Hello.
I've finally found some time to host and hopefully play the second TCGame.
The idea is experimental trait comparison is that we play the same game with only one difference from player to player - the second trait of our leader. For example, first one was played with Agressive leaders of Byzantium.
This is not beginning yet, as i think we should first agree upon restrictions - we allowed too many things to be loose in the first one, and that led to our games being quite uncomparable.

This time we play America, as a civ with essentially no UU or UB.
About the fixed trait, coin has decided it to be Expansive.
Speed i believe should be fixed epic. (or normal, don't know :( )

I'm open to suggestions on what map whould we pick and is it worth it to define early-game strategy, in order to make games more comparable. I have also no idea on what to do with difficulty. Should i encourage every player to play on the same difficulty, or is it better for each to pick the difficulty most fitting him?
Please write anything that you think can help me to make the seriesmore useful and entertaining!

restrictions is purely nonsense. Forcing someone to play not his game will not increase any value....

to get better comparison you just need to attract more players. Restrictions won't serve a thing...

Edit: me likes expnasive. Would play Shaka again...

Votes:

Normal speed

No events or huts (they shatter comparisons)

Fractal map gives variance to the map type without being extreme

Same difficulty is preferred, otherwise we'll get a monarch horse archer rush clearing the continent while players on immortal might have to wait until renaissance...hardly comparing traits then.

Well, let's see how everyone else feels.

Votes:

Normal speed

No events or huts (they shatter comparisons)

Fractal map gives variance to the map type without being extreme

Same difficulty is preferred, otherwise we'll get a monarch horse archer rush clearing the continent while players on immortal might have to wait until renaissance...hardly comparing traits then.

Well, let's see how everyone else feels.

I tend to agree with the above as well - especially along the lines of same difficulty level. If we do that, we probably should consider monarch or emperor. Monarch is more likely to attract the largest audience, but emperor is probably a bit more in line with the skill level of the people who played the first one (since I think we had some like me who are moving up to immortal, and some who are already comfortably immortal players).

Some really interesting leaders though - I hope this series can attract a bunch of players. GW, Joao, Peter, Izzy and one of my favorites, mehmed - should be fun.

i tend to agree on map script fractal, and difficulty emperor.
we will have no restrictions or guidelines for early-game strategy, but i'll try to pick map and opponents to lessen the chances of choisy decisions (i.e. rush/not rush, SE/CE, so that player will be more or less forced into similar styles of play)
events and huts will be off (as in the first one)
barbs will be on.

I don't think we need to constrain actual play - some of that IS dictated by traits, after all.

Maybe we should poll the difficulty, to see what people want generally. I'll play anything...even deity...although that wouldn't be pretty.

As far as game speed goes I'm not sure that fixing it will provide the best results. Sure in a scientific sense it makes perfect sense. The fewer variables the better. In a "I personally feel that epic plays way too slowly and would rather not play" sense I think you will just lose out on some of your potential test group.

It seems agreed upon already but please not terra again (I think that was the last map script you did). Perhaps it was just the neighbors but that game was no fun and right now I'm blaming the map.

For the difficulty I will play anything with the caveat that my deity still involves lots of BC losses, but not to barbs anymore!

Actually game 1 was tectonics AFAIK, which was why we got a bajillion plains tiles.

Speed is a "fine line" sort of thing. On the one hand, allowing it to vary gets us more people willing to participate. On the other, games played at different speeds aren't comparable. It's enough that the optimal tactics change completely. For example, in a recent monarch student game I saw someone pull an immortal rush on immortal epic against a civ that probably required at least 20 tiles of travel. A protective target. Try that on normal...I DARE you. Even if you were to succeed, the results would be far less ideal. Marathon would be even worse ----> you could have cleared that part of the continent completely! Finish dates will always be sooner on slower speeds, but the real issue IMO is the variance in strategies available...was SPI really better than ORG for that early rush? Well, if SPI was on marathon, yes! Around 50% better (functionally more)!

So I don't know what to do with that either, but since this is a trait comparison game, I find it hard to allow speed variance and still buy the argument that we're comparing anything remotely similar.

It was techtonics. Thought up the wrong map type that starts with a T. As far as speed that is definitely the issue. I play marathon up to 1ADish once in a while just for kicks because it is a completely different game. Epic even plays different. Can always fix the speed at normal or epic and just see how many people play. While it is less data I do not think anyone is writing a journal article based on the findings!

Edit - Though quite frankly no matter what we do there will be a ton of variance simply due to skill levels. Watching one of the deity players on the board stomp monarch so badly I feel bad for virtual Shaka with Toku while a monarch level player struggles with Gilgamesh doesn't really prove a thing either... /shrug

i would not make big buzz of comparison... How many people finished first one?

I ma still watermilling farming these plains...

In a "I personally feel that epic plays way too slowly and would rather not play" sense I think you will just lose out on some of your potential test group.

i can't help it :( i always felt epic is waaay too fast. if honestly, i find even marathon extremely fast, but alas - i'm alone here. I believe i certainly should fix speed, and i lean towards epic because i like it slower. But normal maybe an option too. Let's see if any epic-haters express their opinion here.
As AI_shizuka said, "no more tectonics". The second will be on Fractal map. There will be a poll about what difficulty to play, and it will decide.

Definitely normal speed. It gives you no advantages over the AI, which the slower speeds do. Besides, even epic can become a slog. Difficulty no higher than emperor (I have yet to beat emperor, I am trying though;)).

Oh, and what leader? Different leaders, coupled with different players, will lead to wildly different games. I do not think you'll get any comparison worthwhile, but we will have a fun game/series

personally i'd play normal to marathon monarch to diety:lol: [although last one would force be to make sad post about being killed....]

but prefer something in da middle like epic immortal...

And what were the results of the first game?

i understand that different players will play differently, but, alas, leader still must be different - it's the whole point of the series.
i play hammy, you play alex, and then we try to see if organised is better than philosophical or vice versa. - that was the idea!

And what were the results of the first game?
not much results there were, because different games were played at different speeds and difficulties, and, with different strategies, turned not even remotely comparable. it was fun though :lol:
they can be found here:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=319859

if this game succeeds to any extent, i guess i'll put those links to my sig as all those cool series-hosts :lol:

i would say first part had five more or less finished games max....

I would rate fun as main result although... have not pulled such nonsense in long time...

I bagsies Peter, as long as difficulty is somewhat manageable for me:D

hi!
here's the zip of wbsave
217267
to choose your leader, open it in a text editor, find 142-nd line (it is LeaderType=LEADER_ISABELLA) and replace LEADER_ISABELLA with any of the following
LEADER_WASHINGTON : TMIT
LEADER_SURYAVARMAN : michmbk
LEADER_SHAKA : Soirana
LEADER_BISMARCK : budweiser
LEADER_PETER : Single Malt
LEADER_PACAL
LEADER_MEHMED : PaulusIII
LEADER_JOAO : Duckweed
LEADER_ISABELLA : Lansky
LEADER_CHINESE_LEADER : Earthling
The last one should be mao, not qin.
everything should work fine, at least i was able to start isabella game. If it does not, let me know.
Here is the start.
4217270
I do ask you to tell which leader do you choose to play, so that i can keep track of who is who.
i do ask you to post updates with saves and srceens of cities/fin.advisor/tech advisor on following checkpoints:
1.after you have climed your land, be it through rush, REX, or blocking.
2.the first GP
3.1AD
4.liberalism
and any other time you consider to be important.
Please mention your wonders, GP's, wars, and any other thing you would consider important.
General thoughts are always welcome, too

I'll take Washington, even though I tell the AI lies.

ah, never mind. it's just my poor english.
btw, you never know what greeting do the AI's see when they meet TMIT...

shaka again...

just for clear emperor notmal or what?

yes, emperor normal are supposed difficulty and speed settings.

I'll take Peter:) And get my ass kicked on emperor:D

Bismarck...

I'll be taking Mehmed.

Shaka checkpoint one


to 1440BC...

moved warripor one hill and started thinking....
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/initial.jpg
Well, i ended on NW plainhills mainly to keep more initial cross hoping to get some resource in where....

2hammers from centre+2 from plain forest is good while expansive but i had no wish to get worker before AH so i did some manipultions wit lake [okay that means later worker, later growrth i am not sure how good it is in long run...]

http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/manipulations.jpg
got AH and worker done i believe on turn 13... worked lake again before cows was improved [as i will have plenty of hammers while commerce is spare...]
for smae reason i scouted more agreesive being sure cows and sheep will give anough warriors to replace losses and...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/notagain.jpg

This series will be certainly famous for giving AI's sick capitals. At least better rush target this time...
bad thing i have met rome and stalin... mmmm.... not guys i want to live, but double gems...

Luckily my settling paid as i got horses in cap BFC
I farmed a bit to let grow to size five. i will fluctatte it at size five between positive food and mild starvation working these plain hills...

http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/sizefive.jpg

After AH i teched wheel to start chariots as i was not planing to use slavery soon and chopping could really wait...
So it went AH>Wheel>Mining>BW
i started writing but change to mysticism as i needed some border pops.... [neither writing nor mysticism is finished yet...]

I built reasonable size of chariots [i was not sure if inidain cap is not on hill and i am used to immortal calculations...]
And met
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/defenses.jpg
Well, i got two cities while killing two archers and wasting few turns to go through jungle... i ven checked Ghandi had slavery... i really feeel cheating while playing against AI lately...

http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/stone.jpg
I also settled my own city [one of resaons i went for mysticism]

I was worried what to do with all these chariots so deleted barbbusting warriors
and
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/barbcity.jpg
Once in a while in ideal location...

Some may ask why i kept second Indian city... Well, it is good after IW... has few cottages planted by india,,, and it blocks land for good. I have all the land between me and India to play with.

Also if i need to defend it will be these two cities... i actually fell like wanting masonry for walls soon...
[defense + with stone i can overflow the to gold like protective without stone and still play with my racks...]

Wonders have been going late [great wall is still on] and hindu went to rome so i might grab oracle if i get enough loot to get to priesthood... [and how much double gems will cover...]

Position is good but with praets on one side and Stalin on other this still is not autowin...

sorry, i am lazy to post financial and other advisors... added save instead...

I had some trouble changing leaders. I went ot line 142 in the WB save and changed the leader, but I still got American graphics and starting traits, not German.

2budweiser.
i'll have to check it when i get home.
which leader traits do you get instead of Bis's exp&ind?

2budweiser.
i'll have to check it when i get home.
which leader traits do you get instead of Bis's exp&ind?

I'm not sure. I should have said I got America's starting techs, not their traits. I didnt start playing, I didnt want to spoil anything. But everything seemed to be American except the name.

that was it meant to be...

you have american techs, colors, uniques and your chosen traits....

afterall you changed only leader... That is basically unrestricted american leader for player:)

that was it meant to be...

you have american techs, colors, uniques and your chosen traits....

afterall you changed only leader... That is basically unrestricted american leader for player:)

Ah, OK. I misunderstood the challenge.

I'll try Mao if no one contests him, figure it's best to leave a couple of these more appealing leaders still open to encourage people to get into the challenge. Haven't played anything as of yet but I hope it will be fun.

I'll take Sury for loads of cheap buildings! Probably won't get a chance to play it until this weekend though - work is pretty busy.

Checkpoint 1 1280BC, Peter of America, Emperor, Normal speed (as required)

Uneventful, I went down the blocking route, founding New York on Gandhi's border to claim a grassland pig, irrigated corn and coastal fish. Definitely my GP farm, as the rest of the land is very food poor. The second city founded, was to claim the copper west of Washington. I used the expansive trait to get out a fair few workers in Wash, as its hammer heavy. I also went wheel before BW, as it allowed me a superior unit early (chariots), easing my worries of emperor level barbs, aside that whipping in Wash is ineffective, due to poor food supply, and it wasn't too heavily forested. I learned mysticism early too, to have some hope of not being culture crushed by Gandhi's holy city capital, beside which NY is situated. I have pottery, and am currently building up gold for Writing, which I will follow with Aesthetics.

Now for some pics:
The world discovered, before my woodsmanI warrior was beaten by a barb warrior on a forested hill!!!:mad:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/world-1280BC.jpg
My capital:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/capital-1280.jpg
My other two cities:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/new-york1280.jpg
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/boston1280.jpg
The civs I have met so far:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/civs-met1280.jpg
The financial Adviser:http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/fin-adv1280.jpg
The tech Adviser:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/tech-adv1280.jpg

I am in the process of getting some cottages up currently, as I have next to no commerce, and my next city I will settle 1 west of the beavers (also gets fish), to get some much needed happy (need hunting first). Any advice on how to proceed will be greatly appreciated, as I am quite new to emperor, and have yet to beat it.

2Single Malt

start GP farming asap, you're phi, after all
military-wise, gandhi would make some easy prey, he's got a holy city and is unlikely to defend his cities with anything but culture. but you can as well wait untill he shrines the holy city for you. just watch out for two warmongers, they are very likely to go after gandhi, and then after you!

i see now i was a bit unclear. by "tech advisor" i meant the screen showing you available tech trades. i now realise it's actually one of the windows of roreign advisor, sorry.
of course before alpha it's no need to post this.

2Single Malt

start GP farming asap, you're phi, after all
military-wise, gandhi would make some easy prey, he's got a holy city and is unlikely to defend his cities with anything but culture. but you can as well wait untill he shrines the holy city for you. just watch out for two warmongers, they are very likely to go after gandhi, and then after you!

i see now i was a bit unclear. by "tech advisor" i meant the screen showing you available tech trades. i now realise it's actually one of the windows of roreign advisor, sorry.
of course before alpha it's no need to post this.

I am well aware of Gandhi's weakness. At the moment, I cannot afford a huge military, I also suspect at he has Judaism, so I will hit him after construction. I want to extort some techs/cash from him before attacking too:D. GP farming will be started as sonn at writing is done, and NY food supply assured ( a worker has nearly roaded to it, and another is a turn from completion). It is top of the agenda at the moment, but I needed pottery before writing, in order to get much needed commerce.

2 Single Malt

just be sure not to leave that holy city to one of those maniacs ;)

I'll take Issy

Checkpoint 2 for Peter of America, 1st GP 500BC
Popped 1st Great Scientist in 500BC, founded a city to claim fur and fish. gandhi needs to go!, his goddamn culture stole my fish in the GP farm:mad:. Building axes now, and going construction asap.

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/1-GS.jpg
What is best to do with GS? Bulb maths, or academy in capital (best commerce city)?

Alright so I knocked out the first checkpoint concurrently with lunch, I'll probably wait to see what others are up to before going on tonight or tomorrow.


Settled in place, Animal Husbandry reveals we have horses as well. First AI met is a scout by JC, warrior heading South finds Ghandi:

http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2MaomeetGhandiCheckpoint10000.jpg


Went a standard opening into founding my second city, New York to the north so it can work the fish and horses.
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Maocity20000.jpg


Tentative Northern dotmap:
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Maodotmap0000.jpg

A little while later I think I have plans for the South...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Maosoutherndotmap0000.jpg


But a barb city throws a monkey wrench into things:
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Maobarbcity0000.jpg


Back on the home front with the early stone this game was an absolute breeze to get the Pyramids - my capital works on them:
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2MaobeginMids0000.jpg


Fourth city up, I've founded all pretty close around the capital cause the land fits, no reason not to:
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Maofoundphilly0000.jpg


And the mids are finally in, that's it for my opening:
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2MaoPyramids0000.jpg


AI don't seem too threatening at all, I should get plenty of GS, seems like a cruise from here on out. Protective trait won't matter all too much.

I'd take JOAO for a go.

Checkpoint 3, Peter of America, 900AD (a little later than I wanted, but I was a little preoccupied).
Well, I decided to use my GS for the immediate gain, as the next was not far away (PHI is great for the early GP's:D). I bulbed Maths. Turned out to be a good choice, as when Alphabet became available, I could trade to monarchy. From 500BC I also decided to prepare to invade Gandhi, for the big prize of the double holy cities, of the dominant Religions on the continent. I closed borders with Gandhi when JC asked (I did not want to face prats), and as soon as JC declared on Gandhi, I followed suit, pillaging his only strat resource on the way (horse). Sorry, I forgot pic of DoW.

I went straight for the Capital, as that was the big prize. I then hit the city to the west of it (Bombay), and 2 turns later Gandhi capped to JC.

I remembered pics after, here they are.
the empire first:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/empire900.jpg
My capital
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/cap900AD.jpg
My GPfarm:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/GP-farm900.jpg
The newly captured Shrine city (soon to be double, as I am working 3 priests to get that ASAP):
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/Double-shrine.jpg
The tech Adviser:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/Tech-screen900.jpg
And finally the demographics so far:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/demo900.jpg

I did not take the fin adviser, cos I was in anarchy, having just switched over to Judaism. I am going to make the switch to caste system soon, to make use of PHI and generate lots of GS's as I beeline Lib.

To 875BC or may call it checkpoint 1


Settled 1S, riverside city is always preferred without the risk of losing food tiles. Although it turned out that I lost the horse tile by doing this, I don't regret.

Tech:
AH->Mining->Wheel->BW->Pottery->Writing->Alpha

Capital:
Worker->Barrack->Warrior->Settler at pop3->2/3Warrior->Charioits...

A capital with 2 gems is no doubt worth an army and the maintenance fee for a distance city, my warrior came in and grab the free worker as the bonus.
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu224/Duckweed_/DOWGandhi.jpg

The fall of Indian capital -- a double holy city
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu224/Duckweed_/Delhi.jpg

Alpha is in, I can make peace with Gandhi with merely 2 techs
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu224/Duckweed_/Peace-3.jpg

Empire of 4 cities
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu224/Duckweed_/875BCEmpire.jpg

875BC Tech
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu224/Duckweed_/875BCTech.jpg

Someone else can take Bismarck if they want. I just dont have much time this week.

Well, haha, this time it seems like I get to be the odd one out. Slight spoiler

Everyone else is invading Ghandi, while I went for the early wonder build.


Anyway, here's my 2+1/2 checkpoint, up to 600AD


So after Pyramids are in the obvious goal is to get scientists up and running wherever I can. While I get libraries up, settle another city or two, here's some other happenings:

So far no civ is hogging any world wonders - they're split between random civs.
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Maosplitwonders0000.jpg


Some minor conversions back on forth between Hindu/Judaism never led to anything. Ghandi gets a shrine.
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Maoreligiousstuff0000.jpg


The first Great Scientist settles in the capital - since it's low commerce and I'm not running 100% science I judged this better than a first academy.
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2MaofirstGpCheckpoint20000.jpg


With a force of axes I finally clear out the barbarian city, with the intent to settle my own elsewhere, to avoid Ghandi's cultural pressure and all. But Ghandi heads after the site anyway, which provokes me into a slight skirmish to keep him away. Ghandi is the weakling on the continent by far but I didn't feel like killing him so that was that for this war. Unfortunately, Ghandi later peacefully vassaled to Stalin (who has a TON of land on his own little mini-continent) but I should be able to handle them both later.
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2MaokillGhandi0000.jpg


1 AD Overview
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Mao1AD0000.jpg


My tech path didn't involve getting alpha very early and so I paid the price in none of the AI's getting it either. So trading started very late, here's the first time I got things going.
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Maofinallycantrade0000.jpg


But what was I teching then? Well, a quick CS and then to Literature for the Great Libary, another massive benefit to tech.
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2MaoGreatLib0000.jpg


I also picked up the Artist from Music for a free GA.
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2MaoMusicArtist0000.jpg


The second scientist finally makes that Academy. In the meantime, the continent is finally united under hinduism and I get my more southern cities up and running pretty well - everything is farms so far :)
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Mao2ndScientist0000.jpg


At 600AD I figured I've progressed enough for this checkpoint. I decided to go pick up the AP cause I can - I may decide to be devious (declare + capture Ghandi's cities and force peace before Stalin arrives to help) but at any rate I wouldn't sit well with the stupid AI having it. I should have a very quick path to liberalism or whatever else I want, thanks to very OP Pyramids + GL tech.
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo25/richertc/Single%20Player/Trait2Mao600AD0000.jpg



That's it for this checkpoint; I definitely won't be going too far ahead of everyone, but checkpoint 1's are kinda boring and I suspect real divergence will begin in this timeframe for others - good luck to you all too.

i'll be bismarck, then.
and yahoo! i accept congretulations for defending a diploma and graduating from intitute! that's why i have now some time to play this out.

To 1AD


The major decision for this set is that I let Gandhi survive. This eliminates the possibility of being declared by Stalin before Gandhi dies. Things turned out to be better, Gandhi became JC's vassal in 1AD. My only menace now comes from JC and he lacks metals.:lol:

Tech:
Currency->Math->Priest->Aes->Lit

Wonder:
Grabbed mids and GLH, HG and GL is ongoing.

1st GS was born in 425BC
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu224/Duckweed_/1stGS.jpg

1AD Empire of 7 cities, room for another 2 good sites
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu224/Duckweed_/1ADEmpire.jpg

1AD Tech
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu224/Duckweed_/1ADTech.jpg

To 1080AD Liberalism/Checkpoint 4


Tech:
The tech trade sucks,:( Stalin is totally useless for trading. Even worse, JC and Stalin chose very different tech path and this make many techs become monopoly. Moreover, It seems that JC is unwilling to give out the monotech to his vassal. I have to trade for Calender from AI in the other continent in 1070AD!:crazyeye: It's a mistake to delay the Compass so lately, until I started building harbor, I realized that it's half price with expansive trait.

Drama->Music->MC->Med->CoL->CS->Paper->Phi->Edu->Compass->Optics->PP(1GS)->Lib takes Astro (Although no one has Edu and Phi, I might be able to get something like AL as last Emperor game:lol:. But Astro immediately boost the empire income and I'd like to stop now.)->Nat


Wonders:
Grabbed HG, GL, and US, AW is 1 turn left.

1080AD Empire of 9 cities
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu224/Duckweed_/1080ADEmpire.jpg

1080AD Tech Again, Emperor AIs' tech are horrible.
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu224/Duckweed_/1080ADTech.jpg

I don't know what can be concluded from this kind of comparison? Will Joao be the strongest leader :king:?

Congrats for graduating nanomage, did it too just 3 months ago.
Anyway, played the first segment as Pacal. Now I´m off for sports and thereafter I´ll present my results. (Have to register at photobucket finally for some screens)

Peter of America, checkpoint 4 Lib, 1360AD
A few turns after the war on Gandhi ended, JC went wheoohrn and the turn after declared on me. I ended up losing bombay (which was fine by me, as it was recieving massive cultural pressure from JC. I did have a devious plan however, because a few turns later stalin was at pleased, opening this option:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/ally.jpg

It proved to be a fruitful allegiance, as Stalin like me more than JC now, and more importantly he took the Indian city below Delhi, relieving all the cultural pressure from Gandhi. JC took that city shortly after, but as long as I can work both gems I am happy there. I gave JC paper and a world map for peace, although he wanted Delhi (over my dead civ I say). Later a few trades opened with Stalin, not the best, but any trades with that fellow are welcome (he really doesn't like trading, WFYTBA before even one trade with him)
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/stalin1trade.jpg
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/stali2trade.jpg

I was first to lib, took nationalism.
the savisers at 1360AD:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/trade-1360.jpg
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/civic1360.jpg
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/fin-adv-1360.jpg
and finally the double shrine city
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/shrine1360.jpg
I am currently teching to steel, but think a derail to optics is worthwhile, as I need tech trade options.

First, definite congrats to nanomage. :thumbsup:

@Duckweed - haven't read your third update, however, looking at your game combined with mine did make me remember something curious:

Is it because of Emperor difficulty or are the AI just really slow getting wonders this game? I really haven't played Emperor much for a while and they don't start with a worker right - I guess that's hurting them? I remembered that before I got mids, only the GW and Stonehenge, very recently, were built. The Oracle actually came after as well - AI civs got the GLH and HG which I didn't aim for, but I didn't think too much of it at the time. However in your game it seemed it took the AI even longer in a couple of cases. Considering the main "competition" other than Russia seems to be on the other continent, I wonder what differences I'll see in my next turnset.

I'll try Pacal, but I'm a fairly slow player / limited time, not sure how long it will take me to play

actually, nevermind, truthfully I just won't have time to play this anytime soon

First, definite congrats to nanomage. :thumbsup:

@Duckweed - haven't read your third update, however, looking at your game combined with mine did make me remember something curious:

Is it because of Emperor difficulty or are the AI just really slow getting wonders this game? I really haven't played Emperor much for a while and they don't start with a worker right - I guess that's hurting them? I remembered that before I got mids, only the GW and Stonehenge, very recently, were built. The Oracle actually came after as well - AI civs got the GLH and HG which I didn't aim for, but I didn't think too much of it at the time. However in your game it seemed it took the AI even longer in a couple of cases. Considering the main "competition" other than Russia seems to be on the other continent, I wonder what differences I'll see in my next turnset.

I think the answer is that both the difficulty level and wonders count. Wonders like GLH and mids do give player significant advantage. I usually grab many wonders when I play Immortal or below. The date that Emperor AIs can build those wonders is 500~1000 years later. So IND trait is a top tier trait for both getting the wonders or building wonders for cash since many more wonders will be opened for player then.

That wasn't really what I was asking - unless you thought denying an early wonder further slowed the AI down, but neither of us took Oracle or GW or something. I guess this isn't really a spoiler, just general discussion, so anyone else on this game - have the AI seemed early, late, or on time with the wonders? And again it seems to me there's one civ on the other continent who's behavior is varying the most, I'll have to see when I meet them, I'll be sure to mention that if so.

^I answered your question --


The date that Emperor AIs can build those wonders is 500~1000 years later than in a deity game.


So basically, GW, SH would be around 1500-2000BC. Oracle and mids are usually built in 500BC-1000BC.

GW and Oracle actually do not affect the game that much as GLH and mids.

Mehemed through 1000 AD.

Early tech Path:

http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s305/cseanny/Deity%202/Civ4ScreenShot0008.jpg
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s305/cseanny/Deity%202/Civ4ScreenShot0009.jpg

Build Order:

Worker, warrior, barracks, warrior, settler @ 3 pop, 6 Chariots (maybe 7?), worker, TGL in NY @ 975, Pyramids in Washington in 775 BC.

Later tech path was: Writing, Alpha, Currency (350 BC), CoL (before 1AD), Calendar (100 AD), CS, Asthetics, Literature, Drama, Music, Paper, Education (660 AD), Philo, Liberalism.

Great People: 7 1GS - academy, 2GS - settle, 3GS - settle, 4GM - settle, 5GA (Free Music) - settle, 6GS bulb Education, 7GS - GA

Strategy: Attack myself into a big chunk of land then use 2 key wonders, Mids and TGL to mass expand. Those were the only 2 WW I made. After I killed Gandhi I used Washington, New York, and Delhi to mass produce settlers while Bombay and Viynagara mass produced workers (5 turns). Each city producing settlers took around 8 turns or 200 game years, and with 3 cities for that purpose, expansion was quick. Every city which is not at a low population has been running 2 scientist and or spies non stop. I've been getting theaters in place and plan to make the City above Bombay The Globe Theater. There will be some fun whipping/drafting taking place pretty soon. Gonna be able to mass some sick units.

My power was low but Caesar and Stalin ended up sharing an early religion and when Stalin demanded I switch, of course I did - which enabled me to focus on mass expansion. Delhi is the only city with cottages while everywhere else is mass farms. Every city but 2 has a CH thanks to ORG and The Forbidden Palace knocked off over 25 gold per turn. I currently have no Markets in any city but do have 4 Universities.

Next priority is compass and harbors. Too bad there are only 2 AIs on this Island and that I'm too lazy to go towards Astro cause I could be getting some sick trade.Scouting - too lazy - who cares. Besides, that's what world maps are for. I've been massing war elephants and plan to take over my continent with elephants/Cannon then win via space race.

There might not be overflow for gold but I still believe in mass expansion and once you get rolling you'll be a beast.


http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s305/cseanny/Deity%202/Civ4ScreenShot0000-1.jpg
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s305/cseanny/Deity%202/Civ4ScreenShot0001-1.jpg
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s305/cseanny/Deity%202/Civ4ScreenShot0002-1.jpg
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s305/cseanny/Deity%202/Civ4ScreenShot0003-1.jpg
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s305/cseanny/Deity%202/Civ4ScreenShot0004.jpg
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s305/cseanny/Deity%202/Civ4ScreenShot0005.jpg
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s305/cseanny/Deity%202/Civ4ScreenShot0006.jpg
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s305/cseanny/Deity%202/Civ4ScreenShot0007.jpg

hi.
thank you for congatulations!
i've finished bismarck game, but i've got a problem with screenies - screenshots seem to not work under wine :(.
However, i'll write a report in a few hours and post some screens after reopening my saves in Windows.
some thoughts about wonder timing and trait effects here

early wonders really to go later this game.
i haven't played Emp quite much, but i remember they were built much quicker when i learned it :lol:
i figure it's because Stalin isn't that keen on wonders, and Bismarck (not me, the other Bismarck ;) has quite a poor start location - low food. But once he gets online and links his marble he may build something. Stalin wonderspammed in my game, too, but he started later - in classical era.

actually, at least with Ind/ trait, in this game it is possible to both rush Gandhi and build 'mids. i'll try this without Ind later and maybe someone else tried.

Apart from mids+india rush, Ind trait seemed not to be decisive here, i just built the wonders which i was the first to research.

i think i'll try to load your saves and try to derive something from them tomorrow :)

Hi, I played as Pacal as annonced yesterday. first set went to 25AD (missed 1 AD)


T1 Place looks food-poor, but production-rich. Decide I want more grass (seen in the fog SE). Settle 1 SE on the river plains tile and get wheat as a bonus. Start worker and tech AH
t10 Buddhism FIADL (Gandhi)
t13 AH in start mining > BW
t15 worker completes, move for 1t Farm SW, next turn on the wheat. Meet JC from the west. Start 2nd worker
t18 find Gandhi close to the SW
t20 Wheatfarm completed, switch to warrior till growth
t26 Cow pastured, swap back to worker production. Plan on blocking Gandhi at super GPFarm
production after 2nd worker: warriors (2,5 total)
t35 growth to 3, swap prod to settler
t37 BW in, start TW > Pottery. Chopping 2 trees
t40 settler in, more warriors
t45 found NY as my blockcity to the SW
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t0450000.jpg
t52 Pottery in, start Myst, spawnbust is complete on my peninsula (thanks to TMIT for advertising this technique). Revolt to slavery
t58 Myst in, start writing
somewhere around t60: found Boston to the west (1N of the Copper)
t68 Writing in, start Alpha at 0%
t69 Buddhism spreads to NY
t75 Library in NY > 2scientists asap
t76 Library in Washington. More workers and settlers while working my cottages
t77 Meet Stalin from the SW, GW BIADL, go 100% on Alpha
t78 Oracle in Delhi
t80 JC converts to Buddhism
t83 Found Philadelphia to the NE for sheep, horses and fur
t85 Open borders with Gandhi, 2workers start road to enable traderoutes
t88 Alpha in trade with Gandhi (-1 worst enemy trade with stalin), Julius doesn´t want to depart any techs for Alpha. Start currency
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t088techscreen0000.jpg
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t088tradeGandhi0000.jpg
t92 First GS born in NY (575BC), open borders with JC
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t092firstGS575BC0000-1.jpg
t94 Academy in Washington
t97 found Atlanta (Commerce-city with cow and horses)
t100 Pyramids BIADL, cash in 142 gold
t102 currency in start Aest
t107 Aest in, start Poly > Lit(no trades possible due to JC going Alpha Currency as well and snagging my techtrades with Gandhi)
t109 Convert to Budhism
t110 beg Priesthood from Gandhi
t111 Literature in, start Monarchy, start GL in NY
t112 trade Aest around, getting Monarchy, Sailing, Mono and 75 gold, start Maths
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t113Monarchytrade0000.jpg
t114 revolt to HR/OR
t115 found Chicago to NW for Fish&lake
t116 save for segment 1(25AD). Producing wealth, I can get around 80 sustainable bpt, 95 at 100% research
to date, my military consists of 6 warriors, 2 chariots and 5 Axes
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t116units0000.jpg
Gandhi is pretty squeezed, i´ll take him out first, probably with steel from lib (if possible)
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t116Overview0000.jpg
thats my city screen, producing mostly wealth. I plan on overflow whipping into the GL
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t116Cityscreen0000.jpg


I hope spoiler and pics are working fine as this is my first writeup here!
added saves: t085 is shortly before Alpha, t116 is 25AD

Okay, this is how my 2nd segment went. tech is very nice, but trades are scarce, well you´ll see


T117 I envy Stalins starting spot. Well no picture, as you´ll all know this floodplains area
t121 CoL in start CS
t125 sell health resources for 11gpt
t127 trade Con for CoL with JC
t130 GL in (375AD)
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t130GLin0000.jpg
t131 CS in start Music
t132 insert Med(1t), JC bulbs Philo, stalin builds AP in Hinduism
t134 2nd GS bulbs Philo
t136 Music in(first), starting a GA, whipping some buildings (OR), revolt to Buero/Pacifism. Start paper, look on techscreen: OMG, Gandhi got CS and traded with JC for Philo it seems, trades will get tough. Maybe no steel from lib
t138 Stalin declares on Gandhi, my chariot monitors the frontlines
t140 Paper in start Compass. Looking for possible trades it seems JC is teching paper as well (he will only give me 30 gold), the sucker
t141 Compass in start Edu, trade Paper for MC with Gandhi as JC just teched it
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t141tradePaperforMC0000.jpg
t146 3rd GS bulbs Edu, start Gunpowder
t147 trade Compass around
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t147tradewithGandhi0000.jpg
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t147tradewithJC0000.jpg
went from Gunpowder to Lib, notes don´t say which turn
t155 trade Machinery from JC for Drama/Music, reaching wfybta with him
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t155Machinerytrade0000.jpg
t159 Sell Gandhi Edu to get Machinery, otherwise I have tech it myself, definitely no steel from Lib, trying for Chem
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t159SellGandhiEduc0000.jpg
t160 4th GS bulbs PP, insert PP(3t)
t161 Gandhi vassals to JC, dragging him in vs Stalin. This is just just perfect for my planned backstab on Gandhi. Noone can declare on me now. I send JC away
http://i575.photobucket.com/albums/ss193/euripides_de/TCG2t161GandhiVassaledtoJC0000.jpg
t162 PP in resume Lib(1t)
t163 Lib takes chem, start steel(11t), as well, Oxford is just 12 turns away
well all right, my CE seems to work out atm, now i need the production to hammer my continent.
Actually debating with myself if rushbuying is an option, but I think it will take too much time. I have to hit very soon on Gandhi/JC to get more land.
just one quick question, how do I change my game language?? atm all pics are in german you may have noticed... thanks for help!

@euripides, you can change language using Ctrl+O to open options. If German is your native tongue, stick with it. We all know whats what on the screens anyway.

actually, it's funny and interesting to see on your screenies how are that things called in German :)

to 600BC aka first GP

Well, i captured barbcity since i was paying for chariots anyway...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/barbcity-1.jpg

After i found iron i wished i burned it...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/iron.jpg
Could have been corn+fish and pig+iron.... no i have crappy iron city which i will need to block as Rome is lacking any metals at moment....

I used soon to be obsolete overflow tricks to speed Alpha and backfilled a bit via Rome... Stalin won't trade me untill i get him to pleased...

Great Scientist
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/GS.jpg
Will make academy in double gem city...

I probably still try to shoot for Mids....
Some stat screens
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/stats1.jpg
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/stats2.jpg

need to speed this game as it prevents me from using 3.19...

Well I played my game out, and now that I look at other spoilers I went a slightly different route than everyone else. This is some of the most ridiculous slop ever to post a W.

Washington, first GP, 1400 BC:

I settled 1S for riverside and not losing any foods (not that it's a lot of food). Opened AH (missed horse apparently), writing (!), mining, HBR (!), to archery, then BW.

Well, that should kind of give away my intentions I think. This was actually a good game until I didn't know when to quit. Anyway, due to the early writing, I put a library up in washington and ran 2 scientists for some faster tech.

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0000.jpg

Settled in the capitol to assist with necessary early research since I know the slider is going to be low for a long, long time.

~1 AD

HORSE ARCHERS!

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0001.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0002.jpg

Cease fire, heal, HORSE ARCHERS!

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0003.jpg

Peace out big G

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0004.jpg

And the next step? Er...

HORSE ARCHERS!

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0005.jpg

A bunch of mid-AD's stuff and loss of liberalism:

Gimme tech.

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0006.jpg

I SAID, gimme tech.

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0007.jpg

MY HORSE ARCHERS SAY GIMME TECH

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0008.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0009.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0010.jpg

Thank you.

Wait, no, I still need tech.

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0011.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0012.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0013.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0014.jpg


1200 AD to game's end (around 1900 AD):

Strike one!

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0015.jpg

Lib actually went late.

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0016.jpg

I avoided losing units because after getting alpha from peace, I built research to currency, then built wealth to CoL, then whipped courthouses and things got a lot better.

As you can see, I went knights

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0017.jpg

And the magic rifles aren't going to be fun.

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0018.jpg

He has SoZ and I take peace right after he gets to rifles. At least I got his stack first.

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0019.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0020.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0021.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0022.jpg

That war took forever. Knights vs rifles and I still win (city count gave enough espionage for revolts at least).

Bootycall dials up Uncle Joe

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0023.jpg

And I am so backwards that it would be hard to recover. But, I'm pretty big. The solution? Well, darious, boudica, and bismark all don't hate me. Also, I'm huge. So, I'll just win.

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0024.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0025.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0026.jpg

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0027.jpg

Come to think of it, UN is kind of typical for me.

http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss213/CivIVTMIT/trait%20comp%20II/Civ4ScreenShot0028.jpg


Well, at least CHA saw some use, even if this was a pretty horrible showing. At least I didn't lose.

to1Ad

well, hindu refused to spread normally but luckily rome set some missionairies...
Meanwhile i hamered down mids... A bit late but better than never...


had some worries about JC settler, but luckily he did not went for iron spot...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg/stupid.jpg
I managed to get Julius to pleased and begged out Polytheism... meanwhile Stalin remains unwilling to trade and cautious...
me sense some trouble...

Well, i am first on BNP but the only reason i have my cities is Rome total lack of metals...

@Soirana

Your 1st, 2nd, and 4th images don't load.

mmmm... messed something with photobucket... unluckily deleted them already:(...
guess you will have to liuve without them... But you can look at save...

well, i am stocking shock axes against praets... Promises be entertaining game...

to 1170Ad - Lib race...

I made quick way to literature than maths while workers kept prechopping southwards of Deli... I needed to get rid of that forest anyway due to not giving enemies defense bonus and TGL under representation in city with academy is alone arround 20beakers per turn +GPP...
Still not sure it was worth except for denial...

100AD settled that iron spot...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/pigiron.jpg

200AD bulbed Philo...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/philo.jpg
never run pacifism or even caste... mostly to slow lib race as Julius got full hands about that time and i started preparing shock axes... [checked later these handle praets on field reasonably well...]

A bit later i scouted out some praetorians... Well, well...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/stupidtrade.jpg

350AD our friend Stalin builds AP and gets voted to throne...
450Ad trade for priesthood to get these tasty hammer giving temples online...
500AD - barb city appears in unscouted corner near cows... And i was hoping to get something for HE
520AD - i finish TGL in Dheli while Julius finally declares...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/tgl.jpg
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/julius.jpg
Luckily i begged some gold out Stalin before so safely bribed him on Rome [Currency+CoL+gold]. That at least stopped praet production...

Was worried a bit about Russia swallowing Rome but Julius had longbows...
540AD- praets start moving towards Russia ignoring walled and stuffed with defenders Bombay... I start hunting loose ome units in search for 10xp unit....
550AD - finished Maoi in crab copper spot...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/maoi.jpg

600AD burn that stupid city of Rome by hammering through loenly longbow...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/burn.jpg

620AD - stuffed paer for some backfill techs to Stalin.... Ofcourse that ended in him building UoS... Stupid me...
720AD - another GS from mixed genetic pool. Bulb education... [was actually piling gold ascould choose other tech path in case of GSpy
740AD -trade Philosophy for MC and gold to Stalin... Stalin and Julius made peace... My stacks run razing improvements arround Antium.... [i still hope milk out some xp...
780AD Stalin uses AP to stop war... my best unit is only 7xp... but i get out GG in last turn... Settled him in capital..
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/gg.jpg

880AD get feudalism for philo and aesthetics from Julius
960AD get barb city producing two 10xp units in process... needed to cancel open borders with stalin to prevent him getting it...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/barb.jpg

1100 steal calendar from Julius [from third try... so much wasted hammers on spies] also tech compass to clear bulb path...
Put a bulb in lib, trade compass for remaing machinery and HBR to Stalin... tech lib to -1 turn and change mind... decided to get engineering first...
1170 chemistry fro lib...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/lib.jpg

Home advisor
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/home.jpg

Techs:
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/techs.jpg

Finances
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/newtcg/finances.jpg


i will probably go for self research guilds next as main idea is use supercharged workshops to hammer away two morrons on mine continent... other will simply get one missionary gifts in sign of good bye...

Skipped save due to 3.17-3.19 isues and not seeing any action on previous ones anyway...

Right, I'm on the next Checkpoint, to 1755AD
Things were peaceful for a bit, but JC declares in 1500's again (I expected as much, only now I was prepared)
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/tcgwarJC1530.jpg
I bribe Stalin into war, and severely hurt JCs stack, so much that it has to retreat, and Stalin mops it up. I also retake Bombay. Stalin later vassalises JC. I meet the other continent. Things are peaceful till now, but Stalin is WHEOOHRN, I am likely target, due to dropping to pleased again.

The siuation as it stands:
Tech:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/tech1755.jpg

Demographics:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/demo1755.jpg

My cap and gold cities:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/capital1755.jpg
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm20/xl_single_malt/TCGII/shrine1755.jpg

No obvious victory available. If I build UN, it would be a possibility, due to decent relations in the other continent, especially if I do a quick cap of backwards Biz and Booty. War with Stalin seems inevitable, and he is the powerhouse. He may have his sights set on Persia too (he don't like em much). I need to keep an eye on that situation, as he may divert a lot of attention there, allowing me to make inroads against him. techwise my situation is not bad.

Finally got around to playing this and will post when I feel like organizing the couple pictures I took. Overall a fairly easy map. As for spiritual (I had Issy) um... civic swaps are good? Not sure it is a huge secret that swapping between OR/Slave, Pacifism/Caste, and the random free diplomacy tend to make certain aspects of the game much easier.

@TMIT:

Loved the Horse Archers line!

to 1700AD - AP win

1240AD - guilds...
1250AD first golden age...
1270AD - prepare stack wait for Ap voting to go through
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/stack.jpg
1310 capture Antium
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/antium.jpg

1320 - get counter stack near Dheli who is defended by single axe... Call for cease fire rearrange troops...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/counter.jpg

1370 -got to view Rome from inside...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/rome.jpg
That is enough for Julius to cap... I take Drama from him feeeling that is upcoming...

more or less how my city look...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/atlanta.jpg
just need to replace that stupid engineer with mine for extra 2 hammers...
Another city screenshot from later day
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/ny.jpg
With nearly dozen of these i can clean my wy...


1400AD tech out printing press... Why i did that instead of steel? guess was trying to prove myself i can do that with trebs+muskets+knights with no slavery or drafting....
Selll liberalism to Stalin for 800 gold start optics...

1410 AD Optics in and same turn Darius founds me... I combine his map and Julius map and... get circumnavigation:) Meanwhile Stalin is not doing bad.... Already researched constitution but skipped both gunpowder and engineering... Too bad another continent will mess trades....

1420AD - russian stack is prepared...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/russain.jpg
1450AD capture of Rostov...
1470AD - culture goes through 20%...
1480AD - take Yekaterinburg as i can't get into Moscow before AP voting and have no wish to defy it...
1490AD - As peace treatty was signed vote pops for city return. I calculate and it looks like julius+stalin can vote for it...
suddenly i have creative idea... I bribe Julius to free religion and revolt to hinduism myself... Recalcalution showns i can block AP this way... So i rearrange trrops for couple of turns and redeclare...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/voting.jpg
1515 tech Astro....
1525 get St. Petersburg. At least solves Chitzen Itza problem...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/peter.jpg
1545- block war stop voting just by saying no...
1550 Ad get Moscow... Suddenly i remeber i was against SoZ also... now it is clear why i need 40%cultrue already... start gifting missionairies...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/moscow.jpg
Unluckily Stalin won't cap so i beeline his new capitol [also highest pop city as in theory i can win through him with enough population...]
1580AD get Libyan [ex barb city current capitol of Russian]. Stalin is till not wishing to cap...
1585 AD - capture Yakutsk... which is enough. I took city as part of cap deal to increase my votes further...
I also immediately switch to free religion which with some gifting allows open borders with Boudica...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/boudica.jpg
I also bribe my vassals into free religion...
1595 AP votes for open borders between members...
1620 finish off steel... well, i am already doing things on autopilot...
1645 - get voting for AP throne...
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/chair.jpg
1670AD start another golden age [mainly to check my tech capabilities during this...]
1695 - Assembly line... and my voting...
1700AD win... no surprise since i have more population when domination limit...
On last turn is witched all cities to commerce/research to see how much i can get... reached 2K limit not bad for me...

http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/final.jpg
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/win.jpg
http://i358.photobucket.com/albums/oo21/soirana/tcg1/fin.jpg

luckily for me this was not immortal.... i also saw someone leaving second Ghandi's city to let morrons declare on him.. very bright idea...