howdy y'all,

yes, that's kinda odd ... [*grin*]

what i want to do is to make several "regional capitols" [copies of the forbidden palace] and then PREVENT them from being built in certain cities. so if a city has ...
- palace
- forbidden palace
- any other regional cap [they'll pro'ly be named "Reg_Cap_##" where ## is 01 thru 10]

so far, using a simple copy of the FP, they can't be built in the same town as the palace, but they CAN be built in the same town as another reg_cap_##.

i'm stuck. help, please?

take care,
lee

howdy y'all,

yes, that's kinda odd ... [*grin*]

what i want to do is to make several "regional capitols" [copies of the forbidden palace] and then PREVENT them from being built in certain cities. so if a city has ...
- palace
- forbidden palace
- any other regional cap [they'll pro'ly be named "Reg_Cap_##" where ## is 01 thru 10]

so far, using a simple copy of the FP, they can't be built in the same town as the palace, but they CAN be built in the same town as another reg_cap_##.

i'm stuck. help, please?

take care,
lee

Not exactly my area of expertise, but I've seen this trick used in El Justo's AoI 3 (and Beta 4) - require the building to need a certain resource, and then pre-place that resource within the city limits (and only for that city).

For example, say that the building requires the "canadian industrialism" resource - and then place that resource within the city radius. Of course, that means you have to add a resource to the game, but that shouldn't be difficult.

Of course, the converse is true - just deny the resource to the city in question.

I'm sure someone else can probably come up with a better method, but I'd thought I'd drop it in as an idea. :)

howdy CivAgamemnon,

thanks for the response! [*grin*]

i've seen your idea before - possibly right where you mentioned it - and that doesn't quite work for me. i want a more general solution that doesn't require hand-editing the rules AND pre-placing things in locations where i HOPE a city might get built.

my desire here is to make multiple FP-like buildings available [which i have done by duping the FP] AND to prevent the ai from recommending that i build ANOTHER such building in a city that has one already.

it's annoying to have the ai _constantly_ advising me to build another regional capitol in a city that already has one. [*grin*] irritating, but i suspect not avoidable in c3c. [*sigh ...*]

take care,
lee

I don't think you're going to find a general solution to the problem, so good luck with that, dude.

howdy y'all,

yes, that's kinda odd ... [*grin*]

what i want to do is to make several "regional capitols" [copies of the forbidden palace] and then PREVENT them from being built in certain cities. so if a city has ...
- palace
- forbidden palace
- any other regional cap [they'll pro'ly be named "Reg_Cap_##" where ## is 01 thru 10]

so far, using a simple copy of the FP, they can't be built in the same town as the palace, but they CAN be built in the same town as another reg_cap_##.

i'm stuck. help, please?

take care,
lee

Here area a few thoughts for you, however, I have not tested them myself.

One is set it as something like Wall Street, where you have to have a certain number of other buildings, perhaps the courthouse since you are looking at this as a regional capital, in order to build one of your new FP clones. Then you would not be bothered until you had enough of the required building to build a Regional Capital, and then only until you built one.

Second, set as a building requirement that you need a specific advance in order to build and also a specific building, such as the courthouse, for a Regional Capital to be built. Do not build the courthouse in the cities that you do not want the Regional Capital to be built in. Since there is a prior building requirement, that may knock out the Advisor from bugging you to build another one in that same city, as that would require having another courthouse, I think.

Combine the above two ideas to try to break the cycle of being allowed to build more than one type of building in the same city. I am surprised that you are being allowed to build more than one of a given building in a city. That would be nice if it worked with barracks, and if you could build as many units as you have barracks in the city.

If you want to have 10 different forbidden palace type Regional Capitals (RC) available to be built, but only in one city (on random generated maps I'm assuming you are talking about here), the easiest way would be too make each RC require a certain resource to be within it's cities border, and make each RC a wonder, so it can only be built once. (as CivAg said)
RC #1 requires Iron
RC #2 requires Saltpeter
RC #3 requires Coal
etc, etc, etc....

Probably the easiest way to do this, and probably the only way to ensure it works consistently in a randomly generated map. Also the AI would be able to use it just as the human would, so no downside there.

i've seen your idea before - possibly right where you mentioned it - and that doesn't quite work for me. i want a more general solution that doesn't require hand-editing the rules AND pre-placing things in locations where i HOPE a city might get built.

Since you have to add each RC anyways, just add a different required resource for each and click the 'required within city radius' button. You will have to 'hand-edit' the rules anyways when you add 10+ Regional Capitals, so clicking 2 more buttons shouldn't be too much. :) And this solves your problem of having every single city being able to build one.

Tom

I don't think you're going to find a general solution to the problem, so good luck with that, dude.

howdy CivAgamemnon,

you're correct on that. [*sigh ...*] however, as timerover51 pointed out, i can approximate the desired effect by requiring a specific number of a specific building. courthouses will work neatly.

thanks for the try at it! [*grin*]

take care,
lee

Here area a few thoughts for you, however, I have not tested them myself.

One is set it as something like Wall Street, where you have to have a certain number of other buildings, perhaps the courthouse since you are looking at this as a regional capital, in order to build one of your new FP clones. Then you would not be bothered until you had enough of the required building to build a Regional Capital, and then only until you built one.

Second, set as a building requirement that you need a specific advance in order to build and also a specific building, such as the courthouse, for a Regional Capital to be built. Do not build the courthouse in the cities that you do not want the Regional Capital to be built in. Since there is a prior building requirement, that may knock out the Advisor from bugging you to build another one in that same city, as that would require having another courthouse, I think.

Combine the above two ideas to try to break the cycle of being allowed to build more than one type of building in the same city. I am surprised that you are being allowed to build more than one of a given building in a city. That would be nice if it worked with barracks, and if you could build as many units as you have barracks in the city.

howdy timerover51,

your idea works fairly well! thanks. [*grin*]

i found that there's a limit of 25 buildings on the "required building" setting. that's a rather low number for _big_ maps, but i set up 5 RC wonders [renamed FP copies] with each requiring 5 more courthouses than the previous.
rc01 = 5 ch
rc02 = 10 ch
etc ...

i'll see how that works out. i wonder if the ai will use them?

on the more-than-one-building problem, that's not really what's happened. since each RC is actually a DIFFERENT wonder, the problem is the ai keeps recommending that i build RC03 in the same town that i built RC01. the courthouse requirement will at least slow down the nagging ... [*grin*]

take care,
lee

If you want to have 10 different forbidden palace type Regional Capitals (RC) available to be built, but only in one city (on random generated maps I'm assuming you are talking about here), the easiest way would be too make each RC require a certain resource to be within it's cities border, and make each RC a wonder, so it can only be built once. (as CivAg said)
RC #1 requires Iron
RC #2 requires Saltpeter
RC #3 requires Coal
etc, etc, etc....

Probably the easiest way to do this, and probably the only way to ensure it works consistently in a randomly generated map. Also the AI would be able to use it just as the human would, so no downside there.



Since you have to add each RC anyways, just add a different required resource for each and click the 'required within city radius' button. You will have to 'hand-edit' the rules anyways when you add 10+ Regional Capitals, so clicking 2 more buttons shouldn't be too much. :) And this solves your problem of having every single city being able to build one.

Tom

howdy tom2050,

your idea is a variant of CivAgamemnon's idea. it _requires_ editing the MAP to place resources in locations that MAY someday get a city. workable, but too predictable for my taste.

i think i will go with timerover51's idea. thanks tho!

take care,
lee

If you set a Courthouse as a Required building for all of your New additions, each of them will be able to be built once you build a single courthouse in a City. This would not prevent being advised to build them all in the same City as the separate buildings the AI believes them to be. You would have to have a different requirement for each one...same as if you Separated them using Resources. Whether you use Resources or other Improvements or Wonders as requirements, each of your additions will need separate Requirements.

IF you went with making them Wonders, use Small Wonders so all CIVs can build them and would not be in competition for only one of each in the World.

If you set a Courthouse as a Required building for all of your New additions, each of them will be able to be built once you build a single courthouse in a City. This would not prevent being advised to build them all in the same City as the separate buildings the AI believes them to be. You would have to have a different requirement for each one...same as if you Separated them using Resources. Whether you use Resources or other Improvements or Wonders as requirements, each of your additions will need separate Requirements.

IF you went with making them Wonders, use Small Wonders so all CIVs can build them and would not be in competition for only one of each in the World.

howdy Vuldacon,

yes, i went with small wonders. it's the only way to get the FP effect that i could find.

as for separate requirements, it's correct that i'll need such. i just haven't found a set that seems "reasonable" to me. [*grin*] varying the # of needed courthouses seems to be the closest i have come to it so far. i suppose i could also use police stations ... i just don't see any unique pre-requisites that i could gracefully and logically use.

how i wish they had back-ported the extension interface from civ4 to civ3!

thanks for your input!

take care,
lee

Lee Dailey... You could make "generic improvements" that only allow your New Regional Capitals. One for each of them. It is true that you would need to add large and small Civilopedia Icons as well as buildings large and buildings small images but all of those could use the same Generic Images to represent the "improvements". You could simply use a Question Mark for example. Then you could write entries for them in the Civilopedia with Links to explain their Purpose. You could invent plausible improvement entries that allow your Regional Capitals if you think about it.

This way, you would not have to use any Normal improvement and you could set the Prerequisite improvements with 0 cost, 0 Maintenance and 0 any other benefit ar as you like.
Just a thought you might like to try handling your New Regional Capitals this way to gain what you want. The only work you would need to do would to name the Improvements and place Entries in the Editor, PediaIcons.txt and Civilopedia.txt.

Here are some Generic Icons you can use for Large and Small Civilopedia and buildings large and small images if you decide to add other Generic Improvements These are simply Question Marks for the images.

Not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but what about the Replace feature that the factories have?

I don't think that feature works for small wonders...

Lee Dailey... You could make "generic improvements" that only allow your New Regional Capitals. One for each of them. It is true that you would need to add large and small Civilopedia Icons as well as buildings large and buildings small images but all of those could use the same Generic Images to represent the "improvements". You could simply use a Question Mark for example. Then you could write entries for them in the Civilopedia with Links to explain their Purpose. You could invent plausible improvement entries that allow your Regional Capitals if you think about it.

This way, you would not have to use any Normal improvement and you could set the Prerequisite improvements with 0 cost, 0 Maintenance and 0 any other benefit ar as you like.
Just a thought you might like to try handling your New Regional Capitals this way to gain what you want. The only work you would need to do would to name the Improvements and place Entries in the Editor, PediaIcons.txt and Civilopedia.txt.

Here are some Generic Icons you can use for Large and Small Civilopedia and buildings large and small images if you decide to add other Generic Improvements These are simply Question Marks for the images.

howdy Vuldacon,

i'll give it a try. this way would still leave me with extra buildings in the build list, but it might do the job for stopping the "build it" recommendations. of course, there is the chance that i'll get "build this" nags for the generics! [*grin*] thanks for the pointers, dude.

seems like i'm making a lot of work just to make enuf pseudo-FP buildings for a huge map. [*grin*]

take care,
lee

I don't think that feature works for small wonders...

howdy Virote_Considon,

i looked at that, but it seems to do a swap out for ANY building that has that flag.

take care,
lee

seems like I’m making a lot of work just to make enuf pseudo-FP buildings for a huge map.
Lee_Dailey... Yes, it can become a Chore but this is expected when trying to Alter Hard Coded game features and the Forbidden Palace is one of the difficult things to set up and use the way you are wanting them in your Game.
Many of the Things we want to change cannot directly be changed so we are happy when we are able to manage any indirect way of working out a method to gain something different from them.

Most of the time we can find solutions to work around the intended and Hard Coded Game programing although many times the solutions have some negative "side affect”.

Going through the extra efforts Depends on how much we want something and what we are willing to accept to gain it.

If you do not like what seems possible concerning how you want to use the Forbidden Palace, perhaps a different approach would be better. Add improvements that provide more of what you want and that can be built in any building. For example, Reduced Corruption and More Production could be added to an improvement.
Good Luck with your Efforts :)

Lee_Dailey... Yes, it can become a Chore but this is expected when trying to Alter Hard Coded game features and the Forbidden Palace is one of the difficult things to set up and use the way you are wanting them in your Game.
Many of the Things we want to change cannot directly be changed so we are happy when we are able to manage any indirect way of working out a method to gain something different from them.

Most of the time we can find solutions to work around the intended and Hard Coded Game programing although many times the solutions have some negative "side affect”.

Going through the extra efforts Depends on how much we want something and what we are willing to accept to gain it.

If you do not like what seems possible concerning how you want to use the Forbidden Palace, perhaps a different approach would be better. Add improvements that provide more of what you want and that can be built in any building. For example, Reduced Corruption and More Production could be added to an improvement.
Good Luck with your Efforts :)

howdy Vuldacon,

as my mom so often says, anything worth having is worth working for. thanks for the good wishes and the good help! [*grin*]

take care,
lee