I guess most other people are still finishing 121, but this is the first game I've been able to play for 6 months or so. I knew I'd have time for a landing game this month and despite the fact I seem to have forgot various things in only six months, I've really enjoyed this one.

Firstly, what to do with the built up capital. Personally I pillaged it, converting it into settlers by rush buying. I didn't keep a log, but by 1500bc I had six cities and had met and swapped maps with the Carthags. They were a bit too near for my liking so I went for an ICS conquest of them. Luckily they asked for an alliance while I was planning the attack so I was able to build "launch attack" cities right next door to their capital and another city. The attack took place in the early AD's.

Some stats at 1AD
14 cities, 31 techs, researching navigation, Monarchy, 12 crusaders ready for attack, contact & maps from French & Aztecs. Hanging Gardens built.

At the moment I'm just finishing off the space ship, I'll post a few more stats some other time.

Charlie - I guess I've come in whilst you've been away. As you may have noticed from the results for 118 in my case it's more a case of not knowing rather than having forgotten!

I agree that it seems continuing play in GotM 121 has kept people occupied. The large map and excess of forest with the need for conquest make for a long game. In fact I was done on that quite early with momentum from the bug investigation, and I moved onto this one, and have already sent my files in. And I'm now playing one of the games from the past that seems to have gone down well - a bit of a classic with yourself and the rest of the top 5 from the Hall of Fame all playing. (First choice was "The Gauntlet" GoTM 58 but I couldn't seem to find the starting save.)

In 122 the part that was most interesting to me was how to handle the situation from the accelerated start. A built up capital isn't a situation I was familiar with. Given the strong technical position I thought about one city challenge but I took on board the comments in the game thread that location wasn't so great. Also that playing as purple if you get to supreme you are your own key civ - that may make a traditional landing plan successful, although I didn't think I would have to choose between conquest and landing for a time. On the other hand I didn't want to just ignore the strengths, scrap nearly everything, and convert the game to a "normal" one.

I decided I would try and use such a strong city as a main strength, for example for wonders and trade. I would add rather than lose buildings. I did disband a legion into settlers but nothing else. I tried to manage science carefully in the initial turns.

Black clicking suggested we were at the north-west of a large continent so I sent units south and east, and as things turned out some land near Little Bighorn in the other direction stayed unvisited for a very long time.

As I explored the near terrain didn't seem so grass-rich, but I got on with founding cities, including more overlaps than I used to so as to get closer to the usual way play proceeds here.

I went for Hanging Gardens and MPE as others took Pyramids, Great Library and Colossus.

I also have started and hit the AD-barrier. I guess I have messed up a good score already by having "just played along" for too long. After having finished MPE I should have gone straight for conquest (like Charlie), but went for science, trade routes and slow expansion in republic instead. I was planning to build HG, but couldn't due to lack of pottery. AI- and hut-techs allowed Mike's chapel instead. Carths managed to win the philo-race, french built Shakes in 125 BC (which is really early for AI in my estimation).
As I mentioned earlier, I should have realized earlier that there is no point in early-science. :mischief:

However I was surprised at how friendly the AI were! :eek: This is the first game I played after having downgraded to civ2-classic and everybody loves me. Carth troops were outside a new-founded city and instead of demanding all my gold for not declaring war (as they would have done in MPG) we exchanged techs and they marched off.

... I thought about one city challenge but I took on board the comments in the game thread that location wasn't so great. Also that playing as purple if you get to supreme you are your own key civ ...
I still think that OCC would be a good choice for that game. I would settle the supported settler into town, send out two units to explore to AI and find huts, disband others for necessary buildings/wonders/caravans. The NONE-settler could mine the pheasant at the river mouth and chop down some trees for trade arrows and food.
So if you have nothing else to do/play and would like to replay this GOTM for OCC, this would be my suggestion. ;)
The disadvantage would be that you won't be your own key civ and might have none at all.

I didn't have time for 120-121, so I'm reviving my game with 122. As always, I believe in ICS, and built 6 cities by 1600BC. Growth stalled until 1000BC ... then MPE 700BC ... HG 525BC and easier growth again. As I approach AD years, I have about 30 cities and am researching metallurgy (!). I generally avoid INV + NAV, but in this game, the Babs researched Inv/Gun, and gave me Gun. I expect Metallurgy + Explosives by 100AD from van trade. If the Babs will now research NAV (I gave them Seaf and Astro) and perhaps Physics, I might be able to go very far in science without the usual Ren era trade penalty. I was planning to go for EC at approx 400AD, but this weird tech thing is attractive. Also, two AI capitals are huge and walled, maybe with musketeers, so EC may be slower than usual, or at least different.

Welcome back CC.

Charlie - I guess I've come in whilst you've been away. As you may have noticed from the results for 118 in my case it's more a case of not knowing rather than having forgotten!



Hello Inkerman and Major Advantage. When I first found this site, I'd never used van deliveries I used to only play only with monarchy and communism governments. Like you, I learnt a lot here very quickly.

It's no surprise to see Peaster has discovered metallurgy in the bc years. I half expected you to finish BC!

I got a bit caught up in wars throughout my game, firstly the carthags then the French and Aztecs towards the end, this lost me time. I also seemed to stall in the AD period, under Republic I just didn't seem to grow, maybe the terrain didn't help? Also, I don't know about other's games, but the Babs only built 1 city throughout the game, and they didn't even build an aquaduct in that. I found that odd.

I've successfully fninished and submitted.

Also, I don't know about other's games, but the Babs only built 1 city throughout the game, and they didn't even build an aquaduct in that. I found that odd.

The same in my game. Late in the fame, they founded their second city just outside Babylon's city radius. However there is hill with fortress and road on their island, so maybe a city was destroyed by barbs early in the game. I'm replaying the game as OCC right now and they expand normally.

Here is the first part of my log:
-1950: Start exploring, production to settler
-1850: hut: 50g
-1800: discover ocean with continent number 3.
-1700: LB settler, start another, disband horse; pop hut: Math, Wounded Knee founded at 26,10
-1550: (Egypt starts Pyramids), found Cedar Creek at 19,13; meet Carthags, give Mysticism and Construction, get Wheel and Poly, demand tribute, get iron w., peace
-1500 research to Trade, LB settler -> Trireme(?), sell colosseum
-1350 Slim Buttes foundd (29,5)
(Carth. troops outside WK)
-1300 NONE-Legion from hut, talk to Carths, give techs, share maps, no alliance
(Carth retreat)
-1200 WK settler, 50g from hut
-1150 LB riots>elvis; Slim Buttes Warrior ->settler
-1100 Trade -> Literacy; CC settler > Van
-1000 Three Forks founded at 30,14
-975 LB settler, start Marco
-925 WK Dip
-875 Stony Lake founded (24,16)
-825 France builds Pyramids
-800 Carth -> get Trade for Literacy, Research to Philo
(plan1: pottery as freetech, change marco to HG?
plan2: Build Marco, get pottery from AI, build HG as 2nd wow?)
-775 Killdeer (36,4), Stony Lake red, rush Warrior
(Carth discover Philo, bad)
-750 Alliance with Carth, give currency, get philo, maps
-725 choose mono to research, pottery not available, Stony riots, elvis
plan: I guess now Mike's should be top priority
-700 mono -> republic, Bear Paw founded
-575 Aztecs build Colossus
-525 French start Marco, Mike's has 234s already. Still: Finish Mike's first, try to get Marco afterwards
-450 WK starts Marco, meet Aztecs, give Literacy, get Seafaring, peace, maps
-400 Hut: University
-350 Meet French, give philo, get pottery, peace, disband Phalanx in LB to complete Mike's next turn
-325 Mike's finished, re-arrange workers
-275 French almost done with Marco, disband Archer to beat them, found Big Mound
-250 Marco's completed, French change to GL, get Republic from Babylon, peace, maps, no tribute, REVOLUTION
-225 Republic established, T3S7L0, NONE-Crusader from hut
-175 French medicine, switch their wonder to Shakes; Astronomy -> Navigation
-150 French almost done with Shakes, Carth: give Rep, Uni, get Medicine, ask for gift, get Warrior code
-125 Paris builds Shakes, Copper(d) SB to Cartaghe 72g, pop hut just north of France: nomad
-75 Wood Lake founded (deep south), T1S2L7 to trigger celebrations
-50 Dead Buffalo founded
-25 Beads(d) to Caralis for 28g
1AD Celebrations stopped T2S8L0

Stats at 1AD:
Population: 850,000; Cities: 11; Trade routes: 0D2F; Government: Republic
Gold: 31; Cost per turn: 2; Total advances: 27; Production: 48; 0 polluted tiles
Wonders: Marco, Michelangelo
Units: 3 settlers, 4 Warriors, 1 Phalanx, 1 Archer, 2 Legion, 2 Chariots, 1 Crusader, 2 Trireme, 1 Diplomat, 4 Caravan
peace with all

20 hut: Gravity, Dye(d) LB to Utica 196g
40 Navigation -> Physics Silver(d) CC >Carthage 85g
80 Copper(d) WK>Utica 58g, Hides (d) SB>CC 10g
120 LB finishes Library, WK starts HG
Hold on: Where the *** is this supposed to lead to? New plan: build Sun Tzu (instead of HG), build up army and start conquering

After that, things went pretty well (at least by my estimation). ;)

For me, this gotm is different because the Babs researched gunpowder for me (and now democracy). So... many Renaissance benefits such as engineers without the heavy trade penalties. They also researched Nav, but I haven't been able to direct them to Physics yet, so no RR, Corp, etc.

The game is easy to play - with trade profits approx 1000g per turn thru the early AD years, and almost 1 tech per turn with that. I'm curious whether this could be used to improve on standard EC or EL strategies. Probably not EC; I think I could've conquered faster by staying in monarchy, using normal methods. It might work better for EL, in general, but in my game I've allowed the Babs to build Copes, so - no SSC this time. Also, I've been forced to start on Inv.

So, the experiment is about over. I'll probably go back to monarchy and a slightly-delayed EC game, a decent hybrid game.

I have managed to get started too. I just built Marco a few minutes ago, exchanged maps with all rivals and came here to read this thread. I was not sure whether to go for landing or conquest and decided to play the game to Marco and then decide. The map is well poised for conquest but I have to think this over.

My expansion was much slower than most of you guys, not surprisingly. I had only 4 cities by -1000 and have 8 now at -550. I did not disband any units nor did I sell any infra structure. I did quickly rehome units though and within a few turns I got rid of my support problem. I also kept the None settler.

Also, I don't know about other's games, but the Babs only built 1 city throughout the game, and they didn't even build an aquaduct in that. I found that odd.
That is indeed odd, even for perfectionist Babylonians. In my game they already have 2 cities at -550 which is still the lowest by far of their rivals. Aztecs have 4, French and Carthaginians 5.

Status at -1950
Population: 0.28M; Cities: 1; Techs: 12; Government: Monarchy
Gold: 140; Cost: 6; Trade routes: 0D0F;
Wonders:
Units: 2 settlers (1 None), 6 Assault units
Goals: Expand and build Marco before deciding whether to go for conquest or landing.
Babylonian: No contact
French: No contact
Aztec: No contact
Carthaginian: No contact

-1950 T3L0S7. Switched production to settler.
-1800 Wounded Knee founded with access to whale, pheasant, and furs.
-1750 Literacy and horseman from huts.
-1650 None archer from hut. Cedar Creek founded.
-1550 Carthaginian horseman runs into my archer. Construction, Mysticism, Monarchy, Literacy -> Carthaginian (4) -> Wheel, Polytheism, peace, map exchange. My power is moderate which means there is one civ below me.
-1500 -> Philosophy.
-1350 25g from hut.
-1250 Philosophy -> Trade -> Monotheism.
-1100 Slim Buttes founded.

Status at -1000
Population: 0.18M; Cities: 4; Techs: 17; Government: Monarchy
Gold: 11; Cost: 6; Trade routes: 0D0F;
Wonders:
Units: 4 settlers (1 None), 8 Assault units
Goals: Expand and build Marco before deciding whether to go for conquest or landing.
Babylonian: No contact
French: No contact
Aztec: No contact
Carthaginian: 3 cities at last update

-0950 Three Forks founded.
-0900 Stony Lake and Killdeer founded.
-0875 Philosophy -> Carthaginian -> Iron Working, Warrior Code.
-0725 French build Pyramids.
-0700 T5L0S5
-0625 Monotheism -> Bridge Building. Barbarian leader captured for 100g.
-0600 Bear Paw founded.
-0575 First Trireme produced.
-0550 Marco built.
Trade, Philosophy, Iron Working -> Aztec (4) -> Seafaring, Republic, Pottery, peace, maps, 150g.
Iron Working, Wheel -> French (5) -> Math, maps, peace, 150g
Literacy, Philosophy, Republic -> Babylonian (2) -> Engineering, Astronomy, peace, maps
Given the map, I am going to go for conquest. T7L0S3.
-0500 Big Mound founded.

Status at -0500
Population: 0.34M; Cities: 9; Techs: 26; Government: Monarchy
Gold: 140; Cost: 6; Trade routes: 0D0F;
Medieval Wonders: Marco
Units: 5 settlers (1 None), 9 Assault units, 1 Trireme, 1 Caravan
Goals: Expand into NE peninsula of homeland which is unsettled and free of rivals.
Establish an offshore presence on islands 2 and 7.
Build a city at the NW tip of homeland.
Build Hanging Gardens.
Assess the situation for going after Carthage.
Babylonian: 2 cities, 20 techs
French: 5 cities, 22 techs; Pyramids
Aztec: 4 cities, 18 techs
Carthaginian: 6 cities, 16 techs

-0475 Kish founded on island 7.
-0450 Dead Buffalo founded.
-0425 Point of Rocks founded. No tributes.
-0350 Barbarian legion lands near Kish. Hanging Gardens built. Barbarian legion bribed for 82g.
-0300 Aztec -> 25g.
-0250 Barbarian leader captured for 100g.
-0225 Kharg founded on island 2.
-0200 Carthaginians build Great Library.
-0175 My power just became supreme. Math -> Carthaginian -> Bridge building.
-0150 French build Colossus. -> Navigation.
-0100 Aztec -> 100g. French -> Medicine.
-0075 Running Bear founded.
-0025 French -> 300g. Carthaginian -> 0g. Silver Moon founded. Carthaginian Phalanx bribed for 254g to occupy a fort with my assault units.
+0001 I refuse to withdraw and Carthaginians kill the Phalanx, a horseman, and 2 vet Crusaders. All I have left in the fort are 2 chariots. One kills an elephant, the other a legion. Aztec -> 50g. Carthage is defended by 2 warriors and a Phalanx, no city walls.

Status at +0001
Population: 0.59M; Cities: 15; Techs: 28; Government: Monarchy
Gold: 2; Cost: 7; Trade routes: 0D0F;
Ancient Wonders: Hanging Gardens
Medieval Wonders: Marco
Units: 7 settlers (1 None), 10 Assault units, 2 Trireme, 5 Caravan
Goals: Finish off the expansion of NE peninsula of homeland
Build Michelangelo.
Destroy Carthaginians.
Establish trade routes particularly with offshore Babylonians.
Babylonian: 3 cities, 22 techs
French: 5 cities, 25 techs; Pyramids, Colossus; War with Carthaginians, allied with Aztecs
Aztec: 4 cities, 21 techs; War with Carthaginians, allied with French
Carthaginian: 7 cities, 22 techs; Great Library; War with all but Babylonians

+0020 Wounded Carthaginian legion pull back into Carthage and is replaced with a fresh warrior which my vet Crusader kills. Wildcat Valley founded.
+0040 Carthaginian elephant kills my Legion in fort and is killed by my Crusader.
+0060 Carthaginian Archer killed.
+0080 3 Carthaginian units killed. 3 Crusaders easily kill 3 defenders of Carthage. The city is taken for 59g and Great Library. This causes the Carthaginians to get Astronomy, Masonry, Trade, and one other tech from the Great Library!! Carthaginian empire divided into Carthaginian and Persian factions.
Republic -> Persian (0) -> peace. French -> 100g
+0120 Persians build King Richards. Carthaginian catapult killed. Cloth, Hides to Kish for 50, 60 establish the first trade routes. Aztec -> 100g. Persian -> 0g.
+0140 Navigation -> Sanitation. Great River founded.
+0160 Lost 1 Crusader and killed 3 defenders of Utica. The city taken for 79g.
Navigation -> Babylonian -> University
+0180 Carthaginians kill my chariot. Seven Brothers founded.
+0200 Michelangelo built. Carthaginian elephant killed. Domestic delivery for 52. T7L2S1
+0220 Trireme barely survives attack from Carthaginian one. Cartenna bribed for 194g. Got 42g and Phalanx.
+0260 Barbarian legion kills Phalanx defending Kish. Aztecs build Great Wall. Rushed diplomat bribes barbarian legion for 82g. Two defenders of Caralis killed by Crusaders and the city taken for 66g. Carthaginian civilization destroyed.
+0280 Iron Working -> Babylonian -> Invention.
+0300 Navigation -> Persian -> maps.
+0320 Persian -> 75g. Aztec, French -> 0g.
+0340 Persian -> 50g. Aztec, French -> 0g. French Tours bribed for 264. French declare war. So do their Aztec allies. Got Banking. French catapult killed. Single defender of Persian Rusicade killed and the city taken for 9g. Snake Canyon founded.
+0380 Gave French invention to divert an attack on Tours. Gave Aztecs cease fire as well. 2 defenders of Malaca killed and the city taken for 17g and barracks.
+0420 Persians kill a Crusader.
+0460 Hides from LittleBigHorn to Babylon for 468 establishes the first foreign trade route.
+0480 Democracy from Great Library. Persians kill another crusader. Sanitation -> Chemistry. Magellan built. Coal to Babylon for 330. 2 defenders of Persian Gades killed and the city razed for 10g. 25g from hut. T1L2S7

Status at +0500
Population: 1.87M; Cities: 26; Techs: 34; Government: Monarchy
Gold: 50; Cost: 11; Trade routes: 6D2F;
Ancient Wonders: Hanging Gardens, Great Library
Medieval Wonders: Marco , Michelangelo, Magellan
Units: 11 settlers (1 None), 11 Assault units, 6 boats, 22 Caravan
Notes: Babylonians are researching Gunpowder; French Feudalism.
Goals: Buy off last Persian city.
Expand into former Carthaginian home lands.
Get Explosives and Metallurgy.
Build Leo and Liberty.
Keep trading with Babylonians .
Babylonian: 3 cities, 28 techs
French: 6 cities, 32 techs; Pyramids, Colossus; Allied with Aztecs
Aztec: 5 cities, 28 techs; Great Wall; Allied with French
Persian: 1 city, 28 techs; King Richards
Carthaginian: Destroyed by me

+0520 Silk to French for 195. Accepted Persian offer of 50g for cease fire. Persian Panormous bribed for 216g. Got King Richards, 20g, a settler, and 2 soldiers. Persian civilization destroyed. Revolution started.
+0540 Democracy established. T3L4S3. Domestic delivery for 18.
+0560 Babylonians develop Gunpowder! Chemistry -> Gunpowder. Seven cities celebrate. Sanitation -> Babylonian -> Gunpowder. First Wind founded. Domestic delivery for 102.
+0580 -> Metallurgy. Yellow Tree founded across the water from Babylon. Beads to French for 134.
+0600 Hides to Babylonians for 208, 272.
+0620 Metallurgy -> Explosives. Domestic deliveries for 114, 84.
+0640 Leo built. Silk to Paris for 246. T0L4S6
+0660 Babylonians build Copernicus. Explosives -> Conscription. Chief's Crag and Morning Rock founded. Wine to Babylonians for 420, 530.
+0680 Conscription -> Feudalism. French have Feudalism but are unwilling to exchange. Naples founded. Beads to French for 94. T4L4S2
+0700 Silver to Babylon for 480.
+0720 Feudalism -> Theology. Coal to French for 137, Aztecs for 102. Domestic deliveries for 42, 55.
+0740 Coal to Babylon for 360.
+0760 Theology -> Fundamentalism. Leptis Parva founded. Deliveries to Babylonians for 292, 226; Aztecs 85; domestic 54, 20. T1L4S5
+0780 Rifleman survives barbarian Knight. Fundamentalism -> Chivalry. Domestic delivery for 66. LeptisMagna founded. T4L4S2
+0800 Girba founded. Domestic delivery for 42.
+0820 Bach built.
+0840 Domestic delivery for 38, 50. Cloth to French for 165.
+0860 Chivalry -> Leadership. Deliveries to Aztecs for 159, 87.
+0880 Democracy -> Babylonian -> Economics.
+0900 Sanitation -> Aztec -> Physics, maps. WoodLake founded. Domestic delivery for 50.
+0920 Hides to Babylonians for 188. Kerman founded.
+0940 Leadership -> Tactics. Domestic delivery for 50. Hides to Babylonians for 364.
+0960 Domestic delivery for 54.
+0980 Tactics -> Amphibious Warfare. Offshore Spice to French Orleans for 728 (capped). T3L4S3
+1000 French build Liberty. Amphibious Warfare -> Magnetism. Conscription -> Babylonian -> Magnetism. Raging Brook and Oea founded. Domestic delivery for 213. Gems to French for 291. Revolution started. Aztec -> 100g. French -> 0g. 3 Cavalry attack Tenochtitlan easily killing its three defenders. T2L6S2

Status at +1000
Population: 18.6M; Cities: 39; Techs: 49; Government: Anarchy
Gold: 860; Cost: 97; Trade routes: 32D23F;
Ancient Wonders: Hanging Gardens, Great Library
Medieval Wonders: Marco , Michelangelo, Magellan , King Richards
Industrial Wonders: Leo, Bach
Units: 19 Engineers (1 None), 4 Cavalry, 2 Diplomats, 6 Caravel, 14 Caravan
Notes: Every one is in Democracy. Babylonians developed Gunpowder on their own and I gave them Conscription. French have Feudalism, but not Gunpowder. Aztecs have neither.
Goals: Bring the clergy to power. Conquer Aztecs and French with Cavalry.
Babylonians would require powerful attack boats at the very least. Fortunately all their cities are coastal.
Keep expanding and keep trading with Babylonians.
Tech goals are Steam Engine or Electricity for attack boats.
Wonder goal is Sun Tzu.
Babylonian: 3 cities, 36 techs; Copernicus
French: 6 cities, 35 techs; Pyramids, Colossus, Liberty; War with me, allied with Aztecs
Aztec: 5 cities, 32 techs; Great Wall; War with me, allied with French
Persian: Destroyed by me
Carthaginian: Destroyed by me

I am pleased to see that I am not too far behind Ali, except for trade routes. ;)

Here is the next part of my log:

120 LB finishes Library, WK starts HG
Hold on: Where the *** is this supposed to lead to? New plan: build Sun Tzu (instead of HG), build up army and start conquering
160 physics -> Feudalism
180 pop hut: supported Legion
200 Carth: give Navigation, they refuse to tech trade (KRC), get 100 g gift, silk(d) WK>Carthage 90g, Point of Rocks founded
240 Advanced tribe: Raging Brook
280 Feudalism-> Theology
320 Running Bear founded, Sun Tzu almost done
340 Sun Tzu completed, 4 vet Crusaders will be completed next turn
360 Hmpf, Malaca out of Dye-demand, deliver anyway for 24g, demand gift: 100g
380 Coalogne founded (on Coal being mined), just missed oedo year to change back to monarchy; next: 460
400 Meet Babylonians: give Navigation & Irown working, get banking & engineering, alliance, maps: There is continent #1 in the middle of the ocean, 100g from Carth
(Carthage builds HG)
420 Great River founded, another 100 g from Carths, still allied, pay 50g to Aztecs so they declare war with Carths
440 Refuse to join Carths war with Aztecs, refuse to give physics, still allied, get 100g gift, REVOLUTION
460 Monarchy established, another 100g from Carths
480 Cancel Carth alliance, talk to Aztecs: no invitation to join their war with Carth
500 Theology -> Bridge Building, Seven Pheasants founded, 200g from Aztecs, 75g from Carth (wanted them to declare war), start exploring continent1

Stats at 500AD:
Population: 1.17 Mill.; Cities: 25; Trade routes: 2D7F; Government: Monarchy
Gold: 1032; Cost per turn: 4; Total advances: 35; Production: 80; 0 polluted tiles
Wonders: Marco, Michelangelo, Sun Tzu
Carth: HG
French: Pyramids, Shakespeare
Aztecs: Colossus
Units: 5 settlers, 3 Warriors, 1 Phalanx, 1 Archer, 3 Legion, 1 pike, 1 Chariot, 8 Crusaders, 2 Trireme, 1 caravelle, 6 Diplomat, 1 Caravan
peace with all, allied with Babylon

520 Another 150g tribute from Carths, sneak attack anyway, Carthage captured, 2g+HG
bribe Legion 84g, bribe Utica 424g, bribe Caralis 265g, Barb Leader 100g, Slim Butts starts Bach
560 Bribe Malaca 318g
580 Bribe Panormus 159g, Carths down to 1 city but only 43g left
future plans: build up democracy empire before attacking Aztecs & French
techs: Invention (Babylon working on), Demo, Explosives
(interturn) Seven Pheasants destroyed by barbs
600 Snake Canyon founded
660 First Wind founded (on cont. 1)
680 Bach Cathedral finished, time for better government, Yellowtree founded, REVOLUTION
700 Republic, Chief's Grag, Morning Rock founded
720 bribe Leptis Parva 212g, Carths defeated, Panama founded, Bornholm (island 7) founded
740 Babs have Invention first offshore-trade: wool(d) LB<Bornholm 54g, T2S5L3 for some celebration
760 Barb Caravelle sent to the seafloor, get Invention for Astro from Babs
780 Bridge Build. -> Democracy
820 50g from hut; French: give Astro, get chemnistry
840 Seven Pheasants rebuilt
900 Leo's completed; Democracy->Gunpowder
920 Some deliveries, REVOLUTION
940 Demo established T2S6L2
960 Copper Bear Paw>Teotihuacan 128g

Stats at 1000AD:
Population: 4.61 Mill.; Cities: 32; Trade routes: 23D3F; Government: Democracy
Gold: 340; Cost per turn: 22; Total advances: 35; Production: 80; 0 polluted tiles
Wonders: HG, Marco, Michelangelo, Sun Tzu, Bach, Leonardo
French: Pyramids, Shakespeare
Aztecs: Colossus
Units: 22 settlers, 15 Musketeers, 8 Crusaders, 1 catapult, 4 caravelle, 5 Diplomat, 3 Caravan
peace with all, allied with Babylon, Carth destroyed

+1020 Cavalry survives Aztec elephant. Fundamentalism established. T4L5S1. One more defender of Tenochtitlan killed and the city taken for 38g, two structures, and Great Wall. 2 Aztec units killed.
+1040 Cavalry survive Aztec elephant. -> Electricity. 25 of the eligible 29 cities celebrate. Texcoco captured. Crete founded. Hides to Babylonians for 400. Domestic Hides for 38. T2L5S3
+1060 Electricity -> Refrigeration. Coal to Babylonians for 655. T4L5S1
+1080 Sun Tzu built. Lost a cavalry in capture of walled Teo. Domestic delivery for 82.
+1100 Tingis founded. French elephant killed. Gems to Paris for 216. Stole Steam Engine from French and gave it to Babylonians.
+1120 Babylonians develop Railroad. Cavalry barely survives Aztec legion. Refrigeration -> Railroad. Domestic delivery for 65. Wine to French for 175.
+1140 Domestic deliveries for 124, 125, 52. Railroad stolen from Babylonians.
+1160 -> Industrialization. Coal to Babylon for 414. Domestic delivery for 47, 37
+1180 Industrialization -> Theory of Gravity. Deliveries to Babylonians for 88, 227. Domestic delivery for 75, 50. Destroyer easily kills 3 archers defending Marseilles. Tlax captured.
+1200 French Marseilles conquered. Domestic deliveries for 19. Tlacopan founded.
+1220 Domestic delivery for 26, 88, 28. Rusaddit and Alalia founded. Spice to Babylon for 436. Aztec Calix razed.
+1240 Barbarian dragoons kill rifleman and diplomat defending their favorite target: Kish. Cavalry survives Aztec elephant. Theory of Gravity -> Corporation. Destroyer kills barbarian dragoons. Domestic delivery for 40, 44. Coal to Babylon for 334.
+1260 Selinus, Himera, and Zardabad founded. Tlat captured. Aztec civilization destroyed. Domestic delivery for 44.
+1280 Destroyer kills defenders of Orleans. The city captured for 120g and 2 structures. Domestic delivery for 56, 78, 32. Sirjan founded.
+1300 Tlal founded. Domestic delivery for 60. Hides to Babylonians for 262.
+1320 Corporation -> Steel. Deliveries to Babylonians for 605, 365. Domestic deliveries for 66, 78, 82, 72. GreenTree and Ghent founded.
+1340 Steel -> Genetic Engineering. Adam Smith built. Destroyer lost in attack on French Charters defended by a Rifleman! They do not have Conscription or Gunpowder. The unit must have come from a hut. French elephant killed. 2 barbarian dragoons killed. Domestic delivery for 95, 116, 32, 56.
+1360 Domestic delivery for 138. Deliveries to Babylon for 456, 500.
+1380 Genetic Engineering -> Refining. Spice to Babylon for 300. Domestic delivery for 72, 504. Lost a Cruiser on the rifleman in Charters. Cavalry finished off the wounded rifleman. None Musketeer from hut.
+1400 Charters captured. Accepted French offer of 450 for cease fire. Railroad, Industrialization -> French -> maps. Hides to Babylonians for 412. Advanced tribe founds Dublin of size 4 on continent 14.
+1420 Refining -> Combustion. Sabzabad founded. Domestic delivery for 212, 57, 236, 30, 37. Hides to Babylonians for 512.
+1440 Combustion -> Flight. Demand for tribute causes French to declare war. 2 French units killed. Domestic delivery for 52, 84. Deliveries to Babylonians for 255, 228. Akragas founded. Rushed Darwin to keep it away from Babylonians. T5L5S0
+1460 Darwin built. Flight -> Radio -> Machine Tools. T4L5S1. Two defenders of Paris killed and the city taken for Pyramids, Colossus, and Liberty. 3 French units killed. Domestic delivery for 44, 27, 110, 32, 34, 21, 36. 50g from hut.
+1480 Babylonians build Eiffel. Cremona founded. Cruiser kills single defender of Babylon. The city taken for Communism, Copernicus, 307g, and 2 structures. 2 partisans show up and are immediately killed. Plane kills 3 defenders of Lyons. The city is captured. Cavalry kill 2 defenders of Rheims. Advanced tribe founds Shush on continent 8. Shushtar founded on continent 8. Domestic delivery for 44.
+1500 Barbarians kill an Engineer, Babylonians a Cruiser, and French a Cavalry. Rheims captured after plane easily kills its single defender. Domestic delivery for 46, 35, 42. Nineveh captured after its single defender killed by plane. Again two partisans appear. Lost a cruiser killing one of them.

Status at +1500
Population: 24.9M; Cities: 70; Techs: 63; Government: Fundamentalism
Gold: 12; Cost: 291; Trade routes: 144D3F;
Ancient Wonders: Hanging Gardens, Great Library, Pyramids, Colossus, Great Wall
Medieval Wonders: All but Shakespeare
Industrial Wonders: Leo, Bach, Adam Smith, Darwin, Liberty
Units: 50 Engineers (1 None), 11 Assault units, 12 boats, 8 vans
Notes: Every one is in Democracy. Babylonians have Conscription but did not make Riflemen for their cities.
Goals: Finish off the remaining rivals.
Babylonian: 1 city at last update; Eiffel; War with me
French: 1 city at last update; War with me
Aztec: Destroyed by me
Persian: Destroyed by me
Carthaginian: Destroyed by me

Now you really got ahead of me. I have been expanding (and growing) peacefully during this era.

1020 2*100g from huts
1040 settler lost due to food issues, advanced tribe in bad location, Tijuana & Second Wind founded
Nobody started Kopernikus so far, best SSC(without Shakespeare & Colossus)-location would be Utica with 18 rivers
1060 Explosives -> Chivalry (Aztecs working on Sanitation)
1080 Squared River founded
1100 Barb Legion kills Bornholm defender, Kreta founded
1120 Bornholm captured by barbs, gets wine from WK 130g, hut: advanced tribe Verona offshore (cont. 8)
1140 Chivalry -> Magnetism
1160 Aztecs almost done with Kopernikus.. RB it for 940g, Bornholm bribed back for 104g; French: Give Mysticism+Astro, get Steam Engine
1180 Kopernikus finished (Aztecs aband), Magnetism -> Railroad, Third Wind founded
1200 Lissabon, Hamburg founded
1220 Railroad -> Metallurgy
1240 Köln founded
1300 Metallurgy -> Industr. Little Bighorn Darwin: Ind.->Electricity->Corporation
1340 Corporation -> Steel
1360 Barbs from hut (escape via boat) start partying
1380 Steel -> Refinement
1400 Blue Sea Mine founded
1420 Refinement -> Electronics, gems(d) Bear Paw>Paris 378g
1460 Electronics -> Combustion
1480 Party's over for now
1500 Combustion -> Conscription, Barb knight bribed 82g

Stats at 1500 AD:
Population: 12.86 Mill.; Cities: 43; Trade routes: many; Government: Democracy
Gold: 27; Cost per turn: 71; Total advances: 54; Production: 302; 0 polluted tiles
Wonders: Marco, Michelangelo, Sun Tzu, HG, Copernicus, Leo, Bach, Darwin
French: Pyramids, Shakespeare, Adam Smith
Aztecs: Colossus
Units: 31 Engineers, 17 Musketeers, 6 Crusaders, 1 Knight, 1 Cannon, 7 Transport, 8 Diplomat, 2 Freight, 1 Explorer
peace with all, allied with Babylon

Maybe it was not smart to build up an SSC/STC so late in the game, but I enjoyed the effects anyway. ;) Fully developed, Utica could produce 139 trade arrows and 1496 beakers at 100% science (just theoretical, would of course be rioting). Other cities could benefit from trade routes with Utica, so I decided to put all that science and tax income into a full-size-spaceship.

Just finished, by OCC landing. Won't provide a log this time.

@Jokemaster, what is your date?

I also tried this one with OCC landing. This is my second GOTM, so I'm just interested)

Landing? 1874 AD. Not my best OCC game: I could, and should, have done better.

I played pretty well early, but as usual was very poor late.

I had 15 cities at 1ad, but otherwise was doing quite well. I was in Democracy at 390ad, and then got sidetracked buiding and celebrating and forgot to conquer. I had only 31 cities at 31ad. Eventually, I switched to fundy. Unfortunately, I delayed leadership too long, and everybody had musket when I got it. Even the cavalry weren't strong enough, but a few fighters emptied the last cities. Ilimped home in the early 19th century.

In this game, I did not build Marco Polo (because I needed Mike's more) and used the diplomats for embassies when I got close to the AI civs. I would have been so late getting MPE that I am not sure I would have gotten enough techs from the AI to make it worthwhile. What were other players' experiences with MPE in this game?

Hello grigor,

As I found the starting situation quite puzzling I thought I would look to see what had happened in previous GotMs using an accelerated start. There are not very many. GotM 28 (May 2003) was one, and in the spoiler for that game I read something I found helpful: it was written by ...... grigor!
After play, it is clear that conquest is the way to go, which means finding the AI fast is crucial, so MPE becomes a necessity, and LH is useful.

This was very good advice I think. It gave me confidence to set off on EC (early conquest) for the first time. I read a fair amount Peaster has written to try and understand what that means. And that too proved very helpful.

I built Hanging Gardens, Marco Polo, Sun Tzu and Lighthouse (a first for me). The conquest, based on triremes and crusaders, seemed to go well, though perhaps not as fast as the experts might have managed. I did the work in Monarchy, and became despicable. I was particularly mean to Babylon.

I discovered and spent some turns in democracy at the end to reward the people for their sacrifice in our wars. Michaelangelo's Chapel was built in this period.

So very many thanks for recording your comments back in May 2003. Without them I do not think I would have tried EC, built the Lighthouse or indeed experienced how you can do whilst becoming despicable. It was enjoyable.

If only I had had such advice for GotM 123 I would not have to be admitting to a colossal blunder from inattention ... no, it must wait for my entry to the spoiler - I am past AD500 (and it's Prince level!) and still not qualified to read or submit to that spoiler thread.

kind regards, Inkerman

I never considered NOT building MPE in this GOTM. Without it, you would have to rely on finding the AIs on your own, and (hindsight) that would require a lot of time for Aztecs, French and Babylonians.
So MPE was my first wonder choice, and I don't regret it. I didn't build HG because of not having pottery (researching it myself felt like a waste of time at that stage), and when I finally had it, I chose to build Mike's chapel instead.

By the time my first wonder was about ready I had only met Carthaginians, so for me Marco was an easy decision. Once Marco allowed me to see all rivals, I decided on conquest. I waited till +1 to get HG and expand. Given the map, Lighthouse was not necessary and I did not even consider building it. I attacked Carthage shortly after +1. As soon as I was done with their empire I switched to Democracy and expanded till +1000. At that point I switched to fundy and finished every one off shortly after +1500. War in democracy was not a choice for me in this game, since all my rivals switched to democracy and no bribing was possible.

I rushed to finish approx June 9 before leaving on a trip. IIRC I finished by conquest a bit past 500AD. The Babs and I were both in Demo, me despicable. I rarely play Demo and have never mastered the Emissary ploy. So, I had a problem similar to Ali's. My solution was to revolt and conquer all in one turn, an oedo year. This allows you to switch from Demo and back before ending your turn, to get a decent GOTM score. It was possible in my game because the Babs did not build many good defensive units, even though they had conscription. IIRC I did not have SoL - with that, switching to Fundy earlier would have been a simple and good alternative.

As a general rule, an early Marco helps a lot with EC, in getting AI maps and tribute and techs. I built it in this gotm and recommend it. But I'd hesitate to say it is "crucial". Some strong players (solo, and perhaps zenon, grigor, etc) have gotten good EC results without it. In comparison games at Poly, they sent out more early explorers [both land and sea] than I did, and often got lucky with huts and contacts [for very-early tech trades] and "nearest city" info [a substitute for AI maps]. IMO that style is harder to play, and riskier, but not necessarily bad.

Ali - you have always written meticulous logs, which have earned the praise of many GOTM players. Now that you have added "Goals" to your template, I will join the chorus ... Nice!

IIRC I finished by conquest a bit past 500AD. Impressive as always.
Ali - you have always written meticulous logs, which have earned the praise of many GOTM players. Now that you have added "Goals" to your template, I will join the chorus ... Nice! Thanks. I am looking forward to that.

The final part of my log. I'm quite happy with my landing date of 1792 with a full-size spaceship. I conquered the continent anyway, so only two Babylonian cities survived in the end.

1510 Conscription -> Leadership (Automobile blocked), 200g from hut
1530 Leadership -> Automobile
1550 Automobile -> Tactics, Utica Newton, Stuttgart founded, restart Party
1560 Tactics -> Mass Prod.
1570 Mass Prod. -> Mob. Warfare
1590 Mob. Warfare -> Machine Tools
1600 Calabria, Fourth Wind founded
1610 Machine Tools -> Flight, Broken Arm founded, first Tank produced
1620 French develop communism, Flight -> Mini
1630 Mini -> Radio Plan for french attack: Revolt in 1650, take over Paris, grab communism, est. in 1660
1650 Radio -> Computer, REVOLUTION, transport with 8 Tanks shipped to Paris, Paris captured (161g+Pyr+Shakes+Adam Smith+Communism), bribe Avignon
1660 Democracy re-established
1670 Computers -> Espionage
1680 Espionage -> Advanved Flight
1690 Adv. Flight -> Comb. Weapons, SETI built, French Musketeer lands and is bribed, attack Tours + Orleans, Cease fire after cap of Orleans :(
1700 Comb. Weapons -> Robotics
1710 Robotics -> Rocketry -> Space Flight, new plan: Go for spaceship = heavy rb Freights, delay conquest, deliveries only from Utica
1720 Sapce flight -> plastics
1730 plastics -> Atomic theory
1740 Atom. Theory -> Nucl. Fisson
1750 Nucl. Fission -> Nucl. Power
1752 French steal Plastics, declare war, cap Tours 89g, cease fire
1754 Apollo completed, Nucl. Power -> Guerilla
1756 Cease fire with French run out (??), re-establish embassy with Babylon (still OCC), give some techs, no gifts
1758 Guerilla -> Laser (just missed it)
1760 Laser -> Supercond. -> Refrigeration
1762 Refrig. -> Fusion, French sneak attack, cap Reims 193g, cease fire
1766 Fusion -> Stealth, cap Lyons
...
1776 Labor Union -> Recycling, bribe Chartres 505g, 267 back
1778 Recycling -> Genetic Engineering, Spaceship completed: 39-7-7-4-4-4 launched, to arrive in 1792
1779 Genetic -> Amph.
(French steal Space Flight > declare war)
1780 Cap Grenoble (?g) & Marseille (250g) war with Aztecs because of alliance
1781 Bribe rioting Besancon for 247g (206)
1782 Bribe Rouen 282g, 202+Eiffel-Tower, French destroyed
1783 Dye(d) Utica>Babylon 736g
1784 Wine(d) LB>Babylon 850g, cap Texcoco 217g
1785 UN completed, cap Tenochtitlan 197g+Magellan,coll.,GL, cap Teotihuacan 1g + Liberty
1786 cap Xochicalco 11g
1787 Cure 4 Cancer, sign peace with Aztecs
1789 Great Wall, demand Aztec retreat, war, cap Tlaxcala 66g, Tlatelolco 28g, delay deliveries for science,
1790 Hoover & Oracle built, cap Calixtlahuaca, rush LH, Women's Suffrage + Manhattan, sell some unneeded improvements (sewer systems in cities that can't grow further), rush needed improvements instead
1791 Build Manhattan, WS & LH, all wonders built or captured, cap Tlacopan 31g, Aztecs destroyed, 9 endcities founded for score, most engineers settled, Luxuries 100%, workers moved to max out score
1792 Alpha Centauri reached

1778 Recycling -> Genetic Engineering, Spaceship completed: 39-7-7-4-4-4 launched, to arrive in 1792
Why not a 39-8-8-4-4-4 ship which would have arrived in 11 instead of 14 turns?

Why not a 39-8-8-4-4-4 ship which would have arrived in 11 instead of 14 turns?

It was about a rough estimation of score. I couldn't have built those two components by the launch-date, so it would have taken another turn to build them.
I decided to use those two extra turns and the spared resources for score-building instead, since there was still a lot to do at that time, conquer AI-cities, build wonders (7 still unbuilt by then) and let cities grow.

The text that you have entered is too long (56481 characters). Please shorten it to 30,000
I seem to recall having problems with post length limit back in the early days of CivFanatics, LOL.


So, this will be split into 3 parts. I dont have time to make it "pretty" or even consistent with terminology & notations, but here it is.


Log Part 1: 1600 BC to 500 AD
-1600 Carth Horseman, offered trade Warrior Code for Mysticism, I agreed, but took Polythiesm instead. Rejected trade offer for Construction (Pyramids). Rejected Peace, and demanded tribute (paid 50g).

-1550 hut-Elephant(counts as shield support, leaving only 1 shield of production in A02)

-1500 A02

-1400 Carthage breaks peace, attacks my fortified archer/horseman on hill. Both become vets, and defeat Warriors, Archer, Horsemen.

-1300 HUT-Seafaring
-1250 Elephant attacks my fortified Chariot on Mtn, now vet.
-1150 ARcher attacks A03, it dies. A phalanx is now fortified on a river forest, and facing a Carth Legion and Phalanx.
First new settler, from A02. First wonder is 6 turns away.
-1100 Legion attacks my Phalanx, Legion dies, Phalanx becomes vet and recovers fast (its 2 tiles from A03), a 2nd Carth phalanx approaches my phalanx on river.
My archer and horseman have now stacked and fortified on a Forest river next to Carthage.
-1050 French horseman, ask to trade Lit. for WC, I accept and choose trade (dont want WC or Math). Refused peace, they offered 200, accepted, demanded tribute, they sent Warrior Code. Chariot killed carth elephant east of Carthage.
-1000 Found A03 southeast of A01.
-0975 Carthage attacked Chariot from Malaca (B01), and the attacker died, Malaca is unoccupied! Chariot moves in. Plunder 40, and Iron Working (the only choice). Rehomed vet Chariot.

-0950 ---- COLOSSUS---- . A01 about to grow to size 8, set 10s, make warrior for happiness control.
Explorer, will send it around Utica to the SW, and possibly to help my legions coming to Utica, if caught in ZOC.
My north Legion met Carth settler, I granted Audience, the offer cease fire, we reject and call them cowards, they offer 200gold, we accept. We reject peace, and demand a tribute. They "ignore our feeble threats."
Changing to Phalanx at A02, and send Elelphant for rehoming at A03, in 4 turns A02 will grow.
-0925 North Legion fortifing on River Jungle, sending south legion to help for eventual assault.
B01 chariot explores east, trireme and south chariot push south and southwest.
Still focus on Tax, for IRPB's. 2 enemy phalanxs unfortified and seem to have shifted north by one square, each.
-0875 Carth demands I withdraw from Utica.
-0900 A01 is size 8, will make a settler. Size 7 impact is only 2 gold per turn vs. size 8, and send Non up to mine; pre-mines on the way.
Located French with Trireme, Orleans.
-0875 HUT-Horseman(NON) north of French. HUT- Feudalism; this is too soon, and adds IPRB expense, and may restrict trade to new civs.
-0850 A01 settler (now size 7), one shield support paid, pre-road on way to road at Skins; both NON and A01 will road in one turn and make village on hill at whale, east of A01.
HUT-Explorer found hut, with carth warrior next to it, and hut gave a Legion(NON)! There is a nearby carth village somewhere, since B01 is only 4 tiles away.
French have already mined a hill.
-0825 Carth warrior fortified in front of my mighty Explorer, explorer doubled back and found Caralis.
-0800 Bring trireme back to pick up horseman near France, let Chariot take the hut on next turn instead, then probably go meet French.
Barbarians coming from west, to A01. Legions from a trireme, will move out to defend on mountain.
-0775 More barbarians (Horsemen) coming in from east, straight to new village, can arrive in 4 days. In 2 days, I will have a Pikeman there from A03, which is finishing a new one next turn. Carth threatens me at Utica; soon, war will happen and they will lose Utica. Using explorer to move Legion past the defending warrior east of Caralis.
-0750 Founded A03, pikeman will arrive one day late.
-0725 Barb Legion lands between A02 and Carthage, from trireme. 2 Caravans done.
Contacted Carth, they offered 50 for peace, then gave TheWheel as tribute.
-0675 Contact Carth, insist to withdraw, they declare WAR. Legions attack Utica, first Legion dies, 2nd legion wins (vet), and horseman takes village.
Will withdraw from Caralais area; only 1 legion and its not fortified. Forgot to change A03 back to Caravan after IPRB, now it has a Horseman and Pyramids will be delayed. May IPRB a diplomat, and make Pyramids in A03 in 6 turns.
Carth offered cease fire as horseman arrives to allow Phalanx to move to Utica (ZoC). Refused. They offered 50, accepted.
-0650 Barb horseman attacks my fortified pikeman on hill in A03, barb loses, and pike is still not a vet.
Exploring, south, SW, SE; no unit to explore west, yet. Killed barbarian leader, got 100 "ransom". Temp. moving horseman to C02, releasing Phalanx for swap with C03, for shield rehome w/C03. Will not attack Carthage until all the swaps are settled. Changing from Caravan to Horseman at A03, for happiness in A02 in a couple turns.
-0625 Made 2 settlers, and also 2 villages (A03 C03) have citizen #1 as unhappy redface. A northwest tile of B01 city radius is being used, there is a village north of it somewhere. Sending Trireme back to get Horseman. Barbarian Legion that landing north of Carthage is coming for Carthage, but should hit the Carth Phalanx which is blocking my Archer first.
-0600 Barb legion killed an unseen Carth phalanx, Philosophy_Monothiesm_S-Medicine(Choice-Chivalry-Republic)(NoChoices-Theology-Engineering-Math). Explorer finds Crusader in Hut. Making Diplomat in B01 and A03. A03 is IRB'd for next turn, and A02 Caravan is IRB'd, with the 3 caravans moved in place to make Pyramids in it next turn. C02 hourseman is RB'd, Size 2 C02 will not be destroyed if taken before the horseman is made. Its defender (A03 home) now stacks the Carthage archer (A02 vet). Carthage battle is coming, and will rehome when Carthage is taken. Size 2 C02 will not be destroyed if taken before the horseman is made. Still have 70% tax set, and 900+ gold in bank. 24 gold per turn, with 5 cost. Science costs 323, and takes 14 to 33 turns.
-0575 Carth surrounds my troops that are fortified on 2 tiles at Carthage, and attacked my 2 vet Legion stack on river jungle with Carth south legion. One legion took about 1/4 loss HP. Let the battle begin. Legion #1 attacks and defeats Carth fortified Phalanx. Legion #2 (the wounded), attacks and defeats a fortified WARRIOR, and Carthage is still defended at size 2. But if a WARRIOR defends, then what is left is either another Warrior or else not fortified. So the ARcher attacks, and wins with almost no damage, against an unfortified Legion. Carthage is going to be Destroyed, just like Scipio Africanus had to do. There is a fortifying warrior between my archer and Legions, and it will surely go into Carthage next turn, and assuming Carthage might grow to size 2 because of shrunk, filled food box, then Carthage would still be destroyed next turn. There is a wounded Legion coming from the north, facing the fortified Carth phalanx which must be homed in Carthage, but my archer should be able to kill the Barb next turn. So... CARTEGO DELENDA 'EST ("Carthage must be Destroyed"--Marcus Portius Cato). Plunder all of 3 gold. Will heal the forces and then move south to Caralis. The C03 settler will now be used to go found a new village in near the former Carthage. Mistimed the Trireme, it must wait a turn for the Horseman of the southwest to reveal the last 2 tiles.

-0550 ---- PYRAMIDS --- Carth settler finished irrigating a tile next to the rubble of Carthage. How nice. The Barb Legion turned straight for C03, but the phalanx going to C02 will be diverted and stop a the Forest River tile for defense fight. My Legions will never heal&catch.
South horseman cam out of the forest, and met a empty size one Aztec village, they offer Peace, I reject, they offer 200g, we accept, Should we plunder this village and set them back? They are Enthusiastic, but will not trade maps. Strange, assuming they have Mapmaking. Now is when Marco Polo would help greatly. But, no plunder, go around it.
Trireme goes to Landmass 12, and discovers Babylon (Size 7!), which makes this a good trade target. Magellans is now a high priority item, as are Galleons. Republic before Democracy is also an option, though the capital cannot really be moved (it will become the SSC) despite its horrible north location. HUT-50g, uh, yahoo.
-0525 Barb legion suddenly reverses course and now faces my almost healed vet archer. The archer kills the Barb, and is still green. A02 horseman is shadowing the Carth settler, which went to an eastern mountaintop.
BABYLONIAN: My horseman popped out to meet them, and they demanded Literacy, we refused, they declared war. I thought Babylonian would be peaceful, but no, its war. There is a landmass 14 to the northwest, will leave the Babs alone for now. IPRB and PRB shields in north for Caravans, B01 for Diplomat, and C02 for settler. C02 takes Phalanx from C03, and C03 IRB explorer, as the Chariot is going to get kicked out of Aztec. Should have made 2nd explorer some turns ago, but distracted with all the Carth activity. Have nearly 1100 gold. First Mine is done at A03.

-0500
BABYLON: A Barb trireme is now head to head with my trireme, get out of area quick.

Will have Hanging Gardens in A01 in 5 turns, or sooner if necessary. Top priority. A02 & A03 will have caravans in 2 turns, arrive in 4 turns. Explorer finds Advanced Tribe, its "born" red, and worker must make Luxuries to keep happiness. This is the THIRD A.T.

[[Since so far I have had no barbarians from huts, and a 3rd A.T., then for a test, I saved the game, and entered the hut 4 more times. Three times, it gave me an A.T., and once it gave me Engineering. It seems that on this map, A.T. villages are common, or at least the game really is biased to an A.T. I am "Supreme" and "Spotless".]]

-0475
BABYLON: Barb Legion popped out of Trireme, killed by unit in Babylon. Barb Trireme empty. My horse hopped out west of Babylon; a hut is on a mountain, but horseman did not make it "up" this turn.
CARTHAGE: Warrior attacked my Legion 2-stack, caused minor damage.
AZTEC: Chariot was forced to withdraw, even though it was right at a Forest Hut near Texacoco, and could have entered it this turn. Not worth breaking the treaty though. Chariot was sent to B10, which I had not noticed. This village had one worker as Lux, because of redface, and chariot cured it, which cost food and a shield for not noticing.

-0450 Temple in A03, have A02/A03 caravans enroute to rally point, can complete and cheaply buy Hanging Gardens next turn if pressured by anyone.
HUT-Mountaintop Crusader (NON).

Plan: To destroy C02 eventually, but have it spawn settlers for now. Forced to make temple at A02, one worker is Lux. Three units and four redface.

-425
CARTH: Carth settler near B01, bribed it for 168 (NON). Found Panormus when bribed, and this settler could have come "with" Panaormus. Bribe Panaormus for 106(7). One warrior inside.
New plan: Make Trireme at B10, and take Explorer to explore. Will bring back Explorer and rehome it, which should have been done originally anyway. IRB trireme, explorer will arrive next turn.

-400 Crusader found a Bab Legion in a Hilltop Fortress, 7 tiles west of Babylon.

-0375 ---- HANGING GARDENS ---- Aztecs make GREAT LIBRARY.

CARTHAGE: "Have mercy on our humbel and peaceloving civilization. We will give you all of our gold (18) and knowledge if you let us live in peace."
----> REJECTED!! Time to die, Carthaginian. Elephant attacked a Legion, Legion won, but is red.

Crusader is waiting on River, and comes up to Caralis, attack, kills fortified ARcher, is promoted, but red. Vet archer comes along river, to support Crusader on river forest square. Caralis is size 2 and Empty, but they will probably have a unit come out next turn. If the stack is lost, the Legin will prevail next turn. Nothing else is yet in range to occupt the empty Caralis.


To make size 7 capital celebrate takes 20%Lux, which costs 9 arrows (4 in Cap, 5 in tiny villages). The result would be 7 arrows, for a net loss of 2. Ergo, for now, keep 0% LUX, but make Marketplace. The harbor can be used for quick IPRB. B07 will not be unhappy next turn, and A02 can return its worker to finish temple sooner.

-0350 Caralis is still unoccupied, and is now size 3: Wounded crusader will take village, and get 100% health back. Plundered 13 gold, CARTHAGENIANS DESTROYED ***. IPRB harbor 102, have over 800g remaining.

FRENCH: COntacted: Offered peace, we reject, they offer 200g, we accept, then demand tribute, they give us mathematics.
BABYLON: We contact, they demand Literacy, we reject, they continue war.
AZTEC: Uncooperative, but we demand tribute, they pay 50%, are Icy now.

HUT: First Barbarian, and its a big one: 6 horsemen & 2 Legion surround Explorer, forcing withdrawal back to boat.
HUT: 50g

-0325 Barbarian horde of 2+ chariots coming from swamp to B07, in the far east.
HUT: Engineering
HUT: Legion

BABYLON: Crusader located Ur.

-00300 B07 pikeman attacked by Barb chariot, pike went red, got vet, and is now green.
My Explorer is near the Aztec hut that the Chariot had to depart earlier.
BABYLON: Bab Elefant is one move behind crusader, chasing it away from Ur.
-0275: Make roads, prepare to refound new carthage, but in new spot. Rehome some troops. Make caravans.
-0250: Texacoco hut: Crusader (NON)
At B07, chariot kills Leader, barb chariot seems to be chasing settler, and horseman in B07 killed him. Chariot COULD have attacked 07, but did not, and is next to the B07 settler instead. Horseman failed to become Vet, despite nearly dead.

-0225 Making troops to keep control; making Temples. Need MC soon.
HUT: Crusader NON
BABYLON: Elephant still chasing my Crusader, turned back on it, killed it on flatland.

-0200:
AZTEC: forced withdrawal of Texacoco crusader, it went to C05.
HUT: 25 gold
-0175: HUT: Crusader (NON)
-0150: Killed barb horseman w/chariot at B07, one more is coming. More barbs appearing east of A03.
HUT: Advanced Tribe, island east of B07 where barb units were.
HUT: ANOTHER Advanced tribe, F01, on island northwest of Babylon.
Have circumnavigated the world. A large black area west of Capital remains, seems to be mostly water.
RB complete temple at C04, a redman just went black causing 1 happy + 2 red.
Happiness is now becoming a large problem. Send Capital (now size 8, 2 red, 3 happy) horseman to A03, which now has red gone black. Temples started in several villages, will rush completion as it becomes necessary, or if their military units need to deploy.
Making Settler at Capital, instead of going to size 9 in Monarchy, due to affect on empire and small current return on increased size, since celebrations are not practical and no trade is established.

Trade will not generally not be planned on Landmass 3 without proper road/RR.

-0125 First city slipped into Anarchy, B01, after it grew to size 2. Switched to Temple, losing 1 of 2 shields in box, and village is -1 in food until temple is built, since crusader is needed north at village that will be founded on wine hill in 3 turns.
A03: incoming chariot and leader 1 tile behind, rush temple (64g) to free pikeman to defend River Forest with Settler making road on it to east.
4 caravans completed.
Rushed 2 more temples, now down to 1000 gold.

NOTE: HG makes blackman Happy (Light blue), makes Redman content (dark blue). D01 is size 1 redman content; F01 is size 1 blackman Happy (both with zero units at home).

-0100 Barb attacks pikeman at A03, pike is red and now vet, but leader just disappeared before my horseman could chase it. Horseman killed leader at B07 after its chariot easily died attacking the village.
7 temples now, 7 gold per turn.
HUT-50gold
Renamed some villages for better pattern.

PLAN: Use A01 to spawn settlers for west land, and east of A03.
Plan to kill of B01x, B02x, C02x, C05x. Will use Monarchy to help support extra units until disbandments, though empire size is impacted with happiness in Monarchy as villages grow.
Will use landmass bottlenecks to mark off territory as moving south; bringing 2nd NON legion south to hill, and next turn Diplomat will come; a C03x settler with the 2nd Legion escort will make fortress to protect the coming stack, then found a village.

-0075 "Exceed 1,000,000"; Prepare new village foundings, including wine hill. Rehome, distribute.

-0050 Aztech diplomat is at south chokepoint. My diplomat coming from the north will probably bribe it, or I will expel it next turn. IPRBs. Continue to stock up for MChapel. Founded Wine Hill, B05. Barbarians coming from sea, northeast of F01 (north of Babylon); get defender ready and make Diplomat. Bring trireme around east end, past Babylon, prepare to get 2 Babylon island Crusaders. A Legion is stuck on an island, south of D01; no trireme is ready to get it for a long time.

-0025 Bribed Aztec diplomat, ~70 gold at Legion Hill. Will have 8 caravans, but not in correct positions to make MC in under 3 days, so have A01 make MC in 5 turns with 7, starting next time. C02 will Anarch next time, buy last 8 shields of Temple. B07 settler will BI its way to site of coming B06. Avoid temples in X-cities, since MC will be coming in 5 turns. RB A04 horseman for Happiness control, 44g. Change mind; stop Fortress construction, change to mine the Legion hill, and make a village on a hill in that spot. Bring 2nd C03x villager to Legion hill after it makes a road.

+0001 Bribed Aztec Elephant 98g with former Aztec diplomat! Unfortunately, its a C01 elephant not a NON.

Incoming Barb Legions to F01, put Pike on Mountain, position Horseman & Crusader on river system for mobility and to hunt down leader. Get diplomat ready to bribe.
Shift crusader to C05x; it did not help, should have looked at Happy calculation first, shifted C03 horseman to C04 to compensate for loss of Cursder happy control. Will IPRB settler next turn. Ditto for B02x, its a double blackface like C05x.
HUT: Advanced Tribe, Ei1 (Eastern Island, north pole area).

Set A02 to make MC in 5 turns, A01 to make Caravan/Settler/Trireme (TBD). A03 needs to grow to size 4 to make 10 shields, in 5 turns.

+0020 Aztec catapult: 106g cost.) C01 support.
CONTACTED:
AZTEC: Offered CF, we refused, they offere 150g, we accept. Refused peace.
BABYLON: Refused end of war, they continued war.
FRENCH: Demanded tribute, they paid 25g

PLAN: Bring troops down to find Babylon capital, take it, then bribe their villages cheap.
Will bring north pole B10 trireme to capital, to populate west indies.

+0040 Bribe Aztec catapult (102g,vet,NON)
Barb trireme coming for Legion Hill, set up diplomat (was headed for Aztecs) on shore just behind it.

+0060 MC done in 2 turns at A02.

+0080 Barb lLegion attacked mountain fortified Pike (vet), leader went to river, Crusader killed it.
Bab Legion in Fort costs 236 to bribe, too expensive.
Bribe barb Trireme (82), but its supported from C01. Will pick up the Legion next turn.

NEW PLAN: Try to take Ur, cheaply, using Crusader and diplomat.
Babylon is walled, and not able to take it.

+0100 Redistribute troops, rehome, move while MC controls unhappiness.

+0120 Barb Legion attack Legion Hill, loses; leader goes into Jungle; horseman follows and ransoms leaders for 100g.

BABYLON: At Ur, Attack, kill fortified Phalanx easily w/Crusader, Ur size 2 empty w/Settler on grassland west of Ur. Diplomat bribes Ur for 160g(74g). Obtains Settler and an Elephant that was on east side. West 2 crusaders see a size 1, empty village, Nineveh, but cannot plunder it until next turn.
FRENCH: Try to get maps, gift Philosophy, then they have "no more time" for us.

+0140
BABYLON: Legion came out of its Fortress north of Nineveh, met the crusader at Nineveh, and offered 200g for Cease Fire. We accept, they offer peace for 150g, we accept. We then demand tribute, but they "ignore" our "feeble threats". Nineveh is still empty, but Legion will probably occupy it next turn.

Found D01 (Legion Hill); Coal mine completes.
Found A05, on old Carthage Road (which is almost completed).

+0160 A03: Horseman attacks 3-stack on hill, my dug in Pikeman wins, leader jumps onto Mountaintop, horseman kills leader for 100g.
AZTEC: Found Capital village, no walls! North of Teohuiacan, Bribed elephant(NON) for 144g.
PLAN: Use Trireme to move troops north of Ten, then move stack in 2 days and attack.
Setting up road caravan feeder network from A-villages through C-villages, and down to French. 13 days will be the road trip distance from A01, and 5 further days by Trireme to Babylon.

+0200 Medicine; S-Astronomy
+0220
HUT: 100g
FRENCH: We demand tribute. They pay 50g.
AZTEC: Paid 50g for a peace treaty.
+0240 AZTEC: They remind us to remove our troops. Our troops are at Ten; we demand tribute, they declare war.
First elephant attacks (no walls), kills fortified archer. Capitial is EMPTY. Another elepant enters (6g). Capture GREAT LIBRARY, get a Market.
Diplomat meets troop, refuses cease fire, they say WAR. Bribes archer in fortress (64g), then bribes Tlatelolco (3g)(Settler, Pikeman, Aquaduct![Sell for 80], making walls). Aztecs are DOOMED, unless they can rebuild a capital in the next few turns, since my diplomats will take all their villages.
BABYLON: Will not mess with them until the check hill fortress between Babylon and Y02 is complete; it will always be a minimum of a 2-stack to prevent contact bribes. If Babylon had no walls, would probably go for a quick victory.
Found Ai1, west of A01 on island. There is barb trireme nearby.

Four caravans on 2 triremes enroute to Babylon, will arrive in about 12 turns.

+260 FRENCH: Begin SunTzu; I will have SunTzu in A02 in 4 days, or sooner if necessary.
BABYLON: Hill Fortress complete, will road it, and be bullet proof. Will make 3 vet catapults after SunTzu, and back it with mounted units, and take Babylon.
BARB: Barbarians coming for 4th time east of B06, single Barbarian Legion landed from Trireme on trees at Ai1. Diplomat bribes Legion (82g).
AZTEC: Teotihuacan is in ANARCHY, refuse contact, bribing it for 243g (10g)(Barracks, Aquaduct, 3 archers). Must keep an Entertainer in both Z01 and Z02 for happiness; Z02 actually celebrates now.

+0280 Passed 2,000,000 pop.

+0300 HUT-Theology

+0320 Bribe-Aztec Legion in Mountaintop fortress(92g,NON)

+0340 SUN TZU (French switch to Great Wall)

+360 AZTEC: Offered Cease fire, refused, war. Bribe Texcoco 270(10) (2arch,1cat,1sett,0imp-Making Legion)
Offered Cease fire, refused, war. Bribe Tlaxcala-162(4)(1pike,walls-making Pike)
Offered Cease fire, refused, war.
BARB: B07 Pikeman fortified in Jungle killed both horsemen, then leader on forest (100g).
FRENCH: Bribe Elephant, 120g.
BAB: Announced they have discovered Republic

+0380 Making diplomats. There seems to be lots of battling between unseen forces and barbarians south of Paris.

+0400 Subvert Tours 2x73=146 (5g,Chiv,0imp), Adv: Univeristy (only choice).

+0440 Bribe Calixtlahuaca 202(10)(Pike,walls,making courthouse); Adv:Astronomy (only choice).

+460 Cont. ToG
A04-Bab(dCoal-433g)
AZTEC: Catapult Lyons (no walls), killed Pikeman, city empty size 4; Elephant enters (10g,0imp); Aztecs DEAD
BABYLON: Gift Philosophy, Seafaring, University (Worshipful), will not trade, I demand tribute, they give 150g; they may not have any science that I lack.
PLAN: Move forces

+0480 Pop 3,000,000
ToG S-Chemistry (only other choice was Navigation)

+0500
A01-Bab(uHides-450)

Part II, AD0520 - AD 1450 (SS Lands 1451)
+0520 Chemistry S-Invention (Chv,Inv,Rep,San); Sci Cost 702
A01-Nineveh: dHides-468g
A04-Bab: uCoal-308g
FRENCH: We Demand Tribute (WAR!!)
BAB: We demand tribute: WAR!!
Babylon: Push workers into ocean
Subvert-231(21)
Steal: Invention (Nineveh)
Incite: Nineveh 294(21)(Banking or Republic; take Banking--Can skip republic, go stright to democracy--Next turn is Odeo year!)(Phalanx, settler, Market-Making courthouse)
Sci Cost 754 (Delivered 776): Set science to 0, put scientist in last village.
Set 70T/00S/30L, trigger last 2 villages with a scientist, and discover Democracy on last village.
Set villages to celebrate with a Helper entertainer, sacrifice food to do so, and grow when in Democracy.

+0540 Paris completes GREAT WALL.
Lots of barbs land northeast of B07, yet again. This time there is a Legion with 2 horsemen.
Change Irrigation to Fortress for the bottleneck guardian pikeman.
Balance shields & food and celebrations in each village.
Complete key harbors as necessary.
Set 60/00/40L to begin with (245gold per turn).
Change
C04-A01 dGold-99
Disband Elephant & warrior at A02 for JSBach.
FRENCH: Settler keeps blocking the path from Fortress to Orleans, but price is too high to bribe thru the settler, will divert trade ship to pick up diplomat and go arond settler, to bribe Orleans from Water.

+0560 Many barbs inbound at B07; Vet pike in swamp fortress butchers all and heals each turn; ship will catch leader from behind when it arrives
Ai1-A01-u49
Redistributing Settlers, and returning for more cargo at D10.
Vet legion is fortified in forest next to Paris, and Vet Catapults and Mounted will attack the walled village next turn.
PLAN:
FRENCH: To bribe/subvert all French once Capital falls. Diplomat in Boat is ready next to Orleans.
BABYLON: Is in Republic, 99% sure; if so, then have killed all defenders and Babylon possesses exactly one supported unit.
They dont have Offshore Platform or Factories yet, so they have only one shield for support when we blockade all shield tiles for one turn, as we just completed this turn!

+580 Orleans completes Lighthouse... they wont have it for long!
Something attacks from Paris, defending Legion is only half damaged.
Exceed 5,000,000 population.
FRENCH: Pre-Position diplomats for bribing Orleans & Pikeman.
Vet Catapults EASILY slaughtered 2 Pike & 1 archer in Paris. Damaged Legion take Paris(54g)(GREAT WALL,3imp,sell Granary)
Bribe french Pikeman near Orleans (45g,NON)
Bribe Orleans from Trireme, 336(18g,2arch,1sett); LIGHTHOUSE.
Rehome A01 trireme to F02.
Diplomat to Rheims, Senate forces Cease Fire, then forces Peace.
Subvert Rheims, 2x220(9)(Leg,Pik,Set)
French are not dead, and have more cities either west or south.

+0600 007.8M/0554/350 275MT 6/0/4:418/49,0000sci(cost0780); Harbors
B07 pikeman kills Horseman & Legion; Trireme kills Barb leader, 100g (vet).

+0620 010.0M/0593/359 298MT 6/0/4:447/56,0000sci(cost0780); Harbors
FRENCH: Subvert Marseille, 2x110(31)(Pik/Mkt)
FRENCH CIV DESTROYED.
BARB: Killed another leader with vet Trireme, there are at least 2 more in that huge mess.

+0640 011.8M/0632/368 325MT 6/0/4:484/57,0000sci(cost0780); Harbors
+0660 013.7M/0676/377 325MT 6/0/4:554/74,0000sci(cost0780); All money to Aquaducts;More Barbs, Tri killed leader.
+0680 015.8M/0705/381 325MT 6/0/4:581/85,0000sci(cost0780); Most money to Aquaducts;2 leaders in stack (Only got 100g); 1 more remains
+0700 017.7M/0741/387 346MT 6/0/4:629/93,0000sci(cost0780); Most money to Aquaducts; Barbarians coming in 3 places
C04-Bab-u212;D10-Bab-u182;Y02-Bab-u48(Rd)
+0720 020.1M/0778/393 362MT 6/0/4:596/101,0101sci(cost0780); Most money to Aquaducts
+0740 021.4M/0801/395 371MT 6/0/4:615/124,0107sci(cost0806); Gunpowder,S-Sanitation; Aq/Mkt/Tem
BARB: Legion attacked C01(died,pike=vet);Horse killed Leader; Tri kill last 2 leaders,C01 lea
A01-Bab-u390;A02-Bab-u264;Y03-Bab-dCu122(rd)
Set 5/1/4 for this turn.
+0760 023.3M/0841/401 375MT 6/0/4:841/137,0000sci(cost0832); Sanitation,S-Explosives(get Leo ready)
BARB: Archer killed leader at Z07
Finish 1st 3 Sewers: A01,Ai1,Y02
+0780 025.5M/0878/406 383MT 6/0/4:919/152,0000sci(cost0832);
+0800 028.7M/0933/414 414MT 6/0/4:1020/169,0000sci(cost0832);
+0840 030.5M/0960/413 409MT 6/0/4:1081/178,0000sci(cost0832); Leo's in 3 turns. Senate: Peace. Embassy, GIFT: Astro, Sanit, IW, BB, Mono, Chem; Worshipful, but will not trade tech!! They have Economics.
+0860 032.7M/0996/416 000MT 6/0/4:1157/199,0000sci(cost0832); Barbs land AGAIN near B07.
+0880 035.1M/1021/416 000MT 6/0/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000);
A05-Bab-u328;D1-Bab-u236;Y02-Bab-u76;Y03-Bab-u84
Set 5/1/4L (Sci-156)
+0880 036.1M/0000/000 409MT 5/1/4:1157/199,0156sci(cost0832);Exp,S-Eco(Chi/Eco_Rep);LEONARDO
+0900 037.8M/0000/000 411MT 6/0/4:1152/227,0157sci(cost0858); Still wont trade Economics!
Do it the Hard Way. Science is slow in this game, mainly because of Key Civ and small number of civs.
C04-Bab-u272;B04-Bab-u332;

+0920 040.5M/1121/430 421MT 6/0/4:1121/000,0000sci(cost0000); Eco,S-Nav
C08-Bab-dCoal589
Many vill stuck at size 8 or 12, mainly due to terrain and lack of engineers.
Expansion nearly halted, to finish infrastructure and caravan reserves.
Fx1 will spawn and feed F05&F06 which were just founded.

+0940 000.0M/1165/000 000MT 6/0/4:1287/250,0168sci(cost0000); Nav,S-Phys
IPRB AdamSmith (150 shields @600g)
24 Temple,39mkt,3CH,1Lib,43Har=99 gold/turn
C03-Bab-u350;Z01-Bab-u280;F02-Bab-u210
Disband C03 explorer at South Pole.
Disband village Bx2(old Carth village) next turn.
w
Main road to Babylon is 6 turns from completion.

+0960 046.0M/1212/439 436MT 3/3/4:0896/157,0556sci(cost0936); Phys,S-Mag; ADAM-SMITH
J01-Bab-u122,J01-Bab-dCoal305,A02-D01-dGold-123

+0980 048.3M/1234/400 456MT 3/3/4:0911/165,0563sci(cost0962); Mag,S-Met
Ai1-A01-u109,F04-Bab-dCoal330,

+1000 049.9M/1273/441 467MT 3/3/4:0952/175,0581sci(cost0988/43techs); Met, S-Elect; (GT151)
BABYLON: Discovered Navigation. Is in Democracy now.
Fx2-Bab-dCoal225,F04-Bab-u132
A01: IPRB Copernicus (100s for 400g)

+1020 051.7M/1331/447 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000); Elect,S-Ref; COPERNICUS;
+1040 052.7M/1339/444 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000); Ref.S-Consc
BABYLON: Is growing, now size 14.
Z07-B-u278,C01-B-u310,Y02-B-u84,
DELAY RAILROAD (Make Farmland, Engs, & use dirt road trade; flood of Caravans are enroute)

+1060 054.0M/1363/444 000MT 5/1/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000); Consc,S-Fundy
A01-B-u604,
Trade road done, all the way to 2 port terminals!
Z06-B-dCoal728,F02-B-u232

+1080 055.4M/1405/446 000MT 5/1/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000); Fundy,S-AT; MAGELLAN

+1100 054.0M/1443/448 000MT 5/1/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000); AT,S-StEng
Ai1-A01-u108;D04-B-u234,Z07-B-u308

+1120 054.0M/1482/450 000MT 4/2/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000); SE,S-RR
J02-B-dCu236,J03-B-u84,J03-B-dCoal-210,

+1140 054.0M/1482/450 000MT 4/2/4:0000/000,0910sci(cost1170); RR,S-Indus
Deliveries=Forbidden until Corp!; set science to 900+;
Set up Darwin in correct village; IPRB 200 of the shields for 800g.

+1160 063.3M/1481/450 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000); Indust,DARWIN,Corp,Gen,S-Refine
Reserve of 27 Freight now in place at Y02, with RR to Babylon.
Another 33 are at the Port ready to transport.
Main RR backbone is done, with 150 eng-turns. Most Spurs done next turn.
A01-B-u832(max,Record);A06-B-u398;C03-B-u420;Z08-B-u250;Z02-B-280;Z01-B-u326;D01-B-u290;J03-B-dSpice276;C05-Y03-dGold602;C08-B-u354
IPRB 498sh (1992g) for CfC, in coord. village.

+1180 063.6M/1586/450 000MT 6/0/4:0000/000,0006sci(cost0000); Refining,S-Steel
b08-B-u382;B07-B-u362;A10-B-dCoal849;B09-B-u342;B06-u398
41 Freight in place, ready to deliver. 20+ more comning.
RB IsacNewton, 350s for 1400g.

+1200 065.4M/1634/455 548MT 2/4/4:2864/299,0006sci(cost1300);1-sci/turn; Steel,Elect,S-Combust
Pollution is a factor, will take Electronics
Z05-u296,A02-dSpice866(Max),C01-u332,B01-u392,B10-u348

+1220 068.2M/1689/458 555MT 2/4/4:1128/323,1536sci(c1352);1-sci/turn; Combust,Elect,S-Auto
C03-u420,A07-u420,A0?-u414,A05-u372,C06-u314,A03-u414,C04-354
Will Disband 2 villages, Cx1 & Cx2
Disband Rifleman, Buy HD-2320g


+1240 070.5M/1749/462 580MT 2/4/4:1165/328,1656sci(cost1404);1-sci/turn; Auto,Comm,S-Espion
Disbanded 2 villages, Cx1 & Cx2
BAB: B08,C06,B07,Z07,A06,C06-dSpice936;B05,B04-dCoal936 (7,488 total!)
Build key Superhighways for next turn.

+1260 072.3M/1797/000 580MT 3/3/4:1900/404,1528sci(cost1456);1-turn-sci; Espion,Chiv,S-Leader
Build 13 SH: Y02=169 arrows, A01(SSC)=180 arrows (Size28,@30%=468sci)
To Bab(SH only): B04-u696,2xB05-717,2xA03-693,B09-u615,A01-u970,C11-u573
"The Big Chop I"

+1280 074.0M/1797/000 606MT 3/3/4:2193/473,1676sci(cost1508);1-turn-sci; Leader,Tact,S-MachTool
(25SH) To Bab: A07-u570,C10-u516,2xC04-u648,C05-570,C11-u573,Z01-u571,B07-u597,A04-570
"THe Big Chop II"

+1300 075.8M/1873/000 000MT 3/3/4:2289/538,1824sci(cost1560);1-turn-sci; MachTool,Minit,S-MassT
To Bab: z02-u489,2xA10-u759,B08-u669,,
"The Big Chop III"

+1320 078.0M/0000/000 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000);1-sci/turn; MassT,Comp,S-NucFission
First POLLUTION SKULL (A01 making 25 shields, size 30, 14 PIs)
To Bab: z07-dSpice-1074,Z05-522,B10-609,B09-615,u696,u588,
Sabotage barb leader, spy is Vet. Killed barb leader at Z04 with NON-Horseman.
"The Big Chop IV"

+1340 080.0M/1976/000 621MT 3/3/4:2652/602,2071sci(cost1664);1-sci/turn; NuclearFiss_NucPower_S-Geurilla
To Bab: A05-u681,u586,u687,u579,u273,u570,u627,u636,u717,u762, u618,u636,u735,2xu708,u492,dCu1109,2xu420,u393,u44 4,u690 (del ca.)
Disband horseman, RB SETI, 2360g (in opt. village).
Complete Statue of Liberty (for 644g), building in PARIS (hehe).
"The Big Chop V"
Will try a Quad advance. Get TR's up to 3 in most University villages.
Disband many units, change productions to Universities. RB.
Will complete 21 Univ. and 11 lib. + SETI next turn.
Making 10 vet Alpine troops in small villages (instead of Freight, this turn) to replace key disbanded riflemen.
MobWarfare will come next turn or the following, and hence would not be Vets if delayed.
Rail will transport them anywhere, as needed.
Set science to 60%:4576 (70%:5287). After SETI, Need ca.1750x4=7000 (+waste) for next 4 advances.
Spent about 8,600 gold on 22 Univ + 11 Libraries, in villages that will net 30+ beakers (about 1100+ extra beakers each turn).
At 60%, SETI will give about (4600-800-800)*0.5=1500 extra beakers per turn, with scientists.



+1360 082.5M/2051/000 614MT 0/6/4:0079/701,7223sci(cost1794);4-sci/turn; SETI
Build 22 Universities/11 Libs/82 Research Labs(SETI)!
5 Advances in 1 Turn! --- Geu,AW,LabU,Laser,Recy,S-MobWar (RECORD)

PLAN:
TRADE: Flight will hurt economy, empire-wide due to lack of either SuperHighways or Airport at Babylon,
with the trade rate sliced to 33%.
Reduction of Bonus means to deliver most low-value trade now, esp. if not SH complete (only 43 so far).
Keep most Bonus (Coal+Spice+certain Oil) for next 3 turns when Spaceship must be funded, with 33% value freight.
Bonus freight value saved for the last 300+ years exceeds the current science 2/3 cap value, so deliver it post-flight.
Domestic trade partners will mostly be Y02, Bi0, and Ai1, depending on Freight source locations.
Non-Airport villages will use Babylon, to get the 100% bonus.
C04 can be used, once swamps and forests are cleared in about 5 turns (Esp. for Rail core).
B08 can also become a Rail Maxi, when swamps are cleared.
A01 will Rail with A02 as a Maxi partner.
Destroyer kills Barb Cutter approaching J03 (4 barb units dead).
Vet Spy stole Rep, Bab had only had Rep., so can take "any" tech, with near-certain success.

FREIGHT: Domest: G01-A01-u474,u648
To Bab: 2xu574,2xu282,u231,dCoal577,u405,u396,u195,u717,u3 60,A01-u1113,Y03-u170,u96,540,678
Bab Coal: 230,560,240,1213,621
Delivered over 11,000g, but only 47 Freight remain in reserve, most with Bonus (Spice,Coal,Oil,Cu,Gold).

REFERENCE, pre-Flight: A02 Babylon is 21arr; A02-A01(Rail,Col)=26arr
A01(Col)-Bab:27arr; Y02-Bab(Rail)=35arr; Y03-Bab(Rail)=32arr

SCIENCE:
Next 3 cost about 5800 (+ waste). Sci cost up from 1794 to 1820. 13 techs remaining.
Reset TSL to 1/5/4. Most Scientists set to Tax . Sci=6137, Tax1191.
Set SSL Rail Maxis (2x164) with A02 (26arrows per turn, vs. 27 with Babylon). SSC sci=952.
Will do Mobile Warfare +3 next turn, including Flight & Radio(Airports).
Can finish tech tree in 3 turns, but may delay 1 turn to fund Spaceship which can launch in 1440.

"THE BIG CHOP": Terminate. Rehome engineers, make road/RR, create/join key small villages.
Make 27 Eng, 4transp, 17 Freight (Uranium in C04,F04,Z05,B05,Ei3)
2117.



+1380 083.5M/2150/000 000MT 1/5/4:1123/757,6033sci(cost1923);3-sci/turn; MobWar,Robotics,Flight,Radio,S-AdvFlt
Founded 17 size 3 villages, 2 size 1 (record).
Will disband Bx1.

FREIGHT: Have lost 1/3 of pre-flight delivery bonuses (Gold is the issue, not sci).
Domestic:
To Bab: 2xu460,u450,u410,u532,u324,u424,u214,u253
Bab Coal: D01-820,C05-950,978,Z12-760,Z09-635,B01-1130
Bab Spice: D03-774,D10-642,D02-1008,

REFERENCE, SSC=784(down from 952)
A02-Babylon is 21arr before flt, 21arr after (21/21); A02-A01(Rail,Col)=26/21.
A01(Col)-Bab:27/22; Y02-Bab(Rail)=35/35; Y03-Bab(Rail)=32/32

MILITARY: Making 4 more transports, 26 Engineers.
Many units have been disbanded to make Engineers now that no more Sea barbs can appear.
Rail/Transp/Alpine will defend any new hotspots.
2 Destroyers ready to defend the Bablyon ocean now redeploy to possible coastal hotspots.
Down to 48 Freight & 62 Engineers, but making 17f & 28e next turn.

SCIENCE: Reset TSL: 3/3/4 (4099sci/2846g). Can make over 5K net per turn with tax, if needed.

SPACESHIP: Making no-value freight as Spaceship parts food & possible 200g+ crap trade.
Would need 26K to buy the shields as parts, but only 16K as Freight/Wonder.

PLAN: End most large scale landscaping
Grow 30+ villages "cheaply", gain economy & trade & SS parts options.
Prepare to obtain full funds for Apollo & spaceship parts, about 18.5K.
Delay most remaining airports, SH, Banks, SE, Univ (lack of funds).
C04-A01 Maxi RR: Need 23ED+12ED(at C04) for SSC RR, plus 5 feeders -- Suspended.
C04 could be a greater trade village than the SSC (78 base, vs 72); RR will max trade.

(T171)
+1400 078.0M/2330/495 764MT 3/3/4:2855/000,4035sci(cost2002);2-sci/turn; AdvFlt,Rocket,Space,S-Environ
Got a Pollution skull (from old Paris, a 4 PI village).

TRADE:
1st: Airlift of F02 Uranium (via F02 Apt) to Ei4; this will be easily a Max Trade whe F02 airport is RB'd next turn.
2nd: Airlift, H01 to Z01, Oil, which will be another Max trade (1400g +).
1st: Trade between villages with Apt/SH in both (Ei2-F02-484)
1st: Max Trade, Ei2-F02
Domest: Ei2-F02-484,Ei2-F02-dSpice-1334g(RECORD)
Bab Spice: B04-1140,B01-1330,Z09-792,D05-660,G02-440
Bab: J04-u58,D05-u220,Z03-266,A10-u520,B03-u460,u268
Buy APOLLO-2320g

UNITS: Producing 62 Freight, most of which will IRB next turn for Spaceship parts/gold.
All but 1 supported Riflemen are used to make Freight.
59eng,10alp,7rif,2hor,8cru,1can,2dest,16tran,1spy, 49freight
Start about 30+ Wonders (need max of 67 of course); each shield is 4 gold.

SCI: 30%=4111, cost 2002, will take 3 of last 6 advances.


(T172)
+1420 097.0M/2556/000 810MT 6/0/4:6267/901,0292sci(cost2080);2-sci/turn; APOLLO; Eng,Plas,SuperCond,S-Fusion(CombArm&Stealth remain)

TRADE: The key event; some freight has been saved for hundreds of years for this turn.
Y04-C01-dOil-1349(RECORD);104-C08-dSilk-1096;F04-Y03-dGold-796;Z09-/03-dGold-1104
Ei4-F02-dCoal-1404;Ei3-F03-u536;Ei2-F02-u516;Ei4-F03-dOil-1404;2xEi4-F02-u624;
H03-S01-dCoal-1040;B04-Y03-dGold-1040;A01-Y02-u724;Zi2-C03-dOil-424
J02-D01-dGold-464;
Uran(all=1404): F04-Ei4;B05-C05;Z05;C04-Y05;Ei3-S01;Ei3-Y03-dGold-1404
Bab: Z04-dSpice-690,S02-dCoal-655,H03-Z01-dOil-1274,H01-Z01-u500,G04-dCoal-680,Zi2-dSpice-804;B10-u418;B05-u478;A06-u446;A0a-u202;B06-u448;B12-dCu-526

Delivered about 30,000g; Use low value Freight to start SS parts, then RB remainder (e.g., 120g for a Structural).
Made 39 Structural, 16 Components, 12 modules. Used 20 shield IRB in A01 and F04 for Modules.
Did not use 30s IRB for structural (no 30+ shield output).
RB harbors and some key Freight with remaining gold.


(Y1440T173)
+1440 105.0M/0000/000 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000);2-sci/turn; SuperCond,ombArm,Stealth,S-FT001
Fusion,CombArm,Stealth;TechTree-Done
Zi1-H01-dGems_1024g;A03-Y03-dGold-1275;
Bab (Size 17 now): u340,u174
Rebuild Freight Reserves
TSL: 3/3/4


(Y1460T174)
+1441 110.7M/2823/000 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000);2-sci/turn; FT001,2,3
Ei4-F04-dGems-1452;Ai1-Y02-u605;B07-Z06-dGold-795;B07-Y03-dGold-899;
Bab: Z14-dCu-350;D11-dCu-240;D12-dSpice-524;;
Make Freight in new villages (happiness control) & some Imp, until out of gold.

(Y1480T175)
+1442 116.3M/2919/000 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost2444);2-sci/turn; FT004,5,6
Another Pollution (3 total now, Yellow/orange sun)

TRADE:
Domest: Z03-J01-dSilk-604;H03-Z05-dSilk-1168;Z01-G01-dGems-976(Unlocks-Oil);Bi0-Y03-dGold-1629(61/56arrows);
;B02-y05-dUran-1517(no-B05-Apt-yet-but-need-gold-now)
Bab: J06-u106,Y07-u54(same-K),J08-u117,J07-u114,Y09-u92,Y09-u97,Ai2-dSpice-1164,,,
K01-u150,K02-u126,G06-u170,Mi2-u143,Mi1-dSpice-460,A11-dCu-504,B12-u320
Bi1-u278,S05-u124,S06-u116,F03-u87,D09-u106,D07-u117,D06-u152,D13-196,

(Y1500T176)
+1443 121.9M/2823/000 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,5310sci(cost2522);2-sci/turn; FT007,8,9 (small leftover)
More pollution: C03 (3 PIs, but will have MT this turn)

TRADE:
Z02-Ai1-dOil-1681,C01-J02-dDinw-1104;Bi0-Z01-dOil-1582;F06-Ei4-u598
Y03-A03-dGems-1681(Max);Y02-C01-dOil-1681;C04-Mi3-u164;Z08-Ei3-dDye-1032;C03-G01-dOil-1475(unlocks-Gems);
Bab: Y06-u79;Y10-u68;Z15-Cu-312;A09-Cu-582;B11-u222;;;

VILLAGES:
Using population from large villages to join small villages;
Must RB Aquaducts & SH/Mkt/Route (depends).
The small routes are to keep happiness with fast growing villages.
8 villages are less than size 8, but 2 of those are being razed as feeders.

BAB (A.I.): Despite Deity, the Babylon village is NOT cheating any shields.
It produces 2, and it gets only 2, each each and every turn. That is unexpected.


(Y1510T177)
+1444 129.5M/3278/000 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost2600);2-sci/turn; FT010,11,12
Yet ANOTHER pollution, Z01 with 1 PI. Only 3 PI's in entire empire.
TRADE:
Domest: Zi1-Ai1-dWine-1080;Z08-Zi1-dOil-1733(Max);K01-Ai1-dWine-623;S01-Bi0-dOil-1733
A04-G01-dGem-1176;A03-G01-dOil-1391;A04-Y03-dGold-1733(Max);C03-Y02-u354;C08-Y02-u584
F04-Ei3-dUran-1733;H03-F02-u438;D01-Y02-dSpice-1308
Bab: S03-dCu-424;Li0-dSpice-708;D03-u300;B07-u412;Z02-Y02-u412;G06-dSpice-870g

(Y1520T178)
+1445 136.9M/3393/000 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000);2-sci/turn; FT013,14,15
Pollution is killing (5 skulls now)! More at Z01 (from 1 PI).
Clean up 2 pollution skulls, for trade, at Z01.
Stupid AI made an Engineer in Babylon, which is now down to size 16 and now making a Crusader.

TRADE:
Domestic: C12-J01-dSilk-736;A01-G02-dSilver-1250;Z05-Mi1-dSilver-784;Ai1-C11-dGems-1428;Ei3-D02-dGem-1176;Bi1-F04-dGems-1264
Z01-G01-dGem-976;S02-G01-dOil-1316;D04-Y03-dGold-1204;B10-Ai1-dWine-1210;C05-Y03-dGold-1505
;A03-Y03-dGold-1785;D02-J01-dSilk-1204


+1446 141.3M/3586/000 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,5659sci(cost2756);2-sci/turn; FT016,17,18
Domestic: A06-J10-u332;B09-J09-u168;A01-J07-dWine-1280;Mi3-Z12-dSpice-1236;
Bi0-Z01-dOil-1582;Z12-G01-dGems-1240;C11-G01-dOil-868
Bab: D09-dSpice-534,Z18-u168,

+1447 152.1M/3937/000 000MT 3/3/4:4727/1515,5823sci(cost2834);2-sci/turn; FT0019,20,21
Domestic: J01-C03-dOil-1643,A1-Z13-u132,Z19-u89,Z01-Y02-u462,Zi1-1164,G04-Z09-dSilk-964,Ei4-Y02-u614,Y03-G01-dGems-1308,,
Y03(Gold): Ai2-1675,C06-1516,C08-1588,F04-852,Z11-432,B14-1288,C07-1308,G05-498,Bi0-1889(Record),B07-899,
Bab:J05-u170,Li1-u132,F03-u152,Z15-dSp560,D13-dSpice-1050,D09-558,,,,

BUY: Manhattan(2200g), Womens(2200g); this 1200 shields leave only 1900 remaining (at most) to be bought, which cost less than 7,000 gold with the starter frieght & coming unit disbandments.


+1448 163.0M/4004/000 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000);2-sci/turn; FT0022,23,24
Domestic: Z03-H02-u356,A05-Y10-dSilk1372,Mi2-Z05-dSilk-850,Y09-D02-dOil-1204,Y09-Bi0-dOil-1806,Bi0-F10-u642,u310,,
Y03(Gold): H06-1144,Z10-476,,,,,,
Bab: S05-744,,,,


+1449 181.0M/4434/000 000MT 3/3/4:0000/000,0000sci(cost0000);2-sci/turn; FT025,26,27
All wonders built
Finish happy improvements which make a difference, finish MT's....


+1450 200.9M/4849/658.8 (GAME TURN 183);2-sci/turn; FT0028,29,30
Join last few engineers, last trades for small villages.
SS will land as soon as this current game turn (183) ends.
Put lux from 40 to 50%, nothing higher is necessary (and this only "gives" 2 more points).
(Probably should have taken time to obtain more advances per turn with higher sci, and less Lux/Tax).
Score will be 5249 with 400 for the SS, which will land as soon as the turn ends.

CONCLUSION

At game start, I planned to do the Space ship. But in the BC years, it the AI did not really put up much of a fight, and as exploration continued, it became obvious that the map was small enough for a trireme to outflank many civilizations on this water/archipelago type map. Then I thought of just finishing off the enemy with conquest. So the strategy shifted two times, and as a result would not have been a particularly good conquest, and the SS landing was ultimately delayed.

As always in a game/map like this, the major keys were Monarchy, Success of early Democracy, and trade. Notable that Republic was completely skipped, for a direct Democracy, which worked out very well; so well that in fact the units (settlers/engineers) could not keep pace with the natural game advancement, and nearing the end of the game, the Maxi Rails, the Big Chop, and terrain development plan had to be abandoned and villages allowed to grow with emphasis on Sea. The final result was a rather crude civilization. If the game had more grassland, then more engineers would have been possible, and "normal expected" full development of city terrain would likely have been completed, but from early stages, the game was starved for irrigated grassland. Not a single hut yielded a "non" settler, and in fact quite a few "Advanced Tribes" were given, which slowed planned develoment in Monarchy due both to happiness issues and to diverted economic support to villages that were overall a negative drain in Pre-democracy.


DEVIATIONS
Several other factors deviated from how I often start a game.

With all the initial units in A01 and a small map, I decided to make a Trireme and explore the coast, with several objectives. First, to determine future village layout. Second, to see coming Barbarians. Third, to locate Huts before the AI. Fourth, to make early contact with a few civilizations, and possibly avoid Marco Polo if the expected early game wonder race began.

1. This was met, and helped determine how to expand and found the first few villages. And more importantly, where not to found them.
2. This helped, though hindsight showed that the majority of barbarians seemed to come from the east, and my Trireme went west.
3. Finding huts was a good success. Using a ship with a 2-move unit is very helpful for flatland coastal huts.
4. This was very successful, and when Babylonians on a different continent's peninsula (and with a huge trade tile-only capital) were located, it changed the game from that point forward; this effect influenced all future village foundings, and changed the improvement build order in all villages from that point forward. The end result was far more caravans/freight, far fewer airports (some major village never even built one), immediate beeline to Automobile, major resource allocation to make a trade road, then end of the French empire, and the military flanking of the Babylonians, and altered gifting patterns to the Babylonians to orchestrate/contain their development and attempts to increase their capital growth. The location of their capital ultimately allowed me to move most of their village workers into the ocean (more trade arrows), as wells as to surely kill all their defenders except one without firing a shot, and this in turn altered their AI game goals and build pattern, which maximized my trade with them, at least until they built a settler in late game (which reduces trade of course). As RR approached, the value of this was so great that almost no post-RR trade bonus reduction was "felt", since within 2 turns, the entire main trade RR was completed across the empire all other priories were recindent. Ultimately, this allowed a torrid output of science (and when needed, gold), and a very fat mid game democracy. The Maxi RR with their former Ur (My Y02) and Babylon produced a staggering 35 arrows of RR trade for each of the 3 routes, and yet the max size of Babylon was never reached nor did they every make a Superhighway. It turns out that Y02 was by far the best actual SSC location, though it was not possible to make the SSC there of course.

TRIREME
So arguably, the Trireme was the most influential event on the game, but not for the most likely reasons (1-3) that I had thought at the start. In most games, I never make a trireme (though will bribe them from barbarians and hapless AI, if given a good opportunity). If the water exploration was not done, then there may have been a secondary boost to economics, since there would have been several bablyonian high-trade villages to send cargo that would have demand options, which Babylon did not have.


HIDDEN TRADE ISSUES
There were several trade issues that were very powerful, yet most may not realize when reading the log.

1. The village of Babylon was a Spice and Coal demand repeater. The demand for these never ended, and was majorly helpful in funding key improvements in Democracy, as well as a continuous stream of freight.
2. The village of Ur/Y02 was a mid/late game GOLD demand repeater. It took all gold I could make, and with the gold bonus, was greatly useful.
3. The patterns of Oil/gems demand, for instance in villages like G01, allowed windfalls when done properly. G01 would take an demanded Oil , fill that demand, and open the Gems demand. Then Gems delivery would clear the Oil demand, and close the Gems demand. Then an Oil would repeat the process. This allowed streams of Oil/Gems to be sent, and delivered with demand bonuses. On occasion, for a turn one demand would not be unblocked, but then delivery elsewhere (e.g., Bi0) would change it and one would open up again. This is a hidden power of democracy. Very fast you can grow huge trade cities on different continents, which not only increases science output, but trade (which creates strong trade routes, increasing again the total empire economic output, as well as the obvious bonuses). This is also why that, in general, Advanced Tribes are not usually helpful, esp. in early game. That said... G01 was in fact an Advanced Tribe, and at the time, I cringed when I got it from a hut. But given its Oil/Gems late game result, despite its non-ideal location, it was an AT that in fact I was glad to have in hindsight.

FREIGHT
Reserves were created, maintained, and after the huge consumption for Space Ship, rebuilt, and then heavily used near the end of the game to buy all the remaining wonders, Mass Transits, etc. Most domestic trade was matched with demand, but some was done with low bonus to solve happiness issues in fast-growing small villages.

WONDERS
Colossus became a top priority because of the Maxi potential (R/RR) with nearby villages, as well as the long-term return shield/gold cost; the discovery of Babylon reduced this importance, and when Flight was discovered, the empire was hardly affected economically with the loss of Colossus (in some games, the loss of Colossus at Flight is huge). What would have been devastating would have been the loss of Babylon, which turned out to have far far far greater value than Colossus.

Pyramids became a top priority, as the map developed. The effect of "double food" and food reserves allowed pushing caravan production very strongly, and in particular the use of the mighty IPRB.

Hanging gardens is not something I always build, but given the huge starting village, and the unhappiness being caused by early exploration, it became a top priority about BC0500.


OBSOLETE WONDERS
Marco Polo: small map, and rapid contact with civilizations, coupled with the urgent needs for the Pyr,HG, & Col rendered this wonder irrelevant. It would have been nice, but to obtain it was not possible without losing other things of far greater value. In fact, MP was only built 2 turns before game end, as a long-obsolete wonder. This is one of the few games where I recall Marco Polo never being built.
Oracle: No surprise. This wonder is often obsolete in an early democracy push, since JSB is often the most valuable wonder in the game, and fast Theology obsoletes Oracle.
King Richard: KRC was obsoleted by the fast democracy/small map, as well as the demise of many civilizations who were too busy fighting for their life to build it.

SPACESHIP
This was planned to take 2 turns. But when the time came, it was in fact completed in one turn, some units/freight, and delivery of over 29,000 in freight to fund most of the cost. Some of the parts were started as Wonders, before the ability to build SS items, then switched, and this eliminated the initial cost of 160 gold for 20 shields (e.g,. the 80 gold premium per part), as well as giving 4 gold per shield used. Some units were also disbanded, since their shields are worth 4 gold each, for a SS part. The biggest SS, 39-8-4 (400 points), was built.
39-8-8-4-4-4=11.7 years (11 years, rounded down)/100% (Fusion)
39*080=3,120
16*160=2,560
12*320=3,840
_____
9,520 *4 = 38,080g

Freight cost: 160+3x25=235g 235/50=4.7g/shield
With 7 seed, 72+75=147 (2.94g/s)
w 12, 52+75=127 (2.54g/s)

SCIENCE
This is a science in itself. It wa micromanaged throughout the game, to maximize gold. Near the end, the more exact time consuming tweaking of Scientists/Taxmen was reduced, and a setting of 30T30C40L was used, and additional new science produced (eg, libraries, scientists, univ) to compensate for increased science cost. Far more freight deliveries were made each turn that were necessary for an advance alone, the deliveries were for gold to fund the power democracy. Hence, science needed to be only enough to cause 2 advances, given the location of the SSC in the village founding order. This is a subtle effect, but was very advantageous in this game, and allowed very little science waste and a steady, predictable empire science output to obtain a given number of advances each turn.

The record in this game for advances came in 1360AD at 7223 science output, but a science cost of 1794. In that turn, almost only science improvements were timed to complete with the SETI: 22 Universities, 11 Libs, 82 Research Labs(SETI)! This was worth 5 Advances in 1 Turn, --- Guerrilla Warfare, Amphib Warfare, Lab U, Laser, Recycling. This could have been pushed again, but science was by far outstripping the ability of my engineers and gold output to keep up, and was then throttled back to 3 advances per turn (1 for Freight, 2 for 30% science output). This continued throughout most of the rest of the game, due to the science waste that would occur at 0%, 10%, or 20% settings, even with Scientist adjustments.

FACTORIES
These were not used, and a shield economy was not developed after Monarchy. The game proceeded too fast, and was funds limited even with 10,000 and 15,000 gold per turn in later game; With factories, MT's are needed, esp. when so many villages have unroaded forest and jungle due to the speed of the game. Gold Factories (e.g, IPRB, PRB, RB) were used, and the primary engine was Babylon (coal&spice) and Y02(gold & matching apt/sh villages). MT's were built at the end of the game to eliminate the risk of pollution which could cause a -10 penalty if not cleaned on the last turn.

FINAL COMMENTS
This game needed maple syrup, since there was a lot of waffles. I did not have a set, clear objective. The goal changed several times, based on short-term observations, such as AI locations, conquest progress, etc.

Its my first Civ II spaceship to land, in many years. The Spaceship "could" have easily landed before 1400, if that was the goal. Conquest was kept as an option throughout, based on play time that I get while traveling or at work, which is often limited. The earliest conquest could have been about 500AD (if that had been the goal), or could have occurred anytime after 0600AD, as played; from that point onwards, the Babylonians had one village with one defender.

NOTES

My own log notation is inconsistent; Im usually in a hurry. :)

However:

+1380 083.5M/2150/000 000MT 1/5/4:1123/757,6033sci(cost1923);3-sci/turn; MobWar,Robotics,Flight,Radio,S-AdvFlt
Means AD1380, population 83.5 million, score 2050, GOTM Score 000 (not calculated that turn), [note: if GOTM score starts to decrease, then kill the remaining enemy and end the game by conquest], shield output of 000 Metric Tons (it was not recorded on this turn), 10% Tax/50%Science/40%Lux, 6033 science output (this does not include new trade, scientist changes, growth, etc.), 1,123 gold per turn/improvement cost of 757g per turn, science cost 1,923 beakers (could be adjusted if key civ number are recomputed, though not in this game), 3 science output advances per turn, and the list of advances. S- means an advance that is started.

For anyone that is an unbeliever in a Power Democracy, then just watch these numbers over 10 or 15 turns. Then if in doubt, when you are playing sometime, run a test and replay some of your midgame turns using any other form of government. The first few might be difficult if you are not prepared, but the growth and growing gold will crush other governments, in most cases if one is generally prepared. A small Republic (not a sprawling republic) can come close, and if at war, can be "better" in some cases in mid game, esp. if someone does not have JSBach but is fighting with supported units in the field.

Fundamentalism is a pathetic and distant 2nd or 3rd, but can be a short term Democracy substitute in certain situations, esp. if played with the Power Fundamentalism style. On this map, at the speed of this game, Fundamentalism would be crushed.


b08-B-u382;B07-B-u362;A10-B-dCoal849;B09-B-u342;B06-u398
Example decodes:

From A10 to Babylon, delivered demanded Coal for 849 gold/849 science.
From B06 to (implied B, aka Bablyon) delivered undemanded something for 398 gold.

A lowercase u in front of a number means "undemanded", and a lowercase d in front of a commodity name or abbreviation means that commodity was demanded. Example: dCu means demanded Copper. Cu is the (Latin) elemental abbreviation of copper.


IPRB, IRB, RB
Incremental Partial Rush Buy, Incremental Rush Buy, Rush Buy. Very powerful. Explained via the link in my sig block.

C04-A01 Maxi RR
Never completed; the game just flew too fast. There was an optimum path Road/RR that would have yielded enormous trade for a lot of villages, domestically, and it was largely south side symmetric. However, after clearing and roading the path, engineers were needed on other projects for growth, primarily.

Odeo year, trigger
Controlling the precise timing during a game turn in which the next advance (like Democracy) is discovered, entering a Revolution, then immediately completing the turn, entering an Oedo Year, and not losing a single shield or single trade arrow during Anarchy as you enter the new government.

Carthago delenda est
The reason that history knows Marcus Porcius Cato (aka Cato the Elder). He would end every speech in the Roman senate, no matter what the speech topic, with this. And in this game, when the Carthaginians were begging and pleading for life, these words rang across the centuries, and... Carthage was destroyed. The village was destroyed, and not kept. The ground was salted, and no settlement ever grew in the place of Carthage again.

Ref: BC 0550 & BC 0375.


X-cities
These will be destroyed, they are in the wrong place. Many AI villages are built down and destroyed, as are many AT's. No Carthaginian village survived the game, all were in the wrong place and all were eventually destroyed after capture by making lots of settlers.


INITIAL START STRATEGY

When I began, and had so many units, the first priority was to get rid of the shield support so that the capital could devote everything to making units/wonders. The supported settler headed south, to use the Wheat, and the NON settler worked on roading the route to what would be the 2nd village, and irrigating the Wheat. Some units went along with the settler, with intention to rehome as soon as the village was founded. The Legion & Phalanx were disbanded (worth 20 + 10 shields) to make a Trireme in 2 turns. The settler founded A02 on a grassland next to a river, and the other units rehomed. The trireme circled west, spotted 2 islands and continued down to A02 to catch up the some of the units heading south.

FACTORIES

Some comments about Factories.

When I first started playing Civ 2, shield output was always a strong consideration. When the game starts, shield output is a dominant consideration.

One of my favorite wonders was Hoover Dam, and approaching Industrialization, I would pre-build many factories and loved it when they came online a turn or two after Industrializaion, after Darwin would get me to Electronics and the Hoover Dam at the same time as they completed.

But, GOTMs have a speed dimension. And with Factories comes pollution and pollution control. And in a map with Limited Engineers, like GOTM 121 and GOTM 122, there are not enough Engineer-days of work output available to do even the most "essential" tasks much of the time, and pollution diversion would drag this down even more.

To control pollution, it takes a lot of shields for MT's -- even with the free Hydros of the HD.


But, in a Power Democracy, esp. on a "fast" map, there is another path: to cap most shield output to about 10 to 15 shields per village. Most villages will be size 17+, and not making Factories and MT's will not only save 360 shields (or equivalent gold), but will speed other constructions, like Freight, Superhighways, Airports, etc. Shield output is used to seed the IRB. The IRB premium cost for a city improvement is 80 gold. That means starting with an empty box, and disregarding shield output, you can buy an improvement on the next turn for only an 80 gold premium. When you deliver a 1,500 gold freight, then that premium can be worth it, esp. for the SH or Apt.

There is a hidden advantage, also. You are not paying the per turn cost of factories & MT's, and you are not waiting for things to get built for several turns. An airport with a 32 shield output village takes 5 turns. With 400 gold, it takes one turn (160 for 1st 40 shields, 240 for last 120 shields), and then the freight delivered the very next turn usually pays for that airport instantly.

Another thing about gold... its a liquid asset... you can assign it to any village you want. Shield generation is not distributable, and must be consumed in its host village. Small villages are not helped by a nearby 80 shield per turn village since it cant share its shields (unless making units and disbanding, or freight and wonders/SS parts). You can save up gold; you can even save up Freight, and use it when necessary.


For "slow" governments that reward shield production (everything except Republic/Democracy), then the start... wait ... wait... wait ... wait ... complete project is OK. But a Power Democracy will bury all those strategies.

This GOTM (122) was an excellent demonstration of that, and admittedly I did not realize how fast it would be at game start. In retrospect this game advancement (due mostly to the single village called Babylon) was so quick, that most "normal" things like terrain modifications in core villages, proper rail routes, swamp draining, etc. should not have been done. I was in the middle of about a 10 turn "big chop" to increase trade, and the game moved so fast that it and the rail projects had to be dropped long before completion.

If Factories and MT's were used starting at Industrialization, these improvements would have slowed trade, superhighways, and not have paid for themselves properly before the ending of the game.

Likewise, GOTM 121 was not a Factory/MT/R map, -- but then that could be easily noted in BC 4000. It was a near-pure trade map (long distances, in particular), and factories were obviously certain to slow the conquest date.

Great to see you back, starlifter ! And what logs !

So far, I have only scanned them, but did notice your comments about Power Democracy. I think you worked out most of this playing style yourself, and it has had a huge impact on how people play Civ2, especially here at CfC. I haven't used it a lot myself, but IMO it is a prime method of "breaking the game" (like conquering in BC years or winning by OCC, etc). But .... I don't see it as better or worse than the others. Unless people agree on some common and specific Civ2 goal,
it's ultimately a matter of taste which approach is "best". If you disagree, I'd ask - what is Power Demo designed to do ?

Power Democracy
... basically means attempting to maximize all the obvious as well as unfamiliar benefits of Civ II Democracy, often with an aim to maximize speed and score.

Fully utilized, there are very few situations where another form of government yields better results, including most wars. OCC (where Republic will do) and early conquest (where Democracy in never discovered) come to mind as exceptions.

Historical Footnote
The Power Democracy was really a result of discussing GOTMs, when they first started. In the early days of Civ II, there were many interesting game results, and often few explanations about how they were achieved. The PD, detailed logging, and mid game saves provide a map of how others can achieve similar results, or in some cases (like tedious gameplay), when others may not want to get the same results (but at least see how it was done). So in essence, the PD was an effort to demystify what is possible to do in Civ 2, and in effect represents a sort of game limit.

Speed of completion while maximizing score became a factor in the days when Matrix was the GOTM mod, and the GOTM score formula put a premium on not just "winning" a given start, but completing the game rapidly. The intent of the GOTM formula was to prevent the necessity to play every game to a tedious "maximum absolute" score. In the first few GOTMs, this entailed transforming all terrain to grassland, making solid farmland, etc. and was a colossal waste of time.

GOTMs should not only have a result, but IMO others who play the game should be able to have an idea how that result was obtained... and not just have a final game .SAV with a seemingly impossible outcome, esp. back in the 2001-02 time frame. The PD allows any player to maximize game score (which is mainly based on happy population) in the minimal number of game turns.

HOF
The GOTM is quite different than say, the HOF (Hall of Fame) games where the goal is a huge absolute score by 2020. There are many paths to that end that will work with about the same results. But in most GOTMs which do not have special restrictions, a properly played PD will crush any other properly played approach.

Pushing the Envelope
Probably the reason that PD is interesting in general game play is because its human nature to push the limit. Its not enough to make an airplane and merely fly -- one wants to know how fast, or how far a plane can go. When that is answered, one puts restrictions like "human powered" (think Paul Allen, e.g.) and asks what can be done (this is sort of like flight's version of OCC).

but IMO it is a prime method of "breaking the game" (like conquering in BC years or winning by OCC, etc)

I didn't quite understand this part, about breaking the game: early conquer is a great play goal (and one in which PD cannot help), and OCC (specialized OCC in particular) is a great alternative. None of these break the game.

Incidentally, OCC as we know it is possible because of a completely unanticipated fundamental game design decision consequence made by Brian Reynolds when he attempted to create Civ 2 using what he describes as the "rubber band" theory. Brian might perhaps consider OCC "broken", since he never anticipated that players would attempt to use only one village, and as a result, his Rubber Band actually aids the Human, especially at Deity.

"Winning" Civ II
If one plays Civ 2 "just" for entertainment, without any aspect of speed or score considerations, then of course there are dozens of approaches and government strategies --- and in fact one need not even "win" the game at all!

But.... to "win" with consideration of speed and score -- and be able to quantify how it was done so that others can learn -- then PD can crush any other strategy that I'm aware of in Civ 2. :)

Thanks for the explanation. I wasn't sure "where you were coming from". I read your previous post to say you want a style that maximizes GOTM score. I agree that PD is one good way to do that, maybe the best way for someone with lots of RL time and energy. Also, that the writings of yourself and Andu have been very helpful to students of Civ2.

Fully utilized, there are very few situations where another form of government yields better results, including most wars.


Coming from Apolyton in 2005 or so, I felt the main Civ2 situations were Early Landing and Early Conquest. Later, I added GOTM score, Multiplayer, Scenarios, OCC and HOF to my list. From my perspective, PD is good for GOTM score, as you say, but it is not a panacea.


The GOTM is quite different than say, the HOF (Hall of Fame) games where the goal is a huge absolute score by 2020. There are many paths to that end that will work with about the same results. But in most GOTMs which do not have special restrictions, a properly played PD will crush any other properly played approach.


Hmmm... I see similarities between PD and HOF styles, and your "crush" claim seems unsubstantiated.

The GOTM scoring formula is a pretty good compromise between the goals of size and speed. It is far better than the raw Civ2 score, but it's still weighted a bit too far towards size, IMO. A strong player can increase his GOTM score by gratuitously extending a won game, as long as he can add Civ2 points at at rate of 3% or so per turn. In that sense, the GOTM system still rewards patience.

In practice, most GOTM players in 2011 don't play that way. We have limited RL time, and patience, and desire for the Gold star. For such players, I recommend a hybrid strategy: roughly, ICS followed by EC, followed by approx 10 turns of Republic or Democracy ... to jack up the GOTM score. This has been the most successful GOTM strategy, so far, wrt the number of Gold stars.

Has there ever been a fair test of PD vs other Gold styles ? I am aware of your Gold stars from the old days, but doubt the other players were as skilled or determined as you were. See the GOTM 16 spoiler, in which I acheived a higher GOTM score than the old Masters using only Republic. I don't claim this was a perfectly fair test of PD, but the Post-Starlifter PD victories I've seen (by DoM, for example) weren't fair tests either.

I am not sure whether to include other active players, such as Ali, as PD ... I think he uses PD ideas, but don't recall what he calls his style.


I didn't quite understand this part, about breaking the game: early conquer is a great play goal (and one in which PD cannot help), and OCC (specialized OCC in particular) is a great alternative. None of these break the game.


By "breaking the game", I mean a stunt or style of play that the designers could not have foreseen, which makes the game look a bit silly. The goal is not simply to win, but to do so with crazy constraints (like OCC, or conquering with just warriors) or in some dramatic way (eg in BC years, or with 255 large cities, etc). I'm not saying these styles are bad - if it is fun, it is good.

PD is a natural style, unlike OCC or HOF, but if you can conquer by 1AD, or land by 700AD, why spend another 50 turns building up a huge Civ ? Don't answer! This was rhetorical. Again, if it is fun, it is good. I'm just explaining why PD "breaks the game"
in my eyes. Perhaps, with enough skill, ANY style breaks the game!


If one plays Civ 2 "just" for entertainment, without any aspect of speed or score considerations, then of course there are dozens of approaches and government strategies --- and in fact one need not even "win" the game at all!

But.... to "win" with consideration of speed and score ... -- then PD can
crush any other strategy that I'm aware of in Civ 2. :)

I agree that a specific goal is needed before one can even discuss strategy. But PD is not best for speed (EC is much faster) and not best for Civ2 score either, according to your remarks above. It might be best for GOTM score, for players with enough RL time, but IMO this hasn't been proven. I don't totally disagree with you about PD, but feel you've over-stated its power and scope a bit.

IMO the most important Civ2 skill, for most goals, is Growth via ICS. Second, Trade. Third (or lower) is using Govts properly. For longish games, the best govt is probably Demo. Roughly, PD = skill with Trade + Demo (fair?). So, PD certainly deserves a central place in Civ2 strategy, but it is not "The" Civ2 Strategy ! ;)

I haven't played GOTMs in a few years, so there might be new ideas on how to play them, and am not familiar with how the last 100 or so GOTMs have been played :), though I did play at least one about 5 years ago.

When I say "crush", what I refer to is the rapid increase in production, science, and gold... and how that compounds to feed the next turns at an increasing rate.

The "Speed" does not refer to EC; Democracy is not available early, and even if it were, it is not suitable for early expansion and laying the groundwork. However, I have not actually tried forcing a Democracy from 4000BC, so that is an assumption based on the rest of the game design. The speed refers to the sudden change in the trajectory of the game. Switching from Monarchy to Communism, or from Monarchy to Fundamentalism, and in many cases from Monarchy to Republic (depends on specific game layout though) will not alter the endgame as much as Mon-Democracy, or Mon-Rep-Dem.

In GOTM 122, this alteration with the use of the AI village of Babylon was so profound after entering Democracy that Engineers could not complete their "normal" planned projects like trade RRs, basic terrain improvements, etc. The cities themselves could not, even with immediate RB'ing, gain the "normal" lineup of Banks, Stock Exchanges, Universities and (gasp) Airports and Stock Exchanges, much less some Factories. This contrasts strongly with the GOTM 121, where most villages did gain the these improvements (though it was conquest and not SS).

Some will use Mon-Rep(grow)-xxx(Fundy/comm)-Dem(grow)-xxx etc. However, in those cases, a PD can obtain better results, by a wide margin, most of the time.

The PD does require some preparation, and is helped by trade early in its implementation. Other approach can often lead the way, until the Republic/Democratic growth via celebrations occurs.

In GOTM 122, the my own game was "over" at about 640 AD, when I could have taken the last village (Babylon), but was played to the SS landing, which together with the PD, gave a higher GOTM result.

Another area that a PD may not be ideal for is MP.

But for GOTM work, the PD was meant to push players to achieve the best GOTM scores they could obtain in normal games. I recall some GOTMs where there were special rules, like Fundamentalism-only (and there could be others over the years with special rules also), the necessitate another approach.

Has there ever been a fair test of PD vs other Gold styles ? I am aware of your Gold stars from the old days, but doubt the other players were as skilled or determined as you were.
I dont know, since I have been inactive for more than 9 of the last 10 years.

However, I would not term my base Civ II style as "skill" -- it is in fact just a simulation, run with specific constraints. The PD was originally a direct answer to some who were playing in the early days that routinely said their results were from ever-mysterious "skill". Skill can make a difference when everyone is using the same basic approach, but PD in a GOTM will (has, to my knowledge) regularly crush even the most skilled alternative approaches.

If one has the knowledge, and the physical time & desire, then others should be able to achieve similar results. My original aim was that with the understanding of the game itself and a method to play under the rules that were set for the GOTMs (including the GOTM formula), others should also at least have access to the methodology... and this became the "Power Democracy".

ICS is an early game strategy, and PD is by definition at least a mid-game or later strategy. The two are not incompatible, but how then game ends and the constraints that a player uses to get to the end would naturally determine the best choices. If there is an element of speed and score, as in GOTMs, then the PD will prevail unless there are special restrictions or setups, or perhaps certain Scenarios.

A specific case that I can imagine where PD might not crush (but would probably still beat) other "full game" (e.g., not EC/OCC) strategies would be to restrict the number of villages, or restrict certain building improvements. Im not even sure that removing caravans/freight would be enough to stop a PD, though it would certainly extend the game. This is because removing caravans/freight will also affect (though less so) even PF & Communism & Monarchy.


One thing that makes the PD different, is that it cannot really be used intuitively. When I first played Civ II, I never used it until the very end. Any time I switched to just a plain Democracy, the my civ was a mess. And I was not even trying to max perform the Democracy, just trying to survive with it.


But unless there are some examples or ideas that I'm not yet aware of (being "out" for so long), then yes, given a generic GOTM and time to play it, I still see that the PD will crush any other method. :)

(SS Lands 1451)
Wow! That is amazingly quick. Glad to see you are playing again.

I haven't played GOTMs in a few years, so there might be new ideas on how to play them, and am not familiar with how the last 100 or so GOTMs have been played.


Well, there is a new cast of characters, and a few old characters who have improved over the years. In my opinion, interest and skills in ICS, EC and OCC have increased. Our mod(s) have thrown us a lot of creative maps. I suspect some players have used PD ideas aiming for Gold, but they don't talk about it a lot, and the style has not dominated. We have added an index to this forum, with all the old GOTMs listed, if you are interested in the history - and feel free to suggest additions to that.



When I say "crush", what I refer to is the rapid increase in production, science, and gold... and how that compounds to feed the next turns at an increasing rate....

but PD in a GOTM will (has, to my knowledge) regularly crush even the most skilled alternative approaches....

But unless there are some examples or ideas that I'm not yet aware of (being "out" for so long), then yes, given a generic GOTM and time to play it, I still see that the PD will crush any other method.


Well, if you are saying PD is the best long-term method to increase GOTM score after the AI is essentially beaten, then OK, probably so. But, take a look at the records and be realistic - there is not much evidence that it is THE best GOTM style. We've played 100+ comparison games already, and PD has NOT produced the most Gold.

My opinion is that PD is pretty much, flat out, the best strategy... for people that have a lot of time to spare. Problem is? A month is a short time for a Civ2 game, and not many here have enough time to spare to consistently be able to play a PD game to completion in only a month. If people could do that, I think that we would see way more examples of Gold-winning PD GOTMs.

PD is indeed great approach for people with lots of time, since unless faced with very unusual circumstances, you can increase the score for more than 2% a turn for a very long time if you are properly set up (up until a Civ score in the five digits, I think...) During GOTM 118 and 119, I achieved high GOTM scores simply because I had lots and lots of time, and NOT because of skills or hut luck. I won Blue and Gold for GOTM 118, while being one of only 2 (out of 7) players to keep playing until the AD years: more about that in the next spoiler tag.

During GOTM 118, I could have ended it as soon as more or less 400 BC, having initially followed a strategy relying on expansion and conquest in a lean Despo-Mon-Fundy. My final score would have been around the 900 Civ points (after switching to Demo) I think. That would have given me a GOTM score of around 450k points. That would have been good for 4th, maybe 3rd, place.

Now, fast-forward to 25 turns of fat PD: it is 100 AD and the game's over. Civ score is 3241 and GOTM score is at 692k, and I had a lead of 125k over 2nd place.

These last 25 turns took a lot of time, but they made the difference.

For GOTM 119, the results are not out yet, but my estimated GOTM score was very high, and I think that the other scores will also be that high since many people went for PD during that GOTM.



My take on this: if you have enough time, PD is the best option. Otherwise, you may try something else, or submit a PD game once every 2 months.

My opinion is that PD is pretty much, flat out, the best strategy... for people that have a lot of time to spare. Problem is? A month is a short time for a Civ2 game, and not many here have enough time to spare to consistently be able to play a PD game to completion in only a month. If people could do that, I think that we would see way more examples of Gold-winning PD GOTMs.
I agree. Even playing PD, I have had to often end the game simply because I had no more real time to spend on it not because I could not improve my GOTM score anymore.

I do not strongly disagree with these opinions, but would add that I have also had to cut games short while using my hybrid strategy. Probably less damage is done under my strategy, which is not really intended to maximize GOTM score at all costs. So, my "imperfect" games often win Gold, and sometimes also Green. I don't feel I've had much competition for Gold from PD players. For whatever reasons, I have more Golds stars than Starlifter + Jokemaster + Ali combined.

If PD players step it up a level, we might find out which strategy is best. It might turn out to be PD. But for now, it seems to me there is no solid evidence, and people are blowing smoke. For practical purposes, with real players in real time, my strategy is clearly working better !

Sorry to toot my own horn. I find it a bit offensive, but there's a lot going around.

Clearly what we need here is a duel to the death.
Seriously though, as somebody who hasn't fully assimilated the GOTM score rules or truly mastered either style of play, I'm amazed that any comparison can be made at all. Calling any strategy "best" requires some context - it's a very different discussion if we're only talking about GOTM score than if we're debating the one size fits all solution for every Civ2 game. Basically we have two strategies that "always" win, and a formula that's balanced enough to make this discussion possible.

That said, I'd really like to see a GOTM that starts in a (normal player's) hopeless situation, outnumbered and under siege, and see how the experts pull out of it. I'd imagine several of us haven't seen enemy tanks in our territories in years.

I'm just happy to see a clash of ideas in Civ II in 2011!!!!

I am most interested in early game strategies, and I note in Starlifter's beautiful logs that he has not yet assimilated some of the more recent adaptations regarding the fastest way to his beloved Demo. Keeping the NONE settler has been proven a second best strategy for some years now.

That being said, once he gets into PD his machine is a thing of beauty.

But it will never win a green star :)

I don't feel I've had much competition for Gold from PD players. For whatever reasons, I have more Golds stars than Starlifter + Jokemaster + Ali combined.
That is an understatement. Peaster has nearly a quarter (27 out of the 113) gold medals awarded. The closest competitor has only 14.

That said, I'd really like to see a GOTM that starts in a (normal player's) hopeless situation, outnumbered and under siege, and see how the experts pull out of it. I'd imagine several of us haven't seen enemy tanks in our territories in years.
I have recently designed a map that gives you much of what you desire. I have not had a chance to describe it in the forums here yet; I guess I will do that now.

I'm glad to see the PD debate is winding down, as I'm not sure we were arguing about anything substantial. I especially agree with Grigor's post, and that PD results would be higher with more attention to ICS, including the size-1 trick. For those interested in Civ2 trends since 2002, also consider the Theory of Interest, which has probably had some good affect on playing styles, at least on mine.

Regarding Mackerel's idea, I say let's try it. Thinking back, there have been a few attempts already, which were interesting, but not 100% successful. IIRC one was gotm 50 or so, Aztecs on an Earth map. But the Aztecs were not weak enough for the idea to make a strong impression. I think there have been several gotms like that. Another example was a tiny-island map. In my game, the AI attacked out of the blue very early, won easily, and essentially forced me to quit.

It'll be hard to make the AI strong enough without creating a huge luck factor, since AI behavior is quite unpredictable, but maybe that's OK. Or, with an accelerated start, there might be less luck. There are many good scenarios that achieve this idea.

I'm glad to see the PD debate is winding down ...
Down perhaps, but not dead yet. While you are the undisputed leader by a long shot in GOTM hall of fame, you (and I) rose up the ranks in HOF in total or partial absence of super players like Starlifter, Smash, Duke of M., golem, grigor, ... The one game Starlifter played against us, GOTM 68, he trounced us with a GOTM score of 623 vs. 423 for you and 313 for me. I am looking forward to more matches now that he is playing again and so is grigor, not to mention a whole bunch of new quite talented players.

Hmmm... you probably should've just let it wind down. :)

GOTM 68 was a very special map (Ringworld) in which we started with [almost] all the techs including Demo. IIRC, for all practical purposes, it was a test of Democracy skills, and it is no surprise that PD players won (you didn't mention that Duke came in second). So, I'm afraid your example is about as relevant as Grigor's joke that PD doesn't win Green.

Jokemaster's example, GOTM 118, also seems pretty irrelevant. This was the Labyrinth, again a highly unusual map, in which ICS was virtually impossible. Also, the winner had "unbelievable" hut luck (your words).

Duke played many GOTMs after I started, around GOTM 45, and he had some impressive results, including some on normal maps. He didn't post much, but I assume he was a PD player. Unfortunately, he tended not to compete in the same GOTMs that I did, so his successes don't prove much to me. I'm not sure, but don't think Smash, Golem or Grigor are/were PD players, so I'm not sure why you mentioned them.

I was interested in this kind of question a few years ago, and played GOTM 16 (unofficially) as a test of modern play - or mine anyway - against the old. I "won" over Smash and Starlifter and about 20 others, on a normal map, without ever going into Demo (IIRC). See the spoiler, if interested. I have never tried to infer too much from that game, but it's more relevant to our current not-quite-dead debate than GOTMs 68 or 118. It suggests to me that "PD flat-out crushes other methods" is an overstatement.

I am sure there are examples of GOTMs in which I played for Gold on a normal map and failed, probably even to a PD player. I concede that, and you don't need to dig-up an example. But seeing PD players struggle to find one has been fun. ;)

Anyway, I agree with your final comments. I am glad Starlifter is back, and I totally respect him, and PD, and am also happy about our new players.