Sorry if someone already did it.

From here: http://www.joystiq.com/screenshots/civilization-5-mongols-and-babylonian-civilizations/3478876/#/3

1. There are Keshiks and Horsemen on the same screen. So Keshik is not a Horseman replacement. And it looks too early for the Knoghts. So I assume it's Chariot replacement with no movement penalties, etc.

2. The Khan is much more interesting - it's selected and it's clearly a Great General replacement! Moreover I assume it's combat unit, since it's not stacked and has 2 positive promotions.

If that's so, I wonder what strength the Khan has and will it scale somehow through the game? Otherwise the unit will be either overpowered at the beginning or too vulnerable (without stacking) at the end.

EDIT: On the other hand, the Khan has civilian unit triangle icon, so it could be still civilian unit, but with additional capabilities.

My best guess would by the Khan is a Great General with additional Movement. (so he can keep up with an all Cavalry army, or move around easily)

Sorry if someone already did it.

From here: http://www.joystiq.com/screenshots/civilization-5-mongols-and-babylonian-civilizations/3478876/#/3

1. There are Keshiks and Horsemen on the same screen. So Keshik is not a Horseman replacement. And it looks too early for the Knoghts. So I assume it's Chariot replacement with no movement penalties, etc.

2. The Khan is much more interesting - it's selected and it's clearly a Great General replacement! Moreover I assume it's combat unit, since it's not stacked and has 2 positive promotions.

If that's so, I wonder what strength the Khan has and will it scale somehow through the game? Otherwise the unit will be either overpowered at the beginning or too vulnerable (without stacking) at the end.

EDIT: On the other hand, the Khan has civilian unit triangle icon, so it could be still civilian unit, but with additional capabilities.

1. This is possible, maybe even likely, but not necessarily true. The scenario rules say you gain any units beaten in military city states or something like that, so the horsemen could have come from that.

2. I would say the Khan is just a great general with some added abilities. If he were a combat unit he wouldn't have the triangle.

It would be pretty sweet if the Khan was a GG that could gain xp, (but not from fighting himself but rather from units killing with him near)
But I think Krikkitone is more correct (pretty nice if it is so, GG would then be more useful in modern era)

Map on this screen looks also like a map of greater Mongolia terrain especially with location cities Karakorum and Xian ,probably with new nation we are recieve also Mongolian conquests scenario :)

This looks like a scenario game, so Genghis Khan may be a special unit here.

If the Khan were a UU replacing the Great General, I have to think they'd at least change the icon.

It is not possible that Keshik replace Knight because on this screen player reasearch Metal Casting so my bet for chariot :) it will be good to make chariot without terrain penalty movement and only in this situation is make sense to build one or two of them. right now chariot sucks ,especially because they are not moving after shooting.

It is not possible that Keshik replace Knight because on this screen player reasearch Metal Casting so my bet for chariot :) it will be good to make chariot without terrain penalty movement and only in this situation is make sense to build one or two of them. right now chariot sucks ,especially because they are not moving after shooting.

Metal casting is not a prequisite for chivalry though. Also it seems that you start with keshiks in that scenario anyway so we can not say anything definite yet.

Thinking outside the box... and because I cannot see what weapon the Keshik actually has, but is it plausable that the Keshik replaces the Crossbowman?, Didn't the Mongol's heavily invest in a skirmish/harassing type attack with Mounted Archers? i.e. do a ranged attack and retreat?

also for what its worth, I agree its probably the Chariot Archer, It fits the tactic mentioned above.

Thinking outside the box... and because I cannot see what weapon the Keshik actually has, but is it plausable that the Keshik replaces the Crossbowman?, Didn't the Mongol's heavily invest in a skirmish/harassing type attack with Mounted Archers? i.e. do a ranged attack and retreat?

also for what its worth, I agree its probably the Chariot Archer, It fits the tactic mentioned above.

Brilliant thinking! Your IQ must be pretty high :)

It looks like Genghis Khan stole Alexander's horse. As much work as the AI currently needs, I do like the presentation of the game very much.

It is also possible that the khan in the screen shot is only reflective of how the unit will function in the included Mongolian scenario and will be quite different in terms of the actual game.

Alex's CC against Genghis Khan's Keshiks. :popcorn:

Thinking outside the box... and because I cannot see what weapon the Keshik actually has, but is it plausable that the Keshik replaces the Crossbowman?, Didn't the Mongol's heavily invest in a skirmish/harassing type attack with Mounted Archers? i.e. do a ranged attack and retreat?

Yes, I thought about that. Actually they could replace anything, say Pikeman or Trebuchet. The only problem I see here is upgrade path and resources. Crossbowman is the most powerful non-artillery ranged unit and it's resourceless. So if Keshik replaces Crossbowman it shouldn't require horses?

Yes, I thought about that. Actually they could replace anything, say Pikeman or Trebuchet. The only problem I see here is upgrade path and resources. Crossbowman is the most powerful non-artillery ranged unit and it's resourceless. So if Keshik replaces Crossbowman it shouldn't require horses?

I would assume that it would require a horse. Which might not be a bad idea if the Keshek has some very good bonus over whatever stock unit it replaces. It could then Upgrade to the Lancer or Cavalry directly.

We dont actually know what will make the Keshek special, ability might be, so anything is possible.

The most likely scenario is that its:
A) Replaces the Chariot Archer (fits the combat tactics)
B) Replaces the Knight, and then is available earlier in the tech tree, and is available longer.

Its very weird to me if Keshiks replace chariot archers, seeing as the Mongol invasions were during the medieval period.

Though I guess it could work if whatever advantage they have is a promotion that stays on them as they get upgraded into knights (and cavalry).

But.... chariot archer can't upgrade to horseman.

The scenario description looks really cool actually.

It's sounds like basically a mongol rush through which you tech up via conquest.

The Keshik should definitely be a medieval unit. It's not like the Mongol Empire was technologically backwards like the Aztecs and other Mesoamerican civs when Europeans finally met them. The Mongol Empire was a medieval era empire that beat back and conquered medieval armies.

I'm not sure we could really have Keshiks before horseback riding...

My guess would be knight replacement.

My best guess would by the Khan is a Great General with additional Movement. (so he can keep up with an all Cavalry army, or move around easily)

Think you nailed it there.

My previous thought was something like a four move (+1 with UA) Knight. I can see it as a Horse Archer type unit, but I doubt they'll want two Knights with Archer abilities. That's why my first thought was a Horseman replacement. They might copy previous games and give them scout abilities (so 3+1 move on all terrain).

It's not a Horseman replacement -- there are Mongol Horsemen in the same screenshot with the Keshik.

It might be a Chariot replacement, but as Ahriman pointed out, that's an anachronism... the Mongol Keshik was from the Medieval period. The most logical slot to replace is the Knight. And both the Chariot and Knight both have ranged replacements already (War Elephant and Camel Archer), so I don't see that as an argument for or against either.

I would say the Khan is just a great general with some added abilities. If he were a combat unit he wouldn't have the triangle.

Agree. And I suggest it has something else (like additional bonus to cavalry), since it has 2 positive ability icons.

The most logical slot to replace is the Knight. And both the Chariot and Knight both have ranged replacements already (War Elephant and Camel Archer), so I don't see that as an argument for or against either.

The argument is what there are unlikely 2 unique units with the same uniqueness. Elephant's unique ability is hugely increased strength (especially melee), not distance attack, since original unit already has it. But for Camel Archer it's uniqueness is changing from melee unit to ranged, so if Keshiks would replace Knights, they will be similar.

If they want to keep it at least semi historical then the Keshik should replace the knight.

Keshiks fought and destroyed knights in Eastern Europe in 1240-41.


It will make for some epic Siam versus Mongolia battles. :p

I'm going to go way out on a limb here and suggest Keshik replaces longswordsmen or pikemen. Here is my logic:
1) medieval period for historical accuracy
2) Siam changes a mounted unit into what is basically an infantry unit (N.'s elephant), so why not have a UU that goes the other way?
3) This would make Mongol tactics as a whole much more speed and flanking based in the game, matching historical accuracy and contributing to uniqueness of gameplay.

I noticed Western Xia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Xia) is a Mongol city in the first screenshot, so that must be the Genghis Khan scenario. The Tanguts (Western -or Xi- Xia) were the first ones to "get it" from Temujin. Seems to match up geographically.
I'm intrigued.

I noticed Western Xia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Xia) is a Mongol city in the first screenshot, so that must be the Genghis Khan scenario. The Tanguts (Western -or Xi- Xia) were the first ones to "get it" from Temujin. Seems to match up geographically.
I'm intrigued.

Yes, they promised a scenario in the DLC. Looks like it is.

Especially if I'd looked more closely at the 2nd picture!

Especially if I'd looked more closely at the 2nd picture!

I made the same mistake. :P

The scenario looks pretty cool actually. :)

If it hypothetically did replace the chariot archer, it probably wouldn't have the rough terrain penalty, and it would hopefully have 'can move after attacking', giving a genuine early era hit n run unit.