Welcome to Term Four.
This turn I hope to gain Fanatika's lead as the top Industiral Nation in the globe. We are poised on the industrial ages and we can achive victory by dominating this age.

Science Head: SaaM
Deputy: Siegmund

Chat Rep Needed!

Current Queue:
Democracy
Economics
Either: Chemistry OR Navigation

Tech Poll Number Six of Term Three (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=60176)

A new discussion on technology and a possible trade is up.
It can be found Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=60524)

We may well soon reach the point where we can research two techs per turn chat - plus we may pick up some techs via trade. We need to get a medium to long range goal in place so the DP can choose which tech to research without stopping the chat every 4 or 5 turns.

I would also like to suggest determining a long term goal, such as Scientific Method so we can get Theory of Evolution. It is especially important to coordinate such a long-term goal with a prebuild.

This was posted in response to the current science poll (T4P4 I think).


We can't afford to decide these things one tech at a time. That would forcibly slow the game pace to 4 turns per chat, until we reach techs which take longer to research. It also kills us if we get a tech in trade.

To keep the game moving, I would suggest a poll which contains research sequences as the options, such as:

Magnetism->Steam->Military Tradition
Military Tradition->Magnetism->Steam
Magnetism->Steam->Electricity

From the Jade house

I would like to see the plans from the Science department for the fastest way to get Steam Engine. Since our new goal will be to get the ToE before anyone elts gets it.

Thanks,
President CivGeneral

Why in heaven's name are we researching nationalism? Can we research medicine please?

I agree with donsig, although I think the chat was stopped at Turn 9 for further discussion. Judging by the remaining research time for Medicine and Electricity, I don't think that any investment has gone into Nationalism yet.

Governor donsig has a Palace pre-build in Gorina's queue so that we can build Theory of Evolution. We must get to Scientific Method first, and that requires Medicine!

Originally posted by donsig
Why in heaven's name are we researching nationalism? Can we research medicine please?

If our President would ever post summaries, you would have seen that he stopped the chat so we could decide what tech to research next. Although, not much has been done to decide.....

Originally posted by zorven

If our President would ever post summaries, you would have seen that he stopped the chat so we could decide what tech to research next. Although, not much has been done to decide.....

Let's not get on the President about the summaries. After all he's busy posting the game play instruction thread. :rolleyes:

Anyway, let me rephrase my question: Why in heck isn't the Science Leader doing his job and getting a science queue posted so the chat does not have to stop prematurely?

Originally posted by donsig
Anyway, let me rephrase my question: Why in heck isn't the Science Leader doing his job and getting a science queue posted so the chat does not have to stop prematurely?

I checked into this....Stuck_as_a_Mac said he would be absent until about today. He left Siegmund in charge who in turn said he would be absent from the 16th until the 24th but would be checking in periodically. So maybe Stuck_as_a_Mac will be back today and pick up on this.

For crying out loud, didn't we all agree that we want and need ToE? Doesn't it then follow that we should be researching our way to scientific method? In this case I do not see why two people being absent has to hold things up especially when they knew they would be gone! :(

Originally posted by donsig
[B]For crying out loud, didn't we all agree that we want and need ToE? Doesn't it then follow that we should be researching our way to scientific method?

That's what I thought.


In this case I do not see why two people being absent has to hold things up especially when they knew they would be gone! :(

I think that the President stopped the turn chat since he was lacking official orders from the Science Dept. However, it seemed as if the citizens agreed that ToE was the goal, and thus the President could have made the decision for the Science Dept.

In the absence of official instructions the President can (and should) make needed decisions. That was supposed to be the whole lesson we learned from term 3!

Originally posted by donsig
In the absence of official instructions the President can (and should) make needed decisions.

Yes, assuming the President knows the will of the people. And that is definetly the case here.

Has the Science Dept. taking into concideration that we may have several turns before we get ToE, as such we may want to start researching something else before going on to the more advanced More costly Atomic theory and Electronics? Since those we plan to get with ToE...

Thank you General! Ok, we currently have 135 shields saved up in Gorina. By tweaking the laboroers we can get 27 shields per turn. ToE takes 600 shields. 600-135=465. 465/27=17.2, so we have 18 turns before we have enough shields for ToE. We'll have electricity in 7 turn. So unless we can get scientific method in 11 turns or less (after we get electricity) then we'll be stockpiling shields that will just be wasted. If railroading continues around Gorina then we'll make shields even faster there. So it may turn out that the science queue is exactly right in this case. We may not have time to research anything else between the time we get scientific method and build ToE. We will want to turn off research after getting scientific method if ToE will be built the next round.

We may also want to raise our science rate to get electricity and scientific method faster.

I am all for doing research on something else while ToE is being built. I tend to do it myself on games, with Monarch being the limit (but this is monarch, so its fine). I would myself go for Replaceable Parts. This will not only give us the infantry, but much needed 2x speed workers. Add that with Democracy, and thats 4x workers when we are railroading the entire nation (yes, before you say it, Gorina First... (sounds like a certain naziesque isolationist group from the 30s, doesnt it?))

However... I'll poll this between Rep Parts, Sanitation and Industrialization. Whichever one is the winner will be researched while the ToE is being built.

SaaM

Just wanted to make sure we didn't end up wasting research on Atomic Theory, instead of Researching Industrialization since our biggest goal with ToE is Hoover. Or on the opposite note, start Researching Nationalism and end up getting that tech Free by accident from ToE. That's why I felt we needed to use our Science research crucially at this time.

However, by Donsig's estimation we won't need to have any middle techs since it seems right on par.

Originally posted by Stuck_As_a_Mac
Science:
Just go for the ToE. Take Atom and Electricty after that.

Science Leader: What to do in between the time Sci Meth is researched and ToE is constructed? How many turns is that ?

* Do we go for Sanitation in between ?
* Do we hold science ?
* Do we start researching Atom ? ( :smoke: )

That will be tricky. We're a couple turns away from electricity but we don't know how long it will take to research scientific method. We currently have 260 shields saved in Gorina and can make 28 shields per turn. So we are 13 turns away from having the 600 shields for ToE. Our window of research between getting scientific method and building ToE is 11 turns minus the amount of time it will take to research scientific method. My guess is that it will be only a couple turns at best. My suggestion is to turn off research (set science rate to 0%) after getting scientific method. Once ToE is built we'll get atomic theory and electronics for free than we can up the science rate again and continue research.

So, the question is what do we research after we get our two free techs? We should be figuring that out now...

Well, I could just say "My term ends after that", but I'm going to guess and say Industrialization.

Its the next leader's decision for whats next, but Ind. is my choice.

we are 13 turns away from having the 600 shields for ToE.

Our window of research between getting scientific method and building ToE is 11 turns minus the amount of time it will take to research scientific method.

My guess is that it will be only a couple turns at best.

My suggestion is to turn off research (set science rate to 0%) after getting scientific method.


11 turns to TOE..
suppose scientific method takes 6 turns or less. then we'll have 5 turns left of those 11 turns. those could be used to research sanitation if we wanted, right?

then i'd choose sanitation over the gold.

what do you think?

I think the instructions should be:

When we complete research on Scientific Method:

If a tech is available which will complete faster than the number of turns required to finish ToE, then choose the highest cost tech with this property.

If no tech will finish sooner than ToE, then set research to zero and build up a cash reserve.

At least 2 turns before ToE is completed, set research to Atomic Theory. This will ensure that is one of the free techs from ToE, when it is discovered, select Electronics as the next one. Afterwards, choose the winner of the next science poll.

BTW since we're aiming for Hoover, is a prebuild started for that one?

just a technical question: what comes first in a turn, discovered tech or finished productions in the cities? IIRC (but i'm not sure) tech comes first, which means that this "tech which will complete faster than the ToE" could actually be finished the same turn as the ToE is built.

just make sure the research que is set for Atomic Theory and Electronics after whatever tech we might be working on and there would be no need to switch the research to Atomic Theory 2 turns before the completion of ToE.

Originally posted by DaveShack
At least 2 turns before ToE is completed, set research to Atomic Theory. This will ensure that is one of the free techs from ToE, when it is discovered, select Electronics as the next one.
As soon as Sci Meth is researched, we are already required to point a new tech to research. If we have enough spare turns, we can appoint industrialization or sanitation or whatever. The only important thing we have to do is to change to Atomic Theory just before ToE is build and set research to 0 and we'll automatically get Atom Theory.

Of course we'd be loosing a lot of research if the ToE finishes before our spare tech is fully researched. It is very important to not let that happen.

Stuck_As_a_Mac,

I wanted to know if you could point me to any discussions or polls to show why you have us currently researching Industrialization and you current orders are to research Sanitation next.

To tell you the truth: I was not aware we were researching Ind (havent really been that active, and I didnt expect this chat to be on the last day of term)
Also, Sanitation will not be done until after the chat is completed and can be used as a holder for whatever the people decide with their next leader. Could be radio, could be something else.