Patch notes from 2K Greg on a patch due late June or possibly Early July. (in case you missed it on the front page)

[NOTES]
Pacing has received a large amount of work. Expect to have more of a challenge managing your empire at higher difficulty levels than you did before. Consider dropping a difficulty level if you have problems.
Existing saves will work correctly. However, the balance pass may make your existing happiness lower than expected when loading into your existing save post-patch.


[UI]
Civilopedia now available in the Main Menu (under “Other”)
Replay is now available at the end of the game, and through the main menu. You can choose Map, Graphs, and turn-by-turn. Only games played post-patch will apply.
Great People progress UI addition (upper-left Info Corner UI).
Combat preview for Aircraft UI addition.
Fixed aircraft UI issue causing the aircraft selection UI to duplicate itself when rebasing aircraft.
When loading save game files, you can now order the list by name, or last modified.


[DIPLOMACY]
Made backstab routine more transparent (the dialog will clearly state that they are backstabbing you).
AI now remembers when it has been nuked, for a permanent diplomatic penalty.
AI now recognizes a player that captured their capital for a permanent diplomatic penalty.
End declaration of friendship as soon as war is declared (so can't later get a notification that it has expired).
AI remembers if you satisfied one of their requests (positive modifier, decays over time, based on value of items granted).
AI remembers if you fought against a common foe (positive modifier, decays over time, based on damage done to the common foe).
Track trades between players and allow that to positively influence relationships (the better the deal for the AI, the stronger the modifier). Particularly useful for bribing a hostile AI.


[AI]
Rebalanced AI flavors and strategies for unit training to improve AI army composition and build choices.
Allow the AI to consider Pikeman units for offensive roles when they can't build Swordsman or Longswordsman.
Allow Alexander and Darius to consider Hoplites and Immortals for offensive roles in early game.
AI players may now use a Great General in early rushes on higher difficulties.
Modified flavor tags for Atomic Bomb and Nuclear Missile so AI builds them only when it decides it specifically wants Nukes.
Block City States from building carriers, atomic weapons.
Strategies for building mobile units now persist into Modern era to help AI decisions for when to build tanks and modern armor.
Dampen early game Grand Strategies to give the AI time to expand (AI were sometimes stuck in a single city until late in the game).
Victory adjustments to AI behaviors, including alternate victory paths as “back-ups” (for example, building the Apollo Program, even if they are not going for a Spaceship victory).
Revise code calculating recommended army size (using smaller armies if the threat is low).
Correct issue that was causing late-game continent-bound AI’s to over-build units intending to invade, and never properly execute the amphibious invasion.
Scale recommended army sizes based on difficulty level.
AI grand strategy and flavor weighting balance pass.
AI policy choice weighting balance pass.
AI tech choice weighting balance pass.


[GAMEPLAY]
Player is now given the option to return a CS worker that they free from barbarians.
Roads under captured cities no longer charge maintenance.
Machu Picchu no longer destroyed when capturing a city containing Machu Picchu.


[MULTIPLAYER]
Multiplayer AI is now consistent with Single Player AI.
Hot-Seat is now available through the multiplayer menu.

You can have as many humans playing as available slots in the game.
Password protection is built in.
All maps, including purchased and user-created, are available to play in Hot-Seat.
While play-by-email is not yet implemented, we did include an in-between turn saving option for those that want to play via email.



[BALANCE]
Mechanics
Policy “Finishers” added to all 10 policy trees. Taking all policies in a tree will grant an additional bonus effect. See policy notes below for more information.
Tweaked Policy cost formula (cheaper earlier, more expensive later).
Reduced per-city Policy cost increase by 50%.
Culture from City States tweaked (less early, more later).
Killing a barbarian for a city state now gives 12 influence (was 5).
Production cost adjustments for units/buildings/wonders (mostly a little cheaper, much cheaper late game).
Unhappiness per city increased to 3 from 2.
All great person tile improvements now connect all strategic resources.
Reduced Culture from Goody Huts to 20 from 30.
Defense penalty and city assault bonus promotions are now lost with upgrade.
Research agreements now give a tech boost instead of a free tech. Tech boosts start at 50% of the median value of all techs you can research. Can be boosted to 100% if you both start Rationalism and build the Porcelain Tower.


Terrain, Resources, and Improvements
New bonus resource: Stone (+1 production, improved with a Quarry). See the Stone Works building note below for additional details.
Map generation improvements to integrate Stone into production-poor terrain, reducing the temporary usage of Cows. Additionally, will switch grass bonus resources from Cows to Stone when production is needed.
Marsh and Fallout terrain penalty reduced from -33 to -15.
Academy yield increases with Scientific Theory.
Customs House yield increases with Economics.
Manufactory yield increases with Chemistry.
Marble wonder production mod reduced to 15%.
Luxury resources now give 4 Happiness, down from 5.
Remove penalty for improving Tundra, Snow and Desert.
Railroad improvement now takes 3 turns, down from 7.
Scrub Fallout now takes 2 turns, down from 5.
Repair improvement now takes 2 turns, down from 3.
Well improvements now remove jungle/forest/marsh.


Buildings
New building: Stone Works: +1 Happiness and +1 production, and +1 production for each source of Marble and Stone worked. Requires Marble or Stone.
Burial Tomb now correctly has an Artist slot.
Mud Pyramid Mosque reduced 1 Culture.
Circus moved to Trapping.
Forge maintenance reduced 1 gold.
Windmill production modifier reduced 5% to 10%.
Monastery base Culture reduced from 3 to 2. Per resource Culture unchanged.
Mint gold per resource reduced by 1 gold.
Colosseum maintenance reduced by 1 gold, Happiness reduced by 1.
Theatre maintenance reduced by 1 gold, Happiness reduced by 1.
Stadium maintenance reduced by 1 gold, Happiness reduced by 1.
Broadcast tower cultural modifier reduced to 33% but now gives 3 Culture.
Armory maintenance reduced by 1 gold and moved to Machinery.
Military academy maintenance reduced by 2 gold.
Arsenal moved to rifling and now provides city defense instead of unit production.
Walls now gives 4 Defense (was 5).
Walls of Bablylon now give 6 Defense (was 7.5).
Mughal Fort now gives 6 Defense (was 9).
Castle now gives 4 Defense (was 7.5).
University maintenance reduced by 1 gold and now gives a 33% boost to science instead of 50% (will increase to 50% after adopting Free Thought Policy).
Military Academy now requires Armory instead of Barracks.
Arsenal now requires Castle instead of Military Academy.
Military Base now requires Arsenal.
Wat now requires Library.
Mud Pyramid Mosque now requires Monument.
Harbor naval production reduced 10% but now increases sea resources yield by 1 hammer.
Seaports no longer require a sea resource, they now require a Harbor. Production per sea resource reduced by 1 hammer.
Factory production increased by 1 hammer but modifier decreased to 10%.
Solar/Nuclear plant cost greatly reduced.
Solar/Nuclear plant production increased by 1 hammer but modifier decreased to 15%.
Public School science per population reduced by 50% and now provides a flat 3 science.
Research Laboratory modifier reduced by 50% but now gives a flat 4 science.
Workshop production modifier reduced by 5%.
Barracks, Armory, Military Academy and Krepost now provide experience to all units trained.


Wonders
National College moved to Philosophy and reduced by 2 science.
Oxford University now gives 3 additional science.
Great Lighthouse now also provides a free Lighthouse in the city where it was built.
Great library now gives 3 additional science, and provides a free Library in the city where it was built.
Porcelain tower now additionally increases the Science granted when completing Research Agreements by 50%.
Hermitage moved to Acoustics and much cheaper to build. Now requires Opera Houses but gives only a 50% boost to Culture.
Stonehenge Culture reduced to 6 from 8.
Pyramids worker speed increase reduced to 25% from 50% but now give a free Worker when built
Hanging Gardens now give 10 Food instead of 1 population per city and Happiness.
Great Wall now obsoletes with Dynamite instead of metallurgy and gives 3 Culture. Additionally, a free Wall is provided in the city where it was built.
Hagia Sophia great person modifier reduced to 25% from 34%, and gives a free Great Person of your choice.
Eiffel Tower now give 5 Happiness plus 1 for every 2 Policies adopted.
Chichen Itza now grants an additional 4 Happiness.
Machu Picchu trade route gold increased by 5% and also gives a flat 5 gold.
The Colossus now gives an additional 5 gold.
Notre Dame now gives 10 Happiness, up from 5, and 3 Culture.
Sistine Chapel Culture modifier reduced from 33% to 25%.
Kremlin global city defense mod reduced to 25% from 50% but now gives 12 defense in the city where it's built.
Cristo Redentor Policy discount reduced from 25% to 10% but now gives 4 Culture.
Pentagon upgrade cost reduced to 33% from 50% but now gives 3 Culture.
Sydney Opera House moved to Mass Media and gives 50% Culture in the city where it's built plus 4 Culture.
Big Ben hurry modifier reduced to 15% from 25% but now gives a flat 4 gold.
Himeji bonus reduced to 15% from 25%, and provides a free Castle in the city where it was built.


Civilization Unique Abilities
Arabia: Bazaar now gives 2 gold on oil/oasis.
America: Remove river start bias.
America: Increase plot buy modifier to 50% from 25%.
China: Great General trait reduced to 50% from 100%.
Babylon: Great Scientist trait reduced to 50% from 100%.
Germany: Now receives a 25% discount on land unit maintenance.
Ottoman: Now receives a 67% discount on naval unit maintenance, and can upgrade Galley’s to Trireme’s.


Policies
Liberty and Autocracy are no longer mutually exclusive.
Freedom, Autocracy and Order are now mutually exclusive.
Tradition
Aristocracy now provides +15% Production when building Wonders down from 20%.
Landed Elite now provides 1 Happiness at every 10 Citizens in each City.
Tradition Finisher: +15% Growth and +2 Food in each city.

Liberty
Meritocracy: +1 Happiness for each city connected to your capital, and -5% Unhappiness from citizens in non-occupied cities.
Republic now adds an additional 5% building production modifier.
Liberty Finisher: Great Person of your choice.

Honor
Honor Opener now additionally provides Culture for each barbarian killed.
Warrior Code now also gives 15% melee unit production.
Military Caste now provides +1 Happiness and +2 Culture for each city with a garrison.
Professional Army now reduces cost of upgrading units by 33% and provides +1 Happiness per defensive building (Walls, Castle, Arsenal, Military base).
Honor Finisher: Grants gold for each enemy unit killed.

Piety
Piety Opener now provides a 15% production bonus on Culture buildings.
Free Religion now provides only 1 free Policy but increases the Culture from Monuments, Temples and Monasteries by 1.
Organized Religion now gives 1 Happiness per Monument, Temple and Monastery.
Reformation now increases Culture in all cities with a Wonder by 33%, and starts a Golden Age.
Theocracy now increase gold yield by 10% in cities with a Temple.
Piety Finisher: -10% Culture cost of future Policies.

Patronage
Scholasticism reduced from 33% to 25%
Patronage Finisher: Causes other players’ influence with City States to decrease 33% more per turn than usual.

Commerce
Naval Tradition policy now also gives +1 moves to embarked units.
Commerce Finisher: +1 Gold per Specialist.

Rationalism
Rationalist Opener now increases the Science granted when completing Research Agreements by 50%. Stacks with Porcelain Tower.
Free Thought now also increases University science yield by 17%
Humanism now also affects Public Schools and Observatories.
Rationalism Finisher: +1 Gold from Science buildings.

Freedom
Freedom Opener now provides 25% Great Person Points in all cities.
Democracy now provides -50% Unhappiness per Specialist.
Constitution now provides +2 Culture per Wonder.
Free Speech now provides 8 maintenance free units.
Freedom Finisher: +100% yield from Great Tile Improvements and increase length of Golden Ages by 50%.

Autocracy
Police State now provides 3 Happiness per Courthouse, and reduces the time it take to build Courthouses by 50%.
Total War now provides +15% Production when building Military Units and +15 XP for new units.
Autocracy Finisher: 30 turn attack bonus of +20%.

Order
Order Opener now provides +1 Happiness per City.
Socialism and Planned Economy swapped places.
Socialism buff to 15% reduction in building maintenance from 10%.
Planned Economy now increases Science yield by 25% in cities with a Factory.
Communism now provides 2 Production and 10% Production towards buildings in each city.
Order Finisher: +1 Food/Production/Science/Gold/Culture per city.



Technology
Reduced cost of Calendar, Civil Service, Iron Working, Gunpowder, Rifling and Dynamite.
Scaled up costs of all sciences starting in the mid-renaissance era and on (larger increases later on).
Metal Working requires Construction.
Railroad now requires Dynamite.
Radar now requires Combustion.
Globalization requires Computers, and the cost is increased.
Computers require Radar.
Particle Physics no longer requires Globalization (Space victory now possible without overlapping Diplomatic victory).
Future Tech requires Globalization.
Tech Aesthetics: moved Dynamite and all future technologies around by 1 position for better alignment.


Units/Combat
Destroyers no longer start with extra sight.
Extra Sight promotions are now lost with upgrade (Caravel).
Great General promotion spawning effectiveness reduced by 50%.
Mohawk Jungle/Forest bonus reduced to 25% from 50%.
Gunship anti-armor promotions now work correctly.
Jaguar now gets Woodsman promotion.
Minuteman now start with Drill I.
Mohawk Warriors no longer require Iron.
Carriers no longer require Oil.
Destroyer moved to Combustion.
Mechanized infantry moves reduced from 4 to 3.
Galley now upgrades to Trireme.
Ironclad now upgrades to Battleship.
+1 moves for Tank, Panzer, Modern Armor, with no sight penalty.
Increased combat strength of siege weapons to 50% of their ranged strength, increased intrinsic city attack promotions (10%/30% -> 20%/50%).
Increased Incan slinger combat strength slightly.
Increased Crossbowman and Chu-Ko-Nu combat and ranged strength.
Decreased Longswordsman, Fighter, Bomber, Guided Missile, Jet Fighter and corresponding UUs strength.
Removed Mandekalu Cavalry city attack bonus promotion (but still has no penalty).
Reduced Tank, Panzer, Modern Armor to lower tier city attack penalty (-25%, instead of -33%).
Aztec Culture from kills now stacks with new Honor Policy branch opener for double Culture killing barbarians.
Boosted Chariot Archer to strength 4 and ranged 7 (Egypt War Chariot as well).
Drop combat value of Berserker and Huscarl to match Longswordsman.


[MODDING]
Fixed a bug in Lua where "Events.<SomeEvent>.Remove" was not behaving correctly.
(Lua) Added GameEvents.CityCanBuyAnyPlot(ownerID, cityID) (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.CityCanBuyPlot(ownerID, cityID, plotX, plotY) (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.CityCanCreate(ownerID, cityID, projectTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.CityCanMaintain(ownerID, cityID, processTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.CityCanPrepare(ownerID, cityID, specialistTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.CityCanTrain(ownerID, cityID, unitTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerAdoptPolicy(playerID, policyTypeID); (Hook)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerAdoptPolicyBranch(playerID, policyBranchTypeID); (Hook)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerCanAdoptPolicy(playerID, policyTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerCanAdoptPolicyBranch(playerID, policyBranchTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerCanConstruct(playerID, buildingTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerCanCreate(playerID, projectTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerCanEverReseearch(playerID, techtypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerCanMaintain(playerID, processTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerCanPrepare(playerID, specialistTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerCanResearch(playerID, techTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.PlayerCanTrain(playerID, unitTypeID); (TestAll)
(Lua) Added GameEvents.TeamSetHasTech(teamID, techID); (Hook)
It's now possible to have the tech tree "dead end" where the final technology is not repeatable.
New graph datasets used by the replay viewer can be added by mods.
Action Icons now use the database in the same way as other icons instead of using ActionIcons.lua.

Obviously, the biggest change will be: "Research agreements now give a tech boost instead of a free tech. Tech boosts start at 50% of the median value of all techs you can research. Can be boosted to 100% if you both start Rationalism and build the Porcelain Tower."

No more tech blocking, yay!

Found that part very interesting. Will see how folks adjust. :)

Science Related


Research agreements now give a tech boost instead of a free tech. Tech boosts start at 50% of the median value of all techs you can research. Can be boosted to 100% if you both start Rationalism and build the Porcelain Tower.

Public School science per population reduced by 50% and now provides a flat 3 science

Research Laboratory modifier reduced by 50% but now gives a flat 4 science

National College moved to Philosophy and reduced by 2 science

Great library now gives 3 additional science, and provides a free Library in the city where it was built

Oxford University now gives 3 additional science

Liberty Finisher: Great Person of your choice

Reduced cost of Calendar, Civil Service, Iron Working, Gunpowder, Rifling and Dynamite


Looks like it's going to be a good patch. Overhaul the whole research setup, not only RAs.

What I find interesting is that Science and Diplo victories now require more science.

Diplo requires 14 more techs to reach Globalization, while Science requires 1 more (it loses the five techs leading to Global, but gains the six on the bottom leading to Combustion). No more sub-200 Diplo victories!

So, are you going to extend this GotM until the patch? I haven't even started on the Japan one yet, prolly get around to it tomorrow afternoon when I have some free time.

Unhappiness per city increased to 3 from 2.
Luxury resources now give 4 Happiness, down from 5.

Colosseum maintenance reduced by 1 gold, Happiness reduced by 1.
Theatre maintenance reduced by 1 gold, Happiness reduced by 1.
Stadium maintenance reduced by 1 gold, Happiness reduced by 1

Eiffel Tower now give 5 Happiness plus 1 for every 2 Policies adopted
Chichen Itza now grants an additional 4 Happiness.

Landed Elite now provides 1 Happiness at every 10 Citizens in each City.
Meritocracy: +1 Happiness for each city connected to your capital, and -5% Unhappiness from citizens in non-occupied cities.
Military Caste now provides +1 Happiness and +2 Culture for each city with a garrison.
Professional Army now reduces cost of upgrading units by 33% and provides +1 Happiness per defensive building (Walls, Castle, Arsenal, Military base).
Organized Religion now gives 1 Happiness per Monument, Temple and Monastery.
Democracy now provides -50% Unhappiness per Specialist.
Police State now provides 3 Happiness per Courthouse, and reduces the time it take to build Courthouses by 50%.
Order Opener now provides +1 Happiness per City.

There seem to be some radical changes to happiness as well :crazyeye:

So, are you going to extend this GotM until the patch? I haven't even started on the Japan one yet, prolly get around to it tomorrow afternoon when I have some free time.
We'll see when the patch pops up. :hmm:

If it is before June 27th, the game closing date, then TSG15 will be as soon as I can get a save put together and tested. If it is after that date, then we'll be on hold.

If you are getting late, may want to check your settings and set them to not auto update?

Glad they listened to all the advice on Research Agreements. :)

Happiness will become a Very Big Issue though.

With these very big and interesting changes... can we finally migrate to CIV5 GOTM's NOT having a pre-chosen victory condition????

I haven't had enough interest to play the last three CIV5 GOTMS because of the disadvantage of the pre-chosen victory condition which by now, we have all outgrown. Let us chose our own and explore our own playstyles please.

The other thing I want to point out --

Pacing has received a large amount of work. Expect to have more of a challenge managing your empire at higher difficulty levels than you did before. Consider dropping a difficulty level if you have problems.

Perhaps we should have a Prince/King game (depending on other conditions in the game...but one level below what we'd normally do)?

With these very big and interesting changes... can we finally migrate to CIV5 GOTM's NOT having a pre-chosen victory condition????
We have had this discussion and the community chose to have a designated VC. You are not bound by that VC, you may pursue whatever VC you wish.

Think the idea of a designated VC is to help in the learning process as we each find our style. The more players who participate in the discussion, the more styles we are exposed to. It has been rather amazing that players win using so many different routes, and a common VC helps me in understanding. Not sure about others?


Perhaps we should have a Prince/King game (depending on other conditions in the game...but one level below what we'd normally do)?
TSG14 is a King level game. :)

With these very big and interesting changes... can we finally migrate to CIV5 GOTM's NOT having a pre-chosen victory condition????

I haven't had enough interest to play the last three CIV5 GOTMS because of the disadvantage of the pre-chosen victory condition which by now, we have all outgrown. Let us chose our own and explore our own playstyles please.

The problem with not designating a specific VC is most folks will just go for Domination since it's always the fastest. Thus anyone that goes for any other VC will have less than a snowball's chance in hell at even placing in the top 3.

The problem with not designating a specific VC is most folks will just go for Domination since it's always the fastest. Thus anyone that goes for any other VC will have less than a snowball's chance in hell at even placing in the top 3.

Except that... I still feel score/points are important - not ONLY who is fastest to finish. Unfortunately, that isn't considered in the CIV5 GOTM's, and only applies to CIV4 Gotm scoring. :sad:

Unfortunately, that isn't considered in the CIV5 GOTM's, and only applies to CIV4 Gotm scoring
Ahem! We tabulate the Civ5 results by date AND score. :confused:

CiV5 Games are scored by: "fastest finish by (specified) victory and then all other VC listed below by fastest time." to quote the standards. Score isn't even considered according to game announcements unless there is a tie for finish date... unlike the Civ4 series GOTM.

Please let me know what post or site you are quoting from, and I'll fix it.

Meanwhile, Civ5 games are not scored *at all* officially. As I keep trying to remind you, this training exercise is not a competition. The main reference on the subject is the "Welcome" thread, and it says in relation to the Training Game series:

Once the game is released (and the staff has learned the basic routines), we will start hosting training games. This training series will run until we have a security mod (a variant of HOF/BUFFY) that enables us to run the proper competition. The purpose is for Civ5-fanatics to try out the new features, share experiences, and informally compare games in a friendly environment based on the no-reload concept. The staff will propose objectives related to the new features to allow a more focused discussion, and the games will be provided twice a month.

Once the submission website and the security mod are in place, we will start the actual competition. The award system will be designed once we understand the scoring mechanics of the game, and the players will have an important role in this process. We will use the experience from the training series to devise an award system that is fair and encourages players to perform at their best. We will also decide later if we will use adventurer/challenger saves, or if there are other ways to allow for a variety of playing skills.

None of the above is in place yet. This is not a competition!

Please let me know what post or site you are quoting from, and I'll fix it.



It is in the header of every standard Civ5 game, 2nd paragraph of every announcement.

Well done taking that quote out of context. There's nothing about scoring in that paragraph, it says "the results will be posted with fastest finish by [Domination] victory and then all other VC listed below by fastest time.". It was penned when we were only listing submissions in date order because score order seemed to be pretty meaningless. It has been copied and pasted into each game announcement, and it still applies for the date-sorted lists.

Since those early games, our results pages all show both listings because players asked for listings by score as well. Note that the same announcement posts go on to say "We will create a separate thread with the results at the end of the two week period (sorted by date and score)".

Please let me know how you would prefer to see the results listed. Unless I get constructive suggestions for change, I tend to keep on producing the same listings.

Obviously, the biggest change will be: "Research agreements now give a tech boost instead of a free tech. Tech boosts start at 50% of the median value of all techs you can research. Can be boosted to 100% if you both start Rationalism and build the Porcelain Tower."

No more tech blocking, yay! That will be replaced by "boost milking" ... :mischief:

So what will be the best way to maximize the MEDIAN value of all techs you can research? Hmm ... wonder how they will calculate medians. Will it be the value of the middle tech for an odd number, and the average of the two middle techs for an even number?

Will this reward cheap tech completion more than beelining? Will extending the high end of the range be better than chopping off the low end? Might be very case-specific, which would be good. ;)

dV

The changes to research seem like good ones.

The happiness modifications sound like they will make this facet a lot harder to manage.

Out of interest, does anyone know on what basis changes like this are made? It seems a little like random tweaking to me, but there must be more to it than that.

It seems a little like random tweaking to me
it is

only real concept I see is no "get tech for free" mechanic - but then ...
there are still great scientists ....

just very sad notes,
espacially as the most important things - ai, espacially diplomacy improvements seem to be missing ....

These seem like very sensible changes to me, particularly with respect to RAs but also the restructuring on the Social Policies. I like the idea of adding a closer to each track and moving some of the big rewards there (such as GP in Liberty). I was glad to see the Honor track strengthened to where it seems desirable in many situations. The changes sound as if they will encourage using more buildings and/or Wonders, sometimes in combinations for full effect. I generally like advances that cause a wider variety of game features to become viable, which opens up a lot of creativity for multiple approaches. I say "thumbs up" on this patch with no reservations.

Think the idea of a designated VC is to help in the learning process as we each find our style. The more players who participate in the discussion, the more styles we are exposed to. It has been rather amazing that players win using so many different routes, and a common VC helps me in understanding. Not sure about others?
I am a huge fan of designated VCs because that is what allows you to compare your game to someone else's and learn about how your decisions impacted your game. I'm constantly reading other reports and thinking to myself "wow, I didn't think of that". And because I was playing the same type of game, I am much more likely to learn from and understand some of the important decisions and turning points in the game.

well withoutVC it d be Domination all over - thats just main problem of civ5 - ai is so horrible - killing it is easier then steeling kids candy.

I tutaly struggle to see how some1 can LOOSE a game of civ5 - i mean honestly - All you have to have is 3 units and be somewhat careful with em.

No patch or whatever will change that -1upt just is impssible to handle for ai as u have to be able to think ahead and ai just cant do that

Patch is out. It is numbered as 1.0.1.332

Working on TSG15. :mischief:

it is

only real concept I see is no "get tech for free" mechanic - but then ...
there are still great scientists ....

just very sad notes,
espacially as the most important things - ai, espacially diplomacy improvements seem to be missing ....

Hmmm...

AI remembers if you satisfied one of their requests (positive modifier, decays over time, based on value of items granted).
AI remembers if you fought against a common foe (positive modifier, decays over time, based on damage done to the common foe).
Track trades between players and allow that to positively influence relationships (the better the deal for the AI, the stronger the modifier).

What's really funny, I'd been playing assuming that these were already part of the diplomatic picture. Now I know why I consider all the AI to be insane. :lol: None of this mattered before!?! Maybe this patch helps some after all. :crazyeye:

Now that RA blocking has been nerfed, it will be interesting to see what winning strategy evolves (that will be so unbalanced as to be patched out later).:rolleyes:

Without checking, I fully expect that the tech tree offers some opportunities where the 'median' is an expensive technology, and that everybody will b-line for and sign multiple RA's at those very occasions. ;)

Without checking, I fully expect that the tech tree offers some opportunities where the 'median' is an expensive technology, and that everybody will b-line for and sign multiple RA's at those very occasions. ;)
With the normalizing of beakers for techs of the same tier (e.g., Civil Service beakers reduced to be in line with the tier: Theo, Cur, Eng, and MC), I am not such there will be great arbitrage opportunities.

If I had to venture a guess, I think that early RAs will mostly go away. Instead, for non-warring games, you will want to sign some RAs such that they pop after you've gotten Rationalism and built the Porcelain Tower (at least one if not both). By that point, your median tech pretty much has to be a 2nd tier Medieval tech (e.g., Chivalry) or, if you can swing it, a 1st tier Renaissance tech (e.g., Astro). The trick will probably lie in making sure that it is the latter.

If I had to venture a guess, I think that early RAs will mostly go away. Instead, for non-warring games, you will want to sign some RAs such that they pop after you've gotten Rationalism and built the Porcelain Tower (at least one if not both). By that point, your median tech pretty much has to be a 2nd tier Medieval tech (e.g., Chivalry) or, if you can swing it, a 1st tier Renaissance tech (e.g., Astro). The trick will probably lie in making sure that it is the latter.

Kinda definatly:

Step1: stay class age for some time - finish medi techs like theo/cs/compass 90%, time build of GL with fnishing some tech (maybe get chvialiary with it f.e.)
Step2: rush throgh the tech tree in 30 turns till some Ren tech (maybe its astro again)
Step3: GE porzelain tower (with liberty tree only and 1-3 cities and buying some cCS early instead of RA it might be possible to get cult fast)
Step 4: Rationalisam:
Step 5: RA throgh all ren techs
Step 6: profit

maybe its better to do the RAs before entering ren age, espacially if building PT isnt that easy - time will tell

TSG15 Announcement thread has been posted. (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=429434)

Has anyone else experienced problems starting CiV after the patch? I click on my shortcut, Steam says "Preparing to launch CiV" and it stays that way for longer than I am willing to wait (10 minutes). Is it an enormous patch that must download or something like that? I mean... I have 2Mbps download speed... so I can't imagine that is the problem. Any tips on what I should do?

It took about 30 minutes on my system

It took about 30 minutes on my system

Oh! OK, I guess I'll try being patient then. :crazyeye:

2K has released a "hot fix".

Details can be found here. (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=430957)

Nice, I was waiting for the hotfix to complete the Liberty tree in my game. :D

Nice, I was waiting for the hotfix to complete the Liberty tree in my game. :D

LOL, nice move Dave!

Hot fix patch number is version 1.0.1.348

Nice, I was waiting for the hotfix to complete the Liberty tree in my game. :D
:lol: