messy, and inefficient, and so I challenged it. Thi post contains a birief summary of my findings, part of which were determined via discussion and observation with other members of this wonderful forum, and part of which were simple trial and error on my part. It would be arrogant and probably untrue to call myself a pioneer, but I at least tried to find a better way, and suceeeded. Perhaps others who came before me merely didn;t document their findings too well. Another belief I have is that if you think you're the first or best person to do anything, you are completely wrong, and I try my best to avoid such claims.

The flamethrower folder I have provided, satisfies all of the above requirements in one, by providing flamethrower.kfm, flamethrower.nif, and renaming all the animations to use flamethrower as the prefix. Every single file within that folder is needed. Do NOT delete or move anything out of the folder, though the folder itself (assuming all contents are intact) can be moved anywhere you like. For the nif, again through practical experience, I have discovered that the skeleton is all the system really cares about. Therefore the flamethrower.nif in the provided folder contains only a skeleton, and no mesh or texture data, purely for resource saving reasons. Thusly it is only 5Kb and not much to be concerned about, but it IS necessary. DO NOT DELETE IT

The system firaxis have in place for this is rather arcane and confusing, at best. Putting the animations in every unit's folder is certainly the cleanest solution, in that it can be guaranteed to work with minimum fuss. But it is also a horribly inefficient solution. And is an oxymoron for any mod which has chosen to use a shared textures folder. like a step backwards in tech.

The technique I have provided here, is a step forwards, as far as I'm aware. It allows foolproof remote acessibility to a kfm, with the guarantee that it will work, and without the necessity to include anything beyond nif and texture(s) in the art's folder. Or to put it another way, you've been doing it wrong all along! And every unit in planetfall which includes animations from an existing animset is inefficient and wasteful.

As a side note, including th boundshape.nif anywhere, ever, is completely pointless and unecessary. In fact, I'd strongly advise doing a text search and removing all instances of boundshape.nif before your next fpk release. Also, nifskope was here. nifviewer sux.

I would personally advise putting the folder structure as follows:
Flamethrower folder goes under art/animations
Hyperian Folder goes under art/units

But that is entirely my personal preference for organisation. and may not fit yours. In any case, you can point the hyperian artdefine at the flamethrower.kfm, wherever you put it, and be certain that it will work. As a side note, you need to actually make a hyperian artdefine, since you don't currently have one.

Protip. Pointing one unit at another unit's artdefine is BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD. Don't do it. Duplicate the data if necessary, but don't put multiple units on the same artdefine where possible unless you're really sure you want them to look identical no matter what. For placeholder art like this case, just duplicate the data in advance please. Would have saved me a little work in testing.

See, I'm not just a cute face ^__^
I have my areas of expertise, and Lord Tirian has his. I'm sure we both have something to learn from each other. And nobody is ever, ever perfect. The day you stop learning is the day you die.



Also, despite the naming, the included animations are only for the Hyperian, correct?

Right now, yes.
In the long term, no.
therefore, wherever you put them in the file structure, it is strongly advised to not make them a subfolder of any existing unit.
The point of seperating the animations from the unit, is to allow them to be stored and acessed in a central location. Eventually, I hope to make the flamethrower and plasmathrower units use them too. Which will require nothing additional in those units' directories, and will in fact allow deletion of the paratrooper anims which are currently there.

Since I have edited the previous post so many times, I am now making a new post just to remind you to look at again, in case you missed it. Please read over my previous post one more time, just in case..

And if you're sure you've read it all, please check the "last edited" time and be sure you've read it since then.

But if you need a short answer:


1. Put the "Hyperian" folder somewhere
2. Put the "Flamethrower" folder somewhere else
3. Point the artdefine at the "hyperian.nif" and "Flamethrower.kfm" within their respective folders, wherever you put them
4. ???????
5. Profit!

Also, nifskope was here. nifviewer sux.I do prefer nifskope as well, but I have to say, nifviewer has a couple of uses - it's a good test for models before they go into the game, because the rendering is more faithful to Civ4, it's showing the summed up polycount (so you don't have to go through every mesh) and it crashes faster - whenever Civ4 would crash, whereas nifskope can still show models that would kill the Civ4 engine. Good to test them whether something got screwy.

On the animations folder issue, it's a matter of preference, because it's only useful as long as you have re-used animations. If, for example, every flamethrower unit gets a different flame effect (something I'd like and probably want to do later, if you don't mind), then you'd end up with one animation for each model again, just split up into different folders. One thing I do hate, however, is the renaming of nifs to match the animations - I'd rather edit the KFM, if I'm using unique/modified animations anyway.

EDIT: Not saying that setting up an extra shared animation directory is bad, actually I think it's a pretty ingenious idea, as long as you have duplicate animations, just as the shared texture folder is used for textures that are actually shared and non-shared textures are in their respective folders to make it easier to find/organise them. I guess Firaxis set it up as it is because of these two reasons - some textures are reused, but in Civ almost every unit has its own unique animation, making a shared animation directory just messier for organising the graphics team efforts.

Anyway, I'm more than pleased to see somebody with such enthusiasm working on graphics here! :)

Cheers, LT.

Thanks for the explanation, WarKirby! :)

it crashes faster - whenever Civ4 would crash, whereas nifskope can still show models that would kill the Civ4 engine. Good to test them whether something got screwy.

Since you mention it, Scene Viewer actually crashes for me when I try to open the Hyperian. Haven't tested the model in-game yet though.

I never have, and most likely now never will, test things in the scene/nifviewer, but as you can tell from the provided screenshot, I have tested the hyperian ingame and am certain it works. Generally, I test in nifskope until satisfied, then test ingame. If it works as desired, it's done.

Since you mention it, Scene Viewer actually crashes for me when I try to open the Hyperian. Haven't tested the model in-game yet though.Hmmm... WarKirby, is it a unit with shaders? Maniac's PC doesn't support shaders, maybe that's crashing it?

Cheers, LT.

every unit I make, ever, has the basic TCiv4Skinning shader at least, because I use skininstances and bone weightings on everything. I sometimes add gloss maps, although not in this case.

Without shaders, anything with a skinInstance is either distorted or causes a CTD on display. Having a pc which doesn't support shaders is a pretty serious issue which I'd suggest you resolve asap. Kind of falls under the Reasonable Runtime Environment rule.

Without shaders, anything with a skinInstance is either distorted or causes a CTD on display.True. But I quickly wrenched the skinpartition and shaders out of the unit... and done the teamcolour as base/decal setup (i.e. the way it's done for non-shader units in Civ4). The attached version shows animation in nifskope and doesn't crash nifviewer and isn't distorted or anything - I assume it should work for Maniac. If not, post - it's late enough, I'm off to bed, so excuse the lack of an in-game test for now! :p

(I found out a while ago that it's actually the SkinPartition export of blender that causes the distortions/crashs, not the SkinInstance in itself)

Cheers, LT.

Thanks! :)

WarKirby, I've run into a problem which I expect you probably can figure out the cause of.

I dislike the current InVitro unit graphic. It seems less futuristic than unit graphics of the same tech level. Plus that graphic look like a bunch of mindless marching nazis, which is not the mental picture I have of InVitros. So I tried to change it to a model by SeZereth, which you can find in the Art/Units/InVitro folder added in the latest patch g. SeZereth says the unit uses the Navy SEAl animations.

Planetfall already includes a similar model though for the Cyborg; as far as I can tell the only difference is the texture. Unfortunately the file name has been kept the same for the original SeZereth texture, and the Cyborg texture. As a consequence I can't just throw the InVitro nif in the Navy SEAL folder like I did for the Cyborg.

So I put the InVitro nif in its own folder, and included all the Navy SEAL animations in that folder as well. I renamed the kfm file to match the nif.

However when I start the game and I look at the unit in the Datalinks, I get a python exception. I've gotten that one before when there was some problem with the animations.

When I put the InVitro nif in the Navy SEAL folder, there is no problem. But then of course the texture is wrong.

So I don't understand. What element am I missing? Why doesn't it work?

So I tried to change it to a model by SeZereth, which you can find in the Art/Units/InVitro folder added in the latest patch g. SeZereth says the unit uses the Navy SEAl animations.

You included broken art in a patch ? I hope it's not active.

Planetfall already includes a similar model though for the Cyborg; as far as I can tell the only difference is the texture. Unfortunately the file name has been kept the same for the original SeZereth texture, and the Cyborg texture. As a consequence I can't just throw the InVitro nif in the Navy SEAL folder like I did for the Cyborg.

I don;t understand. Why are texture names an issue ? And why would you want to put anything in the navy seal folder ? You can remotely reference the kfm. The majority f FFH units using firaxis animations do so.


So I put the InVitro nif in its own folder, and included all the Navy SEAL animations in that folder as well. I renamed the kfm file to match the nif.

Not just the kfm, but the individual kfs need to be renamed, too. However if you do that, they will break because the kfm stores the original kf names. Therefore those references need to be changed by decoding it with Konverter, editing the resulting xml, and then re-encoding it to a kfm again.

That's not actually as much work as it sounds, but it is still mildly bothersome. as far as you've described, I don't see any need to do so, anyway. Why not just leave it called navyseal.nif and use the navyseal animations as they are ?

However when I start the game and I look at the unit in the Datalinks, I get a python exception. I've gotten that one before when there was some problem with the animations.

When I put the InVitro nif in the Navy SEAL folder, there is no problem. But then of course the texture is wrong.

So I don't understand. What element am I missing? Why doesn't it work?

This is the result of not renaming the kfs too, yes.


If the problem is a wrong texture, then you shouldn't be messing with animations at all. Just rename the texture and change the reference to it in the nif, with nifscope. Do you know how to do that ?

I don;t understand. Why are texture names an issue ? And why would you want to put anything in the navy seal folder ? You can remotely reference the kfm. The majority f FFH units using firaxis animations do so.

The majority of vanilla FfH's unit suffer from the following problem (from the first post in the FfH bug thread):
5. While playing if your units look okay when moving but turn back to normal civ4 units when standing still its because you have "Freeze Animations" turned on in your game options.

I don't have a clue why our experiences are different, and actually why your Hyperian isn't having the same problem I noticed with all other units. If I would link to an animation in a different folder, for example the Cyborg to the SEAL anims while the Cyborg nif is in a different folder, then the Cyborg would suddenly look like the Navy SEAL if you'd turn frozen animations on.

Just a random guess: Might the reason the Hyperian is not having this problem be that flamethrower.nif is a mere skeleton, instead of a full unit?


Also, if kf's need to be renamed too, I'm completely confused now why my solution for the frozen animation problem worked. :confused:

If the problem is a wrong texture, then you shouldn't be messing with animations at all. Just rename the texture and change the reference to it in the nif, with nifscope. Do you know how to do that ?

Nope. :-s

The frozen animations option is a pretty silly thing IMO, for a start. It's not animation related at all. Rather, the units just have several nifs, and it switches between them.

The problem you describe is because FFH didn't remove the frozen animation nifs from those animation folders. And civ looks in the kfm folder for said animations.

Actually supporting this feature is a fair bit of boring extra work for an artist, and not really for much gain. Civ isn;t a game where framerate or reaction times are important, so disabling animations for performance reasons isn't worthwhile.


To put it simply, the frozen animations bug is not caused by having the animations in a seperate folder. It's caused by having frozen animation nifs in the folder where the kfm is. If those nifs were moved to a unit's own folder and it had the kfm there, you'd see the exact same bug. To prevent it, just delete the frozen navyseal nifs. I believe frozen animations only works if the nifs are present, otherwise animations show as normal

The reason the hyperian is not having any problems, is because

1. The kfm is named flamethrower.kfm
2. The folder contains a flamethrower.nif, which has a skeleton matching the animations
3. The animations are all named Flamethrower_<actionhere>

The flamethrower.nif being a mere skeleton, is purely, and only, for resource saving reasons. It takes less harddrive space that way. If it were a full unit with mesh data, it would still work just fine. And waste a few hundred extra kb of space unecessarily. By satisfying all three of the above conditions, all dependancies between the animation set, and the unit using it, are severed. Which means the animation set will work anywhere. You could even copy all the files from the flamethrower folder, into the hyperian's folder. And it would still work perfectly. Although that's the kind of inflexibility and disorganisation that I'm trying to avoid here. By having the animations centralised, it means there's only one place to change if tweaks are needed.