I have read all I can find on the subject and have not come up with any real answer to my question. My question is will diplomacy get any sort of rework?

For me its broken. I realize it is probably working as its designed but the whole "AI is playing to win" thing kills me. I like to have some real chance at making an ally or really any meaningful diplomatic arrangement.

From what I can tell the espionage part being added in looks promising, you can leak war plans with civs and establish embassies. Sounds good on the surface. Will see what the details are later.

I am just wondering if any of you that are better engaged then I am on the subject know of any major reworking of the diplomacy system as of yet? I dropped the game a month after it launched and have come back for a week or two at a time about 3 times since, usually after a big patch but I keep leaving because of the uselessness of diplomacy. There are way better war games out there. What should set this game apart is diplomacy in my opinion.

Guess I am just hoping for a change. Maybe I am wasting my time.

They said they are taking away the negative modifier "you want same victory as us" so I guess they are making diplomacy positive and negative modifiers more reasonable. I hope they fix it that when you liberate a civ that civ does not denounce you and become Hostile. >_>

Well, there are some diplo factors that have been removed. You don't get called a warmonger for conquering city-states w/o allies and the AI doesn't hold it against you if you "are trying to win the same as me" anymore.

Religion plays a role in diplomacy early on, but your order/freedom/autocracy choice plays a role in the late game.

I wouldn't say it has been reworked though.

Yeah, embassies. I'm really hoping this would lead to increased beneficial trade relations and culture competition between civs, rather than just out-and-out warmongering.

Although I wouldn't mind if a civ goes all nuclear if someone is close to winning a culture vic ;)

Also, diplomacy is much more fluid and realistic. Most diplo modifiers aren't permanent, civs don't care as much about settling near them once civ borders have been established, religion affects diplo more and more until renaissance, during industrial social policy choice (order, freedom or autocracy) becomes important

Thanks guys, you have eased my mind. Looks like at the very least there is hope out there for me.

as long as i don't settle a third city and have the whole world denounce me "just because" and have a 50 turn war where the superpower sends 8 military units + 20 workers and settlers to invade me...

One of the previous, which I now forget the name of unfortunately, mentioned something about a pretty substantially re-coding of the diplomatic AI.

I am reasonably confident now that they are aware that it is broken from the point of view of many of us. There is no way to have a meaningful diplomatic interaction if the AI is playing effectively a different game.

I am somewhat less confident that they will be able to fix it.

If they rework diplomacy I may just fall in love with the game again and would 100% purchase the expansion. It was one of the main reasons why I abandoned the game.....its just so stale at the moment.

I saw earlier that they were getting rid of the "trying to win the same way as us" modifier and my heart jumped around in my chest a little.

I imagine diplomacy would be one of their major focuses. Leaving aside espionage and religion, they've probably talked about it more than anything else. I think they recognise that it's not working all that well.

as long as i don't settle a third city and have the whole world denounce me "just because" and have a 50 turn war where the superpower sends 8 military units + 20 workers and settlers to invade me...

... Then offers peace for all your cities... then 10 turns later offers peace for all of their cities. Yeah let's hope they tweak all of that.

Well to be honest I have good hopes they removed the you are winning the same way modifier.

So it seems they are taking a step backwards from a AI who plays like a human and wants to win to actualy diplomacy However we will have to see...


If the AI still plays like a human it doesn't metter how much modifiers they add it will not recognise them