In my opinion, Catapults and cannons should all be 10 shields cheaper, and cannns have a ROF of 2. They should also be able ro ignore the effects of city walls ans size bonuses.

EDIT: OK, it is showing this as post 1... Must be a bug.

I think they will be redoing bombarding, because there is no way they could find a unit worth building between catapult and cannon. Not that cannons or catapults are worth anything anyway.

Trebuchets?
What are they for? do they just knock down a cities walls, or do they work like a catupult?:confused:

In real life, Trebuchets were Medieval Catapults

They will probably be 0.0.1 6.1.1 (A more powerful Bombard unit than a catapult)

catapults and cannon worthless? In Multi player they are a necessity. (sp) Stack of legions with a few catapults in it...almost invincible. Cities with either...10 times harder to take. On the attack...killers...on choke holds....held off 30 mounted stack with 4 catapults and about 8 or nine hoplites-

they should make bombard able to kill units because in real life they can

<sigh> Not the "Lethal Bombardment" debate again.

You will find as many people here who will argue that they *can't* "kill" units in real life, as you will who will argue that they *can*.

If you really want lethal bombardment, there is an option in PTW to turn it on (maybe in Conquests, too; I haven't looked).

IMHO, Trebuchets should have a better chance of taking down improvements, espeically walls. Cos in real life, in the age of Castles, trebs made short work of grand city walls and castles.

Not to mention their effectivness in AoK.
:king:

besides, i agree with troytheface, like to build catapults and then upgrade them to cannon even in single games.

i usually bombard big cities heavily to 'soften' the target
:D

Yes, a catapult is useless.

However, that's not how you are supposed to use them. Instead try having 20 catapults (or any other bombarding units) in a stack and then do a "broadside". Some civver's are even known to attack with stacks of 50 pieces... Now, that's anything but useless. :)

With PTW we got auto-bombard to ease our aching fingers, but it occurred to me that the micromanagement could be reduced further: if you are anyway using artillery units as a stack then why not have a unit that represents, say, 10 pieces of the type? With this I mean that the "artillery battery" unit would cost 10 times as much as the basic unit and the stats would be the same except it would have the blitz ability with 10 attacks. That way you could move the equivalent of 10 catapults by moving just a single unit. Obviously you also ought to flag such a unit as "not transportable" to avoid the exploit of being able to load the equivalent of 80 artillery pieces into a single transport ship...

I don't have access to the civ-editor now so I can't check whether such a unit is already possible to mod, but if not then Conquests would be a good place to add it. At least as a possibility to the editor if not the basic game itself.

mmmm, in real live they use batteries too. But they bombard all in packs. Not multiple times, but one massive bombard (see Stalins tactic during WW2)

but there should (i think there should) be an option in wich (xtra in editor) detirmine the effectiveness against curtaijn structures and units. So u can take away the annoying losing of a tank against spearman

As far as bombard units are concerned. Id like to see:

- Trebuchet (they should have a bombard that automatically targets city walls)
- Howlitzer (Simple Field guns that are less than 100mm arent all that great, give me some 405mm's)
- Katyushas (you probably wont see these, but if they put them in...)

I would also like to see the ability to damage terrain (not just the improvements, but to make the terrain screwed up. Say that it would decrease movement on it). Seeing that could allow the quagmire of the western front, which is something id really like to see.

Originally posted by Sarevok
I would also like to see the ability to damage terrain (not just the improvements, but to make the terrain screwed up. Say that it would decrease movement on it). Seeing that could allow the quagmire of the western front, which is something id really like to see.

That is an excellent idea! It's almost coded in too. Just have to rework the arty units (and the bombing units) and when a terrain is hit, if it doesn't have any improvements, a 'worker-like' action happens instanly where it craterst he terrain, and slows ya down.

Oh, and Padma - Lethal Bombardment is in the VC3 editor too, post 1.17f, I think.

Something along these lines is supposed to be included in Conquests. Look at features page on civ3.com site:
...
Map Features: Bombard the enemy and leave behind craters.

Re: lethal bombard:

Lethal bombard, particularly lethal land bombard, is insanely powerful on normal (non-single use) artillery. Build sufficiently huge stack of Arty, and any invading force can be eliminated instantly at no risk to the defender. Arty stacks are already very powerful on defense - were they given lethal bombard, they'd be beyond fantastic.

The Last Conformist is right. Early versions of the H'wacha in PTW did have Lethal Bombard. It was seriously unbalancing in the human player's favor. A stack of these with a few defenders meant that you could take city after city without losing a unit. This flag was removed from that unit because it just way too easy to win.

How do you turn on Lethal Bombard?

Originally posted by Turner_727


That is an excellent idea! It's almost coded in too. Just have to rework the arty units (and the bombing units) and when a terrain is hit, if it doesn't have any improvements, a 'worker-like' action happens instanly where it craterst he terrain, and slows ya down.

Oh, and Padma - Lethal Bombardment is in the VC3 editor too, post 1.17f, I think.

they had this for the nukes in SMAC, there was nothing like blasting five cities off the planet with one singularity bomb and making a new sea at the same time...

Originally posted by Necromancer
How do you turn on Lethal Bombard?

The PTW editor

they put that feature in!? Cool! Be sure that my first scenario for Conquest will be WW1, a GOOD one!

I just wish that my economy would be strong enough to justify artillary units so early in a game. Maybe I should play some Cheiftan and Warlord (or what ever it is in this) so I can use them. On Emporer & Deity, My economy is barely capable of fielding a modern army early in the medieval era.

I find artillery more essential if I'm the underdog, since I then have to focus on minimizing my losses.

Originally posted by troytheface
catapults and cannon worthless? In Multi player they are a necessity. (sp) Stack of legions with a few catapults in it...almost invincible. Cities with either...10 times harder to take. On the attack...killers...on choke holds....held off 30 mounted stack with 4 catapults and about 8 or nine hoplites-

Must agree with Troy. In a recent, painfully recent, MP game I had 5 spearmen, 3 swordsmen, 7 war chariots in a city (size 5) with walls and I had the Great Wall wonder (staging for an offensive don't ya know!). A stack of 10 legions with 8 catapults destroyed my town in 3 turns. :eek:

By the way, once those damned catapults destroy the walls, the Great Wall is suddenly less useful:( .

Live and learn.........now I build catapults.......

necromancer do you play diablo 2?? you know why i said that if you play do you??










Originally posted by Necromancer


How do you turn on Lethal Bombard?

My guess is that they're making some changes to bombardment so that maybe trebuchets go after the city walls specifically... but that's just my guess. There has to be some sort of change like that because otherwise, they're pointless. It's not worth the +2 bombard over catapults to build them.

true, but it would be cool to have them specifically target city walls.

Hmm arent most cities over size 6 by the middle ages anyways.

very true.