Although I'm sure that most of you already know (I'm just as sure that some of you don't), that spies are (to me) the best weapon of conquest in the game. Provided that you have the right amount of money.

My favorite strategy is to switch to a democracy as soon as possible. Then, accumulate a HUGE pile of jack. As soon as you develop communism, revolt in lieu of a communist government. Send out spies with your armies (on a full transport try to include 2 or 3 spies). Then, when you debark at the objective send the spies in first to incite revolt. After that's done you have 5 or 6 units with which to mop up the partisans.

Granted, it's not the fastest way to win the game via conquest. But it gives you a lot of time to build a large, highly advanced civilization along the way....

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Thou who goes to bed with an itchy butt wakes up with a smelly finger.

hehe, spies are very cool (that's why some forumers want to be a spy when they have posted 2000 posts, even though the spy looks like a female http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/wink.gif)

If you bribe alot, Fundamentalism is probably the best gov't for you. It's not very difficult to gain 2000 Golds each turn under Fundy. http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/smile.gif

Oh yes spys can perform all manner of mischievious taskshttp://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/smile.gif

I build them under Commie so they are vets.Makes a big difference.

Vets are successful and return way more than non vets.So a half dozen or so can sabotage over and over and over and over....hehehe.A dastardly,but extremely effective technique.Especially in MP against those big city perfectionists.As long as you don't pick a specific target you will bat 1.000 with sabotaging.

They are the only way to nuke after SDI.Vets seem to bat around .150-non vets are rarely successful in this mission.

The "sabotage unit" is another extremely under rated tactic for MP.2 spys and cruiser=no more battleship.

I recall attacking a large SSC with a transport full.2 transports and my vet spys returning left that SSC with less than 25 beaker output.Then the poisoning began.....hehehe..hello size 1 http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/smile.gifThe worst or best part was there was NO WAY to stop it.

Gotta last till Espionage though.....

Won't get an argument from me about how great spies can be! Between investigating, the high movement, the bribing and the sabotage they are easily one of the most versatile units.

It makes them all the more powerful that the AI ranks espionage very low on their tech "to get" list. Therefore, there is usually a pretty good stretch where you have spies and they don't - even if you were behind or even in the tech race.

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Diplomacy - the art of
saying "Good Doggie"
until you can find a rock

If there is a vet spy in the defending SSC city good luck trying to destroy stuff.

...and when you get fundamentalism you start buildning tanks and are using the spies to put down city walls and abrakadabra, you have an army impossible to stop.

I disgaree, thunderfall. I think spies are the most effective under democracy. The super-trade I can easily get several hundred or even thousands a turn(almost as much as fundy) and since demo can't support units spies are your only way to go to war. Plus they can't bribe you in democracy. What most people don't realize is that in the late game democracy is an extremely efficient war machine(if you have the U.N.) because of this fact.

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If there is a vet spy in the defending SSC city good luck trying to destroy stuff.
there wasn't http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/smile.gif

True it would have helped but maybe 1 in 4 would be stopped.I was running at least 8 vets per turn.
3 would be better.But there is no reason to wait for spys to do this.Diplomats also bat 1.000 when no target is selected.They don't return so you need more but still works brutally well.

A perfectly suited tactic against Super Growth http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/wink.gif

Spies + Engineers + Armour are the best combination for rolling over an entire Civ in a single turn before you've got Robotics. But once you have Howies going along the railroads your Engineers are building to the AI's front door, spies are not needed so much.

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<IMG SRC="http://www.anglo-saxon.demon.co.uk/stormerne/stormerne.gif" border=0>

I'm in love with a spy

http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/wink.gif

IMHO the spy with it's 30 shield cost compared to what she can achieve is one of the most unbalanced feature in Civ2. She is waaaaay too powerful! It really should be more expensive at least. Then it's ability to peek inside towns losing just 1/3 of it's movement point thus making it able to examine 9 (!) railroad-connected cities in a single turn.. whew!

The other unbalanced feature is of course Fundamentalism with it's immense cash flow, practically non-supported units and no happiness problems what so ever. I'm so glad Sid decided to drop this gov out of Civ3! http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/wink.gif

or for seiges. put cheapy units in all the city squares to starve them, then send waves of spies to destroy stuff, and poisen water supply

Originally posted by Smash:
If there is a vet spy in the defending SSC city good luck trying to destroy stuff.
there wasn't <IMG SRC="http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/smile.gif" border=0>

True it would have helped but maybe 1 in 4 would be stopped.I was running at least 8 vets per turn.
3 would be better.But there is no reason to wait for spys to do this.Diplomats also bat 1.000 when no target is selected.They don't return so you need more but still works brutally well.

A perfectly suited tactic against Super Growth <IMG SRC="http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/wink.gif" border=0>


vet spy has 60% chance of stoping an attack like that.
80% chance if its targeted.. Don't remember all the stats (check apolyton)

But if your playing using my strat, you would have ships patroling etc. Its highly unlikely you would get a chance to attack. Also remember that in most of my games my inner cities are huge and well protected with the outter cities being bases to attack from or warning posts.

I don't know about anybody else...But if I saw anyone parachuting into my city I (and probably anyone else who saw it) would become very suspicious, very fast.

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Thou who goes to bed with an itchy butt wakes up with a smelly finger.

sorry but you are wrong.
as usual <IMG SRC="http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/wink.gif" border=0>

spys or dips can ONLY stop tech theft.Thats it.Only "the citizens" can stop other espionage.In other words-RANDOM.NO target selected=100% success.dips,spys,vets or no.

I have done it against big civs(just like yours <IMG SRC="http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/wink.gif" border=0>).There is no REALISTIC way to stop it.Because of this some players ban sabotage from their games.
Boats won't stop it either.The only thing I've seen that was remotely effective was putting units on every square to block them.Berzerker did this but it was a temporary solution.Losses can get high fast trying to stop them.ICS has big advantage in a situation like this.My sabotaging would be useless.

drop your SG for a game and go commie(SoL) and try it.You'll like it <IMG SRC="http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/smile.gif" border=0>



[This message has been edited by Smash (edited April 10, 2001).]

Originally posted by stormerne:
... once you have Howies going along the railroads your Engineers are building to the AI's front door, spies are not needed so much.

I still like those spies. Without them, you have to waste your Howies getting past nearby enemy troops on your way to the cities. With spies, you can bypass everyone - the AI always provides many railroads to travel on - and get straight to work on the cities.

You still may want to take out those pesky enemy troops, but concentrating your Howies on cities can mean a one-turn anihilation and then all those troops disappear anyway.

Furthermore, check out the cities with spies before sending in the big shells. No need to waste a Howie when the last two defenders are a cruise missile and a transport! That's where the tanks shine. http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/ripperwhore.gif

One of the spies drawback is that they cannot do anything against a group of units. And contrary to real life, they cannot "pass" through into a city if it's totally surrounded by enemy troops. They're also vulnerable ( 0 defence http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/frown.gif )
Anyway, I think it'd be a great and diabolic idea if in Civ3 there was a "droppable" spy unit. So you can paradrop spies into enemy cities. That would totally change our strategy.

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Genghis K.
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