View Full Version : Build Orders (Ancient Times, Middle Ages, Industrial Ages, and Modern Times)


dojoboy
Feb 05, 2003, 08:54 AM
I figure there are three general types of build orders:

(1) for military conquest
(2) for space race and domination
(3) for cultural victory and domination

I placed domination on 2 and 3 because it tends to be a by-product of my pursuits for s/r and cultural victory attempts; triggered by accident. You may feel otherwise. Below is my usual build order, regardless of victory goal. I rarely go for conquest; however, I could use advice on initial build orders for expansion, then settling in to a balanced build que. My main problem is discipline, staying focused on the immediate plan. City placement has a great deal to do with what should be built first, etc.

Ancient Times: Queue #1

temple - happiness
barrack - veteran units ASAP
aqueduct - if away from freshwater, never build otherwise.
library - culture and later university
marketplace - $$$$ and later bank
granary - food stores, increase pop (usually never go for Great Pyramid)
harbor* - trade
courthouse - corruption, if far away from palace or FP

Middle Ages: Queue #2

bank - $$$$$ and Wall Street
university - increase research
cathedral - happiness

Industrial Ages: Queue #3

factory - increase production as fast as possible
hospital - increase pop
airport* - troop mobility
hydro plant (almost always get Hoover Dam)
colosseum - I know its available much sooner, I just don't place much emphasis on it; may wait to build in Modern Times

Modern Times: Queue #4

SAM missile battery - air defense and/or at least six for SDI, if games goes this far
research lab - research
mass transit - pollution control
recycling plant - efficiency
#games are usually over before more advanced facilities come available.

--- Quite often, the last couple improvements listed in each stage are not built until the next era, due to external pressures. :soldier: :sniper:

heikeott
Feb 05, 2003, 10:07 AM
Dojo:

From the MTDG, assorted SG's, the war academy, and various strategy articles, I have adopted the following, which followed loosely seems to be working very well for now, although it will probably change again as I learn more...

After founding of capital:
1. Warrior or Scout -> explore/pop huts
2. Warrior or Scout -> explore/pop huts
3. Settler
4. Defensive unit (spearman, hoplite, etc. to fortify in capital)
5. Settler ..

After founding of 2nd city:

Capital: Granary, Settler, Temple, Settler, Barracks, Settler...
Subsequent Cities: Defender, settler, military, settler, granary (if not building pyramids), worker, military, settler, temple, settler...

When the first rush of expansion has settled down and I am no longer competing in a land rush against the AI civs, my build priorities are as follows (and you know I go for cultural, diplo or SR never conquest or domination yet)

Defender
Temple
Courthouse (if corruption & waste are high)
Marketplace
Barracks
2nd Defender
Aqueduct (if needed)
Courthouse (if corruption & waste are moderate)
Library
Granary
University (high culture + science increase)
Courthouse (unless virtually no corruption/waste)
Cathedral, colosseum, etc. for culture if not happiness
Bank

Harbors get squeezed in as needed for trade and for cities who don't have a lot of good land.

After all the basic stuff is built, it usually goes as follows:

Hospital
Mass Transit ASAP after hospital (pollution!!)
Factory
Recycling Center ASAP after factory (pollution!!)
Hydro or Solar Plant if not on continent w/Hoover
Research Lab

then airports, SAM batteries, etc etc depending on what I feel like and how the game's going.

Of course, many things force adjustments. If I build a city on another continent in modern times (for example to grab a resource that no one else apparently wanted) often the very first thing I build is to rush an airport, then rush temple, or vice versa.
When building a city close to the AI, a temple is very often the first thing I build, and rush it if I can, because a temple is usually enough to make the borders expand.

JMHO

JQW
Feb 05, 2003, 10:57 AM
For my founding city I first build a couple of warrior units, sending one out to explore. I then go for settler, temple, worker followed by the Pyramid. The Great Libary is the other wonder I go for, even though sometimes it has no benefits.

I get all of my cities to produce a settler immediately after building the first unit. I expand until I've filled up as much of the continent that I can. I build a galley ASAP and explore the surrounding area, planting cities on outlying islands in case resources appear in future.

I try to build as many settlers as possible early on, and the automatic benefit of a granary in each city helps this.

Sun Tzu's War Acadamy, Leonardo's Workshop and Wall Street are a must. I also discover Steam Power as soon as I can.

Only late into the game do I go for domination. I usually wait until I can build infantry and/or tanks before attacking any neighbours.

I've a game now on at Regent level on a huge map, currently at approx 1400AD. I'm well ahead of everyone else technology wise, and have the benefit of duplicates of most resources. There's a very weak neighbour to the north and west of me that I'll be conquering as soon as I roll out riflemen to all my cities.

Txurce
Feb 05, 2003, 01:04 PM
Dojoboy, there's almost no difference between domination and conquest, in that if you achieve the former, the latter is inevitable. When playing on emperor or deity, you rarely have an opportunity to expand sufficiently in a peaceful manner. Military expansion is frequently essential, regardless of which sort of victory you're going for. For this reason, many players start their games with rushes, which position you for any sort of win... including domination/conquest. It is the easiest way to play at higher levels.

There are some good threads on rushes - I recall several at Apolyton - but an early rush boils down to this: four or five cities with barracks, built as quickly as possible in whatever manner you find effective, pumping out archers or horsemen. With ten offensive units, you can take two cities on the first turn, and that alone will cripple your enemy... take one more and declare peace, or finish them off. You now have a solid, viable civ, while still in the ancient era. There is no need for temples so early, and no time to build them, so save them for the peace afterward. Or postpone peace, and attack the next guy. That's what I did in our current GOTM, and the results speak for themselves. Note that winning wars will keep you current in tech, so you can switch programs whenever you like, and build infrastructure instead of offensive units. About all you sacrifice with this approach is the valuable early start for a cultural win.

Now would you mind answering my "Image problems" post in the Tournament forum?

dojoboy
Feb 05, 2003, 01:41 PM
Originally posted by Txurce
Dojoboy, there's almost no difference between domination and conquest, in that if you achieve the former, the latter is inevitable.

Well, if you start out for a domination win, I agree; however, my domination victories tend to be when I'm going for space and take too much territory when warring. A mistake yes, but that's why I placed domination with #s 2 and 3.

Originally posted by Txurce
There is no need for temples so early, and no time to build them, so save them for the peace afterward.

Interesting, I've always assumed temples were a must early on emperor to stave off unhappiness. I may replay the GOTM-9 after my first play to see what happens. My first offensive against Egypt was textbook; however, I stalled against Greece, but I did lose about 6 Riders to a culture flip. Thanks, this could be key.

Originally posted by Txurce
Now would you mind answering my "Image problems" post in the Tournament forum?

Okay, okay, I will.:p

Txurce
Feb 05, 2003, 02:06 PM
With smallish towns, unhappiness can be staved off on emperor with a garrison. If you're rushing, and can't afford more than one warrior, you may have to move the luxury slider a bit. But that's easy to do at the start of the game.

Beamup
Feb 05, 2003, 04:00 PM
I actually don't have any "build orders" per se. I always assign production dynamically based on current and anticipated future needs, so what I build when is a lot more variable than most people.

And one point on SAM batteries - in the 1.29 readme, one of the listed changes is
* Fixed bug which prevented SAM Battery from working.
Based on this and some discussions in the main section of the site, it appears that SAM batteries do nothing other than make it possible to build SDI.

*Sigh* I would love to at least have the 1.29 bug fixes.

dojoboy
Feb 05, 2003, 04:30 PM
Originally posted by Beamup

And one point on SAM batteries - in the 1.29 readme, one of the listed changes is
* Fixed bug which prevented SAM Battery from working.
Based on this and some discussions in the main section of the site, it appears that SAM batteries do nothing other than make it possible to build SDI.

*Sigh* I would love to at least have the 1.29 bug fixes.

Really, I often wondered if they were working when a city was bombed, but figured it was some calculation w/out fx defending my cities. I would like those fixes as well. :(

frunobulax
Feb 06, 2003, 07:40 AM
Originally posted by Beamup

And one point on SAM batteries - in the 1.29 readme, one of the listed changes is
* Fixed bug which prevented SAM Battery from working.
Based on this and some discussions in the main section of the site, it appears that SAM batteries do nothing other than make it possible to build SDI.

Aha! I was beginning to wonder about SAM Batteries, after suffering at the hands of the Persian Air Force in my current Americans game - though i did get lots of Elite F-15s :)

As regards build queues, i concentrate on establishing a 'Settler' city (irrigation + granary as first improvement) to pump out settlers every 4 turns or so (with wheat/cattle/river in the city radius), plus a 'Science' city by medieval times (library, university, plus Copernicus & Newton Wonders), and also a 'Military Production' city (i.e. finding a place for a city with mountains/iron/coal, with barracks/factory etc). The rest falls into place...