I was just wondering if there is a way to make any maps in the mod, or in BtS, and convert them for Planetfall? A lot of the random map generations are just blah, and ugly. I know someone started on making a re-make of Planet/Chiron, but I'm not sure how far along they are, since they stopped posting, and I'd like to take a shot at it, I am just not sure how to make a map in a Mod in Civ IV. :confused:

I've never made a premade map myself. Do you know how to make one in unmodded Civ4? Perhaps there are some tutorials in the Tutorial forum.
I presume that you could just start a random game on the desired map size (using the Planetfall mod of course), remove all factions and change all terrain to Ocean, and then start creating the map you want from this empty slate, and save it as a Worldbuilder file.

The guy who started on a Map of Planet never posted a file, so all his work can be presumed lost.

It would be great if you would have a go at creating a Map of Planet! May I ask though that:
1) you make a standard-sized map before anything else
2) that you regularly post updates of the Worldbuilder file, so that if you too mysteriously disappear ;) that not all your work is lost.

Yeah, I think that's the only way to do it. But can a world builder file be used as a map when starting a custom scenario or anything? I'm not sure.

Either way, yeah I'll prolly start on one, and post updates. I'll be working this week tho, so updates may or may not be slow in the beginning. We'll see how this all turns out. xD

Looks like im making good time tonight, actually. This is what I have so far, but its only the minimap- not sure how to zoom out all the way, because when I do, its only a partial map. After the terrain tho, I'll have to lay out the resources, bleh.

Alright, I sorta finished the map, but not really. I don't know where or HOW to place starting points. So, when I tried to play using the map, I got an automatic defeat, Lol. If anyone knows how to place starting points, or how to even play a game from a worldbuilder file, let me know.

I added the save so you all could at least see what was done so far. I forgot to add any unity pods to the land masses tho. But thats about it, besides the start points.

Alright, I sorta finished the map, but not really. I don't know where or HOW to place starting points. So, when I tried to play using the map, I got an automatic defeat, Lol. If anyone knows how to place starting points, or how to even play a game from a worldbuilder file, let me know.You have to edit the file manually (with a text editor), it's not a big edit, I just done in in a couple of minutes and got the map up and running (start points are random, but I think they should be!) - I've attached it so you can see how it's done.

On the map itself: Has its rough spots and some kinks (mainly the placement of features and bonuses) - but in general: It's a beauty! The shapes look great!

Cheers, LT.

Thanks for the map Silverr! I agree with Lord Tirian it needs improvements in certain areas (more on that in later posts), but already a huge thanks for doing what no one has done before in two years! :D

You have to edit the file manually (with a text editor), it's not a big edit, I just done in in a couple of minutes and got the map up and running (start points are random, but I think they should be!) - I've attached it so you can see how it's done.

Thanks! Do you know how to make the starting era settable btw (now fixed on Arrival)? Not useful right now, but would be after the SMAX factions are added.

Thanks! Do you know how to make the starting era settable btw (now fixed on Arrival)? Not useful right now, but would be after the SMAX factions are added.I don't know how to make it settable, but if you add "Era=ERA_EXPANSION" between the "BeginGame" and "EndGame" tags, you start in the expansion era, ditto for the other eras - would mean that you'd have to make one map for each era (i.e. just with the different tag). For more infos, you might want to take a look here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=135669), Dale discusses the file and file structure in detail, lot of tweakable stuff there.

Cheers, LT.

You have to edit the file manually (with a text editor), it's not a big edit, I just done in in a couple of minutes and got the map up and running (start points are random, but I think they should be!) - I've attached it so you can see how it's done.

On the map itself: Has its rough spots and some kinks (mainly the placement of features and bonuses) - but in general: It's a beauty! The shapes look great!

Cheers, LT.

Yeah I pretty much rushed that! Haha. Plus it's my first map, so I have no idea where stuff should be, etc. I wish there was a random bonus script that could be used with it, but I don't know if it would work with the mod.

And thanks both of you! Not sure if I wanna make a huge map now tho, haha! Maybe later on.

Here's some pointers on modding maps suitable for Planetfall. Sorry I didn't post this before Silverr, but I didn't expect you to make the Map of Planet so fast.

Plot types/"Elevation":

In SMAC terrain can only increase at most 1000m per plot. Planetfall does not have this restriction with Lowlands/Highlands/Ridges. Furthermore, elevation serves a different gameplay purpose in Planetfall. Its main effect is on the spread of fungus. Fungus can never grow on Ridges, and only on Highlands at high Flowering Counter levels. In addition, you cannot move directly from a lowland plot to a ridge plot, or vice versa. This turns long ridges of Ridge into a defensive barrier. These two effects together can create easily defendable fungus-free zones, which makes running a Terraformed strategy easier. Without large stretches of highlands+ridges, such a strategy would be very impractical. Therefore it's not advisable to try to copy the elevation encountered in the SMAC Map of Planet, where all the coast is lowland, and the more inland, the higher the elevation generally speaking. There should be several plateaus of highland bordered by ridges. And a considerable percentage of the coastline should be Highlands.

Terrain types:

The land terrain is pretty straightforward. Planetfall's Flat/Rocky Arid/Moist/Rainy resembles SMAC's Flat/Rolling/Rocky Arid/Moist/Rainy close enough.
One difference though: Planetfall adds Polar terrain. This is not included in the map you made. I think some should be added to give room for bonus resources which only occur on Polar terrain to spawn.

Sea terrain: SMAC also had elevation err I mean depth for water terrain. Planetfall does not have this, but it does have Coast, Shelf and Ocean terrain types. (Trenches are a feature now.)
Silverr, I noticed your map had lots of Coast terrain in the middle of the ocean. Is this an intentional move, or were you not aware of this because Coast and Shelf use the same graphic? There is a big difference between these two terrains as Shelf provides two nutrients and Coast one nutrient and two energy. Premade maps can take liberties which are impossible in mapscripts, such as placing Coast terrain in the middle of the ocean. And this Coast terrain could fit to represent certain features of the Map of Planet, such as the Geothermal Shallows. But I don't think it should be used on so many places on plots not bordering land.

The opposite could be done too by the way, in limited locations. Shelf instead of the usual Coast could be placed next to land. The obvious place to do this is the Freshwater Sea of course.

Feature types:

The big thing to mention here is that no Forest at all should be placed on the map! That's introduced by humans to Chiron. The Jungle feature is native to Chiron, and should be placed en masse at the Monsoon Jungle location. It's good to also place occasional features on other spots near the equatorial region, as you did. That way certain resources like Rare Tropical DNA won't always only occur inside the Monsoon Jungle.

Jungle and Xenofungus should only be placed on Lowlands.

I'd prefer a generally thicker Ice cap, with lots of inlets. I have some ideas (focused around the Enclosed Biosphere theme) to make this feature more interesting.

Trenches: the SMAC Map of Planet had trenches in the middle of the ocean, evenly placed between continents. Again a limitation of the SMAC elevation system. In reality it's the other way around. Ocean ridges (can be represented by Shelf) often occur in the middle between continental plates. And Trenches often occur right next to a coastal mountain ridge or an island chain. The mapscript represents this by only allowing a Trench to occur if at least one adjacent plot is a highland/ridge and at least on adjacent plot is Ocean terrain. Sea fungus cannot grow on Trenches. As a consequence, trenches serve the same function as Ridges on land: a barrier against fungus, giving easier sea access to those following a Terraformer strategy. While once again liberties could be taken with Trench placement on a premade maps, placing them on plots the mapscript would never do, I feel their main gameplay function should not be forgotten.

Earth Ocean trench and ridge map as illustration:

http://visual.merriam-webster.com/images/earth/geology/ocean-trenches-ridges.jpg

Resources, unity pods and landmarks

Good news! I had a look and it is in fact possible to randomize resource placement by changing a single line in the WorldBuilder file. By copying a few python code lines from Fall from Heaven, I could also let unity pod and spawning spot placement be randomized. So need to worry about those.

I would prefer to have landmarks at their SMAC location though. This is not the case in your map.

***

I had a look at the Utility Programs forum, and found a program to turn a Bitmap picture into a map for Civ4. :blush: Download it here (http://rhye.civfanatics.net/civ4/files/BMPC186_withTutorial.zip). For it to work, I had to manually type 'import whatever' in the python console. Just double-clicking the scenario file didn't work.

I tried it the process on both the minimap of the Standard and Huge Maps of Planet. The standard-sized minimap gives too much land IMO, but the huge-sized minimap too little. I attached some screenshots for comparison.

I would prefer to have landmarks at their SMAC location though. This is not the case in your map.Oh, something about landmarks: On the middle continent, in the south-western edge, there's a big circular ridge structure - in SMAC, that was the Garland crater - but Planetfall has the crater as landmark as well - you might want to give a suggestion what to do with that (because the SMAC crater is way larger compared to the Planetfall feature, especially once you consider that Planetfall has a larger map than SMAC, due to the higher number of plots in CivIV maps).

Cheers, LT.

Large meteors can cause several concentric mountain ridges. So it would fit to simply place the Garland Crater landmark in the middle, then around that eight plots of lowland, and around that a ring of mostly Ridges. Gives the look of two rings in other words.

Nice map! :) I played a few turns with it and noticed two things:

1. I spotted at least twice the Crabs resource from BTS (one instance is S of the big forest, the other in the great lake in the SW part of the map)
2. The timeline is currently off - each turn is 40 years

3. Loading it under with v11, Patch g) gave me a python exception:

Can't find type enum for type tag BONUS_RESONANCE_CLUSTER

Hmm, that's just a matter of changing the string name.

I don't really feel like supporting that map though. I'd rather see someone redo the map, using the maps I attached a few posts up as base.

it's understandabke if you don't feel like supportng it, but I don't see any other map of planet around here just now. For those who want to play with it, this is their only choice. it's a bit petty to leave it broken when the fix is so simple, just to encourage a remake. I could see your point if it were going to take hours to make it functional again, but all you've done is rename some resources, isn't it ?

This might be a better place for map stuff than the task list thread... I took your map, Maniac, and spruced up the western continent (the one with the pholus ridge and the freshwater lake) - I tried to make it look more natural and to keep in line with western winds, meaning west sides of ridges are more moist than the east. I took some liberties with the terrain and fiddled a bit with the elevation as well, but I hope it looks more natural now. If you like the look, I'd continue with doing the other continents and the oceans.

(Note: This isn't a map you can really play on... for that, I'd need to add resources, pods etc., but I think that should be the very last step after finishing the general terrain)

Cheers, LT.

It looks awesome and very natural indeed! :goodjob:

I'd like there to be an area of the map which is very suitable for each of the ecological strategies. For the Hybrids near the Ruins, for the Terraformers near the Monsoon Jungle and Sunny Mesa, and for the Biodomed ecology under the Freshwater Sea.

The right coast of the Ruins area is all arid. This screams out to follow Biodomed instead of Hybrid. I would therefore like to suggest to place more fungus there and/or change the terrain to at least moist. For the same reason I'd suggest to remove all polar terrain from that area.

For the area under the Freshwater Sea I'd like to suggest to place a mountain ridge somewhere as indicated on the screenshot. North of the Ridge the terrain could be all lowlands, but south of it I would suggest the terrain is all highlands and/or polar. In other words, no trouble with fungus and an encouragement to go Biodomed.

the western continent (the one with the pholus ridge and the freshwater lake)

Names for the three continents would be useful. Long ago I invented the names Runa, Nekkes and Boroli (derived from the Ruins, the Nexus, and the Borehole Cluster), but names from Greek mythology would probably be more in line with the existing theme.

keep in line with western winds

For the record, while it's cool to see the rainy areas where they used to be in SMAC, as a general rule I don't see a need to follow rainfall patterns for the Planetfall map.

(Note: This isn't a map you can really play on... for that, I'd need to add resources, pods etc., but I think that should be the very last step after finishing the general terrain)

It's possible to randomize unity pod and resource placement on a map. So no need to place those, except for those places where we absolutely want a particular resource, like the Uranium Flats.

Edit: I attached a map in which I changed a single plot on Nekkes' west coast back from coast to land.

Names for the three continents would be useful. Long ago I invented the names Runa, Nekkes and Boroli (derived from the Ruins, the Nexus, and the Borehole Cluster), but names from Greek mythology would probably be more in line with the existing theme.

If you want to follow Greek mythology, how about using names derived from the Titans? Less known then the Olympian gods. Here are their names: Oceanos, Coeus, Crius, Hyperion, Iapetos, Theia, Rhea, Themis, Mnemosyne, Phoebe, Tethys, and Kronos. Plenty to give names to subparts of a main continent. :)

It's possible to randomize unity pod and resource placement on a map. So need to place those, except for those places where we absolutely want a particular resource, like the Uranium Flats.

I suppose you meant "So NO need to place those,..."?

If you maybe look at this post (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8737805&postcount=3)...

If you want to follow Greek mythology, how about using names derived from the Titans? Less known then the Olympian gods. Here are their names: Oceanos, Coeus, Crius, Hyperion, Iapetos, Theia, Rhea, Themis, Mnemosyne, Phoebe, Tethys, and Kronos. Plenty to give names to subparts of a main continent. :)

While I would usually never discourage someone from using Titanic names, being a huge fan of them, I will note that Titan names is the naming scheme used for Saturn's moons, and as such it seems unlikely that they would be "reused" for the continents in another solar system. :/ Granted, not all of the ones listed above have been used in our system.

Koios Rhea Themis?
Koios Nekkes Boriolis?
Themis Centralis Boriolis is is?

While I would usually never discourage someone from using Titanic names, being a huge fan of them, I will note that Titan names is the naming scheme used for Saturn's moons, and as such it seems unlikely that they would be "reused" for the continents in another solar system. :/ Granted, not all of the ones listed above have been used in our system.

Okay, let's scrap Hyperion, Iapetos, Rhea, Phoebe and Thetys from that list then. ;)

Koios Rhea Themis?
Koios Nekkes Boriolis?
Themis Centralis Boriolis is is?Sound good. Alternatively, you might find something here (http://www.theoi.com/Georgikos/KentauroiThessalioi.html), which lists a lot of centaurs (since all big Centauri names - Chiron, Nessus, Pholus - are derived from centaurs). I also think Eurytion deserves a mention somewhere - probably for the central continent with the nexus?

I also attached another version. I went over the other two continents and added the changes from your last post. I think it starts to come together now, but still a bit away from being playable.

As an aside: A while ago, actually, Temudjin made a mapscript, Ringworld 2 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=300961) that's compatible with Planetfall... perhaps you could ask him about including it in Planetfall? It looks quite nice and would offer some variety. Plus, the idea of the Progenitors constructing a ringworld with monoliths, fungus etc. just seems to fit and sounds cool! :)

Cheers, LT.

Sound good. Alternatively, you might find something here (http://www.theoi.com/Georgikos/KentauroiThessalioi.html), which lists a lot of centaurs (since all big Centauri names - Chiron, Nessus, Pholus - are derived from centaurs). I also think Eurytion deserves a mention somewhere - probably for the central continent with the nexus?

Heh cool. Alas, Eurytion already has a bay named after him.

I also attached another version. I went over the other two continents and added the changes from your last post. I think it starts to come together now, but still a bit away from being playable.

Awesome thanks! :goodjob: I made four changes though, and have two requests:

1) I changed all the arid plots south of the Freshwater Sea to polar.
2) I let some rainshadow leak into the Garland Crater, so that you don't need to be Biodomed to settle near that landmark early on.
3) I added something resembling New Sargasso.
4) I turned the plot wests of the Great Dunes rainy. I see that place as the landing area of the Believers.

My requests:

1) I don't know how to add rivers. Could you please add a one-plot-length river to one of those flat rainy plots west of the Great Dunes. It would make farming easier and make Centauri Hydrology more useful.

2) You've let two rivers end into the err Amazone Bay on Boriolis.. I'd prefer if it looked more like the huge map of Planet, with three source rivers merging into one, and that one running into the Amazone Bay. I imagine the area around where those three source rivers merge as a fungal swamp, and the birthplace of the Cult of Planet. Not sure if that can be done without looking bad, but I had this idea that the lower unified part of the river could have two lowland plots on both sides, and then those lowland plots would have a ridge next to them, to give some kind of Grand Canyon feel. It might also result in some interesting combat situations.

As an aside: A while ago, actually, Temudjin made a mapscript, Ringworld 2 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=300961) that's compatible with Planetfall

I noticed that mapscript a while ago, but such unusual settings could have unforeseen effects of gameplay. Therefore I am hesitant to include that mapscript as an "officially endorsed" one in the Planetfall dowbload.

Done the changes - since I added the Grand Canyon-style feature, I had to mess around with the hills around it as well, take a look whether you like how it looks now.

I also felt free to add the landmark signs, not sure whether I caught everything... plus I don't have a running SMAC install here right now, meaning I can't copy over the other labels.

Since I'm looking at the map so much right now: I'm wondering - what about the other landmarks from SMAC/X? Is it a lack of graphics or ideas for the Unity Wreckage, the Fossil Ridge, the Geothermal Shallows and Mount Planet?

Cheers, LT.

Awesome thanks!

Personally I feel landmarks signs get in my way, especially on those landmarks which are already represented by a resource button. But I guess I can always delete them myself when playing a game on the map.

Is the map ready for play now except for resources and unity pods, or have we still forgotten something?

Since I'm looking at the map so much right now: I'm wondering - what about the other landmarks from SMAC/X? Is it a lack of graphics or ideas for the Unity Wreckage, the Fossil Ridge, the Geothermal Shallows and Mount Planet?

The Unity Wreckage is kinda represented by being able to build Unity Bays fom supply units found in unity pods. The Fossil Ridge could be represented by a couple Oil and Mineral resources where that landmark is.

Geothermal Shallows lacks graphics and an idea for what it could do. A bonus resource can't be used for a multiple-plot landmark like the Great Dunes.

Mount Planet lacks graphics and an idea what the landmark could do. Besides looking pretty of course, which could be enough.

Talking about maps, are there stats somewhere on the difference between mapsizes in civ4 and Planetfall? I have the impression that for instance Planetfall's "small map" has civ's "standard map" size...
If that's the case, then I suggest adjusting the number of factions on a map. Small and Normal in Planetfall have both 7 factions at the moment. Tiny could have 5 factions as standard.

Mapsizes are the same.

Is the map ready for play now except for resources and unity pods, or have we still forgotten something?I don't think anything else is missing - but there are two things:

1) Do you want the faction start points to be random, be predetermined or have two maps (one with random starts, one with set starts).
2) I tried the randomised resources... and a) it doesn't place pods yet, and b) it deletes all pre-existing resources, which is bad for all landmarks (since most of them are either a resource or resource + improvement). This means that 1) we need to do a "fixed" resource distribution that is the same everytime, 2) all landmarks must become improvements, or 3) you find a way to fix that. :(

Cheers, LT.

I've already made the modifications to allow random starting spots, unity pods, resources and spawning spots. I just noticed myself too that the already placed resources disappear. Shouldn't be hard to fix. I also noticed though that starting spot placement isn't as it should be: factions start too far from each other. No idea what causes this. :( It's the only stumbling block left before I can call the next patch feature-closed.

Mapsizes are the same.

On what mapscript is the Planetfall mapscript based then?

It's the only stumbling block left before I can call the next patch feature-closed.

I hope you find the time to drop my 3 xml files in the next patch feature. :mischief:

On what mapscript is the Planetfall mapscript based then?

Continent and island distribution is more or less based on Big & Small, but it's all mostly written specially for Planetfall.

Geothermal Shallows lacks graphics and an idea for what it could do. A bonus resource can't be used for a multiple-plot landmark like the Great Dunes.

The Dune Wars mod does has spice as a multiple square resource, so whatever method they used might some in useful here.

As for effects, perhaps it just adds energy to the squares and doesn't have any trade network effects.

The Great Dunes could add energy to adjacent windmills.

Mount Planet lacks graphics and an idea what the landmark could do. Besides looking pretty of course, which could be enough.Well, now it doesn't lack a graphic anymore, I've attached one! ;)

It's not such a fancy model, it's just a big volcano and should ideally go on ridges (it conforms to the terrain, so it should blend into the terrain smoothly).

For things it could do, besides looking interesting, I'd propose making the square inpassable for land units (after all, it's filled with lava, harsh rocks and pretty steep etc.). Additionally, it could give you extra energy/minerals, but dependent on techs - like Kinematics unlock +1 energy and High Energy Chemistry unlocks +1 mineral (or something along these lines, showing progressing efficiency in actually using something like a volcano).

Cheers, LT.

Awesome! It's meant as an improvement I assume?

Awesome! It's meant as an improvement I assume?Yep.

Cheers, LT.