Civ = Songhai (largest western African empire)
Difficulty = Emperor
All victory conditions are enabled, even the horrid Diplomatic that I consider a loss. However, the only victory condition we will accept is a military one.

Playing
LKendter
Dark Sheer (needs to re-confirm)
Meldor (needs to re-confirm)
Lt. 'Killer' M. (needs to re-confirm)
OPEN SLOT

Re-confirm slots will be held for 48 hours, and then removed from the list.

Don't sign up if you don't have previous experience with HUGE maps
This is PTW based mod.


The following tactics are PROHIBITED:
RoP Rape - if you have to ask...
RoP Abuse (irrigating all tiles with a city building wonders, denying resources with a RoP, etc.)
Scout resource denial - parking a scout on a resource, as the AI won't ask scouts to leave
False Peace Treaties (must wait for the 20 years to end)
Declaring War to break trade deals including actions like the Demand exploit to force a war, or demanding to leave territory.
False Alliances (ally with several people vs. a civ then peace with that civ), and other actions that completely abuse the AI limited diplomacy ability.
Spy exploit - If you fail to plant a spy, you CAN'T try again. The exploit is: you can infinitely plant a spy until the Civ declares war.
Demand exploit - You may make ONE demand a turn per civ. The exploit is: you can demand to the end of time, and guaranteed to get a civ furious and almost to war.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.


For information on the changes to the wm check the thread http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38461

The game will begin as soon as the final test returns positive.

I will confirm. Is this on going to be with random resources? The songhai have to get horses as their number one priority if it is not random. There are only two sources of horses in Africa, no horses, no UU.

Yes, this will be random resources and goodie huts.
I just randomize the world before this post.


Playing
LKendter
Dark Sheer (needs to re-confirm)
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M. (needs to re-confirm)
OPEN SLOT

I confirm! I confirm! I confirm!

:mwaha: another world map to run over :D

Playing
LKendter
Dark Sheer (needs to re-confirm)
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
OPEN SLOT


As soon as we get a fourth, I will post the 40 starting turns -
I will say - I *HATE* barbs

Food overload at Gao - it doesn't need a granary with *2* flood-plains wheat tiles.

Boy, does this sound like fun. But I have no experience with hugh maps...and my experience with huge maps is that I don't have the time to commit. I wish you all much fun in the game, though.

Arathorn

@Arathorn - Picky, picky, picky...

The typo is corrected.

Is this the scenario that has Argentina as a civilization?
It will be an interesting thread to read.

I would like to play if I can.

My commitments (to cfc related things and a job that finishes at 7pm) may mean the 48 hour play time is a little difficult on the later turns if they are mid-week, but if that is the cost of getting in then I will forgo sleep if I need to.

I have plenty huge map experience, but not recently.

Playing
LKendter
Dark Sheer (needs to re-confirm)
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
anarres


All that is left is for DS to re-confirm - I sent him a pm.

Playing
LKendter
Dark Sheer (needs to re-confirm)
Meldor
Lt. 'Killer' M.
anarres - I like to make sure people are use to the long drag that happens in the late years.


All that is left is for DS to re-confirm - I sent him a pm. It hasn't even been 24 hours yet.

LKender, could you put me down as an alternate in case someone drops out or something please. I have been lurking around the fourm for a a few days now, waiting for a succesion game around my level (monarch-emperor) to start.

I can handle monarch fairly easily. Emperor is usually a tough challenge, but I have played (with varing success) a few emperor games. I always play on Large-Huge maps.

Thanks

@Kazin...go ahead and get your feet wet, Lee doesn't let anyone stray to far from the fold. :hammer:

@Lee... :lol: [dance]

...go ahead and get your feet wet, Lee doesn't let anyone stray to far from the fold.

This I know is true first hand :lol:

Good luck to all you World Map players I know you all spent a lot of time on this one and I am sure it will be a great read !

Hotrod

@Meldor / Hotrod0823 :rolleyes:

============================


4000 BC - The random resources have been kind - flood-plains wheat by the capital.
Gao is formed popping a hut for pottery. :)
Research is begun on writing at token pace.

3750 BC - Welcome to emperor - 20% luxury tax in place.

3550 BC - We have ivory very close to the capital.

3400 BC - Gao with 2 flood-plains wheat is growing so fast, I switch warrior to settler. I think city #2 will supply the troops.

3150 BC - We are up to an oppressive 50% luxury tax - I can't wait to connect that Ivory.

3050 BC (I) - Disease strikes the city of Gao.

3000 BC (I) - The second round of disease, and we don't even rate on the most advanced list.

2950 BC - Our warrior finds an empty village.

2900 BC - Timbuktu is formed, and orders a warrior - this will be our early military source.

2800 BC - Barbs destroy our warrior exploring in the south. :(

2310 BC - We are next to our third goody hut. I will wait a turn or two until the next warrior is ready.

2270 BC - We pop the third goody hut and the angry barbs show up.

2190 BC - Unreal another warrior dies to emperor level barbs :mad:
(I) We complete writing, and start on Map Making.

2150 BC - Jenne is formed, and also orders a warrior. We really got screwed on a good exploring start with 2 dead warriors.


Summary - Gao is a major league settler factory - doesn't even need a granary with **two** flood-plains wheat.
The other cities need warrior to help deal with barbs, and to explore.
We need a coastal city to build a galley.
I am doing a typical tight build - 3 spaces away is fine.

This is PTW; we don't have to get every contact instantly.

The General Songhai plan:
1) First to contact the Zulu, hopefully exclusive and contact trading.
2) Contact Egypt and try to get past for further contact.
3) First ships to America.


LKendter
Anarres (Currently playing)
Anarres - you can do 20 turns, as no contacts yet.

Meldor (on deck)
Dark Sheer (needs to re-confirm)
Kazin (alternate if DS doesn't confirm by the time Meldor is done)
Lt. 'Killer' M.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39-2150BC.zip

Our starting cities, and our exploring directions - only the Zulu path is in progress.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LAK-242.jpg

I didn't realise I was up. What about Dark Seer, Meldor and Killer? They were all above me in the list.

I am gone soon until tomorrow night (9pm GMT), but if this game is still here I will take it.

nice! I was a bit shocked reading '3 tiles away' until I realized you meant '3 tiles in between' :lol:

as anarres says he can't grab the game right now I'll take it and be done in about 1 h.

preturn: mm Jenne to speed warrior (4 instead of 10). Rest is fine.

(1) 2110 BC - Warrior in Timbuktu, as a 2nd barb appears from north I leave town on warrior for now and move new unit to counter st barb.
Caution! I turned 'cancel for enemy units' off! Otherwise, the bar would make our worker stop now as he will move into sight!.
(2) 2070 BC - kill barb with 1 HP left, another barb is next to that which I couldn't see. Also a hut.

(3) 2040 BC - barb moves away :confused: Good for us! Rest Warrior to heal in case barb comes back, I want cover for the worker. mm Jenna for food. mm Timbuktu to Warrior in 1, costs 1 food 1 gold in Gao.

(4) 1990 BC - Warrior in Jenna and Timbuktu, mm both back. Both stay on Warrior for exploration purposes.
(5) 1950 BC - Barb promots Gaos defender.
settler from Gao, warrior ordered. Healed Warrior fortified in the open as barb approaches.

Consider Granary for Gao.

@Killer - Please no more JUMPING OUT OF PLACE! Please do NOT Play yet.

I change from the sign up order to pace out the players familiar with this world map. I hope you see this in time, and we wait for Anarres. I don't want to have to redo the player order.

I didn't catch Killer in time :(

I really don't want to be a hard-lined pita, but jumping from 5th to 2nd is absurd.

If this happens again, I will have to be nasty about it and invalidate the turn. Swapping one player is ok, but this is absurd.

New player order due to killers impatience :mad:
LKendter
Lt. 'Killer' M. (Currently playing)
Anarres (on deck)
Dark Sheer (needs to re-confirm)
Kazin (alternate if DS doesn't confirm by the time Meldor is done)
Meldor

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

OK, but he's gone over the 48h probably he just told me

cancel my turns.

anarres: you are up.

Lee: you should have told why this order (which, btw, spaces the game out due to time zones if I remember locations correctly)

Originally posted by LKendter
I didn't catch Killer in time :(



btw: I checked to see if you were online so I could ask you 10 minutes ago before I started but you didn't show :(

Would it have been so bad to swap us two this one time? You know anarres and his qualities, you can pretty much stick him anywhere, too........ Or did oyu want me flanked by experienced players? In that case I apologize :blush:

anarres: you are up.

Lee: you should have told why this order (which, btw, spaces the game out due to time zones if remember locations correctly)

Sorry, I have to agree I messed up on that one. I wanted to space out the players familiar with playing on this map. I have slots 1,3,5 with players use to the LK world. #2 is not familiar, and if DS doesn't confirm (less then 48 hours to go), then #4 will not be familiar.


btw: I checked to see if you were online so I could ask you 10 minutes ago before I started but you didn't show

Would it have been so bad to swap us two this one time? You know Anarres and his qualities, you can pretty much stick him anywhere, too........ Or did you want me flanked by experienced players? In that case I apologize

My dial-up ISP for when I am on the road changed the rules and limited how much I am on each month. I can no longer stay on-line on night - cheap @!@$!#%!

This is the first time I have ever played a SG with Anarres - I have no clue on his qualities.

If I swapped you and Anarres, then it would be Anarres (5th), Me (1st), and then Anarres (2nd). I don't think any player should play that close together in turns.

hehe. Sorry about the mess-up. :blush:

I tried to post in time for you too see as well LK, but was too late. I saw Killer on msm and explained that I couldn't take it for 24 hours, and asked what was best to do. I was also confused about the order.

LK - what is the best way to get in touch? I use msm but it is not to everyone's taste. Do you get PM notification? If so I will PM you next time...

Oh yeah, I will take the game tonight. Should I replay the turns Killer has done?

anarres: I think you should replay, let'S see what Lee says. But in that phase of the game so much depends on whther you build a warrior or not, whether you lose one to barbs or not that having someone do 5 then hadn it off is not good IMO.

Lee: no sweat, I see your reasoning. I didn't think about the fact that anarres would then, when rotated back, follow himself practically immeadiately - doh!

anarres. you will have to replay, I just found I saved over the turns. I save at the beginning and end of each turn, using the smae name (so I cannot reload far back if I screw up but can correct slip of the mouse mistakes), and I saved over this game with another one.

Despite having played huge maps, can someone tell me if there is anything I should be aware of with this specific map?

Since this is a mod I can load it in the editor and check it out, but maybe there is some useful bit of info that I may miss, so if anyone has any helpful hints about this map I would be grateful.

the barbs are baaaaad! A lot of camps and remember, uprising everywhere when we change ages (well, that one's off for a while, too).

Follow Lees directions for contacts, and do NOT be surprised when all of Eurasia knows each other already!

Originally posted by anarres
hehe. Sorry about the mess-up. :blush:

I tried to post in time for you too see as well LK, but was too late. I saw Killer on msm and explained that I couldn't take it for 24 hours, and asked what was best to do. I was also confused about the order.

LK - what is the best way to get in touch? I use msm but it is not to everyone's taste. Do you get PM notification? If so I will PM you next time...

Oh yeah, I will take the game tonight. Should I replay the turns Killer has done?


1) Yes, I do get PM notification. I don't use any messenger service. If you will be a while, I will swap you with the 3rd player in turn order - not the 5th.

2) Replay Killer turn based on his comments.


3) Sorry at all for the order confusion - the PERMANENT planned order:

LKendter
Anarres (Currently playing)
Meldor (on deck)
Dark Sheer (needs to re-confirm)
Kazin (alternate if DS doesn't confirm by the time Meldor is done)
Lt. 'Killer' M.

@Killer: Thx for the advice.

@LKendter: No problemo, I can play tonight. If that's not soon enough then let meldor go first, but it's only 8 hours away so I can't see a problem.

2 (hopefully) final questions:
- Do I play 10 or 20 turns? I will asume 20 unless I hear otherwise as you said it post #15.
- Does mm mean micro-manage? If so, is that not a requirement for these games anyway?

Thanks again for your patience, I will get the hang of it soon ;)

Does mm mean micro-manage?
YES


Do I play 10 or 20 turns?
20 for you ONLY since trading hasn't started. With this being a World game and Fra, Ger, Rus, Gre, Bab, Egy, Per, and Zul likely for quick contact - trading will get intense quickly.
With Worker buying on the table (and encouraged), and wm trading very profitable early on we need people in the trading screen alot.
Now what we need is a port city for a couple of galleys to go exploring for more wm revenue and first contact with America :)


After your turn I will decide if Meldor gets 20.

anarres: I said mm explicitly where usefull, i.e. where -1 food gives a unit 1 turn earlier, so that you all take note of these cases. I expect everyone to check for themselves, but one might overlook something. If you read about it you're less likely to miss it, even if it only is a 1% risk to begin with! ;)

HELP!!

I have the LKWorld-V9N.bix, and the SETUP-UNITS3.bat batch file, but can not find where to download the units.

I have been looking for ages in vain, I don't even know what forum it is in. I am desperate to play...

Your don't need the .bix - that isn't the issue.

Installation instructions:
All players should run the unit setup file!
Drop the batch file SETUP-UNIT3.bat under the directory:
C:\Program Files\Infogrames Interactive\Civilization III\Art\units
Run it to will create the needed new units.

Really sorry about that :rolleyes:

If I had looked at the file closer I would have realised I didn't need anything else...

I have the save and am playing...

Originally posted by LKendter
Your don't need the .bix - that isn't the issue.

Installation instructions:
All players should run the unit setup file!
Drop the batch file SETUP-UNIT3.bat under the directory:
C:\Program Files\Infogrames Interactive\Civilization III\Art\units
Run it to will create the needed new units.


I'm confused, is it a mod you guys are playing? I thought it was just a WM. :confused:

It is a mod only in that some of the civs were moved and re-named. For instance, Agentina, Austrilia, and the Songhai. The change in name and location also required a UU that is better tied to the new civ. Because the UUs for the new civs, you need to have unit folders for them so the game can determine what animations to use. It will not effect you normal civ3/ptw game play. These are additional units, not replacements.

I replayed Killers moves, so the first 5 moves are the same as his.

preturn: mm Jenne to speed warrior (4 instead of 10). Rest is fine.

(1) 2110 BC - Warrior in Timbuktu, as a 2nd barb appears from north I leave town on warrior for now and move new unit to counter st barb.
Caution! I turned 'cancel for enemy units' off! Otherwise, the bar would make our worker stop now as he will move into sight!.
(2) 2070 BC - kill barb with 1 HP left, another barb is next to that which I couldn't see. Also a hut.

(3) 2040 BC - barb moves away Good for us! Rest Warrior to heal in case barb comes back, I want cover for the worker. mm Jenna for food. mm Timbuktu to Warrior in 1, costs 1 food 1 gold in Gao.

(4) 1990 BC - Warrior in Jenna and Timbuktu, mm both back. Both stay on Warrior for exploration purposes.

(5 - Killer) 1950 BC - Barb promots Gaos defender.
settler from Gao, warrior ordered. Healed Warrior fortified in the open as barb approaches.

----

(5 - anarres) 1950 BC
Unlike Killer, I didn't get a promotion from the barb attacking me. Weird, I must have dome something in a slightly different order :hmm:
Decided to go for the barb and killed it.
Gao Warrior sent NE to Egypt
Gao set to settler for the moment until I can decide.
Timbuktu warrior sent to NW over river to go north to Europe.
Jenne warrior NW towards other cities
Settler south over river. I will build a city to the SW on the river, 3 squares W and 1 square NW of Timbuktu.

(6) 1910 BC
Yet another warrior approaches from the west, next to our warrior. Fortify warrior.
Move Timbuktu warrior, settler and worker on to wheat square just outside the Timbuktu border.
The new city cill make this our land so the wheat should be ready.
Jenne warrior diverted west to explore for resources and help kill any barbs.
mm Timbuktu for warrior

(7) 1870 BC
Warrior on way to egypt sees goodie hut.
Warrior with settler heads west and pops goodie hut. We get a tech! - warrior code.
Feeling lucky, I attack the barb with the other warrior in the west and lost a regular to a conscript :mad:. It's not too bad as the barb has 1HP and I have the other warrior next to it.
I take a small calculated risk and move the settler west on to the same square as the warrior, next to the 1HP barb, as he will surely die next turn and the settler needs to go that way.
Jenne warrior carries on west.
mm Jenne and Timbuktu for food.

(8) 1830 BC
Warrior takes out 1HP barb.
Settler moves west to new city location next to cattle, and with 2 wheat on plains nearby. I feel a second settler factory coming on :D
Send warrior to square 1 south of Timbuktu to build road to Jenne
Warrior from Jenne sees yet another barb on mountain to west.
2 new warriors at Jenne and Timbuktu. Timbuktu warrior fortified. It can stay for 1 turn to avoid lux slider and then it can head north to Europe.
Jenne warrior sent NE, the land looks very promising with 2 visible cattle and one wheat quite close by.
Change Gao production to worker. I have decided against a granary as there are only 4 decent tiles around, and a granary would push the size up quite high and take far too long.
mm Jenne for production, set to warrior. mm Tinbuktu for food, set to warrior. mm Gao for food.
Warrior en route to Egypt pops goodie hut - deserted.
I just saw an Egyptian warrior :)
Egypt has no money, but these techs: Masonry, The Wheel, Mysticism and Masonry
And contact with: Persians, Babs, Greeks, French, Russians and Mongols.
We only have Writing to offer, but Egypt won't even give bronze working for it. The discount he is getting for 7 contacts is huge.
It is a tough choice whether to sell writing or not, but in the end I decide not, as the Zulu's are lass than 10 squares away, and the warrior en route to Egypt can go north now to meet maybe Spain, France, and Greece before heading past egypt (maybe...). The med is only 10 squares away as well. Once we have made some more contacts we will be in a much better postion to buy and sell, and maybe broker with the Zulus. Another (but smaller) factor for me is that if we give Egypt writing it will enable them to get lots of contacts very quickly and maybe get an advantage. As our nearest civ I don't think we should encourage them.

(9) 1790 BC Koumbi Saleh is founded :). This city has 1 cattle and 2 wheat all on plains. This baby is crying out settler factory. Set production to granary.
All warriors continue exploring
mm Gao for food. worker and pop in 2 turns.

(10) 1750 BC Set worker to irrigate new wheat tile for Timbuktu.
Barb has reappeard on mountain in west. Move one of our warriors there on to adjacent mountain. Fortify warrior on forest 1 square SW of Koumbi Saleh.
Timbuktu produces warrior. I have left this warrior in Timbuktu so that the next player can decide which way to sent him.

I decided to do only 10 turns as I met the Egyptions, and I need to go to bed. :sleep:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK37.040.gif
Zoomed out map of current empire

To summarise:

We have a new city, Koumbi Saleh. It is set up perfectly for a settler factory. I would suggest keeping Gao as a settler/worker factory as well. It can never hurt to have too many of them, and so early in the game can provide a massive population boost.

The Egyptions still don't have Writing, if we can meet the Zulus and some European civs as well we should be in a much better position to by some contacts, then buy some techs.

There is nice land to the east, this is currently being explored. There are also warriors heading towards Europe, to the west, and to the Zulus.


Feedback would be appreciated as this is my first SG and so hints on how to play more communally or on my reporting style are very welcome.

Uh, save game please.
Do you know how to use the upload feature?

=========================

The General Songhai plan:
1) First to contact the Zulu, hopefully exclusive and contact trading.
2) Contact Egypt and try to get past for further contact.
3) First ships to America.

Can we get lucky and Egypt sell contact with us?

LKendter
Anarres
Meldor (Currently playing)
Dark Sheer (on deck) (needs to re-confirm with 24 hours, or Kazin is playing)
Kazin (alternate if DS doesn't confirm by the time Meldor is done)
Lt. 'Killer' M.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

Sorry, I almost went to bed without posting the save...

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39.1750_BC.zip

Got it

1750 BC (Pre-turn)
GAo is building a worker to bring it down to size 1? this is bad as it takes too long for it to grow again. Swap it to build a temple and move warrior form Timbuktu in that direction. Gao should not be allowed to go below pop3 again. Timbuktu is building another warrior, I change this to a temple, both to give time to grow and get the pop up to be able to be a true settler factory. Koumbi Saleh is building a granary but it was three bonus food sources within its range and several floodplains. This is changed to an archer to slag some barb camps with. Jenne is building a warrior, I leave this as it will come in handy for MP duty. We have an over abundance of improved tiles at Timbuktu and none at Koumbi Saleh. We are many turns from MM.

1725 BC (1)
Gao grows one but the MP warrior arrives just in time. This is emp level and we get no free happy people. Warrior headed for the Zulu turns back slightly to pick up goodie hut.
(I) Jenne builds its warrior and starts an archer.

1700 BC (2)
Pop goodie hut and get nasty barbs.
(I) Warrior survives tow barb attacks with 1 HP and promotes. Third baeb wanders off. Egyptian warrior appears outside Gao. Good thing it isn't empty.

1675 BC (3)
Southern warrior rests before continuing on. Buy fine worker from Egypt for 112 and send it towards Koumbi Saleh.

1650 BC (4)
Gao grows again and the lux slider is moved to 10%.
(I) Xeres come a calling with Bronze working for 180g, I tell him no thanks as we should be known to every one but South America and Austrilia in a few turns. That will drop the price on thing considerably.

1625 BC (5)
I notice that Xeres has writing and Cleo doesn't. She will have it soon enough so She gets writngs and 55g for Bronze Working and The Wheel. We ahve horses within range of Timbuktu. Thank the resource RnG for that. Spot Zulu border to the south. Almost to the Med to the north.
(I) Gao completes its temple and starts a spear. Koumbi completes an archer and starts a spear.

1600 BC (6)
Find goodie hut and barb camp to the west. Barb horse appears from the NW. Get a step closer to the Zulu but no contact yet.
(I) Horse attacks Gao, warrior promotes.

1575 BC (7)
Pop goodie hut to the west and get a settler!. Pinkish border spotted to the north.
(I) Timbuktu finishes a temple and starts a spear. The Australians complete the Colossus! What devilish things did you do to them Lee?

1550 BC (8)
Warrior ignores barb camp for now and escorts settler to its new home. Alphabet for Iron working and 132g from Shaka. The Wheel get Mysticism and 128g (all he had). We can trade contact with the Zulu for more tech, but I will wait a little. We have iron near Jenne.
(I) Jenne build an archer and starts a barracks.

1525 BC (9)
Walata is formed on the coast by a river and pops the barb camp at the same time. The warrior fortifies as the barb won't be happy we stole his tents. It starts a spear. Still no contact from the pink border, will wait one more turn.
(I) Gao build a spear and switchs to a settler. We need more shield there for sure.

1500 BC (10)
No new contacts. I leave the choice of what to do with the northern warrio to the next person.

At this point we can sell contact to the Zulu to everyone and probably get all contacts and catch up in tech. This I also defer to the next person.
Gao is set to grow to 6 in 5 and produce a settler on the same turn. There is a worker on the way to improve one more tile for more shields.

LK39 1500 BC Saved Game (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39-1500BC.zip)

1575 BC (7)
Pop goodie hut to the west and get a settler!. Pinkish border spotted to the north.
(I) Timbuktu finishes a temple and starts a spear. The Australians complete the Colossus! What devilish things did you do to them Lee?


Free settler - never argrue with those [dance]

The only thing I did to Australia is give them a second worker / settler to get a stronger start. It sounds like it worked. ;)


The General Songhai plan:
1) Trade like crazy, at least every other turn.
2) First ships to America.

Sound like we have entered the heavy trading phase.
Once mapmaking is done the money will be rolling ;)

LKendter
Anarres
Meldor
Kazin (currently playing) **
Lt. 'Killer' M. (on deck)

** Kazin is in, as DS missed my deadline of posting by the time Meldor plays.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

Originally posted by LKendter
The General Songhai plan:
1) Trade like crazy, at least every other turn.
2) First ships to America.

Sound like we have entered the heavy trading phase.
Once mapmaking is done the money will be rolling ;)

Some thoughts since it was so late before I got finished.

1) We can get contact with everyone else and tech parity with everyone else with the sell of contact to the Zulus alone. Start trading contact with the Zulus to those who will give contact with someone else and some small amount of cash. Then move to the next one. You will probably find some of the AI who do not have contact with each other yet. This is the trade you need to sell them contact with the other one for tech that we don't have. Some of them may not have writing as yet, use that for extra contacts and techs as well. Once we know everyone it will make things a lot cheaper.
2) No one has Map Making yet (the tech we are researching) as the cost of it is still max. Hopefully that will be the case when you finish trading contacts and tech. Going after this tech will allow us to be the first to get galleys oout and exploring. This makes our maps worth more and gives us the chance to have the first contact with both Australia and the Americas. More exclusive trading.

We have a bunch of money right now because the tech we are researching is a 40 turn tech no matter what (unless we find someone with it already). The city I settled is on the coast, so when we get close, start a prebuild for a galley so we can get it to America faster.

As for the placement of the next settlers, we should now rapidly expand toward the eastern coast. We have a natural dessert barrier to the north and jungle to teh south, but we need to grab all those bonus food and water locations before the Egyptians can. The good news is that we have plenty of horses and iron. We should be able to connect these up and make a lot of money off of them if we can get trade routes to the rest. Also, there is a nice fertile area on the northwest tip that we should grab as well before the Europeans ran out of room. But please, do not let the population drop in the core cities again. I spent most of my turns getting the pop back up to were it should be. We should now be able to build settlers every 5 or so turns and still keep the pop above 4. We will have threee cities capable of producing settlers and workers so we should hit a rapid expansion phase.

Be careful of the barbs. do not let the camps hang around. We want our settlers to be safe.

A couple more things.....

Buying workers is still a good deal.
Once we can sell maps, we should use that to generate extra income.
I know it is a big pain, but on this map with this many civs things change rapidly. You have to do a diplo check every turn. That also increases the chance we can buy workers.

thoughts:

1) I wouldn't blame anarres for letting the pop go low. w/o at least 1 lux there's too much loss from luxury tax or entertainers.
Things change one you have that one lux, so from now on we should stay on high pop in the core, as meldor says!

2) be carefull trading lux/res to Europe - Egypt will control that and we get the blame if they go to war with either a civ in between or us or our trading partner!

Originally posted by meldor
But please, do not let the population drop in the core cities again. I spent most of my turns getting the pop back up to were it should be.The reason I was going to produce a worker from Gao is that we really needed another one, and I thought that Koumbi Saleh would make an excellent settler factory, so it was busy building a granary. Also, size 2 was max for Gao without any police units or lux slider. I would not have kept it small, just wanted the extra worker. The settler Gao built before the worker was queued was used to build Koumbi Saleh, itself a better location than Gao.

I personally would have kept Koumbi Saleh as a settler factory and nothing else as it has the potential to pump settlers every 4 to 5 turns. I prefer building granaries in any city that is producing workers or settlers, and so I try to have dedicated settler factories and dedicated unit-producing cities. I tend not to build settlers in unit-producing cities when they get too big, instead I manage the tiles so that there is max production and no growth when it is the desired size.

I am new to SG's, and am not familiar with the do's and don'ts. If these kinds of issues have been resolved in the many SG games people here have participated in, please let me know. I am more than ready to accept criticism, but I need more information on why what I have done is wrong if I am to change, as this is my normal playing style.

It was really fun to play, and I can see myself becoming addicted to SG games, but more feedback on the style of play would be appreciated if it is not currently what you want. :)

anarres: I would have built a Granry in Gao, too, then getting a spear and a settler every 15 turns from it with. 2 police it wouldn't have needed lux in any form them. But that's playing style differences, and I agree fully on you decision with the worker. Gao grows so fast that it is worth it, especially as we will soon be short on workers once we start taking all the lands to the east.

I think meldors comment was less criticism and more warning for the future, as things change with the lux we get ;)

Everyone plays cities differently - with 2 floodplains wheat (food heavy and shield poor) I would also run the capital to size 1. This city can grow back to size 3 very fast - we need at least 2 cities building settlers so that we can push toward the med area, toward the Zulu and the spice area, and toward the nice area in the Atlantic.

Koumbi Saleh is an excellent choice for a granary and settlers, as plains wheat has shield and cow plains have shields.

I like the fact that we start have the exclusive on map-making. If we are the first there - probably my turn :) - we can get a lot from the map including probably all of the missing techs. Of course, if Killer doesn't do it first ;)



We may want to make Gao a WORKER factory. It will quickly grow, claim the mined plains, and start the cycle again. We can always us more workers. I granary in Gao will be brutal, as we will need a lot of effort to get 60 shields from that city.

I didn't feel bad about what meldor said, it's just that I dont want to f**k the game up in any way, remember I'm just a noobie at this.

I said what I did so that I could get advice for the future, and I apologise to meldor if the last post sounded a bit defensive, I know he wasn't having a go.

Can't wait for my next turn :D

I did not mean the pre-turn comments to mean that you made bad choices, they just were not the choices I would have made at that time. In general, my choices for building up any city are to try and balance the the amount of food and shields to meet what the city can do at that time. Once we get a decent government our cities will be even more unbalanced towards food.

I think it is better early on to use the lux slider instead of keeping the pop low. Gao's limiting factor for growth is shields not food. While it is true that Gao can quickly get back to 3 pop from 1 it can't build anything while it is doing that. With a low level of population, it must either produce shileds or produce food. With the higher pop level it can produce shields and food. With the population up it should be able to produce a settler every 5 turns, even without the granary. That would take at least twice as long at the lower pop levels. I think I proved to myself in QSC1 that taking the extra few turns to get the pop up pays off in the long run. Commerce is not our main problem right now. We have plenty of income. We can afford to keep the lux slider on 10-20% for a long time if it means getting settlers out sooner.

I have no objection to the a granary in KS, its just that it again has more food than shields to start with. The granary multipoes food but does nothing for shields. The temple allows it to pull in more landed that can be improved to give it more shields. Then the granary can be built quicker and do more for us as the shield production will match better.

AS for trading with the Europeans powers, we need to establish our own routes to Europe through our own harbors on the Med. If we do that and maybe a city somewhere in England, we eliminate the chance that one civ can cut us off (if unintentionally) with our trading partners. I would like to see us with cities and harbors on all three coasts before the expansion grab is over. There are alos wines to the east that would be nice to have as well. Two native luxes are better than one of course.

meldor: exactly what i meant: be wary dealing until the routes are secure. I wasn't thinking so far ahead as a completed harbor for both us and the AIs on the med ;)

On the question of luxuries - don't forget that at least one spice spotted down south :)

We have a huge amount of good spots to get, so multiple settlers sources is a good thing. Plus, we know from the map layout that we want the little island in the Atlantic. Hey, if we hold map making maybe we can be the first in England :lol:

OK, now that I'm actually in, LK, could you give me a link to download the need files please.

The links to the files are in the LK World updates thread:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showt...&threadid=38461
or you can use these:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LKWorld-V9N.zip
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/SETUP-UNITS3.zip

Kazin: see above!

there are the links and the instructions!

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38461

here you can find the *.bat file!

Don't forget:


Installation instructions:
All players should run the unit setup file!
Drop the batch file SETUP-UNIT3.bat under the directory:
C:\Program Files\Infogrames Interactive\Civilization III\Art\units
Run it to will create the needed new units.

Got it.

1) King Kazin ascends to the throne. I trade 250 gold and contact with the Zulu to Xerses for contact with the Russians, Chinese, Mongols and French.

2) Koumbi Saleh and Timbuktu complete spearmen. Koumbli Saleh starts a temple to let it grow before it starts producing settlers /workers. Timbuktu starts a settler. Gao micromanaged to produced a settler faster. Buy contact with the Germans and India for 20 and 25 gold respectively. I notice that India has Horseback Riding and the Zulu need it. I trade 200 gold to India for Horseback Riding, then trade that to the Zulu for Masonry. We are now at full tech parity with everyone, even ahead of some. Also, NO ONE else has contact with the Zulu, this make us their only trading source for now, we must use it like I did with that two for one tech deal .

3) Thought about starting the Pyramids, but realizing that we have no chance at getting them. All the civs had masonry, which leads me to believe that it was discovered a while ago. Thus, having no pre-build, we wouldn't have a change at getting it.


4) France and Persia had discovered Philosophy, no point in buying it now, as no one else has anything to trade for it.

5) There are four spices to the north of us, this must be a priority.

6) Settler produced it Gao, set to Oracle as a pre-build for the Great Library. Popped a hut, warriors :(

7) Temple produced it Koumbi Saleh, starts on worker. The settler from Gao is going to swing by Koumbi Saleh and hook up with the warrior currently on mp duty there. The pair will then head up to the spices.

8) Nothing

9) That spice down south turns out to only be one. Pop a goodie hut, more warriors :(

10) Iron is hooked up. Notice that the Babs have Map making and no one else except Persia has it. They want 500 gold for it, but I decide it is worth it. Then I trade Map making to Joan for Philosophy, WM, and 40 gold. That's 2 techs, a WM, and 40 gold for 500 gold. Not bad.

P.S. : I think I played a few extra turns at the start, but I forgot to keep track, sorry :o


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/lk39-1200_bc.sav

Where is the save file?

got it.

will look at it, but I don't think i will ba able to play. Will know more tomorrow evening, if I can play I'll post so.

@Killer
Please CANCEL the Oracle. I will not get past my turn no matter what. This will cost us multiple cities, which are much more important to get our powerbase.


10) Iron is hooked up. Notice that the Babs have Map making and no one else except Persia has it. They want 500 gold for it, but I decide it is worth it. Then I trade Map making to Joan for Philosophy, WM, and 40 gold. That's 2 techs, a WM, and 40 gold for 500 gold. Not bad.

Please limit future tech trading till more people have the tech. $500 is way high to an ancient age tech. We could have gotten it in 10 more turns for pennies.

Killer - if you play, you need a massive pre-turn map making sesion. Once the tech is out there, we need to get into heavy map selling, and switch our coastal city to galley ASAP.

Sorry about those two :(

A little more detail on the Great Library -

On the world map game, the tech pace is SLOW during the ancient and early middle ages. This is when the library will get it's use. We are already rolling in cash, so it is NO problem at all to keep pace in the early game. Give me the choice of 10+ settlers, or the GL and there is NO question which one will win.


On map making - we had a 40 turn minimum science almost completed. We were due map mapmaking in 10 turns. This is why I said pennies in 10 turns.

I got a chance to look at the game - switch Gao to Granary due in just 5 turns.

I can play this late tonight, so let me know by then Killer.
I get to play mega trading round, which we need to rebuild cash.
I love the trade happy rounds ;)

sory, something came up. Lee can we two switch? I started playing but never got paste the first go-around on the trade screen before I was stopped :(

OK - Get a great pre-turn trading round.
You should be able to get a fortune from the wm ;)

Also, get the other cow / wheat city on a granary.

Lee?

Weird - How did I not see the message between posts?

I got it.


It did take a bit to figure out the confusing "Lee?" until I read the last page again.

@Kazin - Please save the game at the END of the turn.

Worker automation is PROHIBTED - a worker must have been automated - It completed a road 1200BC, then moved next turn.


1200 BC (pre-turn) - I change Gao and Koumbi Saleh to granary, so that we can really pump out settlers soon.
Our lone coastal city is switch to a galley.
We really need some cities building military, so I switch Timbuktu to a barracks.

I begin the massive trading session (mainly maps) with $41, and end with $571.
The only civ left with any cash is Babylon - I just couldn't drain $500 plus from him.

1175 BC - This is why I obsess about trading maps when playing the world - we gain $47, while we are making just $22 a turn.

1125 BC - OUCH, I found a second automated worker.
(I) Russia completed the Oracle.

1100 BC - Several civs have math - did it appear from a hut?
I still double our income thanks to improved maps.

1075 BC - Sokoto is formed along the coast, so it orders a galley. We want to explore those seas.
How did India suddenly get 3 techs above us?
We get to purchase a Russian worker - you can never have enough workers this early on.

1050 BC - Once again, I almost double our income with selling our map.

1000 BC (I) - I decide to skim a worker from Koumbi Saleh before more settlers - we badly need more workers.

975 BC - Gao has gotten to large, luxuries forced to 20%.

950 BC - Gwandu is formed - we have the city of wines [dance].
An immediate temple is ordered, as we are close to France.
I dropped luxuries back to 10% - it looks like we are going to play the moving luxury slider game.
China is nice enough to sell us a worker.

We actually do some tech trading -
I get Polytheism from the Mongols for Map Making, Philosophy, and $10.
I use Polytheism to get Literature from France in an even swap.
I sell Polytheism to China for $130.
I sell Polytheism to Russia for Math and $115.
Nobody else has enough to offer, however I can't argue with us being PAID $235 to get 3 new techs. :)

Summary - Send the Galley from Walata north - to Spain, England, Ireland, Greenland and finally America - I love first contacts.

With the techs we have keep an eye out to buy a worker with a tech.


LKendter
Anarres (on deck)
Meldor
Kazin
Lt. 'Killer' M. (currently playing)

Trade like crazy, at least every other turn, preferably every turn.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39-950BC.zip


The area I really want - count the number of cows. The newest settler is heading that way.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LAK-243.jpg


The other area we can't afford to ignore to long - that many incense is just to good of future trading material.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LAK-244.jpg

got it!


Lee, I edited my post BEFORE you posted, and when it came back after editing you had posted - weird :lol:


How exactly did you trade around? I'd be interested in knowing *your* style. I'd have sold known techs (Writing, Philo) first for WM and cash, then gone around trading Map Making and WM (possibly in 2 steps)........

preturn: if you get a game from Lee, you don't have to check around - but I still do. Well, another 4 minutes for nothing ;)

(1) 925 BC - The Babs start the GL. Worker done, order settler. Make note to settle second iron 'soon' (after the other good spots) so we can trade it. Walata gets mmed to give more tax. Galley will be done next turn. Strat roading used forest tiles to get tax bonus. The settler - where to send him? I decide for the tile with the warrior in Lees screenie. the next one can tehn take the forest at the bottom right of the screenie for a 2 plain overlap, getting wheat, cow, another horse and river. Then, along the same line 5 tiles down is the next river with wheat - but that will be a tight thing against Egypt.
Jenne stops using the grassland with the worker on it atm as it gives no bonus. The iron it is now, as this is NOT a growth, but a unit production town.
Timbuktu will grow into unhappiness in 2, I order a settler (3) as we really really really(!) need them atm, especially as we could use one to go on the Galley for an oversses colony.
The two Spearmen go to the cow site and to Sokoto. Next produced will go to Timbuktu

(2) 900 BC - The Galley is done and goes north. Code of Law is known to two, ask WM and 580 - no tx. There's noone with money to sell it to. The mongols popped a hut and can pay WM and 50 for Literature :D Math has spread around - huts again?

(3) 875 BC - France and Mongols start GL - no surprise here. Go waste shields ;) Three Zulus approach a barb camp and we earn 25 Gold. :p --> Shaka!

(4) 850 BC - almost everyone has CoL now, and only Persia doesn't have Lit and would sell CoL for WM, Lit and 270. Barter him down to 220. I decide to take it as we have so much money and will make more with our Galleys. It *is* expensive, but the price will not drop for a while,a s the other civs are behind us and will take long to learn it.

(5) 825 BC - settler from Gao takes escort Spear along to coast near incense.

(6) 800 BC - Brazil(!) completes Pyramids. Cascade to GL and GLight. Another settler in Koumbi. He goes to coast for iron spot (--> trade). buy a worker each from China and Egypt. Soem civs have huge money lying around, Persia e.g., and we cannot sell anything but WM for 9. Arwan is founded and starts a Temple.
(7) 775 BC - nothing. Map trades get a bit better. 120 for worker from Mao is too much atm. He's at war it seems.

(8) 750 BC - again nothing new. WM down to 1 G each for most.

(9) 725 BC - another Galley. Will keep pumping them out in case one or two get sunk by barbs. Skip trading this turn as 2 time 1 is < 4. If we keep up trading WM every turn we will not see more that 1 Gold / turn usually. every 2nd gives chance at more in my experience. This changes when we discover new areas though (soon, GB).

(10) 710 BC - A third Galley, from Sokoto, goes south to discover coast to up map value. I see no point in sending this on norht, too as it would be the third and also is behind because of starting further south.
Hombori founded. No prod assigned as this is my last turn. A horseman from Timbuktu goes east to cover the two new towns.
Segu founded, 1 tile inland and 1 tile overlap but maximizing landgrab and covering iron. WM value is down to TM or 1 Gold for most.



suggestions: workers can build roads along both sides of rivers to spped movements. I already started this, especially the woker next to Goa on floodplain should road it as a settler going south or east from there will otherwise loose 2/3 move right away.

keep the Galleys going!



http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39-710BC.zip

Originally posted by Lt. 'Killer' M.
How exactly did you trade around? I'd be interested in knowing *your* style. I'd have sold known techs (Writing, Philo) first for WM and cash, then gone around trading Map Making and WM (possibly in 2 steps)........


I went down the line starting trying to sell map, and see if they would give wm in return. I did have to give up tech in a couple of spots, but for the most part I got wm and all cash for wm.

Babylon still had cash after I sold it to him, so I kept going back to him after the next person to keep milking him closer to zero. I did get almost $300 from him.

==========================

On turn 10, when I saw the potential trade with Mongols using 2 techs for just 1 - I rechecked the civs to see if money was out there. When I confirmed it - I went back to the Mongols, made the trade. Then I approached every one with cash to see who wanted the tech. Russia giving away math was an unexpected bonus.

Still getting 3 techs and being AHEAD in cash :D

I have some areas that need improvement like dot maps, but trading is one of my better areas. Your challenge - see if you can find a couple more workers for sale - I was happy to add two to our total.

After I post - was building it for several minutes - I catch
buy a worker each from China and Egypt. :)

We will eventually need to connect to incense area and wine town. We have tons of worker tasks to keep out guys busy.
====================================

LKendter
Anarres (currently playing)
Meldor (on deck)
Kazin
Lt. 'Killer' M.

Trade like crazy, at least every other turn, preferably every turn.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

Got it.

preturn:
Koumbi Saleh mm for food. It will grow in 1 turn, settler still in 2 turns. Hombori set to barracks, I chose between that and granary, but another unit producing city is probably better (especially as it is close to egypt). Segu set to temple to get 3x gold on expansion. Lux slider set back to 0%.

We can afford to let one city get too big and use the scientist insead of the 5 gold per turn we are currntly paying.

AI:
French complete Great Library

(1) 690 BC: Archer just south of Segu is sent east to Sokoto as it is growing in 4 turns. Settler from Gao is sent SE, eventually (hopefully!) to grab the river and wheat tiles just south of the egyptian city El-Amarna

I have decided that I want some more workers. We currently have 4 of our own and 5 foreign workers, but this doesn't seem enough for the job. There is also still plenty of expansion room. I was tempted to build a granary in Hombori or Arwan, but they both need to buid temples to get all the calle and wheat so they may as well build them first. The only other choice is Timbuktu. It is size 5 already, and IMO it is best to keep it below 7 or settlers and workers will cost more if we ever want them from there. With a bit of mm it will build Granary in 8, and expand in 10. With 1 wheat and all plains it should stil be good at producing settlers.

Change Gao to worker next turn. Walata to expand in 2 turns, it will need more happiness, and Kolumbi Saleh can lose a tile and still build settler next turn. Also, raising lux to 10% would not get a happy face in Walata, so I move the spear from Kolumbi Saleh towards Walata, and get a scientist from Kolumbi Saleh. Science slider set to 0%.

120 gold from wm trading :D

AI:
Zulu ask us to leave his territory (I was moving our warrior home)
Chinese complete Great Lighthouse

(2) 670 BC: Settler from Koumbi Saleh sent SE, for another city to the east of Homburi
mm Gao for food, set to settler. Kolumbi Saleh set to settler. Science set back to 10%
51 gold from wm trading.

AI:
Babylon demands 100 gold. I give in because Babylon is 7 moves away if he has an ROP with Egypt. I don't want to take the risk, but normally I would have done so. Make a mental note, Babylon must suffer for this later.

(3) 650 BC: Gwandu builds warrior and now has 2, so I set to worker
Spear from Jenna east to new cities locaion
28 gold from wm trading. I am going to switch to every 2 turns, but I will still check diplo every turn for workers.

(4) 630 BC: Agadez built for incense. Here was the settler in turn 1:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39.02.01.jpg

The black dot and the red dot are the two locations I had to choose from for the incense city. The blue dot is a future city (with 2 whales). I chose the red spot for the incense city for the two plains tiles and to support Gwandu.
mm Kolum Saleh for food

(5) 619 BC: Walate builds another Galley. Set to harbor. Sokoto is now producing Galleys and a harbour would be good for trade. Galley sent to North. Spear from Arwan now goes with settler that is going east.
mm Gao for scientist, it is now size 5. mm Koumbi Saleh for shields. Science to 0%.
78 gold for wm. Pay 116 for worker fro Russia.

(6) 590 BC: Arwan builds temple. Change to barracks. Lots of minor things, but nothing of note.

(7) 570 BC: Gwandu produces worker, set to barracks. Jenne produces another spear, sent east again, left on spear.
mm Gao, Timbuktu for food, mm Koumbi Saleh for happinss instead of lux slider, it can still build settler in 1.
109 gold from wm trades. China has Currency.

(8) 550 BC: Gao produces settler, switch to worker. Koumbi Saleh produces settler, switch to barracks as it is size 2. Sokoto is finally connected by road. Our settlers are heading east, but the egyptians are blocking us off. We have 2 settlers en route to the east but egypt will beat us :mad: I am trying to block with a horse and a spear, but it is only slowing him down marginally.
We have lost our scientist at Gao, so set science to 10%.

(9) 530 BC: Timbuktu produces granary, switch to worker.
85 from wm trading. Mongols and French both got currency this turn, but still ultra expansive. Worker from Zulu for Literature, nearly everyone has it now. Bought worker from China for 108 gold.

(10) 510 BC: Hombori builds temple, set to barracks. Warrior returning from the Zulu kills barb camp for gold.
mm Timbuktu for happiness, get scientist, set slider to 10%. mm Segu for happiness, get taxman. This is only for 2 turns until a connecting road is built.


Summary

Arwan is set to granary, but barracks may be better now the Egytpians are cutting off some nice land to the east. There are 4 settlers heading east. The Egyptians are in our potential territory to the east. The Egyptian settler is in the square to the NE of our selected archer:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39.02.10.east2.jpg

He just moved there last turn from one square west, so I doubt if he will move back there this turn. I was planning a city on the square with the archer in, but you may need to head further south now.

I would reccommend preparing for war, with lots(!) more workers, as Egypt has some very nice land to take. I recently got a Forbidden Palace popup, so an FP may be worth considering, maybe even in Hombori?

There are 3 foreign workers roading up to the grape-city Gwandu, also picking up the incense-city Agadez. This will bring 2 more lux's in the next 15 - 20 turns. :)

I have deliberately been heavy on settlers and workers and light on military, as I wanted to grab as much land as possible before the Egyptians took it.


Here is the save: LK_SAVE (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39.510BC.zip)

LKendter
Anarres
Meldor (currently playing)
Kazin (on deck)
Lt. 'Killer' M.

Trade like crazy, at least every other turn, preferably every turn.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

I got a chance to look at the map - our galley is already in Greenland. :)
:crazyeye: Greenland has a patch of DYES! We want to get a settler, escort and a couple of workers up there!

Speaking of luxuries - don't forget that lone spice in Africa - we already have 3 luxuries. I would love to secure one of two more natural luxuries.

I would love to get blue dot - that will be a great fishing village.

The location of Segu
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LAK-246.jpg
We can always use more coastal city - this game requires a lot of shipping. The city would have been better off at either black dot.

Our current ranking
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LAK-247.jpg


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LAK-248.jpg
The black dots are spaces wasted due to placement of Agadez - not much we can do there.
The other needed city near incense is yellow dot - once the borders expand we will control all 4 incense :)

I see it but can't play until tomorrow night.

@LK:

I agree about Segu, I would have put it on the coast, but it would have been a close call for me. I agree that the yellow dot in the first picture will be a good coastal city.

Agadez placement was more important to me than 2 plains tiles. The long term position is better IMO, as this allows a city on the small island to the NW of Agadez to get both whales and not overlap too much. Also, the incense is now secure from the Babylonian settler that is just east of Agadez.

I agree with anarress on Agadez.

As for Segu: I kept changing my opinion on that one, seeing both the need for shipping and the need to use the inland well. I expect us to take Egypt soon, at least partly, thus I didn't want to put too much emphasis on coastal cities.



As for Dye in Greenland: THis makes me glad I went for settlers and workers, and I felt like :D when I read that anarres kept that up. Expand, expand, expand!

:satan: Egypt a possible victim of the Dynia super knight :satan:

I think our next galley needs to sail north to Greenland with a settler and escort - true it will never be that great on production, but the dyes are worth it. Please ANY city gets us closer to Domination.


===========================
FYI - I think I may have hosed, and forget to disable cultural win :(
#1 in culture is Babylon, so we need to avoid fights with them at all cost until close to the end of the game.


===========================
Medlor should look for a pre-build site - feudalism isn't that far away - I want Sun Tzu since this a mega warmonger game.

===========================

As for the fp - let's wait a bit - we are probably going to do another palace jump game. We need to better see the size of our empire before making the fp jump.

===========================

:love: I will say this much - random resouces makes the game a lot more fun - I never thought I would care about Greenland this early. :love:

I did get a chance to look at the game last night. There are three settlers already built that are in the east. I had thought about getting one from Timbuktu. I don't think it would be worth pulling one of them back, but one may still be on the raod system and can be diverted to a coastal pickup point. The spot I would like to send the new (Timbuktu settler is the last desert spot to seal in the dyes. The other two settlers will probaly go for the cows slightly S.E (directly south of Eygpt. and the seond going for the spices in the jungle. I will also start a galley towards Australia, if we can get there first it would be a bonus, if not we are still opening up more of the map. I will try to also send a couple more settlers up the coast. It would be nice to get one in Ireland/England and Iceland. Of course, lets not wait too long on the islands off our coast. Expasion is still in full swing.

Question: Which AI besides us was the most actiuve explorer? it is important to know as this is the first we should trade maps with each round. The combined maps make it more expensive for the less inclined.

One point for those who haven't played this map yet. As soon as the civs run out of room to expand, expect a massive, everyone and their uncle war. There will probably not be complete peace until we make it.

@Lee, what about the program DS used to disable it last time? Is it available for PTW?

I tried the Civ Placement Tool - At the moment is doesn't understand PTW as many of the tools don't.

I know map stat for PTW is in progress.

CPT has mentioned plans for PTW, but no defined date yet.

on the map:

Persia is the richest - go to them last.
explorers were mongols (as shown in their repeated 25 or 50 Gold jumps).

@Lee, It was Civ3MultiTool he used. It doesn't llok like a PTW version is due anytime soon. I didn't see any PTW bic editor.

[EDIT] Corrected the name of the tool.

I found both the mongols and the germans were discoving new maps with frequency.

When I map trade, I first go through all the civs and buy any maps worth more than 1 gold, buying them with gold only, not with our WM. I then do a second round selling to everyone. That way you make sure to maximise your return, as you guarantee having all of the known maps when you start selling.

I could only squeeze in a couple of turns as my son had a school project to work on and the diplo in this game takes longer than usual. I have managed to buy two workers in two and a half turns.

510 BC (Pre-turn)
Do a quick diplo check, sell map for spare change, pick up worker from Greece for WM and 108g. It may seem expensive, but worker buying pays off big in the long run. Change Timbuktu to settler. I want one to send to get the rest of the incense. Most likely the Egyptian settler will beat us to a spot near the wheat. I will head the four current settlers as follows: the two cows, the spice, on the coast near the congo, and one aboard a gally for Greenland for Lee. I will let the worker finish at Gao but will then hit it for another settler.
(I) The galley completes in Sokoto, I let it build one more. The spear finishes in Jenne, it is set to a settler.

490 BC (1)
The settler and spear in Jenne head for the new galley at the coast. Start the settler towards there new city sites. Three civ now have currency, we could get it from Joan at 730g but could only sell it for ~400g. I then notice we have no embassies. They are cheaper now while the cities are small and the number of cities are low. Get embassy with France for 39g. Paris is size 3 and building a temple. It does have the Great Library Lee if you want to try the same gambit as LK37. It would be a safer gambit here as we won't be in AW and Paris is close to the coast. Complete embassies with others. Thebes completes a worker this turn, we will buy it. Sell maps to everyone at ~4g each. Sell RoP to Mongols at 12g. RoP with Greece for 15g.
(I) Egypt settles on the hill opposite the cow. Gao finishes a worker and starts a settler.

470 BC (2)
Settlers moving. Buy the aforementioned Egyptian worker. Settler/Spear board galley for Greenland. Galley near france turns around for settler/spear for Ireland/England. Sell WM around.

470 BC (2)
(I) Nada

450 BC (3)
Settler rounds the horn of Greenland, we are almost there. Change mind on placement to third city. I buy two Zulu workers for 227g. I then buy currency and resell it for all but 100g of what we paid. It was about to hit the bargin basement and we wouldn't have been able to sell it to anyone. Construction came up with the Mongols, China and Russia. Trade WMs of course. Lux to 10% to prevent riots in Gao in Koumbi Saleh.
(I) The French start the Great Wall. Timbuktu builds a settler, we lose the scientist and move science to 10%.

430 BC (4)
Timbuktu settler moves to lock in the rest of the incense. Trade WMs, no workers this time.
(I) Koumbi Saleh builds a barracks and starts a spear. Segu builds a temple and start a barracks. Jenne builds a spear and starts a temple.

410 BC (5)
Katsina is built in a spot that has overlap but it is the only spot on the river close by. Busa is built on spot with two cows and can grab one of the wheats from Lisht, it starts a temple. Trade WMs, no workers again.
(I) Nada.

390 BC (6)
Build Daria to get spices on expansion and yet still allow for another city to be built on the coast. We round the corner and head for Canada. Again WMs and no workers.
(I) Egypt and China start the Great wall.

370 BC (7)
We are headed down the side of Canada. Trade WM and get Persian worker for 111g.
(I) Nada.

350 BC (8)
Not much, Eyptian archers are drifting south!
(I) Babylon starts the Hanging gardens.

330 BC (9)
Nioro founded to lock in incense. Find some blue borders in the new world, but no contact yet. Trade WM and get Chinese worker for 95g in deal.
(I) Babs start Great Wall, more Egyptian archers are gathering.

310 BC (10)
I switch everthing that makes sense to military builds which isn't much, start recalling the troops. Glad we have embassies, as we are going to need to buy the Babs into the fight. Meet America, they are up on techs except currancy! Sell them currancy for WM, 12g (all they had) and contact with the Iroquois. Strange, his WM has all of SA as well. I think we hit the sell of our contact on our turn bug. We now have contact with everyone in the world and didn't have to pay for it. Sell backward nations techs to clean out treasuries. 416g and WM to Aztecs for Currency. Argentina pays 482g for it. I then sell world maps to empty all but Joanies treasury (she paid 517g). We went from 1200g to 3600+ with the first contact and sell of maps.

I have not finished the last turn yet. I wanted to generate some discussion first. We are behind in tech, by Construction (due in 10 turns) Monarchy, and Monotheism. We can get completely caught up in tech by selling contacts or we can wait 5-10 turns and hope another tech pops up we can grab for them. Joanie is actively out there and I don't know how far she is behind us. China and Mongolia will be coming from the other side.

Notes for the next person: Settle near Timbuktu is headed for Gally to go to either isalnds off of Africa or England/Ireland. We need to fill in the smaller islands and get some of the coast filled in as well. I wuld spend the nexxt 10-20 turns on military if Cleo doesn't force the issue anyway. We are way behind in military and infrastructure. I would almost push for going for tech parity right now just because the threat of war from Egypt. At least then we could switch to Monarchy and cash build infrastructure and troops. There is a settler in place to build a city to lock in desert next to Gao. I know this won't be productive until after rails, but it is a defensive city.

If the discussion leaves nothing to do I will just post the game and pass it on.....else its off to the markets to buy, buy, buy.

meldor: :goodjob:

what are our civ traits? Are we religious? If NOT, buying Monarchy and revolting GUARANTEES an Egyptian attack!

I love the cash rush from America. :)

First contact always rocks. I say SELL contacts now to who will pay the best price. The AI will demand contact, and with a possible war why give them an excuse. In addition, this will hoard cash for military rushes. Plus a rushed harbor in Greenland would be nice ;)

Do we have Republic, or is it available? I would prefer Republic but either cash rush government works.
Either way let's revolt to something - being religious we can quickly get into a cash rush government.

I agree, if Egypt attacks we want to be able to mass cash rush military. In addition to pulling in Babylon, we probably want to pull in the Zulu. Did we aggressively settler a city? That increases the odds of war.

Heading out to work, so can't offer more comments.

we are religious [party]

let's sell, buy, revolt!

The peasants are revolting! (I always wanted to say that)

Hey guys, just leave me some of Egypt to mop up, or at least an army to carry on with :D

I double checked Songahi, per the wm posts:

Remove Rome and replaced with the Songhai - Religious and Commercial.

FWIW, you can tell if religous by checking the cost of temples...

On Kazin turn's, let get a big rush on military with careful spending - $3000 can go quickly at if we aren't careful. Plus we are getting close to our UU, and I would like the $80 a pop to upgrade horseman to Dynia.
Unless Egypt declares war, start the unit, and cash rush the next turn in our LOW shields towns - making sure we have barracks first.
Let the higher shield towns complete on their own. I would still squeeze in some settlers unless war starts.

If Egypt declares war, then use the partial cash rush method - rush worker at $80, then rush the unit. Still make sure we have barracks, as the 1 hp difference does win battles and is one of the human edges.

Let's hope those units are simply wandering around, as the AI usually avoids war when plenty of territory is left. Still, why take chances. I haven't looked at the game, but I think war could get tight at this point.

Have we started a pre-build for Sun Tzu?

Rush buying so much for war is strange to me.

Personally I would try to build some sprears first to avoid being taken by suprise, then build a few horses.

Why rush now when it might not be needed? We seem so close to knights that I would save the moey if possible and do a large upgrade rush, with all the horses we can build before then.

When you are in times of plenty money, and not enough production this seems a better strategy. Upgrading is also half the cost of rushing in cities.

Just my 2 cents.

Where is the save?

anarres: I not for rushing for war, but rather rushing to AVOID war! Maybe rush a few Spears, also some infrastructure.

We are definatly going to need to rush a few spears for defense just in case they do attack, I don't think anyone will argue with that.

The question is, are we going to go on the offensive if they declare war? If so, than most of the empire will have to be commited to prducing units and barracks

If we plan to just defend ourselves and attack later, then a few, high shield per turn cities with barracks should be able to supply enough spears/horsemen to defend the empire.

What do you guys think?

@Kazin -
Meldor did NOT post the save yet - he needs to complete the massive trading from turn 10.

He was looking for feedback on selling contacts, and catching up tech which I am 100% in favor of.

====================

I was thinking the same thing - rush a few units to reduce the possiblity of war. Sometimes even a single unit makes a difference.

OK, we want as much as we can for the contacts, so

We get:
Construction
Monarchy
Monotheism
1 German Worker
Incense
Wines

We give contacts and I had to pay some to Joanie for Mono as I had to buy Monarchy first (it was the most expensive), then construction and finally Monotheism. The only other way to do it would have been to buy Construction, Mono, and then Monarchy. We would have had to pay either way. The money in Joanie's hands is a good thing. As I said, she finished the Great Library, and we may want to grab that before we get education.
With the two new luxes to cover us until we get ours on line, I set our lux tax to 0% and science to 10%. Our incense should be online in two turns and we can then sell it to Joanie for cash.
The Egyptian archers are at least one turn away from any city so I go ahead and start the revolt.
I was going to start the pre-build in Jenne as soon as it finished its temple in one turn. There are some workers that are improving the tiles near it to boost production. We can start the palace there.

One big bonus is that I got to buy 7 workers for less money than we were making on selling our maps around. This is a great thing to do. You might not sell the maps every turn, but everyone should be cheched for workers and they should be bought unless we are so short of cash we can't.

LK39 310 BC Saved Game (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39-310BC2.zip)

OK, this seems to be a criticle time in the game. If egypt doesnt declare war, then what do each of you think I should prioritize?


My goals are to: Settle more land, especially Greenland.
Start a pre-build for Sun Tzu's
Defend our cities
Keep even in tech (at least)

Anything else you guys wanna say before I start?

Personally, I would get a settler away in the boats to Greenland, but apart form that I would build barracks, then a few spears, then horses. Lots and lots of horses. I would set science to 10%, not put science on Feudalism but wait and buy it, then put 100% research in to Chivalry (if it is feasable).

Then, whammo. Instant army of doom. No more Egypt. No more anyone in your way. We get land, we expand again, we build up cities and infrastructure, then we get cav and repeat.

Or is that a bit too over-zealous?

Keep posting some comments. It will work alot better if everyone has a bit of input into this.

I should have the game up by tommorow night btw.

I like annares' plan :)

Ps. Played a turn, it doesn't look like Egypt is going to attack.

My views are goals:
1) Settler into Greenland - This is a very high priority, as a fourth luxury would be great. This will give us two clusters of luxuries to trade. CASH RUSH a harbor - at that point the city can start to supply it's own workers, and maybe even a settler. Greenland with all the ice and forest has a great potential for rubber and oil. We can't control enough of that ice rock.

2) Palace pre-build for Sun Tzu - this city should be #1 for worker priority. If it has some hills, then irrigate enough grassland to use those hills.

3) I really want blue dot - with 2 whales, and a grassland square it will have ok production, and generate a ton of cash.

4) Don't be afraid to horde cash - a nice block of horseman to upgrade to our UU would be nice. The UU should let us put a good dent into Egypt, and get our power base going.

5) I am not to worried about tech, and I am willing to wait for enough civs to have it at a reasonable price. My only concern is increasing cash flow - a marketplace or two in larger cities would be nice.

6) I think military need to start increasing before trouble happens.

Originally posted by LKendter
My views are goals:
1) Settler into Greenland
2) Palace pre-build for Sun Tzu
3) I really want blue dot
4) Don't be afraid to horde cash
5) I am not to worried about tech
6) I think military need to start increasing before trouble happens.
1) There is a settler/spear pair already one the way for this one.
2) Jenne is the best spot we have, but it needed a temple first. There are several workers around it getting the shield totals up already.
3) There was a settler beside Jenne on the way to the coast were it can be joined by the spear building in Koumbi Saleh to board the galley sitting there waiting for it.
4) But yet, don't be afraid to spen it either. Before Jenne is set to pre-build for SunTzu's it would be nice to rush a marketplace there.
5) The tech was set to fuedalism at 10%. I was thinking to get the techs for our UU and then go after Military Tradition. We could then either use those techs to trade for the others or we could simple take the Great Library from Joan.
6) Even if the Egyptians don't attack in the next several turns, I would rush the barracks that only have a few turns left and then quick rush several horses just to keep her honest.

BTW, you guys probably don't need to be told, but the two cheapest ways to cash rush something are to start it and wait for some shields to get added to it, then rush it, or rush a worker, before the end of the turn, switch to what you want to build and then rush it. For instance, if it costs 1200g to rush something from scratch, it will cost almost half of that to rush it depending on how many shields have been appied to it. Otherwise, you can cash rush a worker for 80g, switch to the item desired and rush the rest of it for 560g. It costs more but you don't have to wait any extra turns. Towards the end of this game, we will have a lot of 1 shield towns. After rushing barracks, they can be put to rush build tanks or MA everyturn or two. Using the above you can do it a lot cheaper, which means more units. An extra 10 or so tanks a turn ends the game a lot quicker.

Just one quick question Meldor,

Does that settler north of Gao have a specific place it is supposed to be going. I looked for a while, but couldn't see anywhere obivous to send him.

LKendter
Anarres
Meldor
Kazin (currently playing)
Lt. 'Killer' M. (on deck)

Trade like crazy, at least every other turn, preferably every turn.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

=====================================

I got a chance to look at the game, and Arwan is a better choice for the Sun Tzu pre-build. Why?

1) It already has a temple.
2) It can cash rush a marketplace this turn - this puts it several turns ahead to start vs. Jenne.
3) It has 7 spare food tiles at the moment, vs. Jenne having just 1 or 2.
4) It ALREADY has more shields then Jenne (8 vs. 7), and will quickly add more.
With the hill mined (+3 shields), and several mined plains this city could easily crank 20+ shields a turn.
5) There are plenty of nearby workers to help the city.


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LAK-250.jpg
We can very quickly turn Arwan into a powerhouse city.
Let the workers on blue dot move irrigation down all the blue dots.
Let the workers on yellow dot mining yellow dot hill, then start mining the gray dots.
Arwan needs to be worker priority #1 - if it is - we should get Sun Tzu. :)

@Kazin - I hope this reaches you in time.

Jenne has very little chance to pull the wonder off.

We growth in Arwan CAREFULLY - raising the luxury rate as high as need to keep it growing and more shields - NO SPECIALIST!

@Kazin, the settler was there to lock the borders in the desert. I had intended to build the city were he was standing. It is a low production now, but it keeps the other civs from planting one there and getting a wedge into our empire. Also, that desert is the most likely place for us to get oil.

I like the plan to go for Feudalism by buying, then GET CHIVALRY and WHAM!!!!


it is high time we get a leader (for FP), another one for an army, and some more land :mwaha:

This is the point where a fast, decisive campaign can out us into a sufficisnt lead to get Cavalry those 8 to 10 important turns before the others easily - and WHAM! again ;)

Aside from that I favor a joyride to Paris :D

On Feudalism - I say bag 10% token research; we won't wait for Feudalism if we want Sun Tzu. Set science to 0% and wait to buy it when the price gets reasonable.

On the subject of the FP, we will want it in central Africa. We then move the palace to Berlin later in the game. At that point - game, set, and match - as we will have a huge power base.

On the subject of attack - Babylon is OFF limits - we want to keep the culture leader alive as long as possible to avoid an accidental culture win. We our UU being a super-charged knight, we do want take a chunk of Egypt. Of course, it will be golden age vs. golden age - a war chariot will win at some point. The trick - make sure we take advantage of the ga to get an infrastructure boast, seeing as we have almost NONE.

Pre-turn- Not much to do here since we are in anarchy. I made a worker check, but no civs had any available for trade.

1) Monarchy! 51 GPT, nice :) I hurried barracks in Hombori for 40 gold, I'm still not completely sure the Egyptians will leave us alone, even though they did move in out territory.
Better be safe than sorry; I move a spearmen from down to guard Arwan, and then move the spear that was guarding Arwan down to Hombori, as it would be the city that would be attacked first if Egypt declared war. The settler outside Gao settles down and forms the town of Tadmekket. Workers are ordered to bring Irrigation up to Tadmekket, Nioro and Agadez

2) Gwandu finishes barracks, a spearman is ordered up. The AI would love to have that town with two luxuries in it. Hombori completes barracks, begins work on spear. The French, Russians, and Mongols begin the Hanging Gardens. The AI is very poor. Most of them (France being and exception) have no cash at all, are behind in techs, have no workers, and very few have luxuries for trade. Four workers are committed to making a road between Gwandu and Agadez. Arwan rushes a marketplace for 276 gold ( I know it's alot, be LK had some real good points, and we gotta get the pre-build going )

3) Whohoo, marketplace in Arwen bring us up to 64 gpt. Arwan starts palace.

4) Lux raised to 20% for 2 turns to keep arwen from going into a disorder. A spearman will be ready for mp duty in 2 turns.

5) Goa finishes barracks, starts Market place. Walata finishes temple, starts marketplace. During this turn's trading round, I discover India has discovered the republic. Too bad the want monarchy, construction, wm, and near 2k gold. We'll pass. Sell the our world map around for everyone's wm and ~130 gold.

6) Katsina completes temple, starts marketplace.

7) Crap, and Egyptian settler-warrior pair lands on the island with 2 whales tow turns before we were set to reach there. They might settle where they are though, in which case, I will still settle on the other end of the island. Rush a temple ASAP, agadez is switched to library, we are going to try to flip it. I sell around our wm for ~100 gold.

8) Busa builds temple, begins worker.

9) This is weird, that Egyptian settler-warrior pair moved away instead of founding a city. Oh well all the better for us. Kukiya is founded by the two whales, temple is rushed for 204 gold.

10) Kukiya finishes temple, begins harbour. I rush a temple in Diara for 68 gold as the Zulu were creeping up on our spice. We will have wines hooked up in 1 turn.


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/lk_39_shonghai_110bc.SAV



If there is one thing I did wrong this turn, it was not expanding enough, I was too caught up in "who had a marketplace-temple-barracks."

LKendter (on deck)
Anarres
Meldor
Kazin
Lt. 'Killer' M. (currently playing)
Good luck that workers will start appearing again ;)

Trade like crazy, at least every other turn, preferably every turn.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.


Sell them our world map around for everyone's wm and ~130 gold.
This is why you keep hearing my trade like crazy comments.
One thing we have learned, why playing world map scale, there is a ton of map trading money to make as long as we have galleys out there.


Oh well all the better for us. Kukiya is founded by the two whales; temple is rushed for 204 gold.
:confused: How did we get the price of 204? 80 (worker) + 20 more shields (80) = 160.
Just want to check we aren't overspending.

got it.

preturn: trade map around. india will give us Republic + 11 GPT + 20 G flat for montheisma nd Monarchy - why not? Brazil gives WM and 120 Gold for mono. Currency empties Argentinas treasure, another 80 Gold for us. Germany gives all their 26 Gold for Philosophy.

I realize: Egypt has no advanced Gov to switch to!

I am a bit shocked to find Babylon controling the Suez isthmus :eek: That means: we need to sign an ROP with babylon, station troops on the tiles we need to get our troops through and then NEVER EVER end the ROP! NOTHING would harm a military campaign in Europe or the Near or Middle East as much as a suddenly closed resupply route becuase of some bumbling Babylonian worker!


(1) 90 BC - Diara builds Temple, starts worker. Busa builds worker, another ordered. Then, settler? Change Sokoto to a settler. Gaos markertplace will come after grows (i.e. too late) so 1 citizen goes scientist and rate to 0%. Saves 10 Gold. Arrest growth in Segu to speed barracks from 5 to 2. Why Barracks there? We may have to wait a while for SunTzus, and I want some vet units now. Segu can go w/o more infrastructure for a while while growing and producing a lot.

(2) 70 BC - Babylon is pushing settlers through Egypt. mm Segu again to slow growth and barracks next turn. Decide to bring irrigation there so we can use the iron tile with mine contiunously.
Decide to mine some plains around Arwan now. That way, 1 citizen gives as much prod as otherwise two would. the samller the town the less luxury necessary. No other good tiles available atm. Also, given the current surplus of food, no more food is needed to go size 12.

(3) 50 BC - moves. Persia has spent/lost a bunch of money this turn. :confused: barbs pillaging? No new tech, no nothing as a reason.....

(4) 30 BC - I decide Busa would ba a nice place for the FP. Start a Courthouse as it is at 25% corruption now, we can see if we want to go straight for FP once the city has grown a bit.

(5) 10 BC - Babylon finishes the Great Wall. I would feel better if someone completed Gardens soon..... Settler in Timbuktu --> to coast. Galley reaches Greenland next turn.

(6) 10 AD - everyone now build Hanging Gardens. Culture expan gives us control over the Egyptian settler/warrior pair. We can kick them out antime we want to 'change'our relationship with Egypt. Settler from Sokoto goes east. A Bab Galley approached the little island off our coast - land a settler there. Alos, Greenland is reached. Buy worker (+7 and WM) from Greece for Construction. Big cash from Mao for Mono: WM and 130. Must have popped two huts, he was at 14 last round. Monarchy spreads around America, I sell Republic for some 100 to Brazil and US for together 114. They'd get it soon anyway.

(7) 30 AD - a Galley norht of Sweden sunk by barb. worker from Diara to hook up spices. Kangaba founded. Spear discovers another Dye in Greenland :D Kano will be the town of dyes. I will wait one turn to rush harbor. use two taxmen in Gao and Koumbi to retain happiness, both towns close to improvment so not worht changing lux rate. Spear from Segu on way to Arwan as 3rd MP.

(8) 50 AD - Gao, Jenne, Walata all build Marketplace --> Cathedral selected. The harbor costs 316 Gold.

(9) 70 AD - Of ****!!!! There's sea tiles between su and Greenland! :eek:

(10) 90 AD - What the hell???????
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/import2.jpg
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/import3.jpg

I load the end of the last turn again:


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/import.jpg

how the hell have we been able to IMPORT stuff from them if we cannot trade with them?????????????????????????????????????????????? ???


Oh well, PTW bugs :rolleyes:


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39-90AD.zip

didn't trade this turn.

Hey 'mr most active poster', wanna fix those pics?

Edit: Of course I forget to factor in the 'Killer' style of posting to forums... :crazyeye:


Killer - can you explain what losing those lux's was from? I didn't think there were any active deals...

ah, me dumb: mixed: cannot rade and can trade :lol:


still: we didn't have incense hooked up ten turns ago??????

anarres: I post the text while uploading the images. if there's several images, people who have nothing to do but hang around here may actually get the mail and check the post before the upload is done :p


It must have been meldor doing the trading. That was so long agon I simply forgot.

I checked: no mention of the iron here:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=723250#post723250

nor here:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=724159#post724159


also, meldor speaks of TWO new lux, but mentions only one in his list (Wines).

ah well!

btw: i did never get a good offer for the incense from France so I never sold it. Maybe the next player should look ino that again now......


anarres: you check the post list? :lol: I was a bit schocked when a friend told me I passed Simon DS....

I just follow you around Killer. ;)

I saw gunning1 mention it...

oh, and I've had no email notification for a couple of months now :mad:

I got the incense and wines as part of the trades on my last turn. It was going to be a couple of turns before either was hooked up for us, and they were esentially free. We should use those extra luxes to get techs if possible!

[EDIT] See post #106 on page 6 of this thread.

90 AD (pre-turn) - I change Kano to barracks and rush it. I want to get Greenland up and going.
I change Kangaba to temple and rush it to get the whale on-line.
I find a China worker for sale, and the map selling almost covers the cost.
I notice that we have Republic, so instant revolution.

130 AD - I rush a harbor in Kukiya. This will pay for itself to let that city get up to size 6 and start rolling in the cash, and to speed up growth with the whale tiles adding more food.
I switch Nioro and Agadez to harbors and rush, as this is the only way they can grow beyond size two.
I speed rush the Harbor in Kangaba.

150 AD - I rush a spear in Greenland. I want to send several settlers this way, and at the same time I don't want to weaken our homeland defense.
(I) Hombori starts the forbidden palace - this meets my central Africa goal for the FP with a palace jump to Paris or Berlin quite well.

170 AD - Rush barracks in Kangaba, as it won't benefit from Sun Tzu.
(I) The fighting starts as Babylon declares war on China.

190AD - I rush another spearman in Greenland, as I have several settlers heading that way needing escort.

210 AD - The rush is expensive at $392, but a marketplace appears in Kukiya. The city will gain $2 at size one, as it grows we will be rolling in revenue. I rush a galley in Kangaba to keep shipping settlers to Greenland.
The price of feudalism is starting to get reasonable, as France wants incense and $1050 - I think it can still come down some.

230 AD - I rush the temple in Nioro to close a culture gap that the AI might think about settling.
I hurry an archer in Greenland, as there are barb camps out there.

250 AD - Taghaza is formed - not a great city, but I hate to see a fish square go to waste.
I think this is our first worker from Babylon, but I don't care where they come from.
I don't know where the Iroquois suddenly got some money from, but I sell them Polytheism for $61.
I finally bite the bullet and buy Feudalism for $1035, incense, wm from France.
We only need 13 turns to complete Sun Tzu!
I upgrade 10 spearman to pikeman to improve our military position.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LAK-253.jpg
Yellow dot is the number one priority - with temple this gets us 5 more dyes! The settler for yellow dot is by Ireland and should arrive on Meldor's turn.
Red dot gives us fish and whales and should grow fast for us to rush a settler up there.

260 AD - I rush the harbor in Taghaza, so that this city can grow faster.
I continue the spearman rush in Greenland.
I love map trading with getting the Persian map first - $9 just from Brazil and over $100 total. The Iroquois will become the second map source, as they are exploring around Greenland.
I rush a pike in Nioro to improve our military position.
(I) The wars increase as Egypt allies with Babylon vs. China.
Theology has been learned, as Russia starts Sistine.

270 AD - Koumbi Saleh should be our second best shield city, so I start a palace pre-build there. That city will need some MINED plains.
Theology is out there, but no way I will give up $2100 for it. I will wait for the price to drop, plus I want Engineering first as the rivers are really slowing our movement down. Engineering is still overpriced at $1700.
Tadmekket is under culture pressure from Babylon, so I rush a library to help out position.
(I) The cascade will begin as the Mongols complete Hanging Gardens.

280 AD - Rushing is greatly reduced until Sun Tzu is built, as I want the panic option to buy Theology rather then flush shields down the toilet.
I send our new worker to Besancon to take advantage of the RoP with France and get irrigation to Gwandu - I really want to start using those mountains and hills for shields.
The backwards Iroquois must have popped some barb camps, so I sell them currency for $50 and wm.
(I) Multiple civs switch to Sistine Chapel and Sun Tzu.

290 AD - Our exploring spearman pops a hut in Greenland - of course it is angry barbs.
What I can't believe is I continue to find even MORE dyes in Greenland.
Our recent exploring adds blue dot to the hot list.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LAK-254.jpg

The panic price for Theology is down to ~$1700 before haggling from India.
Engineering is down to $1500, but I want the price a bit lower, and don't want to lose the panic money for Theology.

300 AD - I rush another Kangaba to keep the settler pipeline heading north.
We decide the Persians should get drunk and send them wines for $90 and wm.
China continues to be a great source of workers - the new worker goes to mine north of Gao to get rid of the awkward nine shields a turn. I wish backwards Germany would have one for sale, as we could give them ancient age techs for it.


Summary - The workers are trying to get water to Agadez so that we can irrigate the 2 plains and add some shields to that city.

The rushing I did was to keep cities growing, increase revenue, and to get Greenland up and going.

Why my obsession on Greenland:
1) Any square brings us close to domination.
2) They amount of dyes up is huge, and I want the majority of them. There is a high possibility of oil or rubber in Greenland.
3) Once our palace is in Paris, these cities will have acceptable corruption with courthouses and can generate a ton of revenue.

Keep the military rush in Greenland going, as there are multiple settlers on boats heading toward Greenland. If Greenland fills up, then go for some of the ice above America to increase our chances of oil and get closer to domination. We can even rush settlers in Greenland when size 3 is achieved with the cities.

If we want to go to war anytime soon, we need more defenders and more horsemen for upgrade. Nioro as 1 shield is a great place to rush military every other turn - we still have plenty of cash. Our exploration of Greenland was netting us over $50 a turn.

We really need more workers - let Walata pop a few workers after the granary is complete.

Koumbi Saleh need more mined plains - when the nearby workers complete - please send them to mine plains


LKendter
Anarres (currently playing)
Hopefully seeing Sun Tzu during his turns.
This city is already at 20 shields a turn and still has 2 more plains to mine.
Meldor (on deck)
Kazin
Lt. 'Killer' M.

Trade like crazy, at least every other turn, preferably every turn.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
If you can't complete all turns during a session - post partial turn report
I know these world maps get slow after awhile, but I like to see signs of life.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39-300AD.zip

Note: I played three extra turns to get us to nice even years.

Well, I'm alive :)

I will play later tonight or tomorrow morning.

sorry, meldor, I simply read over it :blush:

preturn: mm Busa for food and change production to markertplace. It is building a courthouse, but the FP is being built 7 squres away. I think Killer intended this to be the FP location, and LK decided Hombori would be best. There is little to choose between the cities, and in the end I leave Hombori on the FP as it will be done quicker and will be of more immediate benifit to existing cities. I change Busa to marketplace as it just about to expand to 7.

AI: Irquois demand Republic. I tell him to do jump off a cliff. He backs down.

(1) 310AD - Make 112 gold from WM trading.

(2) 320AD - Pop a goody hut in greenland and get some barbs...
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39.03.02.barbs.jpg

Engeneering is down to 1500 before haggling, but it is still too much. Buy 2 workers from France for 2-8 gold.

AI: Barbs move away.

(3) 330AD - I change the few cities poducing pikemen to horseman. 132 gold from WM trading.

(4) 340AD - Settler gets to east coast of Greenland. I send hiw overland to the west with a double spearman escort. I rush another spearman in Kano.

(5) 350AD - Set Busa builds marketplace, set to granary. The settler in Greenland hits a problem - the Iroquois:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/LK39.03.05.Iroquois.jpg

Get 166 gold from WM trading.

AI: Iroquois settler founds city on tile in picture. :mad:

(6) 360AD - Hurry galley in Kangaba.Pop another goody hut in Greenland - deserted. Rush settler in Kano (Greenland).

AI: Aztecs demand 100 gold and TM. I say no, he declares war. He is just so far away that in