This is the thread for the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

The term 3 thread is here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=35391) .

Minister of Foreign Affairs: Eyrei
Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs: Chieftess

Congrats eyrei and CT.

Place your Department Vote to Confirm me as Term 4 Judge Advocate (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38073)

Thanks. BTW, I think the title should be "Kill them...one civ at a time[/b]. Like that commercial. ;)

We have lost our alliance with the Babs and I don't think we should pursue anymore diplomatic deals with them for a while. The french are all over oue East coast and will soon have no real purpose there once the Egyptian city is taken. The French will ally with us against the Japanese for 221g. I believe this looks like a timely deal, but would be a waste of gold. I don't think we should sign anymore diplomatic deals with the French for a while. We may need them later against the Americans or Brits.

A poll to establish an embassy with China has been posted here. (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38197)

Originally posted by Cyc
We have lost our alliance with the Babs and I don't think we should pursue anymore diplomatic deals with them for a while. The french are all over oue East coast and will soon have no real purpose there once the Egyptian city is taken. The French will ally with us against the Japanese for 221g. I believe this looks like a timely deal, but would be a waste of gold. I don't think we should sign anymore diplomatic deals with the French for a while. We may need them later against the Americans or Brits.

Well, there goes one civ's reputation down the drain. 14 more to go!;) I also agree that no further alliances are needed with the French, unless they have a large number of troops in our territory when the Egyptians cease to exist.

Well, the Persians have declared war on us from across the world, because we would not give them incense for free. We need to immediately drag as many civs as possible into this war, both to keep the Persians from ever getting to us, and to keep them from finding any alliances. Here is a list of all the possible alliances (civs that we already have embassies with):

America: 267 gold or education
France: 214 gold or feudalism, education or engineering
England: 108 gold or feudalism, education or engineering
India: 97 gold or education
Russia: 291 gold or education
China: 286 or education
Iroquois: 331 gold
Babylon: 445 gold

I will post a full proposal soon, but it will definately include alliances with England and France for feudalism, since they will get it very soon anyway. Obviously, if we are willing to trade education we could bring most of the world down on the Persians. 2 civs already have it, and will likely sell it to anyone we pay gold for an alliance, so we might as well just use the tech and save our money.

We also need to establish an embassy with Rome, as they are Persia's closest neighbor, and likely have quite a few legions, which are an excellent counter to immortals. The embassy will cost 95 gold, but they would likely sign an alliance for education, like everyone else. We can also give them the incense the Persians wanted so badly:lol:

Dog pile on the Persians. Sounds good to me.

I would love to have Rome join in. (It seems their trade deal ended because they temporarily lost a habor, or some sort of agreement). We need an embassy with Rome, and see if they can help out in prolonging the World War.

Mr Minister for Foreign Affairs,

Please direct your attention to this discusion thread regarding whether we should further prosecute the war with Japan (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38729). Thankyou :goodjob:

(Time for some good old fashioned spontenious roleplaying)

Good news from the war front!

My contacts have just come back from Japan, and say that the war is getting to them. Citizens of Satsuma, Novgorod, Toyama, and Shimonoseki would be willing to surrender to us if we sign a peace treaty now. Japan is certainly on the defensive. (There are still 3 cities that are still willing to put up a fight).

eyrei, how the heck did we lose our alliances? We're not in the same good standings this t/c, in terms of the war with the Persians, as we were last t/c. We can't seem to hold on to our foreign diplomatic agreements for very long in any area. Is this just normal for emperor, or are we doing something wrong?

Anyway, I did some checking with my sources and they say that we can get back these alliances with gold per turn agreements.

France will sign an alliance against Persia for 5gpt and 10g.
England will do the same for 3gpt.
China will do the same for 20gpt.
Right now we are bringing in about 61gpt, so the 28gpt we would be spending is less than half our income. At this time I believe the 20gpt deal with China would be well spent as it seems they will be attacking us in a few turns. We may be able to firm up a peace treaty with them through this.

I also think we should continue the war with Japan until they are pushed up into the NW region of their area, and that we should also declare war on the Aztecs and annihilate them. Can we get a discussion thread and poll for declaring war on the Aztecs started by the F/A Dept?

Originally posted by Cyc
eyrei, how the heck did we lose our alliances? We're not in the same good standings this t/c, in terms of the war with the Persians, as we were last t/c. We can't seem to hold on to our foreign diplomatic agreements for very long in any area. Is this just normal for emperor, or are we doing something wrong?

Anyway, I did some checking with my sources and they say that we can get back these alliances with gold per turn agreements.

France will sign an alliance against Persia for 5gpt and 10g.
England will do the same for 3gpt.
China will do the same for 20gpt.
Right now we are bringing in about 61gpt, so the 28gpt we would be spending is less than half our income. At this time I believe the 20gpt deal with China would be well spent as it seems they will be attacking us in a few turns. We may be able to firm up a peace treaty with them through this.

I also think we should continue the war with Japan until they are pushed up into the NW region of their area, and that we should also declare war on the Aztecs and annihilate them. Can we get a discussion thread and poll for declaring war on the Aztecs started by the F/A Dept?

I thought this was going to be an easy week. I guess I was wrong. Thanks for bringing this to my attention...since I didn't wade through the chat log this week I was not aware that these alliances had been broken. I will start a discussion.

England is in our territory, and the AI is known to be bold... But, I don't like spending all of that gpt when we could be using it for techs. We could also give the English incense instead of gpt.

CT, my reson for using gpt was to keep the dweeb AI from turning on us, like they have done again and again.

The English will sign another alliance with us for as little as 1gpt if we give them our world map.

Go for it. Our world map has nothing on it that they don't already know.

I have posted a three part poll regarding utilisation of our Great Leader: What should we use Richthoffen for? (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39230), if the FP, where? (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39232) and if the Palace, where? (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39233) Please vote in all these polls ASAP if you wish to make your voice heard before tonight's turn chat! :)

Why are you posting instructions to ally with China? That was not a popular part of the quick poll you posted before the previous turn chat and it was voted down during that turn chat. You have made no effort to re-poll, or to post a proper (i.e., non-quick) poll on this subject.


I've decided to help you oout and post the poll myself:

Should we pay China 16gpt for an ROP and alliance against Persia? (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39497)

The alliance with China can be ended peacefully in 4 turns. Please make it so. We also have alliances with England, India and the Zulus that can be ended now.

Should we end all our alliances against Persia in 5 turns and then make peace? (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=40038)

I'm going to have to take a look at the entire situation again, donsig. Thanks for the heads up. My main concern is that, as FortyJ said during the chat, Persia is very strong. They had their military strength reduced during the chat before last, but have come back like gang-busters last chat and are to be feared again. On second thought, I won't be able to get back to my game. A change in plans has forced me to spen a week in Vegas. :lol: I won't be able to support a peace plan like this until I look at the save again. Sorry.

Originally posted by donsig
The alliance with China can be ended peacefully in 4 turns. Please make it so. We also have alliances with England, India and the Zulus that can be ended now.

Should we end all our alliances against Persia in 5 turns and then make peace? (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=40038)

I see no need for you to post this poll yourself. It was done improperly as it lumps several alliances that are not costing us anything with one that costs us quite a bit.

Originally posted by eyrei

I see no need for you to post this poll yourself. It was done improperly as it lumps several alliances that are not costing us anything with one that costs us quite a bit.

The main point of the poll is to end the Phony Persian War without damaging our reputation. To do that we must wait until the Chinese alliance has completed it's 20 turns and then we must end all the alliances before we make peace. Hence the lumping together of the alliances.

You see no reason for me to post this poll myself? I could have asked for such a poll and then if some other citizen seconded it then you'd be bound to post it. Well, I tried that back when Eklektikos was Domestic leader, got two citizens to join me in my call for a poll only to have it ignored. My faith in that mechanism is gone.

I also tried PIing our current FA leader for his polling practices only to find out that a warning was the only possible outcome. I have lost my faith in that mechanism as well.

I still have a little bit of faith left in myself so I posted the poll. You may notice that this poll comes one week after the last poll I posted about alliances. You may also notice that there are no posts whatsoever in this thread between my announcements of the two polls. If you do not see your inactivity as reason enough for me to post polls then I would certainly like to hear your views on when it would be appropriate for citizens to post polls. That might make a good topic for a campaign debate, if you are willing to go there.

Originally posted by donsig


The main point of the poll is to end the Phony Persian War without damaging our reputation. To do that we must wait until the Chinese alliance has completed it's 20 turns and then we must end all the alliances before we make peace. Hence the lumping together of the alliances.

You see no reason for me to post this poll myself? I could have asked for such a poll and then if some other citizen seconded it then you'd be bound to post it. Well, I tried that back when Eklektikos was Domestic leader, got two citizens to join me in my call for a poll only to have it ignored. My faith in that mechanism is gone.

I also tried PIing our current FA leader for his polling practices only to find out that a warning was the only possible outcome. I have lost my faith in that mechanism as well.

I still have a little bit of faith left in myself so I posted the poll. You may notice that this poll comes one week after the last poll I posted about alliances. You may also notice that there are no posts whatsoever in this thread between my announcements of the two polls. If you do not see your inactivity as reason enough for me to post polls then I would certainly like to hear your views on when it would be appropriate for citizens to post polls. That might make a good topic for a campaign debate, if you are willing to go there.

My inactivity? You are either joking or deluded. I don't post in this thread because this is not where discussions take place. I have posted polls between those two posts you made, and have participated in several discussions on those topics. Also, since you did not even ask me to post a poll on this subject (which I was doing anyway...it is Christmas Eve and I was waiting for my family to go to bed), your argument holds little weight. Had you asked for a poll, I would have posted one.

As far as my opinion on when it is appropriate for a citizen to post a poll that falls under the jurisdiction of a particular department, I will say this: it is not appropriate for a citizen to post a poll without even attempting to consult the appropriate leader, without having started a discussion on the subject, without having explored all the possibilites for poll options, and most of all not in an attempt to draw support just prior to election time.

I'm deluded? Would you mind posting links to the polls you posted between the two posts I made in this thread. I sure can't find 'em.

While you're at it, please post the links to the discussions you participated in on these subjects. I thought you had said earlier that my poll was invalid because there was no discussion... :confused:

I think I have attempted to consult you eyrei. This post is from 5 days ago. (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=663963#post663963) Here is what I said then:

The alliance was voted down in the turn chat 8-6. I call that significant enough to step back, discuss things more and repoll.

Your replay 3 hours later was:

I don't put much stock in spot votes.

As I said from the beginning of this debate long ago, you wanted these alliances and you were bound and determined to get them anyway you could. I've already shown they were illegally attained through quick polls though the only consequence to you could have been a warning. I tried forestalling your attempt to simply overturn a spot vote by posting a poll that ended in a tie. You tried invalidating my poll at first on the grounds that it was a quick poll (oh, the irony of it all) but you quickly forgot that when the poll ended in a tie as it allowed you to break the tie in you favor. Your recent strategy has been to do nothing. When I try to counter that by posting a poll you get all bent out of shape and start seeing personal vendettas. Well, I've had enough of it. you said you've posted polls between my two posts in this thread. Show me the links or admit that you haven't posted any polls in the last week (other than the ones tonight after I posted my last poll).

I was mistaken regarding having posted any polls between those two posts you made. I was on the verge of posting the poll about trading furs to the Chinese when I discovered our trade leader in the chat room and figured it was more his realm than mine (although the primary intent was to improve relations). However, for all intents and purposes, I did all the work for that poll. As far as participation, if you have the time, I challenge you to do a search for posts I made in that time period. Who do you think you were arguing with about FA matters during that time?;)

Thank you for the holiday gift, you two. I now have a big smile on my face after reading this thread. :D

Merry Christmas Cyc! :)

Dec 28, 2002 08:51 PM

Raven1er
Foreign Advisor Deputy

Registered: Jul 2002
Location: Fanatika
Posts: 494
Style: Modern CFC

Well, easy come, easy go.....

I figure im leaving civfanatics this week.
yep, gone forever, except i cant make a post in the official threads, so i cant make it public. can you guys make it public for me? Just tell em ill be leaving

ill miss yall, its just that i have really important life issues to attend to (like my girlfriend.. )
well, good bye all, see you on the play the world multiplayer rooms


__________________
The gate to tomorrow is not the light of heaven, but the
darkness of the depths of the earth...
-Vincent Valentine, FF7
-**Raven1er holds the title of- Jedi Master


Raven1er wanted me to post this. Its now posted

Term 5 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=40556)