View Full Version : Some Tips on using Poser to make Units


Kinboat
Nov 25, 2002, 08:43 PM
First I have a Poser 4 file that has the lights and cameras set up how I use them. The green ball in the center should be right between the feet of any models you add.

Next, I use the Main Camera as the render camera, and I don't move it at all. I use the Auxillary Camera for most of the 'posing' and the others less often.
Once I set up a model designed as I want it I select the 'Body' and turn it on the Y axis to 315 degrees. I create whatever animation I may be working on in that position. Then all I have to do to get the other directions is turn the 'body' of the model 45 degrees each time. First to 0, then 45, 90, 135, 180, 225, and 270. As a bonus I can choose to make a movie instead of rendering each frame at a time. In the Animation tab choose 'make movie' and make sure to change the format to image file instead of AVI format.
I don't really like how Poser renders very small images so I render them large, around 200X200 or larger, then shrink them down in an image editing program. I then paste each frame into the PCX I get out of Flicster... The palette will take some tweeking but you get that problem with any method.

A note... I like to shrink my Human figures just a bit on the Y axis... Something like down to 95%, you'll also need to shrink any conformable objects by that same amount. It may just be my eyes but the people look stretched tall when I reduce the image in size.
Any other questions can be posted here and I'll try to help if I can.


New Setup File and New suggestions...

I've been using this one for all my most recent units (Japanese, and Native American sets). And I feel this gives a closer match to the lighting and shadows of the original game units.

The Work Light is shining on the back of the model to aid in posing but it should be reduced to 0 Intensity before the final rendering.

The Shadow Ball is there to help create blurrier shadows. The way Poser works the larger the area the program needs to calculate shadows for the blurrier the shadows will be... This combined with a reduction of the Shadow map size gets rid of a hard line cast shadow. All this should be set up the way I use it... Moving the ball closer to the Center Pole will sharpen the shadow, farther away will blur it.

The Center Pole is just there as a reference when placing the model and can be removed afterwards.

I've also set it up so that almost all of my units are rendered at 140x140 size... The main camera should be setup that way. Also I no longer render at a larger size... Basicly the distortion was because I was saving in JPG... BMP works much better and you don't get fuzzy borders. Any questions can be posted here and I'd be happy to try to help.


Some tips from CamJH on using this setup with Poser 5
Came across some discrepancies with running the default setup on Poser 5 instead of Poser 4, and thought I'd mention them here. The first is that shadows for the Main Light need to be reduced to .667 from 1.0. This has been brought up before by other people, but I thought I'd include it. The other is that the Blue and Red values under the properties for the Main Light need to be bumped up to 1.333 from 1.0. The magenta for the background, along with all the other colors, become slightly distorted without fixing this.

Redking
Dec 31, 2002, 10:51 PM
any suggestions as to where to find Poser cheap?

Kinboat
Jan 01, 2003, 07:16 PM
I don't want to support illegal software so I can't help you there...

Now that Poser 5 is out you might be able to pick up Poser 4 at a discount somewhere. I use Poser 4 Propack since I don't have the money to upgrade to the new version.

gael
Jan 03, 2003, 12:41 PM
Only scum bags use the free 'Kazaalite' program to download free software.
Stay away from it.

Redking
Jan 03, 2003, 09:50 PM
okey dokey High King.

Rua Righ.

(I'm too lazy to anyhow - if I had 500 spare bucks I'd buy one of these 3D programs, but I'd rather spend my next 50 on SimCity4 and the 450 after that on food and winter heating)

Gringo
Jan 12, 2003, 03:09 AM
HACK THE PLANET! :p :D

gael
Jan 13, 2003, 01:34 PM
I use free software, put the forum rules don't allow the promotion of it.

Sorry Kinboat, your thread has become a spamfest and its probably my fault.

Future posters stick to the tudorial:

Vdog
Feb 21, 2003, 03:05 PM
Originally posted by Gringo
HACK THE PLANET! :p :D

Get a job!

pdescobar
Mar 29, 2003, 08:26 AM
I happened to come across a copy of Poser and decided to play around with some units using Kinboat's suggestions.

Keeping in mind that I'm a complete 3-d moron, my first questions are:


Am I supposed to delete/hide that green ball before I render the animation? :)
Can I get away with rendering "draft" quality since the unit will be shrunk rather substantially or should I stick with "professional?"
Can I do anything with lighting, etc. so that the shadow actually renders in a nice purply color instead of near black to make it easier when pasting in later?

retroflow
Apr 02, 2003, 05:41 PM
Actually, I think it would be great if the seasoned artists here, made each tutorial software specific. I've spent days now trying to locate good tutorials on how to work with Poser 4, specifically in a way that can be used with Civ3. I'm not using 3D Studio Max, Rhino 3D, POV Ray, Maya, Lightwave, etc, etc, etc..

The main obstacle and question I have, is how to modify the clothing so I can make uniforms and such for a given unit. Poser does not really have that many clothes for the male figures. Some may be adaptable for certain things, but most aren't. The given references as to how to modify some clothing isn't really that well spelled out. Some seem so abrupt that it looks as though the author got bored and cut it short. It also seems that many tutorials are written by folks who use Poser and the like for flat, 2D artwork. With most empasis on creating fantasy art with "sexy" women as the theme. Most of them are concerned with how to make the clothing maps form fitting, or the hair more realistic. This is useless to me for my goal: Making effective Civilization 3 units.

I already belong to a few of the 3D forum sites and they're really quite diverse with limited offerings for each of the dozen or so common 3D programs out there. I will try what is posted here, but I know it's not enough.

Kinboat
Apr 02, 2003, 06:06 PM
Yeah the green ball is just there as a reference point... just so I center my units and everything. You could try draft but I've run across a few problems early on with the anti-aliasing when I tried lower qualities... It's really whatever you can workout best.
As for the shadows you can fiddle with the ambient color (up for lighter) of the ground plane but then your pink color may be changed. Basicly if you set your shadow palette up right it doesn't matter what color the shadow is just where it is on the palette. If your shadows are too dark shift the colors towards the right and you'll lighten the shadows.
Well at the scale you're rendering here you could create uniforms and such with texture maps for the provided clothing. The suit could become a camo outfit with the right textures. Or I've been working in 3DS Max to create some of the props and stuff I need... Poser can import lots of different formats so you could start pulling resources from many different sites.

pdescobar
Apr 03, 2003, 12:25 AM
The problem I had with the shadows originally was that my guy had black shoes which got lost in the black shadows. I'm not sure what you mean about the shadow palette. What I had done was use your setup file posted above, created a storyboard with SBB that I reduced to 8-bit color in PSP, applying a palette I had made in PEdit which had the civ colors at the front and the purple-graded shadows at the back. As everything was basicly the same color, changing the blacks to purples so that they would be in the proper palette position when I applied the palette caused his shoes to change and be shadows as well. Perhaps I'm not understanding the proper way of applying the palette.

To solve it, I eventually found that setting the refraction (i think) color of the ground to a darker magenta (something like 192-0-0 or 128-0-0) worked fine. The ground and background remained the standard magenta and he is now rendering with purple shadows which fit the palette perfectly and aren't used elsewhere on the image.

Regarding clothes, I can see how textures would work for some things, but what about capes and robes which flow away from the body? Are those usually created in some other program like 3ds max or have you downloaded models for them or what?

Kinboat
Apr 03, 2003, 10:24 AM
Well capes I have been having a problem finding decent ones online. I have modeled some of my own but they aren't that good. If you have the Poser Pro Pack there is a thing called the setup room that lets you give static models 'bone' structures that allow you to pose them. So you could take a 3DS model and use it... Or just look around some of the sites... There are a few good ones out there :)
By shadow palette I just meant the last 16 or so colors on the unit palettes... But it looks like you've found a way to solve that.

SK138
Jun 30, 2003, 10:51 PM
What are some good sites to get characters, props, and clothing? I don't really know how to make my own (any tips would be appreciated). I want to make some WW2 and modern infantry units and a Pirate unit.

Kinboat
Jul 01, 2003, 01:27 AM
Well www.renderosity.com has a lot of stuff also www.daz3d.com has a weekly free model... http://host1.bondware.com/~syydr/ takes you to RDNA site with some excellent free stuff.
www.3dcommune.com Also has a large section... Other than these just take a look at the sites in their links sections and try to find a webring and take a look around.

Robertr4836
Jul 02, 2003, 12:19 PM
Originally posted by Kinboat
A note... I like to shrink my Human figures just a bit on the Y axis... Something like down to 95%, you'll also need to shrink any conformable objects by that same amount. It may just be my eyes but the people look stretched tall when I reduce the image in size.

Just a thought. Have you tried fooling around with the main cameras focal length prior to rendering? It might get rid of the elongation your seeing when you shrink the image without having to reduce the Y axis scale.

Kinboat
Jul 02, 2003, 02:09 PM
Well actually I think I have... This file is rather old and I've changed my methods slightly. Although the original civ units are squat and bulky so shrinking the Y axis probably still gives you a better match. I think the setting was 200 in the file above... I usually use 100 now.

Kinboat
Jul 16, 2003, 02:19 PM
Ok... For my 1000th post I'm going to be posting a tip for everyone that uses Poser for unit creation. This wasn't that hard to figure out (maybe some people already do something similar) it just took a little incentive to sit down and fiddle with the settings. Anyway this tip is about the shadows. I've had a problem with the way Poser gives you crisp shadows and the game has more blurry indistinct shadows. Here's what I came up with... Because of the way Poser uses Universal lights if you place a sphere (or anything really but the simplest objects work the same as the complex ones) off to one side and out of the render view, the shadow will become blurry... The farther the object is moved away the blurrier you get. I've moved a sphere 5 on the Xaxis and lowered my shadow map number from 256 to 128 (on the light object... this basicly determines how large an image it will create for the shadow... Larger number equals longer render times and more detail in the shadow). The principle behind this is that the program takes all the objects that would cast a shadow and then calculates the shadow map... So the larger the area with objects in it and the smaller the shadow map number, the blurrier the shadows. Hope this is understandable...

Dr. Yoshi
Jul 18, 2003, 05:04 PM
If you're a student, you can get Poser for a discount at journeyed.com

Kinboat
Oct 08, 2003, 08:42 PM
I've updated the post at the top to include my revised setup that seems to give better shadow results as I mentioned 2 posts above.

Unexisted
Nov 22, 2003, 12:41 AM
Gah! It's impossible Kinboat, I was trying to, but these 'Camera Dots' built up on me so much it would only play the first 8 frames...and also only render those. Bloody Poser.

Kinboat
Nov 22, 2003, 07:31 AM
Don't know quite what the problem is... One thing, if you look at the bottom of the animation pallete there should be a little slide bar that tells poser what frames to render. It could be you haven't moved the end to encompass all your frames.

Unexisted
Nov 26, 2003, 03:50 PM
And when I made the animation, I group the files with Jasc?

Kinboat
Nov 26, 2003, 09:38 PM
No once you render the images you can put them into Flicster storyboards using Steph's SBB program (available on the boards somewhere) and FLICster. Both programs have threads that explain their workings.

ShiroKobbure
Jan 16, 2004, 03:56 AM
how do I turn the bodies?

Kinboat
Jan 18, 2004, 12:52 AM
When you select the 'Body' part of a figure you can go to the dials at the side and rotate the Y-axis (?) 45 degrees. I only do this in the first frame and then clear the 'Body' row of key-frames in the animation palette so it doesn't accidently rotate later in the animation. I start out with the rotate dial at 325 degrees (SW) then 0 (S) then 45 (SE) 90 (E) 135 (NE) 180 (N) 225 (NW) 270 (W).

LouLong
Jan 23, 2004, 03:20 PM
Hi Kinboat,

just downloaded your default set up. Maybe I use it wrong (very likely) but I don't have human figure anymore, only a pink (it is Civ3 background pink, isn't it ?) with a white column and no green ball :D :o . Did I miss something ? I thought it was a blank model for use for Civ3 units ?

Please if you answer me, ilagine you talk to your "very" little sister who knows nothing about 3D or even graphics in general :)

The Slayer
Jan 23, 2004, 03:51 PM
Well, I used it putting first a human model and then importing Kinboat's file to mine, so the columm, the ball, and the color floor changes, but I don't know if thi is the "how to use" of Kinboat's file.

ShiroKobbure
Jan 23, 2004, 03:52 PM
I delete the columm and put in a figure
resize the figure 90% on y axis

LouLong
Jan 24, 2004, 11:34 AM
OK, I got both working at the same time.
But no green ball (maybe it is because I use Poser 5 ?).

So now I am a bit lost. I thought I would just need to add elements (cloth, etc...) but when I select them they just replace the former picture.

Any possibility to have a step by step instruction manual from Kinboat ? !!! like what I must do in a certain order in order not to waste something I have done forgetting a step on the way...

Kinboat
Jan 24, 2004, 12:28 PM
When you want to add a second figure there should be another button at the bottom of the figure Library. In Poser 4 the first button looks like a check mark, the second button is two checkmarks. The first one will replace the figure you already have the second button will just add the second figure to the scene.

In my updated scene I might not have the green ball anymore (don't quite remember :) ) Plus it was only there as a guide to give you the center of the scene. Well I usually load up the default and then import the figure.
Hope this is understandable, if not I'll try to explain it again :)

LouLong
Jan 24, 2004, 01:43 PM
Thanks for the one mark/two marks.
I start to figure it out.

Obviously no green ball anymore but a different view (which is good then).

Next questions :) :

- I can finish modelling before adding, changing anything else, right ?
- I have downloaded some free stuff from the net (swords, hemets,...). Where do I put them so that they appear in the list of usable items ?
- how can i add (change globally or only on a part) color to say a piece of cloth ?
- how can I change globally the color (for a black or for an Indian for instance) ?
- what male form did you choose for your units ?

Sorry to bother you so much. I haven't messed with palettes, rendering (no idea what it is yet ;) ) but from what I have seen it looks kind of easier than copy/pasting (and with much better results if I look at your units).

LouLong
Jan 24, 2004, 04:04 PM
I am back ... already.

Figured how to make downloadable stuff appear in the list :goodjob: (I really need self-congratulations) BUT very few (2% ?) are actually usable directly. :o
Many I can actually import (they are all 3DS files) but they are definitely complicated to use (resize, put at the right place "by hand",...). Is there no way to make them directly usable.

Side note : where did you find all your cloth for your units. got a good place for downloading, made them yourself, select an existing shape then change color/texture yourself to fit your needs ?

BTW : the manual is not specially for dummies. The direct help is even less easy to use.:(

The Slayer
Jan 24, 2004, 10:11 PM
The problem with some of downloadable props and stuff is that they were made for popular figures like Victoria or Michael (I'm sure you have saw a lot of "for Vicky 3.9 / Mike 2.0" ) You can try to conform the clothes to the unit, but something the figure just mess put (like some kimono clothes I downloaded but they don't work properly :cry: )

About the 3DS files, IMHO it's easier to use the numeric commands to rezise than the tool itself.

embryodead
Jan 25, 2004, 04:37 AM
Getting Michael 2 and Daz Tunic will be your best investment possible after the Poser itself. And they're 30% off till 20-something February. 90% of male clothes are for M2, and Tunic can serve as most ancient and medieval clothing, including chainmail. The original Poser figures aren't very friendly.

LouLong
Jan 25, 2004, 10:09 AM
@ the Slayer : Ok :( About resize, what/where are the numeric commands ? And what happens if you put a 3DS helmet in the right position when I animate the guy. Will it move too ? Or do I need to "link" the elmet with the head somehow (the actual somehow would deeply interest me lol).

@ embryodead : :( :eek: You mean I have to buy stuff !!!!!
Arghhhhh !

Before that I need to try one or two things I guess since I won't pay for something I might not know how to use.
But OK, I will try looking for this stuff anyway to see what it is at least.

Man I did not know it was that expensive to create free units !

And what about creating some elements (like an Egyptian shield or an Indian headdress for instance) ? What do I need to create those ? PSP ? Poser itself ?
Did you (units makers) made a pool with some free stuff or stuff you created personally ?:p

@ all : where is the tool to shrink the size to 95 % and should I do that before or after I put the clothes on ?

embryodead
Jan 25, 2004, 11:54 AM
I consider M2 absolutely essential, and when you have it, suddently you can use hundreds of free (and not) items for this model.
The easiest way to create specific elements is to find them on the internet ;) ie. on Renderosity.com , Runtimedna.com and Daz3D.com free archives. If you want to create models yourself, you need to open another pandora's box :) - 3D modelling software (ie. 3DS, Cinema4D, Rhino, POVRay, Lightwave), which Poser isn't. PSP might be handy for making textures, but that's all.

Kinboat
Jan 25, 2004, 02:58 PM
Once you have a 3DS prop (helmet whatever) positioned where you want it you can then save it under the prop list in the Library... Then when you want to use that prop in another figure you can just add it from the list instead of re-importing and resizing it. Also you need to parent the props to the body part they move with. A helmet once positioned can be parented to the Head and then it will move with the head from then on.
Lately I have been creating all my own props in 3DSMax I have a thread posted somewhere here that has my base figure and a few loin-cloths.

LouLong
Jan 26, 2004, 02:32 AM
@ Kinboat : cool.

Do you use M2 or do you use a standard Poser figure yourself.
Where is the "parent" tool ? Is it the "grouping tool" button ?

Any clue where that thread would be ? :king:

LouLong
Jan 26, 2004, 08:15 AM
Originally posted by embryodead
I consider M2 absolutely essential, and when you have it, suddently you can use hundreds of free (and not) items for this model.
The easiest way to create specific elements is to find them on the internet ;) ie. on Renderosity.com , Runtimedna.com and Daz3D.com free archives. If you want to create models yourself, you need to open another pandora's box :) - 3D modelling software (ie. 3DS, Cinema4D, Rhino, POVRay, Lightwave), which Poser isn't. PSP might be handy for making textures, but that's all.

Daz : I have been there but did not find free archives, found only the weekly free stuff. Did I miss something ?

And what happens if you use stuff for M2 or V3 with another model ?

Pardon my questions ! If it gets you mad, just fire me :p !

Kinboat
Jan 26, 2004, 09:51 PM
Well I originally used M2 for most of my stuff (a few with the original Poser Dork) but then I learned how to make figures myself and made a man to more closely fit the Civ3 proportions... I'll try to track down that thread.
The parent option should be in either the second or third menu at the top (poser 4, although 5 shouldn't be that different)
If you are parenting a prop to a figure or another prop then it will be in the third menu (the program isn't in front of me at the moment so I can't be more specific). If you are parenting a figure to another figure or prop then the parent option will be in the second menu.
Some M2 and V3 stuff can be used with other figures... However the conforming clothing very often doesn't work too well because of the differing geometries of the figures. Try out some of the free stuff and see how it works when you conform it to the poser Dork.

Kinboat
Jan 26, 2004, 10:02 PM
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=70328

Here's the thread with my base model.

LouLong
Jan 27, 2004, 03:31 AM
Nice. Took me sometimes to figure out I had to actually import loincloth and paperdoll but it is OK now and I have figured out too how to change colors (about time !).
One question though : do you put the textures in Runtime/Textures or is there another process ?

Do you (all of you) have preferences already for skin colors ? (I mean best for Eastern Indian, black or Asian).

Any chance you will be producing some more stuff (like Egyptian loincloth ?).

Kinboat
Jan 27, 2004, 11:49 PM
Well If I'm going to do some of those sketches by Kal-el I will need to work up an eqyptian style loin-cloth... I'll be sure to post it here. I just created my own folder within Runtime/Textures to keep all my own textures.
I haven't really worked up a set of skin tones that work well... The color my paperdoll comes loaded with is the color I use when you see very little skin (just hands and face for example). Then I change it to the color listed in my readme and apply the texture when the figure is mostly naked. It seems to give a fairly good bronzed/Tan skin tone that is good for a lot of units. Try reducing the Luminosity of the color to darken it or raise it for a lighter one... Although it might be better to get a completely different color rather than trying to alter the one I use here.

LouLong
Jan 28, 2004, 01:26 PM
OK, next set :p :

I did one animation but I have the following pbs :

1. I used an already existing anim (forced walking) which has 30 frames, is there a way I can make this number decrease (a standard run is 10) automatically without having to copy only the frames I select afterwards ?

2. I cannot rotate my model of 45. Where is the tool and on which page (pose, material,...) ?
EDIT : I FOUND IT

3. My model's clothes are too dark and they don't show well in Flcister. I want to change the color but how can I select mulitple items (key ?) to change them together to the same color (changing colors in Poser is easy but knowing to which one is less easy).
Otherwise : should I keep clothes.... colors above a certain light level to avoid all things bluring into black ?

4. After rendering, I have the following pbs :
- palette (that I expected), I just need to change the palette in PSP or do I need to do something while still in Poser ?
- size : it looks too small (rendering settings ?)
- no shadows (palette or settings for rendering ?)

Sorry if some have been answered somewhere before but I failed to find an answer I could understand.

Kinboat
Jan 29, 2004, 08:29 AM
Well for the wallking you could do two things... a) delete multiple keyframes in the animation palette until you get down to 10 (I usually go for 15 frames since deleting 20 out of 30 would make your animation very jumpy) b) use the walk designer to create a walk/run that you like. When you apply it to the figure it asks you for the start and finish frame (letting you set it to as many frames as you want). The walk designer should work with most human figures in Poser.
Well there is a drop-down menu in the materials window that shows all the figures and props in the scene. Select the clothing and then the next menu over lists all the different material sections of that figure/prop. You just need to go down that list changing what you want, most only have a few but there are some where it gets really exhausting. Trial and error is all that I can suggest for the color selection :)
You don't need to fiddle with anything in Poser... Just make sure you save it as a bitmap image to preserve the colors (JPEG compresses and loses some info)
I generally go for a 142x142 frame size. Through much trial and error I came upon that as working with my camera settings the best to arrive at a decent match for the original units. If the unit won't fit I'm forced to adjust the camera and render settings until I get a close match... Endless trial and error :) If your using my setup then 142x142 should be the best fit.
Something that might be causing the last two problems is the importing of my default scene after creating the figure. Sometimes the ground or light settings are messed up if the scene already has these set. A quick and dirty solution would be to remove the ground plane (under the display menu) and delete all the lights before you import my default scene. Hope that works.
The shadows could also be under the render settings, I think there is a place to check whether to render shadows.

Hope this is helpful :)

LouLong
Feb 01, 2004, 04:04 PM
Yep, your answers are always useful, Kinboat :)
But I am not good enough to do without them... yet (hopefully).

Shadows are working (I overlooked it sorry).

OK, I practiced trial and error a few times with diferent things.
I tried to create a Run anim for a character I got (called Lawboy, it is a policeman, you have probably seen it) and I tried to model my own.
I ran into two different pbs.

Lawboy : size is definitely "off" and so are the colors, especially background.
What I did : open your default, posed the character, chose a walk animation, rendered in each direction (size 142 X 142), destroyed every other picture to reach 15 (basic was 30). Used SBB to make the storyboard. Chose size 79 X 75 (or sort of) for the Storboard then replaced another run (+ 5 frames) created with Flicster with this one. The preview in Flicster gave me the original S direction :confused: then the policeman with strange shapes and not centered + too small in the picture...
Here is the generated pcx if someone wants to take a look and tell me what I did wrong.

Own model : I used a "lthtunic" I downloaded which is nice but I don't know where to attach it (I have tried chest, abdomen, hips and shoulders) with no good result. To what part of the body should I attach it ? I wanted it to be a kind of armor so it should not fold and arms/ legs movements should avoid it during movement but all the "buttons" I tried with "resistance" did not work. I used one of your loincloth too but I have the same pb to know where to attach it too so it moves softly with the legs...
Besides I have just checked, when I make the loincloth look good on the front it does not hide the buttom ! So I have a problem with size, position and attachement. But I thought it would be OK since they are both (default + loin) your creation. Anything I am doing wrong ?

What is working :) !
- head attached props
- anim : I have practiced for a while and I must say I have found anims much easier to do than what I thought it would be by comparison to modelling (just thought it would be posing props and ... done !).

What I would love if some of you have it :
- an ancient armor (I got a Greek one but 1/ it is not really Greek 2/ I don't want the legs but they stick with the armor and they are not at the right place (for dwarves ?))
- the sling prop

Kinboat
Feb 01, 2004, 11:26 PM
My loincloth figure has a few issues with it :) When you conform (not parent... Although you could probably just parent it to the hip body part) it to the parperdoll you then need to go to the hip part of the cloth and zero any of the 3 transform axis that have numbers in them.
You should make the storyboard with the same frame size as the renders... so in this case 142x142.
Don't know what is wrong with the Flicster problem... The image looks good except for being too small. Have you tried reloading the FLC in Flicster after you paste the images into the storyboard?
I don't have any Greek armor but I will post that sling soon :)

LouLong
Feb 05, 2004, 11:21 AM
OK the anim was my mistake. I had not learnt SBB carefully ! :o
So it seems to be working now, except for when I try to use civ colors so I guess it means I have to learn to mess with palettes (something I really fear).

Now the second pb remains meaning I still haven't figured out the conform/parent tool. But I should keep on trying !!!

Here is my first job to show I am actually doing something !

Thanks Kinboat (and Dom Pedro in PMs) ! :love:

Kinboat
Feb 07, 2004, 05:56 PM
Well for the civ-specific colors I usually set whatever I want civ-specific to the middle color in the blue civ scale... I think the default blue is 52, 99, 255 RGB. This gives you a fairly decent range of highlight and shadow, and when you paste the image onto the storyboard the blues should all work out.

If you have MSN Messenger I'm now using it to help someone else out with Poser so I'll be checking it at least once a day... Just search for Kinboat

The Slayer
Feb 07, 2004, 11:54 PM
Really Kinboat?, I can add you for some poser lessons?. No matter I do, I can't get rid of the strong light without eliminationg my shadows...

And, the camera angle doesn't seem to be the same, and I'm not noving it :S

Please, if you can help me, add eapanitz --- hotmail --- com .

I hope my not so developed english will be fine for my/you explanation abouit it.

:)

LouLong
Feb 14, 2004, 01:28 PM
When you have a prop made of a combination of different parts (ex Greek armor in 3DS incorporating legs prtoection as well), is it possible to dissociate / destroy part of the prop ?
That would be useful as well for the units Wyrmshadow provided.

embryodead
Feb 14, 2004, 03:55 PM
Poser itself can't edit 3D models, so whole props are uneditable. You can, however, use Grouping Tool as a workaround (create new group, select all polygons of the part you want to "destroy", assign a new material, then make that material invisible...).

Kinboat
Feb 14, 2004, 07:23 PM
Or another way to do it is to select all the polygons you want in the group tool and use the 'spawn props' button at the bottom of the grouping tool. This should make a new prop out of the selected polygons.

embryodead
Feb 14, 2004, 08:31 PM
oh well not the first time I'm wrong;) I recently discovered that I can actually animate materials...

LouLong
Mar 11, 2004, 10:28 AM
OK, next round !! :D

I have a model that includes ligths, background... that I don't like. How can I "incoporate" it into Kinbaot's setting ?
I did it partly but I guess it was not the best (empiric) method for there are differences.

embryodead
Mar 12, 2004, 07:31 AM
choose the figure you want to retain and save it in the library (with the "plus" button). then open your default setup and load the figure.

LouLong
Mar 12, 2004, 10:23 AM
Gee, did not think it was that easy. Thanks !

Kinboat
Mar 12, 2004, 06:35 PM
Make sure you have all the props and stuff parented to the main figure when you save it... It should ask you if you want to save the whole group or just the base figure. You'll want the whole group :D

CivArmy s. 1994
Jun 26, 2004, 10:21 AM
I have some problems with my colors: mu unit CaveMan appear as this:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/pr2.jpg

In Flicster they appear as this:

The yellow is the team color
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/pr1.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/pr3.jpg

In Poser his shorts uses R=127 G=127 B=127 (just the shorst suppost to change color when the team changes) and his skin uses R=119 G=84 B=100 .

WHERE IS THE MISTAKE???

Kinboat
Jun 26, 2004, 10:56 AM
It's hard to see what it looks like in the game but it looks like the palette has too much of the purple. How do you create the palette that you use?

CivArmy s. 1994
Jun 26, 2004, 11:35 AM
It's hard to see what it looks like in the game but it looks like the palette has too much of the purple. How do you create the palette that you use?

- In Poser I used the standard pallete
- I used SBB to create the storyboard, when I replaced the original storyboard created by FLICser by SBB one I changed the black/white by magenta/green in PhotoShop

I'm a beginning in this graphic designer stuffs, is that palette that you were asking me? :confused:


Thanks for helping me! I hopy u help me solve the color problem.

Kinboat
Jun 28, 2004, 09:33 PM
Ok... I'll go through my sequence of events to see if we can work this out.

1) After animating I render them from Poser as 24bit BMP files. I set the color I want to be civ-specific to (58,100,255) Red, Green, Blue. This fits in with the middle of palette color 6 (I think) when exporting from FLICster.
2) I use SBB to create the storyboards.
3) I take some of my renders (a good mix of views) and paste them all into a larger image which I save as a 24bit BMP.
4) I use this image and load it into a program called PEdit... I also load a default palette that only has the civ-specific and shadow, smoke colors on it. I can use this PEdit program to add the colors I need to the blank spaces in the default palette.
5) Load a storyboard created by FLICster into an image editor program (must be the same frame size as your SBB storyboard).
6) Apply the palette you created with PEdit to the FLICster storyboard and then paste the SBB Storyboard onto it. Save it.
7) You'll need to reopen the file in FLICster to get the palette to display correctly.
It doesn't sound like you are creating much of a palette... I hope I explained that so it can be understood.

CivArmy s. 1994
Jun 29, 2004, 02:31 PM
I think my error in the step 3:
- what is the size of this large image that u did?
- how many positions it needd?
- how do u add the colors in this default pallete?
The other steps I think i'm doing well.

Kinbot, thanks!!!

Kinboat
Jun 29, 2004, 08:30 PM
Basicly it could be any size you want. THe goal is just to try to represent all the colors that are in the unit, so if you have an orange symbol only on the back of the unit you need a rear view to see that color. Then you can open the image up in PEdit (look below my signiture) along with the 'essential palette' I've included. You can use this program to select colors from the image into the palette (starting after the civ-specific colors in the palette). You need to select as as many different colors as you need to get the best view (don't select any of the pink shadow or civ-colors since they are already in the palette). The program also has an option to check the picture with the palette you are creating so that you can see if you are missing any major colors. Then you can save the palette in several different formats... hopefully one that you can use in an image editing program to load it onto your FLICster storyboard.

CivArmy s. 1994
Jun 30, 2004, 07:07 PM
I created the cave man pallete in PEdit and using Photo Shop I loaded this pallete in the Flicster storyboard before copy/past the SBB storyboard onto it. The FLICSter storyboard changed to magenta to blue. what I did wrong? :confused:
the caveman pallete, its SBB storyboard and the bigger image that I used to created its palette are all in this attachment.

Kinboat
Jul 01, 2004, 09:14 AM
The palette looks fine to me... Maybe it has to do with the Photo Shop program. I use Paint Shop Pro, Photo Shop (if I remember correctly) might flip the order of the palette. You could ask a general question in the creation forum to see if someone who uses Photo Shop knows more. It could also be when you apply the palette to the FLICster SB there is an option (at least in Paint Shop Pro) to either Apply best match or Maintain Index... You'd want to Maintain Index or what ever the similar option is called. Not sure if that would really make a difference, or cause what you are describing but I really don't know Photo Shop.

CivArmy s. 1994
Jul 01, 2004, 12:53 PM
The palette looks fine to me... Maybe it has to do with the Photo Shop program. I use Paint Shop Pro, Photo Shop (if I remember correctly) might flip the order of the palette. You could ask a general question in the creation forum to see if someone who uses Photo Shop knows more. It could also be when you apply the palette to the FLICster SB there is an option (at least in Paint Shop Pro) to either Apply best match or Maintain Index... You'd want to Maintain Index or what ever the similar option is called. Not sure if that would really make a difference, or cause what you are describing but I really don't know Photo Shop.

I'll do that, I hope I fix these error as soon as possible, it is freak me out :sad:

Hikaro Takayama
Sep 07, 2004, 10:02 AM
Kinboat,

I have a few questions for those of us who have extremely slow connections, and even slower Poser 5 operation, and don't want to go through the time and hassle of downloading and opening your set up just to get what could easily be typed here.

To whit I need to know, in exact x,y,z coordinates and FOV angle, your camera settings are. Also, is it possible to link/have the camera track objects, like in Bryce? If so, you could save a ton of messing around by having the camera follow the ground plane (it would be automatically pointed at 0,0,0 so everything would be proplerly centered), and just rotate the ground plane instead of the figure. I'm trying to create my first human type unit with Poser, but I unfortunately don't know what I'm doing, in terms of camera setup. Any and all help would be appreciated.

Of course, if worse comes to worst (noone replies within the next few days), I'll just make a valiant attempt to use Wyrmshadow's Bryce 5 setup (hey a camera is a camera is a camera.... I hope) and put the camera at -4500,3500,4500 and set the FOV to 1, and adjust the zoom as needed, or someting.

Kinboat
Sep 07, 2004, 10:37 AM
My file shouldn't be that big either...

I use Poser 4 with the Pro Pack expansion and don't know what changes have been made in Poser 5.

You should be able to parent the camera and lights to the ground plane... Although I think it's just easier to rotate the base figure's Body element... Or for multiple figure units (like my bond for example) just parent both of them to a sphere under the ground plane and rotate that.

Main Camera
Focal: 100mm
hither: 0.016
DollyZ: 0.800
DollyY: 0.100
DollyX: 0.000
zScale: 100%
yScale: 100%
xScale: 100%
Scale: 394%
zOrbit: 0
xOrbit: -30
yOrbit: 0

The Other cameras don't need any particular settings.

Main Light
Shadow: 1.000
Map Size: 256
xRotate: -65
yRotate: 35
zRotate: 0
Scale: 55%
Red: 1.000
Green: 1.000
Blue: 1.000
Intensity: 80%

Secondary Light
Shadow: 1.000
Map Size: 256
xRotate: -60
yRotate: 20
zRotate: 0
Scale: 55%
Red: 1.000
Green: 1.000
Blue: 1.000
Intensity: 20%

Tertiary Light 1
Shadow: 1.000
Map Size: 256
xRotate: 0
yRotate: -55
zRotate: 0
Scale: 55%
Red: 1.000
Green: 1.000
Blue: 1.000
Intensity: 50%

Tertiary Light 2
Shadow: 1.000
Map Size: 256
xRotate: 0
yRotate: 55
zRotate: 0
Scale: 55%
Red: 1.000
Green: 1.000
Blue: 1.000
Intensity: 50%

Shadows are turned off under Light Properties for all lights except the Main Light. I also have another Work Light that I use during animating to light the back of the unit. I delete this before final rendering.

Shadow Ball
I place a sphere prop off to the side to help diffuse the shadow. I think I explained previously how this works. This can sometimes cause problems though. If you have a unit that develops flickering shadows in the animations then you can try deleting the sphere and see if it stops.

Scale: all 100%
Rotate: all 0
xTran: 3.000
yTran: 0.000
zTran: 0.000

Hikaro Takayama
Sep 08, 2004, 12:56 PM
KinBoat, Tanks for the info, however I got really bored and decided to play around with the camera settings and figured out another workable arrangement (at least for my Arashi Commando unit that I'm currently working on).

The main Camera is set like this:

Focal/Hither: Default settings
DollyX:-.15
DollyY:1.2
DollyZ:1.2
x/y/z scales:100%
Scale:~400% (i'll have to open the file up)
Zorbit:0
Xorbit:30
Yorbit:45

Lighting: I play around with the three default lights until I got what I wanted (although I'll have to double chech to make sure that the RGB values are equal for all three I don't want any funky colors showing up). Also, my Document Window is 110x110.

As for the Shadows, Poser 5 allows you to set the shadow density for a particlar light, and I've got mine around 75%, so no wories there. I like my shadows a bit on the dense side, though. I'm just wierd like that, i guess. :p

The best part about the camera settings I discovered is that if I change the Yorbit in increments of 45 degrees, I'll get all 8 angles, and the unit will be centered. I'll probably still just rotate the main figure since I don't feel like messing with the lighting.

You can see how the unit looks at civ scale in my latest preview thread. If you have any further advice and comments, it's always welcome. :)

Well, I guess this just goes to show that there's always more than one way to skin a cat ;)

CamJH
Sep 15, 2004, 12:37 PM
Hey KB,

Here's a sketch to give you an idea of the unit I'm working on. Not sure if I could PM you a pic or not, so here it is. This particular picture is of Mazrim Taim, now leader of the Asha'man (my unit). He has dragons wrapped around his sleeves, but that is not typical of their dress, only because he is their "M'Hael."

Thanks, :)
CamJH

Hikaro Takayama
Sep 17, 2004, 02:49 PM
Okay, I was animating last night, and I found a slight annoying problem which I managed to fix.

This occurs only in Poser 5 as far as I know, but if anyone else runs into this problem, the methods I've listed here should work just fine.

Basically, as I was rotating the main figure to get the different facing animations, I ran into a bug where the conformed clothing figures got messed up (lots of poke-through, etc) when I set the Y rotation for the main figure to 180 deg. I undid my last, then set the rotation to -180, and it faced the proper direction without any errors. To get the remaining directions, I then set the yRotate to -135,-90,and -45 respectively.

To sum it up, when using Poser 5 set the main figure rotation to 0, 45, 135, -180, -135, -90, and -45 to render all eight directions.

One more thing to note: If you use a pose from the library (either preset or custom), it will generate a key frame for the main figure, and when you rotate, you'll have to rotate for all the key frames as well. I only use the pose library for storing the original pose in looping animations, so that I don't have to memorize every single angle/side-side setting for every joint I moved during the animation. What this means is that I only have two keyframes, the first and last, to deal with, which is still much faster than dealing with writing down all the values and manually inputing them for the last frame.

Kinboat
Sep 19, 2004, 12:12 PM
I get that problem in Poser 4 occasionally. My solution is to just rotate the figure to 179.9 instead of a full 180. Not really noticable in the final render and it seems to solve the glitch. Not sure what causes it though.

LBPB
Sep 22, 2004, 04:45 PM
Is it possible to repaint only a part of the body of Kinboat model (for exemple his feet) ?

If for exemple I recolor his feets, then I don't have to bother making him some shoes... :confused:

Kinboat
Sep 22, 2004, 10:48 PM
Yep... Select the body part you want a different color (in this case one of the feet) and click on the grouping tool (looks like a dotted line box in Poser 4). Then you can 'Create New Group' Select the polygons you want to recolor (in this case you can 'Select All' to select all the polygons on the foot). Then click on the 'Assign Material' button farther down. It asks for a name and you've just created a new material. You can then do the same thing for the other foot (if you use the same name for the material it will group both feet in the same material group.)

LBPB
Sep 24, 2004, 07:01 AM
:thanx:
It's work better this way ! :goodjob:

CamJH
Sep 27, 2004, 06:50 PM
Quick question KB: When your rendering your images in Poser, do you use the "draft" quality or the "production" quality in render options?
_______
Edit: Nevermind

CamJH
Nov 05, 2004, 01:09 AM
Hey Kinboat,

Came across some discrepancies with running the default setup on Poser 5 instead of Poser 4, and thought I'd mention them here. The first is that shadows for the Main Light need to be reduced to .667 from 1.0. This has been brought up before by other people, but I thought I'd include it. The other is that the Blue and Red values under the properties for the Main Light need to be bumped up to 1.333 from 1.0. The magenta for the background, along with all the other colors, become slightly distorted without fixing this.

Thought maybe you'd like to post this setup in your first post along with your original default setup for all the newbie creators (like me :) ) that are picking up Poser 5. Or if you don't want to, I could attach it here. Thanks Kinboat. You're default setup has been a big help for me, so hopefully this might help some people out there that have been having issues.

Later :D

Kinboat
Nov 06, 2004, 01:03 PM
Thanks :D I've posted it in the first post.

Parthius
Nov 17, 2004, 06:29 AM
Kinboat,
You indicated that you scaled Daz/Poser figures by 95% in y to help get them to (better) match the chunkier Civ3 style. I have played around with various options:

1. Scaling the figure in Y. This can cause issues when different body parts move and has to do with Poser arcana. There are work arounds (scaling individual body parts) that are too much work...

2. Scaling the Main Camera in Y only. This is quick an easy, but in death frames where the figure becomes horizontal becomes an issue. The work around here would be to change the camera scale frame by frame for the death flc.

3. Change the xOrbit value. Your standard value of -30 puts the camera at an elevation angle of 30 degrees (a straight down view would be -90) in Poser 5. Changing it to -35, causes perspective based foreshortening that makes for chunkier looking figures. This is the easiest, most consistent way to get that shorter, chunkier look.

Any thoughts on adjusting the perspective (elevation) camera angle? Do we know with any accuracy what angle was used for the original Civ3 figures?

Your figures/animations are fantastic!

Parthius
Nov 17, 2004, 02:45 PM
Here is an easy way to rotate a poser figure for the different orientations, even when the figure rotates as part of the animation (based on Poser5):

1. Create a basic shape prop (I use the cylinder, which will be correctly centered.) Make it invisible and change the name to "Rotator".

2. Parent your animation figure to the "Rotator" prop.

3. To rotate the figure, select the Rotator prop and change its y-rotation value as desired.

This technique is especially useful for four legged critters like the DAZ elephant. Its shoulders are at the origin, but it rotates about its hip. Thus, rotating the figure moves it away from the origin :( Parenting it to the rotator prop and then rotating the prop serves to rotate the figure about the center of the prop/origin :) and everything works the way it should!

Kinboat
Nov 17, 2004, 11:46 PM
I haven't done anything with scaling original Poser figures for quite some time, since I made my own figures I guess. And it was never a perfect solution... Scaling the camera was out for the precise reason you posted. As for the angles I'm not really sure. It seems that early on people hit on the 30 degrees down and stuck with it... I don't know if someone from Firaxis mentioned it or if it was trial and error that struck upon it. But in my mind it makes sense... Why pick an odd number like 27.5 degrees when 30 will do just as well. I'm not sure if anyone has tried other angles recently but I would think you could go a few degrees off 30 before anyone would really notice a change and you might get some foreshortening effect giving you a stubbier figure.

I usually just leave the 'body' selection un-moved in every frame after the first so I can just rotate that 45 degrees to get the different views... Although for multifigure units I do use a prop (most of the time a sphere :D ) and parent the figures to it... I've also used this method on occasion for mounted units although I think the Poser horse rotates nicely around the center (not sure about the elephant model you mention) and doesn't need this. But I am rotating the 'Body' not the hips to get my directional views... But this method works just as well... it's a matter of preference at this point :D

Parthius
Nov 18, 2004, 06:08 AM
I measured the length of the Civ3 Destroyer in S (120 pixels) and E (69 pixels) views. This gives a ratio of 0.575 and, using a little trigonometry (taking the arcsin(.575)) gives 35.1 degrees. Since being off on the measurement by one pixel only changes the result by a half degree, I am willing to bet that they used 35 degrees elevation as the camera angle.

Again, doing a little trig, using 35 vrs 30 will result in a relative apparent/foreshortening of 94.6%. Alternatively, if the figure is scaled to be the same apparent height, this would increase the apparent width of the figure by 105.7%. This is consistent with Kinboats early poser figure experience of changing the y scale by 5%.

This is of course all moot for anyone using custom models that give good results. For those of us using Daz models and wanting to avoid swizzle stick lookin legs, every little bit helps...

Kinboat
Nov 18, 2004, 11:33 AM
I've said it before... Everyone else puts far too much thought into this than I ever have :D I never really thought of putting my math skills to work here but it all sounds good.

Hikaro Takayama
Jan 15, 2005, 09:35 PM
Kinboat, since I didn't find anything in this thread about how I could solve this conundrum, I figured I might as well bring the subject up. Namely, how in the name of Sam Hill do you do the smoke/flash for your gun using units? I came accross this problem whilst doing my Mithra Ninja, and if I can't work my way around it, I may have to just drop the gun attack altogether. :(

Kinboat
Jan 16, 2005, 07:00 PM
This can be a rather involved answer... I'm sorry for not answering when I saw this post but I didn't have the time. I don't at the moment either. I will post an answer tomorrow (Monday) sometime.

Hikaro Takayama
Jan 16, 2005, 11:31 PM
Thanks. I can wait.

It's just that making smoky gunflashes in Bryce is about as easy as falling off a log, whereas doing any kind of textures in Poser is like trying to solve equations for Quantum Mechanics.

Aeon221
Jan 17, 2005, 10:35 AM
SO glad I found this thread. I am trying to get set up with all the necessary goodies to start playing with unit creation and this has been key (esp since my total experience is playing with the Poser5 demo last night instead of sleeping)!

I hope you keep posting helpful tips here for us new students of your art ;p

Kinboat
Jan 17, 2005, 02:39 PM
Welcome to the thread Aeon221. If you have any questions just ask.

Well... There are two different methods; Gun Flash, and Gun Smoke. The first one I use for more modern weapons, the second one I use for primitive guns before the development of smokless powder. Gun Flash is by far the easier of the two. Basicly I've made up a simple prop that I parent to the gun object and then shrink it to about .1%. Then I just bring it back to 100% when I have the need of it (for one frame only). I usually make this prop a bright yellow with a bright white highlight color. This gives the illusion of a flash of light in the final render. I have in the past placed a spotlight at the barrel to give it an extra flash... I'd recomend this method only for very large guns (look at my Gattling Mecha for an example) as this can mess with the color of the ground and cause problems with civ-color.

Gun Smoke is a far more difficult and tricky issue. What I've finally gotten it down to is this. I parent a sphere to the end of the gun. I then parent 9 rectangular panels to the sphere. I apply a transparency map to each of those panels and then hide the sphere (making sure to turn off shadows for the sphere as well). Now the Maps I use are from a 9 frame explosion animation. Now comes the tricky part... Animating it. For the first frame I'll have all 9 panels shrunk down to .1%. This way nothing will show up. I want to make the second frame the frame where the gun actually fires so I enlarge only the first panel. Then in the next frame I shrink the first panel and enlarge the second... Then shrink the second and enlarge the third etc until I've gone through all 9 of my panels and then shrink them all back to .1%. So my attack animation is going to be at least 10 frames long. I'm currently going for 15 frames each so I have a few extra to get the gun back up into a firing position. In the final render this gives a decent smoke cloud effect which if placed right looks like it comes from the barrel of the gun.

Now the sphere comes in. When you want to rotate the unit to render all the directions you need to rotate the sphere in the opposite direction so that the panels are always facing the camera. It takes a little trial and error to get the sphere positioned correctly so it's still in front of the gun even when you rotate it.

I'll post the props and textures I have for the Smoke setup as soon as I can (later tonight).

CamJH
Jan 17, 2005, 04:11 PM
I was just about to ask you if you'd mind posting these as I was reading along, and then I saw the last line. :) I'd greatly appreciate this. It'll come in handy while I'm working on the Gnoll Gunman.

Hikaro Takayama
Jan 17, 2005, 06:03 PM
Thanks a billion, Kinboat, this is just what I need to get my Mithra Ninja back on track!

Kinboat
Jan 17, 2005, 08:51 PM
I've posted them here: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=1397395#post1397395

CamJH
Jan 17, 2005, 09:57 PM
Thanks again Kinboat. :goodjob:
But I'm sure I'll still probably have a couple questions for you since I've never animated with guns before. :)

Takeno
Jan 24, 2005, 02:46 PM
I have a question about how you make the animations for the 8 movement and attack directions. Do you set up seperate paths for each, or just have him run one way, rotate, the run again?

EDIT:Also, does anyone know the exact color you need to have for it to be civ-specific?

Kinboat
Jan 24, 2005, 07:50 PM
I generally make all the animations in a row (Default, Run, Fortify, Attacks, Victory, Fidget, Death) and then turn the body once in the first frame and render... Turn and Render... Repeat as nessecary :D (make sure that you don't use the 'Body' in any frame but the first or else you may run into problems with this method.)

I'm not sure of the 'exact' color, although I've heard people mention it before. The color I use for blue is 58, 100, 255... It's close to the middle of the first two rows in the palette.

CamJH
Jan 24, 2005, 08:19 PM
I think that might drive me nuts, but to each his own. :)
I come up with a Default stance (single frame) and a Fortified stance (single frame), use them as bookends for the appropriate animations, and create the movements in between. I'd be too afraid I'd mess up a frame and have to start all the way over... but maybe that's just because I'm not a pro like you KB. ;)

EDIT: and you don't have to have an exact color for it to be civ-color. If you're working with blue (default), any blue in the unit will become a shade of the civ-color. I will try out that 58, 100, 255 though, I've just been using 0, 0, 255 so far.

Kinboat
Jan 25, 2005, 03:17 AM
Oh I don't render it one frame at a time... I didn't explain that too well. I set it up so I can render the whole sequence at once (after I've got all the animations done and everything the way I want it.) I just have to turn the 'Body' 45 degrees in the first frame and since I haven't fiddled with the 'Body' in any of the frames later on it stays turned... Then I render the whole thing. Then turn it another 45 degrees and Render.

Takeno
Feb 07, 2005, 08:57 PM
This is a question about after you have the animations rendered and the .PCX file, ready to cut and paste. What is the order in which you paste them? I have the individual images from the frames, I just need to know where to begin. :)

Kinboat
Feb 08, 2005, 11:02 AM
Not sure if it would matter what order they are pasted in. I try to set them up so I can use Steph's SBB program to combine the different sets into storyboards that I can then paste into the FLICster storyboards. Not sure if that's what you were asking or not.

Takeno
Feb 08, 2005, 03:16 PM
I have the SBB, but not FLICster. Where can I get it, and how much will it cost?

Kinboat
Feb 08, 2005, 06:12 PM
FLICster! I thought everyone had it :D It's almost essential if you want to make units (now of course there is another option). It's in the Utilities forum.

Takeno
Feb 10, 2005, 04:35 PM
I have another problem :p . I have finished the animations, and pasted the .bmps onto storyboards I got from Civ3FlcEdit. I then convet them to Flc files. The animations work in the game, but the unit is surrounded by a civ color square :eek: :confused: . I'm sure this problem has happened before but I can't remember how to fix it. BTW, before anyone asks, I have checked the background color and am pretty sure its (255,0,255).

Also, CamJH, I'm having trouble converting the lightning attacks. For some reason my Civ3FlcEdit won't run them anymore.

CamJH
Feb 11, 2005, 12:50 AM
You don't need to paste the bmps onto storyboards, all you have to do is create a storyboard with SBB. Then create a new storyboad with Civ3FlcEdit (or flicster), replace that storyboard with the one you created using SBB, and then open it up with Civ3FlcEdit (or flicster). No cutting and pasting involved. :)

I think I had a similar problem back when I started with a civ-colored square around the unit. Only happened once by accident, but I think it was a problem with my palette. Are you using PEdit to create your own palettes?

If it won't run the lightning animations anymore, something might have altered them. Just delete them and re-download them. If that doesn't work, let me know.

Kinboat
Feb 11, 2005, 02:27 PM
Definitely sounds like a palette problem. Maybe if you can post one of the FLC files here someone can take a look.

Takeno
Feb 13, 2005, 08:41 PM
You don't need to paste the bmps onto storyboards, all you have to do is create a storyboard with SBB. Then create a new storyboad with Civ3FlcEdit (or flicster), replace that storyboard with the one you created using SBB, and then open it up with Civ3FlcEdit (or flicster). No cutting and pasting involved. :)

What do you mean, "replace"? :confused:

CamJH
Feb 13, 2005, 10:15 PM
Using "save as."
Take the storyboard you created with SBB, and save it over the storyboard you created with Civ3FlcEdit (or flicster).

Takeno
Feb 14, 2005, 02:25 PM
Using "save as."
Take the storyboard you created with SBB, and save it over the storyboard you created with Civ3FlcEdit (or flicster).
I tried it, and when I try to view the animation it says "Runtime Error: 9, Subscript out of range."

EDIT: Fixed the box problem, but now my unit is half invisible! :eek: And the other half's colors are all messed up. It's still something to do with the pallette most likely. :rolleyes:

flamescreen
Feb 20, 2005, 12:09 PM
Hi, kinboat, a question for you.
I'm doing this settler unit, in search of directions I should use, I opened the flics of Firaxis' settler and your hobbit. Using 120 frames for it, seemingly 16 for each direction.

How do you do that with a set of 15 animation poses?(after looking your files I decided to make mine on packs of 15 as well) Copy the 1st as sixteenth?

Also, this stands only for the first 7 directions. The 8th is only 8 frames, which look identical to each other. Is that(identicality) my imagination or should I do that this way also?

Oh, and something unrelated to Poser: I noticed units will have an .amb file for sounds. Why is that, how is it used and how can i make one, if you know?

Kinboat
Feb 21, 2005, 08:14 PM
All my recent animations have 15 frames for each direction. If you want the animation to Loop then you can copy the first frame to the 16th. I'm not sure if that's what you're asking or not.

I'm not sure why the 8th direction would show up as only 8 frames... it should be the same as all the rest. Are you using FLICster to look at the FLC files or Animation Shop? I believe Animation Shop cuts off the end of the animations for some reason.

AMB files are sound files for some units. I don't think anyone has figured out a way to make their own AMB files yet although a general post in the creation forum might help you out there.

aaglo
Feb 21, 2005, 11:47 PM
Suggestion to unit makers:

Maybe you should use the same amount of frames as firaxis does (atleast in those animations, where the sound file is an amb-file, namely run and attack animations). That way we can use existing firaxis sounds for some units - without strange sound glitches :)

flamescreen
Feb 23, 2005, 11:39 AM
Yeah, that was exactly what I wanted Kinboat! Thanks.
Also, you're right, Animation shop it was, I just tried flicster, and it looks ok, but no individual frames, like in AS.

Also, I agree with aaglo. Good idea. I might implement it for my next unit. Hope to find some info on .amb manipulation. Thanks for suggesting! :)

flamescreen
Feb 26, 2005, 11:59 AM
I was making my first flc, under your tut's guidance Kinboat(and thank you very much for it) and I've bumped into some problems. Since I've solved at least one of them here's some tips and 2 questions:

After you save the storyboard in PSP(in .pcx format), you have to go to flickster and reopen the file you exported. Since I didn't know I tried to open the storyboard and of course Flickster can't do that. What it can do is open the .fxm file you get with the exported files.

After opening that(since you replaced the storyboard with yours, you should see it in the animation preview, also check Alpha blend, if you don't see just the unit, there's a problem) go to the last tab and export it as flc(it says it exports as 8 different files but I only got one which is how it's supposed to be).

Question 1:
Poser 4(not pro) renders as Name 0001 to 0015, not 0000 to 0014 as SBB asks. Anyway to change that?(I wrote a series of batch files for it)

Question 2:
I got a problem with palettes. The flc included the magenta background. Then I went for the Eccential palette that comes with PEdit and it came through fine, except a grey line surrounding the unit(which I hand painted magenta and then got it fine), also came out as civ-colored. I'm including the palettes I used.

The first 2 are from photoshop 5.5 I have and saved them as pal(one with civ colors first the other as last,but none helped), the other is one I used with PSP, but still nothing(all three are basically: I take the first frame of each direction paste them in one pic and save a palette that includes all colors in the pic, is that the wrong way? cause PEdit is just too fast and seems to have very little space for colors).

Also, I noticed I can't save a palette in PSP(edit it basically, maybe cause it's in .bmp? ), unless I touch it in Photoshop, go indexed mode, save then open it in PSP. Is there a manual on PEdit? One would be quite handy.

And something last, I have some units that wear too white clothing, would that be a problem with flickster?(like it is for leaderheads?)

sorry to ask so much...
Hm, I see the board doesn't accept pal and I have no time to zip. Sending through e-mail...(unfortunatelly, my disk was damaged in the process so can't send the storyboard itself, hope it isn't essential).

Might have to do with this, as I didn't expect it this way(the palette in photoshop), but asking to make sure. http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=44392

Kinboat
Feb 26, 2005, 05:26 PM
I use a program called Irfanview to batch rename the files and organize them for the SBB program. Or if you are using the latest version of SBB there is a check box that lets the program read 1-15 instead of 0-14. My brother is the programer in the family and he mentioned making batch files but I've never gotten around to making up my own.
(FLICster only exports as 8 seperate FLCs when you use that option from a FLC and not a FLC storyboard. Useful when you need to adjust the x/y offsets)

The palette needs to be organized in a specific way. The first 4 rows and the last two rows shouldn't be changed unless you know what you're doing. It doesn't really matter what color is in those spaces but where ever those colors appear in the unit they will be either civ-colored or smoke or shadow colors. In a normal unit you only have the rows in between to work with. Using PEdit and the essential palette I made up you can fill in those colors by clicking on an empty palette square and a color on the reference image you made up. Or when Steph finishes his latest program it will let you create a palette with a few clicks.

flamescreen
Feb 27, 2005, 11:54 AM
Well, too late about the program you suggested...I already wrote yesterday batch files to rename for every single animation case. Took me a while but that's ok. I think I have ver6 so it might have the option you mention, I'll check it out. It's puzzling that I got the grey ghost in flickster if it's ver 6 though. Anyway.

I'm looking forward to this program from Steph. It would be so handy for amateurs like me. :lol: My units textures are blue so I probably can't do something with it. Might use the trick on blue you mention earlier.