The next in the world map series...
Civ = Brazil!
Difficulty = Monarch
All victory conditions are enabled, even the horrid Diplomatic that I consider a loss. However, the only victory condition we will accept is CONQUEST. Domination is NOT possible with the no Tundra city change.

Playing
LKendter
Dark Sheer (needs to confirm)
meldor (needs to confirm)
Jersey Joe (already confirmed)
OPEN SLOT


Don't sign up if you don't have previous experience with HUGH maps


I was able to upgrade Bef to Mech infantry. Wierd game ending - I signed a RoP with Aztes to connect oil in Cananda. America declares war to steal the workers. I then declare war on China to kill a unit that of China that was in the road to build a colony on oil to finish the test. :crazyeye:


I still do want the Jersey_Joe test to finish as a low priority. I am starting another test to see if I fixed the wrong Diplomacy face with Australia and the Industrial age crash.


I really haven't mentioned game playing guidelines with the LK series, but I feel that I am overdue to do so.
The following tactics are NOT allowed in the LK series games: RoP Rape, RoP Abuse (irragating all tiles with a city building wonders), False Peace Treaties (must wait for the 20 years to end), Declaring War to break trade deals, False Alliances (ally with several people vs. a civ then peace with that civ), and other actions that completely abuse the AI limited diplomacy ability.


==========================================
The current history:
V6 - Move Aztecs one square south, slight terrain improvement.
Privateer movement up to 4.
Brazil is not allowed regular infantry.
Fixed crash with Diplomacy and Australia when they are in the Industrial age.



V5 - Playtest showed issue with Tundra. Forest on Tundra = forest.
To limit cities, I must make all Tundra without forest.
Minor improvement to Russian starting position.
The bad thing of stealing a country - I left Brazil with Samuria - switching to regular knights.
Switch America to regular fighter
Added new culure levels: 1.5 to 1 = very impressed, 2.5 to 1 = Great Admirers


V4 - Slightly improved the Greek starting position.
Removed Japan as a civ.
With the elimination of Japan, removed game and 3 goody huts near China.
Added another barb camp near China.
Japna is replaced by Brazil - Industrious and Relgious.
Goverment Leader = Dom Pedro de Alcântara (the emperor when Brazil was recognized as an independent country)
Great Leaders:
Gen. Eurico Gaspar Dutra (ww2 general)
João Baptista de Oliveira Figueredo (Brazilian general and politician, president of Brazil (1979-85)).
Cândido Mariano da Silva Rondon (Brazilian explorer and founder of the Indian Protection Service. A major in the army. The

Brazilian state of Rondônia is named after him.)
Jose Joaquim da Silva Xavier (the leader of the Inconfidência Mineira, a movement against Portuguese rule in late 1780's)
José Bonifácio de Andrada e Silva (known as the "Patriarch of Independence" in Brazil)
Unique Unit = Bef (Brazilian Expeditionary Force) from WWII.
>>>> Cities are NO longer allowed in Tundra . <<<


V3 - Deleted 3 wheat around India to weaken the position.
Deleted 2 cattle around China to weaken the position.
Change the leader of Australia to Menzies and setup as a male.
Middle / Industrial age ship movement up by 1: Caravel, Frigate, Galleon, Ironclad
Modern Era ship movement up by 2: Transport, submarine, destroyer, battleship, Aegis Cruiser, Nuke Sub
Special: Carrier up by 3 - these ships were just as fast as battleships, if not faster.
F15 is removed - new USA unique unit USMC: 10 attack, 8 defense.


V2 - Added Australia. After playtest, improved the Australlian landmass slightly.
Improved the Babylonian position by removing point-blank barb camp, slight terrain improvement.
Placed a horse into America.


V1 - Took a copy of Marla Singer's Map, and cut back on coast squares that are out of reach for the sake of domination.

Removed several Ice only islands.

I am in.....

Playing
LKendter
Dark Sheer (needs to confirm) <<<
meldor (already confirmed)
Jersey Joe (already confirmed)
OPEN SLOT

If Dark Sheer confirms shortly, I will post the first turn in 10 hours. I already complete it ;)

I would like to get at least 4 people, then I will start this one.

Thanx for the invitation - I'm in!

[dance]

I will post the game tonight. My turn is already done. 30 turns to get it rolling, and 3 cities built.


Will still accept a 5th player
I now have incentive for the next variation - play as the Moors. Western Africa will have a civ ;) One leader is known - special unit will be a improved knight.

I really haven't mentioned game playing guidelines with the LK series, but I feel that I am overdue to do so.
The following tactics are NOT allowed in the LK series games: RoP Rape, RoP Abuse (irragating all tiles with a city building wonders), False Peace Treaties (must wait for the 20 years to end), Declaring War to break trade deals, False Alliances (ally with several people vs. a civ then peace with that civ), and other actions that completely abuse the AI limited diplomacy ability.

4000 BC - Salvador is formed.
I begin research on Alphabet a minimum science.

3950 BC - Pop the nearby goody hut before our first military, and we get a conscript warrior.

3700 BC - Pop a goody hut and get $25.

3500 BC - Pop goody hut #3 and angry warriors.
(I) Our conscript survives and becomes a regular.

3350 BC - Pop goody hut #4 and another conscript warrior.

3250 BC - Rio de Janeiro is formed.

3000 BC - Pop goody hut #5 and get maps.
(I) Tacitus most powerful nations rates us #2 - we will have to improve on that ;)

2800 BC - Pop goody hut #5 and more angry barbs. Is free tech to much to ask for?
Scratch 1 barb camp.
(I) The warrior becomes a vet and our palace expands with some nice pretty grass.

2630 BC - Our newly elite warrior frags a barb camp.

2550 BC - Brasilia is formed. It starts a temple to get 2 game squares on line.

-------------------------------------------------

Summary - The warrior in Central America is ready to contact the Aztecs soon.
After that, run through to America / Iroqoius. The faster we can get contacts, the faster to map making and visiting Europe.
Plus, Brazil could afford to buy a few workers ;)

I avoided research on pottery, as we can get it from America / Iroqoius. We want to get to MapMaking ASAP, and get contact

with Europe ASAP. Writing is probably the next tech.


LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M. (playing)
meldor (on deck)
Jersey Joe


20 turns FIRST ROUND ONLY - 24 hours for got it.
48 hours total.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-2550BC.zip


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-144.jpg
The begin of our empire. If we irragate the 3 white dots, we can quickly turn Brasilla into a shield powerhouse by getting

the hills on-line ASAP. This should hopefully be the city to build some key wonders line Sun Tzu and Leo's.

Oh how I hate cutting down woods next to rivers before railroad..... but i guess it ahs to be done with all that jungle around.... :(


got it!

some thoughts on city placing to the south. On a world map, we need strong coastal cities - so i started planning cities from norht to south and from the coast landwards. i tried minimizing overlap (as the worls is large enough), but also unused tiles.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32citiessouth1.jpg

red line: border of current cities after 1st expansion

blue dots: new city sites
blue line: borders for planned cities after 1st expansion

yellow dots: wasted tiles

pink dots: overlap tiles.

obviously, filler is not a place to settle right now.

Rather, Nos. 1,2,3 should have priority, since they are fast-grwoing locations. Filler will have a relatively high production, but needs serious worker-time investion before it will amount to anything.

I'll stay away from the jungle to the north for the moment.

version 2:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32version2.jpg


as you can see, this version eliminates the 'filler' problem, but gives two troublespots (red areas). I'll have a go with the first one, even if it misses out on the whale.

(1) Salvador builds a Warrior. Growth will be in 7, settler in 8 so a settler is ordered. I'd prefer to granary expansion scheme, but this seems OK, too. Order road to Dyes. We dispense a barb camp down south and get a promotion to regular.

(2) Two barbarian learn the hard way about terrain advantages.

(3) moves

(4) moves

(5) moves

(6) Rio builds a settler. He goes for '1' but will need tha Warrior from Salvador to go along and protet him. Dyes are hooked up at end turn.

(7) find two huts that can be opened next turn and the turn after that.

(8) Hut west of Brasilia gives Barbarians. At least, our warrior is in jungle..... The warrior leaves Brazilia to protect the settler. A border is sighted in the north.

(9) Our Warrior is now elite..... :D Salvador finishes a settler and starts a warrior. I decide not to open the htu and let the warrior heal to full strength.

(10) Alphabet found, Writing @ 10%. Brazilia completes a Temple and starts a Warrior. Contact with the Aztecs is established.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/aztecdeal.jpg
I take this deal (though i think the price is a little stiff). They asked for 270 Gold, btw...
the hut fills up our treasury with 25 Gold. :D

(11) Rio finishes a Warrior and starts a settler. I may change that to Granary though. Brazilia switched to Spearman since forest will be cut in 1. Hut discovered down south.

(12) Forest cleared -> non-bonus grassland :( Brazilia will finish Spear in two, then reassign work to cleared tiles to start growth. I will leave 1 forest untouched until a hill is mined.
Barbarians from the hut - what else?

(13) Warrior promoted to elite - when will those albino guys ever learn? :rolleyes: Salvador builds a Warrior (stays as MP) and starts a Granary. Then, we should pump out a few workers.
Brazilia finishes the Spearman. Now, the ciy can use the game/forest tile (which i will leave as is for the present). The Sper stays, the Warrior wanders west to explore and kill white rabbits... ah, white warriors ;)
Sao Paolo fouded in position '1'. Barb camp found - in plains. i already hear the clinks of gold coins.....
Monty asks me to remove our forces. he now has mysticism but won't trade it at all.

(14) nothing but a steady income - another 25 Gold. Our Warrior near Tenochtitlan or whatever that horrible places name is goes north - even if Monty kicks him out he kicks him to the 'right' side now - north! :D

(15) moves

(16) another non-bonus tile freed of forest.

(17) Rio builds a settler (goes south with escort) and starts a worker in 5. order road to gold-hill near Brazilia.

(18) Sao paolo finishes Warrior and starts worker. I decide NOT to pop a hut - after all we have a settler currently....

(19) moves

(20) pop the hut now :( - all around is explored - and get 50(!) Gold :D

Belo Horizonte is founded @ '2'.

State of the empire:

Salvadors bonus tiles can soon be mined by the worker building a road

across the hills from Brazilia and the one close to ready in Rio.
A settler and a warrior are underway, heading for '3'.

Monty is willing to sell either the Wheel or mysticism for a lot of money

- I will leave that decision to the next player (Don't! Make contact

first!!!!)

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK321725BC.zip

I see it and will start on it tonight.

LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
meldor (playing)
Jersey Joe (on deck)

Originally posted by Lt. 'Killer' M.

(10) Alphabet found, Writing @ 10%. Brazilia completes a Temple and starts a Warrior. Contact with the Aztecs is established.
I take this deal (though I think the price is a little stiff). They asked for 270 Gold, btw...
The hut fills up our treasury with 25 Gold. :D

(13) Salvador builds a Warrior (stays as MP) and starts a Granary. Then, we should pump out a few workers.

Monty is willing to sell either the Wheel or mysticism for a lot of money - I will leave that decision to the next player (Don't! Make contact first!!!!)


Turn 10: The price may be a bit high, but we got pottery. This gets us closer to the critical tech of map making. We want to be first to the Caribbean islands, and send at least one settler with escort toward Europe to get the option of buying workers from European Powers.

Turn 13 I agree 100% with Granary and workers for Salvador. We probably want to do the same with Rio. We do want to let Brasilia grow, as this is the best city for wonders. With 2 irrigated game we should have chance that when we make European of a city that can build Sun Tzu which is huge in a military game.

Techs - I agree, contact America / Iroquois first BERFORE more trading. Will drop the price a lot, plus 2 more sources of extra labor. We need every bit of help we can get for labor. Let's hope we can buy a few more workers ;)

We want to get some cities heading up the north coast along with a road net. This is the key to attacking Aztecs and winning the race for northern cities.

Thanx LK.... I'd still NOT irrigate the game as long as possible (as long as we are in despotism and the hills do NOT give more production than the forest).. :)

as soon as we go into a higher government form we then can use the forest chopping at an appropriate moment (i.e. when we are NOT building a wonder) and thus get the 2 times 10 prod from it....

What I want to do with that town is ASAP growth.
That is why I want the game to be irragated quickly.
4 food from 1 square lets us put 2 hills to work now.
I am trying to get the city large enough to build a wonder by the time we meet Europe.

1700 BC (1)
Movement
(I) Rio finishes worker and starts a Granary.

1675 Bc (2)
Frag a barb camp
(I) Sao Paulo finishes a worker, starts a barracks.

1650 BC (3)
Movement
(I) Brasilia finishes the Granary and starts a barracks.

1625-1575 (4-6)
Movement
(I) Salvador completes a Granary and starts a Settler.

1550 BC (7)
Fortaleza founded, starts a temple. Pop goodie hut, get Mysticism.
(I) Nada

1525 BC (8)
Find America, they will trade the wheel for 220g.
(I) Not very nice neighbors, Lincoln asks us to leave.

1500 BC (9)
Movement
(I) Belo Horizonte finishs a spear and starts a settler.

1475 BC (10)
Pop another goodie hut and get barbs.
(I) The Greeks complete the Colossus.

1450 BC (11)
Movement
(I) Salvador completes a settler and starts a Barracks. Brazilia finishes it's Barracks and starts a Spear.

1425-1375 BC (12-14)
Movement
(I) Brazilia finishes a Spear and start another.

1350 BC (15)
Movement, spot Iroquois border.
(I) Nada

1325 BC (16)
Nova Iguacu founded. Meet the Iroquois. Lincoln has been holding out on him. Get the wheel for Alphabet and 2g (all he had). We can now get Horseback Riding for 250g, but since our only horses are still a ways from our nearest city, I pass.
(I) Rio completes a Granary and starts a Settler. Fortaleza finishes a Temple and starts a Worker.

1300 BC (17)
Movement.
(I) Sao Paulo finishes a Barracks and starts a settler.

1275 BC (18)
Movement
(I) Salvador finishes a Barracks and starts a Spear. Fortaleza finishes its Worker and starts a Granary.

1250 BC (19)
Movement
(I) Belo completes a Settler and starts a Barracks.

1225 BC (20)
Movement.

State of the Onion:
Technology - Iroquois are the worst off. They are poor and still need Mysticism. We are next. The Aztecs have Horseback Riding, and the Americans have that and Ironworking. We are 9 turns from Writing and could use this to get both techs.

Cities - Three new ones and a settler moving south. There are two warriors near him to pick up escort.

Military - The two main cities will have two MPs within 2 turns. There is one warrior in Panama blocking the Aztecs (at least until Galleys appear) and a second one on the way up the west coast. When the second one gets there move the block one square west and use both warriors. A third warrior should be sent to move the block farther.

We should continue to expand like minks. The more cities the better. Lots of good food sites to the south, but we also need to spread along the northern coast and get the horses slightly inland. Without these horses we will be in deep doo.

LK32 1225 BC Saved Game (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-1225BC.zip)

I am a little slow lately, but is there a chance where I can still be part of it? :)

Originally posted by Dark Sheer
I am a little slow lately, but is there a chance where I can still be part of it? :)


You are in as #5. Just don't be a "little slow" with moves ;)
This is more encouragement to keep playing with the World Map series. I think we play as the Moors next and there 5-3-2 knights.



LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
meldor
Jersey Joe (playing)
Dark Sheer (on deck)


So far the one disapointment - no workers bought.

I would not build many troops in Salvardor. This city is food heavy, and we can still use more settlers and workers.

Originally posted by meldor
We should continue to expand like minks. The more cities the better. Lots of good food sites to the south, but we also need to spread along the northern coast and get the horses slightly inland. Without these horses we will be in deep doo.

We are 9 turns from Writing and could use this to get both techs.


I agree, we want to stay in mass expansion stage. I would like to snag the carribean islands for just us. Of course, we will need to keep sneaking in workers.

Actually, I would NOT give the AI Writing. The longer we keep them from Map Making the better. I would rather that we broker contact with Europe, rather then the other Americian powers make first contact. The big question: Can we get map making is less then 40 turns? We really want to find Europe.


@meldor :goodjob: Our wonder building city is growing nicely. It should starting pumping our good shields soon, and can be our main military source for the short term.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-146.jpg
My proposal for the next northern city. It starts a temple, and the puts luxuries #2 (gems) in our reach.

Originally posted by LKendter

4 food from 1 square lets us put 2 hills to work now.


exactly - but we should mine them first. by the time that is done and the forest cut we WILL be in Monarchy/Republic anyways ;)

I will pick this up when I get home from work.

Wtih the slow tech rate we are running out of things to build while waiting for the population to grow enough for more settlers. I built barracks in most of the cities, just for this fact. If we are going to be building spears between settlers, we should at least be building vet spears. Once we contact Europe and get that initial surge of tech, we will have too much to build for a period of time.

I would like to get the horses on-line, and us with Horseback Riding, so that we can build some long term offensive units and not just spears.

LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
meldor
Jersey Joe (playing)
OVERDUE - no response in 24 hours then skipped
Dark Sheer (on deck)

1225BC inherited turn: no changes checked diplo - nothing to report
1200BC - 1100BC Workers work, settlers settle, etc.
1075BC Monti & Lincoln have writing horse riding & iron working, I buy iron working from lincoln for 290 gold. Hia is broke so cannot trade with him.
1000BC we learn how to write and begin researching how to draw maps. (I move science upto 80% maps in 23 turns)
850BC trade writing to Hiaw for Horseback Riding & 11 gold.
825BC frag a barb camp + 25 gold
800BC - 730BC Workers work, settlers settle, etc.

I left 3 units on "long gotos" 1 is a settler moving south to build were a warrior is standing close to an iron deposit. I also was roading toward this spot is you wonder why roads being built with no town.

The other 2 units on a lng goto are a settler/spearman pair being
sent to panama.

Also, there are 2 settlers I was moving south to build along the
coast and to fill-in the area to the iron mines. I was building a
road to the coast for one of these settlers. The final settler was going north to found a town bringing us closer to having horses.


Here it is: Brazil (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-BC730.zip)

LKendter (on deck)
Lt. 'Killer' M.
meldor
Jersey Joe
Dark Sheer (playing)
You have the critical 20 turns. Map Making appears. I want 3 ships of spears heading along the Atlantic coast going north

by the end of your turn. We are know in the race for the Caribean islands and to get to Europe.


20 turns FIRST ROUND ONLY - 24 hours for got it.
48 hours total.

Still no purchased workers :(
We only have 10 workers and really need more. You should have more workers then cities.


The current status of our empire.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-147.jpg

Shouldn't some of those ships have a settler or two?

DOH!

Yes, I want 3 settler / spear pairs heading north by the time my turn arrives.

Hi,

I´m one of the owners of the Brazilian site: "Civ3 Brasil".

I´d like to know where did you picked up the brazilian civ...

Regards,
Felipe

I built Brazil from my own research.
I did a web search and found a good map for the city names.
I picked Bef as the only significant military unit I could find.
I picked the head of Goverment / great leaders from the people that I could find the most significant on a web search as listed below:

Goverment Leader = Dom Pedro de Alcântara (the emperor when Brazil was recognized as an independent country)
Great Leaders:
Gen. Eurico Gaspar Dutra (ww2 general)
João Baptista de Oliveira Figueredo (Brazilian general and politician, president of Brazil (1979-85)).
Cândido Mariano da Silva Rondon (Brazilian explorer and founder of the Indian Protection Service. A major in the army. The Brazilian state of Rondônia is named after him.)
Jose Joaquim da Silva Xavier (the leader of the Inconfidência Mineira, a movement against Portuguese rule in late 1780's)
José Bonifácio de Andrada e Silva (known as the "Patriarch of Independence" in Brazil)

You could probably tell me what leaders I missed ;)


Of course, I am really being stumped trying to find a country of interest to add into western Africa.

Hey LK, you can't get enough of these SCs, can you? :D

I was wandering around, and this particular topic called my attention. You guys got a really interesting game going on here, and I'm looking foward to read throught it.

I would like to be on the bench for this game if that's not much to ask. So, if anybody ever drops the game please give me a notice and I'll be here to play.

Edit: BTW, BEF stands for Brazilian Expeditionary Force?
What are the attributes?

BEF stands for Brazilian Expeditionary Force in English.
Of course, Feb is the Brazilian version. I would have to web search again to figure out the exact wording.

It is based on WWII infantry for Brazil, so it is an improved infantry - 7/11/1.

For the curious, Brazil in industrious and religious.
religious as missionaries were a part of the early settlers.
industrious out of need to develope the massive jungles down there.

LKendter (on deck)
Lt. 'Killer' M.
meldor
Jersey Joe
Dark Sheer (playing) GOT IT DUE NOW.
You have the critical 20 turns. Map Making appears. I want 3 ships of spears heading along the Atlantic coast going north by the end of your turn. We are know in the race for the Caribean islands and to get to Europe.

20 turns FIRST ROUND ONLY - 24 hours for got it.
48 hours total.

ok, I got it. :)

I checked yesterday but JJ has not responded yet. ;)

Will get it done tomorrow. :D

OK :)

I will repeat Meldor's correction:
3 ships of settlers / spears heading up the east coast of Brazil.

Once map making is complete, let's go back to 10% science. We are going to need a lot of money to buy all the techs from Europe.

hmmm..... depending on how many AIs there are I wouldn't be too surprised if there aren't too many techs to buy......

And the slower the human goes the slower the AIs research, too.

The distribution of civs is:
1 - Australia, will be a tech laggard. Trying to fix with latest release.
4 - Americias including us. One of the initial traits is missing, so start a tech short.
11 - Eurasia / Africa.

During my test, I jumped into the middle ages from still several techs left in ancient age.

I agree on the human factor for moving tech. More flexible trading, researching alternate paths (rails before nationalism), building cash to buy techs and other tricks all help.

11 - puch.

OK, that means 6 to 9 tech in my experience (though that was NOT gathered on Marla World)......

Maybe even better to pay a bunch for a World Map, then sell ours around for tech.......

I think you now understand my obession with first to Europe.

If we can be the first there with world map of America, you will be able to leverage a fortune from Europe. In addition, I sold contact with the rest of America.

I manage contact with all of Europe, multiple techs, and a pretty good wm the first round. I even got to play wm double dipping. After going through the civs once, I went through a couple more times until I could not squeeze another dime from them.

The reason I am pushing a settler to Europe ASAP -
1) We will want a staging area somewhere in Europe.
2) In order to purchase workers, we must have a city on the same landmass.

730BC(0) - We have undefended Settlers...hmmm
710BC(1) - We buy 1 worker from Aztec, 2 workers from America & 1 worker from Iroquis. Woohoo! :D
670BC(3) - Campinas founded.
610BC(6) - Manaus founded.
590BC(7) - Sao Goncalo founded.
570BC(8) - Campo Grande founded.
530BC(10) - Discovered Map Making and going for Literature. Sao Paolo starts Great Lighthouse. America & Aztec starts Great Library. :(
510BC(11) - Porto Velho founded.
490BC(12) - Sell World Map to Montezuma for WM & 90gp. Talking about AI Cheat! Montezuma know there is 3 barbarian camp in our land! :p
450BC(14) - First Brazilian Galley completed. ;)
410BC(16) - Bele Horizonte founded. Brasillia starts Palace (for Great Library).
370BC(18) - Cleared one Barbarian Camp.
330BC(20) - Salvado request for entertainer. :o American give us Literature, WM & 40gp for our WM. :cooool: Brasillia switch to Great Library.

Our progress is not too shabby. And as Lee requested, 3 Galley is now sailing upward towards Greenland. ;) I have not cut science to 10% as I hope to get Market Place as soon as possible. But its up to the next Leader to decide on this one. :)

Here is the save game.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-330BC.zip

LK: when you're done, could you upload to the file server, not attach the game? i still have trouble downloading attachments....

Originally posted by Dark Sheer
710BC(1) - We buy 1 worker from Aztec, 2 workers from America & 1 worker from Iroquois. Woohoo! :D

530BC(10) Sao Paolo starts Great Lighthouse.

450BC(14) - First Brazilian Galley completed. ;)

410BC(16) - Brasillia starts Palace (for Great Library).

Our progress is not too shabby. And as Lee requested, 3 Galley is now sailing upward towards Greenland. ;)

I have not cut science to 10% as I hope to get Market Place as soon as possible.



710 BC - 4 workers! It is weird how these tend to bunch. I bought 5 during the test game from Germany, which all turned out to be non-German labor :lol:

530 BC - This is a major gamble - Europe is ahead of us in tech. I hope we don't flush shields.

450 BC - [dance]

410 BC - Great Library. I suspect the AI is ahead of us on this one also. However, I will concentrate on improving this town.

I hope that is 3 Galley with settlers and escort. ;)

A fast pace tech game works against us. LK26 was the closest I came to a loss in a long time. We have such a massive amount of land to settle. I don't know how many cities will even build marketplaces in the short term. I suspect I will go back to 10%, if not token scientist.

@Lt. 'Killer' M. - I *ALWAYS* use the upload feature. I know how much problems attachment have cost this board, let alone you.

that's why I also never use attachments :goodjob:

Well, nowadays I use uploads as well. ;)

Dark Sheer: I hope it wasn't me who pressured you into that ;)

No, using the uploads folders keeps the forums from crashing due to too many attachments.

(0) 330 BC - Brasilia was ready to REVOLT! Luxuries to 10% - We should never have entertainers in a wonder building city.
Salvador in revolt :(

I cancel mining by Belo Horizonte. That city needs some irrigation for when a better goverment comes around.
Change Campo Grande to temple, as it really needs the cow square for early growth.
Find a few cities, and switch to workers. 16 cities and 10 native, 4 import workers is to little even with industrious.

:) The good news, none of the AI have map making yet. We have a good chance at the Caribean islands and first to Europe.
Trading > wm & 235 to Iroqouis for wm and philosphy.
I sell the revised wm to Aztecs for wm, $120 and to America for wm, $75 in effect getting philosphy for almost free.


(1) 310 BC - pocket change for wm.
(I) Iroqouis start the Great Library.


(2) 290 BC - pop a goody hut on the island, and angry barbs :(
(I) America start the Great Lighthouse
Rome complete the Great Lighthouse! I had a bad feeling that it was a no chance project.
The only good news, we only wasted 11 shields for a harbor.


(3) 270 BC - Bahia is formed on a Caribean island with dyes - order temple to get 2 fish on-line.
I buy code of laws from Aztecs for $470. I use code of laws and $95 to get poly from the Iroquois.
I really doubt we will get the Great Library, so I may as well keep trading.
A token scientist appears to get Republic in 40 turns. Goverment techs are to expensive in trading.
40 turns to a better goverment.
San Paulo switches to Harbor at a lost of 11 shields.


(4) 250 BC - Natal is formed, fragging a barb camp - temple orders to get horses.
A goodie huts gives us a warrior.


(6) 210 BC - Goody hut gives us $50. We have iron on the road net.


(8) 170 BC - Vitoria is formed, island city #2 is ours - temple orders to gain 2 fish.
(I) The silly domestic advisor wants to build the fp - go away lady - fp is in North America or Africa (maybe Thebes?)


(9) 150 BC -
(I) Belem will be our second kick butt wonder town, so I begin letting is to grow.
France completes the Great Library - I am not surprised.


(10) 130 BC - Brasilla switches to Library wasting 26 shields.
A harbors was completed, so I sell dyes to the Iroquois for $155 and wm. They are broke.

(12) 90 BC - Gems are on the road-net. One barb camp is fragged.


(13) 70 BC - China completes the Great Wall - how natural, but proof the Eurasia is ahead of us.


(14) 50 BC - New Salvador is formed, and we have secured the major gems deposit - granary ordered first.


(16) 10 BC - New Rio de Janerio is formed - orders temple to get cows / whales.
(I) America starts Hanging gardens.


(18) 30 AD - I actually get to buy a worker this round, $26 to America for one.


(19) 50 AD - New Brasilia is formed - culture war city, so a temple is ordered.


(20) 70 AD - I am Killer's can continue with worker luck. $27 to the Aztecs for one.


-------------------------------------------------

Summary - I am working on getting Brasila (10 shields) and Belem (6 sheilds) set up for wonder cities.
Both will start growing like crazy with a new goverment, and when 3 shields hill become available, look out.
Both just started place holders, as Europe is most likely in the middle ages. I want a chance at Sun Tzu, Sistine or Leo's.

When more gems come on-line, we can sell them to North America.


LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M. (playing)
You get the most Critical turns in the game. I hope you really know how to wheel and deal.
We should contact Europe in 10 to 15 turns. You get the 1/2 hour trading round.
Contacts to the world, multiple resell of maps, etc.
The settler / spear is to get us ONE Europe / Africa city - to buy workers, and a staging area for future invasions.
Don't waste it on an island city

meldor (on deck)
Jersey Joe
Dark Sheer


20 turns FOR THE MOMENT - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete
I plan to cut the number of turns later in the game. However, not enough at the moment to justify doing so.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-70AD-R.zip


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-153.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-154.jpg

How about we do build the FP in south America, more centrally located. Then later (I know we will be getting many leaders) we can move the palace to N America and after that over to Eurasia if we want to.
Also, if we do use a palace and build it in a captured city zero flip chance.

Got it!

I agree with JJ - we WILL have wars and then can rush the Palace 'over yonder'......


LK: I do havge to reprimand you: you miss-spelled Yrp!


I am currently preparing mentally for the trading...... :lol:

I'll need some time on this one - the city placement in the north is rather.......... sucky :( Manaus, Natal and New Salvador are badly placed.....

actually, I'll retract the comment on New Salvador.... that one MAY be OK..... but the other two should both have gone 1 tile SE......

OK, been trying around - and I have to admit teh Andes make planning rather difficult....

I will disband New Salvador for a settler :(

Hmmm....
I don't have much time to comment right now, heading toward work :(

Manuas / Natal - One square isn't that big a deal in this case. I think we agree, to disagree. I didn't entirely agree with your first turn cities either.

:smoke: I concede New Salvador. I got a little to rushed to get the gems on-line and didn't plot out well enough.


Of course, the real key is the road net is getting up north. Horses may get connected during your turn.

LK: no sweat - the gems were needed after all... and sure we disagree - otherwise MP would get incredibly boring....... ;)

Yes, get the horses hooked up, you have a warmonger coming up after you. I can't believe we have waited this olong in the game and haven't trimmed the Aztecs a couple of times.

One the Aztec war subject:

1) Horses still are not connected - Killer may get them connectted.

2) Iron was just connected during my turns.

3) The mad city rush is still on. I build 2 island cities, several northern cities, settler to europe, and even a couple more southern cities.

We didn't even have the ability to go after the Aztecs yet, unless you like archer rush - something I never use.

The good news: Our road net is getting far to the north, so we are getting to the point of the needed communications to the north. Our staging point city is building barracks.

Of course - Chivalry is getting close. I think Aztecs have NO Iron.
:satan: Need I say more? :satan:

preturn:

like things as they are

(1) 90 AD - Rio: settler --> on hold, Bele Horizonte: worker --> Library (flip-risk). New Sao Paolo founded. Lincoln now has Monarchy.

(2) 110 AD - Sao Paolo, Recife: settler --> another. Belo Horizonte: Spearman --> library (prebuild?) New Beol Horizonte founded. Maths from goody hut :D Aztecs pay 280 + WM for it :D 3*small change for WM.

Renegotiate peace - get 81 Gold from monty, 20 from Hia and WM from Lincoln (he is broke). Me? Mean????

(3) 130 AD - New Salvador is no more :(

(4) 150 AD -

(5) 170 AD - American Galley sighted near Boston. We survive four barb attacks. New Salvador refounded. Camp dispersed. New Fortaleza founded. Galley survives barb attack near Galapagos.

(6) 190 AD - New Nova Iguaco and New Recife founded. Re-adjust Brasilia for more production and no growth since I do not yet want to go higher in lux rate. Palace in 25 gives a good chance at Sun Tzus.

(7) 210 AD - Recife and Sao paolo: settler, two more ordered. 30 Gold and maps for WM.

(8) 230 AD - American settler right where I want to found a city in Venezuela :eek: :eek: meldor will have something to do..... Buy 1 worker from Aztecs for 30 Gold. Aztec Galley sighted. Another barb camp gone. Island in sight.

(9) 250 AD - the F**** Americans found Cincinnati - in the wrong place! Raze raze raze!!! Build a town 1 tile NW. :mad: meldor, this is where you come in...... new Proto Alegre founded. Horses hooked up :D

(10) 260 AD - New Belem and New Goiania founded. some tiles lost here:( Buy one Iroq worker.

(11) 270 AD - Aztecs land a settler in a city spot on the west coast. Let it grow and take it. Contact! A german city on the east cost of island and a Russian border! germany wants exorbitant prices for contacts, so idecide to wait one turn.

preturn:

like things as they are

(1) 90 AD - Rio: settler --> on hold, Bele Horizonte: worker --> Library (flip-risk). New Sao Paolo founded. Lincoln now has Monarchy.

(2) 110 AD - Sao Paolo, Recife: settler --> another. Belo Horizonte: Spearman --> library (prebuild?) New Beol Horizonte founded. Maths from goody hut :D Aztecs pay 280 + WM for it :D 3*small change for WM.

Renegotiate peace - get 81 Gold from monty, 20 from Hia and WM from Lincoln (he is broke). Me? Mean????

(3) 130 AD - New Salvador is no more :(

(4) 150 AD -

(5) 170 AD - American Galley sighted near Boston. We survive four barb attacks. New Salvador refounded. Camp dispersed. New Fortaleza founded. Galley survives barb attack near Galapagos.

(6) 190 AD - New Nova Iguaco and New Recife founded. Re-adjust Brasilia for more production and no growth since I do not yet want to go higher in lux rate. Palace in 25 gives a good chance at Sun Tzus.

(7) 210 AD - Recife and Sao paolo: settler, two more ordered. 30 Gold and maps for WM.

(8) 230 AD - American settler right where I want to found a city in Venezuela :eek: :eek: meldor will have something to do..... Buy 1 worker from Aztecs for 30 Gold. Aztec Galley sighted. Another barb camp gone. Island in sight.

(9) 250 AD - the F**** Americans found Cincinnati - in the wrong place! Raze raze raze!!! Build a town 1 tile NW. :mad: meldor, this is where you come in...... new Proto Alegre founded. Horses hooked up :D

(10) 260 AD - New Belem and New Goiania founded. some tiles lost here:( Buy one Iroq worker.

(11) 270 AD - Aztecs land a settler in a city spot on the west coast. Let it grow and take it. Contact! A german city on the east cost of island and a Russian border! germany wants exorbitant prices for contacts, so I decide to wait one turn.

(12) 280 AD - Hanging Gardens are gone :(


Renegotiate peace with

France: get contact Greeca for 10 Gold
Greece: TM and 5 Gold
Germany: TM for 20 Gold
Russia: Contact Rome
Rome: contact Persia, Babylon, TM :D
Babylon: India, China, Zulu, TM
Persia: Egypt, TM, 2 Gold
Zulu: TM, Currency, 15 Gold for contact Aztecs, Americans
India: Construction, TM, 5 Gold for contact Aztecs, Americans

Mao is smiling - I do not trust him and do not renegotiate. Same for (furoious) Cleo.

Buy TM from Egypt and Russia and France for contact Aztecs. now we have all territory maps.

Iroquese pay WM and 140 Gold for contact with Greece. Construction gets us furs.
Currency and Construction get us WM 16 Godl and monarchy from America.

720 Gold and three contacts to Persia for Monotheism
900 Gold and three contacts to Rome for Republic.


Now for the map selling:

WM to Aztecs for 30 Gold

WM for WM and contact with Irows from babylon.

Now to get all the money for the WM.....

560 Gold and WM back from Caesar
560 Gold from persia
all others are broke :(

rush Temple in New Brasilia to push back American influence.

Slow down production in prebuild cities. Revolution

(13) 290 AD - New Campinas founded. Galley heads for Western Coast of Africa.

(14) 300 AD - buy some stuff

(15) 310 AD - Porto Velho is a nice place for the FP. Put it on Colosseum as hold.

(16) 320 AD - New Sao Goncalo founded.

(17) 330 AD - New Campo Grande founded. Science up to 60% @ -70 per turn (2473 in the bank) to get Feudalism for sure before Belem builds FP.

(18) 340 AD - get some 120 Gold for trading Wm around.

(19) 350 AD - nothing. Production and growth arrested in Palcae-prebuilding / FP prebuilding city respectively.

(20) 360 AD - New Porto velho founded. Science down to 50% @ -34per turn.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

FP in belem in 10, Feudalism in 9 Turns. Then, hurry for Theology and switch Brasilia to Sixtinian......

Some horsemen are in and on their way to Bele Horizonte (Aztec border). Horsemen are on goto-order!!!!

Galley with settler on west coast can go north to Galapagos islands and found 2nd city there.

Setler in south near New Sao Goncalo has goto to city site near Warrior

Settler west of fotaleza has goto to Spearman on west coast mountain. Coastal city 1 tile due west of said spearman planned.

Did NOT do end-turn dealing.

Remember: we have 20turn peace with Aztecs, 2 turns left. You could either renew and wait for Chivalry to buy or research it and start killing them......


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-360AD.zip

Then, hurry for Theology and switch Brasilia to Sixtinian......
Sounds good - then put science back to a token scientist.
Glad to see a couple more workers bought.

[dance] Eygpt has feudalism sale for $1120 (pre-haggle)
NOBODY else has started Sun Tzu! We can get it in 32 turns - It is almost a lock
Theology in 15 turns - palace in 13 in Brasillia! With slow production we get Sistines [dance]
Good tag team for the "L" crowd.


LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
meldor (playing)
:confused: Sleeping workers in Belo Horizonte - please wake them!
We still need some more settlers - zero being built. :(

Jersey Joe (on deck)
Dark Sheer
20 turns FOR THE MOMENT - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete
I plan to cut the number of turns later in the game. However, not enough at the moment to justify doing so.

No matter how many times I see this I laugh - America is clear our dyes square.
Silly AI just doesn't understand that it is OUR territory now.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-155.jpg


The other good news! We get a city in Africa. With some rushing, we might get a rush temple, and a second city.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-156.jpg

I see it, but it is third on the list of feast. We do have a hurricane close by so I may have to swap with the next person. If I do not post a confirmed "got it" by 12 noon CST, I will probably be somewhere far away from my internet connection, or may not even have one. I would like to finish them all tonight but I doubt I will be able to get there.

@Meldor -
I saw a post under another game today.
Will you be able to get to this one tonight?

I am still here, our neighbors in the next state got it instead of us. We may not even get much rain, as we are on the clean side of the storm. Not so good for them as they have taken two in a row. Of course, poor Jamica got it worse than anyone here.

meldor: good for you though.... they just showed it on TV, and especially the sat images were scary........ :eek:

I went through Hurricane Camile way back when, that was my first and I lived in Pensacola, Fla at the time on the dirty side. That storm convinced me that I will not stay around no matter what for anthing over a catagory 1 Hurricane and that only because I live far enough inland for the storm surge not to get this far. Anthing stronger and I will be in El Paso.

I will be leaving for a 3 days 2 nights company trip tomorrow early morning and will only be back Monday. So if Meldor & JJ finish their turns before Monday evening then I will need to swap with Lee. ;) If not I will take my usual turn when I am back. :D

Is that Monday your time, or mine?
The 12 hour difference makes it very confusing.
I think it is Friday, 9:00 AM for you right know - correct?

360 AD (Pre-turn)
Fire Entertainers in several cities. The Palace isn't set to complete for 44 turns! We will have the tech within 20 or so. Go to Brazilia and find three citizens working jungle instead of hills. Re-arrange tiles to get Palace in 22 without dropping any food and we get 7 more gpt to boot. I may have to slow this down after I see how soon we can pull theology. Right now Theology would be 8 (Feudalism) + 16 turns away or 24 total. We might be able to improve on that, if not a little adjustment in the work force will get it just right.
(I) The Egyptians start Sun Tzu's

370 AD (1)
Eygpt wants 860g and WM for Feudalism, if we make shields at Belem we can get Sun's in 22. Get embassy with Egypt. They are at war with India. Shop around and the cheapest offer is dear Joan at 800g and WM. Shop around WM to everyone but Joanie and pick up some change. Go back to Joanie and it is now 790g and WM. Lowest she will go is 717g and WM, I take it. Theology is now 15 turns away, Palace 21, but Brazilia grows in three and can then be switched to max production. Switch Belem to Sun Tzu's but best we can get it is 20. I hope no one get a GL in the next 22 turns.

380 AD (2)
(I) Gemans and Zulu start Sun Tzu's.

390 AD (3)
Egypt and France sign an alliance against India. The French and Romans start Sun Tzu's.

400 AD (4)
Brazilia grows and is set to max shields, palace in 10, Theology in 11. We will have to MM to get it to come out right. We can shave 5 turns off of Sun Tzu's if Brazilia finishes it and not Belem. There is nothing worth enough shields to perform the swap right now. May move up Theology.

410 AD (5)
(I) Egypt and India sign a peace treaty.

420 AD (6)
Keep squeezing for more money, get Theology down to 8, same as palace. Land of the Songhai formed next to 3 Wheat, a cow and some Iron.

430 AD (7)
Move lux slider up one, fire funny people in Brazilia. Palace in 7, Theology in 6.

440 AD (8)
Still working it. For those of you who didn't believe I could make it this far without declaring war, we now have 15 Horsemen. I was thinking to wait until Sistine is one turn away and selling Thelogy to all comers to get Chivalry.

450 AD (9)
Pretty boring.

460 AD (10)
Palace jumps to 7. Go to city and nothing has changed. No corruption...what gives. Move Theology to 4 turns and +1gpt.

470 AD (11)
Pins and Needles

480 AD (12)
Babylonian's start Sun Tzu's.

490 AD (13)
(I) Swap things around. Sun Tzu's in 3, Sistine in 9.

500 AD (14)
Finally, 4 workers from India for 100g. Trade Theology to Egypt for WM, 34g and 182gpt. Get WM, 20g and 79gpt.
The Egyptians and French start Sistines. The French couldn't pay us anything for the tech and someone sell's it to them for nothing! America starts Sun Tzu's.

510 AD (15)
We have 18 Horsemen ready to go....Cleo has Engineering but we will wait until we have Chivalry in 5 to deal.

520 AD (16)
Rush temple in Land of the Songhai.
(I) We get Sun Tzu's. Everyone else swaps to Sistine if they can. What!!!!The French complete Sistine! They were only a half turn away from beating us the Sun Tzu's. We are going to buy something very expensive in Belem.
(As an aside, I loaded the save game from were I sold Theology to the Egyptians, just to see if I did major weed. France got Theology on that turn because they finished the research on it, not because someone else sold it to them. We were going to lose one of the two anyway.)

530 AD (17)
Melodr the angry, awakens the sleeping hores. It is only 3 turns to Chivalry, but he feels the need to kill something. Sell off 13 barracks on the mainland for 65g and a modest reduction in upkeep.

540 AD (18)
Declare war on the Aztecs and advance on their cities. Capture one worker.

550 AD (19)
Capture Tamuin and a worker.
(I) We get Chivalry, Engineering in 3

560 AD (20)
Capture Atzcapotzalco. Upgrade to our first Knight.

We need to do upgrades. Science was not set after Chivalry. There is a settler down south to settle the hills.

LK32 560 AD Saved Game (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-560AD.zip)

LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor
Jersey Joe (playing)
Dark Sheer (skip if before Monday evening).

20 turns FOR THE MOMENT - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete
I plan to cut the number of turns later in the game. However, there is not enough at the moment to justify doing so.

Land of the Songhai formed next to 3 Wheat, a cow and some Iron.
Are we getting impatient for the next wm game?

I took a look at the game - Why are we researching heavy? The last thing I want is another LK26 space race mess. A fast science game works against us.

I was curious and look at the trade screen.

We can get Engineering from Russia for dyes and Chivalry.
Research invention ASAP to switch Palace to Leo's, then shut off research.

I should back by Monday evening (GMT +8). ;)

Using of GMT make things clearer I hope? :D

I was following the plan on research....The very last turn brought chivalry, I left it for the next person to do as they wanted. The turn before, the Engineering was too expensive. It must have been sold around. I always leave diplo and research decisions to the next person on the last turn (they can change them anyway).

Actually, I was suprised you made no comment on the nearly 3700g that Egypt paid for a middle age tech. That more than made up for the outlay on tech we did. As I stated, the French finished research onthe tech the same turn we did, all other techs were available from someone else at least one trun before we got it. Us not researching, is not slowing the tech race down at this time. Until we have a solid tech lead and everyone else is at war, we won't be able to control it that well.

As an aside, the space race inthe last game was one of the things that made it interesting. The game is not any fun if you never have a worry of losing it.

Actually, I was NOT surprised by the price Egypt paid. If Egypt paid 2nd Civ price, that price is always absurd.

Brazil has so many initial cities; we badly need time for infrastructure building. I would much rather buy the techs at 4th or 5th Civ prices, and be able to spend money on rushing buildings. I want cash to be able to do massive upgrade of troops. We need marketplaces built, along with many other structures. If we have spare cash, rushing courthouses up north would really pay off long term.

What I have realized shortly after this game started is that Brazil is TOO strong. I started working on V7 of the world map, and deleted several cattle in South America to make the position weaker. I already plan to do more to make the position weaker.

I think the basic issue in the game, is that I don't want to be the tech leader while the other players do. I know during my rounds, science will be shut off unless I have no choice.

As an aside, the space race in the last game was one of the things that made it interesting. The game is not any fun if you never have a worry of losing it.
This is why I made the comment Brazil is too strong. Australia proved to be a real challenge, in trying to get off the island. Brazil is turning out to be too strong. I suspect Songhai will offer much more of a challenge with the aggressive Zulu nearby.

LK: I do not mind being behind in tech and buying cheap, but here two important wonders were at stake and I wanted to make SURE we get at least one of them--.---

@Lt. 'Killer' M.
I didn't argue with your choices for science. That is why I started the two placeholders.

We did get Sun Tzu ;) With the size of North America that is a lot free barracks.

@Meldor
Just to clarify - I thought about it some more and remembered the palace under pre-build. We do want science up to Leo's, and then we can lag for a bit.

FYI - I am glad to see the hurt start on the Aztecs. Our challenge is to balance more military with infrastructure. I think knights may be enough to kill / cripple the Aztecs. If the Iroquois have the lone NA horse source, we may be able to put the hurt on America also.

I built mostly infrastructure, trying to get the tech rate up, andget things in like markets, thats why I waited to the end to start hitting the Aztecs. They have iron, but no horses.

Also, on the last turn, we were able to finally sell/buy goods from the other side. I did not explore any of those deals.

So it doesn't get lost

LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor
Jersey Joe (playing)
Dark Sheer (skip if before Monday evening).



@All - The next game is already in the works.
We will have nowhere close to the land in Brazil.

Check out LK26 thread for details. Songhai in western Africa is coming.

I got it.

560AD inherited turn: trade chivalry to China for engineering.
Feudilism to greece for 19 gold + WM + 9 gpt
Chivalry to rome for Wines + WM + 29 gold +11 gpt
Get Ivory from egypt for RoP + dyes +218 gold
everyone else is to broke to trade with.
drop luxury rate to 10%
580AD we capture Teayo.
590AD (I) a bout of war weariness hits.
600AD lincoln annoys me so we are at war with america. Denver
razed, Cincy razed.
610AD sell WM around and net +117 gold + 4 gpt + 1 worker
(I) learn invention start gunpowder ( 0% research, 1 scientist)
620AD Brasilla switched to Leo's. Sell WM around again, net about 100 gold & 1 worker
(I) barbarians sink our galley Worse news the traitors in
Atzcapotzalco leave our wonderful empire to rejoin the aztec's :(
Germany destroys India. (I looked back and we did not have any
trade deals with India, so no hit to reputation.)
630AD Atzcapotzalco captured against my better judgement I keep it (for the culture border.)
640AD
(I) china starts Leo's.
650AD sell WM around again and notice that several civs now have invention, so sell invention to russia for 27 gold + 6 gpt
(I) Lincoln wants peace. I agree and he gives us 36 gold + 8 gpt.
War weariness hits? :mad: loss a turn of production on Leo's
because if it. A few countries start working on Leo's.
670AD Mainaico razed.
690AD The GL Dutre graces us with his presence.
700AD Dutre builds an army.
710AD Tiatelolco razed.
740AD Tlaxcala razed.
750AD Troop movement, workers work, etc.

2 settlers are moving into aztec territory after having the 1 town
flip I started razing. There are several knights on long gotos to
get them upto panama.

Our army won a battle so we are building the heroic epic.

Here it is: Brazil (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-AD750.zip)

@Jersey Joe - Sorta off topic.

How goes the America testing?
Shonghai research is getting there, so World Map in rest Africa is close. However, I would like to know the marines / normal fighter are OK.

My laptop is totally hosed. I am having to reinstall windows, and I don't know how long that will take. I will let Dark Sheer take his turn, and hopefully I have a working machine by then.


LKendter (on deck)
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor
Jersey Joe
Dark Sheer (playing)

Ok, I am back and got it. :)

750AD(0) - Got Silk from China. Lost 2 Knights to Aztec counter attack.
760AD(1) - Palace expanded. Renegotiate Wine deal with Rome.
770AD(2) - Renegotiate Ivory deal with Egypt. Tzintzuntzen captured. Captured 1 Aztec Settler.
780AD(3) - Lost 1 Knight to Aztec. Leo completed in Brasilia.
790AD(4) - We are hit hard by war weariness. :(
800AD(5) - Brasilia 2 & Sao Paolo 2 founded. Tlacopan captured.
820AD(7) - Tenochtitlan razed. Buy 1 worker from China. Buy Education from Germany for 960gp, Gem & Dye.
830AD(8) - Egypt starts Copernicus.
840AD(9) - Palace expanded. French & Chinese starts Copernicus. Belo Horizonte 2 founded.
850AD(10) - Teotihuacan razed. Peace treaty with America extended.
860AD(11) - Calixtlahuaca captured.
870AD(12) - American Frontier founded. Texcoco captured.
880AD(13) - Buy Music Theory from Zulu and starts JS Bach. All of a sudden everyone starts JS Bach. :p
900AD(15) - Xochicalco captured. Signed Peace treaty with Aztec and get Printing Press.


Since I am not sure if it is still 20 turns or 10 turns, I did 15 turns. Aztec left only 1 island city which will be there until marines. Our whole nation is happy so the next leader might want to consider reducing luxury. Cash is a little low but we are gaining 200+ per turn so it should not be a problem. Our next target should be America. :D

Here is the save game.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-900AD.zip

Originally posted by Dark Sheer
780AD(3) - Leo completed in Brasilia.

900AD(15) - Xochicalco captured. Signed Peace treaty with Aztec and get Printing Press.
Aztec left only 1 island city which will be there until marines.


[dance] We get Leo's [dance]

On the Aztecs - I wonder if we could have made peace before and got the island city in the treaty? This military win will have to be by CONQUEST. I don't want to have to play a lot of turns to just go island hopping. One isn't bad, but we should try and get those lone island cities in peace treaties - it is much easier to clean up cities on the main land mass later.


:confused: Why is my turn showing up in all my games the week I have to work OT and get my PC back functional? I again left in the morning downloading more windows updates, and updates to Norton System Works.

we cna switch if that's OK for you - I have time today and tomorrow but will be busy over the WE

I have already started working on the game.

The WE doesn't work for me either - I want the game done before then.

k, if you get it done today or tomorrow morning I can play tomorrow....... if not I will post a 'skip me'

(0) 900 AD - Rio is already at six extra food - cancel workers irragating.
New Natal will gain all hill, and needs the irragated grassland - cancel project.
The war is OVER - I have no idea why luxuries still at 40%. I drop them to 0%.
We have a few to many solo workers, I will get the tag teams back together.

American Fronter has a Brazil citizen, so I will start moving our troops there.

Diplomacy offers nothing of interest except for a nice amount of money from maps.
(I) Germany / Zulu ally vs. Greece.


(1) 910 AD - Salvador needs water, so cancel mining by New Campo Grande.
Iroqoius / China / Egypt / America have banking for Sale.
:confused: How do the Aztecs have $2/turn to pay for wm.


(2) 920 AD - I generally don't like gpt for tech, but I want Astronomy this turn.
$1630, $31/t to China and I get it.
(I) America, Egypt are building Magellans!


(4) 940 AD - I buy a Greek and Persian worker.
$1209, $17/t to China and I buy Navigation - we will more then make it up with our new map knowledge.
Not to metion we may be first to some of the island cities.
(I) Silks supply simply goes away.


(6) 960 AD - Fortaleza 2 is formed - Filled a gap with a wasted river area and an unused cow.
The dangers of modding. This is fixed in V7.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-162.jpg
Another boring round of trading, but still $100 for wm is nice.
(I) Ivory now cost $20/turn.
Wine supply simply goes away :( - New Belem riots, turn lost on fp production.
France completes Copernicus's


(7) 970 AD - $70 / turn to China to get silks. Someday we will want more native luxuries.
More map trading including wm to America for $30 and a worker!
I help out rome and give them Astronomy for wines, $40.
(I) China declares war on the Zulu.
Our people are happy again.


(8) 980 AD - We buy a Egypt worker. France also contributes a worker.
I buy banking from China for $2125 - 5 banks in 12 turns.
[dance]Economics does NOT show up[dance]


(9) 990 AD - Nova Iguacu 2 is formed - we snag a 1 square island!
One less future target for the marines.
(I) :eek: Egypt starts Smith's


(10) 1000 AD - I buy economics for 1450 from China.
We just can't keep any cash in hand.
Egypt gives us another worker.
(I) France / Zulu ally vs. Greece.
Persia / Zulu ally vs. Russia.
BLAST - Zulu complete Bach. I hope the cascade doesn't screw us out of Smith's.
France / China / Iroquois cascade to Smith's.


(11) 1010 AD - Belem builds a very expensive Bank.
Recife 2 is built - we get another 1 square island.
The workers are starting to pour in - this time one from China.


(12) 1020 AD - I don't know where Egypt is getting all these workers from, but I buy another! The 3rd in 5 turns.
Didn't I just buy a worker from France? When it rains, it pours - I also buy a worker from Persia.
(I) France / China ally vs. Zulu


(13) 1030 AD - So much for extra cash - $1830 spent to upgrade to 61 pikeman to musketmen.


(15) 1050 AD - Oh no mr. Lincoln, our peace treaty expired. Silly Lincoln won't even give me Los Angeles, a junk island city.
Not even a token $25/t? Sorry Abe, but you are scum. WAR!
(I) :mad: Egypt completes Smith's :mad:
REALLY :mad: France completes Magellan. Major league shield flush!


(16) 1060 AD - Salvador builds an expensive bank.
Buffalo, San Fransico and Seattle are captured.
We nail a pike / settler pair.
We buy Chemistry from France for Gems, Dyes, $1775.
Something different - I buy an Iroquois worker.
(I) Babylon / Greece peace treaty.
Wasted shields, but Brasilla builds Wall Street.


(17) 1070 AD - Detroit is captured.
(I) Aztecs / France ally vs. Zululand.
Our warriors still have use, great for crushing resitance.


(18) 1080 AD - Porto Alergre 2 is built, yet another 1 square island.
(I) Furs deal now cost $41/t - Can't afford not to get them with war going on.
FP completes in New Belem.
A whole bunch of Civs starts Shakespeare's.

(19) 1090 AD - BITE ME. Our knight army (unhurt) dies taking 1 hp off a demonic Pikeman in Chicago.
Chicago is captured by the next knight.
Egypt has Physics available, for an obscene price. China, Iroquios also have it.
France helps the workers supply again, as does Persia.
(I) Seatle holds with a 1 hp knight.

(20) 1100 AD - Boston falls with several workers gained.

==========================

Summary -
Use a leader to build a Palace in North America.
Hope Shakespeare's builds fast, as we my get Newton's.

America will already talk peace, and concede some cities - I still want Philadelphia and a permanent fur source.
I would try to get Los Angeles from America in the peace treaty - I want to get as many islands as quickly as we can.

LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M. (playing)
Meldor (on deck)
Jersey Joe
Dark Sheer

10 to 20 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete
I plan to cut the number of turns later in the game. However, there is not enough at the moment to justify doing so.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-1100AD.zip

If Killer can't play it this weekend, we can swap and he can play when he gets back....

FYI - I forget to rename the city with the FP to Forbidden City. It is 3 cities NW of the capital.

All of the settlers, and we could use a few more, are trying to snag as many Pacific islands as we can. One ship is heading back to grab another settler. I don't want to spend the last few rounds just island hopping.

@meldor - you just want to beat up a few more American cities - don't you ;)
If Killer doesn't post something within 12 hours, you may well take your turn based on his comments.


We will probably want to take out Iroquois next, and secure our continent. At that point we should be building the military rail-net and can start shipping units over to African foothold. Thebes will we ours.

I hope the next play is as lucky with workers - I bought 10+ my turn, not to mention what I capture from Amercia.

It can be spotty.....I think it helps if Europe is at war with each other as more workers are threatened near the capital.

I will check when I get home tonight and procede from there.

Egypt must have completed Smith using a GL. Started on our 9th Turn and complete by 15th turn?? That got to be a GL or this will be major AI cheat. ;)

Actually, it was a cascade from Bach's, I saw the switch.

BTW, I have it....

By the way, I will be travelling again next week. I will be in a hotel on both Monday night & Wednesday night. So I might be a little bit slow if my turn fall on those days. Otherwise I should be fine. :)

OK, meldor, give them hell - I'm back a bit earlier than expected but rather busy... can play Sunday afternoon GMT.....

1100 AD
Americans attack repulsed at Buffalo, knight near Houston takes out one of our elite knights. The "Land of the Songhai" has disappeared!

1110 AD (1)
Kill two stray American knights near Buffalo. Capture Houston. Kill offending knight near Houston. Re-name Forbidden City. Upgrade the warriors for 20g each to make them better defenders.
(I) American Knight attacks near Buffalo, but dies attacking our knight in the hills. They try to retake Boston with two knights, kill one of ors, but the city holds. Zulus and Russians sign a peace treaty. Resistance ends in Houston...man that didn't take long.

1120 AD (2)
Newly made swordsmen escort a cat towards Boston. I trade the WM around for spare change and a worker from China. Put lots of units on long gotos (ha, Lee), however all of them end before my turn.
(I) With us pressing the atack, America astarts building Shakespears Theater. No America counters this turn.

1130 AD (3)
MOvement and Rest. Start eyeing New York. War Weariness begins, up lux to 10%, pick up spices from Cleo.
(I) The world turns.

1140 AD (4)
Knights begin to move on New York. 3 cities still in resistance, hopefully two of them will come out next turn.
(I) American SOD of 5 swords and one Warrior show up outside of Buffalo. A single American warrior shows up near Buffalo's other side. Two American knights attack Boston and fail.

1150 AD (5)
We have two Knights and a cat in Buffalo, there is a Musket that will arrive next turn, before the swords can get there. We will wait to next turn to start attacking them as they are still in the moutains. However the lone warrior is another story, he is killed by an elite knight, revealing an American spear and two more swords near the Iroquois city on the other side of the mountains. The two knights near Boston are dispatched.
(I) Persia and France sign an alliance against Greece. American sSOD bypasses Buffalo, headed for Detroit. Chicago flips back to America. A SOD of Pikes and Spears are behind the Sword SOD.

1160 AD (6)
Send Knight to Chicago before pike can foritfy. Chicago is razed and we start settler on way to take its place. We capture New York, losing only one Knight, however we can not raze it as the Iroquois culture is to strong to allow us to put in another city, it must be held as is. It will probably get easier once we bounce the American capital up into the Artic circle. Move Knights towards Detroit. Kill one stray America Knight. Buy Physics from Joan for World map and 2440g. Buy ToG from Cleo for 2330g and 31gpt. Sell ToG to Joan for 2324 and 13gpt. Change production at Brazilia to Newton's due in twelve.
(I) Russia and Persia sign a peace treaty. Greece and France sign a peace treaty. Greece only has one city left, I wonder why no one has taken them out. Cleo wants more for her Ivory, it is now 65gpt + dyes. Border expand all over the place. The Chinese and Iroquois start Newton's. We lose our wines and get no chance to buy them back. Sword SOD now headed for Buffalo. Two more groups of two swrods each appear out of Iroqiuos territory.


1170 AD (7)
Rest and recover. Shuffle knights back towards Buffalo. Take out three of the swords, so only two swords and a warrior are left. Move some new knights towards the four other swords. A couple more pikes and spears appear. Do they really think we will let them get too far?
(I) Egypt and China sign against the Zulu. For some strange reason, all but 1 of the 7 resisters in New York are quelled. China hits us up for more for their silks, have to pony up 92gpt for them. When the war is over we can scale that back. America attacks with two of the swords, one wins the other doesn't. The stack is joined by 2 pikes and a spear.

1180 AD (8)
Kill the 2 sword pairs and a warrior.
(I) Houston deposes us, and after a temple and library. French start Newton's.

1190 AD (9)
Move to retake Houston
(I) The french complete Shakespears and the Chinese and Iroquois cascade.

1200 AD (10)
Kill off more American troops, Move to Houston, settler ready to take its place.
(I) Nada.

Sorry, had to stop here..some units still on gotos.


Saved Game (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-1210AD.zip)

got it

Sorry, last few turns were rushed so I could get in at least 10...unfortunately Shake's was completed late. We have about 8 turns to finish Newton's.
There are a bunch of knights headed America'a way. There weren't enough troops to really do much but grab a couple of cities and defend what we had. Two citiy flips was pretty bad, but we lack civ wide culture. I took steps to correct that to stop more future flips.
We might want to buy Metallurgy and research Military Tradition ourselves to allow a space we can eat into the Iroquois.
We need more native luxes.

I already realized that.... had to abaondon new York due to flip risk..... Also, the RNG really hates us atm.

preturn:

like things as they are. Kill 1 Pike in Atlanta, no leader :( Town should

fall next turn. Houston, too. Knights in Buffalo proove incapable of

taking HP from a Pikeman in the open. At least, they kill a spear. New

York is extremely exposed - I abandon it.Order settler in American

Frontier to replace the town.

(1) take Atlanta, found Goinaia 2 (another tiny island), and Campinas 2.

Destory Houston and get ready to found town 1 tile north of it. Get wines

from Rome for Theory of Gravity adn 480 Gold - helps aginst WW. Democracy

in 5 at + 54 - I go for it.

(2) American counterattakc costs us 1 Knight. Manaus 2 founded. Hurt US

knight kills elite knight (odds: 4.2%). Sign ROP with iroqs along with

metallurgy for 2500 Gold flat. Go for northern cities of America. Take

risk on atlanta (flip).

(3) 2-HP US Knight attacks fortified 2 HP Knight in Atlanta and wins w/o

HP loss (17.5%) :mad: There is a barb uprising near Campinas 2 - just

great! Just what i need now that our purse is rather full (almost 4000

Gold left). Since the barbs are already nex to the town I abandon it.
At least - at last :D an Elite Knight attacking out of Atlanta (thank God

it didn't flip!) kills the pesty US knight and gets us a leader!!!!! he is

immediately joined into the freshly created army :D I leave Atlanta empty

and head for Washington.

(4) Our pikeman is killed by the barbs after killing 8 of them. Nothing

new on the America front - moving troops up. Two yellow Galley on the

coast make me leave Knights in the south.

(5) Our elite Knights are incapable of killing exposed Swordsmen on lains

(unfortified). Also, they are too dumb to retreat :mad: Large stack w Army

next to Washington, also 3 knights at New Orleans - but Abe won't give

Military Trad for peace. I get very annoyed with him which shows in the

latest town name.
Demo (we were 1 turn from) it and map and 4 Gold from Shaka for

Theory,Bizzy gets Saltpeter for a few bucks and Free Art. the rest pays

cash for map. noone is willing to part with magnetsim at a reasonable

price atm, same for MT.

(6) nothing from Abe. Spice City founded, Harbour and Temple and Worker =

Spices for us :D. Heavy losses - but Washington is razed. A settler is on

the way. Now, suddenly, we can get a substantive spoil of war for a peace

treaty - Dallas, Cleveland, Denver, New York, LA, Chicago. I take it,

along with WM and all 12 Gold :D Rush Temples ina ll captured cities that

already have some production down. next turn, we will be a Democracy.

(7) Abe kicks our troops out :lol: Love that feature of the game....

imagine some ex-nazi going to the Allies in fall '45 sayin' You get outta

here or we make you leave.... :lol: The Aztecs want to ally against the

Zulu :lol:

(8) For 1700 Gold, WM, Dyes and Gems, I buy magnetism from joan. Zulu give

17 GPT and some for 1 lux, Rome pays 13 GPT for Magnetism. All others a

losers - broke losers. Steam Power in 9 @ -27 - I do not see us buy a lot

of tech for outrageous prices if the AIs will soon all go to war anyways.

Also, I want Steam Power and Industry ASAP - factories factories

factories..... Luxuries to 0 gets us 8 turns and - 33.

(9) Iroquese want 2 lux and straight cash for furs instead of per turn

cash - I don't like that - both because that smells like a sneak attack

and because I don't want to loose the furs. But they want 1500 Gold :nono:
Lots of WLTKD come into effect - end up with Steam Power in 6(!) @ + 14 :D
realize that Cleveland has a problem - a stack of Chinese units on the

second tile - ouch!. need to get top-line defenders there - rush harbor.

(10) set all strong procuders to projetcs that take longer than

researching steam power to save shields for factories. Selling Wm to Zulu

gets us 40 G + 10 GPT!!!!! Well!

(11)

(12)

(13)

(14)


Steam power is around the corner, most large cities prebuilding for factories. next players decision if you want to rush (at negative money) for indus.... i set up the preprod but it's your call....

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/Brazil1290.zip

sorry for the knight Army - but I wanted to break Abes back once and for all...

Summary -
Overall the war went well versus America. Not getting Philadelphia was the only bad thing - I really would have liked a permanent source of furs. I think we will have to go to war vs. the Iroquois soon.
1) The clock is ticking. We are up to rails, and have not secured our own continent.
2) The luxury prices are getting to high, and we want to start securing natural sources.
3) We really need another leader. Our power base is a palace in North American. We should have military tradition soon, and can start building armies. No need to use any more leaders on building armies.

:confused:
Lt. 'Killer' M. - Why democracy? I have found that is a horrid government to fight a war with, and we have a massive amount of fighting coming up. I think the war weariness with is unbearable under Democracy.


LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor
Jersey Joe (playing)
Dark Sheer (on deck)

5 to 10 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

Army is good if it gets us Heroic Epic and more leaders. As soon as we get factories up it is the Iroquois turn.

Hey, Did we get Newton's or not?

Porto Velho already built the Heroic Epic in 870 AD.
I already had an army that won a combat.

We did get Newton's.

I will pick this up when I get home from work tonight.

Lee: demo, because we approach a time where wars are a fast, quickly decided thing (thus no WW) if you have rails. So hold on the war thing until we havge rails (and thus have also time to complete Factories), then blast the Americans and then the iroquese with bunch of Arty until they are a pushover. i always fight my Industrial age wars like that in democracy and I NEVER have trouble unless i have several opponents at the same time on my continent......

At the rate things go I think my turn will fall on weekend. No delay then. ;)

Last night there was a power outage where I live and I was in the beginning of my 4th turn (1305AD). I will finish up tonight.

Mostly the turns were spent building railroads.

1290AD Inherited turn: Changed a few build orders, rush some
culture in NA holdings. Diplo: renegotiate Germany trade for
dyes; we now get 16 gpt + 15 gold + WM. Trade gems to Germany for 16gpt +170gold. Sell WM around for a few more pieces of gold.
1295AD
(I) we learn how to lay rails and begin to Study Industrialization
(due in 5 @ -387 gpt)
1300AD Since it will be easier for us to conquer the world if a
good railnet exists I start trading steam to all other nations:
To France for Military Tradition + 127 gpt + Wm + 87 gold,
to Germany for 233 gpt + 14 gold
to China for 154 gpt + 5 gold
To Egypt (along with our WM + 85 gold) for incense. (we can
cancel our 65gpt for ivory deal with Cleo next year)
Trade Physics to Russia for 30gpt + 33 gold + WM
Trade Metalurgy to Babylon for 14 gpt + 17 gold + WM
I do not trade with the Zulu or Iroquios since they may well be
the next 2 candidates for conquest by us.
Countries not mentioned are to poor to trade with.
Now we are at +171 gpt
1305AD workers build railroads etc.
(I) Greeks destroyed by the Egyptians.
1310AD Trade WM around net 107 gold & 1 gpt :crazyeye:
Economics to Aztecs for 13 gpt + 40 gold. Trade Dyes + 47 gpt to
Egypt for Ivory. Cancel sending 92gpt to China for silk. No one
wants to sell us Nationalism :(
1320AD sell our WM around for net of 266 gold (sometimes I only
sold our Tm and was still getting around 10 gold for that) Sell
Rome Steam power for 12 gpt.
(I) We learn Industrialization & start on medicine,
1325AD workers build railroads etc.
1330AD Fornidden City completes Factory starts on Universal
Suffrage.

I have most of our cities hooked into a thin railnet. I started
working on really improving Brazial since it is a major shield
producer and could build either ToE or Hovers.

We have 2 towns in NA, Was Washington? & Kill Abe that can build Iron Works. We can onlu have 1 being nuilt at a time so 1 town is building iron works other building factory. Both of these towns need MM with rails.

It looks to me like we need more culture in Africa.


Here it is:

Brazil (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-AD1330.zip)

Economics to Aztecs for 13 gpt + 40 gold.
Where is the world did the Aztecs get that type of money?

I do not trade with the Zulu or Iroquois since they may well be
the next 2 candidates for conquest by us.
I agree on the Iroquois as a first target.
I see our first African target as Egypt - They are a tech leader, and I want revenge for them building Smith's.


LKendter (on deck)
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor
Jersey Joe
Dark Sheer (playing) Hopefully getting us to ToE.
I am free this weekend, so hopefully DS can turn around quickly.

5 to 10 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

Alright, I got. Will play this evening. :)

1330AD(0) - Nothing is changed.
1335AD(1) - France war on Egypt. Persia war on Zulu. Rushed a few temples and continue railroads. We lost wine supply and up lux rate to 10%. Upgraded some Knights.
1345AD(3) - Persia war on Egypt.
1350AD(4) - Iroquis war on Egypt. Discovered Medicine and going for Electricity. Also discover our first pollution. :p Lutetia in Africa flip to us! [dance]
1355AD(5) - Russia war on Egypt.
1365AD(7) - Brasilia start Palace as place holder.
1370AD(8) - Babylon war on Egypt.
1375AD(9) - Discovered Electricity and going for Scientific Method.
1380AD(10) - Spice in Spicetown is connected.
1385AD(11) - Celebration starts as spices arrived in America.
1395AD(13) - Palace expanded.
1400AD(14) - Discovered Scientific Method and shut down science. Brasilia switch to ToE. Belem starts Palace as place holder for Hoover Dam.
1405AD(15) - Nothing much happen in the world.

We are getting ToE & Universal Sufferage in 3 turns. That should lead us to Electronics and thus Hoover Dam. After that we can once again do science and go for Replaceable Parts and then Sanitation. The whole world are pretty poor except for Iroquis.

Here is the save game.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-1405AD.zip

got it!

Originally posted by Lt. 'Killer' M.
got it!

HUH????????????????????????????????

Can I have my turn here?


LKendter (playing)
Lt. 'Killer' M. (on deck)
Meldor
Jersey Joe
Dark Sheer
I am free this weekend, so hopefully DS can turn around quickly.

5 to 10 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

I sent Killer e-mail and pm messages about the turn order. Hopefully he gets one of them BEFORE he starts his turn. I am starting my turn right now and do NOT intend to replay it because he jumped out of order.

Is this game getting so interesting or what? ;)

Killer can't wait for his turn. :lol:

Actually, them game is getting a bit scary. I had hoped for the conquest of North America BEFORE rails. We are will into the industrial age, and very little of the world is ours - yet ;)

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-166.jpg


What the??????

Sucession game courtesy - do NOT use the build queue in succession games!

Lee: sorry - just got the PM and realized I screwed up big time. Just go ahead, I hadn't started anyways....


btw: i personally do not mind build queues - after all nothing is started without a popup - so you can plan for yourself, put a suggestion in - but the player who's turn it is has the decision.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-167.jpg


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-168.jpg

(0) 1405 AD - DO NOT TURN OFF AUTO-SAVE! I rely on Auto-Save for the backup of my turns.

We are cash heavy. :) I rush two Aqueducts and a Factory in Africa. I want those cities up to speed ASAP, to help with the conquest of Africa. I rush a second musket man in spice town. I rush a few buildings in the island cities - mainly Barracks and harbors.

Well, so much for Map Brokering, we already know the whole world.

I don't understand Dark Sheer's irrigation obsession? New Belem had an absurd amount of food, but it was adding irrigation? I spot the same problem with Texcoco, and several other cities.

:hammer:
I wield the veto like never before. Mainly factories before banks, cavalry instead of musket man, troops before libraries / universities - we have plenty of research power already. I add the happy build of coliseum in many cities - because of just one unhappy face; we are missing a lot of WTLKD. In addition, we are Democratic - we need every happy building possible to combat war weariness.
:hammer:

Diplomacy check offers nothing of interest, the only tech out there is Nationalism. I think I will wait for either communism or espionage to show up before giving up electricity.
(I) Egypt / Iroquois peace treaty.
Military academy is completed.
Iroquois, China starts Universal Suffrage - good luck!


(1) 1410 AD - I begin recalling all workers toward Salvador - I am going to optimize one city at a time, starting with the critical cities. 4 cities are at optimal - 3 to 4 excess food, and all growth gains shields.
Diplomatic front offers nothing.
(I) Rome wants an alliance vs. Zulu, but will not give us Nationalism - go away.
Ivory supply now costs an obscene dyes plus $115 / turn. We need to start securing more permanent luxury sources.

[dance]
Syracuse flips to us! I have NEVER seen a size 1 city flip before. It reveals Egypt cavalry in 4 squares by it!
I play the rushed worker, then rush building stunt - instant library.


(2) 1415 AD - I rush 2 factories in Africa. We are finally starting to build a power base in Africa.
There is still some money to make from WM - Egypt gives us $70 for it.
I don't know where China suddenly got money from, but they will give $720, $32/turn for gems.
The Iroquois will offer $560 for dyes - tempting, but I don't want to have to wait 20 turns for war - remember the LK game abuse rules.
(I) ToE completes - Atomic Theory and Electronics are learned
I crank science to get replaceable parts in 4 turns losing $324/turn, of course when you have $8458.
Belem will complete Hoover in 10 turns.
Universal Suffrage also completes - how is that for breaking cascades?
The palace expands, and I am happy to report - it is the entire correct scheme.


(3) 1420 AD -
(I) Australia / China ally vs. Egypt.


(4) 1425 AD - Jungleville is formed.
I send Xeres a thank you card for the 2 new workers.
I cancel the RoP with Iroquois, want to guess what is coming up?
(I) The Babylon city near our African holdings is razed!


(5) 1430 AD - Lutetia switches to Settler, due next turn.
Zulu have some cash - ship them gems for $12/turn, $40 - at least worth the bother.
I notice that New Heliopolis is a GERMAN city now - good, no culture, maybe it will flip :satan:

(6) 1435 AD - I decide it is time to sell electricity.
China gives us Nationalism, $2370, $50/turn.
Russia gives us Espionage, $204, $124/turn.
I give Egypt Iron and Electricity for Communism and $19.
France gives us $117, $60/turn.
I give Babylon Industry for $11, $76/turn.
I give Rome Industry for $11, $112/turn.
The Iroquois will only give $480 for electric power - screw it.
I upgrade 87 musket men to Rifleman for a mere $1740.
Add another 14 to the upgrade list for $280.
I love the sound of guns being cocked.
(I) I begin research on radio with a token scientist - we now have sufficient firepower to make war.
ARGGGGGGGGGGGG - The PC crash wiped out the setup for the new units. I have to restart the 1435AD inter-turn again.


(7) 1440 AD - Upgrade time again, this time to Bef. We spend another $1020 on unit upgrades.
We upgrade 13 cannon to artillery, a certain chief better start getting nervous.
Lee's Desert Hideout is formed - instant temple.
We really don't need it, but I buy a Persian worker.
(I) Egypt / America peace treaty.


(8) 1445 AD - I demand wm from the Iroquois, and they give it to me :(
I then demand $100 from the Iroquois, and they give it to me :crazyeye:
Finally, they refuse at $200 - the Iroquois are now furious with us. [dance]
(I) Silks and wine supplies simply go away.


(9) 1450 AD - Did you know that $3000/turn doesn't last long when you rush factories / police stations?
We buy Incense from Egypt for $135 / turn.
I sell the backward Romans Electricity for wines, $42/turn, $50, and wm.
I cancel $6/turn for Iron from Persia - not worth the bother.


(10) 1455 AD - Zzzzzzzzzzzz.



==========================

Summary - Once we get hospitals, we can start merging our NATIVE workers into our cities.
Use the massive cash to keep rushing Police Stations / factories and our African holdings.

Keep shuttling workers to Africa. I want to be ready to rush a rail-net over there.


LKendter (on deck)
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor
Jersey Joe
Dark Sheer (playing)

5 to 10 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete



http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-1455AD.zip


IF THE GAME CRASHES AT 37% LOADING, THEN:
Download the file - http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/SETUP-UNITS.zip

Installation instructions:
Drop the batch file SETUP-UNITS.BAT under the directory:
C:\Program Files\Infogrames Interactive\Civilization III\Art\units

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-169.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-170.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-171.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-172.jpg

Lee: that's what I call a hint the size of a planet :lol:

LKendter (on deck)
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor
Jersey Joe
Dark Sheer (playing)

will you two finish off the game for us? ;)

LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M. (playing)
Meldor (on deck)
Jersey Joe
Dark Sheer


Picky, picky, picky - I forget to change that section ;)


Just don't complain I didn't leave you enough troops. Of course, with a Democracy, we want THEM to declare war.

Keep building the transport / escort line that can head to Africa. We are almost ready to start building military in Africa. I don't want to wait for flight before attacking Egypt.

PS - Enjoy the golden age - we are bound to get a victorious BeF.

Lee: :D you know me ;)

If we are getting down to serious fighting, I think we should revolt into a republic where we can take a 100+ turns of warfare.

Well I am hoping the Lt. will kick some Iroquios butt.

We are religous, so we can switch back to Republic with little effort. If he gets a few more ships crossing the Atlantic, look out Egypt!

Alright, some clarification :

1) I didn't know there were production que around. :eek:
2) I didn't do improvement on town by town basis as most town has already have enough tiles with railroad for 12 citizens. My primary aim was to rail those production tiles. ;)

Finally, good work on building those Artillery. :goodjob:

Well most of our towns our in much better shape - I also do a town by town evaluation. Almost all of South America is sitting with cities with 3 to 4 spare food getting ready grow when hospitals appear.

****, been trying to get the save running - doesn't work. loads to 100% and quits. Must be trouble with the DLed units - will have to do that again. Please skip me.


I'll also be gone until Sunday night so expect to see 'clean' Americas by then ;)

I assume you built some BEFs. What is the official name of the files and what unit graphic did you use?

Originally posted by LKendter
Download the file - http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/SETUP-UNITS.zip

Installation instructions:
Drop the batch file SETUP-UNITS.BAT under the directory:
C:\Program Files\Infogrames Interactive\Civilization III\Art\units

Meldor I used Lee's provided set-up and it works. It uses a copy of the infantry file for the BEF. There might be something else it does for the BEF like change the ini file.

Lee has the set-up file changed since map v3? Maybe I should rerun the set-up.

I upgraded almost ALL units to BEF.

@Jersey Joe, if you see the BEF, you have the lastest version of setup.



LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor (playing)
Jersey Joe (on deck)
Dark Sheer

5 to 10 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

I had already done this, but assumed Killer had not, since he got the load bug. I had the units when we ran the beta testing.

[EDIT] Got it by the way, I have to do LK31 tonight (getting a late start as I was at a high school swim meet for my daughter tonight), and will start on LK32 first thing tomorrow.

So I am not the only 30+ person here. ;)
Seeing all the people talking about school work makes me feel ancient.

well i used the file as described - before, it crashed totally, after installing it stopped at 100% :( will have to try again I guess :(

:confused:
I just download the posted link, and it works fines.

I know you have played other hugh maps, so it isn't the game size.


C:\Program Files\Infogrames Interactive\Civilization III\Art\units
should have had 3 new directories:

Bef
Usmc
Anzac
Do you get these?

Are you using a PC or Mac?

Yes, it's all there.....

I have a PC, WinXP home.... everythign else works fine....

it also cant be the file size - I waited over 5 min...

maybe if I try now, after a reboot.....

Killer,

If it works are you going to take your turn? If so, I will un-"got it" and wait for your results.

meldor: sorry, I am too busy here preparing my trip.......

go wipe out the Iroqus!

I loaded the game on my PC and checked out the time to load.
It took FOUR minutes on my PC. A good chunk of that time was at 100%. This is with 384MB memory and 866mh Pentium III.

Could you try loading it and walk away for 10 minutes and see what happens?

1455 AD (Pre-turn)
With Hoover 2 turns away it is time to broker the techs we have for big cash.
SciMeth to China for silks (worth ~150gpt), 148gpt and 2981 gold, leaving them with 6g in the bank.
SciMeth to Cleo for 147gpt and 350 g
SciMeth to Cathie for 147gpt and 170g
Ask the Iroquois to accept voluntary tax of 500g, he refuses.
Owego is bombarded and then razed. It was to close to one of our cities.
Chondote is captured.
(I) The Aztecs and Iroquois sign an embargo against us.
Egypt and Russia make peace.
In honor of his election to power, WLT(Meldor)Day is celebrated throughout the land (It couldn't have anything to do with the free silks he gave away, oh no)
The Intelligence Agency completes.
The sum total of the Iroquois response is to attack our Knights in the frozen north.

1460 AD (1)
Another spy bites the dust attempting to infiltrate Haiwatha's HQ.
The knights counter, taking out one cav and MW.
Rush temples in Miami and Chondote.
Spy was caught by the Iroquios.
Get Lincoln to sign straight up RoP and alliance vs. Iroquois.
Sappers rail to Chondote, Miami and across Phillie to get at Oil Springs.
Oil Springs is then razed as it is too close to the surrounding cities.
Akwesasne is captured.
Niagra Falls is captured as well. The city also donates two cannon to us, which are proptly upgraded to arty.
(I) Finally, the Iroquois muster a response and attempt to re-take Niagra Falls, triggering our Golden Age. Income jumps from 2862gpt to 3969gpt.
Question: How do Iroquois rifles get three squares into the American territoryto try and reach our sappers, when they are at war with America? Did they forget to cancel the RoP?
Egypt and Persia find peace.
We complete Hoover's Dam.

1465 AD (3)
Salamanca is bombarded and then captured. We now have a native source of furs.
Not much else.
(I) The Russians sign an alliance with the Iroquois against America. We are probably too big to attack many takers.
Australia abandons it isolationist policies and signs an alliance with Russia against the Zulu.
The Iron works completes in Kill.
Although they populace insists that they still love me, they stop celebrating the fact. WW hits with polls show unhappy poeple with54% wanting peace.

1470 AD (4)
Tonawanda falls next with a quickly upgraded cannon.
Allegheny is ours with two more cannons. The cannons are upgraded in place.
Centralia is now ours, but no cannon.
Sanitation is now on the board so....
Mao gets Atomic Theory, we get Sanitation, 521gpt, 2189g, and a Trade Embargo vs the Iroquois. Oh yea, his WM for grins.
Cathie gets AT for 119gpt, 150g, Embargo and WM.
Cleo gets AT for 32gpt, 60g, WM, and Embargo.
Everyone else except for Rome and Persia gives an Embargo against Haiwatha.
I have been rushing building throughout the world. This is especially true in Africa where we have two cities in real danger of flipping. One of them even has a first ring city covered by an Egyptian city's culture.
Lux tax raised to 20% for duration of the war,
(I) The Iroquois counter attck in force and are repulsed. We lose several BEF but they lose a bunch of cav.
Hammie begs me to sell him Communism for 60g. He gets our WM for 40g instead.
The Zulu and French make peace.
All of the cities that are size 12 and complete their production this turn are switched to hospitals.
Everyone starts celebrating WTL(Meldor)D again.

1475 AD (5)
Sappers connect Tonawanda to rail net and then begin work around Buffalo and other places now out of cav range.
Mauch Chunk is ours.
I kill off 10 Iroquois Cav and 5 rifles, outside of cities
(I) Weak Iroquois counter attack with only 3 Cav

I hope the Iroquois will be nice enough to supply a leader for a North American Palace.

If you run out of buildings for Africa, start rushing troops ;)
I want to be ready for war over there to.

:goodjob: Looks like you are making good progress on taking our the Iroquios. The faster they are dead / crippled, the faster we can ship troops to Africa and begin the real battle.

The Iroquois are half done. They only have a couple of cities east of the rockies and the capital is bounced west now. They are still a democracy (as we are) so I haven't been able to plant a spy yet. Unfortunately, no GL yet. I am trying though. Grand River looks to be the spot for the new capital, unless we move it to Africa.

1480 AD (6)
CAttaraugus is captured with three cannon.
Caughawaga is our as well.
(I) The Aztecs and Germans sign an alliance against the Zulu.
Since we are in the GA and the war is going well, I am building a ton of hospitals and police stations. We don't need the police stations for corruption but they do help with war weariness. On one island, WW is reaching 100%.

1485 AD (7)
Finally! When attacking Kahnnawake we get a GL for the palace move. I won't capture Grand Rivers until next turn though, which is a good spot for our capital. BTW, we capture the city as well.
Unfortunately the Iroquois haven't finished building the rail net for us so progress is slowed. Grand Rivers takes an extra turn so I can attack from the same side of the river. No sense in throwing the troops away.
(I) Persia and Zulu sign peace.
Russia China alliance against America.
I can't believe I forgot to move BeF into Kahnnawake, the Iroquois recapture it.

1490 AD (8)
Grand River is ours.
Oka is ours as well.
Kahnnawake is returned to the fold.

Turn is only half finished, lots of stuff to rush and do.
Unfortunately I can not finish this.....there is a stack of workers in NA waiting for border lock to get NA in shape.
The GL can rush the palace as soon as Grand River is out of resistance.
Be sure and set all former Iroquois cities to entertainers until we get rid of them so they don't flip.
Inter-turn is up to 24minutes on my PC.

LK32 1490 AD Saved Game (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-1490AD.zip)

The GL can rush the palace as soon as Grand River is out of resistance.
The leader can rush it right now. I verified that the leader rush worked, 1 turn to palace in Grand River. I do want the chance for another leader. ;) Use the stack of swords near Grand River to quickly kill the resitance.

On the subject of war weariness, our approval rating is still 87%. This is the key item to watch, ww isn’t beating us up to hard. In addition, I notice the wonderful puffs of smoke by many cities, a very good sign.

Summary -
LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor
Jersey Joe (playing) - Your mission, improve the size of our transport fleet.
Dark Sheer (on deck)

5 to 10 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

Of course, continue to rush like a mad man.

Summary -
LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor
Jersey Joe (playing) - Your mission, improve the size of our transport fleet. Finish off the Iroquios.
OVER 24 hours - OVERDUE for got it.


Dark Sheer (on deck)

5 to 10 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

Jersery Joe is WAY overdue for got it.
If I don't get something with 24 hours - SKIPPED.

If JJ don't show up I will pick it up tomorrow. :)

LKendter (on deck)
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor
Jersey Joe (skipped - I don't know what is going on, but I can't wait forever)
Dark Sheer (playing) - Your mission, improve the size of our transport fleet.
Also, finish the Iroquois.

5 to 10 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

Ok, I got it. But I can only play tomorrow. So expect something to be posted tomorrow. ;)

@Dark Sheer - I know this is a monster, but let us know partial updates.

1490AD(0) - Loading time is 2 minutes on a P4 1.8 with 512MB RAM. :)
1495AD(1) - Palace completed in Grand River. Other than that mainly is movement of troops and workers.
1500AD(2) - Kahnawake flipped! :mad: Our losses was 1 Bef & 1 Swordsman. Kahnawake recaptured! :D More movement of troops & workers.
1505AD(3) - Our forces finally approaches Iroquis towns and bombardment begins. Clearing a few foolish Iroquis who tries to enter our border. More movement of troops & workers.
1510AD(4) - Discovered Corporation and going for Refining. St. Regis captured. Tyendenaga captured.
1515AD(5) - Gandasetaigon captured.
1520AD(6) - Mainly movement of troops and workers.

I did tried to post earlier but Forums was busy. :p

Originally posted by Dark Sheer

Loading time is 2 minutes on a P4 1.8 with 512MB RAM.


1510AD(4) - Discovered Corporation and going for Refining.

I did tried to post earlier but Forums was busy. :p


I am jealous of the load time ;)


:confused: Why was the 40 turn research on Radio abandonded?
We have a tech lead, and sufficient tech to take out the Iroqoius.

Forums to busy :cry:
I know, the forums have sucked recently for response time.

Actually I am going the Airport and Tank route so we can transport troops quickly to the main continent later. ;)

As it is there is nothing to rush and we have over 20k in gold even as we get tech in 4 turns and still plus 1.5k a turn. So I guess I am going for the tech lead until tank and maybe marines. :)

I have PTW.
JJ appears to be MIA.
I know Killer is getting PTW.
I know Meldor has PTW.


@Dark Sheer - do you plan to get PTW?
It looks like PTW may allow more then 16 civs! I only tested real quick, but I could assign a civ of "TEST" (# 17) a starting location. The original game would NOT let me do that.

The next world map game, IF I GET SOME RESEARCH HELP - SEE LK26, could have more then 16 civs [dance]
I was planing to add Argentina (SA needs competition!), Songhai, and possible the Mongols to offset China :satan:

The stories continues...
1525AD(7) - Iroquis captured Cincinnati. New Orlean liberated.
1530AD(8) - Discovered Refining & going for Steel. Ganogeh captured. Baltimore liberated. Gewauga captured. Goigouen captured. Signed RoP with Aztec.
1535AD(9) - Mainly movement of troops and workers.
1540AD(10) - Cempaola liberated. More movement of troops and workers.
1545AD(11) - More movement of troops and workers as we push nearer to the last Iroquis cities on American soil.
1550AD(12) - Discovered Steel & Going for Combustion. Kawauka captured. Gayagaahe captured. Kente captured and Iroquis' present in American soil is no more. Could have signed Peace Treaty if not for the Alliance with America & Aztec. :p
1555AD(13) - Cincinnati liberated.
1560AD(14) - Mainly shipment of troops to Africa. Roman captured St. Louis
1565AD(15) - Our Golden Age has ended. :( 2 cities went into disorder and entertainers hired.

Our best bet would be signing an RoP with Egypt and then declare war on Zulu. At the moment only 2 nation is polite with us, Egypt and Persia. Furthermore, we might need to keep Egypt around to avoid cultural victory. ;) Also, since I have build a number of Universities, we might want to keep science spending at 10% instead of the usual 40 turns. But of course its up to Lee now. :D

Here is the savegame.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-1565AD.zip

On the side note, of course I plan to get PTW! :D Actually I already placed my order but I am not sure when will it arrive in Malaysia. :)

Got it - It will probably take a more then 48 hours.

Will post updates when something happens, as for :flamedevi: Egypt :flamedevi:

(0) 1565 AD - The Iroquois are a non-player, just one lousy island city.
Diplomatic front shows - I am stuck with the Aztecs for 17 more turns.
9 turns of open deals with Egypt - GACK. I should have made my intentions to attack Egypt clearer.
13 turns to trade deals with America are done.

I cancel the alliance with America vs. the Iroquois.

I wake up some workers to fix over irrigation in North America.

(I) Germany / Iroquois trade embargo.
The all but dead Iroquois ally with Russia vs. Zulu.
We are the happiest nation in the world [party]


(1) 1570 AD - I don't see attacking Russia anytime soon. I sell them The Corporation for $430, $341/turn.
The same deal with Rome, I sell them Electronics for $130, $125/turn.
(I) More deals start ending :)
Persia cancels the Iroquois embargo.
France / Zulu peace treaty, followed by France declares war on the Zulu :crazyeye:
Aztec / Egypt ally vs. France.
EGADS - I am beginning to understand the slow inter-turns.
Begin research on flight, due in 6 turns.


(2) 1575 AD -
(I) Cathy calls wanting an embargo vs. the Zulu. She will pay us $288, and the Zulu have NO open deals.
I accept the offer, Zulu is on the so to be hit parade.


(3) 1580 AD -
(I) Zulu / Egypt ally vs. Rome.
America / Egypt ally vs. France.
The Pentagon is completed.


(4) 1585 AD -
(I) Babylon / Persia peace treaty.
Babylon / China MPP.
Zulu / Aztec peace treaty.
Babylon / Zulu ally vs. Iroquois.
Babylon declares war on the Zulu. WT??????


To be continued.....

I was thinking of suggesting Flight then only Motorized Transport but now I see that Lee think the same way. :D

While researching for tanks we can start building airports and also bombers. ;)

(5) 1590 AD - Germany has too much cash; I sell him AT for $1260, $32/turn.
Our alliance with the Aztecs is over, peace with the Iroquois. With one lousy island city, the Iroquois are not much of a threat. :lol: Our approval rating jumps to 99%. Luxuries drop to 0% for the moment, and science goes up.
(I) Silly AI - Aztecs ally with Egypt vs. China.
Zulu / Russia peace treaty.


(6) 1595 AD - I am running out of busy work for our workers, so many of them start fortifying in Southern Brazil. The Aztecs have $236, which is unacceptable. I sell them medicine to empty their treasury.
(I) Germany / America peace treaty.
Rome / China ally vs. Aztecs.
Mass production in 4 turns with just 50% science.


(7) 1600 AD -
(I) :crazyeye: Atzec / Egypt ally vs. Babylon.
Aztec / Egypt ally vs. Persia.


(8) 1605 AD -
(I) More really silly alliances - Russia / Iroquois ally vs. Babylon. !!! Russia declares war on Babylon.
Australia and China ally vs. Aztecs.
China declares war on Russia.


(9) 1610 AD - One deal cancelled with Egypt. We will have to survive on seven luxuries, as no other ivory is available at the moment.
(I) The insanity continues...
Egypt / Aztecs ally vs. Australia.

:satan: To be continued - I plan more then 10, as I want to actually do some fighting :satan:
I already had to do a setup last time ;)

Lee: take your time - I need to sort out the Tr1 mess anyways.

Its ok Lee, take your time and start a war. ;)

I know I am bad at starting a war, only good with fighting one. :D

(10) 1615 AD -
(I) America / Babylon peace treaty.
Amphibious warfare in 4 turns with just 40% science!

(11) 1620 AD - Our troops report the new air travel plan works, as a division of troops were successfully sent to Africa.
(I) America / Iroquois peace treaty.
Australia / China ally vs. America.
Roman ships appear by Philadelphia!
Aztecs / Egypt ally vs. Russia.
I have to do something about these reports from one city civs ;)


(12) 1625 AD -
(I) The most meaningless alliance ever - America / Iroquois have allied vs. Zulu.


(13) 1630 AD - An American galleon collided with a sight seeing boat near St. Louis. Our battle fleet by St. Louis is ordered to destroy the offending ships. The navy is happy with the performance of the battleship. Mr. Lincoln perceives this a hostile act, and war with American begins. The Americans fought bravely, killing a couple of divisions of cavalry after Philadelphia was pounded into rubble. The "glorious" Americans no longer exist. Our diplomats can't figure out Mr. Lincoln's timing, as we had no diplomatic obligations.
(I) Australia / China ally vs. Russia.
Germany / Aztecs ally vs. Persia - I am tiring of hearing silliness from Monty. He had better fear our marine!
Atzec / France peace treaty.
France / Persia ally vs. Zulu.


(14) 1635 AD - I sell Ms. Cleo Corporation for $2350. I don't want her wasting cash on things like troop upgrades.
(I) Iroquois / China ally with Russia - Hmmm, someone else who had better fear our marine!
:lol: Egypt want us to ally with them vs. Russia, how about the other way honey?
Begin research on tanks that are due in 4 turns.

You were wondering were Monty was getting his money. He is selling alliances to any one who will pay for one........and then not sending any troops.

An intertesting piece of PTW news.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-179.jpg

Once everybody gets PTW in the Earth Map crowd, a really intense world.

(15) 1640 AD -
(I) Zulu / Iroquois peace treaty.
Persia / Iroquois ally vs. Babylon.
Germany / Zulu vs. France.
Russia / Egypt peace treaty.


(16) 1645 AD - A vulture settler adds to our African Empire - Campinas 2 is formed - temple is slam rushed, I think we can afford it with over $40,000 in the bank. Same deal with Sao Goncalo 2. I may need to build more settlers soon ;)
I sell off ALL of our universities. We are in danger of an accidental culture win by about 1800 - worse as we are stopping the AI culture development. Egypt looks like #2 in culture, and is getting ripped to shreds by China / France.
(I) NOTHING!


(17) 1650 AD - We tell miss Cleo to shove our rip off prices for incense. We demand she gives us it for free, but she refuses. We cancel the deal for iron. We demand wm and get it - still just annoyed, then $10, $10, and $10. See now refuses to give us the next $10 and is furious. The Bia attempts to play a spy, and fails - WAR [dance] [dance]

ARGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG - I get hit with the memory overload bug, and lose most of the turn. :mad: I now remember why to save OFTEN on a huge map, and not to play to many turns without exiting the game.

Cities captured - Herakleia, Byzantium, Busbastis (went from size 12 to size 1 thanks to artillery SoD)
Cities temp captured - Brundisium (to close to our city).
They turn replay DOESN'T give me a leader :(
(I) Our supply of wines is lost, since we are a couple of turns from a permanent source - forget it.
We do have a couple of cities riot, however I don't thing the production break will hurt.
UNREAL - Silks come up the SAME turn :(

To be concluded....

go Lee go!

(18) 1655 AD - The navy admiral wants a test of the marine before continuing massive building of them.
The marines are proud to report the capture of Tula. The solid Aztecs are toasted.

Cities captured - New Heliopolis, Hierconpolis (a source of wines and incense), Viroconium (with a Roman and a Zulu citizen?), Mendes
Cities formed - Campo Grande 2 (we have a permanent source of Ivory)
(I) Egypt / Babylon peace treaty, which last for a few nanoseconds, as war begins again.
We really don't need it, but radio due in 6 turns - we still clear $737/turn.
I don't know what happened, but a "short" inter-turn (15 minutes).

(19) 1660 AD -
Cities captured - This
Cities formed - Porto Velho 2, Bele Horizonte 2 (I bit of a tight squeeze, but I don't want the AI near our incense. Incense road completed - natural luxury #7 as soon as borders expand.
(I) Australia / Rome ally vs. Zululand.
Egypt / Persia peace treaty.
China / Egypt peace treaty.


(20) 1665 AD -
Cities captured - Athribis, Abydos
Cities formed - Bahia 2
A great leader of Xavier is formed - he rushes a factory in Bubastis, a city that will be productive quite soon.

==========================

Summary -
Remember we CAN'T attack civs whom we have open trades, or 20 turns on peace i/p (Iroquois). Of course, I have eliminated most trade deals ;) - we are about to start mass world stomping.
Remember: We are at the MUST FIGHT point - I don't care who, but beat up / kill a civ somewhere - even a 90lb weakling like Persia / Babylon.

Universities / Libraries are BANNED - no accidental culture win here I sold some libraries, we should check for more to sell.

A naval SoD is formed by Teayo, and is about to be joined by another near Bele Horizonte. Once those transports are filled, massive island hopping is possible.

Our next targets are
Zulu - Well, we do need to take them out someday, and the cities will have some productivity.
China - they control the Alexandria choice point along with Smith's. First pass would simple be cleaning up Africa. Smith's doesn't mean much to us, but taking it would hurt the Chinese economy big time.


@ALL - We COULD still attempt for domination - forest in Tundra allows for building of cities. If we build a ton of forest up in Canada, we could be a ton of cities up there. I just realized this at the end of my turn, killers choice to start it going.

LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M. (playing)
Hopefully will load for you this time. Note: My P3 - 833 is around 4-5 minutes load time. The between turns (greater then 30 minutes!) have been brutal with all of the AI fighting and city captures going on.
Meldor (on deck)
Dark Sheer

5 to 20 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-1665AD.zip

Only one advice on China, if we plan to go to war with China we should build up an airport and fly some troops to Spicetown so we don't lose the spice to China when war starts. :)

As to the PTW part....31 Civ ?? :eek: I am thinking of a 1.5-2 hours inter turn here. :D

Good point on Spicetown - take care of that Killer.

OK got it!

it took a full re-install of everything, but now it does work! :D

ah... if i didn't miss anything, China has 1(!) saltpeter, 1(!) coal and no oil :D :mwaha:

I just better NOT here any complaints about enough troops ;)
The naval SoD building near Panama is enough to take out Australia when full.

Originally posted by LKendter
I just better NOT here any complaints about enough troops ;)
The naval SoD building near Panama is enough to take out Australia when full.

been there, done that


well, not (yet) really :lol: but I saw it and then checked the chinese islands, then checked the stack again, then the cities again, then Australia.........


and then a very evil grin started spreading on my face :satan: :flamedevi :mwaha: :mwaha:

:scan:

@Killer
Please post partial turn updates to that we know your working on it. I know this monster takes awhile.

:scan:

will do! problem is that I can't use my laptop at work atm b/c of network troubles and the office PC doesn't have a disk drive so I either need to type it all again or burn it on a CD :(

they are fixing the network atm and claim they'll be done this afternoon so I'll come here again this evening and post!

OK, finally (3h work) got my new network settings into the laptop correctly - everything seems to work - :confused: how can that be? it was their first try to install the new network........

here's what i played until now, will now play some more and finish in maybe 2 hours or so:

all losses are Cavalry, btw.

(1) I: Persia and Iroqus ally against Russia. Embargo against us between

Germany and Iroqus ends.
Zulu want embargo against Babylon - declined!

Egypt takes Abydos :eek: :eek: Their Cav doesn't even loose a single HP!

:mad:

M: I take Abydos back easily. order two settlers into nile valley (with strong escorts). I want a base from which to quickly take Suez area Chinese towns. Fill northern Marine Expeditionary Corps transports, goto it to our city closest to Australia (can then be used to go for southern China, too, while the other stack could go for their east coast :mwaha:.

move lots of troops to Abydos and Arty beyond it against Egypt, bombard some. We do NOT have sufficient artillery to move faster since the stacks are only enought for 1 town each.

(2)I: the gist is: some greek guy thinks we are the most powerfull! :lol:

I'll teach him we are the ONLY powerfull ;)

M:taken (town/losses/resisters or rushed buildings): Cairo/0/1, Buhen/0/2.

start filling Canada with cities.

fly tanks to Lees desert hidout, once there are 20 or so.......Zulus do NOT have Replaceable parts yet.....

(3) I: Rome starts taking over Egypt Babylon wants Russias hide and offers embargo Russia signs peace with Australia, China gets Germany to join war against Russia. France and Zulu sign peace (good, now their lands are ours, no frenchies to get in our tanks way). Same for France and Egypt.

P: rush Airports in Jungleville and Spicetown.

M: taken:
El-Alamei...ah.....El-Amarna/1/Temple
New Memphis/0/5
New El-Amarna/0/1
Ibabanago/0/Temple - door into Zululand wide open!

more filler cities, this time in Africa.

this turn took almost 3 hours because of the waiting when taking/founding a city!!!!!

(4) I: nothing, it still takes over 50 minutes.

M: fly tanks and Bef to Spicetown and the other isolated town in southeast asia.
El-Ashmunein/7(!)/1(!)
New Umfolozi/0/1
New Ngome/1/2
New Zimbabwe/0/destroyed
Zunguin/1/1
Mpondo/3/3
Umfolozi/0/1
Tugela/0/3
Hlobane/2/Temple
Zimbabwe (capital)/5/1 Bachs is ours :D
Bapedi/6/3
Intombe/3/4 mismoved 5 Cav because the goto-routine is too stupid to preserve the 1/3 move that would have been enough to attack the city

:aargh:
Ulundi/3/4

(4) continued:

taken:
Isipezi/1/3
Swazi/1/1
Umtata/0/1

zulus down to 1 city in mainland africa and 5 tiny island outposts.

natal2 founded.

OK, this was as close as you can get to a one turn war ;) pity that

there's four tiles to cross to get to Isandhlawa....

(5) I: as expected, Egypt signs peace with Rome. Iroquese and Rome sign an

alliance against the poor old Zulu :lol:
Zulu sign peace with Persia.

the Zulu refuse to talk - need to teach them some manners. Ishandlawa

taken for no losses.
New Bapedi cost us 1 tank.
Edfu is bombarded to pieces, gives us a leader - and falls :D

clean up some stray Zulu.


Lagash destroyed. I sit here waiting for the babs border to expand over

the rail connection to the other egyptian cities :( Sign ROp in that

case??

been waiting now for 20 minutes.....

30 min

40

ahhhhhhh! there it is! Yuk - Tanis has radius of 4! They offer two pissy

little cities we can reach easily for peace - I say no. Zulu will not

talk. Decide to regroup, rest and heal....

hand it off here - 2st battel group is approach our Pacific islands. This

turn can fill the 2nd. Propose two-point landing on China - one stack from

south, one from (north)-east :D

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32in1690ad.zip


Lee: troop number was...... sufficient ;) tx!

somehow the upload doesn't want to work :(

I'll try tomorrow morning.

LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M. (uh - did you leave any Zulu cities?)
Meldor (playing as soon as we get the game save)
Dark Sheer (on deck)

5 to 20 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

Lee: yep, had to leave the island cities sinc ethey wouldn't talk and I had to remove them from the continent because of the flip risk.


save should work now.

@killer - I was being a bit wise about how absurdly fast the Zulu collapsed.


LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor (playing)
Dark Sheer (on deck)

5 to 20 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

@ALL - We COULD still attempt for domination - forest in Tundra allows for building of cities. If we build a ton of forest up in Canada, we could build a ton of cities up there. I just realized this at the end of my turn, killers choice to start it going. We have plenty of money to rush temples.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-195.jpg

Remember: We are at the MUST FIGHT point - I don't care who, but beat up / kill a civ somewhere - even a 90lb weakling like Persia / Babylon. The 80lb weaking of the Zulu is pretty much done.

THE BAD NEWS!
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-196.jpg

Meldor, please sell ALL libraries ASAP. That date isn’t that far away!

Thanks for emailing the save, I am back on the forums. I will post updates as to the progress of our empire.

Lee: :p

that is one lesson I learned the hard way: better loose tons of Cavalry but do NOT give the enemy time to draft if they only have Riflemen, not Infantry....... we lost some 30 units I'd guess - but no counterattack at all!

@ Killer : :goodjob:

I haven't made it through the pre-turn yet. There was a lot of Navy units that hadn't moved and then I went through and checked the cities, MM were needed and sold the libraries. Hopefully I can hit an interturn break tomorrow and have some fun killing things.

Lee, one other thing we could do to slow the culture creep is to sell off all temples and Cathedrals with the 1000 year bonus and then rebuild them. That hopefully would cut their culture production in half, at least for a 1000 years. Thoughts?

I think we can live WITHOUT the temples in the large cities - 1 content face isn't that much. With Brazil being religious, we can easily switch to Monarchy is WW becomes that big of an issue.
That will crunch quite a bit of culutre. The cathedrals are harder to call, we can look at Apollo after your turn. DS may get a sell order, as the cathedrals help a lot more with happy people, I will wait a few turns.


As for killing things - I hope there is something left to kill :lol:
You won't have much Zulu to beat up, but I suspect all those marines will have a target somewhere;)

Well, Australia is sitting there, too... or China... just waiting for a free-for-all..... buy everyone into it and land some Marines 3 or 4 turns after that so they have moved their troops west to deal with all the other nations......



har har har :mwaha:

1690 AD (Pre-turn)
Cahnge a lot of builds in Africa to Temples, rush those I can. Rush a ton of units. Declare war on the Chinese. Persia gets horses, Germany 650g. Rome gets dyes and Ivory, Australia get Furs and Inscense. All declare war on China, Russia was already fighting them. Get trade embaros with everyone (even Russia) vs the Chinese. I have come to like trade embargos. The AI will sometimes bail on a war, but them seem to keep the embargos even after signing peace. Sometimes, this is just as good, as the AI doesn't always send units to the fighting.

Capture - New Byblos, Pi-Ramesses, Thebes, Buto
Capture a bunch of Chinese workers and at least 5 cannon.

(I) Chinese backlash consists of some shore bombardment in Africa. We get Radio, start on Fission. WW hits in a lot of cities. Must have hit #1 in some catagory, we get palace expansion.

Thus ends the longest turn I have every played in any civ game. Checking the cities and rushing units took hours and hours. Rushes take a long time when you have to switch to worker rush, switch to desired unit and rush again. Oh well, it will play off from now on.

Thus ends the longest turn I have every played in any Civ game. Checking the cities and rushing units took hours and hours. Rushes take a long time when you have to switch to worker rush, switch to desired unit and rush again. Oh well, it will pay off from now on.
I know that feeling. In addition, you have the big library sell off. My university sell off alone took a while.

The turns that I finished the last world map game with taking most of the Persia cities took forever. Of course, it did achieve domination ;)

I agree that it will pay off, just like my getting our first African cities speed rushed to the point of producing troops.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It is time to start thinking about LK## - World Map - Songhai. There is still a decent amount of time left to finish this one, but I suspect we will continue to steamroll at this point. I have a feeling that China will start having there island cities quickly taken away with the marine stack, not to mention expanding from the two islands that we have cities on.

1) 4 players in the minimum for a sg, and I don't want to spend more time to develop the Songhai if I don't have at least 4 players.
Do the other players here want to play in the next wm game?

2) I got rid on Tundra cities to try and improve the inter-turn speed. This is clearly NOT working. The lack of Tundra cities is also causing a lot earlier fighting in Eurasia that is making the game easy for us. This also limits the ability to win by domination. I think Tundra cities should be valid again.
Should I allow cities back on Tundra for the next game?


I finally have the Songhai city list. :)
I NEVER found a name for the Songhai Knight :(
I think my leader list can go to 3 by making the planned head-of-state (Ali) a leader. I just need to find a different head-of-state. This will make 3 leaders, which I can live with.

3) The science factor can be changes to 10 - giving techs every 4 turns even in the BC. With some good trading, you should get a very short game. Would any of you be available for a science-cheated test game for several test scenarios?


4) At the current time I play for this to be Civ3, not PTW. DS / Killer let me know when you get PTW, as we can go to 17+ civs ;)


Additional thoughts to speed up the finish:
Build some northern transports to drop workers on either or islands above Canada.
Rush build a transport in Alaska, drop 6 workers, settler and escort on an ice island. Keep hoping to the ice islands, to get at least 9 squares an islands.

I will do whatever you need. Just let me know.

For the Songhai:

LKendter
meldor (confirmed)
Dark Sheer ?????
Lt. 'Killer' M. ?????

@meldor - when your turn is done, I will come up with some testing to do. Any comments on the Tundra cities? I hope to this weekend enter the Songhai information I collected ;)

I think you are correct. The lack of space in europe cause earlier wars which really slowed things down. I haven't even had an inkling that this game was even close to being at risk. I haven't seen a big difference in interturn times either. Put them back in and let 'er rip.

I understand that PTW should be out in Germany by the end of the month. That should at least take care of Killer. I haven't heard of any dates for the Orient, but it might be possible to get a copy shipped.

I had never heard of the Songhai, so did a real quick look for them. It seems just at first glance that anyone but Sunni Ali for the official leader wouldn't be quite right.

I don't know what your list is, but I did see these:

"Amina, daughter of Queen Turunku of the Songhai in mid-Niger ruled the Hausa empire from 1536 to 1573. She extended her nation's boundaries to the Atlantic coast, founded cities and personally led her army of 20,000 soldiers into battle."
( http://www.gendergap.com/military/Warriors-1.htm )

"The Songhai emperor Muhammad ibn abu Bakr Ture justifies his wars of expansion in the southern Sahara as jihads meant to spread orthodox Islam throughout the region."
( http://ejmas.com/kronos/NewHist1350-1699.htm )

On their downfall and cav -
"Four thousand Moroccan, Andalusian, and Turkish soldiers under the command of a Spanish eunuch called Judar Pasha smash a Songhai army of about 20,000 men near Gao, in present-day Mali. The Moroccan victory was due almost entirely to their firearms panicking the Songhai cavalry’s horses, which had never before seen or heard gunpowder weapons. The Moroccan victory represents the first major use of firearms in Sudanic Africa, and caused the Songhai Empire to become a province of the Sultanate of Morocco."

So it seems they were the "Gunshy Knights" !

A page on some African role play game calls the Songhai Knights
as ""Faris" - but I'm unsure if they mean horse/cav or some infantry in armor

http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Ring/1399/d-intro-ifar.html

For others as clueless on the Songhai, a short defn I came across was:
Songhai Empire - the kingdom led by Sunni Ali Ber from 1464 to 1492, and the Askia dynasty from 1493 to 1592, it grew out of the city-state of Gao. Before its capital was sacked in 1591 by a Moroccan invasion, it had been a major trading nation, an active promoter of Islam. Portuguese sea trading routes sealed its demise.
( http://caql.org/questions/veto02/B2B.html )

These world map games look rather interesting, but just skimming the last page the game length seems downright oppressive - are you guys having fun with this?? (The idea of a map with 31 civs sounds pretty slick too)

Charis

I have PTW already - sabo10 kindly shipped it to me :D it arrived yesterday and I already have a new favorite UU - the Berserk :D

Charis,

It is a different type of game. You control an empire. You know you are in for the long hauk, no quick victories. You know were everything is at, but can you do anything about it. This game hasn't been as intense as the last one. There we had to go after most of the AI covs major cities in a short period to keep all of them from launching. I think we had most of the cvis building parts at one time. It was also the first game I had ever seen the AI use nukes on a first strike basis. Most other SGs and SP games never make it to a point were that is possible.

Killer,
Are we going to see "K6 - The Zany 'Zerkers" anytime soon. If so sign me up.

Originally posted by meldor
You know where everything is at, but can you do anything about it.

This game hasn't been as intense as the last one. There we had to go after most of the AI covs major cities in a short period to keep all of them from launching.


:satan: Actually, I just found out the you DON'T have to know where everything is at :satan:
We have an option to randomize resources. I am very tempted to turn it on, any comments from the others?

On the subject of space race, do you mean joys like some civs hitting part #9, or paying $146/turn to have the Iroquois fight America to give us enough time to hit the capital?

Originally posted by LKendter



:satan: Actually, I just found out the you DON'T have to know where everything is at :satan:
We have an option to randomize resources. I am very tempted to turn it on, any comments from the others?
That would be great, add more to the mix. No more rushing to SA to make sure you grab rubber. Of course a lot of that will still hold true, as the terrian effects the resources. Still, the early resources and luxes in unknown places would be great.


On the subject of space race, do you mean joys like some civs hitting part #9, or paying $146/turn to have the Iroquois fight America to give us enough time to hit the capital?
That is what made it so much fun. If you can't lose, you may as well not play the game.

meldor: it will be K7 :lol:

you missed out on K 6 - Diplomacy. I decided I need to learn some humility - diplo is the only way to win :lol:

but K 7 isn't far - anyone else interested?

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=37301

there you go - everyone is invited (provided you are a warmonger)....

@Lt. 'Killer' M.

Actually, I am already doing Viking game, the current always war ;)

Since you are reading this thread:
Any comments on the next world map game?
1) Do you want to play
2) The recent posts about possible changes including resource randomizes

@Dark sheer
The same issues ;)

Killer, I will join you....I see it as standard with lots 'o islands. 'Zerker raiders in galleys assualting coastal cities and retreating with the goods.

[EDIT]...and now back to your regularly scheduled programming.

Songhai Status.
1) Do you want to play in the next world map game?
LKendter
Meldor


2) We have an option to randomize resources. I am very tempted to turn it on, any comments from the others?
For:
LKendter
Meldor


3) Upgrade the game to PTW, currently have PTW
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.


4) I got rid on Tundra cities to try and improve the inter-turn speed. This is clearly NOT working. If anything, it caused a negative effect with a lot earlier fighting in Eurasia.
For:
LKendter
Meldor

Without going into details, my time has gotten more demands on it, including a possible part-time opportunity to pick up more cash. I simply can't invest the time to finish the Songhai with there being a good possibility of the game starting. The project is on HOLD until such time I get confirmation of enough possible players from this group, or a lurker who has played HUGE maps before


5) Up the level on the next game to EMPEROR.
For:
LKendter

Just to give you an idea how crazy random resources get!

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LAK-205.jpg

I love the unknown! ;)

Anything on the world map is good for me. :D

Originally posted by LKendter
@Lt. 'Killer' M.

Actually, I am already doing Viking game, the current always war ;)

Since you are reading this thread:
Any comments on the next world map game?
1) Do you want to play
2) The recent posts about possible changes including resource randomizes


hope you enjoy the 'zerks ;)

1) Hell yes I'd love to play!
2) use random. If it stinks it's only a game after all ;)

OK, as soon as I get literal "YES, I want to play" from DS, I will start working on the Songhai.
I think his comment is a yes, but not definitive. NO question of a yes from Killer ;)
Still waiting on Tundra comments from Killer and DS.
Still waiting on level comments from all.
Really hoping for a lurker that plays wm to give us player #5 [party]

1) Do you want to play in the next world map game?
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Dark Sheer (??? - No direct answer, but appears yes)

2) We have an option to randomize resources. I am very tempted to turn it on, any comments from the others?
For:
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Dark Sheer


3) Upgrade the game to PTW, currently have PTW
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Dark Sheer (status = UNKNOWN)

4) I got rid on Tundra cities to try and improve the inter-turn speed. This is clearly NOT working. If anything, it caused a negative effect with a lot earlier fighting in Eurasia.
For:
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M (NOT YET VOTED).
Dark Sheer (NOT YET VOTED)

5) Up the level on the next game to EMPEROR.
For:
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M (NOT YET VOTED).
Dark Sheer (??? - No direct answer, but appears yes)

Tundra: I still like the idea of NOT being able to found cities in desert and Tundra, but if that screws up Europe then take it ou!
emperor: OK!

OK, as soon as I get literal "YES, I want to play" from DS, I will start working on the Songhai.
I think his comment is a yes, but not definitive. NO question of a yes from Killer ;)
Still waiting on Tundra comments from Killer and DS.
Still waiting on level comments from all.
Really hoping for a lurker that plays wm to give us player #5 [party]

1) Do you want to play in the next world map game?
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Dark Sheer (??? - No direct answer, but appears yes)

2) We have an option to randomize resources. I am very tempted to turn it on, any comments from the others?
For:
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Dark Sheer


3) Upgrade the game to PTW, currently have PTW
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Dark Sheer (status = UNKNOWN)

4) I got rid on Tundra cities to try and improve the inter-turn speed. This is clearly NOT working. If anything, it caused a negative effect with a lot earlier fighting in Eurasia.
For:
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M
Dark Sheer (NOT YET VOTED)

5) Up the level on the next game to EMPEROR.
For:
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M
Dark Sheer (??? - No direct answer, but appears yes)

1695 AD (1)
A whole lot of bombardment. RoP Babylon to get at China. China had a fleet of ten ironclads off the African coast, they are all now at 1hp.

Cities founded - Vitoria2, New Salavador2
Cities razed - Giza
Cities captured - Byblos, Alexandria (and Smith's), Delhi

(I) Germany and Persia sign peace. Rome wants steel, get gems instead. Persia wants alliance vs Russia, they get free WM instead. Iroquios and China imbargo us. They sign an alliance against Germany, Australia, and Persia. They also retake Delhi. Russia and Zulu sign embargo against us. Babylon and Egypt sign a peace treaty.

1700 AD (2)
Slow production of marines and change them over to tanks. We plant a spy in China. They have 51 ironclads and 127 infantry. We get a GL in the battle for Asyut who rushes a factory at Campo Grande 2. The Egyptians no longer have any African holdings.

Cities founded - Desert Retreat
Cities razed - None
Cities captured - New Paoting, New Yangchow, Tanis, Sardis, New Elephantine, Asyut, Delhi (again).

(I)
France and the Iroquois ally against Russia. Rome and Iroquois ally vs Babylon. France and Rome ally against Babylon. Iroquois and Babylon sign a peace treaty. Iroquois and China sign an alliance vs Rome.

1705 AD (3)
Get another GL in battle for Madras.

Cities founded - None
Cities razed - None
Cities captured - Madras, New Ulundi, New Intombe

YES! YES! YES! ;)

However, I am still waiting for my copy of PTW. :( I placed my order on 26/10 and the shop now tell me its out of stock!! :mad:

So I might need to wait a little for PTW.

Cities captured - Byblos, Alexandria (and Smith's), Delhi
[dance]
With this news we can revolt back to Monarchy if ww gets to bad, thanks to a HUGH increase in income. I suspect we have gained several hundred a turn with the size of our nation and the number of marketplace, banks, harbors and airports we have. This also tells me that outside of the couple of French cities, we own Africa. We definitely crimped China big time.

@Meldor - It looks like you have begun the island hopping vs. China :)
There is a ton of cities to pick up from China that way including a big chunk of them in Japan.
If you haven't already done so - how about a couple rushed transports in the Indian Ocean, so that we can land in Madagascar at the stray island cities left for Egypt / Zulu.

@Meldor / Dark Sheer - For once I am NOT in a rush to see the next turn. It appears I could get in over the Thanksgiving holiday weekend (11/28 to 12/1), and I know I won't have the time for this monster that weekend as I will see my family 4 days straight.

@All - The start of work on Songhai will begin.

@Dark Sheer - Any comments on issues #4 / 5?


1) Do you want to play in the next world map game?
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Dark Sheer

2) We have an option to randomize resources. I am very tempted to turn it on, any comments from the others?
For:
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Dark Sheer


3) Upgrade the game to PTW, currently have PTW
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Dark Sheer (status = waiting)

4) I got rid on Tundra cities to try and improve the inter-turn speed. This is clearly NOT working. If anything, it caused a negative effect with a lot earlier fighting in Eurasia.
For:
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M
Dark Sheer (NOT YET VOTED)

5) Up the level on the next game to EMPEROR.
For:
LKendter
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M
Dark Sheer (??? - No direct answer, but appears yes)

@Medor -
:satan: We could rush a airport in Los Angeles, upgrade the transport, and send the marines to kill the Iroquois once an for all :satan:


I understand the massive turn 0 - quite a bit changed in Africa, too much going on in the Pacific, etc.

I found New Unlundi. The island hopping has begun :)

I have a transport with Marines headed for the Chinese city next to the last Iroquois city. I had planned on hitting it after the Chinese city. I will look at your suggestions. It may free more units to hit more islands.

1705 AD (3)
(I) China and the Iroquois sign an alliance vs Egypt. Russia and Rome sign vs the Zulu. Our trade embargo with Russia against the Zulu ends. France and China sign an alliance against Australia. France and China sign against Rome. China and Babylon sign against us, hmmm, more targets. Babylon and China vs. Austrilia. Egypt and France sign vs Germany. China and the Zulus find peace.
Wonder why the interturn is so long, Rostov goes from China to Rome to China

1710 AD (4)
With the betrayal of Babylon, we no longer have an RoP to re-enforce the units in India. That front may slow for a few turns while the troops clear a path through Babylon. Got another GL from an elite Cav. Unfortunately he is in India. He will rush an airport in Delhi. We own all of the Chinese holdings in former India, and will work our way through Banhladesh next.

Cities Founded -
Cities Razed - New Tugela.
Cities Captured - Lahore, Bombay, Indus, Bengal, Hyderabad. New Giza.

(I) Like an idiot, I didn't see the Babylonian city in our midst in Africa, thought I checked. It cost us San Salvador 2 (a new city). They will pay. Egypt and Russia sign vs the Zulu.

1715 AD (5)
I kill off the Babylon units in our territory. Re-build San Salvador 2 as Snafu. Notice the Bab capital name below....

Cities Founded - Snafu, Fubar
Cities Razed -
Cities Captured - Babylon, Oryx, Nineveh, Chengdu 2. New Umtata, Astrakhan.


I went ahead and upgraded the Galleon and rushed the airport. It was worth it just to get another transport full of marines half way across the Pacific.

Actually what I noticed was Chengdu 2 and New Umtata. 2 more cities south of Australlia that are ours. Astrakhan shown more island hoping - China is a great target for acquiring islands ;)

You do have a massive front to keep track of - Oryx is in the middle east :) with two Babs cities nearby.

Oryx was actually easy. I had already sent 5 tanks in its direction while I still had the RoP with the Babs. The city was first bombed from the south and then it only took one tank to capture the city. The tank took out a 1 hp rifle without damage so I attacked the 1 HP musket that was under it with the asame tank to get the auto promotion. That was it for the city. I then used the other four tanks to move next to the closest Bab city and they can attack next turn. Its strongest defender is a Cav. I also have units set to take the Bab city on mainland Africa, and we are approaching Ur. Once Ur is taken, the RoPs with Germany and France will give us the passage back to India. I don't know why the Babs did what they did, they are now toast. Before I end my turn, they will be like the Egyptians and the Zulu, only clinging to life because their last cities aren't close enough to hit yet. I am hoping to take out the Zulu, Iroquois, and the Egyptians before the end of my turn. The Egyptians may live, as I may not have time to get the last couple of island cities with marines before time expires. I have, however, been bombingg their cities to dust each turn and any vessel theat set out from port is quickly reduced to 1hp and heads back to repair. I will probably rush a transport on the eastern Africa coast so I can send it full of tanks to take Madagasgar.
It may well be that after we crush the Chinese, we might as well declare war on everyone else and just take it by conquest. We awould be pretty close in which would be first, the conquest or the domination.
I am in Democracy still running 30% lux. I have thought about going to Republic (we should have picked up two more native luxes before the Chinese are done. I will try to stick with democracy as long as possible (until I need 50% lux).

I think it is time to revolt back to Monarchy. With 7 or 8 luxuries we can keep plenty of people happy un Monarchy. We will lose some productivity due to higher corruption, but the luxury tax is going up to fast. The only thing that would help - kill a civ like the Zulu or Egypt and get rid of a ww source.


As for turning on the whole world - lets stay with on civ at a time.

1715 AD (5)
I rush a transport on the east coast of Africa and then throw us into anarchy.

(I) Germany and Babylon sign an alliance against us. Persia and Babylon sign a peace treaty. Persia and Germany sign a trade embargo against us. They also sign a military alliance against Egypt and France. Rome and Egypt sign a military alliance against Persia. Ten years of chaos suits our people and WLT(Meldor)D breaks out all over our empire.

1720 AD (6)
The Bab city in Africa is ours. Its a good thing that I am observant, otherwise I might have left some sleeping transports full of marines and Bef sitting off the coast. They are on their way now.

Cities founded -
Cities razed -
Cities captured - Zariqum, Uruk, Bangalore, Chittagong, Dortmund, Hangchow 2, Beijing 2

Peace? Whats that?

What a totally insane picture! It was definitely time for war happy Monarchy. I think we need to simplify that picture, and knock a couple civ off of it;)

meldor: have you submitted it as SOTD?

ONe correction and two omissions. The anarchy was only 5 years (1 turn) and we are now a Monarchy. Also I made some cheap lux trade deals with both France and Rome to keep them from betraying us as well. Rome could probably do a little damage before we knocked them down but there is no sense in giving them incentive.

Of interest is the fact that the Germany alliance is the second betrayal committed against us. We had both an RoP and alliance against China with Germany. They didn't make peace with China though, so good luck to them. There are a lot of German cities between us and the Chinese. They also HAD a couple in south India that are now ours. They also have one in SE Asia which should be ours in the next few turns.
Since most of the AI cities (except for China's) are protected by rifles at best I don't expect this game to get back around to me unless it is for clean-up and island capture (although I am trying to take care of most of that now).
I was half way kidding about jjust going to war with everyone, be careful what you wish for.....

Killer, I didn't even think about it, you are welcome to point it out to themm if you like.

Go Meldor go!! :D

By the way, I just got my PTW today so if the next sg is on PTW I am fine now. ;)

DarkSheer: :goodjob:[party]

1720 AD (6)
We land troops on Madagascar. We are at war with the covs of all three cities. As a funny side note, somehow the Romans get a foothold on our side of the world. I built a forest patch near them and they immediately sent a settler/rifle pair to try and settle it. I put a tank on top of it to hold it until a settler was ready.

(I) It is really calm this turn. I watch Chinese ironclads run from our battleships.

1725 AD (7)
During exercises in the Hawaian Islands our troops accidently bomb and then invade the Iroquois city of Kiohero. We tried to give the city back, but unfortunately it was their only one and we were unable to locate Hiawatha to return it. We will hold it for him until he is located. Get another GL, rush a factory.

Cities founded -
Cities razed -
Cities captured - Ur, Persepolis (German), Samarra, Kiohero, Kolhapur, Ganges, New Isandhlwana (Chinese), Amatikulu, New Leipzi, Pasargadae, Gordium.

(I) The evil Chinese steal Pasargar from us!

1730 AD (8)
We retake Pasargadae. Kill off a German Cav army. We capture the rest of SE Asia. This is mainly a setup turn, lots of movement little action.

Cities founded - Janfu, Istfu
Cities razed -
Cities captured - Pasargadae, New Bombay (German), New Alexandria (Chinese)

==========================

Ok, it is time to begin the testing.
I am still trying to find a name of the Songhai Knight.
I am still trying to find another leader -
One possible is Sulaiman-Mar, but I could only find his name mentioned once anywhere :(

-------------------------

I am still working on issues including that I want to spend my time to add Argentina to balance Brazil as part of this game, and I could use some testing help. These will be a science cheated test. Expect a *VERY* fast tech game.

1) Songhai ICS test. Pack cities two squares away, and simply verify a wrap back to Gao.
>>>I don't want stuck on Geelong again.
2) USA test. With the loss of Jersey Joe, we never finished the testing of the USA changes.
Play the USA, probably with just the American continent civs to be quick.
Get to the point of marines - attack and verify a GA.
Stop after building your first regular jet fighter.
>>> This time America should be around awhile, so the USMC may appear.
3) Australia test.
Play unit 1 Anzac is built.
>>> I don't know if I have to change the directories for ANY new unit to the PTW directories.
4) Diplomacy test with contact and Songhai
Play as a neighbor of the VERY AGRESSIVE Songhai, and verify Shaka animation in all 4 eras.
>>> I blew this with Australia, and don't want a repeat.


My time will be to complete the research on Argentina and Songhai cleanup.
This is still more to do, and more tests to run before the next world map game.
I will not start the game until these test are done - wm games take a hugh time commitment, as I don't want to waste a ton of time for a crashed game

If you can help with any, post which one you will test.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LKWorld-V8-QUICK.zip

-------------------------



V8 - Restore Tundra based cities. Add the forest back to Cananda, and Siberia.
Remove Rome and replaced with the Songhai - Religious and Commercial.
With literally several thousand cultures under its control, Songhai was the largest empire in African history.
GovermentLeader is Sunni Ali

City list =
Gao, Timbuktu, Jenne, Koumbi Saleh, Walata, Sokoto, Gwandu, Arwan
Hombori, Segu, Agadez, Katsina, Busa, Diara, Nioro, Tadmekket
Kukiya, Kangaba, Kano, Taghaza, Tekedda, Taudene, Awlil, Tendirma
Tondibi, Niani


Unique Unit = A knight with the stats of 5-3-2
Great Leaders =
Askia Mohammed (he was Sonni Ali's best general)
Alternate versions of name: Muhammad Ture, Muhammad Ibn Abi Bakr Ture
Ali Kohlen (was taken hostage, then later returned to Gao and liberated his people)



V7 - Further drop OCN to 20.
Add an extra worker and settler to Australia to help that position
Add an extra worker to Aztecs to help that position.
Tell Germany to build more workers.
Added some gold to Western Africa, and many of the civs in that area were involved in gold trade.
Fixed cost of Caravel to 40 shields.


V6 - Move Aztecs one square south, slight terrain improvement.
Privateer movement up to 4.
Brazil is not allowed regular infantry.
Fixed crash with Diplomacy and Australia when they are in the Industrial age.
Fixed Diplomacy to show the right leader head for Australia.
Remove nearby cattle to weaken Brazil position.
Deleted 2 other cattle in SA to weaken Brazil position.
Reduce OCN from 40 to 32, and lowered science factor - this is to attempt to help early science.
Added new culture level: 3.5 to 1 = blown away by


V5 - Playtest showed issue with Tundra. Forest on Tundra = forest.
To limit cities, I must make all Tundra without forest.
Minor improvement to Russian starting position.
The bad thing of stealing a country - I left Brazil with Samuria - switching to regular knights.
Switch America to regular fighter
Added new culture levels: 1.5 to 1 = very impressed, 2.5 to 1 = Great Admirers


V4 - Slightly improved the Greek starting position.
Removed Japan as a civ.
With the elimination of Japan, removed game and 3 goody huts near China.
Added another barb camp near China.
Japan is replaced by Brazil - Industrious and Relgious.
Goverment Leader = Dom Pedro de Alcântara (the emperor when Brazil was recognized as an independent country)
Great Leaders:
Gen. Eurico Gaspar Dutra (ww2 general)
João Baptista de Oliveira Figueredo (Brazilian general and politician, president of Brazil (1979-85)).
Cândido Mariano da Silva Rondon (Brazilian explorer and founder of the Indian Protection Service. A major in the army. The Brazilian state of Rondônia is named after him.)
Jose Joaquim da Silva Xavier (the leader of the Inconfidência Mineira, a movement against Portuguese rule in late 1780's)
José Bonifácio de Andrada e Silva (known as the "Patriarch of Independence" in Brazil)
Unique Unit = Bef (Brazilian Expeditionary Force) from WWII.
>>>> Cities are NO longer allowed in Tundra . <<<


V3 - Deleted 3 wheat around India to weaken the position.
Deleted 2 cattle around China to weaken the position.
Change the leader of Australia to Menzies and setup as a male.
Middle / Industrial age ship movement up by 1: Caravel, Frigate, Galleon, Ironclad
Modern Era ship movement up by 2: Transport, submarine, destroyer, battleship, Aegis Cruiser, Nuke Sub
Special: Carrier up by 3 - these ships were just as fast as battleships, if not faster.
F15 is removed - new USA unique unit USMC: 10 attack, 8 defense.


V2 - Added Australia. After playtest, improved the Australlian landmass slightly.
Improved the Babylonian position by removing point-blank barb camp, slight terrain improvement.
Placed a horse into America.


V1 - Took a copy of Marla Singer's Map, and cut back on coast squares that are out of reach for the sake of domination. Removed several Ice only islands.

1730 AD (8)
(I) The Chinese take Persepolis!

1735 AD (9)
We conquer Magagascar, Egypt, Zulu, and Babylonian are down to 1 city a piece. We are chewing into German holdings and are going to be attacking the Second ring cities of the Chinese empire next run. As I said, this one shouldn't get back to me.

Cities founded -
Cities razed -
Cities captured - Ashur, Antioch, Arbela, New Hlobane (Chinese), Sebennytus, New Mpondo (Egyptian), New Berlin, Jaipur, Shuruppak, New Chendu, Hangchow

(I) The Germans bombard a tank of ours down to 1 HP and then I watch as 6 rifles attack it in a row, all die but the last and our tank retreats with 1 hp and is elite.

1740 AD (10)
The steam roll continues.

Cities founded -
Cities razed -
Cities captured - Pune, Pharsalos. Tarsus, Tsingtao 2, Samaria, Tatung, Paoting, Shanghai 2, Nanking 2,

1745 AD (11)
I have to take part of this turn so I can do three attacks, forgive me.
1 - Eridu is captured, eliminating the Babylonians.
2 - Attack New Pi-Ramesses, one win, one loss, leaves the Egytians alive with one 1HP inf in their last city.
3 - New Swazi is liberated and the Zulu are gone.

Well, two out of three isn't bad. Shame about the Egyptians.
If you see any workers running around, they are cleaning pollution.

LK 32 1745 AD Saved Game (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LK32-1745AD.zip)

LKendter (on deck) - Can’t play this monster till Monday.
Lt. 'Killer' M.
Meldor (I suspect one 1 turn for him).
Dark Sheer (playing)
We are in deep you know what, Culture win in 1782 AD. :mad:
Remind me to turn that OFF next game! I did check even selling just a handfull of temples / catherdrals changed it to 1784.
PRE-TURN - Sell all culture buildings unless we need it for gaining tiles - 10% luxuries is better than accidental culture win.

Domination status
Still needed tiles / pop
1695 AD - 3774, 524
1745 AD - 2579, 103

5 to 20 turns - 24 hours for got it, 48 hours from last player turn to complete

Hmmm...cultural win...is it possible to turn it off with Gramphos' multitool? I will give that a try and see. :)

Another question, if I were to use the PTW client to load and continue this SG, will it affect the game in anyway? I have tried loading old SG with PTW and they seems to work but I never try to reload those game with Civ3. I am just a little lazy to keep switching CD...hehe :p

I will get the game this evening when I get home. Just tried out a new game with PTW yesterday with every Civ on Marla's Map (added all the correct starting position for the 8 new Civ myself) and it is tough even at regent level on Eurasia!! :D

Leave the game as CivIII. I don't know if it will have any effects, so stick with pure civIII. I know CivIII *WON'T* leave a ptw game.

Lee, I will start the ICS and let you know.

You didn't look at the save game Lee, the only civ we will have a problem knocking out by then is the Aussie, and that only because we can't start for 10 turns and they have more islands. Otherwise we should easily cruise to a conquest win before then.

Ok, I got it and will play it using the original Civ3. :)

why the hell can't we go for Aussie right now? meldor: is it distance you are talking about or a treaty? If the latter - behave like an AI - break it :D

Yes, it is a treaty. We have about ten turns left on it. I would have to agree with you at this point that treaties and rep mena nothing. However, it really won't matter as we can finish sweeping Asia and Europe. It might be nice to start the process of getting the foothold and building the airport that spells their doom.

Probably the area I know I play different then most, and it shows. I don't like playing like the AI, and definitely don't like useing it's worst traits.

I won't disagree that rep is becoming meaningless, but personally I would wait the 10 turns.

Of course, since we may win "cultural" soon, the whole discussion may be meaningless.

This is another bad this about the lack of tundra cities - you are forced into painful every city conquest mode :(

I agree, we stated "no broken treaties" at the start, no we should finish that way. I am not trying to argue for breaking them now, just pointing the things out. It will take almost the complete ten turns just the get the units there to attack and hold anyway.

The same applies to the French, Romans and Russians. By the time we clean up the Chinese and Germans, we will be well placed to take them out (except islands) in a few turns.

I will say that in my SP games, I will play "honorably" until it gets to the point that it doesn't matter. Most of the time, I just stop making deals of any kind, so honor doesn't enter in to it. However, I won't extend a game for 10-15 turns when it is past the point of no return. It is either that or not finish the game at all. As you can probably tell by my playing style most of them (even diety) are conquest wins. I hate diplo and culture wins. Once is nice, but after that it usually hits just when the game gets interesting.

My point wasn't stated clearly - At this point, it doesn't matter. My personal preference doesn't rule the game.

I would not have set up the need to wait 10 turns. I would NOT have signed any treaties in the first place. That is why my 20 ended with almost ZERO treaties, to set it up for any possible target.

I am well underway for V9 to be completed [party]
Unique unit seems by block again.

V9 - Added Argentina
Commericial - Heavily dependent on the trade of Agriculture
Militaristic - Much of its time in 1800's was in external of internal wars.

Unique Unit = ?????????????????????
Creole revolutionaries - weak possibility.

Great Leaders =
Jose de san Martin - Lead the removal of Spanish influence in nearby countries.
Justo Jose de Urquiza - overturned the cruel dictatorship of Rosas
General Bartolome Mitre - Reestablished Buenos Aires as the captital
Agustin Pedro Justo - he was instrumental in ending the Chaco War.

Rejected
Julio Roca - Won the war to claim the reamining Indian land (how significant?)
Simon Bolivar - Also involved in the removal of Spanish influence in nearby countries (however, little with Argentina)

Goverment Leader = Bernardino Rivadavia, first president of the Argentine republic.


Capital = Buenos Aires
Preffered Goverment = Republic
Disliked Goverment = Communism

City list =
Buenos Aires
La Plata
Ushuaia
Rio Gallegos
Rawson
Viedma
Bahin Blanca
Neuquen
Santa Rosa
Mar de Plata
Tandil
Mendoza
San Luis
San Juan
La Rioja
Salta
Santa Fe
Lujan
Tigre
Zarate
Cordoba
Posadas
Formosa
Avenllanada
Rosario
San Luis
Villa Maria
Parana
Concordia

Ok, it is time to begin the testing.
I am still trying to find a name of the Songhai Knight.
I am still trying to find another leader - One possible is Sulaiman-Mar, but I could only find his name mentioned once anywhere :(
I am trying to find any idea for the Argentina UU.


-------------------------

I am still working on issues including that I want to spend my time to add Argentina to balance Brazil as part of this game, and I could use some testing help. These will be a science cheated test. Expect a *VERY* fast tech game.

1) Songhai ICS test. Pack cities two squares away, and simply verify a wrap back to Gao.
Meldor is doing >>>I don't want stuck on Geelong again.


2) USA test. With the loss of Jersey Joe, we never finished the testing of the USA changes.
Play the USA, probably with just the American continent civs to be quick.
Get to the point of marines - attack and verify a GA.
Stop after building your first regular jet fighter.
>>> This time America should be around awhile, so the USMC may appear.


3) Australia test.
Play unit 1 Anzac is built.
>>> I don't know if I have to change the directories for ANY new unit to the PTW directories.


4) Diplomacy test with contact and Songhai
Play as a neighbor of the VERY AGRESSIVE Songhai, and verify Shaka animation in all 4 eras.
>>> I blew this with Australia, and don't want a repeat.

5) Diplomacy test with contact and Argentina
Play as a neighbor of Argentina, and verify Monty animation in all 4 eras.
>>> I blew this with Australia, and don't want a repeat.

6) Argetina ICS test. Pack cities two squares away, and simply verify a wrap back to Buenos Aires.
>>>I don't want stuck on Geelong again.


My time will be to complete the research on Argentina and Songhai cleanup.
This is still more to do, and more tests to run before the next world map game.
I will not start the game until these test are done - wm games take a hugh time commitment, as I don't want to waste a ton of time for a crashed game

If you can help with any, post which one you will test.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/LKWorld-V9.zip

1745AD(0) - Pre-turn. Nanking captured after some bombardment. No city in America is building settlers? :confused: France enter into alliance with China against us. [dance] Enter into RoP with Roman to get to Germany (Also let Roman get to France ;) )
1750AD(1) - Poitiers captured. Sheer's Northern City founded. New Brasilia 2 founded. New Sao Paulo 2 founded. Kish captured. Shanghai captured. New Canton captured. Sidon captured. Bactra captured. Dariush Kabir captured.
1755AD(2) - Celebration everywhere as Silk is brought in from newly conquered chinese cities. New Shanghai captured. New Shantung captured. Tsingtao captured as we get a new Leader, Silva. A factory is rushed. Ningpo captured. Beijing captured. Cherbourg captured. Akkad captured. Heidelburg captured. Kaifeng captured. Pi-Ramesses captured and Egypt is finished. New Belo Horizonte 2 founded.
175AD(3) - Chengdu captured. Susa captured. Chinan captured. Athens captured. Stuttgart captured. New Fortaleza 2 founded. Planted agents in Germany and France.

I have disabled cultural victory using MultiTools so we can start building all the temple and cultural buildings that we wanted. :) (To be continued...)

If you want a Leader for Argentina from the XIX century, it should be definitely Juan Manuel de Rosas, but if you want a leader from the XX century it should be Juan Domingo Peron, or his wife Evita Peron if you want a female leader.

The gaucho is the ideal unit for Argentina, here they are preparing it.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=34741&highlight=gaucho