View Full Version : Is Culture and Faith the same thing?


KokeenoPokameso
Mar 10, 2012, 01:46 PM
:think:Well just as the tittle says reading the descriptions from various articles I can't help put feel that faith and culture are almost the same thing.


You accumulate culture through buildings and combat (honor tree). You use the accumulated culture to buy social policies that provide a benefit to your empire. Mid to late game policies are influential in determining your relation with other cives.

you accumulate Faith through buildings and combat (special unit). You use the accumulated faith to buy beliefs that provide a benefit to your empire. Early game Beliefs are influential in determining your relation with other cives.


The only difference that I can see is that all social policies are available to all civs where beliefs seem to be more like World Wonders in that one one civ can have each one.

Agree? Disagree? Yes, But...

CYZ
Mar 10, 2012, 01:48 PM
Also, religions spread from cities. If I understand correctly, someone elses religion can spread to your city and thus give you bonusses they paid for with faith. While culture gives a empire wide bonus, but within your empire only.

moysturfurmer
Mar 10, 2012, 01:53 PM
&& faith can be used to purchase (probably only religion-related) units and buildings. And I've heard rumblings that you can use faith to purchase Great People too.

Louis XXIV
Mar 10, 2012, 02:08 PM
I think all this is right.

Faith can be used to purchase other things besides abilities (such as missionaries)
Religion can give you bonuses from even enemy cities and give bonuses to enemy cities
Religious bonuses are mutually exclusive. If you use it, your enemies cannot.

I wonder if they'll add new culture buildings or if Temples are staying as a culture building. Personally, I hope they change them, although I'm not sure with what just yet.

KokeenoPokameso
Mar 10, 2012, 02:52 PM
Would it not make sense for some cultural building (i.e. monument, temple, etc) to do double duty? I feel as though culture should be a natural emergent property of a civilization rather than something specifically sought out.

So faith Effects are limited to individual cities? So different cities will have different religions. So will there be an official national religion?

Can I choose which religions enter my empire? So if I fallow another cities Religion I get bonuses from their religion and they get bonuses form me being a follower. could be a great way bolster relations between civs from an role playing stand point.

Camikaze
Mar 10, 2012, 07:05 PM
Faith sounds like it will be quite similar to culture, in that it is a yield, and you have thresholds at which point you get things (like a pantheon). But then it's like gold too, in that you can buy things with it. As a yield, it can't really be too drastically different, but yeah, I guess it does seem most similar to culture. It should be like adding another dimension. Do you go for culture or do you go for faith?

Louis XXIV
Mar 11, 2012, 12:03 AM
BTW, it wouldn't surprise me if faith doesn't have to be used all at once (unlike culture, which, by default, must be used the turn you unlock it). For starters, there isn't a goal listed on the screenshot, faith just accumulates. Second, you can use it to purchase other things besides new abilities and there might be a reason to do that first. Third, with the first come first serve system, there's a cost to waiting that will discourage and balance out policy saving.

JtW
Mar 11, 2012, 03:37 AM
One difference that strikes me from the gameplay POW is that culture works with the principle of 'the less cities, the better' (the more cities you have the longer you wait for new SPs), whereas faith rather works with the principle of 'the more cities, the better' (diplomatic bonus if you spread your religion, the Follower Belief gives per-city bonuses, and, from what we know so far, at least some of the Founder Beliefs give you bonuses for each new city joining the religion).

Uberfrog
Mar 11, 2012, 05:55 AM
One difference that strikes me from the gameplay POW is that culture works with the principle of 'the less cities, the better' (the more cities you have the longer you wait for new SPs), whereas faith rather works with the principle of 'the more cities, the better' (diplomatic bonus if you spread your religion, the Follower Belief gives per-city bonuses, and, from what we know so far, at least some of the Founder Beliefs give you bonuses for each new city joining the religion).

An interesting point. Perhaps there may be a Founder belief offering you culture per city folowing your religion -- this could potentially offset the culture penalty from expansion.

ShahJahanII
Mar 11, 2012, 07:35 AM
BTW, it wouldn't surprise me if faith doesn't have to be used all at once (unlike culture, which, by default, must be used the turn you unlock it). For starters, there isn't a goal listed on the screenshot, faith just accumulates. Second, you can use it to purchase other things besides new abilities and there might be a reason to do that first. Third, with the first come first serve system, there's a cost to waiting that will discourage and balance out policy saving.

This is because there are several ways to spend it.
For example: purchasing beliefs, buying missionaries and inquisitors, erecting religious buldings, etc.
Same reason there is no "goal" for gold.

MaximusK
Mar 11, 2012, 10:38 AM
SP trees are open to every player while only so many religions can be in a particular game (based on the # of civs in the game, I believe). Also, once you choose a particular belief for your religion other religions cannot choose that belief for their religion. Those are significant differences.

Louis XXIV
Mar 11, 2012, 11:11 AM
Yeah. Saying it's the same thing might as well be the same as saying culture, science, and gold are the same thing because they're all currency.

Babri
Mar 11, 2012, 01:20 PM
Faith sounds like it will be quite similar to culture, in that it is a yield, and you have thresholds at which point you get things (like a pantheon). But then it's like gold too, in that you can buy things with it. As a yield, it can't really be too drastically different, but yeah, I guess it does seem most similar to culture. It should be like adding another dimension. Do you go for culture or do you go for faith?
:religion: >>> :c5culture: :p

KokeenoPokameso
Mar 11, 2012, 02:44 PM
for the most part you all are discussing how the things you are buying with faith points behave differently than the policies you buy with culture. which is true but the underlying mechanic is fundamentally the same in how you get these beliefs.

snapple232 Posted his own thread on Mar 10, 2012, 06:46 PM called Three tech trees (research/culture/faith) is lazy design Where he express a similar opinion to mine thou perhaps a little more eloquently.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=11324299

KokeenoPokameso
Mar 11, 2012, 02:46 PM
Oh P.S. JtW what dose POW stand for. Prisoner of War?

Louis XXIV
Mar 11, 2012, 02:48 PM
Would you also agree that science is fundamentally the same mechanic?

JtW
Mar 12, 2012, 03:38 AM
Oh P.S. JtW what dose POW stand for. Prisoner of War?

It was a typo. Was supposed to be POV = point of view.