View Full Version : Goodwill towards Men


Emerald Knight
Dec 19, 2002, 12:11 AM
I've read about stories about Christmas being celebrated on both sides on the front, during WW1 and 2, about both sides of the front (English/Amer, German), coming together to celebrate Christmas, and some playing a round of soccer and exchanging gifts.

It's kinda uplifting to hear about such goodwill towards men, even during war.

Just wondering what everyone else thinks about it. :)

vonork
Dec 19, 2002, 02:28 AM
It's not surprisingly HATED by the high command cuz, it shows to the solider that his opponent is not that demon, childmolestering cannibal rapier. But only a man like himself, that has a wife and kids back home and don't want to be here anymore then them.

This can give the soldier’s crazy ides like why not have the high command doing this fighting, dying in the trenches. Why not go home and live side by side as friends.

Dangerous thoughts like this have to be stopped, therefore all events like this were seen with and bad eye by the high command.

It also has some sick absurdity to it: eat food and celebrate charismas together, then the next day shot them to pieces.

SLIMSHADY339802
Dec 19, 2002, 06:04 AM
Hitler actually allowed that? Or he didn't know?

Knight-Dragon
Dec 19, 2002, 06:17 AM
I don't know about WW2, but it definitely happened during WW1.

It probably happened amongst the troops at the front, w/o approval, knowledge or supervision by the high command. ;) Only 1 or 2 incidents actually.

Vrylakas
Dec 19, 2002, 08:36 AM
There was only one Christmas Truce that I'm aware of, in 1914 on the Western Front of World War I. It only took place between the Germans and British; apparently the French were still too miffed about having their country invaded to take part.

On Christmas Eve (which is the most important day in Central Europe) the Germans began erecting Tannenbaums and candles along their lines, and broke into Christmas Carols (Stille Nacht, etc.). After some time they popped up on top of their trenches and waved white flags and showed the British that they didn't have their guns, and walked into No-Man's Land. After some hesitation some Brits met them, and local unofficial truces were arranged - usually without their commanders' knowledge. Gifts of food were exchanged, common meals eaten, rounds of Christmas Carols were sang together (many English carols are translations of German ones), pictures of family traded, and even a few football/soccer matches played. Some trices lasted two or three days, but for most it ended by the 26th. The commanders on both sides struggled to get the men back into their trenches and fighting one another. For the next 3 Christmases of the war the commanders issued strict orders against fraternizations with the enemy, sometimes ordering artillery barrages on that day to discourage the Germans from trying another truce. By then the hatred had settled in too much anyway, but in 1914 despite some ferocious battles the two sides were still full of homesick boys who didn't understand the war yet.

Some modern historians like to call this the last gasp of the 19th century and its optimism. That's a bit romantic for me, but it was an extraordinary event nonetheless. A good book on the subject is Stanley Weintraub's Silent Night, which I think just came out last year. Weintraub is a Ken Burns-style historian who chooses an event and then collects letters and eye-witness accounts from average people connected to the event, so it doesn't read like a narritive but you get an idea of what it was like to be there, taking part.

I agree Emerald Knight; it is hopeful to see such a sign of humanity in the worst of possible conditions.

Hitro
Dec 19, 2002, 09:25 AM
I also knew about that truce in 1914 but have never heard of any such thing in WW2.

Didn't the Nazis even start the Ardennes Offensive (the Battle of the Bulge) at Christmas 1944?

Pillager
Dec 19, 2002, 11:20 AM
Like Hitro, I knew of the truce in the Great War, but was unaware of any such event happening in WWII, at least on such a large and well-known scale. I'd be interested to know if it ever did happen.

Flatlander Fox
Dec 19, 2002, 02:31 PM
I don't know many "goodwill" stories of WWII, but one in particular was in North Africa, the Germans had captured an English doctor, and then gave him back to the British (Who were suffering from an outbreak of dysentary) for cases of cigarettes and the like. The German commander knew it was wrong, but wanted his troops to get some goodies*, AND didn't want the Brit soldiers to suffer needlessly.

*Disclaimer* This was written in Hans Von Luck's book about his service on all three fronts of the war with Rommel and others. I do not remember exactly what the trade specified, but I remember the doctor story well.

joespaniel
Dec 19, 2002, 05:00 PM
There was no truce in 1944, in fact quite the opposite.

The Germans and Americans were engaged in a brutal battle in the Ardennes.

In 1914, the spontaneous celebration engulfed both sides of no-man's land, in a spectacular event known as the Christmas truce.

edit: http://www.firstworldwar.com/features/christmastruce.htm

Illustrious
Dec 19, 2002, 06:29 PM
My favourite "goodwill" story of WW2 comes from a German major who was put in charge of a scratch unit of boys and invalids in 1944. This green unit was unlucky enough to be posted near Arnhem, and so had to be thrown into the ring of units isolating the British paras during operation Market Garden.

One morning, the major was presented with two of the recruits who were in tears, since someone had stolen their machine gun. This sort of thing happened a lot in all armies when supplies were scarce. The major asked the two boys to describe the thieves (perhaps he might be able to recover the gun).

"I remember this," said one boy. "They were wearing red berets."

Long after the war, the major recalled this incident (to Colonel R B Smith, US Army). "They were a British patrol, of course. They looked at these two young soldiers of mine, these two boys, took the machine gun and went on their way... They would not kill children who had no idea what soldiering was about."

onejayhawk
Dec 19, 2002, 07:34 PM
My favorite part of the story of the Christmas truce is the football game. Reports vary, but it is commonly held that the Germans were leading 3-2 when the ball gasped its last on some razor wire.

J

napoleon526
Dec 20, 2002, 12:37 AM
Of course, we Americans have set the opposite example, as we can see from Christmas Day, 1776 in Trenton NJ.

Crimson Sunrise
Dec 20, 2002, 12:41 AM
There was more of this kind of thing in the age of chivalry. I've even heard that Saladin and Richard Lionheart met and dined together, or some such.

gr8ful wes
Dec 20, 2002, 09:24 AM
Originally posted by napoleon526
Of course, we Americans have set the opposite example, as we can see from Christmas Day, 1776 in Trenton NJ.

Ah yes the attack on the hungover Hessians. Brilliant.

joespaniel
Dec 20, 2002, 11:12 PM
Originally posted by gr8ful wes
Ah yes the attack on the hungover Hessians. Brilliant.
Perhaps the 1944 offensive was payback. ;)