Ok, I just bought C3C last week. So far I only played a bit with the conquests "Mesopotamia" "Napoleonic Europe" and "WWII Pacific".

Overall I like them, some things (eg. the importance of combined sea/air forces in the pacific scn) are IMO very well reflected. However, OTOH I think many of those conquests could need improvement in both graphical and game play aspects.

So I did what real modders do - and started modding :D

So I have begun to make new art for the Napoleon scn, see examples. I plan to do more, and also for the other scns, but a lot depends on my amount of free time.

Here are some previews (unfortunately bad quality due to high jpg compression - they look better in civ)

Another preview, and a question for the military experts: I want to add the PTW bazooka guy to the pacific conquest - but were Bazookas really in use in the pacific theatre? Or only in Europe?

To the gameplay side - I think the napoleonic conquest could have more techs - I researched everything available long time before the end of the scn. Someone who has nice ideas for techs of tha time?

Originally posted by BeBro
To the gameplay side - I think the napoleonic conquest could have more techs - I researched everything available long time before the end of the scn. Someone who has nice ideas for techs of tha time?

Check out this thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=64314&perpage=20&display=&pagenumber=1) starting at this post (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=1252380#post1252380) and keep on scrolling -- the "actual" alpha tech tree is further along ;)

Best,

Oz

Thanks :) That´s enough to read for the whole week :)

Maybe I can provide some of the art I currently make for this project -- just in case there´s interest and there aren´t already gfx made for this purpose (didn´t check that so far).

Wow. Keep going :) I really like these graphics !

Wow this is fantastic Bebro! Could you make this for the Medieval Conquest too? As im sure you already guessed im very interestet in the medieval conquest;)

I have to admit, I was rather annoyed with how easy the Napoleonic scenario was from the British side... I had every country in the world (except for Denmark) at war with France in the first turn.

I captured two French cities before the Russians showed up and cleaned up with the Cossacks... I had the French licked by 1802.


EDIT: Also, I personally think that any variation of these conquests has GOT to include increased HP because its vastly too random otherwise. I find unmodded Civ3 to be almost unplayable for this reason in particular.

On another point, does anyone know what the Flak cannon does? Whether it shoots down planes or just prevents them from succeeding in air missions.... Because in the World War II game, I probably got bombed by the Japanese anywhere between 150-200 times, and the Flak did not shoot down ONE Bomber... I have a feeling though that I got shot down by their ground-based air defense... I know at the very least that I got shot down by their Cruisers a number of times.

BeBro, you are hired (or your screens are) for the Grognards.

BeBro, this looks very good. :thumbsup:
And I see that both Sanitation and the Hospital needs new gfx. :hmm:

Dom: there is some sort of bug that lets you demand anything for a MPP in the first turn of this conquest. People have won, by getting all the cities from the AI. If you don't use diplomacy the first turn this conquest is as hard as it should be.

there is some sort of bug that lets you demand anything for a MPP in the first turn of this conquest. People have won, by getting all the cities from the AI.


:lol: :lol:

Oh man! I'm going to have to try that!


Actually, it wasn't ever really that hard to get the AI to reinitiate war on France either since pretty much every civ periodically resigned peace treaties with France, but I'll give it a try without that first turn of diplomacy... after I try one round of geting the AI to hand over every city of course ;).

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads5/europemapturn1.jpg


I must admit. I'm a little disappointed. I was hoping for more cities from the Turks... ;)

Oh, Dom, you're such an accomplished civ player. :lol:

Try waiting a couple turns when France has stolen all your undefended cities ;)

And that's why its better to take everything but Prussia's, Spain's, and Austria's cities bordering France.

Originally posted by Yoda Power
Wow this is fantastic Bebro! Could you make this for the Medieval Conquest too? As im sure you already guessed im very interestet in the medieval conquest;)

Yup, and I even have already certain ideas for that. It is just a matter of time :)

Dom Pedro II:

I have to admit, I was rather annoyed with how easy the Napoleonic scenario was from the British side... I had every country in the world (except for Denmark) at war with France in the first turn.

Yeah, that is my experience too. This one of the really annoying things - a Napoleonic scn with France wiped out as first civ :(

Maybe once I´m through the gfx changes I´ll mod it to make France stronger. Or we all urge Lou to finish his Napoleonic project at lightspeed ;)

Lou: :) Ok, I´ll post them once the whole set is done. So far I have modified the advisor screens, espionage screen, and will add the wonder and demography screens too. I have not found a way so far too change the campaign progress screen (where it say how much points you need, or how many turns are left). When I put a changed screen in the folder of the Napoleonic conquest, civ ignores it, and shows the standard pic located in the conquests main art folder. But maybe that is no problem when you put the scn under the scn folder - have to test this.

I have also some advisor pics military and science as shown inthe preview, plus foreign.

Finally I have a modified Euro city style, since I think the standard industrial style of civ looks too much like late 19th century, but does not fit very well to the time 1800-1815.

I read an account - this being written by a US marine who fought in the Pacific - and the use of the bazooka was mentioned - though, my impression being that it's use was far outweighed by the flame-thrower - still used, nonetheless.

Originally posted by BeBro
Here are some previews (unfortunately bad quality due to high jpg compression - they look better in civ)

Ah, Bebro, bad quality, my @$$. Bad@$$ quality is more like it.

Can't wait for the finished version.

:thumbsup:

this is fantastic!

Yes, this is absoutly amazing. What i would really like to see is all the conquests getting the graphical upgrades they deserve, rather then getting the standard civ3 graphics thrown over them.
I have yet to play the Napoleon scenerio, but is France really that weak? it's a scenerio about NAPOLEON! What the hell? I've played the WWII, Medievil, and Sengoku and looked at most of the other ones, including Rise of Rome. They all need some serious updates to their graphics, for instance to start with ASIAN advisors for the Sengoku scenerio.

As for the FLAKs, they kinda work like aircraft. If you set fighters to Air Superiority, there's a random number generator (I believe) that determines if the fighter intercepts an in-comming plane on a boming run. if it happens, the plane flys in on a perpendicular and attacks the bomber, destroying it. From what i've seen from experience in the scenerio, a FLAK basically does the same thing, working of a RNG it determines if it shoots a plane down, and if it does you see it attacking and the plane falling. I think you need to be fortified for this to work though. I'm not sure.



EDIT: DROOL! i love this Bebro
(we really need a drool smiley)

Originally posted by BeBro


Yup, and I even have already certain ideas for that. It is just a matter of time :) You are the man:worship:

Here´s the city style I mentioned. The idea is that - despite the steam engine was already invented and in use in some industries - the main industrialization took place during the later 19th century in many European countries. So the cities around 1800 would look still more like they looked in the 17th/18th century - most bigger buildings (cathedrals, houses etc.) would be from that time. I added some of those colorfull houses we still have today in many older european city cores.

Feedback would be welcome, esp. I´m not sure if I should keep the walls for the walled style.

Originally posted by BeBro
Here´s the city style I mentioned. The idea is that - despite the steam engine was already invented and in use in some industries - the main industrialization took place during the later 19th century in many European countries. So the cities around 1800 would look still more like they looked in the 17th/18th century - most bigger buildings (cathedrals, houses etc.) would be from that time. I added some of those colorfull houses we still have today in many older european city cores.

Feedback would be welcome, esp. I´m not sure if I should keep the walls for the walled style.

I like it very much :goodjob: My only comment is re: the walls -- I'd "simply" add another bastion on each wall to make it have more of a Vauban fortress look.

I'm eagerly looking forward to your posting this set! :)

Best,

Oz

Very nice, though you should tone the colors down just a but I think.

Found another prob in the Napoleonic conquest: under certain circumstances some civs build units that don´t belong into the scn. When I attacked the last French city, they had a trebuchet unit there :( I think we could solve that simply by clearing all civs from the build lists of the units in question via editor - I saw that a lot of standard civ units (archer, spearmen etc.) are still there, and available for all civs. If we clear the lists, the last available unit for all (even without resources) would be the musket man.

Originally posted by Yoda Power
Very nice, though you should tone the colors down just a but I think.

Do you mean this dark red on the church? Should represent red bricks. But I can make it a bit lighter.

Could you make the size 2 city bigger? It's almost the same size as the size 1. Just add a few buildings, spread things out a bit. :)

I fortified the Flaks, and they still didn't do anything! :mad:

The only thing I didn't do was try to pick 'em up and throw them at the planes as they flew overhead!

And it was so frustrating because when I got my aircraft carriers within range, I'd put the fighters in the city, and every single one of them would be destroyed by bombing before the end of the turn, so I couldn't set them to intercept!!

*sigh* Ah well.. I probably wasn't supposed to hold Manila the whole game anyway.



Back on topic, the Napoleonic cities look good I think.

With regards to the AI building useless units, deleting the units from the game altogether makes the most amount of sense to me.

Because honestly, what's the point of have to scroll, scroll, scroll through the Civilopedia when most of the units aren't even in the scenario anyway. You could fit all the playable units on one screen I think if you just took the others out.

Originally posted by BeBro


Do you mean this dark red on the church? Should represent red bricks. But I can make it a bit lighter. Yes and I know. It just looks a bit to cartoonish when its not a little "dirty".

I was going to start something like this. Maybe we should organize a "Conquest Fixers" team. :)

I've played three Conquests - Mesopotamia, Rise of Rome, and Fall of Rome. Rise of Rome was great fun, and would be fine with just some graphical additions, but the other two need a lot of work, IMO. Fall of Rome in particular is quite bad. Mesopotamia had some potential, but needs some more Civs to intensify things a little. I think we should devote a thread to each Conquest.

Originally posted by thestonesfan
I was going to start something like this. Maybe we should organize a "Conquest Fixers" team. :)

I've played three Conquests - Mesopotamia, Rise of Rome, and Fall of Rome. Rise of Rome was great fun, and would be fine with just some graphical additions, but the other two need a lot of work, IMO. Fall of Rome in particular is quite bad. Mesopotamia had some potential, but needs some more Civs to intensify things a little. I think we should devote a thread to each Conquest.

I'd have to add that "fixers" should use some of the new roman units out there and for Sengoku I replaced the galley and Caravel anim with the Baode and tongkang found in the forums

Dom Pedro II:

With regards to the AI building useless units, deleting the units from the game altogether makes the most amount of sense to me.

Because honestly, what's the point of have to scroll, scroll, scroll through the Civilopedia when most of the units aren't even in the scenario anyway. You could fit all the playable units on one screen I think if you just took the others out.

I agree. But we cannot simply delete those units in the editor, because then the unit slots will be messed up - if you delete units, the editor counts the next available unit in the list as the deleted one. So the preplaced units in the cities are exchanged by something else. Eg. when I delete the warrior you do not have musketman etc. in the cities anymore, but knights etc.

So IMO we can either:

- delete all useless units, then placing again the right units in the cities (in that case it would be wise to note what and how many units are placed in which city before the deletion) which is a boring task

- or we could add some more units to "overwrite" useless units. Eg. let´s say we add a grenadier for Prussia, but putting him in the warrior slot. There are ca. a dozen units which need to be added for this, but we could use the same trick Firaxis used. They added one unit, eg. Guards infantry as different units with different stats, but the same anims.

Yes, that would work as well. As long as you can find units to fill those spaces... and I'm sure that won't be a problem for anybody... ;)

You could either make these units unavailable for all civs.

What Supa said, or you could add a tech that's a prerequisite for everything unwanted.

Originally posted by Supa
You could either make these units unavailable for all civs.

Yeah, I know, but then they would still "contaminate" ;) the pedia. It is annouying IMO to have warriors etc. in the civilopedia when you play in the Napolenic age.

OK, I did some replacement jobs. First I used Colonel Krakens excellent ships.

So I have now...

Corvette: Kraken´s unit, French replacement for privateer, 1HP bonus, enslavement,

Late Galleass: Kraken´s unit, Ottoman replacement for troop transporter, since they still used galleys/galleasses, even with slaves at this time

For the SoL´s I thought it would make sense to use the ranking system of the Royal Navy, so I made
SoL 1st rate: Kraken´s Ship of the Line
SoL 2nd rate: the standard SoL
SoL 3rd rate: the former ManOWar
Frigate (which would be 4th rate AFAIK) is unchanged

I also changed the availability of some ships, those countries rather known as land powers do not get eg. 1st rate SoL´s, and they´ll get transporters with lower capacity (used the caravel as brigg here).

Coastal battery: uses the PTW fire cannon from the "extras" folder, range 2, lethal naval bombardment, but very expensive and immobile. Should represent heavy guns of coastal fortresses, some of them are preplaced on strategic spots (eg. Gibraltar, Bosporus etc.)

Grenadier: from Steph´s Cossacks collection, for several countries. Currently their names sound a bit stupid, I named them Genadier A, Grenadier P, E etc. where the Letters indicate the country (P-Prussia, A-Austria etc), because it is not possible to use the same name for diff. units in the editor. Maybe I´ll solve that by using something like Royal Grenadiers (English), Koeniglicher Grenadier (Prussia) etc. - if one has good ideas here, let me know :)

There are still some slots to replace, however. Maybe I´ll give the bigger powers both standard cav and Hussars, since Hussars were widely used, not only by Austria (the Austrian could be still UU with bettter stats)

I think it was embryodead who got the idea to name units with spaces in their names. "Grenadier" is not the same as "Grenadier " with a space in the name, but it looks the same in the game. :)

I think the French deserve Privateers more than the British. The British had the largest navy... the French had to scrounge up vessels and crews where they could. They employed a lot of privateers as a certain movie that recently came out will show... :mischief:

I think it was embryodead who got the idea to name units with spaces in their names. "Grenadier" is not the same as "Grenadier " with a space in the name, but it looks the same in the game.

Didn´t know, sounds like a good solution.

However, just solved it a bit different. I have now a generic "Grenadier" unit for several smaller powers, which comes late in the game as well as a specific "Garde-Grenadier" (Garde=Guard) for Prussia, and a "K.K. Grenadier" for Austria. K.K. (known alsoas K.u.K.) is used for Austrian units of the 18/19th century often, it means "Kaiserlich-Königlich" which refers to the fact that the rulers of Austria had both the title of king and emperor (in German "König" bzw. "Kaiser").

I also gave most countries two types of cav - light (cossacks, hussars) and heavy (cuirassiers, imperial french, household, dragoons, carabiniers.

However, I always use the existing units for this (guards_infantry for the grenadiers, cavalry for the various heavy cav types), just their stats are different. I don´t want this to be a full scale napolenic scn, just a modification to increase the fun of the existing conquest :)

Originally posted by BeBro

Grenadier: from Steph´s Cossacks collection, for several countries. Currently their names sound a bit stupid, I named them Genadier A, Grenadier P, E etc. where the Letters indicate the country (P-Prussia, A-Austria etc), because it is not possible to use the same name for diff. units in the editor. Maybe I´ll solve that by using something like Royal Grenadiers (English), Koeniglicher Grenadier (Prussia) etc. - if one has good ideas here, let me know :)

First, Cossacks grenadier are not historically accurate for Napoleonic wars : they only regiment which was still using with kind of head gear was the Russian Pavlov Regiment.

Second, there is a way to have several unis with the same name : just use Civ3 Multi tools, make n copies of your grenadier, and keep the name.

Originally posted by Steph

First, Cossacks grenadier are not historically accurate for Napoleonic wars : they only regiment which was still using with kind of head gear was the Russian Pavlov Regiment.


Yeah, I finally decided against using it, although I planned it earlier. I use the guards infantry now for Prussia and Austria too ;)

Would you need some improvement on my current Napoleonic units to include them ? Because apart from quality they fit in much better than Cossack units which refer to earlier ones.
BTW statusperfect made a Napoleonic Portuguese rifleman (non c&P) that can be found at CDG.

Well, as said I don´t want this to be a big, historically correct Napoleon project, then I should make much more changes than I currently have done. But this would distract me from my other stuff too much (X-COM update for C3C, doing units etc.) ;)

For historical accuracy I look forward to this big Napoleon scn already in the works -- I think you know what I mean ;)