This SG is based on the GOTM24 (Korea) Scenario. However some changes will be made to allow players to meet more of the units and special features in this scenario.

List of Changes.

1. The playable Civ will be the Oda (with standard in-game starting units).
2. Maximum tech rate will be 5 turns/tech
3. Resource locations will be re-spun.

[civ3] Roster A
Karasu
Sir Bugsy
AlanH
smackster
Gengis Khan
CivGeneral

[civ3] Roster B
AdrianE
gormdragan
Alweth
MacBaldrick
mad-bax

[ptw] Roster
Ted Jackson
Shevek
Denyd
Space
Daveshack
jimmydean

The Rosters for this game have been opened again to support demand.


Here is the start position.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads5/mb4a.jpg

Here are the links to your respective team threads

[civ3] Roster A (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=1341881#post1341881)
[civ3] Roster B (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=1341882#post1341882)
[ptw] Roster (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=1341879#post1341879)

Do not enter into any discussions in this thread. Use your own thread from now on.

Ahem, adopts stern voice..
Do not discuss what is going on in the other threads. I want no "cross pollination", and I hope that most of you can bear not to even look in your competitors threads.

Finally, I thanked cracker for the effort he has put into this on our behalf, and I hope he won't mind me sharing his response with you.

It was as follows:-
It is I that owe you and all the players a debt of gratitude.

The designed intent of the games is to present you with a chellenging play experience that you will want to reslice and rechallenge exactly as you are doing here in this example.

One thing to remember if your do get to the Later Technologies in the game is that the WWII Kamikaze style airplanes are engaged in your game just as they were in Gotm24 with the discovery of Flight.

Also, you may benefit from having a sensitivity to the different unit names and animations that are on in the PTW version of the game versus the Civ3v1.29 version of the game. The games play the same and the stats/strengths are the same but because the PTW units are so restricted their are slight differences in teh name of who is doing what and when.

You should be right in the big middle of lots of exciting stuff.

First of all, discussion regarding the scenario should be limited to non-spoiler info until after October 31--the submission deadline for GOTM 24--right?

Second, I may be interested. I was also thinking of using GOTM24 as a basis for an SG before I saw your thread. My only reservation is that Civ3 is taking up more and more of my time.

Third, I am confused about what this "Quick Games" forum is and why this post is in here and not the SG forum. This is just a normal SG, right?

Cracker suggested that I post here. So I did. Once the game(s) are underway then I will probably set up the in game threads in the SG forum.

The game will not start until 9th November, and spoiler information is subject to the same rules as in any other thread in this forum.

Sign me up, please. I started GOTM24, submitted the QSC even, but I'm not going to make the deadline, I'm still in the BC's. :(

So, yeah, I'd like a chance to see all the special features. And I hope we get enough people in to make teams to add a little extra spice.

I was thinking about starting a GotM 24 SG after finishing the GotM 23 SG (PTW).

Looks like you've saved me the bother :D

Sign me up MB.


Ted
p.s. I haven't even looked at the GotM 24 announcement page so it's all a mystery to me

I had planned to suggest going back to the previous games first to minimize the amount of knowledge carried forward from a recently played game... :rolleyes:

But since we're here, I have some interest in joining the [ptw] team, but don't take that as a firm committment yet. There is some RL going on which might impede my civability in the near future.

I probably (or should I say 'hopefully') won't be around between mid-November and beginning of December, when my holidays are due...
I'll gladly join if I stay, though. I would really like to be Nobunaga once in my life -or Shingen for that matter (anyone likes "Kagemusha" too?)

EDIT: @Dave. I too hope we'll manage to play all past GOTMs as SGs...

I'd love to join the PTW team.
Played and submitted GOTM24 but did not see a lot of the special units. I was to replay it on my own but a SG is much better especially as it starts with a different civ/tribe.

Will there be a fixed win condition like Diplomacy again? I found it a bit limiting in this particular scenario.

Yeah, let's make it Conquest and swarm the world with our Bushi!

I was kinda hoping we would aim for a military victory. :satan:
One point of note..... We don't know what our UU will be :eek:

Do you want to know?

No thanks MB (I think Karasu has already let the cat out of the bag) :D


Ted

Are you sure Ted? There are so many new unit names that "normal" unit names are the exception in this GOTM!

No, I'm not sure and I really don't want to know until I start playing :)


Ted

I swear I do not know what Oda's UU is. I assumed they would be able to build Bushi, and I like them a lot...

I agree not to unveil our UU until we start the game, anyway

Thanks Karasu


Ted

I'm interested in a PTW version if the current SG for GOTM 23 is done (and it should be, right Ted). I can't commit to more than 1 at a time and still have time for the normal GOTM. :)


I won a diplomacy on GOTM 24, but only met units from my neighbors, so the units for the Oda should be a new treat. I would expect the tech tree should remain the same as for the Koreans, but I'd expect different units than the Koreans used (particularly the Hwacha). It'll also be interesting to see how the computer plays the Koreans in a similar starting point. :D

A conquest / domination type victory would be a good chance to see these new units in action.

MB: You might want to spilt this into separate PTW & Civ3 teams ala GOTM 23 SG.

Originally posted by denyd
I'm interested in a PTW version if the current SG for GOTM 23 is done (and it should be, right Ted). At the rate we've been playing SG23 should be over by this time next week :D


Ted

Just an idea but I think we should restrict the use of suicide galleys since a number of players know the layout of the land masses already. That would create an unfair advantage.
We could either prohibit suicide galleys altogether and wait to be contacted or only team members that haven't played GOTM 24 nor visited the spoilers can use them (but how likely is that to have someone to fit this criteria?)

regarding difficulty I vote for predator. I didn't have the guts to go for it in the GOTM (me coward) but would love to try it.

Shevek: I don't object to this restriction. We could just say that no boats are to be built until we are in control of the starting landmass. It would probably amount to the same thing.

If there is a [civ3] version, I'd like to join up. I did well until the start of the Industrial Age playing open and then fell behind in techs and never caught up.

MB: It looks like PTW SG 23 will be done in time (maybe even this weekend), so I'll commit to playing. I prefer PTW 1.27 since I've already got all the files.

As for level and goal, my preferences are open and either domination or conquest. I'd like to give the new units a workout.

See you in about a week. :D

Unfortunately, it looks unlikely that there will be sufficient interest in the civIII version of this SG. I guess if Daveshack and/or puppeteer firm up their desire to play then I could join the civIII team, but we would still need one or two others. With only 3 players the turn around time is too quick.

There are still a few days left before the games will start, but I am unable to do more than I already have to advertise the games. I don't know what else I can do.

Originally posted by mad-bax
I guess if Daveshack and/or puppeteer firm up their desire to play Unfortunately Civ3 is taking up way too much of my time. I decided not going to join this SG (or any other for now). One SG and the GOTM/Medal games have shorted me of sleep and work for the past month, so adding more to the mix is a bad idea for me.

I'm not married and don't have kids. I don't know how you family folk keep up all the Civ3 action! :eek:

That's what work is for!

*flips desktop to a copy of Crystal Reports as the boss walks by*

:lol: :D :lol:

OK. Denyd raised this subject in SG23, and I've fallen for it.

I didn't play any of GOTM24, so this is a great opportunity to catch up, IF we can get a quorum together for Civ3 1.29, IF SirBugsy will have me, and IF Karasu is still talking to me ;)

The 9th is still almost a week away, so there shouldn't be too much overlap with SG23. One condition, after ControlFreak's departure from SG23 - please don't quit, MB, or if you do, please don't pass the buck to me!

Actually Alan, given your fine reputation, the question would be if you'd have me. :D I'd be honored to be on your team. I'll beat the drum amongst the 1.29 folks I know and see if we can get up a whole team.

I guess we can run the game with 4 players on each team. So it looks as if we can play. It would be nice if we could get 2 or 3 more players though. I'll try again to persuade some more people.

I've started some gentle persuasion on the rest of the SG23 Civ3 team ...

cracker has said he will try to supply the saves in both formats on or before the 7th November. At this point I will kill this thread and open new threads in the SG forum. We will then have a couple of days pre-game discussion before we start.

Please take the time to read the first post in your respective threads. My hope is that we can post turnlogs in each thread that end on the same date.

I am tempted to get everyone to post their firaxis scores at the end of each set of turns and to store the results in some sort of publicly available table.... what do you think? A little friendly rivalry?

Sounds like a plan, MB. :thumbsup:

Fine with me.
Additionally, count me in for good.
I hope I won't slow down the Civ3 team too much, but with the holidays coming in I won't be able to play GOTM 25 -so, I should have some more time for SGs. Besides, I just can't say no... :)

Glad to hear it Karasu. Are you OK with vanilla?

Yes. I love vanilla...

Originally posted by mad-bax
.... what do you think? A little friendly rivalry?

Oh why not. That should spice it up some more.:p

Sure. Posting regular Firaxis scores sounds like a way to keep in touch with relative progress. Of course, if we are ahead it will all be down to our superior mastery of the game, and if we are behind I reserve the right to point out what a useless measure of performance the Firaxis score is ;)

Pleased to see you've seen the light, Karasu. Now, what do we need to do to convince the others in SG23C to sign up?

I'll sign up, I am about to go on an extended trip so don't really know when I'll be online at anytime, although I will have my laptop and both PTW and CivIII disks with me. Hopefully I'll play all my turns, but you have been warned.

My other problem to signing up before was that my internal modem seemed to be broken, but a very nice man just brought me a new modem, which is about the size of my thumb???

I can therefore play Civ III or PTW.

Smackster

Originally posted by smackster
I can therefore play Civ III or PTW.
Well. it's gotta be CivIII then, eh? Now we are four [edit - whoops - five with MB], vs 4.5 PTW. Just need another one or or two of the old gang and we'll win the first round, since this is becoming a tad competitive :p

Hi smackster :)

You're in the vanilla team.

I'd like to join the Civ 1.29 team. I was thinking that it would be fun to try as the Oda. They were looking pretty good in my game.

Adrian

OK Adrian. I'll drop back to the PTW team to compensate.

The first post has been edited with provisional rosters. If anyone has a problem with the order of play please say so and I'll change it.

I'm sure Space will have something to say about going first (again) :D


Ted

Are there any more openings for vanilla? I would like to sign up if possible.

Ted: She usually has something to say about most things ;)

Gormdragan: you are on the roster.

Hey, I leave the web for a few hours, and they start talking about me! Oh no, I've done it, had something to say... [puts fist in mouth] :ack:

Originally posted by mad-bax
[civ3] Roster
Karasu
Sir Bugsy
AllanH
smackster
AdrianE
gormdragon
... and

If anyone has a problem with the order of play please say so and I'll change it.
No problem with the roster, but my name only has one "L". I actually answer to two four letter words ;)

Sorry Alan, fixed. :thumbsup:

if it's not too much trouble, there are 2 "a"s in gormdragan. :D

I spell about as well as I play :)

<sigh> fixed.

Originally posted by mad-bax
I spell about as well as I play :)

<sigh> fixed.
I copy and paste whenever possible, and I do that superbly. So my spelling's OK, my typing's lousy, and I haven't found a way to play Civ3 using copy/paste yet!

I'd like to play in the Vanilla game, if possible.

Alweth, OK you are on the roster.
I think I'll close the vanilla roster now, otherwise you'll only get one turn each.

Hmm, imagine a 1turn per player SG. We could be playing till 2005.

I am flexible to swap to PTW if need arises.

OK gormdragan, I'll keep that in mind. Thanks. Even teams would probably be better.

@ mad-bax - When will we be seeing the start picture and separate threads opened up for discussion?

Bugs

Arrgh!! Looks like I'm too late & you guys have a full roster. D'oh!

One of these days I'll actually play a GoTM.:lol:

Good luck to both teams! I'll be hiding in the shadows to see what I missed, just post alot of screenshots.;)

Originally posted by Sir Bugsy
@ mad-bax - When will we be seeing the start picture and separate threads opened up for discussion?

Bugs
Please don't push MB too hard, SirBugsy. Some of us are still trying to complete the SG23 Civ3 game ;)

Sign me up for the PTW.

Looks like bigger rosters than last time, so that will lower the impact enough to let me commit to the [ptw] team.

Originally posted by Sir Bugsy
@ mad-bax - When will we be seeing the start picture and separate threads opened up for discussion?


Bugs:
cracker has agreed to supply the starting saves on 7th November and the game will start on the 9th November. Cracker is looking at the most effective way of slowing tech pace in the game to extend the time we have to play with the new units.

Once I have the saves I will open the threads and post a link to them here. Hopefully we will have 48hrs for pre-game discussion.

I am pleased to see that I share the honour with Space to be the starting player in the vanilla roster... :p

Is this a subtle hint about my having something to say about anything? :crazyeye:

Since we now have seven players in each team I have decided to close the rosters. I hope this is OK with everyone.

Hi mad-bax,

Sorry to be slow to respond but was away from home over the weekend (running up and down cliffs in Cornwall - my legs still ache) and spend all last night moving the SC23 forward.

Since the roster is closed I will just follow the play and can fill in for anyone if they have an availability issue - to keep thing rolling if that is OK.

As a Mac user I will be playing the 1.29 version.

MacBaldrick: It is not my intention to prevent anyone from playing this game. So if there are no objections to you being added to the civIII roster in the next 24hrs, then I will add you tomorrow.

I have amended the ptw roster order to accomodate RL issues.

Now we just have to sit on our hands patiently waiting for the saves. :)

MB (Mad-Bax not Macbaldrick): There seems to be a lot additional interest for this game, any chance of multiple teams for one of the types??

:beer:

There is no limit (in theory) for the number of teams. The only limit is the least number of players on a team. Fewer than 5 means that turns come round too quickly for some people (me specifically ;) ). So, if we get 10 signups for a version I will split it into 2 teams.

It's a good idea IMO :thumbsup:

So with MacBaldrick and Gengis Khan, that's at least 16 players. we could have 3 teams... What a competition!

Is GK playing? Get him to sign up here somebody please. Again I can shift to civIII to even up the teams.

I agree Bugs, this should be a lot of fun. :D

Me PM GK.

Edit - Done.

Assuming GK is playing I have opened the rosters again. Please tell your friend. ;)

I wish to sign up for the PTW or the Civ3 team, Which ever has more room for me. Please, I realy would like to be in a GOTM SG :)

CivGeneral: I am going to put you on Vanilla CivIII Roster A, if that's OK. If you haven't played Vanilla GOTM lately you have a big download and some instructions to follow. Nice to have you with us.

A hardy "well done" to you mad-bax. I think this is going to be a blast. :goodjob: Too bad CF isn't around to see the fruits of what he wrought a month ago.

Yeah, I miss CF. He was (erm is) a great guy.

I have the saves. I'm posting the new threads now.

I think you might be right. Team play GOTM might just be the next evolution of this format. Cracker's crafted scenarios are superb, but I have found that the pressure to play a good ten turns, and hand over a save file I can defend and be proud of to my colleagues, adds an extra dimension to the game. I have had no previous opportunities to try the SG experience, but I have really appreciated the progressive learning experience during between-turn discussions. It gives much more immediate feedback vs. the after-the-event learning that comes at spoiler time in the GOTMs.

Imagine a multi-team SG, played on a Cracker magic map, to a one-month deadline - with all the multi-player logistics that implies. We could pitch single players against teams and test the relative benefits of a focused single player vs. multi-skilled team play. Heaven knows what it would do for the ranking systems, and star players would become commodities to be traded between teams on a transfer market, but it could add a new dimension to the already-sparkling community game experience that is GOTM.

Of curse, I could just be suffering from the immediate after effects of that rather splendid Chardonnay we had for dinner ... ;)

The first post in the thread has been edited to show the start position, links to your respective threads and a few words from our patron.

I have the saves, but I will not make them available until midnight GMT 8th November.

I can see it now

Manchester United Trades Star Civ Player AlanH to Sporting Lisbon

;) not bad for a Yank?

Originally posted by Sir Bugsy
I can see it now

Manchester United Trades Star Civ Player AlanH to Sporting Lisbon


.... on a free transfer, maybe!

;) not bad for a Yank? Well done! You probably know more about MU than I do. I live in one of the few soccer-free zones in the UK, and I have no problem with that!

Actually, those are the only two teams I know. :D I saw them play each other a few years ago.

Originally posted by Sir Bugsy
Actually, those are the only two teams I know. :D I saw them play each other a few years ago. Then you *do* know more than me. MU is the only one I'm prepared to admit to having heard of ;)

Originally posted by mad-bax
CivGeneral: I am going to put you on Vanilla CivIII Roster A, if that's OK. If you haven't played Vanilla GOTM lately you have a big download and some instructions to follow. Nice to have you with us.

Thanks :). I have not played the GOTM on Civ3 Vanilla, so I would expect to Download a huge file. Luckly I dont have to deal with Floppies since I can just plug in my USB FLash Drive and load it in there. Once done, I can head to my Laptop and transfer it to it. (Since I have yet to get an exstention phone cable from my Phone Jack to the Sofa)

I just ran across your posts and it should be fun for everyone. Is there a way I can have the start file to play on my own. I played a nd finished the open class with space victory. No amount of gifting helped their attitude. I would love to play from the other island. It looks like they had more trouble than the Han gave us on ours.

@barbslinger: Come and share the fun, as far as I know you can still join in one of the teams... :)

CivGeneral: Yes, I am in the same boat. I doubt you will be ableto download the big "full install", I've tried a couple of times. You may have to download the full install for GOTM21 and then the three patches for subsequent games. There is also a graphics enhancement pack that you might like.

Barbslinger: Space is quite right (as usual). If you sign up in this thread or PM me I will add you to the roster. Just be sure to let me know whether you want to play PTW or CivIII.

If on the other hand you really don't want to play with us, then you can play solo by downloading the 4000BC save from the threads linked in the first post of this thread. They will not be available until 9th November however.

Either way, have fun. :)

Thanks for the welcome wagon. (Should that be a CIV unit?). I play PTW and as I type have my new Conquests ready to load so I can re-kick some Yamamoto a$$. I played the Korean GOTM with PTW but at launch crashed due to some pediaicon message. I think my CIV3 still works though. I have an icon and the disk. I prefer PTW because I played Koreans with that. I think I will have to reload something to get rid of the pediaicon error. I would hate to think it would mess up an SG game.
Anyway I really enjoyed that GOTM and when I saw your thread I couldn't resist. If you have room I will be available to add my .02 yen.

barbslinger: I'll add you to the PTW Roster, but I would urge you to PM cracker about your Pediaicon issue. I believe (though I am not certain) that this was a known issue with a known fix. I am confident that cracker will be able to give you the information you need to play this game.

BTW: Welcome :)

If you re-download the setup and re-install then the problem will be resolved.

Alternatively, download the GotM start save. The updated Pedia file is in there too.


Ted

I was wondering if it is possible to swap me to the A team? GK, Bugsy and I are sort of partners in crime.

gormdragan: Find someone who is willing to swap with you and I'll do it, no problem. If I just do it then I may upset the person I swap you with. Though in your shoes I'd like the chance to play against them. ;)

Hmm, you are absolutely right. Playing against them kind of intrigues me. Destiny has placed us on opposite sides, so be it.

Don't worry Gormdragan. They'll have me on their side to cramp their style ;)