View Full Version : Dawn of Civilization - an RFC modmod by Leoreth


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Kraizer
May 26, 2011, 04:49 PM
Got my Computer working so I can post/play again.
Played as France and the game crashed when Italy flipped it's second city.
Up untill that point though I was REALLY enjoying myself.

hoplitejoe
May 26, 2011, 05:01 PM
Could you WB all of Italy's cities to someone like Maya (or some other dead civ) to stop the spawn then WB then back to being indy when Italy's spawn time is over?
i think italy's spawn is conditional, if it is however messy this is it should solve your problem.
(a more extreme step if that doesn't work might be to remove all the cities in italy with WB)

Kraizer
May 26, 2011, 05:43 PM
Well it sounded like a good idea, but unfortunately I was misfortunate enough to have saved my game a turn before this event happened and my save is failing to load :D
Thanks though Joe :)

Although Italy actually spawned with only it's single city (around 1100 A.D.) and it was actually the following turn or two (possibly three) when it flipped what I think was Venice, seconds before the crash.

hoplitejoe
May 26, 2011, 05:50 PM
No autosaves?
I would be interested to see if my plan works so if you ever have the problem again and use my method feel free to post the results here :D

BenZL43
May 27, 2011, 07:04 AM
Since Leoreth's gone for awhile,
why don't we compile list of recently known bugs or sort of suggestion into a single post?
Here,
I'm thinking about creating a special post here, which contain all of us, as community, suggestion for the DoC, from our side.. and everytime there's a new idea that suitable enough, and based on a rational consideration, we could edit it and put it there..
What do you think?
Personally, I like this better than we spent nothing waiting him to finish his project and take a look back here :)
Nah, anybody like to start giving ideas or something that I can compile into? hehe

Algor Mortis
May 27, 2011, 11:10 AM
Hi everyone. I've been suffering from crashes which I assume everyone is still suffering from. I got fed up with these crashes and really wanted to play, so I fixed them. I figured I'd come share my fixes if anyone would like to have them. The crashes that should be fixed include the italy respawn crash, roman UP crash, a crash I had when Phoenicia switches its capital from Carthage back to Sur (or near Sur) after Carthage being razed, and the Persia respawn crash. I have been able to successfully play several longer games through the points where it has crashed in the past. I have to warn you though, I have no modding talent whatsoever, and I cannot guarantee I haven't done something terrible in my changes I've made. I just figured I would fix what I could fix, even if it was rough, so people (myself :P) could play until the problems get fixed for real. So... Here you go! And please respond if this fixes your crashes, or more importantly, if it does not.

Extract these two files to ...RFC Dawn of Civilization\Assets\Python and overwrite.
Enjoy!

hoplitejoe
May 27, 2011, 11:19 AM
Nice work :D i don't have time to try out your changes a the moment but thank you for sharing it.

jammerculture
May 27, 2011, 05:58 PM
Hi everyone. I've been suffering from crashes which I assume everyone is still suffering from. I got fed up with these crashes and really wanted to play, so I fixed them. I figured I'd come share my fixes if anyone would like to have them. The crashes that should be fixed include the italy respawn crash, roman UP crash, a crash I had when Phoenicia switches its capital from Carthage back to Sur (or near Sur) after Carthage being razed, and the Persia respawn crash. I have been able to successfully play several longer games through the points where it has crashed in the past. I have to warn you though, I have no modding talent whatsoever, and I cannot guarantee I haven't done something terrible in my changes I've made. I just figured I would fix what I could fix, even if it was rough, so people (myself :P) could play until the problems get fixed for real. So... Here you go! And please respond if this fixes your crashes, or more importantly, if it does not.

Extract these two files to ...RFC Dawn of Civilization\Assets\Python and overwrite.
Enjoy!


what exactly did you do? Did you just disable the offending bits of the mod or did you actually fix the problem?

Algor Mortis
May 27, 2011, 08:52 PM
what exactly did you do? Did you just disable the offending bits of the mod or did you actually fix the problem?

Well, what I tried to do was disable as little as possible and still have the mod work... So... I suppose I should go through each individual crash. Italy respawn should work fine in that Italy does indeed respawn. I cannot recall exactly what I did... Heh... But if I remember correctly, I figured the crash (for a reason I cannot figure) was caused by something having to do with Florence being founded as a capital, and then switching to Venice as the capital when it flips to Italy the next turn. I just made a change so Florence does not spawn with Italy, but is instead founded the next turn, after Venice flips and is already the capital. So yes, there is a functioning rebirth of Italy and you can play as them and everything. The Roman UP I just made so that the spawned armies do not have to be spawned right beside the enemy capital, but I believe in a 3x3 area of the capital. I believe I have a much more direct fix that is easily done in mind that I'll work on. But as it is, Rome can spawn all the armies it wants (at least in my games so far) without any crashes, they just may be a little ways away from the capital. Carthage being razed crash should be fixed completely. Persia also respawns with seemingly no problems, although I do not actually remember what I did... In any case, I've not had a single crash on multiple games that have gone through Persian and Italian respawns. Apologies for the long-winded explanation, but does that at least answer your question?

BenZL43
May 28, 2011, 08:04 AM
This is what I able to compile so far..
Please tell if what I post do not really reflect your suggestion or problem, or already resolved :)
Leoreth's last post is #3162, so I assume he haven't read from #3163, so on.

BUG

Spawn, Respawn, and the Flipping Cities
-Sometimes Byzantine or Italian do not spawn or playable
-Byzantine is not available at the Main Screen
-Safavid spawn at 1505 and then the game Crashed (as Byzantine)
-Game crash few turns after Turn 281 (as Viking)
-Downloaded SVN Versions for Persian respawn but still crashed
-Game crash after Italia flip its second cities (as France)
-Arabia (3000BC) flip Egypt when spawn
-Over-cultured Babylonia so Phoenicia spawn at their tile and thrown to Anatolia on the next turn

Leader and Settler
-Sometimes Justinian I is not contactable.
-Alfred (Celtic) is at war with every Civs
-Can't found city 1 plots of razed cities

Game Mechanism, UHV and Balance
-Greece sometime overpowered
-Can't update via SVN
-English 3rd UHV is now impossible

SUGGESTION

Spawn and Respawn
-Spawn Harappa and auto-raze it around 1700-1000BC
-Spawn Taxila around 500BC
-Re-spawn Inca and Aztec

Game Mechanism
-Change the city expansion threshold to 10/250/2500/25000/50000 or 100/250/2500/25000/50000
-Re-enable the plague
-Add Judaism as a minor religion
-Add no nuclear bomb criteria
-Re-enable Roman Roads as their UP
-Make Occupation available to Ancient Civs (except Persia) before Nationalism

jammerculture
May 28, 2011, 11:16 AM
Well, what I tried to do was disable as little as possible and still have the mod work... So... I suppose I should go through each individual crash. Italy respawn should work fine in that Italy does indeed respawn. I cannot recall exactly what I did... Heh... But if I remember correctly, I figured the crash (for a reason I cannot figure) was caused by something having to do with Florence being founded as a capital, and then switching to Venice as the capital when it flips to Italy the next turn. I just made a change so Florence does not spawn with Italy, but is instead founded the next turn, after Venice flips and is already the capital. So yes, there is a functioning rebirth of Italy and you can play as them and everything. The Roman UP I just made so that the spawned armies do not have to be spawned right beside the enemy capital, but I believe in a 3x3 area of the capital. I believe I have a much more direct fix that is easily done in mind that I'll work on. But as it is, Rome can spawn all the armies it wants (at least in my games so far) without any crashes, they just may be a little ways away from the capital. Carthage being razed crash should be fixed completely. Persia also respawns with seemingly no problems, although I do not actually remember what I did... In any case, I've not had a single crash on multiple games that have gone through Persian and Italian respawns. Apologies for the long-winded explanation, but does that at least answer your question?


The Carthage fix is what draws my attention as if IIRC the Roman UP crash happened at conquest of Carthage (at least in my games) so maybe the Roman UP BUG= the carthage bug?


Good work! Can anyone confirm that the problems are gone?

srpt
May 28, 2011, 12:51 PM
I used the roman UP on its own in my modmod and it never crashed. I did have to comment out a line about the italian respawn.

rogue131
May 29, 2011, 01:25 AM
so I know it's been a while. But I got an update. Got the Byzantines working fine now, just deleted old version and playing new. Guess I ran into that Persia problem though, but I can see we already are taking care of things so this is not a complaint, just a status update. I'm moving 1.72 out of the mod folder and re-putting in the older version. Least I know I can play the older version just fine. :-)

azander12
May 29, 2011, 11:21 AM
This is what I able to compile so far..
Please tell if what I post do not really reflect your suggestion or problem, or already resolved :)
Leoreth's last post is #3162, so I assume he haven't read from #3163, so on.

BUG

Spawn, Respawn, and the Flipping Cities
-Sometimes Byzantine or Italian do not spawn or playable
-Byzantine is not available at the Main Screen
-Safavid spawn at 1505 and then the game Crashed (as Byzantine)
-Game crash few turns after Turn 281 (as Viking)
-Downloaded SVN Versions for Persian respawn but still crashed
-Game crash after Italia flip its second cities (as France)
-Arabia (3000BC) flip Egypt when spawn
-Over-cultured Babylonia so Phoenicia spawn at their tile and thrown to Anatolia on the next turn

Leader and Settler
-Sometimes Justinian I is not contactable.
-Alfred (Celtic) is at war with every Civs
-Can't found city 1 plots of razed cities

Game Mechanism and Balance
-Greece sometime overpowered
-Can't update via SVN

SUGGESTION

Spawn and Respawn
-Spawn Harappa and auto-raze it around 1700-1000BC
-Spawn Taxila around 500BC
-Re-spawn Inca and Aztec

Game Mechanism
-Change the city expansion threshold to 10/250/2500/25000/50000 or 100/250/2500/25000/50000
-Re-enable the plague
-Add Judaism as a minor religion
-Add no nuclear bomb criteria
-Re-enable Roman Roads as their UP
-Make Occupation available to Ancient Civs (except Persia) before Nationalism

Another bug I found. I was playing as the British, their UHV is now impossible, as no technologies move you into the Modern Age. I have zero coding ability, does anyone have any idea what might be going on?

BenZL43
May 29, 2011, 12:42 PM
Another bug I found. I was playing as the British, their UHV is now impossible, as no technologies move you into the Modern Age. I have zero coding ability, does anyone have any idea what might be going on?

The 'Have navies bigger than 2 other combined European navy' ?
In my opinion, as they haven't stated a certain naval units, I think it can be done by having like 100 Galley or other cheap units..
I don't know, I haven't try this method yet hehe :)

azander12
May 29, 2011, 01:06 PM
The 'Have navies bigger than 2 other combined European navy' ?
In my opinion, as they haven't stated a certain naval units, I think it can be done by having like 100 Galley or other cheap units..
I don't know, I haven't try this method yet hehe :)

No, the "Be the first to enter the Industrial and Modern ages" UHV, i think its number three. I was so close to beating the British UHV, I've been working on it for a long time....

rogue131
May 29, 2011, 03:17 PM
Is it possible we as a group could fix these issues for Leoreth? Be a nice present for all his hard work.

BenZL43
May 30, 2011, 08:06 AM
No, the "Be the first to enter the Industrial and Modern ages" UHV, i think its number three. I was so close to beating the British UHV, I've been working on it for a long time....

Oh.. that one.. Okay I'll put that into the list :)

Is it possible we as a group could fix these issues for Leoreth? Be a nice present for all his hard work.

Why not? Let's fix that together :)

And by the way, to Moderator, could you please.. create a new sub-forum for DoC? Believe me, it'll looks better than seeing all these screwed up all bug, pictures, ideas, suggestion, conflict everything into one thread :)

Gruekiller
May 30, 2011, 09:44 AM
And by the way, to Moderator, could you please.. create a new sub-forum for DoC? Believe me, it'll looks better than seeing all these screwed up all bug, pictures, ideas, suggestion, conflict everything into one thread :)

Seconded.

azander12
May 30, 2011, 02:38 PM
..Thirded? Is that a word?

corovanrobber
May 30, 2011, 08:18 PM
It is. It's even in the dictionary.

keli
May 31, 2011, 04:34 AM
shouldn't state property and totalitarianism decrease your cities by 2 when you switch to them?

rogue131
May 31, 2011, 07:08 AM
Why not? Let's fix that together :)

And by the way, to Moderator, could you please.. create a new sub-forum for DoC? Believe me, it'll looks better than seeing all these screwed up all bug, pictures, ideas, suggestion, conflict everything into one thread :)

FIrst, yeah, umm not really much of a coder. But I can learn if someone helps. Secondly, yeah, we need a sub-forum. This is becoming a Novel.

BenZL43
May 31, 2011, 07:34 AM
This is becoming a Novel.

Seconded

Tyo
May 31, 2011, 08:08 PM
I downloaded the mod, and I can play it for a bit...But after a while, it crashes. It's done so multiple times in about the same exact time(AD ~1000). Anyone know if this is a random mishap or...

Thanks in advance.

rogue131
Jun 01, 2011, 02:25 AM
I downloaded the mod, and I can play it for a bit...But after a while, it crashes. It's done so multiple times in about the same exact time(AD ~1000). Anyone know if this is a random mishap or...

Thanks in advance.

As you can see, we understand there are a few bugs. It could be something with the Italy respawn maybe? We've compiled them into a list.

BenZL43
Jun 01, 2011, 08:28 AM
Yeah..
most bug usually related to either Persian re-spawn or Italian re-spawn...
I still get some Python Exception though through a few games I play lately as a European Civs around the 1200 yet its about the Roman UP problem somehow..

Anyway,
I just wished when a moderator read this recent posts,
he or she will create a new sub-forum, then we could have thread of our own, and develop the community fix for DoC, as a present or surprise to Leoreth and thanks him for the great foundation he laid :)
*I bet Leoreth do not read this, right? He's trying to be as away as possible now :)

Tyo
Jun 01, 2011, 03:03 PM
Ahh, I see. Sorry to bug then.

In any case, Italy had already spawned and I'm relatively sure Persia did aswell. Might be wrong about Persia though.

Anyway, good luck fixing these bugs. It was indeed a great mod for the time I played it.

rogue131
Jun 02, 2011, 01:18 AM
Yeah..
most bug usually related to either Persian re-spawn or Italian re-spawn...
I still get some Python Exception though through a few games I play lately as a European Civs around the 1200 yet its about the Roman UP problem somehow..

Anyway,
I just wished when a moderator read this recent posts,
he or she will create a new sub-forum, then we could have thread of our own, and develop the community fix for DoC, as a present or surprise to Leoreth and thanks him for the great foundation he laid :)
*I bet Leoreth do not read this, right? He's trying to be as away as possible now :)

Here, here!

civ_king
Jun 02, 2011, 02:23 AM
I checked Leoreth's last 300 posts and pretty much all have been in the Colosseum

AdrienIer
Jun 02, 2011, 07:51 AM
I suppose there will be no subforum while the modder (Leoreth) is absent. And there are only subforums for mods which already have severall threads.
The best thing we can do IMO is create a few specific threads (for bugs, suggestions, playtests, even svn tests), and wait for leoreth to come back.

BenZL43
Jun 02, 2011, 11:28 AM
Hmm.. SoI was granted a new sub-forum because there's quite much new thread..
But I don't remember if embryodead was around when the moderator make it into a sub-forum..
Hey! I got a good idea then! Everybody, let's sprout this forum with a lot of junk threads start with [DoC] so they'll move our thread into a sub-forum! rofl

The Turk
Jun 02, 2011, 01:17 PM
Hmm.. SoI was granted a new sub-forum because there's quite much new thread..
But I don't remember if embryodead was around when the moderator make it into a sub-forum..
Hey! I got a good idea then! Everybody, let's sprout this forum with a lot of junk threads start with [DoC] so they'll move our thread into a sub-forum! rofl

The problem is that, while SoI is a big change away from RFC (even bigger than RFC Europe IMO), DoC is based more off of RFC, and therefore the need for a subforum seems a bit trivial, especially since I don't see a need to post up anymore threads.

hoplitejoe
Jun 02, 2011, 01:40 PM
The problem is that, while SoI is a big change away from RFC (even bigger than RFC Europe IMO), DoC is based more off of RFC, and therefore the need for a subforum seems a bit trivial, especially since I don't see a need to post up anymore threads.
:agree:

Mekajiki
Jun 03, 2011, 01:55 AM
DoC doesn't need a subforum. All of the modmods which received subforums were full conversions or Rhye's personal creations. This modmod just doesn't meet that criteria.

civ-addicted
Jun 03, 2011, 03:36 AM
I think the subforum system shouldn't be abused for PR reasons. What's worth 50 subforums with 3 threads each when this one here is empty?

jammerculture
Jun 03, 2011, 05:00 PM
At some point we might have to deal with the fact that other then the last remaining bug fixes, that may or may not be done by Leoreth himself, that this mod is finished its development.

With that potential reality in mind, does a subforum really make sense?

frog3
Jun 03, 2011, 06:56 PM
mod looks dead to me

Gruekiller
Jun 03, 2011, 09:12 PM
The mod's hardly dead. Whenever Leo is done with his current "project" (which I am curious to learn about), I'm sure he'll return to DoC.

BenZL43
Jun 04, 2011, 11:22 AM
Well... in my opinion, we still need a sub-forum, because.. what's happen here is like..

A & B are discussing about X, then C came and tell about Y from the game he play, then A & C are discussing about Y, and left the discussion about X behind.. then came D, with B are discussing about Z, and its all screwed up..

I just think with a sub-forum, we could create a specific thread, for the development of the mod, the OMG screen, the Python Exception screen, the conflict & drama, the suggestion, which we can expand into Suggestion on Spawn date, suggestion on adding Civilization, etc.. we could have another thread for bug.. bug about spawn date, bug about this and that, and so on..

And even as there's been a suggestion for community fix, so we do what we can, temporary or permanent, to assist Leo while he's gone awhile.. it could be more focused if each problem is discussed in separate thread, so each thread will have their own war of Wikipedia, own brainstorm and such and not mixed altogether and get biased like now :)

I believe, may the Mod die awhile, the thread not. See, Leo's been gone for around 1 month, but latest post here isn't 1 months ago right? This thread do not forgotten though the mod is paused awhile.. Any thread, especially, when it's focused, will keep risen, and as most of us are really active somehow, I know we wouldn't see only 3 or 4 threads, but much! And each thread will contain much post..I am sure :)

But I'm going with the community. Whatever the choice is, I believe it'll be the best for our DoC.. Viva!

AdrienIer
Jun 04, 2011, 11:59 AM
If you'd rather have severall threads for DOC, well... Create new threads !
I agree with the fact that this thread is a bit overwhelmed with diverse stuff, so if you think it would be better, just create a thread or two on the RFC modmod subforum (there are severall RFCA threads for example).

hoplitejoe
Jun 04, 2011, 01:38 PM
Just create some new threads in the modmod subforum, it's really not that busy so it would be fine.
(No i did not read the post above :p)

The Turk
Jun 06, 2011, 06:43 AM
I really don't see any point to creating new threads, since the creator is not here, and there hasn't been much action on tis thread anyway...

nickoman23
Jun 06, 2011, 06:29 PM
Was playing as the mongols and crashed around 1510.
here is a save of just before it happens.
I hate late game bugs.:cry::mad::cry::mad::cry::mad::cry::mad::cry: :mad::cry::mad::cry::(:mad::cry:

nickoman23
Jun 06, 2011, 08:29 PM
mod crashed again at same time while playing as japan. not going to play this mod until new patch is out. this is a pretty obvious bug.
as a matter of fact, I will delete until a new version is out.
the save is from 2 or 3 turns from crash.

Mazzini
Jun 06, 2011, 09:14 PM
Hey guys, I'm noticing Babylonia's UP doesn't work. I used the Oracle to bulb Code of Laws hoping for that juicy bonus in my capital, but there doesn't seem to be any bonus. Boo....

Mekajiki
Jun 07, 2011, 12:11 AM
Was playing as the mongols and crashed around 1510.
here is a save of just before it happens.
I hate late game bugs.:cry::mad::cry::mad::cry::mad::cry::mad::cry: :mad::cry::mad::cry::(:mad::cry:

mod crashed again at same time while playing as japan. not going to play this mod until new patch is out. this is a pretty obvious bug.
as a matter of fact, I will delete until a new version is out.
the save is from 2 or 3 turns from crash.

It's like people don't even read the thread, they just come here to complain.

hoplitejoe
Jun 07, 2011, 04:37 AM
It's like people don't even read the thread, they just come here to complain.
It's 165 pages long and they're not complaining, they found a crash and think it should be fixed.
To all the people above, currently the modder who works on this is doing a different project, your best hope is to get an auto save and play on from there.

BenZL43
Jun 07, 2011, 05:55 AM
I think I got a new idea for a new thread..

[DOC] Bug

So, later on, I'll move all the known bugs there, and if you found a new bug, or anything, move it there..

Nah, what do you think?
If most of the response is positive, I'll create the thread.. so it's not wasting if nobody agreed to..

etp_ak
Jun 07, 2011, 03:20 PM
Ok maybe i'm a new newb and I don't feel like digging through 150 pages in this thread. But I just downloaded and played as Germany and they are called "the holy roman empire." ..I know that their flag was replaced with the Holy Roman Empire's.. could someone explain to me why they are called that. Is it the early dynamic name for Germany? Thanks.

oh and in the features list it said new Leaders were added but I do not see any new leaders... i'm really confused.

thanks a lot guys.

Ekolite
Jun 07, 2011, 04:46 PM
That's what Germany was during the middle ages...

etp_ak
Jun 07, 2011, 06:29 PM
That's what Germany was during the middle ages...

Ok... I wasn't sure... thanks.

What about the new Leaders that says are included in the mod? i.e. Nicholas II for Russia...I'm not seeing them.

Tyo
Jun 07, 2011, 07:34 PM
Ok... I wasn't sure... thanks.

What about the new Leaders that says are included in the mod? i.e. Nicholas II for Russia...I'm not seeing them.

Dependant on the time and the civics.

nickoman23
Jun 07, 2011, 08:04 PM
Ok maybe i'm a new newb and I don't feel like digging through 150 pages in this thread. But I just downloaded and played as Germany and they are called "the holy roman empire." ..I know that their flag was replaced with the Holy Roman Empire's.. could someone explain to me why they are called that. Is it the early dynamic name for Germany? Thanks.

oh and in the features list it said new Leaders were added but I do not see any new leaders... i'm really confused.

thanks a lot guys.

the holy roman empire is the historical name for the land known as germany today for over 1000 years: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roman_Empire

I'm a history buff, so you committed the mortal sin.
You have to play around a bit to see them all.
Also, I wouldn't recommend playing until a new patch is out. I even attempted using auto saves yet the game still crash no matter what I do or who I play as, on the same date.

Tyo
Jun 07, 2011, 08:18 PM
the holy roman empire is the historical name for the land known as germany today for over 1000 years: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roman_Empire

I'm a history buff, so you committed the mortal sin.
You have to play around a bit to see them all.
Also, I wouldn't recommend playing until a new patch is out. I even attempted using auto saves yet the game still crash no matter what I do or who I play as, on the same date.

I think it might be the amount of civs all at once. For example, though it was another modmod, right when America spawned my game crashed. I WB'd the netherlands out(I reduced them to Indonesia, chances are they were gonna collapse anyway) and went with the turn....And the game played smoothly. Check the date and try to remember/check if anyone starts then. That might be the problem.

etp_ak
Jun 07, 2011, 08:50 PM
the holy roman empire is the historical name for the land known as germany today for over 1000 years: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roman_Empire

I'm a history buff, so you committed the mortal sin.
You have to play around a bit to see them all.
Also, I wouldn't recommend playing until a new patch is out. I even attempted using auto saves yet the game still crash no matter what I do or who I play as, on the same date.

You know I'm a history buff too man and I'm totally embarrassed! I just took western civ last semester in college and learned about Charlemagne and everything but we did not go in depth any further after that. Then again I got a C because my teacher was an idiot.

But yeah... learn something new everyday at least. I'm running like a 101 fever too so i'm not thinking clear.

That sucks... so its not even worth trying to play right now?

McDonough
Jun 08, 2011, 06:15 AM
Hello, I'm new to this forum, I played around a little with your mod and let me just say it here and now - it's AMAZING. BUT, sadly, I ran into a little issue that I don't really know how to solve. If somebody could help, it's be very grateful.

Ok, so I decided to have a shot at Greece UHV, Marathon speed (i thought that it might give me the edge I need considering how one needs a goddamn blitzkrieg strategy to get the conquests done before the time limit).
Below is a screenshot from the turn 360. The time limit for the conquests UHV is the turn 364, and I thought that I have all the necessary objectives, but apparently I don't, as on the turn 364 the UHV I'm after greys out and gets marked as 'failed'.

Here's what happened:
- I destroyed Egypt at the very beginning of the game with my starting units
- After turtling for a while, I attacked and captured Jerusalem and Sur. The Phoenicians at that point had Carthage, so I did not destroy the civ, but they begged for peace after I took their city. I let them be - I assumed that the UHV requires the territory of Sur and Sur only, especially considering how capturing Carthage by Greece is not only ahistorical, but also pretty much impossible if you're going for Persia and Babylon simultaneously.
- I attacked Babylon, captured the city of Babylon, after which the civ collapsed, but they left behind an independent city on the territory of modern day Georgia - I marked it on my map.
- I attacked Persia, destroyed Parsa, captured Sirajis, and then also captured their far up north, whose name I can't remember. My intention is to settle somewhere in between those two.

So basically, I'd just like to know what the EXACT requirements of the UHV are - what territories do I need to control? And what does "control the territories of X Y and Z" from the UHV description actually mean? Do I need to have a specific number of cities? Do I need to destroy the said civs? Help me out pretty please :)

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/Drekorig/GreeceUHVrun.jpg

LuKo
Jun 08, 2011, 06:37 AM
I think you need more cities in Persia. I never tried the mod but this UHV looks like vanilla Rome UHV- control 3 cities in France, 2 in Spain, etc. So I assume you need 2 cities in Persia (it looks pretty empty, don't you think?).

BenZL43
Jun 08, 2011, 10:16 AM
Enough!
I'll create the new thread specifically for the Bug..
It's mushrooming lately and it makes them even absurd...

Mekajiki
Jun 09, 2011, 08:56 AM
It's 165 pages long and they're not complaining, they found a crash and think it should be fixed.
To all the people above, currently the modder who works on this is doing a different project, your best hope is to get an auto save and play on from there.

I wouldn't suggest reading 160 pages of thread, but most of the recent conversation is about the bugs. Reading maybe 1 or 2 pages of the thread near the end to see if others are having the problem would make sense. After the extent where the bug is ruled out of being a corrupt download or something of the sort(probably 3-4 reports), further bug reports for the same bug is just clutter. Posting bugs that have already been posted is IMO complaining.

Valex Charme
Jun 09, 2011, 01:34 PM
You only need 1 city in Persia because I did the Greek UHV and all I had was Persepolis.

jammerculture
Jun 09, 2011, 06:07 PM
The modder has (had) a plan to create a later civ spawn as Prussia, which would become Germany. Currently the "German" civ is the Holy Roman Empire throughout the middle ages and will eventually become Austria once the Prussian/German civ is created.

There is new leaders. some of them require certain conditions to be met to arrive, like specific civ combinations etc. It's a pretty big mod. You'll have to play a lot to see all the new stuff.

The 1500 crash is a result of a Persian respawn that is bugged. There is instructions earlier in the thread on how to disable the respawn. Can anyone confirm if Algor Mortis's fixes work? I spoke to Leoreth and let him know about the potential fixes, he said that it sounds reasonable, but he is not in a position to confirm. If we can get confirmation, perhaps we can get a patch put together and add it to the first page/download page.

@mcdonogh, you need to have cities in all the areas and no one else can have cities there. I have failed the UHV before because of a barb city out in the fog.

Algor Mortis
Jun 11, 2011, 04:38 PM
First of all, sorry I've been silent/absent for awhile now. Second of all, I have managed to get a (seemingly) crash-free game on my end with only changing one file, and it leaves the Roman UP perfectly unchanged as opposed to the range of the spawn around a city changing in my last two files. It would seem that the problem was indeed Phoenicia's capital switch when Carthage falls that was causing the crashes I suspected were being caused by the Roman UP. I've done very little testing on this, but at first glance it seems that there is no problem whatsoever with the UP itself. But to all those interested in helping me test this, (or at least have a chance to get through a game without crashing, if that sounds better :P) I'm using the latest SVN version of the mod, with only the one file attached overwriting the default file in ...\RFC Dawn of Civilization\Assets\Python

This SHOULD fix the Roman crash, the Italy respawn crash, and the Persian respawn crash, or at least it does for me.

Once again, if you have the time to try this out, or at least want to have a shot at playing a full game, please try this fix. Also I suppose I should say, anyone else is very welcome and encouraged to use the changes I've made, or make changes to my changes if you know something that would work better!

The Turk
Jun 11, 2011, 07:30 PM
You only need 1 city in Persia because I did the Greek UHV and all I had was Persepolis.

You must have at least one city in their core area.

hoplitejoe
Jun 12, 2011, 05:44 AM
Bees? is that meant to say need? :lol:

The Turk
Jun 12, 2011, 11:41 AM
Bees? is that meant to say need? :lol:

Whoops! :mischief:
I was typing in a hurry on my iphone -__-"

Bocator
Jun 15, 2011, 04:32 AM
I can't play this, being a fan of RFC it makes me crazy :crazyeye:

I get it when I run 600AD or 3000BC in PublicMaps.

http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/9708/fock.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/195/fock.jpg/)

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/307/fock2.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/12/fock2.jpg/)


Edit: I've BTS in his latest version, and it already happens to me with other mods, do you have any idea ?

corovanrobber
Jun 15, 2011, 02:02 PM
switch language to english

Bocator
Jun 15, 2011, 03:08 PM
switch language to english

It works :eek:
I didn't expect it. Thanks!

dafiden
Jun 17, 2011, 05:56 PM
First of all, sorry I've been silent/absent for awhile now. Second of all, I have managed to get a (seemingly) crash-free game on my end with only changing one file, and it leaves the Roman UP perfectly unchanged as opposed to the range of the spawn around a city changing in my last two files. It would seem that the problem was indeed Phoenicia's capital switch when Carthage falls that was causing the crashes I suspected were being caused by the Roman UP. I've done very little testing on this, but at first glance it seems that there is no problem whatsoever with the UP itself. But to all those interested in helping me test this, (or at least have a chance to get through a game without crashing, if that sounds better :P) I'm using the latest SVN version of the mod, with only the one file attached overwriting the default file in ...\RFC Dawn of Civilization\Assets\Python

This SHOULD fix the Roman crash, the Italy respawn crash, and the Persian respawn crash, or at least it does for me.

Once again, if you have the time to try this out, or at least want to have a shot at playing a full game, please try this fix. Also I suppose I should say, anyone else is very welcome and encouraged to use the changes I've made, or make changes to my changes if you know something that would work better!

This fixed my CTD!!!

Thank you so much Algor Mortis. :D

FYI, for those bug-fixing I still get a Python Exception: 292984

jammerculture
Jun 17, 2011, 10:17 PM
First of all, sorry I've been silent/absent for awhile now. Second of all, I have managed to get a (seemingly) crash-free game on my end with only changing one file, and it leaves the Roman UP perfectly unchanged as opposed to the range of the spawn around a city changing in my last two files. It would seem that the problem was indeed Phoenicia's capital switch when Carthage falls that was causing the crashes I suspected were being caused by the Roman UP. I've done very little testing on this, but at first glance it seems that there is no problem whatsoever with the UP itself. But to all those interested in helping me test this, (or at least have a chance to get through a game without crashing, if that sounds better :P) I'm using the latest SVN version of the mod, with only the one file attached overwriting the default file in ...\RFC Dawn of Civilization\Assets\Python

This SHOULD fix the Roman crash, the Italy respawn crash, and the Persian respawn crash, or at least it does for me.

Once again, if you have the time to try this out, or at least want to have a shot at playing a full game, please try this fix. Also I suppose I should say, anyone else is very welcome and encouraged to use the changes I've made, or make changes to my changes if you know something that would work better!

Awesome!

I will definitely try this out and get back to you. I had my suspicions about the Carthage crash as well, having this confirmed is excellent. If it works out I will see about getting Leoreth to add it to the SVN to get rid of all the new bug reports.

Depravo
Jun 23, 2011, 03:04 PM
Download's coming up as 'File not found' for me. Anyone else having trouble?

mayor
Jun 23, 2011, 04:31 PM
yep, I've got the same problem :(

hoplitejoe
Jun 23, 2011, 05:00 PM
You can try downloading it from the SVN (https://www.assembla.com/code/Dawn_of_Civilization/subversion/nodes).

trexeric
Jun 23, 2011, 07:52 PM
Could I have help downloading? I have only three (probably really stupid) questions:
1: I put it in the Beyond the Sword Mods folder, right?
2: How do I 'extract' a file?
3: How do I get it to work (This probably relates to how I can't extract a file)?

p.s. - This is my first time loading a modmod

AdrienIer
Jun 24, 2011, 03:15 AM
I think the question is rather : do you have winrar ? Because you need it to extract the file.
If you do, you just have to click on "extract file", and put it in the Beyond The Sword\Mods folder. Then you can access the modmod from BTS or directly from the public maps file inside the DoC folder.
I hope this helped. Have fun playing !

mayor
Jun 24, 2011, 03:55 AM
You can try downloading it from the SVN (https://www.assembla.com/code/Dawn_of_Civilization/subversion/nodes).

And could you tell how I download it from there? It just shows files and folders who are normally placed within the modfolder... And I can't find the .RAR folder or an other type of folder that could be the modfolder

hoplitejoe
Jun 24, 2011, 04:40 AM
And could you tell how I download it from there? It just shows files and folders who are normally placed within the modfolder... And I can't find the .RAR folder or an other type of folder that could be the modfolder
You have to download the SVN tool then use the tutorial from the bottom of the screen.

trexeric
Jun 24, 2011, 08:36 AM
Does winrar cost money? Or is there something like a free trial? I currently have 7-Zip.

AdrienIer
Jun 24, 2011, 09:40 AM
Supposedly there is a 40 days free trial. But I have been using it for years, all for free !

trexeric
Jun 24, 2011, 01:37 PM
Oh, okay! Thanks, AdrienIer!

jammerculture
Jun 25, 2011, 02:30 PM
I have actually considered buying it just to get rid of the stupid opening screen!

It is free for life if you can deal with the pop up

P.S. can anyone report on the success of Algor Mortis's fix?

BenZL43
Jun 26, 2011, 11:20 AM
AFAIK 7-Zip is the free version of WinRar

AOS9001
Jun 27, 2011, 01:44 AM
Fixed the crashes, eh? Good, good... Now we await the return of the great Leoreth, and press onwards. Or you all press onwards, I'll just play.

Bocator
Jun 28, 2011, 12:06 PM
http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/8357/geraj.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/28/geraj.jpg/)

:aargh:

My game crash, and even if I reload 2 turns before I re-crash, so I can't continue my game. :wallbash:
It often happens in my games, around this period, why ? :hammer2:

Edit: Oh, apparently this is the respawn of Persia, I'm going to try the fix.
Edit2: It works ! :run:

The Turk
Jun 28, 2011, 01:02 PM
Is this mod dead? I'm quite confused to put it lightly...

I'd really like to play, but there seems to be some glaring bugs :(

hoplitejoe
Jun 28, 2011, 01:19 PM
Is this mod dead? I'm quite confused to put it lightly...

I'd really like to play, but there seems to be some glaring bugs :(

Quite a bit earlier I PM'ed Leoreth who said that he had another project he was completely focusing on.
As for the bugs, try some of the attempts people have made to fix them.

The Turk
Jun 28, 2011, 01:57 PM
Quite a bit earlier I PM'ed Leoreth who said that he had another project he was completely focusing on.
As for the bugs, try some of the attempts people have made to fix them.

mmm... I haven't seen anything but lets see....

As for the bug fixes, could we have a bug fix compilation, with a newest update?

rogue131
Jun 29, 2011, 09:27 AM
sorry it's been a hot minute, but really as far as "bugs," "silence," and "complaining" is going, I'm just playing the earlier version (before playable Byzantium) and waiting it out. Leo's busy, I respect that.

robf32
Jul 07, 2011, 10:47 PM
Been playing DoC (pretty heavily modified to be more to my liking...) for along time, probably should have jumped in this forum sooner.

Not sure about all the bugs that were listed a bit further up, I haven't experienced a lot of them, but I hardly get to play anymore.

Anyways, I have played a few dozen games since the latest version came out, crash free; mind you I pretty consistantly play as Byzantium and haven't tested as any asian or american civ.

The offending bit of code, or at least what fixed the respawn crash for me was in CvPlayer.cpp at line 5342:

case PERSIA:
if (!GET_PLAYER((PlayerTypes)ROME).isReborn())
startingEra = 1;
else
startingEra = 3; //Leoreth: Safavid Persia
break;

Changed the Rome to Persia, recompiled, and no crash. Now mind you I made a few dozen other changes as well; none of which had anything to do with the respawns (some changes to spawns for Byz and Arabs though, nothing that would impact the crash.)

So, if anyone wants to make the change, build, and try feel free. Unfortunately I do not really have the time to either undo the other changes I've made or wait for the download as the internet is a bit crappy off my phone on the train. If it turns out not to have been the fix I can take a closer look at the changes I've made and see what else might have fixed it.

hoplitejoe
Jul 08, 2011, 04:56 AM
Been playing DoC (pretty heavily modified to be more to my liking...) for along time, probably should have jumped in this forum sooner.

Not sure about all the bugs that were listed a bit further up, I haven't experienced a lot of them, but I hardly get to play anymore.

Anyways, I have played a few dozen games since the latest version came out, crash free; mind you I pretty consistantly play as Byzantium and haven't tested as any asian or american civ.

The offending bit of code, or at least what fixed the respawn crash for me was in CvPlayer.cpp at line 5342:

case PERSIA:
if (!GET_PLAYER((PlayerTypes)ROME).isReborn())
startingEra = 1;
else
startingEra = 3; //Leoreth: Safavid Persia
break;

Changed the Rome to Persia, recompiled, and no crash. Now mind you I made a few dozen other changes as well; none of which had anything to do with the respawns (some changes to spawns for Byz and Arabs though, nothing that would impact the crash.)

So, if anyone wants to make the change, build, and try feel free. Unfortunately I do not really have the time to either undo the other changes I've made or wait for the download as the internet is a bit crappy off my phone on the train. If it turns out not to have been the fix I can take a closer look at the changes I've made and see what else might have fixed it.

Welcome to the forum :cool:. thank you for helping us with the fix, if i have time i will try it later.

Alduskkel
Jul 11, 2011, 12:03 AM
Hey, first time poster. Anyway, I just wanted to ask why Byzantium isn't spawning in 3000 BC starts. I have played a couple of games as the Romans and they won't spawn there, even though I control Greece. For what it's worth, I usually have a good stability rating. Also, does Constantinopolis have to exist?

I've also let the game autoplay as the Vikings and then entered the world builder, but the Byzantines won't spawn either.

They will spawn if I play as them, but obviously I don't always want to play as them or even play as them and switch to another civ.

constantinople
Jul 12, 2011, 06:59 PM
@Bocator The exact same thing happens to me around the same turn!!!

hoplitejoe
Jul 12, 2011, 07:19 PM
@Bocator The exact same thing happens to me around the same turn!!!
If you look at the thread you will find several fixes for this already.


Hey, first time poster. Anyway, I just wanted to ask why Byzantium isn't spawning in 3000 BC starts. I have played a couple of games as the Romans and they won't spawn there, even though I control Greece. For what it's worth, I usually have a good stability rating. Also, does Constantinopolis have to exist?

I've also let the game autoplay as the Vikings and then entered the world builder, but the Byzantines won't spawn either.

They will spawn if I play as them, but obviously I don't always want to play as them or even play as them and switch to another civ.
A belated welcome [party] perhaps it is due to the fact you are Rome and control Greece. do the spawn when you play as India?
Sorry for the late response.

Alduskkel
Jul 13, 2011, 03:40 AM
Played a game as India. Rome died early on (to the Celts, actually) but they did destroy Greece which was controlled by independents/barbarians at the Byzantine spawn date.

Still no spawn. FYI I am playing on Marathon speed.

OldGuard
Jul 13, 2011, 09:59 AM
You can't switch to the Byzantines. The only way to play as the Byzantines is to choose them from the start :(

BenZL43
Jul 14, 2011, 10:25 AM
I've tried changing the word ROME into PERSIA..
But it still crashing (?)

Anybody have the example of the fixed CvPlayer.cpp ?
Or robf32, will you upload your version of CvPlayer.cpp ? It's okay kok with the Byzantine etc spawn you edited :)

Linkman226
Jul 16, 2011, 12:23 AM
Just returned to these forums after a long hiatus.


What is the latest version? 1.72?

BenZL43
Jul 16, 2011, 02:24 AM
afaik there's no new version, it's been around 1 to 2 months Leoreth didn't show up here, because he's got a project to be focused first ;)

jammerculture
Jul 18, 2011, 10:15 PM
I have informed Leoreth that there is a fix for the respawn crashes (which definitely work woohooo) and he said he would add them to the SVN but hasn't yet. He is very busy. This mod is not going anywhere any time soon.

However with Algor Mortis's fix we do have a stable version

Take it for what it is

Linkman226
Jul 19, 2011, 08:58 PM
Can I get a copy of the fix? For Synthesis.

jb94ifb
Jul 20, 2011, 10:12 PM
Hi Leoreth,
Your mod is great and i really enjoy it. However, every file i start end up crashing. No matter what civ i choose, the game crashes in the year 1510AD. I have tried uninstalling and reinstalling, and different civs, but it always crashes at the same point. Will this be fixed in the next update? And when do you plan on releasing the next update?
Thanks,
Josh

***Update***
I kinda figured out that Netherlands and Persia Span right before this. It there a way to edit that so that Persia doesnt spawn???

BenZL43
Jul 21, 2011, 03:02 PM
there's currently some bugs on Italy or Persia spawn..
And since Leoreth is currently hibernating, no official solutions available at the moment :)
But you can try using Algor Mortis works or robf32 CvPlayer.cpp trick etc for a while..

and..

WELCOME TO THE FORUM :D

HardRocker
Jul 26, 2011, 01:37 PM
can anyone help me with this?

I wanted to spawn as Italy, but they di not appear on the Civ Choosing Menu. I decided I wanted to play as Egypt, but when I accept the War Chariots quest (or any quest) I get a CTD. Is there a fix for this.

ALSO: maybe bug, maybe not, but India always succumbs to Barbs at the beginning of the Bronze Age

hoplitejoe
Jul 26, 2011, 01:43 PM
can anyone help me with this?

I wanted to spawn as Italy, but they di not appear on the Civ Choosing Menu. I decided I wanted to play as Egypt, but when I accept the War Chariots quest (or any quest) I get a CTD. Is there a fix for this.
You can only play as Itay by waiting for them to spawn.
As for the Egypt thing is have no idea :D

robf32
Jul 27, 2011, 12:10 AM
Haven't had much free time, but I have managed to put enough together to completely rewrite the scripted re-spawn; merging it back in with the original spawn methods.

I have tested this with several of the posted saved games that seem to have the bug and experienced 0 crashes.

There are some other changes to this file that I use for my games, some may like them, some wont, I honestly am not sure what they are at this point. If everything works without crashing, but something is weird or off, let me know; shouldn't be too hard to change back.

I have also included my cvPlayer.cpp since it was asked for.

Update 07/28/2011: Found a bug where you wouldn't be asked if you wanted to take over a conditional spawn Civ... bug fixed.

296769

Linkman226
Jul 27, 2011, 10:19 AM
Nice job

J. pride
Jul 27, 2011, 08:43 PM
Thanks Rob

Btw: is it just me or would anyone else also like to see an HRE Germany split. Something like this.
HRE spawns in 840 in Vienna. They get a Uhv that goes something like(this is on top of my head; you can suggest as u like) control Germany, Austria and Italy (maybe vassalize Spain too), built x amount of cathedrals and win the Apoltalic election 2-3 times.

Then in 1600 Germany spawns as Prussia in Berlin; they have the same goals except this time Frankfurt doesnt flip to them but to componsate that they have strong military (like historically).
In case ur wondering the name of HRE would change to Austria in or Austria Hungary in 1700 (i think thats correct).

I think adding HRE could be a great addition to the game and it could also stop Germany's unhistorical eastwards expansion.

AdrienIer
Jul 28, 2011, 05:42 AM
IIRC J. pride, that was Leoreth's plan in the long term, but unfortunately he can't continue DoC for some time.

BenZL43
Jul 28, 2011, 01:14 PM
Yeah, Leoreth already intended to split HRE to Prussia and Austria when fire nation suddenly attacked :P

And about the India succumbs to barbs in Bronze Age, it's indeed historical and that's what I expect of :D

Linkman226
Jul 30, 2011, 01:47 AM
Um anyone else with DoC's SVN experiencing this? It won't let you update without a username and password.

robf32
Jul 30, 2011, 02:00 AM
Yea, I had that problem earlier, just kind of gave up on it.

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

Linkman226
Jul 30, 2011, 02:23 AM
From Leoreth's Assembla page, I cans see he hasn't changed anything since April, so at least we're not missing out...

Sikandar
Jul 30, 2011, 10:07 AM
Wow he just updated it.

Sikandar
Jul 30, 2011, 10:10 AM
It's funny because I saw 1.72 and was reading the future release plans and then I left the page and came back about 30 seconds later when I realized I only had 1.71 and immediately saw that it had become 1.73 in that 30-second span.

Leoreth
Jul 30, 2011, 10:17 AM
Well, that's changed now :D

Right, I'm back to DoC modding, and to give you something to make up for the long period of inactivity, I release the last update for 1.7, version 1.73, right along with it.

That's the reason why the SVN has been unavailable for some days - I didn't want anyone to download any of the intermediate versions which didn't work properly.

Special thanks go to Algor Mortis and robf32, who were able to detect errors I was unable to find for some time. Their fixes have been incorporated into 1.73. Its other features are mainly a UHV progress display similar to SoI's, as well as small bugfixes and balancing issues. All features:

Temple of Solomon now loses its effect with Liberalism, instead of acquiring it
fixed the transition to democracy instability (you now only need to have Representation before you can switch to Parliament without penalty)
Arabian expansion now also in the 3000 BC scenario
Made Washington more reluctant to peacefully vassalize
included Algor Mortis' fixes to the Roman UP and Italian spawn crashes
included robf32's fix to the Persian spawn crash
England's first UHV goal now requires them to build a total of 25 frigates and ships of the line
added an SoI style UHV goal progress display
fixed the Persian UHV so that it also accounts for the new wonders added in DoC
expanded the Roman UHV requirements to include the whole Roman Empire (4 cities in Greece or Anatolia, 2 cities in Egypt)
changed the Arabian UHV requirements to controlling or vassalizing Spain, the Maghreb, Mesopotamia and Persia
the Arabian UHV now requires at least one of the area's cities to be controlled by them or one of their vassals, and no cities controlled by anyone else (e.g. your vassal Persia could hold Mesopotamia for you as well)

You have the usual three methods of downloading the update: via SVN (the password requirement has been removed), downloading the whole mod at the download center or downloading the 1.72 to 1.73 patch attached to this post. As always, this patch only works if you have 1.72 (overwrite everything) and doesn't include the current C++ sourcecode.

I'll now commence with the work on 1.8, following the ideas laid out in the first post.

Gruekiller
Jul 30, 2011, 10:37 AM
You're a god among men, Leoreth.

hoplitejoe
Jul 30, 2011, 10:45 AM
Welcome back :D

J. pride
Jul 30, 2011, 01:23 PM
Welcome Back, Leoreth,

v1.8 (The Far East) features:

spawn Mongolian settlers in Transoxania?
Mongolia flips Transoxania on spawn
Mongolian and Arabian "conqueror" events
slightly buff the Indian subcontinent
find a way to improve Silk Route cities (maybe via corporation: +2 food, +5 commerce per silk?)
replace Mongolian 12% area goal? (maybe "control 5-7 cores"?)
include additional Hindu wonders
include additional Buddhist wonders
return Confucianism as an eighth religion
new civilization: Korea
open up jungles in Indonesia to allow European colonization

I just had a few questions/suggestions on the version 1.8

1) What would be a Mongolian/Arabian conquerers event look like?
2) Are u sure about Korea, my concern is that adding them would cause unhistorical expansion into Siberia and Manchuria.
3) There is no mention of changing Chinese and Indian capitals; does that mean that it is not included in this version? ( Louyang or Xian for China, Pataliputra for India)
4) Are u adding the following cities to the game:
-Nanjing (replaces Qofu)
-Turfan and Kashgar along the silk road; these cities would later flip to the mongols thus opening the way for western expansion. Also Ive noticed that the Mongols should not get settler, first because they waste them and second they were primarily a conquering civilization

Leoreth
Jul 30, 2011, 02:46 PM
1) I don't think the Arabians still need it, that's kinda obsolete. For the Mongols, currently I picture it as an AI only event that triggers when they make contact with appropriate civilizations (Russia, Byzantium, Arabia, Persia, India), gives them a sizeable army close to their borders and starts a war.
2) I am. Undesired expansion can easily be kept at bay with settler maps, and they ought to add a little more complexity to the diplomacy in the far east.
3) The list is far from comprehensive. Changed capitals have to be tested, though (I'm in favor of Varanasi for the Indians) - for example the Indian candidates would be stuck in a lot of jungle.
4) Yeah, Nanjing really makes sense (though it looks a little odd to have holy cities there), especially with a certain new wonder I plan to add ;)
I agree about the silk route cities as well; they should spawn or be already present in 600 AD.

robf32
Jul 30, 2011, 06:44 PM
Other than the cvPlayer.cpp if statement were any other changes made to the DLL for the change from 1.72 to 1.73?

Sent from my EVO 4G running CyanogenMod.

J. pride
Jul 30, 2011, 10:57 PM
1) I don't think the Arabians still need it, that's kinda obsolete. For the Mongols, currently I picture it as an AI only event that triggers when they make contact with appropriate civilizations (Russia, Byzantium, Arabia, Persia, India), gives them a sizeable army close to their borders and starts a war.
Arabia and Persia are appropriate targets for the mongols but the rest I dont think are good ideas for the following reasons:

Byzantine- were allies of the Mongols (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzantine%E2%80%93Mongol_alliance). The better thing to do would be to spawn seljuk barbarians in Anotolia in the 12th century ad that spread Islam on conquest. I recall that you also wanted to spawn seljuk barbs in the Middle East but i wouldnt recommend that because unlike the conquest of Anatolia the seljuk conquest of the Middle East was largely peaceful even to an extent that the Abbasid Caliph and the Seljuk Sultan could co-exist. Instead for the Middle East, the Mongol conquerors event would be more fitting.

India- The Mongol Empire never conquered India; they stopped at the Indus River which was the boundry between Ancient Persia and India.

Russia- It would be better if the Russians just vassalize to the Mongols because if the Russians collapse it would just be mess later on. On a similar note, I think you should push the Russian spawn back and they should have more cities flip to them instead of settling (their settlers are just terrible at picking a good spot)


BTW: Leoreth, You should consider merging the feature from Civilizations in Abundance where Jarkov gave every Independent Civ unique Graphics, Stats, etc.
That would not only look really cool but also can be tweaked in a way where u can have those indies to behave a certain way like if u want the Arabs to conquer the Sassanids or the French to conquer Rome

296904

296905

296906

hoplitejoe
Jul 31, 2011, 05:49 AM
BTW: Leoreth, You should consider merging the feature from Civilizations in Abundance where Jarkov gave every Independent Civ unique Graphics, Stats, etc.
That would not only look really cool but also can be tweaked in a way where u can have those indies to behave a certain way like if u want the Arabs to conquer the Sassanids or the French to conquer Rome

:agree: but if you do make them a separate folder in the civpeadia otherwise it gets quite messy.

Orka
Jul 31, 2011, 09:44 AM
:D Welcome back Leoreth! Can't wait for the next version. How exactly do you plan to implement the Silk Road (I saw the Silk corporation thing, but is that the final choice?).

Also I noticed Confucianism is on the list? I thought you removed it long ago b/c it was redundant.

Leoreth
Jul 31, 2011, 09:50 AM
Other than the cvPlayer.cpp if statement were any other changes made to the DLL for the change from 1.72 to 1.73?
No, did you find anything else?

Arabia and Persia are appropriate targets for the mongols but the rest I dont think are good ideas for the following reasons:

Byzantine- were allies of the Mongols (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzantine%E2%80%93Mongol_alliance). The better thing to do would be to spawn seljuk barbarians in Anotolia in the 12th century ad that spread Islam on conquest. I recall that you also wanted to spawn seljuk barbs in the Middle East but i wouldnt recommend that because unlike the conquest of Anatolia the seljuk conquest of the Middle East was largely peaceful even to an extent that the Abbasid Caliph and the Seljuk Sultan could co-exist. Instead for the Middle East, the Mongol conquerors event would be more fitting.

India- The Mongol Empire never conquered India; they stopped at the Indus River which was the boundry between Ancient Persia and India.

Russia- It would be better if the Russians just vassalize to the Mongols because if the Russians collapse it would just be mess later on. On a similar note, I think you should push the Russian spawn back and they should have more cities flip to them instead of settling (their settlers are just terrible at picking a good spot)
That's how it actually played out in history, but that's no reason to enforce it. I see no reason why the Mongols shouldn't ally with say Arabia to conquer Anatolia instead.
And the Mongols tried to conquer India (not very hard though) and failed. Consider that ingame the war could end without a city conquered, only a few cities conquered or the target vassalizing.

BTW: Leoreth, You should consider merging the feature from Civilizations in Abundance where Jarkov gave every Independent Civ unique Graphics, Stats, etc.
That would not only look really cool but also can be tweaked in a way where u can have those indies to behave a certain way like if u want the Arabs to conquer the Sassanids or the French to conquer Rome
I haven't followed CiA for a while, what exactly did Jarkov do? Split the independents into lots of different players?

BenZL43
Jul 31, 2011, 10:03 AM
LEORETH IS BACK~!!!

WELCOME :D

*downloading the patch now*

robf32
Jul 31, 2011, 10:56 AM
Not that I recall, just wondering if I needed to go back and make my other changes. Thanks.

Sent from my EVO 4G running CyanogenMod.

Sikandar
Jul 31, 2011, 11:02 AM
Any idea why Rhye excluded the Persians (Sassanids), Ethiopians (Axumites), and Maya from the 600 AD start? All three were still active and strong in 600. Also shouldn't the Indians respawn in 750 as the Palas?

Gruekiller
Jul 31, 2011, 11:18 AM
I don't see much use in having the Sassanids when they'll just be conquered in a few years by the Arabs any way (despite the fact that the Arabs often don't conquer the Persian indies any way).

Leoreth
Jul 31, 2011, 02:15 PM
I guess Rhye's reasoning was that they all have failed at least one of their UHV goals at that point. They also all collapse one way or another until 1000 AD, which isn't much in game turn terms.

J. pride
Jul 31, 2011, 03:50 PM
I haven't followed CiA for a while, what exactly did Jarkov do? Split the independents into lots of different players?

Yes, so their like minor civs but without the lag time.

ilduce349
Jul 31, 2011, 10:01 PM
So Leoreth, now that you have returned, any word on ways of how to re-add plauges into the game?

Barratt_87
Aug 01, 2011, 11:45 AM
So, I know I asked this before but how do I set the starting stability? I think I remember how to do this but just to be sure, how do i set it so I can switch players as many times as I want?

Also, is there a way to boost the french colonization? I set them up for it my self in the WB all the time but I never see france colonize as much as the others on their own, and sometimes it sadens me, especially when they vassalize because they are so weak.

And final question.. Can I choose which leader I can play as or the default 'switch to' leader? Im not a fan of switching to france (for example) and being called Charlemange for the rest of time.

PS, welcome back! I took a vacation from civ due to the lack of progress on this mod (and the slightly broken dynamic names on RFCE)

Leoreth
Aug 01, 2011, 12:40 PM
Thanks :)

Okay, in order:

1. You can use utils.setStability(iPlayer, iValue) in the checkTurn() method in RiseAndFall.py.
2. The fastest way to do this is to find getAlreadySwitched() in RiseAndFall.py and replace its implementation with "return False".
3. You could try to change tMaxColonists in Consts.py, although they already have 6 like everyone else. France's weakness bothers me too, by the way.
4. Not sure about civs you switch to (I guess you're stuck with the leader the civ has when you switch, unless you use Python for help), but you can change the leader the player starts a civ with in the WBS files (open them with an editor and replace LEADER_VICTORIA with LEADER_ELIZABETH, for example).

skunkpuppy
Aug 02, 2011, 06:27 AM
I'm so excited about the East Asian focus! Please tell us more about the proposed wonders! And Confucianism! And Korea!

Oh, heck, just tell us EVERYTHING!

The Turk
Aug 02, 2011, 07:53 AM
Leoreth, did you just block the svn update?

keli
Aug 02, 2011, 08:51 AM
Could you please add more stability to the newly spawning Lombard League? Plus some extra workers and units would help them surviving more than 15 turns.

Leoreth
Aug 02, 2011, 09:27 AM
I'm so excited about the East Asian focus! Please tell us more about the proposed wonders! And Confucianism! And Korea!

Oh, heck, just tell us EVERYTHING!
Korea is already in the SVN, nothing special there: UU and UB from BtS, spawn is 50BC at Seoul. UP and UHV are not implemented, mainly because I don't know for sure which UP to give them. The UHV will involve building a Cathedral (or two, one Buddhist and one Confucian), sinking enemy ships and being the first to discover Printing Press and Gunpowder.

They also need a little tweaking, from what I've seen.

Not much to say about Confucianism - it will be restored to its former position, and Zoroastrianism becomes an eighth religion. This will be in the SVN as well soon.

Wonders, well, I don't want to reveal everything. I've got sure candidates for an explicitly Buddhist and an explicitly Hinduist wonder, as well as two generic Indian ones, as well as one from China and Japan each, which all will likely end up with their local religion as requirement to spread them accurately. Good luck figuring them out ;)

Leoreth, did you just block the svn update?
Not intentionally, and I've just checked and the repository had public view access. Maybe assembla had problems at that time, just try it later.

Could you please add more stability to the newly spawning Lombard League? Plus some extra workers and units would help them surviving more than 15 turns.
Yeah, they need the stability, you're right.

Are you concerned about the AI problems with military or for the player as well?

keli
Aug 02, 2011, 09:29 AM
To be honest, I couldn't really play with the Lombard League, because the game crushed after the 5th turn, but taking Rome is hard with your starting units (usually I give the AI units from the world builder, still they fail to build up a decent empire), and they need 3 workers pretty badly.

And since the Italian reunion idea was scrapped, is Cavour still apropriate as the leader of the Lombard League?

Leoreth
Aug 02, 2011, 09:39 AM
Well, Italy wasn't unified until 1861, so they are meant to have it hard even uniting their own peninsula. In earlier versions they had it too easy (Germany and France should be dangerous for a long time), but now since they also don't get Rome from the start, I maybe went a bit overboard. They could get some additional siege weapons to boost their ability to take Rome without strengthening them in the defense.

Edit: Confucianism now in the SVN :)
http://i52.tinypic.com/rjecls.jpg

Orka
Aug 02, 2011, 11:03 AM
Will Confucianism replace Taoism as the dominant East Asian religion (Taoism restricted to China)? Or will it be special?

Also, I have a question about your stability hits for civs after their "fall" date. Looking at the code in Stability.py, it seems that an AI civ is toast because the stability hits just keep on coming, larger and larger. Is this intended by design? And will resurrected civs be affected?

Lord Ainsbirth
Aug 02, 2011, 11:32 AM
Hello Leoreth,
Welcome back, thanks for your update!
I tried the 1.73 version, and I realized that the Roman UP doesn't work for me. I declared war at all the Mediterranean Civs, and no army spawned... It is a bug?
Un saludo

Leoreth
Aug 02, 2011, 11:53 AM
Will Confucianism replace Taoism as the dominant East Asian religion (Taoism restricted to China)? Or will it be special?

Also, I have a question about your stability hits for civs after their "fall" date. Looking at the code in Stability.py, it seems that an AI civ is toast because the stability hits just keep on coming, larger and larger. Is this intended by design? And will resurrected civs be affected?
I've changed everything concerning Confucianism and Taoism back to how it is in regular RFC. So China is still the only civ where Taoism spreads decently, while Confucianism should reach Mongolia, Korea and Japan at least.

The calculation there computes the "base stability" at every turn, and should not be confused with temporary stability effects. So the effect doesn't "stack up". It does slowly build up by design, but is capped at certain values (15 for human neighbors, 25 for everyone else). It's just like golden ages work, which apply +20 stability as long as you're under their effect, but not +160 stability in the 8th turn of the GA.

Reborn civs are affected, though I'll change that soon.

Hello Leoreth,
Welcome back, thanks for your update!
I tried the 1.73 version, and I realized that the Roman UP doesn't work for me. I declared war at all the Mediterranean Civs, and no army spawned... It is a bug?
Un saludo
Thanks :) I will look into this soon.

The Turk
Aug 02, 2011, 01:55 PM
Welcome back Leoreth! Hope you enjoyed your break! :)

Now that you can add more religions (yay Confucianism is back!) perhaps adding a Pagan Hellenic religion for the Greeks, Romans, Phoenicians would be a good idea; in general a Pagan Mediteranean religion is in need big time IMO, to counter Zorastrianism in the East.

Lord Ainsbirth
Aug 02, 2011, 03:49 PM
BTW, I finished the game with the Romans (without UP!!) and the new UHV (to have the whole Roman Empire) is really good!!! Very changeling indeed!!
And I agree with The Turk, I think some sort of Helleninc Religion is needed (mmm... or maybe it's represented by the Paganism Civic?)
Thanks!

Leoreth
Aug 02, 2011, 05:39 PM
Cool, I thought you'd need the UP for that.

I've included the Pantheon civic to model exactly the Greek/Roman/Egyptian etc. religions. Them having the same religion and loving each other doesn't really make much sense. In future I'll even modify the Pantheon civic further that it gives more penalties with actual religions.

Leoreth
Aug 02, 2011, 07:13 PM
I've re-enabled the Roman UP and fixed its announcement text, update the SVN :)

The Turk
Aug 02, 2011, 08:30 PM
I've re-enabled the Roman UP and fixed its announcement text, update the SVN :)

Hey Leoreth, I've bought a new computer recently, and therefore had to get RFC DoC again, through the SVN. But, I can no longer play it because whenever I start up the SVN checkout (in an empty RFC DoC folder), I get an error after a while. Do you know by any chance what might be causing it to stop uploading files?

azander12
Aug 02, 2011, 09:06 PM
Hey Leoreth, I've bought a new computer recently, and therefore had to get RFC DoC again, through the SVN. But, I can no longer play it because whenever I start up the SVN checkout (in an empty RFC DoC folder), I get an error after a while. Do you know by any chance what might be causing it to stop uploading files?

I've been getting the same thing.

Valex Charme
Aug 03, 2011, 02:23 AM
Could Orthodoxy come in some time in the future? It's very funny for me to see a Catholic/Protestant Russia and Byzantium.

ilduce349
Aug 03, 2011, 02:51 AM
Was I ignored?

Leoreth
Aug 03, 2011, 04:38 AM
Hey Leoreth, I've bought a new computer recently, and therefore had to get RFC DoC again, through the SVN. But, I can no longer play it because whenever I start up the SVN checkout (in an empty RFC DoC folder), I get an error after a while. Do you know by any chance what might be causing it to stop uploading files?
No idea what's going on there, could you show me the error message? And have you tried updating the incomplete folder you've checked out?

Could Orthodoxy come in some time in the future? It's very funny for me to see a Catholic/Protestant Russia and Byzantium.
I was thinking the same thing, although it won't be in the next release.

Was I ignored?
Sorry, I'm not sure what you were talking about. I suppose plagues are still in the game ...?

skunkpuppy
Aug 03, 2011, 06:42 AM
I've changed everything concerning Confucianism and Taoism back to how it is in regular RFC. So China is still the only civ where Taoism spreads decently, while Confucianism should reach Mongolia, Korea and Japan at least.


If Taoism is restricted to China, is it worthwhile gameplay wise to have it at all? Maybe it can be replaced with Orthodoxy?

Historically, it seems that the politically dominant East Asian religions were Buddhism and Confucianism, which would ensure enough religious conflict gameplaywise. Not sure if there was ever a Taoist state even in China.

The Turk
Aug 03, 2011, 08:39 AM
No idea what's going on there, could you show me the error message? And have you tried updating the incomplete folder you've checked out?


Here is a screenshot I took. Basically it gets up to a Mongkut or some other LH and it stops and gives that error message. Do you know what might be behind this?

@Skunkpuppy, I agree with you 100%. But as we no longer need to remove/replace religions, we should just keep it; also there never was a Taoist state civilization in China. And I for one am 100% behind adding Orthodoxy, that would be really great if a proper Eastern Europe and Byzantium could emerge!

Leoreth
Aug 03, 2011, 09:37 AM
I have tried and was just able to check out a complete folder of DoC. Judging from your error message, it seems that there are already some SVN auxiliary data in the folder you want to check out to. Is there still a folder named ".svn" (it's usually hidden)? If so, delete it.

The Turk
Aug 03, 2011, 10:12 AM
I have tried and was just able to check out a complete folder of DoC. Judging from your error message, it seems that there are already some SVN auxiliary data in the folder you want to check out to. Is there still a folder named ".svn" (it's usually hidden)? If so, delete it.

Well I mean, I keep creating new folders, with nothing inside. I know what your talking about, about the .svn folder, but its not there. Do you have any other ideas? Currently I'm checking out RFC Europe, and so far its working fine, I will tell you if I get the same error, or if it works out fine.

Linkman226
Aug 03, 2011, 10:19 AM
Well I mean, I keep creating new folders, with nothing inside. I know what your talking about, about the .svn folder, but its not there. Do you have any other ideas? Currently I'm checking out RFC Europe, and so far its working fine, I will tell you if I get the same error, or if it works out fine.

Do a google search for revealing hidden folders on your operating system. .svn is a hidden folder so you won't see it normally.

The Turk
Aug 03, 2011, 06:18 PM
Do a google search for revealing hidden folders on your operating system. .svn is a hidden folder so you won't see it normally.

Thanks Leoreth and Linkman, I got it to work now! I'm going to test 1.73 and see how Confucianism works now! :)

Can't wait to see Orthodoxy in the game! That would be awesome!

Leoreth
Aug 03, 2011, 06:19 PM
Good to see you got it to work.

ilduce349
Aug 03, 2011, 09:19 PM
Sorry, I'm not sure what you were talking about. I suppose plagues are still in the game ...?
Must have been a bug in mine then, one game I played the plauge never came. However I only played till like 1380...

Linkman226
Aug 04, 2011, 12:13 AM
The city screen does not show Zoroastrianism

Leoreth
Aug 04, 2011, 05:09 AM
Must have been a bug in mine then, one game I played the plauge never came. However I only played till like 1380...
Well recently I haven't played until the relevant eras. Can someone confirm?

The city screen does not show Zoroastrianism
Thanks for the hint, in the next SVN revision it will.

keli
Aug 04, 2011, 05:48 AM
I think the plague either hits the east or the west, but not both, so maybe you were lucky cuz the plague always spawned at the far east

The Turk
Aug 04, 2011, 05:51 AM
Ok Leoreth, after playing the game, here are some suggestions I would like to make:

1. Korea was Taoist, it should be Buddhist, perhaps starting with a Buddhist missionary, or Buddhism preplaced in the city.

2. Korea ended up expanding into Siberia and Central Asia, which was kind of annoying. They should really be limited to two cities at most in South Korea and North Korea.

3. Taoism still has a pretty high spread rate it would seem as it spread across Japan (also Hinduism spread to Tokyo :eek: ), needless to say that Religions should be capped.

4. Islam spread all over Britain; Islam really should be capped again in Europe.

5. The Turks were not able to capture Constantinople/Istanbul, even after the Byzantines collapsed. I would recommend therefore having the city flip to the Turks or that they get more troops (siege units), ONLY when the Byzantines & Turks are AI though, no bonus for human players.

6. Please change the Heavy Swordsmen (old macemen), unit art for the East Asian units, because they look kind of strange, with their European outfit. Just another reason to include VD units ;)

7. Having a civic called Serfdom in 3000 BC is a tad strange, I would strongly recommend you changing it to Slavery if you can for 3000 BC games.

8. I forgot... So I'll come up with more later...



PS. Good job coming up with the Korea UHV's, I think you did a fine job in selecting them!

@Keli,

Considering that the Black Plague, or more accurately the Bubonic Plague began in South West China, it makes sense for it to start in China, and then spread to Europe, while the regions of India, South East Asia and really the rest of East Asia should be spared, while transfering it to the Middle East and then to Europe, that would be the best solution for the plague.

Leoreth
Aug 04, 2011, 07:21 AM
I think the plague either hits the east or the west, but not both, so maybe you were lucky cuz the plague always spawned at the far east
Is this already the case in regular RFC? Or a side effect of something I've done here?

Ok Leoreth, after playing the game, here are some suggestions I would like to make:

1. Korea was Taoist, it should be Buddhist, perhaps starting with a Buddhist missionary, or Buddhism preplaced in the city.
Yeah, they'll spawn with at least one Buddhist missionary. The spawn units and techs are not properly balanced out anyway (did you have some observations on their tech performance?).

2. Korea ended up expanding into Siberia and Central Asia, which was kind of annoying. They should really be limited to two cities at most in South Korea and North Korea.
I allowed them to settle some cities in Manchuria (Goguryeo expanded there for example). Most of these cities should get lost at least when the Mongols arrive. These cities include Mudanjiang/Botankou and Qiqihaer most of the time. Or did they expand beyond that?

I'm striving to have their initial settlers settle on Hanseong/Seoul and Pyongyang, and make the Manchurian expansion more of an exception.

3. Taoism still has a pretty high spread rate it would seem as it spread across Japan (also Hinduism spread to Tokyo :eek: ), needless to say that Religions should be capped.

4. Islam spread all over Britain; Islam really should be capped again in Europe.
The figures are both pretty low already. Mind that the religion spread mechanism is still random.

5. The Turks were not able to capture Constantinople/Istanbul, even after the Byzantines collapsed. I would recommend therefore having the city flip to the Turks or that they get more troops (siege units), ONLY when the Byzantines & Turks are AI though, no bonus for human players.
Yeah, AI only may be possible. I think this is mostly an AI problem with the Theodosian Walls' effect (they seem hesitant to attack a city whose defenses they can't reduce, because usually they have enough troops to do it). I was planning on modifying its effect anyway to see how it turns out.

6. Please change the Heavy Swordsmen (old macemen), unit art for the East Asian units, because they look kind of strange, with their European outfit. Just another reason to include VD units ;)
That was on my to do list anyway (different units sets for different cultures are nothing new, so no need to implement VD). Do you have some fitting graphics in mind? Then I wouldn't need to crawl the database.

7. Having a civic called Serfdom in 3000 BC is a tad strange, I would strongly recommend you changing it to Slavery if you can for 3000 BC games.
We already had this discussion. Serfdom sounds strange for Antiquity, Slavery sounds strange for the Middle Ages, and the mechanic is usually in use for both eras. It's hard to come up with a term that covers both, maybe "Forced Labor"?

PS. Good job coming up with the Korea UHV's, I think you did a fine job in selecting them!
Let's see how they work out. Especially the deadline for the cathedrals might have to be adjusted. I also thought about including Education into the tech goal, but decided against it.

The Turk
Aug 04, 2011, 07:46 AM
Yeah, they'll spawn with at least one Buddhist missionary. The spawn units and techs are not properly balanced out anyway (did you have some observations on their tech performance?).

Oh excellent, I think several civ's need to have perhaps one missionary to start off with, such as the Russians.

I allowed them to settle some cities in Manchuria (Goguryeo expanded there for example). Most of these cities should get lost at least when the Mongols arrive. These cities include Mudanjiang/Botankou and Qiqihaer most of the time. Or did they expand beyond that?

I'm striving to have their initial settlers settle on Hanseong/Seoul and Pyongyang, and make the Manchurian expansion more of an exception.

Ya! That would be really great. I guess I'm fine with them spreading out to Manchuria a bit, but not when they begin creating crappy/unhistorical cities in Siberia. I did see them build Mudanjiang though, so that was nice. But otherwise a Korean civ with max 3 cities, sounds good enough for me, they can play it Mayan/Babylon style ;)
And yes in the case of the two games I was observing them, they did settle outside of Manchuria. I'll try to supply you with a screenshot the next time I get a chance!

The figures are both pretty low already. Mind that the religion spread mechanism is still random.

Mmmm... perhaps they should be less randomized then, and a bit more structured. Having an Islamic Sultanate of Britain or Hindu Japan, just ruins the game a bit IMO.

Yeah, AI only may be possible. I think this is mostly an AI problem with the Theodosian Walls' effect (they seem hesitant to attack a city whose defenses they can't reduce, because usually they have enough troops to do it). I was planning on modifying its effect anyway to see how it turns out.

Yes please do modify it, as having the Turks unable to capture Constantinople, is allowing mega Russian/German Empires to sprawl into Eastern Europe and the Balkans.
Also have you given any thought to an independent Polish nation buffer state between the Russians and Germans. It would also have the adverse affect of stopping uncontrollable German eastward expansion ;)

That was on my to do list anyway (different units sets for different cultures are nothing new, so no need to implement VD). Do you have some fitting graphics in mind? Then I wouldn't need to crawl the database.

Yes, the East does need a texture reboot. My first suggestion would be to look at what Bakuel has to offer, but off the top of my memory, he has not done much/any at all East Asian Units, specifically Chinese. I know the VD units has a nice Chinese heavy swordsman, but I will try and help you look for something...

We already had this discussion. Serfdom sounds strange for Antiquity, Slavery sounds strange for the Middle Ages, and the mechanic is usually in use for both eras. It's hard to come up with a term that covers both, maybe "Forced Labor"?

Yes I know we talked about this before, so far I can't think of something else, but I will sleep on it, and think of some other name. Would "Servitude" sound ok?

Let's see how they work out. Especially the deadline for the cathedrals might have to be adjusted. I also thought about including Education into the tech goal, but decided against it.

I haven't tried the Korean UHV, but at a blank look, it looked a lot better then the RFCA Korean UHV's :P

And lastly, the Persian spawn in 1500, they spawn in Rashat, rather than Isfahan, something that should be changed. Also Rashat should be replaced with Tabriz.

PS. I don't play as Mali, often or really at all, but something which I've noticed recently is that they get crushed by barbarians pretty easily. That is another thing that needs to be changed, the barbs. Currently Elephant riding barbs, attacking North Africa and Egypt is a bit ridiculous, and should change.

PPS. Some of the LH's in the civilopedia, are pink squares, or missing information, I'm guessing your just leaving that on the back burner for now?

PPPS. Britain seems to be weaker IMO, from what I've seen, now that they don't build Manchester/Newcastle. Perhaps forcing the AI do build one of those cities, would be a good idea, for its own sake :mischief:

hoplitejoe
Aug 04, 2011, 07:54 AM
Is it just me who enjoys the more random moments of the game?
Although religions being wrong every time seems bad it would be a loss to see the same religions in the same place every time.

ilduce349
Aug 04, 2011, 07:59 AM
I like partial random. I am not here to recreate history, but rewrite it. However most things should go historically but the game should incorporate ability to deter from history.

Leoreth
Aug 04, 2011, 08:40 AM
Yes please do modify it, as having the Turks unable to capture Constantinople, is allowing mega Russian/German Empires to sprawl into Eastern Europe and the Balkans.
Also have you given any thought to an independent Polish nation buffer state between the Russians and Germans. It would also have the adverse affect of stopping uncontrollable German eastward expansion ;)
The release after 1.8 will focus on Europe and its colonies, make of that what you will ;)

Yes, the East does need a texture reboot. My first suggestion would be to look at what Bakuel has to offer, but off the top of my memory, he has not done much/any at all East Asian Units, specifically Chinese. I know the VD units has a nice Chinese heavy swordsman, but I will try and help you look for something...
That would be good. Art etc. comes last, but I'll definitely have everything polished this time (that goes for your button question later on as well). This includes missing music or diplomacy texts.

Yes I know we talked about this before, so far I can't think of something else, but I will sleep on it, and think of some other name. Would "Servitude" sound ok?
Yeah, I considered servitude as well.

And lastly, the Persian spawn in 1500, they spawn in Rashat, rather than Isfahan, something that should be changed. Also Rashat should be replaced with Tabriz.
They spawn on the Esfahan tile, but are seldom inclined to found there. Forcing them to found a city via Python resulted in the infamous Persian respawn crashes. I'll see if I can find a way around that.

PS. I don't play as Mali, often or really at all, but something which I've noticed recently is that they get crushed by barbarians pretty easily. That is another thing that needs to be changed, the barbs. Currently Elephant riding barbs, attacking North Africa and Egypt is a bit ridiculous, and should change.
Carthage and Egypt need some trouble at its borders. When I've taken a look into the code earlier on I've found that most of the elephants that trouble Mali actually spawn at the Mediterranean coast and move south due to a lack of targets. Maybe it would help to prohibit elephants from crossing the desert?

PPPS. Britain seems to be weaker IMO, from what I've seen, now that they don't build Manchester/Newcastle. Perhaps forcing the AI do build one of those cities, would be a good idea, for its own sake :mischief:
You don't know how often I've tried to achieve this ...

Another question to you, since you seem to have played the latest revision until Turkey appears and the Byzantines collapse: does Catholicism get removed from Turkey's core when Byzantium collapses?

I like partial random. I am not here to recreate history, but rewrite it. However most things should go historically but the game should incorporate ability to deter from history.
This is my philosophy as well. I do grant that there are certain European civs who spawn late and are quite distant to Christianity and might need missionary help (Russia, Vikings, England maybe). If there's a chance for Muslim Britain or Taoist Japan, why not? It should still be rather rare over a large selection of games.

Qalled
Aug 04, 2011, 10:01 AM
Have i missed something or is Italy removed, because they do not spawn in my games. Have played several games today and no italians :/

And i'm only able to play one turn of the persian respawn.

lemonjelly
Aug 04, 2011, 10:16 AM
I get a python error saying that global name pKorea isn't defined.

Victory.py - line 898, 2027

Latest revision, 95.

Leoreth
Aug 04, 2011, 11:16 AM
Have i missed something or is Italy removed, because they do not spawn in my games. Have played several games today and no italians :/

And i'm only able to play one turn of the persian respawn.
The Italians don't appear if somebody else controls northern Italy.

On the Persians, do you get an error message or and immediate CTD? Have you enabled logging? If so, PythonErr and PythonDbg would be interesting.

I get a python error saying that global name pKorea isn't defined.

Victory.py - line 898, 2027

Latest revision, 95.
Thanks, it's fixed in the current revision.

Qalled
Aug 04, 2011, 01:33 PM
i only get ctd when i play as a civ that started at 600, if i load as the dutch i can swap to persia without any problem.

ah okey that explains alot with the italians, thx :)

Leoreth
Aug 04, 2011, 01:40 PM
Do you have logging enabled? (In the Civ4_config file).

Qalled
Aug 05, 2011, 05:51 AM
Do you have logging enabled? (In the Civ4_config file).

yes i have, but might just have been some unrelated computer bug because now it works :D

BenZL43
Aug 05, 2011, 10:54 PM
Leoreth,
I really need to tell you,
please add more starting unit to Italia!

In my 2 games, one as Inca switching Italy, one as Ottoman get notification Italy independence.

-> Inca switching Italy

All went as usual and fine,
Start with 3 Pikeman 3 (forgot) and 2 Longbowman.
Rome at 100% Fortification, decided not to attack it.
Lots of French and HRE stacked troops near Rome, perhaps waiting each other to attack first.
French suddenly declare war on me.
French capture Fiorenze easily with their promoted, stacked lots of troops (and Mercenaries)
I WB Fiorenza back
Not so long after that, Byzantine declare war on me. Sank my couple Venetian galley away.
I got exiled to Vikings.
Got message Venetia captured by French.
Few turns after, Byzantine collapsed (They already unstable when they met me)

-> Italy as Ottoman
First turn, got message, Italian cities have declared blablabla...
Third turn, check in WB. Firenze, Venetia, Rom and Neapel under HRE.
Lots of HRE and French troops in Italian heartland.

Also, how about making that Italy will always spawn even if HRE or German control Venetia etc?
Perhaps, we could add Italy to fill the Romans in 600AD

And since you're working on Asia now, how about adding Mughal as well? To counterbalance the Safavid.

Linkman226
Aug 05, 2011, 10:58 PM
Really nice features in the latest SVN version, especially the Silk Road corporation and the Mongol hordes.

Leoreth
Aug 06, 2011, 05:51 AM
Leoreth,
I really need to tell you,
please add more starting unit to Italia!
It seems you're right about that - I'll increase their starting units and will have an eye on them during the development of 1.8.

And since you're working on Asia now, how about adding Mughal as well? To counterbalance the Safavid.
Yes, that's on the table.

Really nice features in the latest SVN version, especially the Silk Road corporation and the Mongol hordes.
Yeah, the new corporations still need to be worked out (I want to modify the whole corporation system). The intended goal is to make silk route cities and colonial cities like the caribbean and indonesia more valuable.

Did you have the opportunity to test the horde feature already? I don't even know if it triggers properly.

J. pride
Aug 06, 2011, 07:04 AM
Did you have the opportunity to test the horde feature already? I don't even know if it triggers properly.

I don't think it trigger at all.

BenZL43
Aug 06, 2011, 09:02 AM
It doesn't trigger either in my game. Mongol stays the same.. only attacking China, though rarely they go to India as well (But not Ottoman etc as said in your 1.8 note)

The Beer Baron
Aug 06, 2011, 10:12 AM
On the latest SVN version, the Americans are spawning without having technologies.

Leoreth
Aug 06, 2011, 10:30 AM
Yes I'll take a look into the code.

On the latest SVN version, the Americans are spawning without having technologies.
Sounds like the RiseAndFall module failed at some point. Do you have Python exceptions enabled?

StuartKleinsen
Aug 06, 2011, 10:40 AM
On the latest SVN version, the Americans are spawning without having technologies.

I'm facing the same situation.

Sounds like the RiseAndFall module failed at some point. Do you have Python exceptions enabled?

I've the 'hide python exception popup' option on '1' in the .ini file

Leoreth
Aug 06, 2011, 10:47 AM
You have to set to 0 (the entry asks you if you want to hide them - don't know why they did it, it's rather confusing).

StuartKleinsen
Aug 06, 2011, 11:05 AM
You have to set to 0 (the entry asks you if you want to hide them - don't know why they did it, it's rather confusing).

:crazyeye: I thought I had enabled this 'cause I'm playing a lot of wip mods...
Well, I'm loading a 600AD American start right now and checking if it's working.

EDIT: I got a pop-up but it didn't work...no techs! :sad:

Leoreth
Aug 06, 2011, 11:25 AM
Thanks.

Kcawesome
Aug 06, 2011, 12:06 PM
I have a problem. I have installed the mod in the mod folder and it will not let me open the World Builder files to start the mod or launch in the main menu. Any ideas?

Leoreth
Aug 06, 2011, 01:31 PM
What's your error message? Or don't you get one at all?

Kcawesome
Aug 06, 2011, 04:15 PM
I dont get one, i can launch all of RFC in the menu but I cant launch DoC at all.

Leoreth
Aug 06, 2011, 04:59 PM
And you're sure you have a folder called "RFC Dawn of Civilization" in Beyond the Sword/Mods/?

Also, after you've doubleclicked one of the WBSave files, open your task manager and look if theres a process called Civ4BeyondSword.exe. If that's the case, maybe all you have to do is wait a little.

Kcawesome
Aug 06, 2011, 05:30 PM
Yep, its all there. I think the problem is that my computer cant find a program to open the saves. Do you know a program that will work? I tried worlbuilder but I couldnt find it.

Leoreth
Aug 06, 2011, 06:31 PM
So you practically end up with the "select a program to open this file" window? Try the Civ4BeyondSword.exe in the Beyond the Sword folder then.

Kcawesome
Aug 06, 2011, 06:58 PM
Yep the game launches now but I still cant play the actual mod. (I used the game launcher thats what the exe is right?) It just takes me to BTS menu. Any ideas? Thanks for trying to help me btw.:goodjob:

Linkman226
Aug 07, 2011, 02:12 AM
Got this python exception:

Traceback (most recent call last):

File "CvEventInterface", line 23, in onEvent

File "CvRFCEventManager", line 111, in handleEvent

File "CvRFCEventManager", line 122, in _handleDefaultEvent

File "CvRFCEventHandler", line 615, in onFirstContact

File "RiseAndFall", line 3088, in onFirstContact

File "RFCUtils", line 1287, in getEasternmostCity

NameError: global name 'pPlayer' is not defined
ERR: Python function onEvent failed, module CvEventInterface

Leoreth
Aug 07, 2011, 05:29 AM
Yep the game launches now but I still cant play the actual mod. (I used the game launcher thats what the exe is right?) It just takes me to BTS menu. Any ideas? Thanks for trying to help me btw.:goodjob:
No problem, but unfortunately I'm at the end of my wisdom here :( Regular RFC or other modmods work fine?

Got this python exception:

Traceback (most recent call last):

File "CvEventInterface", line 23, in onEvent

File "CvRFCEventManager", line 111, in handleEvent

File "CvRFCEventManager", line 122, in _handleDefaultEvent

File "CvRFCEventHandler", line 615, in onFirstContact

File "RiseAndFall", line 3088, in onFirstContact

File "RFCUtils", line 1287, in getEasternmostCity

NameError: global name 'pPlayer' is not defined
ERR: Python function onEvent failed, module CvEventInterface
Yeah, thanks, already caught that one myself :)

Kcawesome
Aug 07, 2011, 07:36 AM
Yep I think a screeny would help though, but is there a file I have to change initially because I just downloaded the mod without changing anthing.

Leoreth
Aug 07, 2011, 08:09 AM
If you unpack the .rar file into Beyond the Sword/Mods/ everything should be fine.

J. pride
Aug 07, 2011, 08:33 AM
Leoreth, How do u plan on implementing the Silk Route Corp and What are its Geographical extents?

Leoreth
Aug 07, 2011, 09:28 AM
I plan to change the whole corporation system to resemble SoI (though not completely). Corporations will spread to everyone who has the prereq tech based on a number of conditions - in the case of the Silk Route, you need silk (obviously) and the city must be along the traditional silk route or one of its prominent end ports. Basically Mongolia, Gobi Desert, Transoxania, Persia, Mesopotamia and the Levant.

I've also found out that Bakuel did make a Chinese replacement for the Maceman (here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=6869)). It's not optimal for the others, but should do for all far east civs.

Kcawesome
Aug 07, 2011, 09:37 AM
You wont believe this, but i found out I intalled it in the WRONG BTS mod folder:mad: It works now though, thanks for the help.

Linkman226
Aug 07, 2011, 10:55 AM
So what are other ways to fix American civs building Old World Pantheon wonders, other than adding Hellenism?

AdrienIer
Aug 07, 2011, 10:59 AM
Making them only buildable with marble, since the only marble in n-America is in the us.

J. pride
Aug 07, 2011, 12:38 PM
Discount their hammers for the civs that built them. I personally think that there isnt enough time for them to be built. If we suppose make the Mosoleum of Mosolus cheaper for the Persians or the Colloseum cheap for the Romans, that could work.

Leoreth
Aug 07, 2011, 04:11 PM
So what are other ways to fix American civs building Old World Pantheon wonders, other than adding Hellenism?
Not allowing to build them from the Middle Ages onwards.

BenZL43
Aug 08, 2011, 10:33 AM
Not allowing to build them from the Middle Ages onwards.

Which doesn't really solve the problem, IMO..

Since most of European switch from Pantheon quite early, IIRC..
Chances are back to Maya etc..

And..
Leoreth,
Could you make European colonization in Asia more effective and fierce?
Somehow most AI now, are colonizing by:

1) Find empty space
2) Sent settler
3) Colonized

Which is fulfilled usually either in South America, Easter part of North America, or Africa..

which mean, they're rarely do like..
English attacking India for Calcutta and Khmer for Singapore..
Dutch attacking Khmer for Jayakarta
French attacking Khmer for Hanoi etc..

Most of the time, when European reach Asia, they're already pretty full of Asian cities..
And somehow AI European are too lazy to conquer those cities (?)

Gruekiller
Aug 08, 2011, 01:22 PM
I'd actually like to see the same thing. :D Increased European presence in Asia would be nice.

J. pride
Aug 08, 2011, 01:28 PM
As I suggested before, for India the Mughals should be added and there should be European conquerers event. Something like this, when the British get in contact with the Mughals Calcutta flips to them but everytime the Mughals or the British declare war on each other, more units appear in Calcutta thus representing the eventual conquest of India.

azander12
Aug 08, 2011, 01:29 PM
I'd actually like to see the same thing. :D Increased European presence in Asia would be nice.

One thing that might work would be making the AI Khmer much more likely to collapse around the time Europeans are starting to arrive. I find that AI is much more willing to conquer indie or (especially) barbarian cities than declare a war on a real civ.

Leoreth
Aug 08, 2011, 04:40 PM
Which doesn't really solve the problem, IMO..

Since most of European switch from Pantheon quite early, IIRC..
Chances are back to Maya etc..
I'm also planning to make chances of running Pantheon really high as long you have no or only a few religions in your cities (which should be the case for the Mediterranean civs its targeted at).

For the Maya, well if you're going for the UHV, you'll have to worry about the Temple of Kukulkan anyway. And you don't want to drag out the classical era for too long because you need longbowmen against the Europeans.

Could you make European colonization in Asia more effective and fierce?
Somehow most AI now, are colonizing by:

1) Find empty space
2) Sent settler
3) Colonized

Which is fulfilled usually either in South America, Easter part of North America, or Africa..

which mean, they're rarely do like..
English attacking India for Calcutta and Khmer for Singapore..
Dutch attacking Khmer for Jayakarta
French attacking Khmer for Hanoi etc..

Most of the time, when European reach Asia, they're already pretty full of Asian cities..
And somehow AI European are too lazy to conquer those cities (?)
I'd like to do that too, but unfortunately short of outright granting them what they should get by themselves (which I won't do), there's no easy way to make that happen. I'm afraid there's no pSpain.finallyGetThoseColonies() method available :(

I've got some ideas though, and 1.9 will focus on the Europeans and their colonies again, which is when I will start testing them out.

One thing that might work would be making the AI Khmer much more likely to collapse around the time Europeans are starting to arrive. I find that AI is much more willing to conquer indie or (especially) barbarian cities than declare a war on a real civ.
Yeah, the Khmer really live for too long.

Sikandar
Aug 08, 2011, 06:38 PM
I see that you are planning Arabian and Mongolian conqueror events. Do you have any plans for a Greek conqueror event for the Near East/India to represent the spread of Hellenic culture to Asia?

Gruekiller
Aug 08, 2011, 06:40 PM
I have to say, that'd be interesting too. I don't think I've ever seen the Greeks go past the Taurus mountains and occasionally Egypt. In fact, they seem more prone to taking over northern Italy, central Russia, and the North African coast than places they ever actually conquered. :lol:

Leoreth
Aug 09, 2011, 05:30 AM
Good point.

rob85
Aug 09, 2011, 09:23 AM
The conditions of the Italian respawn should be removed or at least changed. I have never seen Venice remaining independent until Italy spawn (at least on marathon speed). A short report on the owners of the city of Venice:
1. Captured by the other independents from Rome (or culture flipped) don't know when
2. Independent until about 1000 AD
3. Byzantium captures Venice
4. I go to world builder in order to make Venice independent again, so that I will see Italy in my game
5. The next turn Spain captures Venice. I go again to the WB and this time give 5 longbowmen to Venice (more than Rome)
6. The next turn France captures Venice... So this time I added 7 or 8 longbowmen (2 times as much as Rome) and a wall and it seems that they stopped conquering. But the French were trying to take again the city with a stack of doom.
I don't know what is so interesting about Venice. I've seen almost every European nation there. Rome remains independent much longer.

Gruekiller
Aug 09, 2011, 10:04 AM
I've seen Russia take over Venice before. :p

rob85
Aug 09, 2011, 10:59 AM
Yeah, me too... many times... not saying about Portuguese one...

Soujya
Aug 09, 2011, 03:48 PM
Love what you're doing with the mod Leoreth. Just thought I'd mention that a game I rolled on the latest SVN version saw Korea get destroyed by barbarian horse archers on turn 30 (AD600).

Also, I'm getting consistent CTD's on entering worldbuilder after a certain turn every game.

Leoreth
Aug 09, 2011, 06:50 PM
Love what you're doing with the mod Leoreth. Just thought I'd mention that a game I rolled on the latest SVN version saw Korea get destroyed by barbarian horse archers on turn 30 (AD600).

Also, I'm getting consistent CTD's on entering worldbuilder after a certain turn every game.
I've encountered that as well ... the corporation business is still unfinished, maybe it has something to do with mission icons.

Linkman226
Aug 09, 2011, 08:37 PM
Oh that's good. I experienced this in Synthesis and thought it was something I had done.

Alduskkel
Aug 09, 2011, 10:33 PM
I don't know how hard it is to implement, but will there be a conditional Eastern Roman spawn in the 3000 B.C. scenario? It should definitely only be if Greece is gone and it is controlled by independents/barbarians/Romans.

One problem with the spawn in general is that Egypt doesn't flip to Eastern Rome either, which is weird if Western Rome controls Egypt, thus resulting in it having distinctly eastern holdings. I'm fine if Egypt is controlled by barbarians/independents or even Egyptians since Eastern Rome can easily take it then, what with Egypt probably being way behind on tech at that stage.

Also, it's weird that Eastern Rome is ahead on technology compared to Western Rome. I don't know how you would fix that, but it doesn't make any sense historically.

Also, and I'm not 100% sure on this, but it seems to me that Western Rome takes a hit to stability if it's losing cities to Eastern Rome. If anything it should be the opposite.

Now, the big problem with an AI Eastern Rome spawning is that it conflicts with the 476 deadline for controlling Greece and Egypt. You could just move the deadline to just before 330 for only Greece and Egypt, though that almost qualifies as a 4th UHV condition.

Minor point: you should change the names for Rome and Byzantium to Western Rome and Eastern Rome when both are alive.

Finally, I must say that playing as Rome it's kind of weird to watch your territories sucked up by France, Spain, and Britain, when nothing of the kind happened historically. Plus, by the time they DO spawn you've probably gotten the barbarian situation under control so maybe they should win a bit before Spain spawns? That may or may not counterbalance an earlier deadline for the territory gains.

Whatever you do, keep up the good work Leoreth, this is a great modmod. :)

Linkman226
Aug 09, 2011, 10:46 PM
The Byzantine 3000 BC spawn already exists.

Alduskkel
Aug 09, 2011, 11:50 PM
Only if you pick them yourself at the start.

Linkman226
Aug 09, 2011, 11:54 PM
Oh, really? I see.

The Turk
Aug 10, 2011, 12:53 AM
Ok, I'm back from my brief vacation to the Big Apple, and I'm ready to test, test, test!

But before I do, I was hoping Leoreth that you could add this new LH:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=17408

Its an updated Catherine the Great, who I always thought looked like trash, (also Isabella).

Also good job on finding a East Asian replacement for the Heavy Swordsman! :)

I'll play test the newest version tomorrow. I also back you 100% on your overhaul of the terrible companies system. Having them spread automatically is much better then having the state have to build units to spread it. Can't wait to try it out!

civ_king
Aug 10, 2011, 01:39 AM
Ok, I'm back from my brief vacation to the Big Apple, and I'm ready to test, test, test!

But before I do, I was hoping Leoreth that you could add this new LH:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=17408

Its an updated Catherine the Great, who I always thought looked like trash, (also Isabella).

Also good job on finding a East Asian replacement for the Heavy Swordsman! :)

I'll play test the newest version tomorrow. I also back you 100% on your overhaul of the terrible companies system. Having them spread automatically is much better then having the state have to build units to spread it. Can't wait to try it out!

A new Isabella (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=10261978&postcount=33)? This one looks more modest

http://forums.civfanatics.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=284252&d=1298941123

AdrienIer
Aug 10, 2011, 02:43 AM
Is it normal that the UP for Rome doesn't work ? In two different games I DoW on Greece then Phoenicia, and I get no army... How disapointing !
I'm playing on viceroy BTW.

keli
Aug 10, 2011, 03:47 AM
don't DoW on other nations on the first turn

Leoreth
Aug 10, 2011, 04:03 AM
I don't know how hard it is to implement, but will there be a conditional Eastern Roman spawn in the 3000 B.C. scenario? It should definitely only be if Greece is gone and it is controlled by independents/barbarians/Romans.
This is exactly how it works. No Greece + Roman city in the Greek core = Byzantine spawn.

One problem with the spawn in general is that Egypt doesn't flip to Eastern Rome either, which is weird if Western Rome controls Egypt, thus resulting in it having distinctly eastern holdings. I'm fine if Egypt is controlled by barbarians/independents or even Egyptians since Eastern Rome can easily take it then, what with Egypt probably being way behind on tech at that stage.
Yeah, but you can't know in advance who owns these cities. It's like saying America flipping the East Coast makes no sense if it's French controlled or whatever.

Also, it's weird that Eastern Rome is ahead on technology compared to Western Rome. I don't know how you would fix that, but it doesn't make any sense historically.
They need a different tech setup because they're meant to be competitive in the Medieval Era, while Rome isn't. Also, usually you lose a few turns in the beginning before you can actually start teching, this is meant to compensate for that.

Now, the big problem with an AI Eastern Rome spawning is that it conflicts with the 476 deadline for controlling Greece and Egypt. You could just move the deadline to just before 330 for only Greece and Egypt, though that almost qualifies as a 4th UHV condition.
You're right, I completely forgot that the Roman deadline is that late. The goal is based on Trajan's empire anyway, and I think with the UP it should be doable by 300 or something.

Minor point: you should change the names for Rome and Byzantium to Western Rome and Eastern Rome when both are alive.
Unfortunately the current dynamic names system doesn't allow for that. Some day in the future I'll change it to make a little more sense, with names based on eras and situation.

Finally, I must say that playing as Rome it's kind of weird to watch your territories sucked up by France, Spain, and Britain, when nothing of the kind happened historically. Plus, by the time they DO spawn you've probably gotten the barbarian situation under control so maybe they should win a bit before Spain spawns? That may or may not counterbalance an earlier deadline for the territory gains.
I may remove the barbarian goal altogether, because if you get your cities conquered by them, you'll mess up your territory goal anyway. I need to playtest them myself to find out what's possible, though.

But before I do, I was hoping Leoreth that you could add this new LH:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=17408

Its an updated Catherine the Great, who I always thought looked like trash, (also Isabella).
Yeah, melcher's LH replacements are really good.

I'll play test the newest version tomorrow. I also back you 100% on your overhaul of the terrible companies system. Having them spread automatically is much better then having the state have to build units to spread it. Can't wait to try it out!
It's not implemented yet though.

Is it normal that the UP for Rome doesn't work ? In two different games I DoW on Greece then Phoenicia, and I get no army... How disapointing !
I'm playing on viceroy BTW.
As already said, did you try it in the first turn? It doesn't work then because that would mess with Rome's wars on spawn.

AdrienIer
Aug 10, 2011, 04:42 AM
No it was after the flip, I had even founded my French cities with the initial settlers.

Leoreth
Aug 10, 2011, 06:29 AM
Okay. Did you have logging enabled? I'd like to see the content of your PythonDbg.txt then.

AdrienIer
Aug 10, 2011, 07:10 AM
I didn't... How do you turn it on ?

Leoreth
Aug 10, 2011, 07:19 AM
There's an entry in _Civ4Config.txt in your BtS folder called "LoggingEnabled" which you have to set to 1.

The Turk
Aug 10, 2011, 09:53 AM
So Leoreth will you change the Catherine and Isabella LH's then? Also I was wondering what the dealio was with Chiang Kai Chek, as it would seem that his civilopedia entry is a bit strange. Is he at all included in the game?

Also have you thought about adding a new earlier Italian LH? This is not as important for me, due to the fact that I turn off Renaissance Italy until 1871, but in general, having an earlier Italian LH might be a good idea.

Also why do you have Mongols spawning near India? IMO that stack, should just be redirected to attacking Persia. Also is there one against Russia and Eastern Europe?

Also after playing for just 10 minutes, something which I realized is that an Orthodoxy religion in this game, could really shake some things up, for more interesting gameplay!

EDIT: Also when will you add the new East Asian Longswordsmen?

Alduskkel
Aug 10, 2011, 11:58 AM
This is exactly how it works. No Greece + Roman city in the Greek core = Byzantine spawn.Ummm... then why haven't they spawned when I play as Rome? I've definitely been controlling at least Greece's core by what I believe is 330, though I don't usually go for calendar so I am not 100% sure.

Leoreth
Aug 10, 2011, 12:23 PM
They definitely don't spawn never (see Tyo's conquest of the Roman Empire in the OMG thread), but if you encounter a game where they don't spawn when you think they should, a screenshot or save would help.

soul-breathing
Aug 10, 2011, 09:57 PM
v1.8 seems very wonderful,I‘m looking foward it.:cool:

AdrienIer
Aug 11, 2011, 04:37 AM
There's an entry in _Civ4Config.txt in your BtS folder called "LoggingEnabled" which you have to set to 1.

It might only be me being really stupid, but I can't find _Civ4Config.txt anywhere...

lemonjelly
Aug 11, 2011, 07:06 AM
Do you mean the .ini?
There's a shortcut directly to it in the BtS folder. :)

AdrienIer
Aug 11, 2011, 07:13 AM
I found the shortcut but it leads nowhere unfortunately... Could it be linked to the fact that I'm on Civ IV complete ?

Leoreth
Aug 11, 2011, 07:17 AM
So Leoreth will you change the Catherine and Isabella LH's then? Also I was wondering what the dealio was with Chiang Kai Chek, as it would seem that his civilopedia entry is a bit strange. Is he at all included in the game?
Not sure actually, I don't think so though. The LH is not that great anyway, so if he is I'll disable him unless I happen to find better graphics. And yes, I think I will add them at some point.

Also have you thought about adding a new earlier Italian LH? This is not as important for me, due to the fact that I turn off Renaissance Italy until 1871, but in general, having an earlier Italian LH might be a good idea.
I've thought about it a lot, but there's no Italian LH available that warrants the inclusion. I'm already waiting for a long time for Da Capo's Lorenzo de'Medici - because I want it to be somebody who actually embodies Renaissance Italy. Gian Galeazzo Visconti might be another alternative, but an LH for him is even more unlikely.

Also why do you have Mongols spawning near India? IMO that stack, should just be redirected to attacking Persia. Also is there one against Russia and Eastern Europe?
The target civs are India, Persia, Byzantium, Arabia and Russia, and they get their armies when they make their first contact with them. If an Indian army spawns, it's meant for India. From my observations the greatest problem is independent Persia in 600 AD, which hinders them from making contact with the Near East. I guess I have to adapt their war maps for these areas so they're more likely to go to war with the independents there.

Also after playing for just 10 minutes, something which I realized is that an Orthodoxy religion in this game, could really shake some things up, for more interesting gameplay!

EDIT: Also when will you add the new East Asian Longswordsmen?
I know ;)

Don't know, when I'm done with the actual coding aspects that are still pending.

v1.8 seems very wonderful,Im looking foward it.:cool:
Good to hear! :)

It's also rare that we have actual East Asians on these boards (only youtien comes to mind), so if you have some input or suggestions, now's the time :)

It might only be me being really stupid, but I can't find _Civ4Config.txt anywhere...
May be my setup then, it's actually only a link to the actual file which is called CivilizationIV.ini and should be in your My Games/Beyond the Sword/ folder (where your savegames are).

Samsa
Aug 11, 2011, 07:22 AM
If you got Win7 it's quite easy to find, go to the "Documents" Library:
"My Games\Beyond the Sword\CivilizationIV.ini"
(It's actually located in "C:\Users\<username>\Documents\My Games\Beyond the Sword" just faster to access through the Libraries)

On WinXP im not quite sure where it should be located, something like "C:\Documents and Settings\<username>\My Games\Beyond the Sword"

BenZL43
Aug 11, 2011, 08:18 AM
I'm also planning to make chances of running Pantheon really high as long you have no or only a few religions in your cities (which should be the case for the Mediterranean civs its targeted at).
For the Maya, well if you're going for the UHV, you'll have to worry about the Temple of Kukulkan anyway.


I see..
So, most Mediterranean will still be Pantheon until either moving to Middle ages or having more than 2 religion in the city?
Well, talk no more. Looking forward to the new modified Pantheon! :D


I'd like to do that too, but unfortunately short of outright granting them what they should get by themselves (which I won't do), there's no easy way to make that happen. I'm afraid there's no pSpain.finallyGetThoseColonies() method available :(

I've got some ideas though, and 1.9 will focus on the Europeans and their colonies again, which is when I will start testing them out.


I was thinking giving some resources more precious to an European AI than to other that they'll do anything to possess it..
But I'll wait till 1.9 come out ;)


Yeah, the Khmer really live for too long.

Which is the reason you dynamically change them into Thai at 1400 (IIRC), right?
Thai still up till today, probably around that 1400 you should unstable them a lot so only few cities in the Indochina heartland still belong to them,
indie Hanoi (or Hue, that's the most cities in vietnam they usually found).. >> Increase possibility of French Indochina
Indie Indonesia (usually Jayakarta & Padang) >> Dutch East Indies
Indie Singapore.. >> Strait Settlement (British, IIRC)
Spawn Indie Brunei with Islam

Leoreth
Aug 11, 2011, 09:28 AM
I see..
So, most Mediterranean will still be Pantheon until either moving to Middle ages or having more than 2 religion in the city?
Well, talk no more. Looking forward to the new modified Pantheon! :D
A first attempt is already in the SVN: the AI for mediterranean civs (Egypt, Rome, Greece, Phoenicia, Babylonia) now values Pantheon twice as highly if half or less of their cities have a religion. I haven't tested it yet, but I hope this suffices to keep it until Christianity comes around (else we still can increase the numbers).

Some of my new wonders from the beginning also weren't recognized by the DLL (where some civ's favorite wonders are coded), unfortunately I couldn't compile these because my new laptop lacks a compiler. This should help to focus some civs on their usual wonders as well.

The only thing that's not quite covered is the Mausoleum. It's practically a Persian wonder - should it be reclassified to Zoroastrianism to encourage them building it? It'll still come across as weird because they still rarely get to Anatolia.

Which is the reason you dynamically change them into Thai at 1400 (IIRC), right?
Thai still up till today, probably around that 1400 you should unstable them a lot so only few cities in the Indochina heartland still belong to them,
indie Hanoi (or Hue, that's the most cities in vietnam they usually found).. >> Increase possibility of French Indochina
Indie Indonesia (usually Jayakarta & Padang) >> Dutch East Indies
Indie Singapore.. >> Strait Settlement (British, IIRC)
Spawn Indie Brunei with Islam
They change to Thai/Siam when they reach the Renaissance. Thinking about it, the best course would be a rather likely historical collapse of the Khmer Empire in the 14th century, followed by a respawn under the name of Siam/Thailand.

And yes, I'll try to implement the scramble for Africa and late colonialism in India and SE-Asia by helping the AI out in case their historical targets are indie or otherwise available.

Gruekiller
Aug 11, 2011, 09:43 AM
Can't wait till 1.8 comes out. :D

AdrienIer
Aug 11, 2011, 10:33 AM
If you got Win7 it's quite easy to find, go to the "Documents" Library:
"My Games\Beyond the Sword\CivilizationIV.ini"
(It's actually located in "C:\Users\<username>\Documents\My Games\Beyond the Sword" just faster to access through the Libraries)

On WinXP im not quite sure where it should be located, something like "C:\Documents and Settings\<username>\My Games\Beyond the Sword"

Thank you very much, I finally found it.

I tried again, there was no extra troops and there was no error message...

Tandur
Aug 12, 2011, 01:49 AM
Just discovered this modmod today, so far I'm very impressed!

I'm glad to see that this first problem I noticed is a current issue, and that the author is still around and continuing to update! I was plenty happy playing core RFC for the past 3 years, but I finally needed something new.

I'm having the same issue as AdrienIer, with no units spawning for the Romans after declaring war. I've tried declaring war on the first turn, and after about 10 turns on Phoenicia. I'm wondering if it's something to do with game speed, whether it's in Normal, Epic, or Marathon.

I'm also wondering, in the OP, it's stated that Rome has a larger starting army, but compared to core RFC, 4 Legions (Praetorians) and 3 Archers is the same starting group as we get in RFC.

I'm going to test the UP right now by declaring war on Phoenicia after 20 turns. I turned on the logging, and I'll post the debug if it doesn't work.

Tandur
Aug 12, 2011, 02:50 AM
Ok, I ran this twice, once on Normal speed, once on Epic speed, both on Monarch. Both times I founded Nova Carthago and Pompeii, then opened borders with Greece and Phoenicia. The first time through, Pompeii declared war on me after ~12 turns, and I played through two more turns to see if the unit would spawn. No luck. For reference, that's the file marked "PythonDbg-copy". The second play through (Epic), I declared war on both Greece and Phoenicia, and got no spawn for either event. That log is "PythonDbg-copy2".

On a side note, I noticed it wouldn't let me attatch the files as logs, so I saved them as txt files. Hope that's ok.

I assume that what you're looking for is this, from when Phoenicia declared war on me:


Check AI wars

('Setting AIWar', 6, 'attacking', 7)

. . .

('iGameTurn', 102)

Roman conquest triggered.

Getting random target city.

Roman conquest completed.


and for the second game, since I declared war, this:


('iGameTurn', 149)
Roman conquest triggered.

Getting random target city.

Roman conquest completed.

. . .

('iGameTurn', 150)

Stability

('Base:', 6, 'Modifier:', 9, 'Total:', 15, 'civic', 25, u'Egyptian Old Kingdom')

('Base:', -7, 'Modifier:', 31, 'Total:', 24, 'civic', 25, u'Indian Empire')

('Base:', 16, 'Modifier:', 36, 'Total:', 52, 'civic', 25, u'Middle Country of China')

('Base:', 19, 'Modifier:', -31, 'Total:', -12, 'civic', 25, u'Babylonian Empire')

('Base:', 16, 'Modifier:', 21, 'Total:', 37, 'civic', 25, u'Greek League')

('Base:', 17, 'Modifier:', 11, 'Total:', 28, 'civic', 25, u'Persian Empire')

('Base:', 23, 'Modifier:', 8, 'Total:', 31, 'civic', 25, u'Carthaginian Empire')

('Base:', 10, 'Modifier:', 16, 'Total:', 26, 'civic', 25, u'Roman Empire')

('dead', 8)

('dead', 9)

('dead', 10)

('dead', 11)

('dead', 12)

('dead', 13)

('dead', 14)

('dead', 15)

('dead', 16)

('dead', 17)

('dead', 18)

('dead', 19)

('dead', 20)

('dead', 21)

('dead', 22)

('dead', 23)

('dead', 24)

('dead', 25)

('dead', 26)

('dead', 27)

('Parameter', 0, -5)

('Parameter', 1, 1)

('Parameter', 2, 6)

('Parameter', 3, 0)

('Parameter', 4, 0)

('Parameter', 5, 5)

('Parameter', 6, 0)

('Parameter', 7, 6)

('Parameter', 8, 0)

('Parameter', 9, 1)

('Parameter', 10, 0)

('Parameter', 11, -2)

('Parameter', 12, 14)

Roman conquest triggered.

Getting random target city.

Roman conquest completed.


I started to figure it out (I think) after checking the file over a few times while waiting for the forums to come back up after a 20 minute crash (idk?).

Linkman226
Aug 12, 2011, 06:31 AM
I may be wrong but I believe that the last release didn't have the Roman UP due to a bug. Try updating to the latest SVN version. If you don't know what that is, see OP. Also, the change log in the OP is not current. For the latest info, check the change log within the folder.

Leoreth
Aug 12, 2011, 07:00 AM
Thanks for all of your feedback, especially the logs. Linkman is right of course, it was an error that was contained in the RAR I've uploaded here but fixed shortly afterwards for the SVN version - and I was under the assumption the fix was already included into the RAR. Sorry :(

You can get it fixed by updating to the recent SVN version (see first post for details), or if that's to much hassle for you, download the attached UniquePowers archive, unpack it into your RFC Dawn of Civilization\Assets\Python\ folder and overwrite.

And yeah, the info on the Roman starting army is outdated (I removed that again when I added the new UP to make up for it). I'll correct the feature list with my next release.

BenZL43
Aug 12, 2011, 08:30 AM
The only thing that's not quite covered is the Mausoleum. It's practically a Persian wonder - should it be reclassified to Zoroastrianism to encourage them building it? It'll still come across as weird because they still rarely get to Anatolia.


The mausoleum, which were built in Greek style, I think is better to be coded to Pantheon...
But yeah, IMO, War maps between Persia and Greek should be increased, make Anatolia as historical tile for Persia, or perhaps it's better for them to start hostile (?)

They change to Thai/Siam when they reach the Renaissance. Thinking about it, the best course would be a rather likely historical collapse of the Khmer Empire in the 14th century, followed by a respawn under the name of Siam/Thailand.


The problem for implementing respawn, IMO, is turns between Khmer collapse and Thai spawn is really short in terms of game turns, unlike Rome to Italy or Persia to Safavid..

Another problem with Khmer is, Phnom Penh is never built in its accurate location. The tile, after I checked, belong to Oc Eo, a great harbor city known to Romans as Kattigara (Cattigara)..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kattigara

And despite being a great and powerful empire, the reign of Khmer were just some tiles, which create the UHV to built 10 cities ahistorical already IF they were to represent the Khmer people themselves..

I was thinking, a crazy idea, change the Khmer into Funan..
Starts earlier at 1st Century, lived long until around 550, and also had contacts to European empire..
We could use the Trung sisters from RFCA as LH..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Funan

If they dead, spawn as Sukhothai at around 1200AD represent Thailand...
We could use Suryavarman II as leaderhead with different name since Thai and Khmer people are still look-alike

Off course the most problem is we have to stabilize everything again..
But still, I have to admit this is a really crazy idea ;)
Never mind if you don't like it :)

Leoreth
Aug 12, 2011, 04:57 PM
I think I'll keep the Khmer, they're a completely developed civ that I don't want to lose. The Thai don't need to reemerge exactly afterwards, their kingdom wasn't that dominant in SE Asia early on afaik, so they could just as well respawn later.

On another note, I've found and eliminated the reason for the crash on entering the world builder. Couldn't confirm yet if this was also the cause of other crashes during autoplay, though.