This is from the PAD1 setup (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=40604) for the warload team. The random civ turned out to be Arabia.

Warlord 4000BC Gamesave (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1_Warlord.SAV)

Arabia is Religious, Expansionist
UU: Ansar Warrior 4.2.3, 60 shields, requires iron and horses.

Remember, Padma plays the first 20 turns.

Hoo doggie! :)

- Edit:

I thought I'd post what our start looks like. :)

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1war_start.jpg

Not a bad start. Looks like we got fresh water (I checked and the coastal tile has 2 food, not 1. :) ). Looks like 2 bonus grassland as well. Padma should have fun with this location!

BoB

Each player will play 20 turns the first round, then 10 after that. The roster for the Warlord Team is as follows:

1- Padma
2 - BtB
3 - mcdan
4 - stwils
5 - kevinicus

Thanks Bob, I was going to post that. :D

And to follow up on what Chieftess just said, We don't look at the other team's game until we know the whole map, just to avoid "contamination".

00 - 4000BC: Hmm, a fresh-water lake, some forest, some bonus grasslands, as well as regular grasslands. I send the scout south, to check out the local area. I don't see anything close any better than this, so I build Mecca right where we start. Aha, we have a luxury to the east. (I don't know what it is, but I see a smiley showing through the fog.) I set research to Bronze Working, at 50% - 36 turns, +1gpt income. I send the worker to the bonus grassland to the SE. I start building another Scout.

01 - 3950BC: Worker starts a mine. Scout decides to head south some more. We see Wheat X 2, and a coast. I check F11 - we have Rome, Greece, Ottomans, Korea, and Carthage sharing our world. We'll find out who else, later. ;)

02 - 3900BC: The scout heads east along the coast, and spies a goody hut. We open it, and ... the Parthians have taught us Warrior Code!

03 - 3850BC: Exploring.

04 - 3800BC: Exploring.

05 - 3750BC: 2nd Scout built. Send him West. 1st Scout sees that our Lux is Dyes. Just one. Just because I am a worry-wart, wih Restless Barbs, I set Mecca to a Warrior.

06 - 3700BC: Exploring. (Man, I miss Industrious. That worker is taking forever to build that mine. :D )

07 - 3650BC: Mountains to the East, past some jungle. Hills, with Incense, to the East. Worker finishes Mine, starts Road.

08 - 3600BC: Exploring.

09 - 3550BC: Exploring. More Coast to the East, past the mountains. I decide to turn north. Warrior is done, start another Scout. (If Expansionist, IMO you can't have too many scouts! :D )

10 - 3500BC: Borders expand, we see a Cow to the NW, just past the border. Worker done with road, moves south to next BG. We see Wines and game to the west, another dye in the east.

11 - 3450BC: Worker starts mine. East scout follows mountain chain north, West scout keeps heading west. I bump the science slider up to 70%. Still 1 gpt, BW done in 17. (should have done that earlier.)

12 - 3400BC: East worker pops a goody hut - the Hittites teach us the Wheel! Mecca builds another Scout, I send him north, past the lake. I set for a Settler to be done as we hit size 3. West scout sees a Red border - must be Rome!

13 - 3350BC: Exploring. I decide to check on Caesar. He has the Alphabet, which I would love, but he wants both CB and the Wheel for it. Errm, not right now, Julius.

14 - 3300BC: Exploring. East scout sees a dark purple border. Not sure who that is.

15 - 3250BC: Aha! The purple border is Vikings!, and I see an orange (Ottoman) border in the west. The only tech the Vikings don't have is the Wheel, and I'm not sure I want to sell it for a mere 35g. (BTW, this map is starting to look pangea-ish.)

16 - 3200BC: I strike up a conversation with Osman, the Ottoman. He has both BW and Masonry, but he wants all three of our techs (CB, Pottery, the Wheel) for them. I'll check later, Osman. ;)

17 - 3150BC: Worker completes the mine, starts road.

18 - 3100BC: We see Spices to the east, south of the Vikings.

19 - 3050BC: We finally see horses! Way northwest of us! But then, there is a lot of fog near home, too.

20 - 3000BC: Mecca builds a Settler. After much internal debate, I decide on another scout. I send the settler east, intending to settle near the cow in the NE along the river. Worker finishes road, I send him into forest to road.

We need to bust more of the fog near Mecca. Hope we have Horses nearby! One more check with F11 - Ah, the French are the remaining Civ.

Here is the save:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1_Warlord_3000bc.zip

Here's a screenshot:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1_3000bc.jpg

Turn Order:

Padma
BtB >>> UP NOW
mcdan >>> On Deck
stwils
kevinicus

Screenshot didn't post! :(

Otherwise :goodjob: Padma. It looks like we're off to a solid start! I'll post my "got it' when I get home.

BoB

Originally posted by BoBtheBUILDER
Screenshot didn't post! :(
Are you sure?

It was there when I posted it from home last night, and I see it from work this morning. :confused:

I see it now... it was a broken link when I looked at it at the time of my earlier post. :)

Don't know why it was broken for you - I haven't changed it. FWIW, at my work I sometimes cannot see any pics from the file server. If I just wait, and check later, they come through.

I think it's just been/going to be one of those days... :smirk:

Stuff I take out of my inbox is going... right back into my inbox.

BoB

Just a few more thoughts for the next player (BoB). (If you notice the timestamp on my report, it was after midnight, so I may not have been thinking straight for my 20 turns.)

My intention with the Settler was to have him settle on the river just SW of the cow. That should give him some good production with the hills/mountains/cow, and some decent food with the grasslands. Aso good commerce along the river. I was going to send the Warrior along to guard him, but it looks like I forgot to do that.

We need to bust that fog near Mecca. I was expecting a smaller land mass, for some reason, so the scouts would normally have "doubled back" from the coasts by now. Scandinavia is expansionist too, I believe, so they may pop all the goody huts near us unless we hurry. (Scouts popping goody huts = no angry barbs popping out :D ) I also hope to find horses nearby that we can use for our UU. I would take the scout currently building to check out the areas near Mecca. Maybe even send that warrior out on a short exploratory trip before the scout gets done.

We also may want to consider taking out those vikings before they get their UU - the Berserker. But that decision is probably not going to need to be made for a while, yet.

I didn't manage to make a dot map before I fell asleep, but other good sites to consider are: in the jungle along the river between the 2 dyes to snag them, south near the 2 wheats, NW near the cow and wheat.

A suggestion for next time:

You guys will learn more if you step up a difficulty level or 2. It will at least teach you two things:
- The AI is still the AI on higher difficulty levels (i.e. not so swift) so it's not really as much harder to play on higher difficulty levels as you might think.
- Do not be afraid to be in a come-from-behind situation. Pretty much every Deity game is one until a significant ways into the Industrial age, and there are lots of Deity-capable players on the board these days -- a far cry from when I first found out about CivFanatics. Look at RBE2 for an example of what's possible. You may not be ready for that just yet, but you can certainly handle some amount of working out of a hole.

You're making it too easy on yourselves staying on Warlord. Anything up to and including Monarch is pretty easy, especially in an SG where if one player makes a mistake the next player can work to correct it. It's only once you get to Emperor that the AI bonuses start to make any sort of difference at all. Again, you'll learn more playing on a higher difficulty level, as well as improving your confidence, so stretch yourselves and take the plunge!

Zed-F: I can't really argue with you. ;)

I know I can win through Monarch, and I could probably even handle Emperor in an SG, where my mess could be cleaned up by someone else. :lol:

But knowing something in your head is not the same as knowing it in your heart, knowing it in your bones. Some of these folks don't *feel* ready to take that plunge, yet. If they want a Warlord level game, I'm willing to give them one. I do hope to step up again for my next SG, though.

The best way to get used to a cold pool is to dive in. :) Feeling you're ready is less of an indicator than actually trying it, and I'd bet that if you (collectively) did, you'd find the experience more rewarding than beating Warlord again. Even if you don't win the first time, and I expect you would, so long as you learn something, you'll be that much more ready the next time. Only if you jump so far ahead of the curve that you don't have enough basic knowledge to learn the lessons that difficulty level will teach you do you truly lose out. I doubt even Deity has that level of challenge to offer; lots of people have tried to bootstrap themselves by taking on over-challenging Epics over at RBCiv, knowing they would likely lose the first few, and collectively have acheived a pretty good success rate at improving their play, so you guys could undoubtedly do the same.

Hi Zed-f

We did win a Chieftain game. [party]

But we are still playing a Warlord game and as yet, we don't know the outcome. :scan:

We have not won it yet...

So for me, I am very happy to go forward with Warlord as I don't feel I have really mastered that level yet.

But I feel there are some on our team who could easily and successfully move up to a higher level.

stwils

Heh, our next step will be a PBEM game against each other! :)

BoB

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

stwils

stwils, I believe that you, like everyone else here, could do okay in a Regent level SG, if only because, like I said about me in an Emperor SG, the "mess can be cleaned up by somebody else. :lol:"

I almost insisted on making this Regent, but decided I wouldn't try to push people too fast or too far out of their comfort zone. Some people, who want to learn as fast as they can, do good with the "immersion" technique: dive into the deep end and struggle to sink or swim. Others would get scared off, or become frustrated and drop out. For them, a step-by-step approach works best, until one day they look around and say "Hey, we just won on Emperor! How'd we get here?" :)

:D

Padma, if you want to change us to Regent I will stick with it. I am not going to drop out.

My biggest problem (among other things :) ) is that I lack confidence after I make mistakes that penalize the whole team.

But SGs are so much more fun in every way than playing by yourself, so I will hang tough and march on - in whatever directiion the group wants.

stwils

(0) 3000 BC:
Like I said earlier it looks like Padma got us off to a good start.
After some long thinking I decide to wake up the warrior to go escort the settler.

Mecca seems to be working well, not much to check there. I leave citizens and production as is.

Adviser check:
I'm not sure if Padma was keeping up with the domestic adviser or what, but we're losing 1gpt to research at 70%. I slip the slider back down to 60% so that our budget is balanced. Bronze Working will be done in 3, rather than 2 turns.
Our military adviser says we're average against Rome and the Ottomans, but we're weak against the Vikings. Our military support costs are 2/turn (that will change once the city is founded).
Ottomans are polite, impressed with our culture, have bronze working and masonry, lack pottery and the Wheel and ceremonial burial, one incense connected, one city and 10gp
Vikings are cautious, impressed with our culture, have bronze working, lack the Wheel, have one city, one spice connected and 35gp
Romans are cautious, impressed with our culture, have bronze working and alphabet, lack the Wheel and ceremonial burial, have one city, no luxes or resources and 10 gp
Just out of curiosity, did you notice that there are no ? on the diplo adviser screen? Is this all we have then, just these three and us?
I just realized we have a monopoly on the wheel. I wonder what we can get out of this! :)
Rome will give up the Alphabet for the Wheel and 5gp. I make that trade, bringing Rome's treasury up to 15gp. Rome is still cautious though. :(
Osman will give up Masonry and 10gp for the Wheel. I make that trade as well, bankrupting Osman. Osman stays polite.
Ragnar will give up his treasury (35gp) and Bronze Working for the Wheel. Seeing the Wheel doesn't really bring them closer to their UU I trade that as well, bankrupting him and getting us to our next tech that much more quicker! ;) I hope I didn't settle too much in that exchange. Rangar goes to polite! :)
I decide to set us up with Horseback Riding so that we can build units that we can later upgrade to our UU.
That's right, I forgot that Padma already investigated who the other civs were. The Greeks, Koreans and French are on the top 5 cities screen with Osman and Caesar right now.

With nothing left to do I go on! :)

Intraturn
Nada

(1) 2950 BC:
I let our pair continue toward the grassland NE of Mecca, SW of the cattle along the river. I'm not sure if he should settle the bonus grassland or the regular grassland. I figure since we'll probably have enough production with the forests on the other side of the river and the cattle and the other BG it's okay to settle on the one BG, though it will result in wasting the forest 2 tiles E of Mecca. :(
Worker starts road on forest tile E of Mecca (to connect the two cities.
I start to bring our northern scout towards home by moving SW,S to the hill tile. He finds a nice river site.
I pop the hut on the coast with our eastern scout, the Cumans teach us Mysticism.
I move our western scout into Ottoman territory just to see if the continent kind of ends or there's more to see past his city. It looks like it pretty much ends out there. I'm going to bring him back to explore the fog SW of Mecca and S of Rome.

Adviser Check
Not a whole lot new to report here.
Rome is cautious, didn't make any gold (15), lacks Masonry and Ceremonial Burial.
Osman is polite, didn't make any gold (0), lacks Alphabet, Pottery and Ceremonial Burial. He has 1 incense connected.
Rangar is polite, didn't make any gold (0), lacks Masonry, Alphabet and Mysticism. He did found Bergen last turn for a total of 2 cities.

Intraturn
Osman is upset about our scout on his land. We tell him we'll move. He stays polite.

(2) 2900 BC:
I change our northern scout's name to North Wind. He moves W, SW and finds some flood plains along those rivers.
I change our eastern scout's name to East Wind. He moves NE,NW and finds some gold hills.
I change our western scout's name to West Wind. He moves toward the bend in the river along the south coast of the continent, SE of Istanbul.

Adviser Check
Only diplomacy to report this time around.
Rome is cautious, didn't make any gold (15), lacks Masonry and Ceremonial Burial. He has 1 city.
Osman is polite, didn't make any gold (0), lacks Alphabet, Pottery and Ceremonial Burial. He has 1 incense connected and 1 city.
Rangar is polite, didn't make any gold (0), lacks Alphabet, Masonry and Mysticism. He has 1 spice connected and 2 cities.

Intraturn
A Viking scout emerges from the fog NW of Mecca and stops two tiles W of Mecca. Bastard and a half, I didn't notice it before, but Rangar settled his city in the freakin' fog. You can just make the outline of it's cultural borders! Grr!

(3) 2850 BC:
North Wind moves S, SE to the hill to see what Rangar did and what he controls at that site. It looks like he went there for the flood plain and the incense so far. Only three tiles in the border are visible right now.
East Wind moves NW, N to the hill and fleshes out the outline of the eastern peninsula, Gold Point.

Adviser Check
Rome is off the list of the top 5 cities, they must have built a settler.
Rome... no change
Osman... no change
Ragnar... no change

Intraturn
The Viking scout skirts around our border, moving S, SE.

(4) 2800 BC:
Mecca produces scout, I change production to warrior.
I move the scout (South Wind) to the tile just north of the wheat.
North Wind moves two tiles south just to see what Bergen is sitting on. Nothing major to speak of, the flood plain in his cultural border and the incense just outside seem to be the two most remarkable features. I'm going to take a wild guess and say there's probably iron in one of the hills near Bergen.
East Wind moves NW, NW and finds wheat along the river E of Trondheim.

Adviser Check
Our new unit has us losing 1gpt. I leave things as they are since we'll be setting our new city (Medina?) next turn.
Trondheim is down to 1, I'm guessing they produced another Settler.
Nothing changes on the diplomatic front.

Intraturn
Ragnar is upset about our scout in his land and goes from polite to cautious. I tell him we'll move and he stays cautious.
The Viking scout moves SE, S.

(5) 2750 BC:
South Wind moves S, SE and discovers that the coast forms a little inlet SW of Mecca.
Medina founded 2750 BC, begins training a worker. I set the citizen to work the cattle. Warrior fortifies in Medina.
North Wind moves W, disovers nothing remarkable.

Adviser Check
We can now resarch at 100% and still break even. Not bad, eh? Horseback Riding in 19 turns now.
No change on the diplomatic front other than Ragnar going from polite to cautious because of North Wind's incursion into his territory.

Intraturn
Viking scout moves SE, S

(6) 2710 BC:
South Wind moves S, SE to the mountain and discovers that the inlet is indeed narrow... it could be blocaded very easily on only one tile! We shall call it Muhammad's Reach. South Wind names the mountain Allah's Staircase.
North Wind moves W, W and finds more horses in the plains up that way.
East Wind moves NW, NW and continues to explore the coast.
West Wind moves SE into the jungle.

Adviser Check
Istabul has dropped to two, probably a worker or settler coming out of there too.
No changes diplomatically

Intraturn
Viking scout heads E and disappears.

(7) 2670 BC:
South Wind moves along Muhammad's Neck
Worker completes road, moves NE to continue road.
East Wind moves along east coast, nothing remarkable discovered.
West Wind moves E and finds another silk source along the river.
North Wind moves NW, NW.

Adviser Check
No change on the diplo front except that I noticed just now that Osman has Ceremonial Burial (it shows him lacking Mysticism).

Intraturn
Nada

(8) 2630 BC:
Mecca trains warrior, starts warrior (if we start a settler now he'll be ready before we get to size 3).
I send warrior NW just to eliminate the fog around Bergen.
North Wind moves NW, NW.
West Wind moves N, W.
East Wind moves N, NW.
Rome founds Veii three tiles W and 1 tile NW of Rome.

Adviser Check
Rome now has a second city, Veii. No change otherwise.

Intraturn
Caesar is now annoyed because our scout is in his territory. I acquiese and he stays annoyed (man, does he hold a grudge or what?)

(9) 2590 BC:
West Wind moves SE, S along the edge of the jungle.
East Wind moves N, W and discovers Copenhagen (just founded last turn).
South Wind moves W, W. The end of Muhammad's Neck has a land bridge that causes the last tile to be a freshwater lake rather than a sea coast tile. More food! :)

Adviser Check
Whoops, skipped (hit enter by mistake. :( )

Intraturn
Nada

(10) 2550 BC:
South Wind moves S and discovers a hut.
Our exploring warrior finds another cattle tile that would be inside Bergen's cultural border should it expand. Ragnar put this town in an odd place (doesn't use both cattle tiles or the wheat tile).
East Wind moves NW.
North Wind moves N, NW.. pops a hut. The Cumans teach us writing.
West Wind moves SE, S and finds another border. I believe this will be Korean blue.
I check out embassy prices. Wacked out... 39 for Rome, 52 for Istanbul and 30 for Trondheim.
Mecca grows to 2, citizen working second roaded/mined grassland.

Adviser Check
We're now on the top 5 and it is Korea that I see.
Rome is back to cautious and lacks writing and contact with the other civs.
Osman lacks contact with the other civs.
Ragnar lacks contact with the other civs.

Intraturn
Nada

(11) 2510 BC:
Mecca builds warrior, changes production to spearman.
Warrior fortifies in Mecca.
Exploring warrior heads N
South Wind moves W, pops hut and gets a map from the Sandabar tribe. That'll save some time! :)
West Wind moves SE, S and observes Korean worker. It costs 39gp to build an embassy in Seoul.
North Wind moves N, N.

Adviser Check
Rome has hooked up 1 source of Gems. Other than that there's no change.
No change with Osman.
Wang is polite, is outnumbered by our forces, is impressed with our culture, has 1 city and 1 source of ivory and 10gp, lacks Masonry and Pottery and Ceremonial Burial and Writing and contact with the other civs.
No change with Ragnar.

Intraturn
Ragnar goes from cautious to annoyed because our scout is in his territory. We pledge to move him. No change in attitude.
Wang goes from polite to cautious because our scout is in his territory. We pldge to move him. No change in attitude.
South Wind observes Korea's first settler leave Seoul and head W.

(12) 2670 BC:
West Wind heads S, W. He finds horses near Seoul.
South Wind heads NW, W.
Exploring warrior heads N.
East Wind moves W, N and finds horses inside Copenhagen's cultural border.
North Wind moves N and finds northern coastline.
Medina grows, works forest tile on river NW of town.

Adviser Check
We now have a strong military compared to every except the Vikings, against whom it is average.
Osman has an additional incense connected.

Intraturn
Settler heads W of Seoul.

(13) 2430 BC:
Medina completes worker, begins settler
Worker moves NE, begins irrigation on cattle
Exploring warrior moves north, elimnates all fog north of Mecca.
Scouting parties contine their missions

Adviser Check
I dial back the science slider to 80% because the worker from Medina puts us over our unit allowance. We break even at 80% with Horseback Riding coming in 10 turns.
No changes with our diplomacy.
I will say this, Ragnar certainly has his act together for an AI civ. I'm fairly certain we'll see his fourth city poppingout of the fog any day now.

Intraturn
Nada

(14) 2390 BC:
Worker completes road in forest, moves E to continue road (I know that it's not in the cultural border yet, but I want the city connected. It would take forever to build that road through the forest).
Exploring warrior moves S.

Adviser Check
No changes.

Intraturn
Viking scout shows up, then disappears into the fog.

(15) 2350 BC:
Mecca trains spearman, begins settler.
I fortify the spearman, wake up the warrior and send him to dispel the fog to the SE.
Exploring warrior moves S.
South Wind pops a hut between Rome and Seoul. We get 25gp from the Assiyrian village.

Adviser Check
The spearman puts us over on unit costs again so I dial back to 70% with horseback riding in 10 turns.
Ooh... Rome has Iron Working! That could make things interesting. He definately wants contacts of some sort for it. That or three techs. Maybe he'll change his tune if I open an embassy there...
Wang is taking his sweet time deciding on a city location.
I decide to open an embassy in Rome for 40gp. He has 9 fpt and 3spt, he hasn't built any improvements in Rome. He does have a lot of flood plains available to him, but isn't making much use of them. He has one irrigated and he is using two unimproved bonus grasslands for his other citizens. Whatever, let's see if he'll play ball now. :)
Rome is polite now! :) Still an awful deal... he wants contact with another civ (which I don't think we should trade at all) and Masonry or Masonry, CB and 20gp. I decide that I'll wait till someone discovers it and it's a bit cheaper.
Otherwise no changes in diplomacy.

Intraturn
That viking scout shows up again on the mountains SE of our settled lands.

(16) 2310 BC:
Exploring warrior fortifies outside Bergen
East Wind continues to explore the north coast.
North Wind moves toward a hut he discovered.
South Wind discovers another horse tile, this one is on our side of Seoul's cutlure border.

Adviser Check
Still no changes on the diplomatic front.

Intraturn
Viking scout heads NE.

(17) 2270 BC:
Wang founds his second city on the coast. Lots of jungle and flood plains, but he'll get the horse when his borders expand.
North Wind gets 25gp from hut.

Adviser Check
It seems like everyone's on a flood plain but us... dang you Strider! ;)
The Ottomans have founded Edrine and have discovered Masonry.
The Koreans have founded P'yongyang.
No other changes

Intraturn
Viking scout heads east

(18) 2230 BC:
Worker completes irrigation and begins road to cattle.
Worker completes road across river and moves toward 2 tiles NE of Mecca to build road.
Southern exploring warrior moves SE.

Adviser Check
Osman hooked up another source of incense, bringing him to 3 total.
Ragnar has Iron Working now as well, so now either will part for a single tech. Rome will give me IW and 15gp for Masonry, which I think is a steal, so I go for it.
I decide to build an embassy in Trondheim for 31gp. Nothing particularly special about Trondheim, though there are three sources of spices nearby. So not only does every civ have a flood plain to work with but us... they all have luxes to use immediately. Oh, and for good measure? No Iron anywhere near us. We're just going to have to build up and take out the Vikings... they have both items we need (horses and iron) and they're the leader of the known world so far.

Intraturn
nada

(19) 2190 BC:
Crap... North Wind runs right into a barb camp. :(

Adviser Check
Osman has IW now too.

Intraturn
The barbs kill North Wind :(

(20) 2150 BC:
Well, not much else happened. Losing our scout reduced our unit support cost and Mecca's growth to size three gave our gpt a boost. You may want to change the slider to get Horseback Riding sooner.

Summary
Lots of exploration and a decisive tech lead has really gotten us nowhere. We're about even for expansion, though the Vikings are kicking but in that department. The biggest news is that we have no early strategic resources. We're going to have to have an early conflict no matter what. I would suggest building tons of archers and taking out Trondheim, getting Bergen as a peace settlement, then waiting 20 turns and take out the rest of the civ. Otherwise we're dead meat... it's only a matter of time before the Romans decide to come after us with their legionairy. :(

Here are some maps:
Our land -
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1a_arab.jpg

The Vikings home -
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1a_scan.jpg

The rest of the known world:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1a_west.jpg

Here's the save:
Abu Bakar of the Arabs, 2150 BC (http://www.civfantaics.net/uploads3/PAD1a_bc2150.zip)

Dotmap proposal:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1a_dot1.jpg

BoB

We need to pause a moment and discuss before mcdan takes this for his turns. Chieftess and I are talking about changing the "20 turns for the first round" rule.

I'll comment on your round in a bit, BoB. FWIW, I don't see anything particulalry "weedy" there. :D

We are now going to use a "stepdown" approach to the individual turn length. mcdan will play 15 turns, and everyone after will play 10. Chieftess and I decided that this will let everyone get a bit more playing time in the different ages, now that the initial "Hit Enter, and wait" phase is done.

BoB, I didn't see any particular :smoke: in your turns. Actually, you caught me on not paying attention to domestic. ;) (Hey, I said it was past midnight when I played.) Our GPT went negative because we had just built the settler, and I didn't notice it until I posted the screenshot. :crazyeye:

Your dotmap looks pretty good, using Optimal City Spacing. We might want to consider spacing them a bit closer though, since no city will be over Size 12 in a loooong time. Besides, on a Standard Map, the OCN is 16, and we will get the option to build the FP after only 8 cities. If we use a tighter build around our capital, they will be less corrupt. Just a thought.

Another thought about taking out the Scandinavians: their UU, the Berserker, is *tough*. We want to at least knock them well down before they can build it. I think I'd rather face a Legionary than a Berserker. ;)

@mcdan: you "got your ears on"? If you don't respond soon we'll have to skip you and continue with the rotation.

What's the best way to handle our resource scarcity?

"ears on" :) and "got it"

trying to download Bob's turn but cannot get it to work - I think it is my server. Will try again in a bit.

I'm having the same trouble... I can't download it from the link (page not available error), but if I go to the downloads folder and try it from there it works fine (even though the link points right to it?!?!?!?!?!).

Here's a second try, if this doesn't work go directly to the folder and download PAD1a_bc2150.zip

Second try (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1a_bc2150.zip)

Sorry bout that! :(

BoB

BoB, the second one works fine. In the first, you mispelled "civfanatics". ;)

now have "got it" - thanks for the download :)

t00t t00t. Forgot I was in this. Luckily my turn wasn't even close. I will investigate our status and more later :)

Originally posted by Padma
BoB, the second one works fine. In the first, you mispelled "civfanatics". ;)

Doh!!! :homer:

BoB

20-6... Nip and tuck there for a while guys, and I'm sorry we had to play you, but either way I was in trouble (my brother in law is a huge 49ers fan). :)

You guys played great and if the game wasn't in Philly I don't know if we pull it out.

BoB

Originally posted by BoBtheBUILDER
20-6... Nip and tuck there for a while guys, and I'm sorry we had to play you, but either way I was in trouble (my brother in law is a huge 49ers fan). :)

You guys played great and if the game wasn't in Philly I don't know if we pull it out.

BoB

It was a great game - a reason I didn't post last night as planned ;) - kept us watching until the middle of the fourth when we finally had to admit it was over. Great defense by you guys - hands down you guys had us this time.

Ok - now to post :)

PRETURN: 2150 BC

Strategy Plan - 1. Build more settlers and begin new towns in close proximity to current towns. (See Bob's Dot Map and Padma's comments). 2. Devise plan to get more resources - will this mean taking out another civ - most likely - but not immediately- resource plan is vital. Colonies are a possibility to harvest them but I have never had much lasting luck with colonies - rather settle/road/(attack) instead if location is right. 3. Take or be Taken. Who to take out??? Rome or Vikings - liked the idea of taking on the VIkings until I read Padma's comment on the Beserks - yikes - didn't know their power - manual says they have replaced the longbowman (4/1/1) which the B's outclass by 50% - super at offense - and as a side note are also an amphibious unit. Legionary is 3/3/1. I can see how Rome would be easier to take. Wonder if we could use the same tactic - take one city and get peace settlement for other. Will see how things develop. 4. Build more military. 5. Keep those Winds exploring.

Currently our forces outnumber Rome. :thumbsup: We are outnumbered by the Vikings. :(

Civs Check:

Rome: 0 gold, Veii as second city, no extra luxs. Advisor says: Roman scientists are not veryadvanced, they have the warrior, impressed with our culture and our tech advances. Fear our spearman. OUr forces outnumber them. Polite.

Ottomans: 0 gold. Edrine as second city, 2 extra incense luxs. Impr. with our culture and our tech advances, fear our spearman, our forces out number them. Their scientists are not very advanced. Osman is polite.

Korea: 10 gold. Pyongyang as second city. No extra luxs - has ivory for self. Their scientists are not very advances and they see that we are, WE are impressed with their culture and they are impressed with ours, they have warriror and fear our spearman. Our forces outnumber theirs.
Wang Kon is polite.

Scandinavia: 0 gold. Bergen and Copenhagen.No extra luxs - have spices for selves. Their scientists are not very advanced, We are impressed with thier culture and they ours, they have spearman and fear our spearman. We are tech advanced. Their forces outnumber ours. Ragnar is polite.

Advisor Check:

Domestic: Play with slider - keep at 70% - 3 pgt and Horse- Riding in 3 turns. Citizens in Mecca and Medina are content.
Trade: Well, as we know - no resources and luxs - augh!
Military: Parthian trides near Mecca. Need more gold for milit. We have a strong military compared to the Parthians.
Culture: Time for temples.
Science Ad - coming up soon is the choice of Monarchy or Republic. Literarture for librarys or Map making for exploration and hopefully trade, or other choices. Sceince Ad notes the good funding it has - this may soon change but for now will get Horse-riding in 3 turns.

Demos:
Top 5 cities - Mecca makes it - as well as Seoul, Athens, Istanbul and Paris. We rank 7th in approval rating and annual income. 5th in land area at 3100 sq miles and #1 in population, life expect., productivity, and literacy.
World Ranking - Vikings have us beat - in second place at a tie are Rome and ourselves. Closely after that follows Korea and Ottomans.

City Checks:
Mecca: Settler in 1, growth in 10. Garrisoned spearman. P5/F8/C7 (prod, food, comm). Lots of forest and a worker roading for 6 turns - gotta connect to Medina.

Medina: Settler in 7, growth in 6. Garrisoned warrior. P4/F7/C4. Worker building road to complete in one turn.

Embassies: Rome and Trondheim

End of Preturn: 2150 BC, 58 g, +2 pt, Horseback riding in 3t.

Intraturn: Korea wants us off their property. We say sure. Korea is now cautious.
Mecca builds settler. Settler will move NE to tiles between two current cities - will get wheat and good bonus grassland with some desert. Considered coast - but decided for this settler to go north and get our tiles claimed as we see the Vikings growing. Next settler will go South.
Mecca set for Archer to begin Military expansion. Have one settler about to be on the move and another soon to be produced. Want to produce two towns and increase milit.

Turn One: 2110 BC, 60 g, +0 pt, HBR in 2.
Time to check out the slider. Move it around - 60% at 2 gpt with HBR in 3
Move settler one tile to East planning to build city - see Intraturn above.
Worker in Mecca set to irrigate bonus grassland tile. Then will build road.
Warrior moves N to Settler
Worker in Medina irrigates for 4 turns
South and West winds head south - oops out of the fog comes a stack of Yu-Chi Warriors ready for South Wind. East continues NE.

Civ Check: Rome, Ottomans and Koreans have not changed. Vikings are up 25 g now.

Note: We are out of the top 5 cities - we did just produce settler in Mecca

Intraturn:
Ouch - Yu-CHi Warrior does in our West Wind. South Wind will contiue South on his own.

TURN 3: 2030 BC, 65 g, +3 pt, HBR in one
Warrior and Settler move NW
East Wind going NW still closing on in examining Roman territory

Advisors: I keep slider at 60%

Intraturn:
Horseback Riding is complete. Now where to go? Look around - decide on Map Making so we can explore.

TURN 4: 1990 BC, 68 g, +3 pt

South Wind moving south finds Goodie Hut - here's hoping...
Settler and Warrior move NW

City checks - no change

Intraturn:
Rome asks that our East Wind move out of his land. We say sorry.

TURN 5: 1950 BC, 71 g, +4 pt, MM in 39

Goodie Hut is deserted - augh!
Settle Damascus
East Wind goes West but still in Roman territory

Intraturn:
Romans on the move towards East Wind - thought I had one more turn to get out of territory.
Settler completed in Medina and moves NW

TURN 6: 1910 BC, 75 G, +3 pt, MM in 38

Medina worker builds road in same irrigated tile in NW.
East Wind runs! Escapes from Romans
Mecca worker completes a roaded tile, moves to build road on a 2-food tile instead of clearing forest on a 0 food tile.
South Wind on the move as well

Advisor Check:
Domestic - can now move the slider way down - get more gpt and still not lose any turns to get Map Making. Slider is set at 20% with a +6 gpt.

Civs: No change in Vikings, Romans. Osman has more incense now. Korean has workers to trade now.

Let's meet Alex the Great - Greece. (Exposed by Wind - I almost missed this.) He is cautious - they say we are advanced and they fear our spearman. Military is about same size. Scientists not advanced. They are impressed with our culture. They have the warrior.

He has 35 g, no extra luxs - but has Ivory for self, cities: Sparta.

We are not in the top 5 - all cities are back to 1

Intraturn:

2 Sarbadar warriors move in on our moving new settler.

TURN SEVEN:
1870 BC, 81 g, +6 pt, MM in 37
Worker building road
Settler moves away from warriors and towards it's destination
East Wind still running from pursuing Romans
South Wind noses around Greece

Intraturn:
D*#@! - worker knocked off by barbarians in Medina - Medina is protected by only one warrior and two are headed towards him

TURN EIGHT:
1830 BC, 87 G, +6 pt, MM in 36

Archer is completed in Mecca. Set for Barracks.
Augh - settler moves NW - runs into Viking warrior
Winds move W

City checks/ Advisor Checks:
slider is fine
cities fine except need workers, military and a few things like granaries and temples...^%$&%^

Intraturn:

Barbarians destroy our road and irrigation by Medina.
But at least the Viking warrior retreats from the settler
Yet another Barbarian is now blocking East Wind from exploring fog. East wind will see what is near Rome for now.

TURN NINE:
1790 BC. 93 g, +6 pt,

Ah - more resources are revealed by East Wind - near Rome
South Wind moves W
Settler moves one tile NW
Warrior closes in on Domascus to help protect it.

intraturn:

Greece is getting ready to settle I think - settler running in the SW
Viking Warrior moves back N

Slider: Move slider to 10% - get +8 gpt and still MM in 34
Still no resources
Rome has a third city - Antium
Osman has new city - Edrine
No other changes in civs
Considering Embassy in Greece.
Done for 45 g.

Greece Info: In Athens - 2 warriors garrisoned and a Hoplite on its way in 6 turns. No improvements beyond Palace, Ivory is its one lux, 35 g, culture is 2 pt expanding in 10, pop 13,000 approx, currently prodcution 3/ food 4/ commerce 5. Others resources but no roads.

TURN 10:

1750 BC, 54 g, +8 pt

Turn 10 - 15 - to post in a.m. (gotta sleep - 1 am ...) Post to be completed in morning. Thanks.

TURN 10:

1750 BC, 54 g, +8 pt

Move settler to final tile to settle in next turn - also moving in are warrior and worker - can see Viking warrior on tile again next to settler. He is always hovering :viking:
Warrior takes it's fortified place in Damascus
East Wind discovers more resources near Rome in mt's
South Wind sees settler - fortifies in its location to hold island location - not that it is great - or a true choke hold - tundra and looks like an island although there still is fog.

Intraturn:
Barbs appear everywhere and stack - augh :cry: - I need to understand more about how to handle barbs. I know if I attack and win - get to be elite - BUT they are stacked and also they are going after the winds. East Wind who had just escaped the Romans is now up against two barbs. Doesn't look good.

TURN 11:
1725 BC, 62 g, +9 pt, MM in 33
East Wind runs - would like to save him to scout out other lands after we get MM and galley etc.
Baghdad is founded - warrior moves onto tile to fortify, Worker builds road. Set for Temple in 15 turns.

Slider check - stays at 10% - can go all the way to 50% and still MM in 33 but 10% gives +9 gpt

Greece- no change
Vikings- no change
Rome - workers added
(Look to see what Rome is after - as what they would trade for workers - they ask for contact with Vikings and CB - we say no thanks.)
Osman- no change
Korea - 5 g

Mecca is back in top 5 cities

In Histograph - Rome has pulled slightly ahead of us and Vikings are still out in front

Change from archer to worker in Medina in one turn then will go back to archer in four. No shield loss to do this.

Intraturn: Viking warrior moves away, Settler in Greece just moves around scout - so much for semi-choke theory.

TURN 12:
1700 BC, 71 g, +9 pt, MM in 32
Worker completed in Medina and archer begun - need more military. Need Need Need everything.
Medina worker moves to bouns grassland tile
East Wind moves N away from conflict and towards fog

intraturn:
two barbs attack worker near Baghdad - damn I cannot seem to prepare my people for barbs. Help! :help:

TURN 13:
1675 BC, 80 g, +8 pt, MM in 31

Worker sees barb in tile near him in Medina - well - this worker wants to flee but he stays put as warrior from Medina moves to attack barb - this cannot continue. :rant:
Move citizen off cattle tile - with all that food - and move to increase production - thus getting the archer more quickly.

Attack the barbs! :mad:
Kill two in Baghdad - our warrior becomes Veteran I was wrong about Elite but hey - two down and a veteran - will take it!
TPLY :party: - glad someone is happy ;)
Kill barb in Medina - but he kills our worker first.
Workers - cannot grow without them - and not willing to trade Rome for them - so change production from Temple to worker in Baghdad.
Greece settles in South near South Wind.

Intraturn:
Greece asks us to move. :rolleyes: New city is Thermaoplae.

TURN 14:
1625 BC, 96 G, +8 pt, MM in 31

Damascus completes archer. Set for Worker. Then it will be time to get settlers again too. And more archers. Need to focus on granary etc but am not.

Slider check : MM in 29 no matter 10% to 100% so stays at 10% with +8 g pt

Intraturn:
Barb moves towards Mecca but we are ready with a warrior and archer

TURN 15:
1600 BC, 104 g, +8 pt, MM 28
East Wind moves NW
Military is fotified in all cities

Civ Check: Greece has worker
They want contact with Rome to trade. We say no. No need to trade contact with other civs yet.
(Same goes for Korea - wants contact with Rome for workers - no we say.)
No other changes

Slider: Slider still at 10% - still 28 turns all the way to 100% so why not get the gold.

Here's the save:

TURN 10:

1750 BC, 54 g, +8 pt

Move settler to final tile to settle in next turn - also moving in are warrior and worker - can see Viking warrior on tile again next to settler. He is always hovering :viking:
Warrior takes it's fortified place in Damascus
East Wind discovers more resources near Rome in mt's
South Wind sees settler - fortifies in its location to hold island location - not that it is great - or a true choke hold - tundra and looks like an island although there still is fog.

Intraturn:
Barbs appear everywhere and stack - augh :cry: - I need to understand more about how to handle barbs. I know if I attack and win - get to be elite - BUT they are stacked and also they are going after the winds. East Wind who had just escaped the Romans is now up against two barbs. Doesn't look good.

TURN 11:
1725 BC, 62 g, +9 pt, MM in 33
East Wind runs - would like to save him to scout out other lands after we get MM and galley etc.
Baghdad is founded - warrior moves onto tile to fortify, Worker builds road. Set for Temple in 15 turns.

Slider check - stays at 10% - can go all the way to 50% and still MM in 33 but 10% gives +9 gpt

Greece- no change
Vikings- no change
Rome - workers added
(Look to see what Rome is after - as what they would trade for workers - they ask for contact with Vikings and CB - we say no thanks.)
Osman- no change
Korea - 5 g

Mecca is back in top 5 cities

In Histograph - Rome has pulled slightly ahead of us and Vikings are still out in front

Change from archer to worker in Medina in one turn then will go back to archer in four. No shield loss to do this.

Intraturn: Viking warrior moves away, Settler in Greece just moves around scout - so much for semi-choke theory.

TURN 12:
1700 BC, 71 g, +9 pt, MM in 32
Worker completed in Medina and archer begun - need more military. Need Need Need everything.
Medina worker moves to bouns grassland tile
East Wind moves N away from conflict and towards fog

intraturn:
two barbs attack worker near Baghdad - damn I cannot seem to prepare my people for barbs. Help! :help:

TURN 13:
1675 BC, 80 g, +8 pt, MM in 31

Worker sees barb in tile near him in Medina - well - this worker wants to flee but he stays put as warrior from Medina moves to attack barb - this cannot continue. :rant:
Move citizen off cattle tile - with all that food - and move to increase production - thus getting the archer more quickly.

Attack the barbs! :mad:
Kill two in Baghdad - our warrior becomes Veteran I was wrong about Elite but hey - two down and a veteran - will take it!
TPLY :party: - glad someone is happy ;)
Kill barb in Medina - but he kills our worker first.
Workers - cannot grow without them - and not willing to trade Rome for them - so change production from Temple to worker in Baghdad.
Greece settles in South near South Wind.

Intraturn:
Greece asks us to move. :rolleyes: New city is Thermaoplae.

TURN 14:
1625 BC, 96 G, +8 pt, MM in 31

Damascus completes archer. Set for Worker. Then it will be time to get settlers again too. And more archers. Need to focus on granary etc but am not.

Slider check : MM in 29 no matter 10% to 100% so stays at 10% with +8 g pt

Intraturn:
Barb moves towards Mecca but we are ready with a warrior and archer

TURN 15:
1600 BC, 104 g, +8 pt, MM 28
East Wind moves NW
Military is fotified in all cities

Civ Check: Greece has worker
They want contact with Rome to trade. We say no. No need to trade contact with other civs yet.
(Same goes for Korea - wants contact with Rome for workers - no we say.)
No other changes

Slider: Slider still at 10% - still 28 turns all the way to 100% so why not get the gold.

Final comments: game did not go as planned at all. Barbs did me in and I hope the game will be OK -
did achieve some of the goals:
2 new cities
stacking milt. in cities - archers and spearmen as well as the warrior
some exploration but not much
wanted more archers and city improvements. Instead had to go backwards and rebuild up workers. No resources still. Not able to trade for them and we are not ready to attack for them.
Let me get this save done and I will post a few more comments.

Here's the save:http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/Abu_Bakr_of_the_Arabs,_1600_BC.SAV

Hi all,

I'm back home and in checking on Civ. Fanatics I found something new you might enjoy.

Go to the Civ Fanatics Center. On the left under Civ3 find "reference." Click on it and under General Reference you will see that Lone Wolf has updated his wonderful, colorful "complete reference file" now for PTW.

It prints out to 16 pages.

Go see!

stwils

Not bad all in all mcdan! I think you did a good job exploring and it sounds like your city-building strategy is sound (I haven't looked at the save yet).

One question about the military buildup... why did you choose archers as your military unit to build? Was it because they are available more quickly than horsemen? In this game I would favor horsemen over archers primarily because there's a great deal of room between us and the other civs and because horsemen are upgradeable to our UU, so every horseman you train is one less knight we'll have to train down the road.

I don't know what to tell you about the barbs... I didn't see a single barb near us and didn't see many period. I'm wondering if one of the other civs could possibly have reached the next tech age (isn't that when the uprisings are tripped Padma?). That seems awfully soon for such a development, especially when you consider that we're ahead of everyone else on tech on our continent.

I'll probably have more once I see the save.

BoB

Originally posted by BoBtheBUILDER

One question about the military buildup... why did you choose archers as your military unit to build? Was it because they are available more quickly than horsemen?
BoB

yes - only spearmen and archers were available - tried to get a mix of these - agreed about horsemen and future upgrades.

Thanks for the vote of confidence - will wait til you see the save ;)

(Home now from inaugural festivites for our first Rep gov in 130 years!)

mcd...

I am such an IDIOT... we don't have horses! How can we build horsemen without horses? Please ignore my random ramblings! :)

BTW, I hope you enjoyed the festivities. We've got a big city council race/mayoral race this year in Fort Wayne (all nine council seats and the mayors office are up for grabs at the same time every year - don't ask me who comes up with this stuff... if the council is supposed to be a check on the mayor, why elect them all at the same time?!?!?) so I am starting to get geared up for that. :)

BoB

Still not my turn :o

Hi Kevinicus,

If it is all right with Padma and all, let's you and me swap this round. I am having to use my laptop now, and hopefully by the weekend I'll be able to use my desktop.

So you go next after all the comments for the last game, and then I will go after you.

Is that all right with everyone?

stwils

It's fine by me. :)

I haven't looked at the save yet, myself. RL is still quite busy.
Originally posted by BoBtheBUILDER
I don't know what to tell you about the barbs... I didn't see a single barb near us and didn't see many period. I'm wondering if one of the other civs could possibly have reached the next tech age (isn't that when the uprisings are tripped Padma?). That seems awfully soon for such a development, especially when you consider that we're ahead of everyone else on tech on our continent.Uprisings occur when the 2nd civ reaches the next age. I agree that it seems awfully early for this to happen, when we appear to be the tech leader, and we aren't there yet. It could just be the difference between "Roaming" Barbs and "Restless" ones, plus the smarter Barb AI in PTW.

Oh so me before stwils? Well then I will start Wednesday cuz it's 11pm right now :D
Thanks :)

Yup, it's getting a bit late in bella Roma. ;)

You can play while I am sleeping, or having my morning coffee. :D

Here's the current lineup:

Padma
BtB
mcdan
kevinicus >>> UP NOW
stwils >>> On Deck

1575-Barracks finished in Mecca, changed em to Settler, you can't expand enough. Can you?
1550-Scout killed by unforseen Barbarian :(
1525-Worker made in Baghdad and went down one square to connect with Mecca.
1500- Scandinavia demand contact with Romans for nothing...I give it to them. :crazyeye:
Cultural points for Mecca, borders expand. Demascus finishes a worker, started a granary and send worker from Demascus East to connect to Mecca. Baghdad worker starts road, down in 3 rounds.
1475- Demascus worker starts road and will be done in 6 turns due to a forest.
1450- Medina finishes an Archer and started barracks. Are we planning to attack someone??? Or we trying to get barbs?
1425- Baghdad is now connected to Mecca, Baghdad worker will connect the wheat to Baghdad and the settler built in Mecca will get 2 other wheat fields in the south.
1400- Building Granary in Mecca and Baghdad...
1375- Road finished to wheat fields near Baghdad.
1350-Two warriors attack Damascus, defended effectively by a warrior.
1325- Najran founded south of Mecca and starts worker.
1300- Archer kills Barbarian and worker is almost finished with the road from Demascus to Mecca.
1275- Archer kills Barbarian.
1250- Archer kills another Barbarian and becoems veteran.
1225- Barbarian hut captured and got 25 gold.
1200- Palace expansion!
1175- Ah, moved the archer...Big whoop :p
1150- Demascus is now connected to Mecca.
1125- Started a worker in Medina, barracks are finished there.
1100- Moved archer

*censored*
save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/Abu_Bakr_of_the_Arabs,_1600BC.sav)

Two things I see immediately on reviewing your turn.

1) Apparently you missed my post before mcdans's turn: We are now going to use a "stepdown" approach to the individual turn length. mcdan will play 15 turns, and everyone after will play 10. Chieftess and I decided that this will let everyone get a bit more playing time in the different ages, now that the initial "Hit Enter, and wait" phase is done.You should have only played 10 turns. ;)

2) Originally posted by Kevinicus
After my turn I decided to keep on playing. I succeeded on becoming number 1 in the histograph and got 222 points at the end of my turn in the year 410 AD. :aargh: :nono:

When playing a SG, one does not play beyond the end of his/her turn! (At least, don't talk about it!) You now know things abouth the map, and possible interactions with the AI that we don't. It is quite unfair to the next player(s), as they will be "replaying" the save. It is similar to the "no reloads" restriction in place for SGs. It puts you in a position to say,"Hey, do this, don't do that," because you have fore-knowledge of the game. Some would consider it grounds for kicking you from the game! Right now, I only hope that by the time the turns get around to you again, the situation will be totally different from what it was when you played.

Fixed it :)
Sorry about the 20 turn thing :o

Thanks, Kevinicus. :)

BTW, Kevinicus, I haven't been able to download the save to check (I'm at work), but the *name* of the save you linked to is the 1600BC save from mcdan.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Kevinicus

1450- Medina finishes an Archer and started barracks. Are we planning to attack someone??? Or we trying to get barbs?

Earlier the plan had been considered to go after Rome - not Vikings - so building up military was key - then the barbs got in on the action.


\1300- Archer kills Barbarian and worker is almost finished with the road from Demascus to Mecca.
1275- Archer kills Barbarian.
1250- Archer kills another Barbarian and becoems veteran.
1225- Barbarian hut captured and got 25 gold.

get those barbs!!! :goodjob:

Haven't seen the save yet - but good to see workers being popped since so many were killed during the previous turns. :)

What about giving Vikings contact with Rome? Just interested in tactics on this one. I might have cleared the table and played a bit just to see but sometimes when the AI makes a demand - that is not an option.

What's our plan now? Any ideas? I'll post more after the save.

p.s. Bob- 9 council seats and the mayor - at the same time !!! :rolleyes:

This looks fun (I'm playing at warlord myself), bad that I dosen't got PTW and the game at an PC with internet coonection (I am at my parents PC)

Good luck :)

Tell me about it mcdan... stupid stupid stupid... just to mess with the folks at the election board I asked what happens if the third-highest and fourth-highest votegetters in the council's at-large race (three seats are up) tie. She said that she prays every four years that it doesn't happen, because she has no idea what would happen. :)

BoB

Caliph Abu Bakr (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/Abu_Bakr_of_the_Arabs,_1100_v.Chr..SAV)
There we go :goodjob:

Hellooooo?!

Stwils? Are you here? :)

This isn't a Training Day Game, so you are free to just pick up the game and go, you know. (Just let us know that you "got it". ;) )

And mcdan was going to discuss some more when the save was posted, etc. etc. :lol:

Comments and random thoughts:

Thanks for updating the post Kevinicus :) Didn't see that until just now - mcdan asleep at the civ wheel :rolleyes:

Good lookin' cluster of 5 cities. In the next ten turns we will have 3 granarys and two more workers. (In the next 3 turns - get the two workers and one of the gran's - good to see the workers alive and well :)) Then perhaps it is time for one more settler? Lots of resources/lux in the East which the Vikings could go for soon if we don't.

Maybe then we can look to a temple or a early wonder - and barracks since we are definately going to have face some battles in the future. Military is growing but still needs to continue if we want to take out Rome. Greece might be a possiblity as well - their towns are young - not sure how that works if we take them out first in regard to our relations with other civs. No battle lines have been drawn yet. We need to consider who we might like as allies. Vikings are still in first place in the historgraph and we again are tied with Rome for second.

We have a good amount of gold - embassies - rush a few things if needed.

Now might be a good time to get embassies in Korea and Ottomans. Wish we could get galleys - but not yet - MM due in 8 turns though!

Have fun stwils - hope the venetian blinds are gone! :scan:

I got it! Busy weekend but should be able to get this done.

Yes, mcdan, the venetian blinds are gone. And as of yesterday a
Dell technician installed a new driver so that I am no longer stuck at 400X600 resolution.

So now I can use my desktop for playing Civ!!!!!

stwils

Good for you, stwils! Glad you don't have to peer through the venetian blinds anymore! :lol:

(You think you have a busy weekend - look at my post in the OT "Weekend Plans?" thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=714303#post714303).)

:D

Now THAT is a busy weekend! But, Padma, it does sound like fun.

Some of my "busy weekend" stuff is semi dreary. :(

stwils

A few thoughts...

In cycling through our 5 cities, I see we have NO luxeries and NO strategic resources. And we need horses in the worst way.

The only improvements so far (besides Palace) are Barracks in two cities.

We are currently building granaries and workers.

The Ottomans are building the Oracle. That's one wonder I had thought about for us since we are Religious as well as Expansive. And the Greeks are building the Pyramids.

In looking at the map there is the most delicious plot of land to the east, just south of the Vikings. A horse! and spices and gold. But it would take any settler we built forever to get over there to found a city, and by then the Vikings will have expanded their borders. Also it would not be connected to any of our cities. So (sigh) I'll not go for it with a settler.

My thoughts now are to go on with building the workers (one for 3 turns, one for 1) and perhaps keep the three granary productions going. Then build up our military.

We’ve got to have those resources, and so far we can’t trade for them. Maybe attacking that SE city of the Vikings would be one way. Our archers are strong on attack, and their UU is not strong on defence.

We need temples and I really would like to race to get the Oracle. What do you think?

Give me your thoughts before I go forward.

stwils

Quick correction. I was wrong about the Berserk being weak on defence against our archer's attack. Archer is 2/1/1 and (good grief) the Berserk is 6/2/1. I don't know what I was looking at.

However, I doubt if the Vikings have the Berserk yet as they first must get Invention. All the more reason for us to get rid of them before they get Berserks.

stwils

Right. If we're going to get rid of the Vikings, we need to do it early, before they get Invention and Berserkers.

Either that, or stay on their good side! :eek:

Always choices and decisions. ;)

stwils

Preturn
Set Damascus from granary to Oracle
Change Baghdad from granary to Barracks

Enter*
Najran gets worker/ set to archer

Turn#1 1075 bc
Najran worker goes to wheat
Worker moves from Baghdad to construct road joining to Damascus
Archer in Medina kills barb

Enter*
Mecca gets Spearman/ set archer
Baghdad gets barracks/ set archer

Turn# 2 1050 bc
worker roads, and is joined by another to road
Set archer in Najran to Sentry
worker mines wheat
Medina archer moves toward Barb

Enter*
Medina archer kills barb

Turn# 3 1025 bc
Medina worker mines cow
Archer returns to city
worker roads
Najran archer kills barb

Enter*

Turn #4 1000bc
our archer outside Najran kills another barb but is wounded
Medina archer is sentried
worker mines cow (I thought he was already doing that. ???)

Turn# 5 975
our wounded archer comes home to Najran to heal
we get map making in 3 turns

Enter*
Damn barb horseman kills our worker in Medina

Turn #6 950 bc
2 workers finish road
Moved each a different way and both messed up :(
Medina archer kills barb horseman
Wounded archer in Najran waits for healing

Turn #7 925 bc
Najran archer still not heal (Why not?)

Enter*
We get Map Making/ set for Code of Laws (on our way for Republic)
Bagdad archer kills barb

Turn #8 900 bc
various

Enter*
Ackkkk. Worker in Damascus destroyed by barb horseman

Turn #9 875bc
Sentry archer in Najran
I wake up archer in Damascus and he kills barb horseman. (now is elite or veteran - not sure)

Enter*
Greece says move scout out
We trade territory maps with them (and 25 gold.)

Turn #10 850 bc
Poor South Wind. He is at the jumping off place outside Thermopolie. There is nothing to do but fortify him

Save will follow.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/Abu_Bakr_of_the_Arabs,_850_BC.SAV

The save

stwils

BUMP!

Where is everybody?

stwils:confused:

Sorry, I've been MIA (at inlaws) all weekend (Monday was a federal holiday) so I'm just back in now... haven't had a chance to view the save, sorry! :(

I'll take a look at it tonight. :)

Outside of some barbarian activity it sounds like your turns went well! :goodjob:

BoB

Got it. :)

I, too, was MIA all weekend. (See my earlier post for details.) To top it off, I came down with "the Mother of All Colds", and didn't even have the desire to look at Civ yesterday.

Your turns look fairly uneventful, stwils, except for those nasty "Restless Barbs". ;) I will see what I can do with this today.

Yes, my turn was pretty much uneventful except those barbs kept me busy.

What do you all think about my having started the Oracle? I wondered about it a bit. Two other civs now have started it.

Sorry about your bad cold, Padma. Must have been that drafty bowling alley. ;)

stwils

Preturn: First, I make the rounds diplomatically. No Embassy with the Turks or Koreans? Well, with 350+ gold, I fix that. The Romans are nearly broke, and want communications with Korea, and Greece. I'll think about it. The Vikings are broke, and only want Communications with others. Plus, they don't have Map-Making, yet. But, they *are* broke. The Greeks have a worker for sale. It's late enough that it won't cripple them, so I buy it, plus a ROP (I want to be able to get SouthWind out of there), plus all 52 of their gold, for contact with Rome. Now he is polite. The Turks offer their WM, + all their gold (50) for contact with the Koreans (their neighbor)! I say sure. Korea is broke. I go back to Caesar, and sell him Contact with Korea for 26 gold.

After that round of diplomacy, I can see that we are the Science Leader on this continent. So I go back to the F1 screen, and push our research up to 70%. We get CoL in 20 turns instead of 38, and are still making 1gpt.

I make the rounds of the cities. Everything seems alright. I change Najram from Archer to Spearman. It will take 11 turns for either one, and he needs defense down there more than offense. I think hard about the Oracle. If we really want it, it would be better built in Mecca, where we could shave 16 turns off the time: 60 vs 76 in Damascus. OTOH, Istanbul is still 109 turns away, and I don't think Trondheim will get there any faster. In the end, I leave it be. If nothing else, it can serve as a prebuild for something else.

I move our newly aquired Greek worker towards Damascus, to begin improving tiles there. Aargh! I mismoved! Stupid Greeks can't understand Arabic, even when it is spelled out to them! :D

Note: we need to think about Luxuries and/or Lux Tax soon. Nobody anywhere is Happy, and Mecca will grow to size 5 in 4 turns.

1) 825BC: I put the Greek worker to work roading the square he ended up on. May as well make him useful. I fortify the Archer in Damascus. The worker by Najran moves north to build road to connect it with the rest of our civ. I micromanage Najran - faster growth. Aargh, now I realize why SouthWind was fortified. He *can't* get back past Thermopylae!

2) 800BC: --

3) 775BC: I fortify the new Archer in Baghdad. I see a Barb horseman in the east, and put the Warrior in Medina with the Workers there, for protection.

3) 750BC: Another Barb Warrior appears from the south. I send the new Archer from Mecca his way to deal with him.

4) 730BC: Rome is building the Pyramids. Another Barb Horseman appears from the south, and threatens the Worker roading up from Najran. He completes his road, though, and high-tails it back to town. I send an Archer south from Mecca, and he deals with the Horseman quickly. The same for the Archer I sent out last turn against the Barb Warrior.

IT: The Barb Horseman by Medina Finally attacks our defended Workers, and gets killed for his efforts. No promotions in any of these combats, BTW.

5) 710BC: Workers work. The 2 Archers I had sent SE to deal with Barbs are moving SE to find the Barb camp and kill it.

6) 690BC: Our Archers find the SE Barb camp. They should take it out next turn.

7) 670BC: Barb Camp dispersed. 25 gold added to our coffers.

8) 650BC: Hmmm. Osman, of the Turks, has Philosophy. He want's our WM + 140 gold. It's 2nd Civ price, but we can afford it, and it will give us a boost towards Republic. I also push our Research up to 100%: CoL in 7 turns at -4gpt.

IT: Wang-Kon of Korea wants to trade Territory Maps. I agree. It costs us virtually nothing, yet keeps him happy.

:lol: Osman just came by wanting to trade World Maps! He just bought ours, and now wants another copy, for which he'll give us his. I say sure.

9) 630BC: Mecca has gone to Size 6. I bump Lux Tax to 10% to make a Happy Face. Science now 90%. CoL in 5 turns.

10) 610BC: -- (This doesn't sound right. It shouldn't be 610BC. Oh, crap! I counted Turn 3 twice. I actually played 11 turns. Sorry, folks.)

One of the 2 Archers in the SE is heading NE to take out the Barb Camp there. The other is just kind of hanging around on anti-barb watch.

We have a pretty good-sized force of Archers built up in Mecca and Baghdad (5 in Baghdad alone). I decided to not start the war against Scandinavia on my next-to-last turn, and let the next player make that final decision.

Whatever we do, we need to start pumping out some more Settlers soon. We also need to get some Temples built, to grow our city radii. We *need* those Spices by Medina!

The Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/Pad1_610BC.zip

Edit: Woo-hoo! Post 2000! [party] [dance] [party]

Padma - Over 2000 posts ! [party]

stwils and padma - good turns :goodjob: - the vikings now must await our attack. Guess they are the target - before they get any stronger - and our military is ready.

We have ROP with Rome for 9 turns. Good to see the new embassies. Time for settlers and temples - just a thought and I think Padma said so as well. For a while it was touch and go and we had to build up the workers and the military - but now we can expand some and get those res/luxs.

Off topic:

hope your cold is better Padma -

I took my little girl to a bowling birthday party the other day and we all had a blast.- sounds like you had a busy but fun weekend (aside from cold).

stwils - hope you got all your "dreary" work done - augh - I can only imagine it must be paper work (like mine all cluttered around the computer) and BtB - hope the in-laws were enjoyable and maybe you will add more photos to website.

We just stayed in - saw two local plays, went to the movie "Chicago" and avoided yard work.

Just for info:

Padma
BtB >>> UP NOW
mcdan >>> On Deck
stwils
kevinicus

Lots of good diplomacy, Padma.

I have two questions. I know we have a ROP with Greece because your log indicates that we do. However, when I go to F4 there is nothing there to show that we do. Where does one look?

And two, you say that Istanbul is still 109 turns away from the Oracle. How did you find that out? I went to the embassy page but could not get the information.

Mcdan: I like your new avatar!

stwils:scan:

Hey guys, sorry I didn't play last night. I will get to it today, I promise! :)

stwils - when you go to F4 make sure that the right of passage button on the diplomacy screen is toggled. I think it is a green line. When it is on it will show right of passage between us and whomever else is on the screen. YOu can also see who has ROPs with other civs by shift-clicking on the leader's head so that it's highlighted. If we have an embassy with that civ we'll see what their relations are like with the other civs.

BoB

Originally posted by stwils
Lots of good diplomacy, Padma.

I have two questions. I know we have a ROP with Greece because your log indicates that we do. However, when I go to F4 there is nothing there to show that we do. Where does one look?

And two, you say that Istanbul is still 109 turns away from the Oracle. How did you find that out? I went to the embassy page but could not get the information.

Mcdan: I like your new avatar!

stwils:scan: BoB answered your first question well. It *should* be visible in the F4 screen. If it isn't there, then we don't have RoP. :confused: The only explanation I can come up with if we don't have it is that I was doing a lot of back-and-forth between civs as I was checking initial diplomacy, so it is possible that the deal I struck with Alex did not actually include RoP. I was sure I did, but that is a possibility.

As to Istanbul being 109 turns away from the Oracle: easy. ;) When I established the embassy, like always, it showed me the data of the Ottoman capital: Istanbul. At that point it was building Oracle, and was 109 turns away. :D

It's there, Padma. I went back to F4, and toggled that little button. (I did not know about it before.) And sure enough the green lines between Arabia and Greece appeared.

As to knowing what's going on in a city building a wonder: is it only when you establish an embassy that you get that one time free look at the capital? If you want to look again, would you have to go to the epionage button and then pay some gold to spy? I have never done that. Does it hurt your reputation? I guess I better get out the manual.

stwils

It shouldn't hurt your rep to investigate a city... which is the most we would be able to do right now without the Intelligence Agency wonder. It'll cost some dough. YOu can find out what city is building a wonder on F7, then investigate using the espianoge menu (even though it is not espianoge).

BoB

That's right, stwils. When you establish an embassy, you get a one-time free look at their capital city. After that, you need to use the espionage screen, and pay $$ to see what's going on.

And like BoB says, you can check out the cities building Wonders that way. In my private games, I will sometimes do that, especially if I think the race might be close.

It doesn't appear to hurt your rep, since you don't get "caught spying". You're just having your embassy personnel send back a report about what's happening in the city; things any visitor could see.

(0) 610 BC:
Some minor planing for the great Bakim el Bazildur, now soverign of the great Arab people. Our people seem ready for conflict with many archers ready to take up arms for their country. The Vikings present our post potent threat and therefore must be the first to be crippled. We shall attack with four archers against the force at Bergen, and take the rest of our compliment north to Oslo. Once these two Viking strongholds have been secured we shall look to Copenhagen and Rekjavik as our next targets. Finally we shall subdue Trondheim and Stockholm if our forces allow us. We reason this priority because Bergen is to close to let remain. Oslo has the only visible source of iron near our territory and is close to a source of horses. Copenhagen is on a truly excellent site... a protected harbor with river tiles and a horse! Rekjavik has the best growth potential of all the Viking cities, located on a river with a food bonus tile in its immediate radius. Trondheim has a luxury and is on a river, but not a lot of good food tiles nearby and Stockholm is just not a high priority.

Our next immediate neighbors (Rome and Greece) both have early UU's and will lose the bonus from these forces when our UU comes into effect. This plan should garuntee the survival of the Arab world for years to come. Another benefit of taking Bergen quickly is that it will allow us three additional units that will not cost us anything. Bakim sees that we have a strong military compared to that of the Scandanavians, which help our troops to victory. As he completes his decisions on this matter he dispatches the troops.

Operation North Star (Oslo):
Baghdad 1st Archer Corps
Baghdad 2nd Archer Corps
Baghdad 3rd Archer Corps
Baghdad 4th Archer Corps

Operation Hagen-Daaz (Bergen):
Baghdad 5th Archer Corps
Narjan 1st Archer Corps
Mecca 3rd Archer Corps
Damascus 1st Archer Corps

Operation Cool as Ice (Rekjavik):
Medina 1st Archer Corps
Unassigned Barb Corps, 1st Division
Unassigned Barb Corps, 2nd Division
Mecca 2nd Archer Corps
Mecca 1st Archer Corps

As Bakim orders his troops to combat he notices dissention in the ranks of his followers. He gives them more chocolate bon bons, with the promise that the success of Operation Hagen-Daaz will give the people better quality ice cream at slightly higher prices. The people rejoice in the thought of growing large with the spoils of war and agree with the wise Bakim.

Bakim also orders that construction of a temple in Najran halt immediately so that more settlers can be sent out into the world, particularly so that they may claim some fine wine to the southwest before another civ takes it.

Adviser Checks:
Domestic - the city checks are good for the most part, though Bakim is distressed to learn that improvements around Median have not focused on the river, which brings Bakim much gold, er, I mean the Arab people much gold and happiness. He encourages the workers in that area to devote more attention to the riverfront property.
Trade - nothing much to report here.
Military - the campaign is under way, soon the Vikings will tremble before the descendants Abu Bakar and their mighty adviser Bakim el Bazildur!
Diplomacy - nothing much to report here, though our country checks show:
* Caesar has 69gp, 1 source of gems, Code of Laws and seven cities. He lacks Philosphy.
* Alex has 25gp and five cities. He lacks communications with the Vikings, Mysticism, Philosophy, Map Making, and Horseback Riding.
* Osman has 70gp, 4 sources of incense and six cities. He is in parity with us, so I may be able to trade him Code of Laws for some gp once I get it off of Casesar.
* Wang has 24gp, 1 source of ivory and three cities. He lacks Philosophy.
* Ragnar has 36gp, 1 source of spices and five cities (for now anyway... muahahahahaha). He lacks communication with the Greeks, Philosophy and Map Making.
- I trade Philosophy to Caesar for 9gp (60gp) and Code of Laws.
- I trade Code of Laws to Osman for 70gp (0gp) and his world map.
- I trade the world map to Caesar for 18gp (42gp).
Culture - we don't have much right now, but everyone else seems impressed so no one must be doing much in the way of cultural development (why must the arts always suffer?).
Science - well, since I traded for Code of Laws I set research to the Republic (40 turns at 80% research). Seems like a long time, but we need the luxes to keep cities from revolting. The nice thing about the trade is that we should be able to trade the Republic to another civ for some nice techs when we finish researching it.

Intraturn
Nada

(1) 590 BC:
Mecca 3rd Archer Corps ready for deployment. Mecca's armory begins recruiting another archer corps.
Medina spearmen fortify. Medina begins training more spearmen for greater city defense.
Medina 1st Archer Corps deployed to disperse barbarian camp outside Medina.
Workers complete road outside Medina and begin mines
Our Viking Campaign deployment continues.

Adviser Checks:
Domestic - While we are running a deficit (-7gpt), we will still complete research of the Republic with a positive cash balance provided that there are no drastic changes in the economy. The war against the Vikings should help some income as it will allow more military units without penalty. Narjan has some attitude issues, I set a citizen to entertain until the settlers are ready to leave and there are less crowding issues to upset the people.
Trade - Medina is now connected to the trade network since the road is complete.
Diplomacy - country checks:
* Caesar did not gain any gpt (42gp) but he did found a new city (Ravenna) north of Neapolis near the flood plains.
* Alex did not gain any gpt (25gp). I trade him Horseback Riding for all his gp (0gp) and his world map. He has communication with the Vikings now.
* Osman did not gain any gpt (0gpt) but he did research Mathematics. He wants 240gp and our world map for it. I decide that the trade is not worth it, for now.
* Wang did something interesting financially because he picked up 34gpt (58gp). He doesn't have Code of Laws or Philosphy. He'll trade the bank for Philosophy. I decide to make the deal before he talks to someone else (0gp).
* Ragnar lost 34gpt (2gp)... presumably he traded with Wang to get contact with Alex. Silly Ragnar. He also has a worker available but I don't feel like trading him for it (why trade for it when we'll probably capture it anyway?).

Intraturn
Wounded Viking archer on mountains NE of Medina fortifies.
Livy completes "Wealthiest Nations of the World" The order is: Arabs, Carthaginians, Romans, Greeks, French, Vikings, Koreans, Ottomans.
Hittite warrior fortifies in his camp outside Medina.

(2) 570 BC:
Operation North Star encounters a wandering Marcomanni warrior (2/2).

Adviser Checks:
Domestic - I micromanage Mecca and move two citizens off unimproved grassland tiles to roaded forest tiles. Mecca is at zero growth but it will produce it's 4th Archer Corps in two turns. I also move a citizen in Damascus from an unimproved grassland tile to a forest tile. Damascus is at zero growth but it will produce the Oracle in 25 turns (if it grows to six it will need more luxuries or an entertainer).
Diplomacy - country checks:
* Caesar did not gain any gpt (42gp)
* Alex picked up 25gpt (25gp) and he no longer lacks Mysticism.
* Osman did not gain any gpt (0gp)
* Wang did not gain any gpt (0gp)
* Ragnar did not gain any gpt (2gp) but no longer lacks Map Making or Philosophy.

Intraturn
A viking spearman shows up NE of Baghdad.

(3) 550 BC:
Worker S of Damascus completes irrigation and begins road.
Medina 1st Archer Corps (4/4) engages the Bactrian barbarian in the Hitite camp. He promotes to Elite and wins 25gp.
Worker NW of Najran completes road and begins mine.
Bakim decides that Trondheim would be a more appropriate target for Operation Cool as Ice and orders his troops appropriately.

Adviser Checks:
Domestic - our commerce has increased and we are now 33 turns away from the Republic.
Diplomacy - country checks:
* Caesar did not gain any gpt (42gp)
* Alex did not gain any gpt (25gp)
* Osman did not gain any gpt (0gp)
* Wang did not gain any gpt (0gp)
* Ragnar did not gain any gpt (2gp)

Intraturn
A Roman warrior approaches our western border
The barbarian near Operation North Star continued east toward Scandanavia.
The Viking troops near Operation Cool as Ice dispersed north.

(4) 530 BC:
Baghdad 5th Archer Corps ready for deployment. Baghdad begins recruiting spearmen to defend the city.
Mecca 4th Archer Corps ready for deployment. This corps is assigned to Operation Cool as Ice and deploys immediately. Mecca begins recruiting spearmen to defend the city.
Workers SW of Medina complete mine and move N to hill tile.

Adviser Checks:
It only costs 20gp to investigate Oslo so I pay the cash to see how long till it grows to size 2. It grows next turn and is guarded only by a warrior. I think we should find the same situation in Bergen, though we will need to attack the spearman on the way to defend the city before he gets there.
Diplomatic - Osman has right of passage with Alex now. No other changes on the international scene.

Intraturn
The Roman warrior moves into the fog near Bergen.
A Viking archer shows up on the mountain S of Trondheim.
The Viking spearman moves toward Bergen.
Koreans found Pusan right where I wanted to send the settler from Najran! :(

(5) 510 BC:
Oslo didn't grow! :( How frustrating. I can't wait any longer. I do not want that spearman to be a factor in the sack of Bergen. I can wait till Oslo grows if I must, unless he whiped the spearman... that would be VERY frustrating.
Najran gets the settlers ready for their trip. I send them north, toward Baghdad. They will take Oslo's place should it have to fall. I change my mind and have the spearman in Najran accompany the settler. I decide that they should found a city on the west side of Muhammad's Reach.
I declare war on Ragnar.
I try to demand a worker from him but he doesn't go for that.
Operation Hagen-Daaz moves into the tile directly SE of Bergen. There is a spearman defender there.
Operation North Star moves into the tile directly SW of Oslo. There is a spearman defender there.

Adviser Checks:
Osman has 22gp more, Alex is down to 3gp, Wang has Mathmatics now and is willing to trade for Code of Laws, which I readily accept. Caesar will give me 42gp and his world map for Mathmatics, which I also accept.

Intraturn
An elite warrior from Oslo attacks our veteran Baghdad 1st Archer Corps. We win, losing 1 hp in the battle.
The viking spearman moves to the tile directly E of Bergen.

(6) 490 BC:
Baghdad goes into disorder (how did I miss that?!? :( ). I give it an entertainer.
Baghdad 5th Archer Corps (4/4) attacks Viking spearman outside Bergen... win 1, win 1, lose 1, lose 1, win 1... our Baghdad 5th Archer Corps is now elite (3/5)
Narjan 1st Archer Corps (3/3) attacks Viking spearman fortified in Bergen... win 1, win 1, lose 1, win 1.
Damascus 1st Archer Corps (4/4) attacks Viking spearman in Bergen... win 1, win 1, lose 1, win 1... our archer corps has captured Bergen!
Mecca 3rd Archer Corps moves to help fortify Bergen.
Captured Viking workers move SE out of Bergen.
Baghdad 4th Archer Corps (4/4) attacks Viking spearman fortified in Oslo... win 1, lose 1, lose 1, win 1, lose 1, lose 1... the enemy unit promotes to veteran (2/4)!
Baghdad 3rd Archer Corps (4/4) attacks wounded Viking spearman fortified in Oslo... lose 1, lose 1, lose 1, lose 1.
Baghdad 2nd Archer Corps (4/4) attacks wounded Viking spearman fortified in Oslo... win 1, win 1... our archer corps have destroyed Oslo.
Baghdad 1st Archer Corps (3/4) fortifies to heal.

Adviser Checks:
Nothing new on the domestic or diplomatic fronts... we now have 0 military support costs.

Intraturn
Greece declares war on the Romans?!?!
The Greeks destroy the Roman city near the wines. This may be a good opportunity for that settler/spearman pair we have headed that way!

(7) 470 BC:
Mecca and Baghdad both complete their recruitment of spearmen.
Order returns to Baghdad but the required entertainer starves some of the population. I order the current recuritment activity altered to give us more settlers to civilize the region to the north.
Narjan 1st Archer Corps (1/3) fortifes to heal.
Captured viking workers begin road to trade network.
Damascus 1st Archer Corps (2/4) fortifies to protect Bergen and heal.
Mecca 3rd Archer Corps (4/4) fortifies to protect Bergen.
Baghdad 5th Archer Corps (3/5) fortifies to heal.
Worker begins road in forest SE of Damascus.
Spearman in Mecca ordered to report to Baghdad to protect the settlers heading north.
Spearman in Medina fortifies to protect city. Recruiters take a break and help with the construction of a new temple.
Operation North Star begins campaign toward Copenhagen.

Adviser Checks:
Caesar lost a city and the Vikings still don't want to talk to us. That's about it. Our military support costs are back up to 2gpt.

Intraturn
Two wounded elite Viking archers show up on the mountain tile SSW of Trondheim.

(8) 450 BC:
Worker NE of Damascus begins road to Bergen on unimproved cattle tile.
Spearman/settler pair head west to wine tiles.

Adviser Checks:
The vikings won't talk to us but not much else chages.

Intraturn
The viking archers attack and defeat our Barbarian Corps, 2nd division and Mecca 4th Archer Corps.

(9) 430 BC:
Narjan grows to size 4, but the people are unhappy so I have to make one citizen an entertainer.
Worker NW of Narjan completes mine, moves to wheat tile to build road.

Adviser Checks:
Ragnar is willing to talk, he'll part with a worker and all his gold (2gp) for peace, but that's all. No cities. No deal I say!

Intraturn
Alex wants right of passage... I give it to him for his treasury (3gp).
Some Viking troop movement... looks like an archer was added to Trondheim's compliment.

(10) 410 BC:
Baghdad's settlers are ready to move. Recruiters take a break and begin building a temple. I move the settlers toward the forest tile at the confluence of the two rivers N of Bergen. I move the spearman north of Baghdad in that direction as well.
Spearman in Mecca fortifies, recruiters begin working on getting another settler party together.
Mecca 2nd Archer Corps (4/4) attacks spearman fortified in Trondheim... lose 1, win 1, lose 1, win 1, lose 1, win 1
Mecca 1st Archer Corps (4/4) attacks spearman fortified in Trondheim... lose 1, win 1, win 1, lose 1, lose 1, lose 1... enemy unit promotes to elite!
Medina 1st Archer Corps (5/5) attacks wounded spearman fortified in Trondheim... lose 1, win 1, lose 1, lose 1, lose 1, lose 1
Barbarian Corps, 1st Division (4/4) attacks archer in Trondheim... win 1, lose 1, win 1, win 1, win 1... our unit promotes to elite (4/5)
The remnants of Operation North Star are on the horse tile W of Copenhagen.

Conclusion
Overall I'm pleased with the turns. I almost achieved my main objective. I only wish the AI hadn't rushed that spearman in Oslo. :( We're on our way to expanding our civilization and the Viking menace is greatly diminshed. Another round of battles and it will be over. His production capacity has been greatly injured and if we're lucky on this next turn we may be able to take Trondheim, at least temporarily, or hold it till reinforcements arrive.

My two favored sites for cities are that spot on the confluence right next to the barb camp and the forest tile directly E of the ruins of the former Roman city. Whoever is next has their own discretion though, but I think those are best. Good luck!

Here's our map and the purple dots are my picks for city sites. Feel free to discuss amongst yourselves!
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1a_410bc.jpg

Here's the save:
Abu Akbar of the Arabs, 410 BC (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/PAD1a_bc410.zip)

Comments and or questions are appreciated! :)
BoB

Looking good, BoB! :goodjob:

I believe mcdan is up now.

Just to let the players know: I will be pretty much out of contact all weekend, again. Second half of our Junior City Bowling Tournament.

got it - will post asap after completing post for Sulla-B :D

Is anyone else having trouble getting on the internet (via cable?)

Sometimes I can get on and sometimes it is impossible. (I am not talking about Civ Fan site, but about any site!)

Cable folks came out. Some mysterious outage at the local cox.net. Then I read about a "worm" getting us all. Off and on for several days now.

This is disconcerting. Hope you all have not been bothered with this problem.

stwiils

stwils - sorry you continue to have computer problems - do you have broadband? I heard of the virus reproted on the Drudge Report that hit a lot of people this weekend :eek: and GA was definately hit. Hope things are better.

I am up a little late - studying BtB latest turn before I play my turns in the a.m. - Had to wait until after the State of the Union address - then people kept calling to discuss it. (usually we have a no-late calls policy in our home - but hey - lots to discuss after a speech like that.) Consensus via calls was that it was excellent in addressing vital topics- even by my 2 NYTimes writer friends :grad: ) - but maybe they were just being polite to us... we did just have them over for dinner ;)

TOPIC:

OK - back to topic- :undecide: but getting ready to do some study - will restudy BtB's post and his purple dot map - a city site that seems very important is to the left of Najran and Mecca is set for a settler in 4. So that is where I may settle first. I also think settling above Bergen is important as well. by the river.
I see BtB mentions a site near the ruins of the Roman city as well.

Will study tonight, sleep, carpool, and then post in the morning. Sorry to be so slow at this. One day this game will just be instinct for me - and not filled with manuals, Prima guides and printouts.

Off topic again but curious: How do you others set up your desks? Would love to know this one day !!! - with all these manuals/guilds - I keep up on shelves during dinner partys - but the guest eye wanders instead to NOT the shelves of literary/ immpressive works - but to PTW, Prima everything, AlphaCentauri, LotR, CIV 1 - 2 - the short lived Civ-Net and now 3. The worst might have been when I insisted the children played RollerCoaster Tycoon - until they gleefully busted me for having best score...

If this helps your desk: I print out our turns and put them in binders. Big mess at first but once I bind them it is so easy to go back a review. (Once in a while my 7 yr old sneaks in a Barbie picture she printed to make my game more fun and pink. But you should see her on Age of Mythology!!!) Barbie to Warrior in eight seconds flat :)

BACK TO TOPIC:

Looks like a great turn before me :goodjob:- we lost some men but hey - that's how it goes - let's remember Alex has the RoP. Main concern now is settling and will post a few questions to BtB re: his last turn and to team before playing if anyone has time.

mcdan

3 AM ?!?!?! :eek:

Any questions, I'll do my best to answer. I didn't really have the full SOTU experience because I was kind of being dad during most of it. I told my wife she could change the channel if she wanted since I'd be reading it in the morning anyway but she stuck with it.

I hate to use media cliches but it certainly was a tale of two speeches. It seemed as if there was a good transition between the two, though when he started talking about the assistance for fighting AIDS in Aftrica I was certain that he was going to parlay the speech into the international dimension there but he waited a bit longer to do that.

Overall it was a pretty good speech. The nice thing about the SOTU speech for the president is that it allows you to define yourself and your administration in your own terms without interruption. In the world of 24 hour news channels and talking heads it is rare that anyone has such an opportunity. I think he "took" a number of issues away from the democrats, which Clinton was effective at doing to republicans during his administration.

It'll be interesting to see what others think and what the fallout from the speech will be. Have fun reading over the turns again and feel free to send me your ?s. :)

BoB

Just wishing you guys luck. PAD1 Regent has finished their game. (we just had a quick turn time). Good luck!

my fault for the delay in the game - augh - computer trouble and wonderful (but always present :) ) family has slowed me down. I have missed being on the forum.

I can post tomorrow if need be and happy :D to do so but - I will pass as I understand the 48 hr rule - so if I don't hear anything, will post around noon Atlanta time.

mcdan

Go ahead, mcdan.

I was starting to wonder where you were, but I didn't want to push stwils, yet, because she is up in SUL5b, also.

Quick Report this time - sorry guys :eek: but RL/ travel is overtaking my game time for now. Hate to be so short and lack detail but here goes... :rolleyes:

******Main goal was to get settlers to good locations and then build for attack (and defense) ***********

I did the preturn check- but nothing was changed. BoB had us set up well.

enter:

Trohdheim takes out our 2 archers
Barbs run in SW

turn 1: 390 BC-

Bagdad 2nd archer corps takes Copenhagen - no gold
move a settler and warrior to SW to settler near wheat and grapes

intraturn:
second settler and spearman move N to settle
all workers on roads

turn 2:370 BC

worker killed in Najran by Viking
We attack back and are victorious and now a veteran
move settler to settle in SW - had thought I had move one tile too close to forest and decided to return settler - in retrospect - a wasted turn on that one.

turn 3- 350 BC:

settler settles Kufah - not in tile I would have liked but two warriors were closing in and wanted to get a city settled and spearman to fortify before all was lost.
slider check - reduce slightly
move and stack workers and spearmen

Turn 4- 330 BC

Koreans are building the Colossus
workers on roads
settlers on the move but no new towns
slider check - move to 50% for net gain of 50%

Turn 5- 310

attacked by Viking but we attack back and kill near Stockholm.
Vikings want peace treaty but have nothing to offer us
Bagdad produced temple
Badgdad set for spearman - we need to build up our military
Carthage has Pyramids

Turn 6- 290 BC

workers on those roads
Basra is found ed in N
Spearman moves to foritfy new city
have two workers building roads but not in good locations- will change in next turn if it seems correct.
move settler #3 to the west

Turn 7- 270 BC

worker movement
moving settler to good spot
other civs get wonders - too fast to report
change Kufah from 25 turns to settler to a quick warrior
get Lit from Romans for 200
new city- Khurasan

Turn 8 and 9 and 10 - 230 BC

Not sure how I lost track of time - I didn't think I hit that play button once but suddenly it is 230 BC.
but mainly moved workers and fortified cities so there was no "news"

g at 2 pt

Summary:

3 new cities
Oracle in 8 turns
settler in 1
archer in 1
spearman in 1
temple in 7

***goal is to protect new cities I think and assess certain lone soldiers out there on their own - then attack :)

save: to follow

SAVE:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/Abu_Bakr_of_the_Arabs,_230_BC.SAV

SAVE:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/Abu_Bakr_of_the_Arabs,_230_BC.SAV

I'm next. I think.

However I'm hoping we'll have some discussion about this game before I launch in. (I need to study it and refresh my memory, too. I still have Sul5b in my head. :))

stwils

Yes, stwils, you're up next. :)

I can't look at mcdan's save, yet, for discussion.

See my post (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=764695#post764695) in SUL5B for details. ;)

Padma, I'd like to hold off for a day to get your comments and those of others as to where you think we now stand.

Since we are a team, I'd like to hear what you all think our next goal is before I go forward.

stwils

That's fine by me, stwils. :)

Although I hope BoB, mcdan, and kevinicus will be able weigh in here with their thoughts, soon. (hint, hint. nudge nudge. ;) ;) ) I'm firmly convinced that this team is Ready for Regent, and I enjoy seeing what you all think. (Sometimes you make me re-look at a situation and go "oops!" :D )

Hey, I've been doing a lot of weighing! :( Honestly I've been wrapped up with CivIII that I haven't even put in the PTW cd in a while. I'll try to look at it tonight. :)

BoB

Hey, I've been doing a lot of weighing! :( :lol: Indeed you have! That's why I value your opinions and insights!

It will be good to hear from everyone! (Hope to hear from Kevinicus soon - have missed you.)

And Padma, you really think our team is ready for Regent?? Count me in when we are ready to start a Regent game.

stwils (trying to get used to the lavendar Arabians instead of the orange English. They were orange, weren't they? Games run together...)

My most looming question is about the city placements. What was the decision-making process you used to put the cities where they are. I'm worried that Wang may see our SW placements as "aggressive" and use it as cause to start a war. We're kind of depleted militarily as it is right now and can not afford a two-front war.

Overall I think we're in kind of an odd place right now. Personally I think we should just dispatch the Vikings, grab as much of the territory for ourselves up there as possible, then assess which direction we would like to go for a victory. We may also want to consider starting the Great Lighthouse in one of our coastal cities so that we'll be able to reach the other continent first.

That's my initial thoughts. Anyone else? :)

BoB

BoB, you're reading my mind. :D

Padma, did you say Bob has been weighing a lot lately?;) ;) ;)

stwils:lol:

On a side note I have been weighing a lot lately. I started a diet program on the advice of my doctor. I'm not keeping track of how much I lose each week, I think that would be depressing, but I am eating better and working out on a regular basis.

Now for the kicker... the goal is to get from 293 lbs to 200 lbs! :0 My estimate is that the earliest I could possibly reach this goal will be January of next year, and that's an optimistic goal! I've had to swear off a lot of things I like... fast food has gone from a semi-regular thing to a luxury or reward, particularly Sonic Chocolate Shakes. It's a good thing there's only one Sonic in Fort Wayne, otherwise I'd go crazy.

Oh, and I'll have more baby pics soon... I meant to upload them last night but it didn't happen.

BoB

Originally posted by BoBtheBUILDER
My most looming question is about the city placements. What was the decision-making process you used to put the cities where they are. I'm worried that Wang may see our SW placements as "aggressive" and use it as cause to start a war. We're kind of depleted militarily as it is right now and can not afford a two-front war.

Overall I think we're in kind of an odd place right now. Personally I think we should just dispatch the Vikings, grab as much of the territory for ourselves up there as possible, then assess which direction we would like to go for a victory. We may also want to consider starting the Great Lighthouse in one of our coastal cities so that we'll be able to reach the other continent first.

That's my initial thoughts. Anyone else? :)

BoB

Good Questions!

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