[IDEAS] Fallen Ages [Archive] - Civilization Fanatics' Forums

lemonjelly

Jun 27, 2009, 05:06 AM

[[IF YOU ARE READING THIS, I'M WARNING YOU, MOST OF THE IDEAS AND STUFF IN THIS THREAD NO LONGER APPLY TO MY VIEW OF THE MOD.]]

THIS MOD IS STILL IN PROGRESS, WAITING FOR 1.3 FOR THE NEW DLL FUNCTIONS WE NEED.

Well, the other day, I had an idea to create a new mod, based on FF, that starts from the beginning of Erebus, to the Age Of Rebirth (Or beyond?)

I have no idea how to make it work, but if anybody is interested, here are some ideas:

@ Use the code from Rise Of Civilization? (The one where civilisations spawn from others.)

@ Have:
~Age Of Creation
~Age Of Magic
~Age Of Ice
~Age Of Rebirth

@ Complete overhaul of Amurites and magic, bring Summoners back, make magic more powerful.

@ Bring back the Aifons.

@ More religions.

@ Teach the AI to use it.

MAGIC
@ Summoner line have more powerful summons.
@ Keep spheres how they are, just extra summons for these units.
@ Only available to Amurites, Sheaim, Keeyln?

@ Spells that require two promotions, such as;
~Earth 2, Fire 2-Summon Lava Golem
~Air 1, Force 1- +2:move: to ships

CIVILIZATIONS
@ A seperate 'tribe' for each God (In AoC)
@ A united elven race
@ Aifons will have to come back

@ No Amurites until AoI, when the player gets the option to play them.
@ Scions will spawn from Patrians, when AoM ends.
@ In AoI, the elven cizilization will have to split off into the two (3-Sidar?) elven races.

RELIGION
@ Empyran
@ Order
@ FoL
@ OO
@ AV
@ Runes
@ CoE
^As Normal

@ The White Hand
@ Cult Of Dragons
@ All of the other minor religions.

Any other ideas?
How will the AoM work, with the one big Patrian empire that lore says there should be?
What about the civilizations run by the archmages of the spheres, and Kylorin?
Any other religions?
Lore problems?
Ways to enhance magic?

Feedback, positive AND negative welcome, thanks.

WarKirby

Jun 27, 2009, 07:23 AM

The Age of Ice scenario that comes with BtS can provide plenty of resources for that part. But you're going to run into a problem with this:

I have no idea how to make it work, but if anybody is interested, here are some ideas:

The chances of somebody investing the time to make your idea for you is very, very low. granted, it's not impossible, but it generally doesn't happen. And when it does, it's people picking up half-finished projects, and finishing them. Not taking ideas and making things from scratch. The community here will certainly be glad to help, give you technical details, write small code snippets, answer questions, etc. But for the most part if a project is going to suceed, you personally will have to do some work on it.

You might be syrprised how easy it is to learn to do things. And very enjoyable too : )

1234567890

Jun 27, 2009, 07:32 PM

You might be happy to see this (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=295302) and this (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=322399). About the Cult of the Dragons and other religions (e.g. Agares), it may be cool, but I think you should give more details.

Tasunke

Jun 27, 2009, 09:45 PM

Having a Rhyes and fall type mod for FFH would be tre-uberness.
Im trying to think of ways to make it work. Im not sure where to put in ROK, Cult of Dragon, OO, Empy, Esus, AV, Order exept for in the rebirth. Maybe someone that played the original FFH would have a better Idea of how age of magic should go down XD

As in Rhyes and Fall, you are not always going to have the world turn out the way it normally does, but you can definitely make patterns. One cool think to try would be to try and hold patria together as it revolts, ect.

In age of Creation, I think every civ should have basic units, really cheap settlers and workers, really cheap crappy units. Also, maybe no inflation during this time. That way you can try to explode your economy before some giant comes along to gobble you up, rinse wash and repeat until you tech enough (or enough turns have past) to get to the age of magic.

Aye, I have the feeling that Each civ should have an immortal ubermonster, ready to do their bidding, until the compact is signed. so its basically ubermonster vs ubermonster, and no one really has a chance to properly attack or defend as its all hectic.
But I think once someone researches (compact) or (pact of mankind) or something, several things happen. All of the ubermonsters are removed from the game, as if they were religious units and u switched religion. This means that they can be rebuilt! which is important later ... ;)

So the person that researches this tech "becomes" patria. Every one else starts having to pay maintanence as normal, but STILL NO INFLATION!!!
The unique things about "Patria" is that all their units will get Channeling I-III, their cities get free courthouses and Basilicas, they have access to this "summoner" unit, and their palace removes unhappiness and unhealth from their capital city. If possible, Patria should not suffer distance maintanence (at least for this part of the game ;) )
the remaining tribes, with their crappy units, can still try to survive, although most tribes will have the AI set out to let their cities join Patria.

I can only think of 3 other civs which would spawn at this time. Bannor, Alphars, and Aiphons.
The Alphars would have Ljos archery units and Svart recon units. Imthinking everything else would be Ljos, althogh Im tempted to make arcane Svartesque as well. an alternative would be for them to simply be Ljosalphar. the Fellowship of Leaves would found in their capital city, and they would spawn in the largest cluster of forest which has room for a good economy. Per lore, if these forests were almost completely separate from everyone else by mountains, even better.

The aiphons would be a happy civ with elohim AI most likely. they would spawn on an island(if possible) or next to the ocean, and all their units wouild get Water II for waterwalking.
at this time the water tribe would start being able to build lanun units and buildings, and gain the seafarer tech. The Aiphons would also have the seafarer tech, and the seawonder tech. The seawonder tech would grant the Aiphons +1 hammer in each water tile. There would also be no nasties (barbarians) in the water. (exept weaker versions of pirates) The sea wonder tech would also have them found Ocean wonders, adoptable by lanun in the AI, whose priestess is a naval unit called mermaid, which can cast tsunami and blinding light(or somthing with the same effect)

Patria, "lanun", and Aiphons would all start out friendly to each other, and the water tribe (lanun) would be the only tribe to not capitulate. The nature and deception tribe would capitiulate to the Alphars, and the Law and fire tribes wouild capitulate to the Bannor.

The Bannor would be ... awesome XD
(by the way, the only religions I think should be in the Age of Magic would be FOL, Bhall, and Ocean Wonders) maybe a Patria religion called Dominion of Kylorin?
The bannor would start the religion of bhall. It would be founded in their capital, and the religion wouild have two buildings. One, available to everyone that adopts the Bhall religion, would have access to fire priests. Ring of Fire. On 6th level, these priests would auto aquire a promotion called "purgur" that would allow the pillar of fire spell. Fire priests have +1 fire affinity.

Another building, only available to the bannor, called Code of Man, would grant undead slaying and magic resistance to units built in the city. The holy shrine would be called Pyre of the Seraphic, and would grant 3 fire mana.

Then at a certain time, Patria would undergo revolution, or something. Bannor would be able to crusade, but would get peasants, instead of Demagogues. Fire Priests +mobs of peasants would be main bannor army, while Patria would be summoners and undead for the most part. Maybe revolting peasants should start under bannor control? Idk, there are alot of ways to do this part, and the revolting Patria could introduce quite a few other civs at this point. Although bannor would probably auto declare anyone following the Dominion of Kylorin religion similar to Basium's mechanic, at the same time as new civs start popping up to capture Patrian cities for themselves.

Perhaps near this time, The elven armies split. Not sure how to evenly divide the elven empire. But I think it could be done. Certainly archers would have a 75% chance of joining ljos and the recon would have a 75% chance of joining Svart. Everything else would be 50-50, Ithink, although the Svart may have to spawn a whole new army and half of their cities would switch sides.

It would be much easier to use a Lore-ish map in order to use the Rhyes and Fall coding which makes a city flip one way or another due to its geographical location.

This era should have its own time, with its own rules, Aiphons should dissapear, or try to be forced to dissapear, at this time, perhaps by having each of their units gain the crazed promotion, but the kind that makes them turn barbarian. And when they turn barbarian, they are no longer the previous unit but a powerful squid unit. Perhaps at this time to spawn a squid empire to take over the Aiphons, I am uncertain. But at any point during this time, a civ that loses most of their empire, or something, can build a ritual "the Draw" which will bring their monster unit back into creation. The only downside is that every other civ can build their monster civ ... so treat the monster civ like "nukes" and the draw like the manhatten project. You are only summoning your god, but then the compact is broken. In this way, trenton could save the Aiphons, ect, ect. But im not sure what to do after this happens, since its into WAY WAY alternate reality land.

After a certain time, or when Patria falls, ect, All of Bannor's Fire Priests will vanish (same as how the monsters vanished earlier) and they will start building Orcish units. Im thinking a majority of their units should go barbarian, while the few that stay loyal somehow gain the orcish promotion. chances are the barbarians will take over most of your cities, and you will have to rebuild your orcish empire. Somehow the Luichurp are supposed to be in the game at this time, with the best army, because its them who is supposed to try and stop mulcarn when he reenters, .... So maybe Spawn the Luichurp when Patria revolts and give them plenty of bonuses.

But anyways, Mulcarn enters Creation, Spawns with the Illians, and all kindsa bad stuff starts happening, ect ect. Im thinking Illians and Doviello should spawn in a permanent alliance with each other.

Its not much, but here is a start on Ideas.

cyther

Jun 28, 2009, 05:56 AM

Korias

Jun 28, 2009, 06:15 AM

This project excites me so I will be able to donate a good amount of time to it until August 25.

The main goals that you would want to have early on would be these:

1) Find a good map for the game

I would suggest Knight's Erebus or Ozzy KP's map as a base for the game but whichever one is chosen would have to be tweaked to optimize gameplay and fit the settings of the game.

2) Define which civilizations would appear and when

Just a simple list of civs and a timeline of when the would appear, no details about them but the timeline would have to be very detailed

3)Flesh out the civs that will be in the game

This would be the first really big job. Once every civ that would enter the game was chosen you would have to decide the detials of them.

For the Map, I agree. But it may need to be modified to be bigger than normal as per which civilizations would be in the game. Do we go with the standard FfH, Or, since this IS the FF forum, do we include FF civs? What about Orbis or FF+ Civs?

EDIT: I've been thinking about something- would the LEADERS themselves change for specific civs? (IE: Garrim Gyr take over the Luchiurp after a certain point of it being undr Beeri Bawl?)

1234567890

Jun 28, 2009, 08:16 AM

The chances of somebody investing the time to make your idea for you is very, very low.

How ironic...

cyther

Jun 28, 2009, 08:25 AM

Korias

Jun 28, 2009, 08:49 AM

Leaders might change with the civ but they could also be a result of a lack of stability so that your civ could split and another leader might take over. Then again it could be an alternating thing with Keelyn/Perpentach or completly seperate civs such as Falamar/Hannah.

As for civs that could be used I would use every FfH civ. I don't know enough about the FF civs to make a judgement but a number will come from there. The Mechanos probably would be put in as they are rather popular but they would probably be a lategame spawn. There also could be a few other civs from other modmoders if they had enough lore or if the creator were to provide lore for it. I think that Loocas' werewolf civ might be able to splinter off of the Doviello and if I end up doing a lot of work with this I might include one of two tops of my civs.

Edit:

I know, I wasn't expecting anyone to play with this either but it just sort of caught my attention and I guess I'll just go with it.

Well, the civs I think that we would NEED for this one would be, excluding the FfH Civs...

Aifons
Patria
United Elves
Pre-Patria civs, which are the various human kingdoms before unification.

Then, we can add in the FF Civs, and listed is their reasoning and probable entrance.

Scions, spawning late game (probably with the Mechanos). Why? They're the Patrians Reborn. Its the FfH equivilant of a Civ "recurring" in Rhye's and Fall of Civ.
Dural, spawning shortly after the Bannor. According to lore, they stick close with the Bannor and are good allies, training Bannor thinkers and in return the Bannor gives a buffer between the Dural and the CoE
Matazl and Cuali: Spawning near the Clan's spawn period, But I dont know their lore well enough to give a reason.
Khadi: Comes in after the Amurites, the reason being that Khad was originaly from the Amurites until he met Embar. Enables another High-Magic civ for the player.
Archos: Spawns isolated and would probably spawn midgame. Their lore shows that they took their time getting out of the caves, and as such become the "Mid Game Doviello".
Austrin: Spawns early on in the AoR, possibly one of the first to spawn from Patria as their tendency towards free spirited culture breaks out of Patrian society. I havent seen much lore besides from their leaders PoV, which occurs far after the Mechanos spawn.
Mechanos: Late spawning, and Thematically as people move away from the AoM type things and towards machinery, as well as the fact that they've become freethinking enough to build a tower to the heavens (Pillar of Creation) which is a basic "Screw You" to every one of the gods. Plus, their civ thrives on high tech, which would only be avaliable late game.

1234567890

Jun 28, 2009, 08:57 AM

Well, the civs I think that we would NEED for this one would be, excluding the FfH Civs...

United Elves

I don't think you need them. Just put them as Ljosalfars and insert the Splintered Court scenario just before AOI.

lemonjelly

Jun 28, 2009, 10:17 AM

cyther

Jun 28, 2009, 10:37 AM

Yeah, the United Elves need to be included.

And, I don't think that the Splintered Court needs to be included.

They start fighting because of the Age Of Ice, so, if all elven units have 50% chance to start with an effect promotion called PROMOTION_SUMMER_COURT, and the other 50% start with another effect promotion called PROMOTION_WINTER_COURT, then, when the Ljosalfars split off, because the Winter Court refuse to hand over leadership to the Summer Court, because of the Eternal Winter thing, the units with the PROMOTION_SUMMER_COURT can convert to the 'new' civilization.

They would need a new name, because United Elves sounds, well... too different from Ljosalfar and Svartalfar. Perhaps Sucelsfar? Or something like that.

Illians and Dovellio will have to form some type of alliance.

So, so far, we have:

A civilization for each god:
. * Lugus- Angel of Light (Sun)
. Malakim
. * Sirona- Angel of Wisdom (Spirit)
. Elohim
. * Nantosuelta- Angel of Faith (Enchantment)
. ?
. * Nemed- Angel of Life (Life)
. Grigori? (Does he have one?)
. * Amathaon- Angel of Fertility (Creation)
. ?
. * Junil- Angel of Justice (Law)
. Bannor?
. * Arawn- Angel of Death (Death)
. ?
. * Oghma- Angel of Knowledge (Metamagic)
. ?
. * Danalin- Angel of the Water (Water)
. Aifons
. * Dagda- Angel of Balance (Force)
. ?
. * Kilmorph- Angel of the Earth (Earth)
. ? (They wouldn't be Dwarves yet, would they?)
. * Sucellus- Angel of Growth (Nature)
. Elves (Need a name)
. * Tali- Angel of the Air (Air)
. ?
. * Cernunnos- Angel of Growth (Nature)
. Elves (Need a name)
. * Camulos- Angel of Peace (Chaos)
. Elohim
. * Aeron- Angel of Strength (Body)
. ?
. * Ceridwen- Angel of the Stars (Dimensional)
. ?
. * Mammon- Angel of Foresight (Mind)
. ?
. * Esus- Angel of Trust (Shadow)
. ?
. * Mulcarn- Angel of Ice (Winter)
. Illains
. * Agares- Angel of Hope (Entropy)
. ?
. * Bhall- Angel of Fire (Fire)
. Bannor

The leaders. Should they be the gods?
Then, there is:

Os-Gabella leading a vampire civilization. (Not vampires yet.)

Is anybody, who isn't busy, willing to form a team, to help with this massive project?

It is going to need a lot of work, and I only know XML...

...If not, can somebody post links to reccomended tutorials to making such a massive mod-mod-mod-mod-mod?

Thanks :D

I will help you with this. If you need any help with python work I will be able to handle that and I can do a little DLL.

The elves before Ljos and Svart were called the once elves. I think that the gods would be the leaders of the civs in the beginning.

A civilization for each god:
. * Lugus- Angel of Light (Sun)
. Malakim (Some desert nomads probably they were not the Malakim until Varn Gosam brought Empyrean to them)
. * Sirona- Angel of Wisdom (Spirit)
. Elohim
. * Nantosuelta- Angel of Faith (Enchantment)
. ? (She eventually got some surface dwarves (luchurip) in the Age of Magic)
. * Nemed- Angel of Life (Life)
. Grigori? (Nemed was no longer a god by this time)
. * Amathaon- Angel of Fertility (Creation)
. ? (Kuriotates in Age of Magic (maybe,lore changed a few time there))
. * Junil- Angel of Justice (Law)
. Bannor? (Junil did not like man at all and would have let them be)
. * Arawn- Angel of Death (Death)
. ? (Uninvolved)
. * Oghma- Angel of Knowledge (Metamagic)
. ? (Nothing until the Amurites)
. * Danalin- Angel of the Water (Water)
. Aifons
. * Dagda- Angel of Balance (Force)
. ? (Nothing)
. * Kilmorph- Angel of the Earth (Earth)
. ? (They wouldn't be Dwarves yet, would they?)
. * Sucellus- Angel of Growth (Nature)
. Elves (Need a name)
. * Tali- Angel of the Air (Air)
. ? (Hippus/Austrin in Age of Magic)
. * Cernunnos- Angel of Growth (Nature)
. Elves (Need a name) (Not god until AoR)
. * Camulos- Angel of Peace (Chaos)
. Elohim (Not Elohim, would later be patron god of Doviello)
. * Aeron- Angel of Strength (Body)
. ? (Vampires)
. * Ceridwen- Angel of the Stars (Dimensional)
. ? (Os-Gabella? Worshiped by Kylorin during the Corrupt age of Patria)
. * Mammon- Angel of Foresight (Mind)
. ? (Later Balseraphs)
. * Esus- Angel of Trust (Shadow)
. ? (Worshiped by Dark Elves)
. * Mulcarn- Angel of Ice (Winter)
. Illains
. * Agares- Angel of Hope (Entropy)
. ?
. * Bhall- Angel of Fire (Fire)
. Bannor (Later Clan of Embers)

WarKirby

Jun 28, 2009, 10:53 AM

Before the Age of Ice, I believe the elves were united under alternating leaders in the summer and winter, under the guidance and personal protection of sucellus.

lemonjelly

Jun 28, 2009, 11:06 AM

Okay, thanks, I really appreciate this, cyther.

So, how do I start coding this baby?

I know that I need to copy and rename the FF+ directory, but, from there...

I think it would have to start with re-coding the eras. Do I just add in the extra ones, with the religious ones, or would it be better to find a new way of coding the religions?

Why do they need to use the eras anyway? Is it to make all of the graphics change?

Then, how do I go about adding in the Rhyes and Fall aspect of it?
That is the important part of it.

Thanks for editing the list for me.

A civilization for each god:
. * Lugus- Angel of Light (Sun)
. Desert Nomads. (Need a name) (Some desert nomads probably they were not the Malakim until Varn Gosam brought Empyrean to them)
. * Sirona- Angel of Wisdom (Spirit)
. Elohim
. * Nantosuelta- Angel of Faith (Enchantment)
. Nothing, until Luchurip (She eventually got some surface dwarves (luchurip) in the Age of Magic)
. * Nemed
. Grigori (Nemed would still be the leader, wouldn't he?)
. * Amathaon- Angel of Fertility (Creation)
. ? (Kuriotates in Age of Magic (maybe,lore changed a few time there))
. * Junil- Angel of Justice (Law)
. Uninvolved
. * Arawn- Angel of Death (Death)
. Uninvolved
. * Oghma- Angel of Knowledge (Metamagic)
. Amurites (But much later)
. * Danalin- Angel of the Water (Water)
. Aifons
. * Dagda- Angel of Balance (Force)
. Nothing
. * Kilmorph- Angel of the Earth (Earth)
. ? (They wouldn't be Dwarves yet, would they?)
. * Sucellus- Angel of Growth (Nature)
. Once-Elves
. * Tali- Angel of the Air (Air)
. ? (Hippus/Austrin in Age of Magic)
. * Cernunnos- Angel of Growth (Nature)
. Not a God (Yet...)
. * Camulos- Angel of Peace (Chaos)
. Doviello
. * Aeron- Angel of Strength (Body)
. ? (Vampires) (Not in the Age Of Creation.)
. * Ceridwen- Angel of the Stars (Dimensional)
. ? (Os-Gabella? Worshiped by Kylorin during the Corrupt age of Patria)
. * Mammon- Angel of Foresight (Mind)
. ? (Later Balseraphs)
. * Esus- Angel of Trust (Shadow)
. ? (Worshiped by Dark Elves)
. * Mulcarn- Angel of Ice (Winter)
. Illains
. * Agares- Angel of Hope (Entropy)
. ?
. * Bhall- Angel of Fire (Fire)
. Bannor (Later Clan of Embers)

Need names for the following civilizations (They will exist until AoP, mostly)

Agares-
Esus-
Mammon-
Ceridwen-
Aeron-
Tali-
Kilmorph-
Amathaon-
Lugus-
Os-Gabella-

Then, we need a collective name for the humans that refuse to follow a god.
I was thinking Grigori, but did they exist until the contract?

Is anybody else interested? If not it is just me and cyther.

Thanks x

WarKirby

Jun 28, 2009, 11:56 AM

i'd hazard a guess that any humans who refuse to follow a god, simply wouldn't exist. Without the compact to protect them, they'd be smited by any number of angry gods.

cyther

Jun 28, 2009, 12:08 PM

Okay, thanks, I really appreciate this, cyther.

So, how do I start coding this baby?

I know that I need to copy and rename the FF+ directory, but, from there...

I think it would have to start with re-coding the eras. Do I just add in the extra ones, with the religious ones, or would it be better to find a new way of coding the religions?

A good way to do it would be to replace the current eras of Ancient, Classical, Medival with AoC, AoM and, AoI. Then you would have to add in the AoR era. That era would have to be added in alone. All eras would have to be placed into every single leader's era songtrack.

After Eras the next thing you would want would be a map.

Why do they need to use the eras anyway? Is it to make all of the graphics change?

Eras are used for songtrack data as well as graphics change. One of these was allowed to be set free by BtS 3.19 patch I think though.

Then, how do I go about adding in the Rhyes and Fall aspect of it?
That is the important part of it.

That would come in a bit later. The first thing you would want would be an accurate map. I attached two maps to the bottom of the page. They are for FfH so there would need to be a few changes made for FF+. If you choose one of them I will be able to update one to FF+.

Thanks for editing the list for me.

A civilization for each god:
. * Lugus- Angel of Light (Sun)
. Desert Nomads. (Need a name) (Some desert nomads probably they were not the Malakim until Varn Gosam brought Empyrean to them)
. * Sirona- Angel of Wisdom (Spirit)
. Elohim
. * Nantosuelta- Angel of Faith (Enchantment)
. Nothing, until Luchurip (She eventually got some surface dwarves (luchurip) in the Age of Magic)
. * Nemed
. Grigori (Nemed would still be the leader, wouldn't he?)
. * Amathaon- Angel of Fertility (Creation)
. ? (Kuriotates in Age of Magic (maybe,lore changed a few time there))
. * Junil- Angel of Justice (Law)
. Uninvolved
. * Arawn- Angel of Death (Death)
. Uninvolved
. * Oghma- Angel of Knowledge (Metamagic)
. Amurites (But much later)
. * Danalin- Angel of the Water (Water)
. Aifons
. * Dagda- Angel of Balance (Force)
. Nothing
. * Kilmorph- Angel of the Earth (Earth)
. ? (They wouldn't be Dwarves yet, would they?)
. * Sucellus- Angel of Growth (Nature)
. Once-Elves
. * Tali- Angel of the Air (Air)
. ? (Hippus/Austrin in Age of Magic)
. * Cernunnos- Angel of Growth (Nature)
. Not a God (Yet...)
. * Camulos- Angel of Peace (Chaos)
. Doviello
. * Aeron- Angel of Strength (Body)
. ? (Vampires) (Not in the Age Of Creation.)
. * Ceridwen- Angel of the Stars (Dimensional)
. ? (Os-Gabella? Worshiped by Kylorin during the Corrupt age of Patria)
. * Mammon- Angel of Foresight (Mind)
. ? (Later Balseraphs)
. * Esus- Angel of Trust (Shadow)
. ? (Worshiped by Dark Elves)
. * Mulcarn- Angel of Ice (Winter)
. Illains
. * Agares- Angel of Hope (Entropy)
. ?
. * Bhall- Angel of Fire (Fire)
. Bannor (Later Clan of Embers)

Need names for the following civilizations (They will exist until AoP, mostly)

Agares-
Esus-
Mammon-
Ceridwen-
Aeron-
Tali-
Kilmorph-
Amathaon-
Lugus-
Os-Gabella-

Then, we need a collective name for the humans that refuse to follow a god.
I was thinking Grigori, but did they exist until the contract?

Is anybody else interested? If not it is just me and cyther.

Thanks x

Os-Gabella really wouldn't be a leader. She spent most of her time in hiding until the Age of Magic.

Edit: We may want to go with another name because First Fall is the same acronym as Fall Further.

lemonjelly

Jun 28, 2009, 12:47 PM

I like Ozzy's one, but how hard would it be to make it a bit bigger, to add in all of the extra civilizations?

There are the extra FF ones:
@ Good Lizardman
@ Bad Lizardman
@ Dural
@ Chislef
@ Archos
@ The Explorer People
@ Jotnar

Then there is:
@ The Mechanos
@ The D'Tesh
@ The Aifons

And, can the elves be moved closer together? And put a massive forest around their starting postion?

In the bay, between the Amuries and the Sheaim, could you put a small island, with a one-tile lake in the middle, for Aifon Isle? (And put Aifon Isle in the 1-tile lake?)

Oh, and how hard would it be to make the resources random, but the Special Features to not be?

Thanks so much for helping me with this. :D

So, names needed for:
Agares-
Esus-
Mammon-
Ceridwen-
Aeron-
Tali-
Kilmorph-
Amathaon-
Lugus-

Os-Gabella-
^I think there does need to be a civilization for the children she steals, because the Calabim need something in the early game, just more savage, instead of the astirocracy-based system that the Calabim use, more of a pack, hunting for humans, type-thing.

And yeah, a new name would be nice.

Any ideas people?

It just needs to not be:
FFH
FF
Anything with a + on the end (Because I think this is a bit more than just adding things to FFH.)

I will try to post during the week, but I cannot guarantee any posts until next weekend, sorry.

x

Tasunke

Jun 28, 2009, 03:23 PM

Rise and Fall Further?

Ages of Fall?

Fallen Ages

cyther

Jun 28, 2009, 05:10 PM

I'm thinking Age of Erebus or Fallen Ages. They both sound pretty cool.

Edit: Bah, I applied patch 3.19 so FF doesn't work for me. I'll have to make the Map without worldbuilder for now.

WarKirby

Jun 29, 2009, 06:18 AM

The amurites didn't exist before the age of rebirth. Probably most other civs didn't too.

cyther

Jun 29, 2009, 08:26 AM

Quick question. Did Xienwolf lift the limit on the number of civs for FF? I remember hear about there being a limit of 50 now.

MagisterCultuum

Jun 29, 2009, 08:38 AM

Kael lifted it from 18 (I think) in normal BtS to 40 in FfH, but then lowered it again to 35 since FfH at the time didn't have enough leaders for them to all be unique with 40 in the game. I think Xienwolf lifted it again, pehaps to 50, since FF had more leaders.

cyther

Jun 29, 2009, 11:33 AM

Thanks, Magister. I nearly have the map done now and sneakily :mischief: added in the Cult of Nikito Civ to show up :mischief:. If lemonjelly doesn't object I think I'll keep it in.

Tasunke

Jun 29, 2009, 11:57 AM

So, civ appearances are all but completed now? Or was it just with the Nikito cult

xienwolf

Jun 29, 2009, 01:02 PM

Limit is 50, but also remember there are 3 Barbarians. So you need the Orcs as 50, Animals as 51, and Demons as 52, for a grand total of 53 slots (not sure precisely what information you need for a map setup)

cyther

Jun 30, 2009, 07:59 AM

Ok, here is a beta map to be used with FF+ with I believe is what this mod will eventually be based off of. If it is working right it should give you a few errors that talk about Aifons, Nikito and Shapeshifters. If you get errors besides that please tell me in this thread.

This is only a map not any XML and python editing and I really can't make very drastic map changes due to the fact that I am running 3.19.

It is also not final because many of these civs will not appear until the Age of Rebirth and some of them will be gone by then.

lemonjelly

Jun 30, 2009, 03:15 PM

Fallen ages

And I don't mind the CoN being in it. But can somebody email the map to callooke@googlemail.com please because I can't download it

cyther

Jul 01, 2009, 06:09 AM

Sent it to you, hope you get it.

Edit: Do you think that we should open a new thread in the FF+ Subforum or get this one moved there? The modmod, once we get to the actual ModModing will require it so it would confuse a lot less people is it moved now.

lemonjelly

Jul 01, 2009, 09:32 AM

Yeah thanks and

Yes, can somebody move it please?

Valkrionn

Jul 01, 2009, 12:35 PM

Haha, so this is a modmodmodmod then? :eek:

cyther

Jul 01, 2009, 01:03 PM

TO MUCH MOD! :crazyeye:

Anyways I think I found something down in Mod Components that we might be able to use to dictate the spawning of civs based on era. Once FF updates I'll take a look at what it can do.

Also you should probably PM a moderator to get this moved.

Sifaus

Jul 01, 2009, 01:56 PM

Wow! Very Exciting project, Good luck!

Vermicious Knid

Jul 01, 2009, 07:38 PM

Haha, so this is a modmodmodmod then? :eek:

New goal: to be the first guy to do a First Fall mod.

modmodmodmodmod FTW :goodjob:

Tasunke

Jul 01, 2009, 07:50 PM

Perhaps the thread should somehow be renamed to Fallen Ages?

lemonjelly

Jul 03, 2009, 05:50 PM

yeah, thanks cypher, I got it, but it won't open :s

I unzipped it into privatemaps for FF+, and when I loaded it up, it got as far as Initialising Graphics, then it CtD

BUT, if I run it on FFH, on turn 1, I get an automatic 'you've been destroyed.' Then it takes me to the playback screen thing. But I can only see half of the map. The other half is complete black...

Does anybody know how to change this?

[EDIT] But the half I can see looks very, very good!

Korias

Jul 03, 2009, 08:00 PM

New goal: to be the first guy to do a First Fall mod.

modmodmodmodmod FTW :goodjob:

Oh.. Oh God... :eek:

Maybe we should just shorten that down to Mod^5 :crazyeye:

As far as the map goes, I've been having the same issues. But I've also gotten some ideas as for other things that we may need to consideration.

Because of this going over the whole timeline, we may have to cover the whole fact that Death Mana wont be avaliable until a certain point due to the fact of that one guy stealing the gem from which it flows. Time Limit restrictions on Mana might be an interesting thing to think about, as the various gods's thoughts on Erebus shift.

A facet of the Rhyes and Fall of Civilization mod, stability might be an issue. However, perhaps there is a way to eliminate this to a greater degree, as FfH/FF/FF+/Orbis/(insert Mod here) have the option for Minor Leaders. Perhaps when running Republic, City States, or something similar, you can have part of your actual empire break off into an allied AI faction using a Minor Leader, either as a Team Member or as a highly friendly vassal. This was partially seen in the way that Shatner revolted into Republic in his Amurite AAR, and seems to be an interesting thing to do to improve stability. Obviously we would need to add a "Stability" civic catagory, I suppose.

While only Decius and the Jotnar have it, Conqueror creates an issue with letting other civs maintain their cultural values. Would these civs that have been conquered have a greater chance to revolt back into power, or would they stay complacent? Perhaps tying these factors to civics might be interesting, or creating an event every time you conquer a Civ to decide how you treat them, ranging from "Members of our Civ" (Low revolt chance, -15% production/culture or some other penalty) to "Slaves of the Master Civ" (High Revolt chance, +20% production, maybe an unhappy face?)

This might also mean that Decius could eventually reform Patria if given the chance, Nullifying the Scions (Unless he manages to fails before they appear).

How do we include the events that occured? Things like the Fall of Cuantine might be interesting to include as it gives the chance for Decius Malakim/Calabim instead of just Bannor, The Momus's events could lead to which leader is chosen for the Luchiurp, perhaps giving a bonus to Diplomacy with them if you help them out in the events, ect. We may need to tie these into the "Civ Switch" code, from what I can tell.

Once the Compact has been signed, it may be broken again, it seems. Beyond Hyborem and Basium, FF+'s Broken Compact Leaders, while in danger of being removed, may be interesting to include. Otherwise, we could go the opposite way and prevent Hyborem from leaving Hell Terrain, and some other restriction on Basium. But its been stated that there is more than one Gate and there are far more Balors out and about than just Hyborem, as per Ethne building a gate and the Lord of the Balors Scenario.

lemonjelly

Jul 03, 2009, 08:44 PM

Originally Posted by Mana
Because of this going over the whole timeline, we may have to cover the whole fact that Death Mana wont be avaliable until a certain point due to the fact of that one guy stealing the gem from which it flows. Time Limit restrictions on Mana might be an interesting thing to think about, as the various gods's thoughts on Erebus shift.
urrrm yeah, limits on Death Mana seem good, but no mana can be used until the Age Of Magic anyway, and most of the knowledge is lost in the Age Of Ice,so perhaps make it only available in the Age Of Rebirth?

Originally Posted by Stability
A facet of the Rhyes and Fall of Civilization mod, stability might be an issue. However, perhaps there is a way to eliminate this to a greater degree, as FfH/FF/FF+/Orbis/(insert Mod here) have the option for Minor Leaders. Perhaps when running Republic, City States, or something similar, you can have part of your actual empire break off into an allied AI faction using a Minor Leader, either as a Team Member or as a highly friendly vassal. This was partially seen in the way that Shatner revolted into Republic in his Amurite AAR, and seems to be an interesting thing to do to improve stability. Obviously we would need to add a "Stability" civic catagory, I suppose.

Ooooohhhhh... I like stability! And, yeah them ideas are great!, But the Scions are already the rebirth of the Patrians, and I'd like to keep it that way.
I did have an idea, that in the AoR, there is a chance that any city ruins that used to be Patrian would have a chance to turn into a Scions city.

And, yeah another civic option... BTW, is it possible to make a drop-down menu, so you could only see one civic group at a time?

Originally Posted by Conqueror
While only Decius and the Jotnar have it, Conqueror creates an issue with letting other civs maintain their cultural values. Would these civs that have been conquered have a greater chance to revolt back into power, or would they stay complacent? Perhaps tying these factors to civics might be interesting, or creating an event every time you conquer a Civ to decide how you treat them, ranging from "Members of our Civ" (Low revolt chance, -15% production/culture or some other penalty) to "Slaves of the Master Civ" (High Revolt chance, +20% production, maybe an unhappy face?)

This might also mean that Decius could eventually reform Patria if given the chance, Nullifying the Scions (Unless he manages to fails before they appear).
I think an option would be good, but these cities would always have a chance to re-spawn their other civ. Perhaps the options would be the chance to revolt, and the chance for the spawning civ to be on their team, friendly, pleased, upset or furious with the conquering civ.

Originally Posted by The Scenario Arc
How do we include the events that occured? Things like the Fall of Cuantine might be interesting to include as it gives the chance for Decius Malakim/Calabim instead of just Bannor, The Momus's events could lead to which leader is chosen for the Luchiurp, perhaps giving a bonus to Diplomacy with them if you help them out in the events, ect. We may need to tie these into the "Civ Switch" code, from what I can tell.

I wasn't planning on including the scenarios, but it could be a good idea. But it would have to be optional, like, play the Splintered Court scenario and perhaps get some extra settlers, adepts, archers ect. OR don't play it and finish the game quicker.

Originally Posted by The Compact
Once the Compact has been signed, it may be broken again, it seems. Beyond Hyborem and Basium, FF+'s Broken Compact Leaders, while in danger of being removed, may be interesting to include. Otherwise, we could go the opposite way and prevent Hyborem from leaving Hell Terrain, and some other restriction on Basium. But its been stated that there is more than one Gate and there are far more Balors out and about than just Hyborem, as per Ethne building a gate and the Lord of the Balors Scenario.

Well, the Aifons had the chance to break the compact, Cassiel broke it, Hyborem and Basium broke it, the Illians broke it, so why can't anybody else?
Perhaps make it an emergency-only thing, like only one city left, and the AC at 90 or more?

Or make it only possible in the Age Of Hell idea I had, after Acopalypse, where the world is full of Demons, perhaps then the leaders would be willing to bring their gods into creation.

So, what do people think about the Age Of Hell?

Is it a good idea?

Would you play it?

And what about the ideas above?
Good or bad?
What would make you play them ect.?

x

Tasunke

Jul 03, 2009, 08:48 PM

Firstly, on Mana, Fire mana should not be allowable to evil (or neutral civs) until the Fall of Bhall. In fact, im wondering if Fire mana should only be allowed for worshipers of Bhall, and then when that religion is destroyed, upon the fall of Bhall, the fire access is from then on open to everyone.

I think the Death Magic should be allowable at age of magic, and on certain Patrian casters before that age.

Primarily because I see the early battlles being between the Undead and Sorcerors of Patria and the Mobs of vigilantes let by priests of Bhall.

I also think that Lizardmen and Centaurs should be powerful permanent summons during the Patrian age and the Age of magic, and after a time, maybe at the end of the age of magic, all Lizard units should join the Mazatl, and the Mazatl should begin in some tucked away jungle, and after the age of Ice the Cualli should branch off from them. If possible, the converted lizards should be transported to the Mazatl starting location somehow.

lemonjelly

Jul 03, 2009, 08:59 PM

yeah, a whole two ages without fire mana? sounds good!

Because it goes
AoC - no magic anyway
AoM - fire magic only for good civs
AoI - only amurites have magic
AoR - finally everyone can get it!
AoH - only evil civs can get it?

And, didn't Patria form in the AoM, because the compact had been signed?
So, the Patrian casters would get Death Mana anyway? :S

Unless, you give certain Patrian units that aren't spellcasters get death spells.

x

Tasunke

Jul 03, 2009, 09:50 PM

hehe, Well, I guess Patria does form in the large age of Magic. I just see the Age of magic in two parts.

In one part, Patria is the dominant civ similar to Rome in the Classic age, if even more overbearing, (the metaphore only works if you look at the mediterranean as ALL of erebus) and then in another part (im thinking later part after the two peasant rebellions, I think the second rebellion was led by Kylorin) but in the second, later part, there are many nations equally battling for supremacy, ect. It is in this second half of the age of magic where I see 3 basic powerhouses forming, The Patrian Lords, the Luichurp, and the Bannor. The Patrian lords would be the most widespread but not allied or anything, they might even end up fighting each other. Probably broken into several civs, namely the Shieam, the Balseraph, (the Aiphons?), and a couple others (including Laroth, who should probably govern the Spirit god civ, which I guess should be recreated at this time with Laroth as their leader, and this civ should be created in the Isle that will later be called the Land of the Dead, when Tebryn occupies it later and covers the well of death. Each would be a master in their own sphere, and lots of undead units probably. Their main enemy would be the Bannor, and their mobs of peasants.

The Luichurp would be the main enemy of Mulcarn when he first enters Erebus, although a few others would fight against him as well. Perhaps the elves?

I know the Malakim and Sidar could only be created after the Age of Ice, as well as the Kuriotates, because the leaders of Malakim and Sidar were forming their nations while Auric was a teenager. In addition, the books of Laroth were taken by Sandalphon during this time I believe, so the Sidar and their shades couldnt exist until the age of Rebirth, around the same time as the birthing of the Malakim, or a couple turns later. Maybe start with a couple Shades to jumpstart their builder theme. ( a couple free Great People in the beginning in the form of Shades, can only be joined to cities. Sure it "could" be used aggresively, but at least they can afford to be defensive and turtle if they already have a couple great people to work with)

My Initial statement was that the Age of Magic starts out with Patria as the main boss, and then somewhere in the middle Patria splits up into the various magical lords (because Kylorin leaves and has his little rebellion), and the Bannor and Luichurp take center stage, I would imagine.

The Patrian Lord characters I would see as particularly powerful would be Perpentach, Tebryn Arbandi, and Laroth. meanwhile Trenton majosi is a goody goody and a wild card. Perhaps at this time, as Perpentach has not yet been locked in the tower, should not get the insane trait, but instead should have arcane, aggresive, and charismatic.

I think it would be nice for the patrian lords to all (except Trenton of course) to gain the "corrupt" trait, which has some negative inclination, but maybe nothing so much as increased distance maintanence, or something, because although corrupt, they are still supposed to be insanely powerful.

lemonjelly

Jul 03, 2009, 10:10 PM

Yeah, it would make sense to split the AoM into two eras.

So, in the 1st part of the AoM:
~Patria
~Elves (They haven't split off yet)
~Aifons
~Lurchip
(They definately existed then, but they didn't gain much power until Kylorin asked them for their help defeat the corrupted Archmages.)
~Hippus
~Bannor

Then, in the second part:
~Renmants Of Patria
~Kylorin's Fellowship
~Elves
~Aifons
~Bannor
~Hippus

Yeah, perhaps making each city in Renmants of Patria split off into their own civilizations called Perpenanch's City ect. ect.
And not letting them bujild settlers.
And putting them in a team together?

And, couldn't the Sidar exist earlier, just without all of the unique stuff. I thought they formed in the AoI :S. And the free shade idea sounds really good.

And the Isle of the dead could have:
Broken Sepulcher
Bradeline's Well
AND
Legions Of D'Tesh
Sheaim

So it would have to be pretty big.

And the Malakim really need to spawn in deserts. Or desert (Plural).
Does it say anything in the lore about a big desert in Erebus?

Tasunke, you are full of the most wonderful ideas! :D

lemonjelly

Jul 04, 2009, 07:30 AM

cyther

Jul 04, 2009, 08:04 AM

OMG! Random idea time!
And, cypher, when I read your post in the lore forum, I realised something. The Age Of Creation would be better off being called the Age Of Dragons, because thats what I meant, the age of the Godswar type thing.

And, for the Godswar, do AI hidden nationality units attack each other?

Probably we should rename it to the Age of Dragons.

Yes, Barbs would fight each other.

Anyways, can somebody help me with the map problems Iv been having, and would you play this modmodmodmodmod with the feature below? Feedback please!

POPULATION LIMITS
-----------------------

Well, to create the feeling of small tribes in the AoD, instead of massive cities, there would be Population Limits.

AoD - Pop. Limit of 3
AoM - No Pop. Limit
AoI - Pop. Limit of 2
AoR - Pop. Limit of 6
AoH - Pop. Limit of 2

And, to go with this idea, there would be buildings that increase the Pop. Limit, such as:

~ House +2 Pop. Limit
~ Inn +1 Pop. Limit
~ Orphanage +1 Pop. Limit +1:yuck:
~ Beggars Sanctuary +1 Pop Limit +1:yuck:
I can't think of any more ATM, if you have any ideas, please tell

Then, civics:

~Slavery (Change) +1 Pop. Limit

So, Maximum Pop. Limits would be:
AoD - 9 Pop. Limit
AoM - No Pop. Limit
AoI - 8 Pop. Limit
AoR - 12 Pop. Limit
AoH - 8 Pop. Limit

This could be expanded, and capitals wold provide another +1 Pop. Limit

And, perhaps the Jotnar, Scions, Sidar and the Kutirionites wouldn't have these limitations.

x

I can't do much for the map problems right now as I can't play FF or FF+ but the pop limits probably could be put in. The Jotnar already something like this so it would be rather easy to code.

I have another idea. Perhaps the actions of the civs during the Age of Rebirth could trigger what era they go into next. I think in lore there were three possible outcomes.

1) Age of Despair: Hell wins, the empires of Erebus are reduced to almost nothing.

2) Age of Machines: The probable outcome. As many humans and mages are created the ether is influenced by too many forces. Magic doesn't work and the gods are weak. Mankind begins to rely on machines and tools more than magic and a sect arises to try and destroy enough magical artifacts and mages so that magic works again.

3) Age of Enlightenment: Mankind permemantly overcomes the taint of Agares. All of the gods relinquish their powers of creation and The One returns in glory to Erebus.

Tasunke

Jul 04, 2009, 08:27 AM

what kind of victory could be attained in the age of enlightenment? or is it sort of a prologue to an alter victory?

ehm, on a differnt note, what are the relative lengths you want each age to be?

(also, the age of machines should probably not have a population limit, same with enlightenment)

lemonjelly

Jul 04, 2009, 08:27 AM

Yeah, so, my Age of Hell idea is Age Of Despair.

The Age of Machines appears to be a good idea, but I like magic too much, but, if there was a choice of three different outcomes, then that wouldn't be a problem. The Gods being weak... Hmmmm............. Perhaps not weak but, they lost their connections to Erebus, probably through some ritual by the Mechanos or Os-Gabella believing that with the gods' power removed from Erebus, she would be able to die completely.

The Age of Enlightenment... I don't think that all of mankind could overcome the taint pernamently but maybe Danalin could wake up, turning the Overlords good, or at least neutral.

And, the Ashen Veil would become less and less appealing, as people realised what they were doing, and seek redemption. BUT, mankind would never be able to overcome evil completely. The One may be able to come back, but Agares's taint is in all of creation still, so The One would still accidentally destroy Erebus by coming back.

And, don't worry that much about the map.
If somebody started a game with it, and posted the save here, it should work.
If not, I will download the original and figure out how to edit it.

All I would need to know would be to how to increase the sie, because the Civilizations don't really matter at the moment.

Are we waiting for FF and FF+ to update to FFH 041b?
Then it would work with 3.19, which would save the effort of making it compatable in the end.

OR, do we start now?
x

lemonjelly

Jul 04, 2009, 08:35 AM

And, I suppose it would be after the Altar, and, there should be an evil victory condition but I cannot think of any ATM.

Perhaps:
The One Victory - destroy ALL evil civs, make sure there is no hell terrain or AV, OO worship. Build ritual 'Stairs To Divinity'

^The One comes back to Erebus, all of Agares's taint pernamently removed from creation. Everyone lives happily ever after. The End.

x

cyther

Jul 04, 2009, 09:36 AM

All that I really am waiting on is the update of FF and FF+ for two reasons:

1)It will but coming soon and I don't want to update files between versions so early on

2)The current DLL core files of FF are badly messed up (or so I've heard)

3)I installed BtS 3.19 patch so I can't use FF without some repatching.

lemonjelly

Jul 04, 2009, 10:50 AM

And,

4) It gives more time to come up with ideas that we would like to include, and to get feedback.

So, we wait. I cannot wait to start trying to figure out what the code means.

Its going to be fun.
x

black_imperator

Jul 04, 2009, 12:43 PM

i like the idea of different outcomes for the fifth age. If you need some help for python or xml i'll be happy to help

lemonjelly

Jul 04, 2009, 12:59 PM

aww thanks all help is appreciated.

I'm not too sure about the idea of the different outcomes, because that just gives me too many ideas of ages to carry it on.

Like, in the Age Of Machines, it could have a Mana Counter, which increases by 1 for every unit with channeling 1, by 2 for channeling 2, and 3 for channeling 3.
The, you have to kill a vast amount of units with these promotions to reduce the counter, and get magic working for long enough to build a ritual that
a) grants your civ magic for ever
b) strenghtens the link between erebus and the gods, making the MC only go up 0.5-C1, 1-C2, 1.5-C3.

And, Tasunke, yeah, no Pop. limits on the AoE and Age of Machines (perhaps a name change)

Age of Magic
Age of Machines.

Yeahh, a new name for the Age Of Machines.

x

Tasunke

Jul 04, 2009, 04:22 PM

Age of Future? Age of leymen?

Vehem

Jul 04, 2009, 04:45 PM

2)The current DLL core files of FF are badly messed up (or so I've heard)

Not so much - the current release (for 3.17) works fine for 3.17. The Internal version (for 3.19) works fine on 3.19. DLL issues are pretty much sorted so far as the BtS update is concerned.

Valkrionn

Jul 04, 2009, 04:48 PM

I believe what he means there is the Hawk bug, but that's a result of me using some of Xienwolf's 'work-in-progress' :lol:

lemonjelly

Jul 05, 2009, 07:52 AM

Hawk bug?

is that the bug where the game crashes when trying to do a recon sweep?

I get it with Floating Eyes, but I don't use hawks so IDK if it is the same bug...

and... is there any way, without touching the DLL, to give religions a better chance at being founded in the capital, something like 6x, to combat the -8x that the capital usually gets.
x

WarKirby

Jul 05, 2009, 12:16 PM

Hawk bug?

is that the bug where the game crashes when trying to do a recon sweep?

I get it with Floating Eyes, but I don't use hawks so IDK if it is the same bug...

Hawks and Floating Eyes are essentially the same thing, just with a different model. so, yes.

cyther

Jul 05, 2009, 06:55 PM

and... is there any way, without touching the DLL, to give religions a better chance at being founded in the capital, something like 6x, to combat the -8x that the capital usually gets.
x

I really can't think of a way.

cyther

Jul 07, 2009, 03:36 PM

Tasunke

Jul 07, 2009, 09:35 PM

Who are the Bezeri?

Darksaber1

Jul 07, 2009, 10:10 PM

New FF+ race. They have a thread here.

Rasta69

Jul 07, 2009, 10:10 PM

Wow ive always wondered what would happen if they combined my two fave mods....

Are you planning on adding UHV (Unique Historical Victories)? If so it will give you a little freedom in the historical accuracy.(If any of the civs in AoC manage to summon their God back into creation, well don't worry lets just say you won and call it a day xD)

Also for the Age of Ice your probably going to have to have Ice walls, or glaciers forming blocking certain races from doing much ie Svlats and Ljsofar, (and take control/defeat multiple civs at this time to remove the boredom factor, a few hundred years till the Amurites get busy and kill Mulcarn? No thank you....) Then add in the thaw from winter with numerous civs starting up, maybe just have the Amurites, Illians and Dovellio continue to play, though it may be better to have the Illians collapse then re-form later, once Auric gets his Manic depressive butt in gear. And again Kudos to lemonjelly and Cyther for even attempting something that will be more epic than the power of a thousand suns.....

armyofwhispers

Jul 09, 2009, 04:58 PM

The Bezeri are now in the game (at least will be soon). How would we have any interaction between these two races. As playing as the Aifons will probably get you killed, should there be some transfer of an Aifon player to this civ when it is founded/the Aifons vanish?

Lore wise, the Bezeri split from the Mazatl right at the start of the age of ice, and submerge until it's over... I'm not sure when the Aifons are destroyed, but the Bezeri are basically unplayable until after the age of ice... seeing as they are trapped under the ice until it melts... from what I understand.

Valkrionn

Jul 10, 2009, 01:13 AM

Pretty much. They aren't truly trapped, but stay deep enough that the ice doesn't affect them one way or the other. All I know about the Aifons, is they are destroyed BEFORE the AoI, as the ritual Trenton found to save them (and didn't use) is what was used to summon Mulcarn.

armyofwhispers

Jul 17, 2009, 08:29 PM

EDIT- wrong thread :)

lemonjelly

Jul 18, 2009, 11:50 AM

cyther

Jul 19, 2009, 09:20 AM

Urmm...

how many of the files will be changed in the 3.19 update?

I'm sure that I'v read somewhere that XML will not be changed, but what about python?

and, can somebody post some code for the population limits please? I cannot seem to get it to work...

thanks.

Both XML and python of FfH, FF, FF+... were unchanged.

What are you doing for your population limits?

The way that I would do it would be to modify CvCity::doGrowth() in the DLL.
It looks a bit complicated but I think I would be able to do it with about a week or so of time.

lemonjelly

Jul 24, 2009, 07:51 PM

I've been using the jotnar code, but with a piece of code that checks for the player's current era, instead of civilization...

I'm going to install the 3.19 patch as well now, because patch 'a' is out for FF 051.

And, with the new modular mod stuff, I'm going to import all of my XML changes into a module, so I can quickly port it to FF+ when it comes out.
And, then I could release it and the changed python files here for people to look at?

Would it help you if you had my current changes?

But be warned, most of the changes are for Amurites... I just feel that they are majorly lacking at the moment.

x

lemonjelly

Jul 24, 2009, 11:29 PM

Building Resource Converter
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179993

Cultural Influences
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=170884

Immigration
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4149559

Resource Tech Modifier
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=180594 <-- Pointless

Upgradable Buildings
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=186158

^All of these are by TheLopez

I think that these would make great and useful additions to Fallen Ages. I just have to figure out how to add them, but that can wait until FF+ updates.

I'm just posting them here in case they are useful to anybody, and so I don't forget about them.

x

xienwolf

Jul 25, 2009, 12:03 AM

Resource Tech Modifier would be a massive waste of your time, we already have the ability to do MORE than that in FF code.

lemonjelly

Jul 25, 2009, 01:08 AM

oh okay thanks. I just chose the ones that sounded good...

x

cyther

Jul 25, 2009, 07:20 AM

Upgradable buildings looks something like the Altar of the Luonnator. If it was added it would probably simplify the Altar a bit.

lemonjelly

Jul 25, 2009, 09:24 AM

I was thinking about using it for houses (Pop. Limit) and unit training things, like, an improved on created with a spell usuable by Confessors, that gives units Blessed.

It would only exist while a confessor is in the tile, but it wouldn't clutter the city info's up.

Opera

Jul 25, 2009, 11:08 AM

Upgradable buildings is really interesting :)

lemonjelly

Jul 25, 2009, 12:47 PM

The ony thing is that they are ony compatable with vanilla civ 4 or warlords.

Unless it can still be used.

And, how do you trim XML files? is there any special code needed, or can I just go through and trim them myself? I really only want building infos done, its a PITA to add new buildings at the moment, especially for buildings that don't do anything in XML... all of that code...

And:
JCityLimit: Controlling City Count
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=7064255

^That is going to be important.

And, Opera, are you thinking about using it ;)
What would you use it for?
I cannot really think of anything ATM, apart for the Altar and the Barracks example included with it. Or giving every city with a spellcaster in a 'Wards' buiding. Growth and the other good magical buffs would upgrade from this, and then Dispel Magic could get rid of all of the good magical buildings in one go.
x

Opera

Jul 25, 2009, 01:10 PM

The ony thing is that they are ony compatable with vanilla civ 4 or warlords.

Unless it can still be used.

And, how do you trim XML files? is there any special code needed, or can I just go through and trim them myself? I really only want building infos done, its a PITA to add new buildings at the moment, especially for buildings that don't do anything in XML... all of that code...One useful thing sadly not used by FF is the XML Editor provided in FFH and Orbis. Makes things much easier. I wonder why xienwolf and Vehem never used it.

And, Opera, are you thinking about using it ;)
What would you use it for?
I cannot really think of anything ATM, apart for the Altar and the Barracks example included with it. Or giving every city with a spellcaster in a 'Wards' buiding. Growth and the other good magical buffs would upgrade from this, and then Dispel Magic could get rid of all of the good magical buildings in one go.
xWell, I don't have many ideas either. I just feel it could be used... I know it could be great for Palisade -> Walls, and, why not, for some wonders: Mage Guild->Catabomb Libralus, Lighthouse->Great Lighthouse, etc.
Maybe I'll use it for my plant civ too...

cyther

Jul 25, 2009, 08:55 PM

The ony thing is that they are ony compatable with vanilla civ 4 or warlords.

Unless it can still be used.

And, how do you trim XML files? is there any special code needed, or can I just go through and trim them myself? I really only want building infos done, its a PITA to add new buildings at the moment, especially for buildings that don't do anything in XML... all of that code...

Xienwolf's trimming is done by switching some tags in the schema to mincount = 0. It will work for many things but could cause weird stuff with certain tags.

And:
JCityLimit: Controlling City Count
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=7064255

^That is going to be important.

And, Opera, are you thinking about using it ;)
What would you use it for?
I cannot really think of anything ATM, apart for the Altar and the Barracks example included with it. Or giving every city with a spellcaster in a 'Wards' buiding. Growth and the other good magical buffs would upgrade from this, and then Dispel Magic could get rid of all of the good magical buildings in one go.
x

If Valk releases his source/updates to FF.51 in the next two weeks I'll probably be able to add those mod comps to the DLL.

lemonjelly

Aug 01, 2009, 09:33 AM

Thanks, cypher. Would you be able to increase the chances of religions being founded in the capital, or just remove the block that civ 4 has on it.

thanks.
x

Opera

Aug 01, 2009, 09:55 AM

Removing this block is easy enough but it's in the DLL.

As for trimming, I got from Xienwolf recently that, mostly, you just want to not forget the <Type>. Most of the other tags are minOccurs="0" already. That includes FF files. You don't have to trim the files yourself, except in you want to reduce the already existing entries. Just add your entry with the necessary tags and nothing more... (at least, I believe the schema for buildings is already trimmed).

cyther

Aug 02, 2009, 05:28 PM

Thanks, cypher. Would you be able to increase the chances of religions being founded in the capital, or just remove the block that civ 4 has on it.

thanks.
x

It isn't a block but it does make the Religion highly unlikely to be founded there. I'll get rid of it so that the religions are founded where they should be.

Tasunke

Aug 03, 2009, 05:55 PM

itd be kinda nice for religions to spawn in flavorful places .... ROK in highest hammer city, Esus in highest gold city, FOl in most forested city, OO in most watery city, Order in most food city, Empyrean in most GPP city, AV in most tech city, ect.

and for exceptions to be made due to unique features.

AV close to bradelines well or broken sepulcher, FOL close to Yggdrassil, Empy close to Mirror of Heaven, ROK close to standing stones, ect

Korias

Aug 05, 2009, 03:16 PM

I think that the first peice of work would be to examine where we can merge FfH code into the Rhyes and Fall code. THEN we can get to changing things around once we have a handle on the mechanics of that mod's interactions, and whether they will conflict with FfH, and by extension, FF and FF+.

cyther

Aug 13, 2009, 06:53 AM

I got the map to work. Again it is simply a display of where the civs will be in the game but it could also be used as a map for multiplayer games if you wanted every civ in.

Now to make a DLL...

lemonjelly

Aug 14, 2009, 12:30 PM

Thanks x

I have a massive list of ideas on my home computer. I will post them some time. Gotta download the new ff+ first. Then I can get started.

x

cyther

Aug 14, 2009, 01:28 PM

I'm already working on the DLL. I need to get a compiler working on my computer but I wrote the code to limit populations already. Just need to compile and test it.

lemonjelly

Aug 16, 2009, 12:49 PM

Yey!
I'v downloaded the map, and FF+, with all of the addons.
will play a couple of games, mod a few things, and then we can start!

Thanks cypher, I really appreciate you helping me with this. I don't know what I would do without you.

Here are the ideas, some are .doc files, some are in rich text format. Enjoy!
Included are lots of buttons for level 4 of the channeling and spell spheres. (in .dds format)

x

black_imperator

Aug 16, 2009, 02:03 PM

As i said earlier , i will help for python and xml. I'll begin an Aifon civ during the week.( but i'll need art)

edit: about your excel file about the civ, Mazalt and cualli existed before the age of ice in a single nation i think

Opera

Aug 16, 2009, 02:13 PM

Hmm, I like this. Too bad I don't see the Ngomele anywhere :p

Tasunke

Aug 16, 2009, 11:47 PM

Just one minor detail. As horselord I must inform you that Tali is the hippus domain ... of the wind. Technically the Austrin could hold this domain as well, but if hippus and Austrin both split from the tribe of Tali, the split would have occured right at the start of the age of magic.

I see the tribe of Danalin evolving into the Lanun, and the Aiphons being there own thing ... more favored by Danalin of course, but being "better" than a mere tribe. Starting from the beginning.

Also, the hippus prefer the grazing fields good for their animal husbandry ... mostly sheep on hills. Usually tend to be trapped in-between larger and scary empires. Alive even as early as the age of magic.

Tasunke

Aug 17, 2009, 01:49 AM

Dimension 4-> Levitate (grant flying promo to all units in the stack, essentially)

Sun 4 -> Scry (gain sentry I, II, and Perfect sight granted to caster upon first casting. Acts like a hawk with near unlimited range)

Water 4 -> Sea March (waterwalking for entire stack, or maybe just arcane and melee)

Law 4 -> Ordum Magnamitas, grants Magnanimitas promo which is removed upon combat. (Acts like loyalty, valor, and strong, exp gain stacks with valor and strength boost will occur even on a unit already having the actual strong promo, cause its a new promo)

Body 4 -> Flesh Hunger (grants cannibalism promo to all divine, melee, and recon units)

Chaos 4 -> Battle Frenzy (grants all non-hero melee units drill I-III and burning blood promo, as well as random promotions of all kinds. All the way from Plague and Weak to Strong, Valor, or enchanted blade ... maybe even a chance at magnanimitas?)

Entropy 4 -> dissolve (can be resisted, grants enemy units the weak promo, the withered promo, and removes ALL metals, including mithril)

Demon + Entropy 4-> Corrupt (can alternatively turn a 16 tile block into hell terrain)

Shadow 4 -> Fade Out (grants invisibility to all arcane units, hidden to all other units)

Wind 4 -> Hurricane March (grants all units, living or non, +1 movement and commando. Even Siege weapons)

Enchantment 4 -> Power Infusion (grants heavy and combat 1 to all golem and seige units)

Fire 4 -> Asteroid (casts ring of Fire while summoning 3 or 4 asteroids. Asteroids are like meteors, only they have +1 fire affinity, and double the bombard value, and three times the collateral damage amount, still to a limited max of course, in collateral that is)
// alternatively, Fire4 could be the old Meteor shower, which summoned 3 meteors

Force 4 -> Banish (can be resisted. Enemy undead, demons, and angels, have a chance to dissapear back from whence they came)

Death 4 -> Exterminate (range 2, cannot be resisted, reduces enemy city to pop 1, creates a wraith for every pop the city had. Can also target a stack, giving a 10% chance for each living unit to turn undead, and a 5% chance for a living unit to die. Effects units in targeted cities. Always attacks a rival city if its within range, otherwise goes for largest stack)
// alternatively you could make the spell simpler by reducing city pop to 1 and creating a blight in the city

Ice 4-> New Winter (turns all tiles to ice in a 16 tile block. Permanent transformation. (countered by below)

Nature 4 -> New Summer (works like genises on a 16 tile block, centered on caster. also summons a Treant.)

Spirit 4 -> Spirit's Resolve (a 16 square sanctuary, as well as supplying demon slaying and undead slaying to all units in the stack.)

Metamagic 4 -> Omniscience (gain knowledge of entire map, can see rival tech progression (as if they were a vassal)

Life 4 -> Everlasting Devotion ->grants immortality promotion to melee units and recon units(and mounted?) (and Divine?) anything but arcane, basically. possibly can be used only once per supermage, or maybe Life 4 is lost upon casting it, requiring a further level to buy it again, in order to use it again.

Mind 4 -> Mind steal -> randomly steals enemy tech, has a chance (2 tile range) of converting enemy arcane units ... 5%. Another 5% to give enemy arcane units (3 tile range) the held promotion.

Earth 4 -> Kilmorph Provides -> creates random resource on a barren mine+hill

Creation 4-> radomly creates a food or animal resource, 5% of doing nothing, 5% of randomly creating a great person instead (except for great prophets)

I made these spells with the Opinion that each super mage (unless Patria) can only know ONE tier 4 spell

2Hydroclopse

Aug 17, 2009, 06:23 AM

It's rather neat to find a thread that parallels the concept that I was searching/hoping for earlier. Though I think the improved magic idea might be better off if partitioned off of the multi-ages part of the mod, this mod looks interesting want-able.

Coincidentally, I had started working on something un-dis-similar not so long ago, but it seems the methods differ on how to get to similar ends. If it helps, the multiple concepts I was going to try and implement were: to implement an Ice Counter to replace the Armageddon counter in the early game; I was also going to make a strange tech-based system for the birth and diversification of different civs, as well as encourage the dividing of civs trough a bolstered colonization mechanic; I had then planned to make each angel-and arc- have a running opinion of each civ, the most favored would then color the development of said angel via an implementation of a better broader alignments. However, your methods to accomplish the Ages are likely more compatible with reality. I have only come to the mod scene recently and most of these plans are far from fruition.

This thread seems to be several months old and likely has seniority in terms of how much of the mod is actually completed. For now, I shall still toil away on my attempt at a mod -I was gonna name it 'Rise from Erebus' but I'm not sure if that taken yet; that, and the progress that has been made is not yet worthy of a name-; but, I wish you best of luck.

cyther

Aug 17, 2009, 11:13 AM

You're probably gone by now but here is a DLL and some schema files of the population limits.

It is set by era. By default I have set each of them to four population max each but you can change them to whatever you want.

I also included the ability for buildings to modify the pop limit. As an example is the monument building. It raises the limit by 2. You could also make some buildings raise such as well, graniary, ect. and other's lower such as demon's alter or the pillar of chains.

Lastly I modified the city screen to display the current pop over the maximum as a fraction. It is displayed next to the city name when you load it up.

Edit: Might be able to put on a tag on buildings to show that they raise the pop limit. I'll add it in when I merge the culture from improvements you showed me earlier.
Edit2: Might be something else but this makes the ci4Alerts go crazy. We may need to disable them until I figure out how they work.

lemonjelly

Aug 17, 2009, 12:23 PM

OMG! Thank you! Thank You! THANK YOU!!!

I can play some games now!

Gotta port my changes from befor 3.19 across first though.

@ black_imperator - any help is always appreciated, thanks!

@ Opera - The excel file is really old. I haven't updated it for ages. But I would love to include them in this mod.

@ Tasunke - Thanks for the spell ideas. Patria and Amurites will be exceptions to the one-spell rule. And the hippus and austrin can both spawn. I forgot about the hippus and gods TBH, I don't really play them much.

x

Opera

Aug 17, 2009, 05:40 PM

@cyther: it's funny, I did the pop cap things for the Ngomele not that long ago... :lol:

@lemonjelly: no, I would love it if you did that :goodjob: I'm very interested in a Rhye's and Fall From Heaven (just a pun :p) type of game. I'll try to help as much as I can :)

As for the Ngomele, well, add them if you want to. I think the civilization itself shouldn't appear before late in the Age of Rebirth. Before the Age of Ice, they're basically ununified tribes of wild gnolls. During the Age of Ice, most of them die and only a few survive (I don't know which map you choose, so I can't say where they are located). They got unified during the Age of Rebirth :)

cyther

Aug 17, 2009, 09:09 PM

@Opera: More civs are always better. As long as there is enough lore to help place a civ almost anything could be put in.

I also have some ideas of things that could be put in.
1) Civs changing with a tech- There are a few civs that come from the same tribe or worship the same god. Perhaps the techs you research could determine what civ you become.

Ex: The tribe of Tali- They research horseback riding and become Hippus if they research Exploration? they can split off and become the Austerin.

2) Dual Axis Alignments- A better broader alignments system is coming (hopefully) and with it we should probably introduce another Axis. (Lawful<--->Chaotic) It could have an impact on stability too as well as normal alignment concepts such as diplomacy and units.

Tasunke

Aug 18, 2009, 10:20 PM

cyther

Aug 19, 2009, 04:02 PM

Yea, I have the feeling that units in a Chaotic army would vary from wildly powerful to cowardly and weak. A way of implementing it could be after battle, to have a chance to gain a boost promo or a nerf promo, (eg strong or weak, although I would rather it be a percentage boost/nerf that replaces each other)

wheras a lawful army would be considerably more organized, and the paragon for stacks of bland, flavorless units (although predictable)

Also, I think supermages on a pure evil should get an extra entropy 4 spell slot, while pure good should get an extra spirit 4 spell slot.

on the same note, Lawful would have an extra Law slot, and Chaotic would have an extra Chaos slot.

In addition, It would be interesting if spirit users of Evil nations got the weak promo, entropy users in a good nation would get a weak (or tainted) promo (tainted would -1 str +1 unholy damage, 20% withdraw, 10 or 20% chance to turn barb (or infernal) after combat).

Interesting. I love everything except for the part about magic. Magic is shown to be able to be used by both good and evil nations in both a good and evil way.

The Elohim use spirit magic to help people and to inspire, empathize, ect.

On the other hand perhaps one of the most evil archmages of all time, Laroth uses spirit magic to steal the souls of his victims and use them to create items to aid him in his quest to become the god of Death and to trick others into helping him as well.

Tasunke

Aug 19, 2009, 06:15 PM

very well, maybe good entropy users could get tainted + flanking, while evil spirit users get weak and magic resistant. Just a thought. Generally weaker but something special for sticking with it.

I have another thought for Patria. Patrian Archmages can sacrifice themselves (or maybe a mundane lv 6 unit) to create a raw mana node on a tile. A Patrian Super mage can infuse himself with an upgraded node to gain that fourth level spell. This process destroys the node, but they can sacrifice the souls of their brave warriors to gain more portals to the gems of magic/creation.

lemonjelly

Aug 22, 2009, 11:36 AM

@ Tasunke, I like your patria ideas!

@ cypher - have you played a game with the new dll?
- when I did, when the city went to grow to size 5, the game crashed.

@ all modders - I am having troubles playing. It all loads, but on turn 1, it says that I have founded AV, would I like to switch, then that I have been destroyed, then, if I am playing a minor leader, before the AV pop-up, I have all of the trait pop-ups. Attached are my XML and Python folders.

@ 2Hydroclopse - we have the dll and a few XML/Python changes. That is it. I like the name, and feel free to take ideas and ask questions.

@ Opera - how hard would it be to import the stuff you put into Orbis into this Mod? Specifically the custom Diplo modifiers for leaders? Could I add this in?

@ cypher (again) - could you add the above in if Opera lets us?

CHANGELOG
This is a .rtf file listing all of the changes I have added so far. I will not release this version, but attached are the XML and Python changes, the map and the dll are posted above, and with a few art tweaks, you should be able to *cough*figure out how to play it*cough*

x

lemonjelly

Aug 22, 2009, 11:40 AM

Changelog for Fallen Ages (Current Version - Acolyte)
Blue = Changes To Old Stuff
Red = Bugs, Errors, Glitches
Pink = New Stuff

Version Acolyte - Let The Modding Commence
This version is a prototype. It has lots of changes in, but they are rather small ones. It is also rather Amurite-heavy. :P

~ An Error Message On Startup Referring To A 'ERA_ANCIENT' Tag In BCoC_CIV4SpellInfos.xml (Bannor Chain Of Command).
~ Population Limits.
~ Age Of Dragons- 4
~ Age Of Magic- 50
~ Age Of Ice- 2
~ Age Of Rebirth- 6
~ Granary- +2
~ Smokehouse- +2
~ Growth- +2
~ Amurite Unique Units.
~ Bladewarper (Swordsman with FireX, Entropy 1, Channelling 2, 50% versus Warriors, Strength 3, 1 Lightning Damage and a custom spell, but with a cost of 80 hammers).
~ Magree (Hunter with Poisoned Blade and Nature 1).
~ Firebow (Channeling 2, FireX, Earth1, Firebow).
~ Firebow Promotion (Gets Caster XP, +1 Fire Strength, Blocks Ability To Get Death2, Force2).
~ Ignite Spell (Creates A Fireball With Weak Promotion)
~ Fireball Spell (Requires Fire2, Firebow. Creates A Fireball With Strong).
~ Amurites start with an Adept instead of a Warrior.
~ Amurite World Spell requires Sorcery, to stop the AI casting it on the first turn.
~ Mana Allow Promotions.
~ Effect promotions.
~ Randomly given out to Amurite units.
~ If you have the right mana, you may learn the level 1 for that sphere.
~ E.g. Amurite Warrior has MetamagicX and WaterX.
Amurite Warrior destroys Barbarian Warrior.
Amurite Warrior gains 10 XP.
Amurites have: Metamagic, Death, Enchantment Mana.
Amurite Warrior, because it has the promotion (Metamagic X), and the Mana, (Metamagic) can choose to gain a level and learn Metamagic 1.
~ Hell terrain now spreads to: (Python)
~ Ashen Veil lands at AC 0.
~ Unowned lands at AC 15.
~ Evil lands at AC 35.
~ Neutral lands at AC 50.
~ Good lands at AC 80.

x

black_imperator

Aug 23, 2009, 11:06 AM

first work on the aifons explained on this thread : http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8389283&postcount=237

cyther

Aug 23, 2009, 12:35 PM

@ cypher - have you played a game with the new dll?
- when I did, when the city went to grow to size 5, the game crashed.

Odd, could it be connected to the Civ4lerts? I changed something in there but it doesn't look like it was included in your files. The process stops growth, maybe something connected with food buildings that give you more food.

@ all modders - I am having troubles playing. It all loads, but on turn 1, it says that I have founded AV, would I like to switch, then that I have been destroyed, then, if I am playing a minor leader, before the AV pop-up, I have all of the trait pop-ups. Attached are my XML and Python folders.

Didn't get that. Although on turn two everything turned into ice...
Edit: != means not. On line 960 of the eventmanager you have the AoI ice spread to occur unless it is the Age of Ice.

@ cypher (again) - could you add the above in if Opera lets us?

I was planning on adding them anyways if she lets us use them.

Changelog for Fallen Ages (Current Version - Acolyte)
Blue = Changes To Old Stuff
Red = Bugs, Errors, Glitches
Pink = New Stuff

Version Acolyte - Let The Modding Commence
This version is a prototype. It has lots of changes in, but they are rather small ones. It is also rather Amurite-heavy. :P

~ An Error Message On Startup Referring To A 'ERA_ANCIENT' Tag In BCoC_CIV4SpellInfos.xml (Bannor Chain Of Command).
~ Population Limits.
~ Age Of Dragons- 4
~ Age Of Magic- 50
~ Age Of Ice- 2
~ Age Of Rebirth- 6
~ Granary- +2
~ Smokehouse- +2
~ Growth- +2
~ Amurite Unique Units.
~ Bladewarper (Swordsman with FireX, Entropy 1, Channelling 2, 50% versus Warriors, Strength 3, 1 Lightning Damage and a custom spell, but with a cost of 80 hammers).
~ Magree (Hunter with Poisoned Blade and Nature 1).
~ Firebow (Channeling 2, FireX, Earth1, Firebow).
~ Firebow Promotion (Gets Caster XP, +1 Fire Strength, Blocks Ability To Get Death2, Force2).
~ Ignite Spell (Creates A Fireball With Weak Promotion)
~ Fireball Spell (Requires Fire2, Firebow. Creates A Fireball With Strong).
~ Amurites start with an Adept instead of a Warrior.
~ Amurite World Spell requires Sorcery, to stop the AI casting it on the first turn.
~ Mana Allow Promotions.
~ Effect promotions.
~ Randomly given out to Amurite units.
~ If you have the right mana, you may learn the level 1 for that sphere.
~ E.g. Amurite Warrior has MetamagicX and WaterX.
Amurite Warrior destroys Barbarian Warrior.
Amurite Warrior gains 10 XP.
Amurites have: Metamagic, Death, Enchantment Mana.
Amurite Warrior, because it has the promotion (Metamagic X), and the Mana, (Metamagic) can choose to gain a level and learn Metamagic 1.
~ Hell terrain now spreads to: (Python)
~ Ashen Veil lands at AC 0.
~ Unowned lands at AC 15.
~ Evil lands at AC 35.
~ Neutral lands at AC 50.
~ Good lands at AC 80.

x

Good changes, I didn't get the Bannor chain of commands error though. Perhaps we're using different versions of FF or FF+.

first work on the aifons explained on this thread : http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8389283&postcount=237

Looks cool, can't wait to see how it comes out.

lemonjelly

Aug 23, 2009, 12:45 PM

Okayy thanks. I'v had both errors before.

Good to know that it does actually work.

I will back it up and re-install. FFH has always been a bit buggy on my computer.

Thanks.

Oh and good news about the ice thing. I will change it, the != was an error, but at least I know it works now.

x

cyther

Aug 23, 2009, 12:50 PM

Also there is something wrong with the code that you used to cover lakes and oceans with ice. You need a reference to pPlot in there or it will fail.

lemonjelly

Aug 23, 2009, 12:55 PM

Urm... where?

I copied the code from the End Of Winter option, so it should work.

And, if ERA_AGE_OF_MAGIC has a Population Limit of 50, and you move to ERA_AGE_OF_ICE, which has a Population Limit of 4, will all of your cities automatically shrink to size 4?

x

cyther

Aug 23, 2009, 12:58 PM

Err... Line 962 python error I think that is where it is.

The cities will not shrink down to size 4. That could probably be done in python though so that whenever the era becomes AoI the cities take a huge blast in pop.

lemonjelly

Aug 23, 2009, 01:23 PM

Okay. The Jotnar code should work. And then the dll will stop them from growing.
Oh, and the two pics attached to the post above will (hopefully) be a leader for the once-elves and a good leader for the lanun.

And, I think that leaders should be able to change through the game. Is this possible?

And thanks. I will change it.

cyther

Aug 23, 2009, 03:10 PM

I could probably make it so that leaders could change. I'll try to write something up tomorrow that allows python to change leaders and civilizations.

lemonjelly

Aug 23, 2009, 03:32 PM

Oh, okay thanks.
And, btw, great work on the map! I use it in all of my games.

And, when I finally get to play again, after re-installing Civ IV, I will fix the python thing and mess about with populations.

Also, in EraInfos, the pop. limits, if I don't want a pop. limit, would -1 work, or should I just put 99 or something?

x

Opera

Aug 23, 2009, 03:37 PM

I guess 0 would do the trick.

You can use the leaders relations, yes :)

lemonjelly

Aug 23, 2009, 03:42 PM

THANK YOU OPERA!

Now... Cypher, would you kindly add it in for me? please?

And, thanks, I will try 0.

x

cyther

Aug 23, 2009, 03:45 PM

Hmm, I didn't put in a way to give a limitless poplimit. I think 99, 100 or anything else really high would work as only fallow civs could get up there so it would work with them for now. I'll make zero work when I make a new DLL tomorrow.

Edit: Leader Relations might take a while. I'll see what parts I can get in before tomorow.

Opera

Aug 23, 2009, 03:48 PM

@cyther: Leaders Relations are very straightforward to add. New file, new schema, new class in the DLL.

lemonjelly

Aug 23, 2009, 03:56 PM

Okay, thanks. And it only applies to the Age Of Magic at the moment.

And, thanks cyther, there isn't a rush, take as much time as you need.

And, what can we expect in tomorrows release?
Pure amazing awesomeness knowing you, cyther.

x

EDIT: Sorry, cyther, but I keep on spelling your name wrong. I don't mean it, I just keep on forgeting. Sorry.

cyther

Aug 23, 2009, 04:07 PM

I probably will be able to merge in Leader relations and a bunch of Opera's other improvements. Probably hated civic and hated wonder (is that in yet? might have to just create it myself).

Also I'll merge in a bunch of the ModComps you pointed out and add the ability to change leader and civ in python.

Lastly if I have time I'll try to merge Piece of Mind's Advanced combat odds. (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=310415) It is a simple little thing that I really enjoy using.

Opera

Aug 23, 2009, 04:11 PM

Not yet. But if you do create it, you might as well give FavoriteWonder an XML value rather than the hardcoded current +4. I'll do that too :)

lemonjelly

Aug 23, 2009, 04:49 PM

Well, I think that thay are good ideas, and if you want to use any of them Opera, you can.

but I'm sure cyther wouldn't have any objections to you borrowing any of our code.

All modders helping each other, that's what I believe.

And, thanks again cyther. I could never do any of the dll work you're doing for us.

x

cyther

Aug 24, 2009, 10:42 AM

Bah, changing a leader or civ of a player in python is taking too much of my time the next DLL will not have that in it.
Edit: Got Leader Relations working as well as hated civic.
Edit2: Hmm, Changing the civ and leader worked the whole time.

cyther

Aug 24, 2009, 05:47 PM

Finished the new DLL here is what I got done before I started to hallucinate header files moving just outside of my sight :crazyeye::

Buildings that change the Population Limit display the change.

New Python:

pPlayer.setCivilizationType(Any Player, Any Civ)
pPlayer.setLeaderType(Any Player, Any Leader)

New XML:

Leader Relations- See Leader Relations file for info
New Hated Civics and Hated Wonders- See Cassiel for how hatedCivics are handled, hatedWonders are exactly the same.

lemonjelly

Aug 24, 2009, 06:03 PM

thanks loads cyther!

will look at this!
And play after Civ4 is reinstalled.
x

cyther

Aug 25, 2009, 03:55 PM

Just one thing about the setCiv and setLeader. You should use an iPlayer, pPlayer as in gc.getPlayer(iPlayer) or it will cause python errors.

lemonjelly

Sep 12, 2009, 12:14 PM

Hey, cyther, could you post the source code for me?

Thanks
x

cyther

Sep 13, 2009, 07:00 AM

Here you go. Hope this is is everything I changed.

lemonjelly

Sep 13, 2009, 07:27 AM

Thanks Cyther.

x

cyther

Oct 23, 2009, 01:01 PM

Here's an updated DLL and schema.

Valkrionn

Oct 23, 2009, 01:06 PM

It'll just need to be updated again in a few days. ;)

Although I have an up to date download for the changed DLL files in the first post of the Download thread.... Only adding one more thing it looks like, and it'll be a small tweak.

Tasunke

Oct 24, 2009, 11:17 PM

looks like the DLL has grown in size 4x ... should we be expecting any playable beta's soon?

Psychic_Llamas

Oct 25, 2009, 02:16 AM

*excitement* :D

cyther

Oct 25, 2009, 06:41 AM

I made something interesting yesterday. ;) I'm showing it to lemonjelly today to see what he thinks about it.

blade117

Oct 25, 2009, 03:59 PM

I won't even bother asking what it is.

cyther

Oct 25, 2009, 05:40 PM

I'm finished anyways. Here it is.

I would suggest playing as the Bannor, Patria, Lanun, or Illians.

You need to put the files in the right places and the Scenario is coded to only play in the "Fallen Ages" mod folder.

(There are some python errors on start up. They don't break anything. Expect many if you play as Patria.)

lemonjelly

Oct 26, 2009, 11:35 AM

Sorry tasunke, no betas until I can get the python to work =[
Wow! I will play with this tonight, thanks Cyther!

Oh, I started coding Patria last night, this should help loads!

Oh, Cyther, could you make a python file for the Civ/Leader switching please? Just an example, because I can't get it to work... =[

Thanks =]

cyther

Oct 26, 2009, 12:53 PM

There is no file needed, the code I used was short:

def doTurnTheFallofPatria(self):

iBannor = gc.getInfoTypeForString('CIVILIZATION_BANNOR')
iClan = gc.getInfoTypeForString('CIVILIZATION_CLAN_OF_EMBE RS')
for iPlayer in range(gc.getMAX_PLAYERS()):
pPlayer = gc.getPlayer(iPlayer)
if pPlayer.isAlive():
if pPlayer.isHuman():
if gc.getGame().getGameTurn() == 300:
if pPlayer.getCivilizationType() == iBannor:
pPlayer.setCivilizationType(iPlayer, iClan)
pPlayer.setLeaderType(iPlayer, gc.getInfoTypeForString('LEADER_JONAS'))

lemonjelly

Oct 26, 2009, 01:03 PM

Thanks =]

lemonjelly

Oct 26, 2009, 01:30 PM

Oh, now I have that and some other cool code (thanks black_imperator) you can expect a beta release much sooner. Still a while away yet. Depends really, on what you expect in a beta release.

I can definately do civ switching, so may focus on the AoM-AoI-AoR to begin with, and add the others later, because adding in 21 civs is too much work for me atm xD

blade117

Oct 27, 2009, 02:32 PM

Yes! Fallen Ages FTW!

lemonjelly

Oct 30, 2009, 09:35 PM

FALLEN AGES NEEDS
YOU!

Yes, you! Post what you would like in a beta release please.

Nothing too hard. Apart from that, post it, and I will consider adding it. Oh, and if you want to speed the release up, there are 21 spells to be coded =] ideas are on the previous pages somewhere xD

And, if there is something you want added that is just XML, make a module, and chances are, I will include it with the main beta download.

Basically, the more help I get, the faster I can release and get this out of beta.

lemonjelly

Nov 01, 2009, 06:10 AM

Everybody say thanks to black_imperator! He has coded loads of spells for me, and a special feature, that I think is rather cool =]

blade117

Nov 01, 2009, 10:15 AM

Thanks black_imperator.

Fluesterwitz

Nov 04, 2009, 07:11 AM

So say we all!

lemonjelly

Nov 04, 2009, 06:40 PM

black_imperator has done it again. Yey for new spells and fixing old bugs =]

I still need an updated dll and would like some source files so I can (try to) keep it updated myself.

Oh, and I asked Pazyryk whether I could merge Elohim Guardians into Fallen Ages =]

I may borrow (steal ;)) some stuff from LENA if:
1] Opera lets me
2] I can be bothered
3] I can find something I like that isn't or won't be in RiFE in 1.12 or the next patches :lol:

Valkrionn

Nov 04, 2009, 06:59 PM

What did you want to take from LENA? Think I got alot of it already. :lol:

lemonjelly

Nov 05, 2009, 01:50 AM

cyther

Nov 05, 2009, 11:25 AM

I can get a new DLL ready for tomorrow but that isn't certain.

Here is something special for you, lemonjelly:

Valkrionn

Nov 05, 2009, 01:03 PM

Well, I would want to put Espionage back in, but no idea how hard that is =]

Urm, Civilization Traits:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8123721&postcount=3

Agricultural
Greedy
Scientific
Opportunistic
Trader
Centaur
Peaceful

And, if I can add espionage back in:
Sly =]

-----

But, I got permission from Pazyryk to add Elohim Guardians in! :eekdance::eekdance::eekdance:

Agricultural is in, in a stronger form... Look at the female centaur, forget her name.

Opportunistic is in already.

Trader is not, but it's an easy one.. The tags needed are used in Merchant.

Centaur is done using python, I believe.

Peaceful would need DLL work, think it's the only one. ;) Aside from Sly, of course. :lol:

Espionage was something I'd always disliked, so barring a total rewrite of the system I wouldn't put it back in... Unless there's a compelling reason for it, which there may be soon... :lol:

How are you going to work in Elohim Guardians? I dislike the mod, mostly because of the Asian-sounding names when they're based of European monks. :lol: I would, at the least, allow them 3-4 normal cities in addition to those spawned. That way they have a defendable core to the empire.

cyther

Nov 07, 2009, 10:27 AM

Here's a DLL for Valk's current version. I made no changes but you get his now.

lemonjelly

Nov 07, 2009, 05:57 PM

Ahh, thanks =] Downloaded =]

Do you mind posting the source code, or emailing it to me? I don't mind which, whatever one is easier =]

cyther

Nov 07, 2009, 09:13 PM

Sure, here is everything I might have touched.

I'm also taking down everything except the current source code and DLL.

lemonjelly

Nov 13, 2009, 10:49 PM

Thanks for the dll. I added some stuff in and

IT COMPILED CORRECTLY!

Yey! So, I just need civ/leader switches to be coded in. I'm thinking that would be easier in dll/XML, but I have no idea:
1] How to set it out
2] How to code it

But, yeah, I CAN COMPILE DLL NOW! =]

blade117

Nov 14, 2009, 10:31 AM

w00t!

IceFire9yt

Nov 14, 2009, 01:36 PM

I'd consider in the age of dragons and creation to start everyone off as minor civs (from the Revolution mod). Everyone starts out at war with everyone else, and you research a specific tech (possibly the one that starts the age of magic) to conduct diplomacy.

You might also consider using the revolutions dynamic with Patria's fall.

blade117

Nov 14, 2009, 04:30 PM

Both good ideas.

arcticnightwolf

Dec 22, 2009, 10:42 AM

:bump: ... hello ? anyone here ?

Deon

Dec 22, 2009, 12:28 PM

@ Bring back the Aifons.

...

@ Teach the AI to use it.

It would be the hardest part for me if I did it :).

black_imperator

Dec 22, 2009, 12:31 PM

concerning the Aifons i am working on them ( waiting for Valk's work on the Bezeri cause there are things i'll use too, hopefully a start of sea ai ^^ ).

I still need art though

Valkrionn

Dec 22, 2009, 01:15 PM

concerning the Aifons i am working on them ( waiting for Valk's work on the Bezeri cause there are things i'll use too, hopefully a start of sea ai ^^ ).

I still need art though

The Bezeri will be worked on soonish, just need to clean up the xml, add stuff for Vermicious, then the New Featuretm. THEN the Bezeri. :goodjob:

cyther

Dec 22, 2009, 05:20 PM

:bump: ... hello ? anyone here ?

I'm lurking but I haven't seen Lemonjelly for a while.

lemonjelly

Dec 24, 2009, 10:35 AM

Yeah, I had a little break... whoops...

Anyways, I'm back now, and have lots of new ideas, and a word document with stuff on =]

Basically, I think I got too sidetracked before, so I want to just focus on the rise and fall aspect. But, I still don't get the DLL, so I need somebody else to do it lmaoo

lemonjelly

Dec 31, 2009, 07:22 PM

Right, so, anybody want to help?

What do you want in the first version?

I have made some progress in my learning of Python =] (See Pieces Of Heaven thread :P )

Anybody still here? Cyther, black_imperator, you still want to help with this?

:D

blade117

Dec 31, 2009, 09:44 PM

the New Featuretm:goodjob:

Question Mark. Was this revealed yet (or am I getting too hopeful.) Qu'est que-ce?

lemonjelly

Dec 31, 2009, 09:48 PM

You'd have to ask Valkrionn. It wasn't for Fallen Ages, but it may have been the Chaotic-Lawful alignment axis.

And, what would you like to see in the first version of Fallen Ages? :D

Valkrionn

Jan 01, 2010, 12:09 PM

Question Mark. Was this revealed yet (or am I getting too hopeful.) Qu'est que-ce?

It was not. And won't be until it's finished, for once. ;)

As it is, we're still in the 'Cleanup' phase of that process. Then the week or so of coding for Vermicious, then the New FeatureTM. :mischief:

lemonjelly

Jan 01, 2010, 12:15 PM

Hmm... a feature I don't know about?

Curiouser and curiouser.

Who is still willing to help? And, what do you want in the 1st version?

Valkrionn

Jan 01, 2010, 12:16 PM

Actually, I believe you do as it's been mentioned in #Erebus, and in the team group which you have access to. ;)

lemonjelly

Jan 01, 2010, 12:20 PM

/me runs off to check the group.

EDIT: Damn chat lmao

Right so... what one of the civs that I need to add has the biggest amount of unique and interesting stuff?

EDIT2: Ahh, I knew about that... I forgot lmao, but, its very interesting :D

arcticnightwolf

Jan 01, 2010, 03:32 PM

/me hugs Lemonized_Jelly
/me hugs Valkrionn
/me wishes them all best to new year 2010

/me is fascinated by Fallen Age

/me checks Fall Further Plus group
/me thinks it's all awsum

/me runs back to #erebus

lemonjelly

Feb 02, 2010, 02:22 PM

I'm back after a couple of breaks from modding.

And, I need a feature to mod, so I thought of adding in civilizations and putting them up for release while black_imperator works on the stability code.

So, I was thinking, and I want to work on the Bannor from the Age of Magic, thing is, I don't know a lot of lore "/

I have some ideas:
Good, Lawful
Spiritual
Fire Mana
Law Mana
UB Courthouse/Temple cross
New Religion needed
Peaceful, Defender
Beautiful cities
Unique cross-sphere fire spells.

So, I need ideas on buildings and stuff that tie in with the lore and ideas posted above. I need ideas for leaders, pictures and everything. So, I'm asking for help.

Tasunke

Feb 02, 2010, 03:10 PM

The Bannor used mobs of Peasants to hunt and kill powerful mages, as well as their priests wielding powerful Fire burning with the Passion of Faith. I would say something reminding me of Mobs that chace people with pitchforks and hang people.

Probably a Xenophobic Civ-Trait, a Populist Trait (either through diplomacy or warfare), and also spiritual (priest magic) ways to both quell the populace (unyielding order) and burninate the heretic (pillar of fire).

I think they should have a Civic available at some mid-early game tech (of the Age of Magic Era) which spawn "peasant mobs" from farms and all cottage improvmements. Say, 3 strength and can use copper, with 20% magic resistance. Their priests of Bhall should be able to use Courage spell and Fireball, while their high-priest should be able to use Valor, Unyielding Order, and Pillar of Fire.

Their Courthouse UB should be a Guillotine, and their Dungeon UB should be a PIT of FIRE (to throw the heretics into)

The Patrians on the Other hand, would be in some ways the complete opposite. their mages would come in two folds ... summoners and sorcerors.

The summoner would start with twincast, and they would pass their combat promotions directly to their summons.

The Sorceror would start with Enchanted Staff as a unique spell, or simply enchantment 3, as well as magic immune.

With death and mind mana, the Patrians will be able to Build a Unique wonder to them called the Tower of Arrogance. The city with Tower of Arrogance allows all units to start with channeling I and II, as well as allow the building of the National unit the "Technocrat" the Technocrat would be immortal, magic immune, -50% enemy resistance, as well as start with Death III, Mind III, and twincast. This national unit would have a limit of 2. The technocrat would also be of the arcane combat-type, as well as posses channelling I-III, as well as start with the rust and slow spells.

The Rebels would start with the Magic-Resistance civ-trait, as well as all units starting with courage, and first strike.

The archer UU of the Rebellion would be the crossbow. It would be funtionally the same, except for start with 5 extra first strikes.

The leader of the Rebellion would, of course, be Kylorin. Agressive, Organized, and (instead of arcane) raiders.

The Rebels would appear in the late magical age, somewhere near the Patrians (or inside Patrian land). The leader of Patria woulid switch from Kylorin to Perpentach (most likely). And this Perpentach's traits would be Arcane, Philosophical, and (something related to mind control .... financial? magic resistant?) ... the third trait would Hopefully be something called Alluring, which would give the Allure promotion to all (living) units, and allow enemy units a 15% chance of converting upon defeat.

The Alphar would be one united force, with Sinister Assasins, Dextrous Archers, and Illusionists. The leader would be Arendel Phaedra @ philosophical/Defensive and Neutral. (to represent the balance between the two halves, not just her) During these glory days, the Elven racial promotion would grant +50% forest strength and +100% ancient forest strength. Also the ancient forest upgrade mechanic and the treant-spawn mechanic would be tied directly to the Alphar nation (as opposed to FOL), and FoL would be founded upon the building of Evermore.

The Aiphons would all start with the amphibious and water-walking trait, as well as have a hunter UU who starts with Mezmerize Ocean Animal. @ Fanatacism they should be allowed to build the Leviathan, and at the destruction of the Aiphons, the Leviathan becomes barbarian (or if he is not alive, a new Barbarian Leviathan is borne). If the Leviathan is not currently alive, exploring Aiphons Isle should give a 10% chance of re-awakening the Leviathan.

Their cavalry would ride Sea-Snakes while their recon units would ride sea-horses. Their recon would also be allowed Water-Stealth (and potentially marksman and HN mask abilities) Their recon units wouldn't be able to leave the Ocean, while their Mounted line could slither onto land at a detriment of -20% strength. (an extra -30% in desert or ice). Sea snakes would also gain a +15% strength in Marshland, as well as a +10% strength in jungle.

Valkrionn

Feb 02, 2010, 03:14 PM

Actually, at the time innocent people would be unharmed by holy fire. So some kind of spell which 'judges' units based on their religion would be good.

MagisterCultuum

Feb 02, 2010, 03:16 PM

The Bannor were the largest and most powerful of the factions of the Patrian Civil war. Their patron goddess was Bhall, and their essence was passion. They were a very warlike civ (less peaceful than the modern Bannor), who wielded the holy flames indiscriminately against guilty and innocent, knowing Bhall would sort things out and her flames would consume the evil while providing only pleasant warmth for the innocent. Fire was judge, jury, and executioner. I suspect they forced their children to walk through fire in what after Bhall's fall would certainly be human sacrifice, but at the time it was harmless to those not living in significant sin. (It has been claimed that fire never hurt the innocent before Bhall's fall, yet has also been stated that during the Godswar the innocent were sometimes harmed by fire not directed at them. I choose to think that most flames could hurt the innocent, but Bhall took care that Holy Flame taken from her temple would not.)

They were well on their way to crushing the remnants of all evil civs when their goddess fell. They had spread the worship of Bhall throughout Erebus, giving her perhaps as many worshipers as all other gods combined. They were allies with the elves, or perhaps even the masters in a voluntary vassalage agreement. Braduk was a multi-ethnic holy city, which drew pilgrims from all the world. (Personally, I prefer to think that only the Clan of Embers are descended from actual Bannor humans, while other Orcs are from their human vassals, and Goblins and Ogres from their vassals of other races. Kael considers then all former humans though.)

The last king of the Bannor was Khorde NuValle, and his wife was Mellony NuValle (I'm not sure of the spelling). In the D&D campaigns on which FfHt was based, Khorde was good friends with Orthus. He frequently drank and gambled with the future Orcish warlord, who at the time may have been a young Bannor nobleman.

The Bannor Capital of Braduk was most known as the home of the greatest temple of Bhall, which held the Eternal Flame. This temple complex and the much smaller but still huge) royal palace of NuValle dominated the inner city, which is the part of Braduk that would eventually be dragged into hell and replaced with a giant burning crater. Bhall's clergy was exclusively female. Her high priestess carried a sacred staff known as the Matron Essendi, which would later be stolen and serve as the haft of Orthus's Axe.

Junil had no real religion at the time, but he had small shrines in many Temples of Bhall, and probably a medium sized temple among in the temple complex at Braduk. Bhall and Junil were the closest of allies, so he was revered by many who worshiped her, including those he sent Sabathiel to lead out of hell.

Bhall represented passion, especially but not only righteous indignation and a passion to right injustices. The Bannor were great warriors, but perhaps even greater poets. They were famous for their heroic epics and ballads of love. Their language was considered ideal for beautifully expressing intense emotions. It is unpronounceable by most Orcs, but the Bhall-Orcs (hags descended from Bhall's old priesthood, who continue to act as such to their now evil goddess) and a few Shamen still speak it. The modern Bannor tongue is closer to it, but has been stripped down to be a harsh, quick, and utilitarian tongue best suited for barking orders to soldiers instead of expressing love.

I personally like to think that The Empyrean was once the name of her faith, and her heaven. The word means "highest heaven" or more literally "heaven of fire." Her heaven was torn asunder during her fall, with portions of it falling to Erebus, portions into hell, and probably most of it being joined to Lugus's heaven when he accepted her Seraphim into his service. Lugus had a religion in the Age of Dragons and likely much of the Age of Magic, but I get the impression that the Calabim of that age (whose only connection to the modern Calabim is Alexis and Flauros) succeeded in exterminating the faith of their old nemesis. Lugus was probably among the weakest gods of the late Age of Magic, as he did not have worshipers through whom to act.