I just recently started playing again and wanted more experienced players' thoughts on espionage.

Do you use the espionage system?

Do you distribute your espionage points among a lot of civs, or focus on the biggest threat(s)?

Do you allocate commerce, or just use buildings?

Spy specialists, do you use them?

I tend to use too few spies. So, I'm wrong person to give advices but you might want to take a look at this strategy article (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=330515).

I'm no expert, but usually I'll adjust the espionage sliders so my allies and vassals have a weight of 1, most other civs have a weight of 2, and factions that I am actively warring with (or about to target) I'll set to 3.

I guess it works okay? I never really put much thought or effort into espionage. Mostly I'll build spies and send them into cause a city revolt if I'm about to invade, to remove the fortification bonus. That's about it.

It really depends on what you want to do: 1) Do you want to steal techs from others; 2) Are you planning on invading someone and want to do it with mounted units; 3) Do you want to change religion/civics of an AI to be on better terms with them; 4) ...

In almost every case I will concentrate my EP on 1 or 2 particular AI's rather than really spread it around.

The article is an excellent read.

However, if you do not want to really use espionage, it usually suffices to put 1 spy on watch duty in each of your cities.

An espionage economy can be fun to do though if you have to catch up in tech and have many neighbours. Espionage to gain techs will be about two times as efficient as research if you do it right.

I just recently started playing again and wanted more experienced players' thoughts on espionage.

Do you use the espionage system?
Yes, heavily.

Do you distribute your espionage points among a lot of civs, or focus on the biggest threat(s)? Usually one at a time.
Either to steal techs or to support city revolt during an invasion.
Support City Revolt is one of the strongest options you have. In my current game, I had an extreme espionage advantage versus Monty, 10 to 1 most of the time. At one point I had 20k points invested in him, and him 2k in me. He was actually going for a culture victory (he had conquered all his neighbors except me, and I was his friend throughout the game), and he was getting dangerously close. So after a bit of tech stealing I concentrated on making one of his cities go into riot EVERY TURN! :D eventually I started doing this on two of his cities cause a 4th city caught up on the culture.
The other way to use Support City Revolt is of course during an invasion. Especially useful with Mounted units that don't want to wait for siege units. Since it brings the city into a 1 turn riot, the city defense is brought down to 0%!

Once they get Security Bureau's a good trick can be to first destroy it, then poison the city, destroy all health buildings, and then destroy production if he is rebuilding it (helps if you have so much espionage points you can see what he is constructing in this city).

Do you allocate commerce, or just use buildings?Early game almost only buildings and specialists. But I crank up the slider if I know I will need some in a while, like before a war or during a war.
End game it's a fair bit from buildings, but when I go into heavy espionage mode most of it is from commerce (had like 3300 per turn in my current game at 100% slider :D).

Spy specialists, do you use them?
As mentioned above, yes. Early game it's a big boost to your EP rate, and a great way to increase your potential EP rate (if you get Great Spy for Scotland Yard.)
Later game, a city with a Courthouse, Jail, Security Bureau, and Intelligence Agency can use 7 Spies. If you use them all and have the Scotland yard in this city that's 28:espionage: from the spies, 22:espionage: from the Buildings, and after the boost from buildings 120:espionage: total!
I rarely use that many in the same city (can be good for golden ages too though, ya know).

Thanks, guys. Is stealing techs from others really more commerce-efficient than researching yourself?

I really like the tip about distributing your EP to see the statistics graph.

Do you use the espionage system?


Yes, some games only defensively others extensively and offensively as possible.

Do you distribute your espionage points among a lot of civs, or focus on the biggest threat(s)?


I like for some to go to each close rival and non to far away civs but I pile on one civ if I'm about to invade.

Do you allocate commerce, or just use buildings?


None in the early game, tech is too important. Later in the game I bump it up.

Spy specialists, do you use them?

Yes, if not running caste system. Great scientist are more preferable to me.

I usually distribute my espionage points roughly evenly until I can see everyone's research, or until I have Alphabet. I usually plop down a counterintel agent in each of my cities and at least one spy in each rival's territory. Generally the city I pick is the one with the lowest espionage cost. At some point you have to start being more selective. Usually if I'm planning to go to war with (or expecting an attack from) somebody I'll direct most or all of my points to them.

I think the counterespionage mission is extremely underrated. I find that if I have a counterintel agent in every city, and I do counterespionage, I rarely end up with poisoned water or stolen techs.

By far though, being able to throw an enemy city into revolt and neutralize its cultural defense is a huge help in an offensive war.

focus them on a single nearby AI until you have ~600 points early in the game. This will allow you to city revolt their capital and take it with minimal losses. Once you take a civs capitol, they often slide downhill pretty fast.

You might want to target esp. points on the civ you plan on destroying second. The first civ you take out could go down before you have the alphabet.

I really think thats the best use of your first 600 esp. points.

After you collect 600, it might make sense to start distributing them to other civs. I often avoid wasting esp. point on civs that will never be a threat through (civs with choked expansion, civs that everybody hates and that will inevitably go down, etc.)

focus them on a single nearby AI until you have ~600 points early in the game. This will allow you to city revolt their capital and take it with minimal losses. Once you take a civs capitol, they often slide downhill pretty fast.

You might want to target esp. points on the civ you plan on destroying second. The first civ you take out could go down before you have the alphabet.

I really think thats the best use of your first 600 esp. points.

After you collect 600, it might make sense to start distributing them to other civs. I often avoid wasting esp. point on civs that will never be a threat through (civs with choked expansion, civs that everybody hates and that will inevitably go down, etc.)

That sounds like a good approach if you're warmongering right from the start and your main use of espionage is going to be offensive. One reason I like to distribute the points more evenly so that I can see their research is it often helps me time a tech trade, especially for gold. Why not sell the AI a tech they're going to have in 2 turns anyway?

"One reason I like to distribute the points more evenly so that I can see their research is it often helps me time a tech trade, especially for gold. "

That is very handy. However, it seems like I can't accumulate enough points to see their research when distributing until I have a significant number of courthouses, which is typically after I accumulate those first 400-600 points. An obvious exception would be when I build teh great wall and pop a spy specialist.

"One reason I like to distribute the points more evenly so that I can see their research is it often helps me time a tech trade, especially for gold. "

That is very handy. However, it seems like I can't accumulate enough points to see their research when distributing until I have a significant number of courthouses, which is typically after I accumulate those first 400-600 points. An obvious exception would be when I build teh great wall and pop a spy specialist.

Sometimes you can get an early edge by cranking up the espionage slider. You can't always afford to do that but if you have gold or gems or some other source of commerce you can still maintain an acceptable pace of research while spending more on espionage.

I am new to espionage but I am really fond of the passive bonuses more than the active ones. I really like having view of cities and their production.