so, you get ONLY ONE nomination for this title- who would you say is the SINGLE coolest dude (or dudette ;)) in all history...

for me its a tough choice- part of me wants to go with Caesar, Julius that is ;), another part want Xenphon to be cool dude elect, other choices would be Scipio Africanus, or Regulus... I'll decide a bit later though, after I can see some of the others guys choices, and reasonings behind them

Part of me says Wellington because he made some great comments down the years he served in the wars he fought :D But people might think I'm obsessive.... which I kinda am :D So I'll go with him, an example being at the congress of Vienna, some French officers turned their backs on Wellington in disgust at their countries defeat. An austrian lady attempted to stop an incident by appologising. Wellington simply replied "That's quite alright my lady, I've seen their backs before" :goodjob:

Honourable mentions for me go to Churchill, Tantham Warner (bloke at Arnhem Bridge with the umbrella), Frederick the Great and Lincoln :)

if we were going by quotes alone it would be socrates who would win (or, if we were going for comedy, several 20th century american republic officials ;))

None of whom had an unbeaten string of victories against a wide range of opponents, unlike Wellington, were kings, unlike Frederick, guided their country through war with a greater power, unlike Churchill, or had the British eccentricity to carry an umbrella on a battlefield like Tantham Warner :p

I could no doubt think of others, but Wellington thrashed most of his opponents, had excellent quotes, outfought Napoleon and knew when to quit when his political career failed. Considering his father thought he was "not very clever", he achieved a lot :D

yeah, but was he COOL? :p

I've a list:

1.Ramesses II
2.Narmer
3.Alexander the Great
4.Gaius Julius Caesar
5.Sun Tzu
6.Socrates
7.Ghandi

Originally posted by Xen
yeah, but was he COOL? :p

Yup, the quotes show it :p

Besides, he inspired a boot! What more could you ask for? ;)

Alexander The Great -or- Darius I

Rommel?
Hannibal?
Count Dracul? :-)

I think the coolest anonimous dude ever would surely be the Chinese student with white bags in front of the tank. I mean, was he brave and cool, or what?

Genghis Khan without a doubt.

Napoleon had some pretty cool quotes, Erwin von Rommel had a cool attitude, and so did Gaius Julius Caeser, Alexander, Churchill and many others.
And lets not forget Kruschev, with his sterical scandals... :lol:

Xen, can't you make this a poll? We all named enough candidates to make quite an impressive list.

And MoCo, indeed Genghis should be on the list too.

By the way, have anyone of you ever heard of the mad baron? I can't remember his name now. But he was an Austrian baron who fought in the Russian army. It was around 1920, I believe. I have a book about him, but I can't find it at the moment.
He eventually went to Mongolia and there he became sort of a demigod, claiming to be the reincarnation of Genghis. The Mongolians believed this, because he also had the facial features of the Kahn (although I find that hard to believe, Austrian guy looking like a Mongolian guy?). With the Mongolian forces he tried to reconquer some territories lost to the SU. He was so feared by his own men, because everybody faling him was tortured, burned and all that sort of things. Then after a major defeat at the hands of the Red Army his own men were tired of him and hoped the
at they would be left aloine by the Russians if they weren't lead by the baron anymore.
They tied him up to a tree and left him there. Probably a week later Russian scouts noticed him and didn't dare to come close to him. He was raging like the devil himself and they were also frightened by the stories they heard about the baron. They literally waited for the regular troops to come and then a couple of 'brave' men dared to untie him and take him with them.

I think he was pretty cool too! I think I will look that book up today and give you the name of him.

I already found him, eh, well the book!

His name was Baron Roman von Ungern-Sternberg. He was born in Graz, Austria, on Januari 10 1886. But his family owned many lands in the Baltic states, dating back to the Teutonic Order, so he moved there. He already fought in the Russian-Turkish was of 1877-1878. Then he went to a madhouse in 1899 (cool, hahaha). In 1903 he went to a navy school. And in 1904 he fought against Japan. He then became an officer with the Cossacks. He was fired, because of a fight he had with another officer, whom gave him a big scar in the face with the slash of a sable.
He wandered the forests of Manchuria, living of the hunt. In 1911 a little war broke out between Mongolia and China. He offered his services to the Mongolians and became the commander of the cavalry.
In the WW1 he became an officer for the Cossacks again and fought many battles with them. With the Revolution he went back to Mongolia fighting against the Red Army. Mongolia was however occupied by the Chinese. He defeated them and then became the reincarnation of the Kahn, in Mongolian eyes. He then wanted to build a big Asian state with the Mongolians as leaders to fight off the commies and even the Germans (it was still 1917). With the white army of Russians and the Mongolian cavalry he went to fight the Red Army, but was then defeated and then all the things in my last post happened.

In the book there are also stories about him, how he would crawl to the German side, cutting barbwire underway, and singlehandedly brought back German prisoners. How far this is true, we don't know of course, but the myth is cool, anyway!

Ooooh...good one. I'm split, so I'll ignore the one and only one requirement.

Napoleon definately had the style; all he was missing was cool sunglasses, which I'm sure he'd wear if they were available back then. However, when it comes to cool as in "somebody I'd want to hang out with on a streetcorner" cool, I'd have to go with Frederick the Great. Napoleon seems like the kind of guy who would just keep talking about himself in a condescending way. With Frederick, I could always talk about philosophy or, um, potatoes.

Napoleon is cool even by today's standards. He's got that "I'm invincible" attitude, the loose fitting clothes, because he's so short, and the rapper hands-down-the-pants style.

My opinion goes like this-

1. Ghandi(he kicked ass without even trying. too cool)
2. Genghis khan(did what he wanted to. Didn't care about anyone else. Selfishness is cool nowadays)
3. Napoleon.
4. Hannibal
5. That roman general who decided to use flaming pigs to fight elephants.

1. Athorilanta
2. T. Mrowiec III
3. S. Stopenski I

Nikita Chrushtshev, that guy was truly cool.

1) Jesus, the perfect human being.
2) Abraham Lincoln
3) Martin Luther

No, wait a minute, I got it. The truly coolest dude ever is still alive. It is the former Iraqi minister of foreign affairs, Shariff (spelled correctly?)!
Man, telling the press with a steel face that the situation is under control while enemy tanks are driving by in the background! If that isn't cool, then I don't know what is.

Genghis Khan, he did whatever he wanted.

Originally posted by puglover
1) Jesus, the perfect human being.


only in the opinion of the christians, and offshoot groups- I for one think he is amoung the worse people in the world- for not making it clear what he meant in his words, and bringing utter hell on the world because of it

Major warning for trolling Christians. - XIII

Coolest of the cool was Diogenes.

Diogenes was the original cynic, totally independent and sure of himself. Never desired a thing, completely laid back dude. Alexander the Great once came to meet him because he had heard so much about him and found Diogenes sitting in his tub in the sun. Alexander the Great offered Diogenes anything in the world, any service that he wanted. And what did Diogenes say?
"Hey man, could you step out of my sun?"
Totally cool. And to this Alexander the Great replied "If I were not Alexander the Great, I should wish to be Diogenes."

When the man that has conquered the entire world by the age of 18 wishes he were you, you know you are cool.

Originally posted by Pirate
Coolest of the cool was Diogenes.

Diogenes was the original cynic, totally independent and sure of himself. Never desired a thing, completely laid back dude. Alexander the Great once came to meet him because he had heard so much about him and found Diogenes sitting in his tub in the sun. Alexander the Great offered Diogenes anything in the world, any service that he wanted. And what did Diogenes say?
"Hey man, could you step out of my sun?"
Totally cool. And to this Alexander the Great replied "If I were not Alexander the Great, I should wish to be Diogenes."

When the man that has conquered the entire world by the age of 18 wishes he were you, you know you are cool.



I wonder how much of this legend happened really. And Alexander was not 18 when he conquered the whole world and it was not the whole world. He himself said that there are so many world out there and he could not even conquer one. Probably a myth too, him saying that...
We all love to believe those famous last words, sayings and all that. But unfortunately 99% of them never happened or were never said. It was just written down by mostly admirers of their time to make them even more legendary or by later historians who made it up in a time history was based even more on interpretations rather then facts as it does today.

Good point, most of our accounts of Alexander's remarks are no more proveable than the words of Jesus. Considering some of these accounts are considered something of a work of his spin doctor style historian it's anyone's guess as to what Alexander actually did and said.

I read he rallied his troops by making obscen gestures at the enemy with a pickle- and considering his youth, and the fact that such a thing is just to absured not to be, I think it might be true :)

Xen, are you an idiot or something? Your "perfect" Rome ( :rolleyes: ) has records of crusifieing (spelling? not native speaker) a man named Jesus and there are secular records of a man named Jesus mysteriously coming out a grave. Jesus' message could not be clearer! The message is that he is the son of God and that he loves you so much that he died for you, and he begs you to just trust in him and you can enter heaven. You are the definition of a pagan, Xen. What "hell" has Jesus Christ brought on the world, exactly? :rolleyes: :p. Is your ancient cult not respected?

No name-calling pls. - XIII

@Packer-Backer - Your calling Xen an idiot? Perhaps you should read your own posts.

What have I done? Are a few typos by a non-native speaker a sign of an idiot? :p

Idiot is too strong a word, narrow-minded would be a better term for him I think :)

Xen: To be fair most of what we know about alexander on campaign though either draws directly from his historian or books based on the writings of his historians or his generals. Alexander seemed to have more than a slight talent for what we would now call spin. Quite what Alexander said and did is more often than not open for question. It always will be, more often than not these quotes are either innacurate or attributed as an afterthought I imagine.

PB: I find it amusing you refer to the roman and greek religions as "ancient cults" when that was precisely what Judaism and Christianity began as and remained for quite some time.

I think Puglover's nomination of Luther is a good one. Here is a monk who turned the western world upside down. Archemides would be another, losing his sense of place enough to be running naked down the street. That's cool.

J

I agree, Luther was a great man. Maybe Archimedes invented the nudist colony? ;)

Originally posted by Xen


only in the opinion of the christians, and offshoot groups- I for one think he is amoung the worse people in the world- for not making it clear what he meant in his words, and bringing utter hell on the world because of it

:o

I think I owe Packer-Backer a bit of an apology. I didn't see Xen's post related to Christians until just now, and I can see why Packer-Backer would be so angry.

Xen, you should watch what you say... if I were a Christian, I'd be kinda pissed if I saw this post.

PB: I find it amusing you refer to the roman and greek religions as "ancient cults" when that was precisely what Judaism and Christianity began as and remained for quite some time.

Thats one of the main reasons Christianity spread throughout the Roman Empire so quickly, the Romans were cult freaks. They would go from cult to cult picking which one was in style and trendy at the time, then these odd Christians come along and the Emperor totally hates them and starts killing them off, isn't that the coolest thing? I gotta become a Christian, its the thing to be!

Originally posted by onejayhawk
I think Puglover's nomination of Luther is a good one. Here is a monk who turned the western world upside down. Archemides would be another, losing his sense of place enough to be running naked down the street. That's cool.

J



And Archimedes was around and witnessed one of the coolest wars ever: the Punic Wars. And he also met some cool generals of that time.

I think this is too difficult a task. We can better name one for every era. One ancient cool dude, one medieval, one gunpowder era and finally a modern era dude.

My 4 dudes would be:
Ancient: Archimedes
Middle Ages: Leifur Eriksson
Gunpowder: Piet Heyn
Modern: Baron Roman von Ungern-Sternberg

Piet Heyn was the most famous Dutch pirate and he captured the biggest Spanish treasure ever, the Silverfleet. And not on some accidently voyage, no, he just sailed boldly to one of the most heavily fortified towns of that time in the Carinean, Havana. Sailed into the harbour, met with the governor, demanding the silver. His fleet was smaller, mind you.
The governor said no, of course. He stabbed the governor and his present soldiers. Walked calmly back to the harbour, entered his ship, made gestures and manouvres as if he was making ready to leave. But actually pointing all of his guns at the enemy ships. Fired all cannons at once and crippled the guard ships of the fleet and took the silver-transports with him, all the way to Amsterdam.

Originally posted by Packer-Backer
Xen, are you an idiot or something? Your "perfect" Rome ( :rolleyes: ) has records of crusifieing (spelling? not native speaker) a man named Jesus and there are secular records of a man named Jesus mysteriously coming out a grave. Jesus' message could not be clearer! The message is that he is the son of God and that he loves you so much that he died for you, and he begs you to just trust in him and you can enter heaven. You are the definition of a pagan, Xen. What "hell" has Jesus Christ brought on the world, exactly? :rolleyes: :p. Is your ancient cult not respected?


dont be my hero, I never claimed Rome was perfect- its far from in many respects- but its achiments warrent admeration, and emulation in the things they did get right.

as for christianity- then why, after chrsitianity, the self proclaimed religion of peace, were there a thousand years of bloodshed and tyranny in its name? seem pretty damn obvious to me that either A)everything he said was utter bull****, or B)if he did have some sort of a message to give, he obviouslly couldnt express himself well enough to get it through his followers heads right, not to mention the whole claiming to be the son of a god thing.

as my religion- pagans are the frest barbarians- christianity is more pagan in that regars then most religions everhave been, or will be

Warned again, for same. - XIII

as for christianity- then why, after chrsitianity, the self proclaimed religion of peace, were there a thousand years of bloodshed and tyranny in its name?

Thank the Catholic Church for that up to the 1500s :)

Greek Orthadox and the later advent of the protestant subgroup of chrstiainty werent very peachy eithert (that said, of all the christian groups, I suppose, while I dont feel a connection with any of them I feel most at ease with the Greek orthadox, and the Catholics)

Post on-topic, Xen. Thou wouldst threadjack thee own thread?

sorry, I just sort of saw the post as an offshoot argument of the whole jesus thing, I'll stop though, if they will

The coolest guy in history? Willis Haviland Carrier. He developed the formula that made air conditioning possible. :p

Nah, I'll go with Edward Teach. That guy was cool. Before battle, he braided his hair into pigtails and tucked slow-burning matches in them. He supposedly suffered 25 major wounds in his final fight before being decapitated and his body (which was thrown overboard) swam around the enemy's ship three times before sinking.

"May hell seize my soul if I give you quarter or take any from you."

Most pirates were cool if a little... violent yes :D

Originally posted by Tavenier




I wonder how much of this legend happened really. And Alexander was not 18 when he conquered the whole world and it was not the whole world. He himself said that there are so many world out there and he could not even conquer one. Probably a myth too, him saying that...
We all love to believe those famous last words, sayings and all that. But unfortunately 99% of them never happened or were never said. It was just written down by mostly admirers of their time to make them even more legendary or by later historians who made it up in a time history was based even more on interpretations rather then facts as it does today.

Wow people are such sticklers in the History forums. So I took a little liberty with the 18 years old thing, but the story is cool and Diogenes attitude was cool. Actually the whole story is probably made up since it supposedly happened in a totally different city then where Diogenes lived in his tub (and he wouldn't have dragged the tub wherever he went). Anyway, maybe my point should have been if you are cool enough to have a cool story about you last for centuries and still be cool, then you are cool.

Keith Richards.

Originally posted by Pirate


Wow people are such sticklers in the History forums. So I took a little liberty with the 18 years old thing, but the story is cool and Diogenes attitude was cool. Actually the whole story is probably made up since it supposedly happened in a totally different city then where Diogenes lived in his tub (and he wouldn't have dragged the tub wherever he went). Anyway, maybe my point should have been if you are cool enough to have a cool story about you last for centuries and still be cool, then you are cool.


I know what you mean. Sorry for being so serious! :)

Most legends/stories/myths make history so interesting. And at some universities they even teach the subject 'legends and myths'. Not to only tell about them, but also how they evolved and stuff.

One of the most illogical myths of Holland is the following. Right after Napoleon left for a permanent holiday to Elba (fortunately for Wellington it was not so permanent, otherwise he would not be so well known today) Belgium, Luxembourg and Holland became one country. Then the Belgians wanted to be independent. A little war followed, largely fought at sea. A Dutch fleetcommander was surrounded on his flagship, which held crucial information. He fought like a lion till the Belgian soldiers entered his ship. He ran to the ammo-storage and waited till there were many enemy ships closeby and a lot of Belgian sailors on board. Then he said the following: Dan liever de lucht in! <I'd rather be blown to pieces!> and fired a shot at the gunpowder, after which the ship exploded taking with it some Belgian ships.

Who was the guy hearing him say those words? Did he survived the blast, which every other person for a hundred meters around didn't?

You'll stop If I'll stop, Xen. :lol: Can't we talk civilized for a second? The Catholic church is evil. First it was established for all the wrong reasons, then it was sort of unlucky because of the timing in which it was most prominent, but it continued to kill hundreds of thousands if not a few million innocent reformists. Look at Jesus' message, it is the most clear message ever. And what the Catholic church has done is so obviously denounced in the teachings of Jesus it isn't funny. Besides, the Catholic church isn't exactly a form of Christianity, Christianity means excepted Jesus as your savior, but most of the Catholic church leaders think of Jesus as a high ranking angel, not the messiah. And you have to admit, forgiving those who killed you and those who despised you is pretty cool.

Now my ten most un-cool people of all time:
1. Lenin, what more can I say, he caused the deaths of millions upon millions upon millions of innocent people who only wanted the freedom that they were promised.
2. Muhammad. I don't want a ban. :p
3. Iosef Stalin. Do you even have to ask?
4. Adolf Hitler. Do you even have to ask?
5. Nero. Burned his own city and then blamed the Christians.
6. Uday Hussein. He tortured his soccer players when they were too hurt to play. I'll spare you the rest of his horrific evil.
7. Saddam Hussein. Do you even have to ask?
8. Osama bin Laden. Do you even have to ask?
9. Napoleon. He isn't cool, they is some evidence that he was a Satanist, he was probably a communist early on the revolution but then turned into an emperor, and was more imperialistic than even those kings of Europe who he hated.
10. Whoever was the woman that accepted Solomon's test to cut the baby in half. Not only was she stupid but who can you even think of something like that?

Isn't the coolest guy Joe Dimagio? Not only was he married to Marilyn Monroe and a great baseball player, lets not discuss Mr Coffee, but at the present time, if I recall correctly, he is submerged in liquid helium, a very cool temperature, awaiting revival when medical science moves forward enough. Who is cooler than liquid helium?

Even Scott, the antarictic explorer whose party was second to the south pole, was probably only about 30 degrees below zero. Cool but not as cool as Dimagio.

My list of coolest atheletes!:

1. Secretariat. He may not be human but he is the best.
2. Pete Marovich.
3. Brett Favre.
4. Lou Gehrig. Now that's keeping your cool. :cool: Poor guy.
5. Joe DiMaggio.
6. Jeff Gordon.
7. Don Hudson.
8. Jason Kidd.
9. Reggie White.
10. Monarchos! It's a very odd inside joke. ;)

And now my list of coolist musicians!

1. Ted Nugent
2-10. Ted Nugent.

His right-wing rhetoric makes me smile. :)

Originally posted by Packer-Backer
You'll stop If I'll stop, Xen. :lol: Can't we talk civilized for a second? The Catholic church is evil. First it was established for all the wrong reasons, then it was sort of unlucky because of the timing in which it was most prominent, but it continued to kill hundreds of thousands if not a few million innocent reformists. Look at Jesus' message, it is the most clear message ever. And what the Catholic church has done is so obviously denounced in the teachings of Jesus it isn't funny. Besides, the Catholic church isn't exactly a form of Christianity, Christianity means excepted Jesus as your savior, but most of the Catholic church leaders think of Jesus as a high ranking angel, not the messiah. And you have to admit, forgiving those who killed you and those who despised you is pretty cool.

Now my ten most un-cool people of all time:
1. Lenin, what more can I say, he caused the deaths of millions upon millions upon millions of innocent people who only wanted the freedom that they were promised.
2. Muhammad. I don't want a ban. :p
3. Iosef Stalin. Do you even have to ask?
4. Adolf Hitler. Do you even have to ask?
5. Nero. Burned his own city and then blamed the Christians.
6. Uday Hussein. He tortured his soccer players when they were too hurt to play. I'll spare you the rest of his horrific evil.
7. Saddam Hussein. Do you even have to ask?
8. Osama bin Laden. Do you even have to ask?
9. Napoleon. He isn't cool, they is some evidence that he was a Satanist, he was probably a communist early on the revolution but then turned into an emperor, and was more imperialistic than even those kings of Europe who he hated.
10. Whoever was the woman that accepted Solomon's test to cut the baby in half. Not only was she stupid but who can you even think of something like that?



And you fail to mention the biggest murderer of all time, Mao Zedong? The guy who never washed, but every night wanted to quench himself with a new virgin? The guy who made on of the greatest nations of this world a beggar? The man who defied the world by telling that if half his population was killed by US atomic bombs he still would have 300 million left to fight (showing complete disrespect fr his own people)? And so forth.

Originally posted by Packer-Backer
You'll stop If I'll stop, Xen. :lol: Can't we talk civilized for a second? The Catholic church is evil. First it was established for all the wrong reasons, then it was sort of unlucky because of the timing in which it was most prominent, but it continued to kill hundreds of thousands if not a few million innocent reformists. Look at Jesus' message, it is the most clear message ever. And what the Catholic church has done is so obviously denounced in the teachings of Jesus it isn't funny. Besides, the Catholic church isn't exactly a form of Christianity, Christianity means excepted Jesus as your savior, but most of the Catholic church leaders think of Jesus as a high ranking angel, not the messiah. And you have to admit, forgiving those who killed you and those who despised you is pretty cool.

Now my ten most un-cool people of all time:
1. Lenin, what more can I say, he caused the deaths of millions upon millions upon millions of innocent people who only wanted the freedom that they were promised.
2. Muhammad. I don't want a ban. :p
3. Iosef Stalin. Do you even have to ask?
4. Adolf Hitler. Do you even have to ask?
5. Nero. Burned his own city and then blamed the Christians.
6. Uday Hussein. He tortured his soccer players when they were too hurt to play. I'll spare you the rest of his horrific evil.
7. Saddam Hussein. Do you even have to ask?
8. Osama bin Laden. Do you even have to ask?
9. Napoleon. He isn't cool, they is some evidence that he was a Satanist, he was probably a communist early on the revolution but then turned into an emperor, and was more imperialistic than even those kings of Europe who he hated.
10. Whoever was the woman that accepted Solomon's test to cut the baby in half. Not only was she stupid but who can you even think of something like that?

Why is Mohammed above Hitler and Stalin?

I must agree, Mao Should come just below Adolf or Nero. He was just plain evil!:mad:

the Fonz

The Catholic church is evil. First it was established for all the wrong reasons, then it was sort of unlucky because of the timing in which it was most prominent, but it continued to kill hundreds of thousands if not a few million innocent reformists. Look at Jesus' message, it is the most clear message ever. And what the Catholic church has done is so obviously denounced in the teachings of Jesus it isn't funny. Besides, the Catholic church isn't exactly a form of Christianity, Christianity means excepted Jesus as your savior, but most of the Catholic church leaders think of Jesus as a high ranking angel, not the messiah. And you have to admit, forgiving those who killed you and those who despised you is pretty cool.

If the qualification for the Catholic church being evil is it's killing of millions of innocent people then it's easy enough to throw that argument back, the protestant church killed "hundreds of thousands if not a few million" native americans and other indiginous peoples wherever they colonised. Meanwhile church leaders and protestant people were busy espousing theories that they were not even human, which I imagine was directly against the teachings of Jesus, who prefferred inclusion to genocide. By the logic you put forward, the protestant church is evil. :)

(please note, I do not believe this theory on the churches myself, just reversing the logic)

Also from what I read, it's at least up for debate as to if Nero burnt rome on purpose. I also find it interesting that you believe Napoleon evil, but not for the slaughter he caused, but for his religious and political beliefs and hypocricy. :confused:

Well said privatehudson. I would also add that there are worse people than Uday Hussein, Saddam Hussein, and Osama bin Laden.

Possibly, but those are his choices... I'd personally add the likes of some of the conquistadores and Andrew Jackson, they wouldn't make a top 10, but they were as if not more evil than OBL for example.

I think Josef Mengele, the nazi scientist, would also score high. He was the guy asking for Jewish twins so he could conduct researsch on them. The first was then injected with some disease and the other with just water, or some other harless fluid, and then he would observe them. And he did all kinds of experiments on Jews.
Strange and really absurd thing is that his research did help the medical world, albeit in a truly barbaric manner.

5. Nero. Burned his own city and then blamed the Christians.

He didn't burn Rome, that was a widly accepted rumor the Romans took to because of their dislike for his reign.

I'd personally add the likes of some of the conquistadores

If your gonna add them, you shouldn't leave out the Central/South Americian civilizations, they turned human sacrifice and cannibalism into an industry.

9. Napoleon. He isn't cool, they is some evidence that he was a Satanist, he was probably a communist early on the revolution but then turned into an emperor, and was more imperialistic than even those kings of Europe who he hated.

Hehe, he's the only Frenchman I respect :)

And a Satanist? Then labal the rest of Europe that with their infatuation with the Occult during the 1700 and 1800s.

I'm really getting the vibe your look on right/wrong is very black and white :)

There is a line of thought that Napoleon I was not French. He was Corsican, which today would be, I think, Italian. Of course he served in the French army and was head of state, and is burried in France, but one of his wives was Austrian, and his first wife was from Haiti, If I recall correctly. His son was "King of Rome". One of his brothers served as King of Naples and then as King of Spain.

Ted Williams is the coolest athlete in history! :lol:

This man, Richard "Demo Dick" Marcinko, Founder of SEAL Team Six and about as cool as you can get.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/demo_dick.jpg

Why is Ted Williams "the coolest athlete in history?" Generally speaking this sort of assertion should have some proof offered. Among baseball players why is he better than Babe Ruth, who also was a pretty good pitcher, or Dimagio, or any number of very good hitters. Yes, he was the last modern player to bat .400. But are baseball players "athletes"? How about a decathalon runner/jumper/thrower, or biker like Lance Armstrong. Those guys sweat. Half the game ballplayers sit down (when the other side is in the field and they aren't batting or on base.) Soccer players run all game long. (not the goalie) Water polo is lots more violent than baseball, or almost any other sport with the opportunity to drown thrown in to make it more interesting. And boxing-- cooler than mohamad ali? A white guy who can't jump?

Please offer some evidence or reasons or atleast attempt a justification. History includes a lot of athletes in a lot of sports. I doubt Ted Willaims is the cooles athlete who ever played for the Boston Red Sox, never mind in history. (Babe Ruth was a Red Sock before the trade to the Yankees. And they have had some pretty fair players since them.

If your gonna add them, you shouldn't leave out the Central/South Americian civilizations, they turned human sacrifice and cannibalism into an industry.

It's much harder to pick out individual people in this though, I went for the conquistadores because they were easier to pick the individuals out without whom the sucess of the genocide they launched would be less likely.

Originally posted by barron of ideas
Why is Ted Williams "the coolest athlete in history?" Generally speaking this sort of assertion should have some proof offered. Among baseball players why is he better than Babe Ruth, who also was a pretty good pitcher, or Dimagio, or any number of very good hitters. Yes, he was the last modern player to bat .400. But are baseball players "athletes"? How about a decathalon runner/jumper/thrower, or biker like Lance Armstrong. Those guys sweat. Half the game ballplayers sit down (when the other side is in the field and they aren't batting or on base.) Soccer players run all game long. (not the goalie) Water polo is lots more violent than baseball, or almost any other sport with the opportunity to drown thrown in to make it more interesting. And boxing-- cooler than mohamad ali? A white guy who can't jump?

Please offer some evidence or reasons or atleast attempt a justification. History includes a lot of athletes in a lot of sports. I doubt Ted Willaims is the cooles athlete who ever played for the Boston Red Sox, never mind in history. (Babe Ruth was a Red Sock before the trade to the Yankees. And they have had some pretty fair players since them.


Then call him the best athlete of AMERICAN history. I have never heard of the guy. Only baseballeplayer I ever heard of was Babe Ruth. The biggest sport in the world is football/soccer. And the best guy at that ever was Pele from Brazil.

I'll have to go with Baghdad Bob..

He was hilarious, and really should look at a career in motivational speaking

I forget about Mao Zedong (Or whoever it is spelled), I don't know how I did. But Napoleon, that great Frenchman, oh what, Corsican(!), was a real, well a-hole. He accused those other kings as imperialistic but look at him! There's just something about him that rubs me the wrong way. But still, Lenin is the worst person of all time. There has not been a single minority, religion, or other person who wasn't a mindless drone that has not been tortured or murdered in some way. Just looking at pictures of him he looks evil. In no way was he just a charamatic politician or anything less than a cool blooded murderer. I could go on and on about how much I hate him, but everyone on my worst 10 would definently be in my new worst 30 list. But I would need to look into how much each human devil did before I could rank them. So don't ask why someone is on my list, I'll never stop bad-mouthing!

uhm why lenin and not stalin? Packer backer its still about the coolest guy in history man :p
anyway i choose that austrian baron guy.

I'd say that it was Lincoln, since he was cool enough to free the slaves. I think it was someone elso who signed the 14th Ammendment, but it never would have happened had it not been for Lincoln.

Lenin started it, simply put. But #2 on my list is now Vladimir "Dracule" Tepes, Count of Wallachia. He was Dracula (Dracule-Dragon/Devil) and he used Strigoii (werewolves) quite often. He impaled 1/5 of his own population. And sometimes stuck a round-topped stick (harder to impale someone) up some peoples' butts, it took them days to die and they usually died of starvation, but at the end the stick came out through their shoulder. How would you like to be impaled on your own weights?!?!

My newest "coolest" (not best) person in history: The Fonz! Who else could it be? ;)

Originally posted by Packer-Backer
Lenin started it, simply put. But #2 on my list is now Vladimir "Dracule" Tepes, Count of Wallachia. He was Dracula (Dracule-Dragon/Devil) and he used Strigoii (werewolves) quite often. He impaled 1/5 of his own population. And sometimes stuck a round-topped stick (harder to impale someone) up some peoples' butts, it took them days to die and they usually died of starvation, but at the end the stick came out through their shoulder. How would you like to be impaled on your own weights?!?!

My newest "coolest" (not best) person in history: The Fonz! Who else could it be? ;)


Vlad the Impaler was indeed quite an infamous character. Legend says he drank blood of his opponents. I don't know about impaling his own citizens, but I do know he defeated a Turkish army and the captured soldiers (legend tells of 100.000 men, but it probably was around 10.000 men) were all impaled and he had them all in one place and he liked to walk through it. As if it was some sort of really macabre forest.
His favourite 'pets' indeed were wolves and mix that with an enormous amount of bats found in his lands and there you have a legend we all know.

Exactly, Tavenier. But he did kill his own people, a whole lot of them. He also would sometimes eat dinner near his impaled citizens or enemies, and dip his bread in the blood of victim then eat it. European kings calling Napoleon the Corsican devil is moronic compared to not calling Vlad the Wallachian devil.

Id say it was me ;)

Besides that id go with Either Napoleon or Churchill.

Gandhi was a smooth dude.

not to everyone, he got shot.

Originally posted by Syterion
5. That roman general who decided to use flaming pigs to fight elephants.

A roman emporer did use pigs to fight elephants, but the flaming pigs comes here:
The most frequently told tale concerning pigs as a counter weapon to elephants may be represented by Aelian and Polyaenus: when Antigonas Gonatas was besieging Megara, the Megarians succeeded in routing the besiegers’ elephants by dousing pigs in oil and igniting them and then turning them loose against the elephants. One might object that this is hardly a fair test of the elephant’s reaction to pigs per se; but both authors specifically state that the beasts were startled by the squeal rather than by the fire. The flames were simply a means of guaranteeing a satisfactory squeal. As a final instance of the effect of pigs on elephants in battle, it is feasible to examine Procopius’ account of events at Edessa. The city was being besieged by Chosroes, and an elephant with many soldiers on its back was driven up to the city wall and towered over it. The resourceful inhabitants thrust a squealing pig over the wall and into the face of the looming elephant. The result was panic and retreat.19 Altogether the pig seems to have been quite an effective weapon against the elephant, although its use does not appear to have been widespread in the ancient world.
Certainly a cool tale :cool:
source (http://www.clickfire.com/viewpoints/articles/political/elephants.php)

Da Vinci. Too much. How can such a man be possible?

Originally posted by Sean Lindstrom
Da Vinci. Too much. How can such a man be possible?


Da Vinci certainly would score high (maybe highest) on the most intelligent and versatile man in history. Don't know if he was cool though.

Genghis Khan or Alexander the Great.

Tom Paine...at least 150 years ahead of his time, genuinly believed that what he advocated would be the solution to the troubles of everyone, not just a select few. Had the guts to out it into practice and came mighty close.

Originally posted by Gingerbread Man


A roman emporer did use pigs to fight elephants, but the flaming pigs comes here:

Certainly a cool tale :cool:
source (http://www.clickfire.com/viewpoints/articles/political/elephants.php)

They need a counter-unit in Civ and AOE for the elephant...

THE PIG!!! :D

Alcibiades! He was handsome, athletic, rich, intelligent, but most of all treacherous. I simply love characters who, like rats, will do anything to survive. Another thing that impresses me about Alcibiades is that he would take ridiculous risks but almost always weasled out of the consequences of his actions.

Genghis Khan, Napoleon, Alexander the great, who else tried to conquer the world? Well They are cool, all tried to conquer the Worldand succeded and many places!

I wanna do what they did just better than everyone will say i'm the coolest! (or they won't say anything else anymore ;) )

Corsica is still part of France. Italy owns Sardinia & Sicily. (someone was wondering about this on page 3)

Coolest: Churchill. I forgive him for the Darnelles, Norway, and the smaller things because he said the coolest things ever.

"I may be drunk, but in the morning I will sober and you will still be ugly" (This one is paraphrased)

and

"A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. "

and insulting my country:

"The Americans will always do the right thing... after they've exhausted all the alternatives."

or who could forget

"History will be kind to me for I intend to write it. "

Leanardo da vinchy.

Originally posted by Souron
Leanardo da vinchy.



Don't know him/her! :p

Originally posted by NankingDan
Alcibiades! He was handsome, athletic, rich, intelligent, but most of all treacherous. I simply love characters who, like rats, will do anything to survive. Another thing that impresses me about Alcibiades is that he would take ridiculous risks but almost always weasled out of the consequences of his actions. Alcibiades without a doubt! First he rises, to become a major player in Athenian polotics. Then using his status, convincis Athens to invade Syracuse for no reason at all. He is then run out of Athens for some accused statue defacings(nevermind the disaterous invasion of Syracus). So now, he goes over to Sparta, Athens' mortal enemy. He then becomes "the most Spartan of Spartans" virtually taking up the kings place whilst he is at war with Athens(did I mention Alcabiates instigated this war too). Alright now cut to the Spartan king on some distant battle camp. A messenger comes up and joyously anounces that his wife is about to have a child. The king thiks this is just a tad sucpicious and count up the months since he last saw his wife. Ti has beenten months. The king pomptly turns home, to kill the criminal. Now take a wild guess as to who that man might be. that's right, none other tah Alcibiaties. So alcibiaties gets word of this and leaves Sparta before the king arives. Now at this point most people would be resined to their fate. But no Alcabiaties has one lat trick up his sleeve. He runs off to Persia, and once again rises to a position of power. And he once again insigates a war, this time between the migthy Persian Empire, and the entirerty of Greece. I forget the end of it all, but suffice to say, Alcibiaties was one smooth dude.

My second choice for coolest dide ever would be be Seargent Alvin York.

I'll put forward Arichmedes. Nobody can deny that setting Roman ships on fire with giant mirrors isn't cool.

Originally posted by Xen

for not making it clear what he meant in his words


I am not sure if everything that Jesus Christ said are his own words or later additions or deliberate or not misinterpretations. I might displease some people but I am not even sure if he truly had claimed to be the son of god.

Originally posted by Xen


as for christianity- then why, after chrsitianity, the self proclaimed religion of peace, were there a thousand years of bloodshed and tyranny in its name?


Originally posted by Packer-Backer


The Catholic church is evil. First it was established for all the wrong reasons, then it was sort of unlucky because of the timing in which it was most prominent, but it continued to kill hundreds of thousands if not a few million innocent reformists.


It is not Christianity that is evil, it is those that in the name of God and Christianity having the power in their hands commited attrocities.

Originally posted by SoCalian


Then using his status, convincis Athens to invade Syracuse for no reason at all.


Actually there was a reasoning behind this decission.

Pericles was the first to extend Athenian interests in Sicily and South Italy by making alliances with Greek city-states there that where afraid of the continual rise of power of their neighbor, Syracuse. Pericles took advantage of the situtation to extend Athenian influence. Among his plans was possibly the control of the sea lines from the Italy and Sicily to Greece. In addition with the control of the sea lines from Black Sea and Trace to Greece that Athens already had would cut off Spartans and their allies from valuable routes. Syracuse was an obstacle to that perspective and had a strong navy that could help Spartans hit Atheneans to what they were strong. Their navy.

Taking that in mind Atheneans were in a quite hard possition, facing with the fear of a future alliance between Sparta and Syracuse that could threaten their navy superiority. The debate is whether the Atheneans could handle Syracuse diplomatically or leave the campaign for later times or even making peace with the Spartans.

@Keygen- a religion that inspires people to commit such atrocities in the first place isnt all that peachy any way you want to look at it- it jusrt happens that the various christian denominations have more such atrocities then any other religion that makes people haver it as a constant topic

Otto Von Bismarck

Originally posted by Xen


@Keygen- a religion that inspires people to commit such atrocities in the first place isnt all that peachy any way you want to look at it- it jusrt happens that the various christian denominations have more such atrocities then any other religion that makes people haver it as a constant topic


I don't think there is something within Jesus word that would inspire violence and hate. On the contrary. I've never heared of such inspiration but I might be wrong as I am not expert in religious issues.

However some people that were supposed to mediate God on Earth according to the Christian religion, took advantage of the situation and commited countless atrocities, for power, joy or money. That happened with other religions too. People are stupid or ignorant enough to submit to their weaknesses and fanaticism, making this world a harder place to live.

Vlad the Impalor, only the coolest guy in history could earn such a great title.

Originally posted by Tavenier




Don't know him/her! :p Leonardo da vinci? (I misspelled vinci)

Look Here (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=Leonardo+da+vinci%27s&btnG=Google+Search). He was probobly the only man who could be considered a Renaissance Man.

Though there have been lot of cool dudes in this planet I should mention one for now:

Aristotle

Not only he's one of the very few that had so much wide field of activity but he'd influenced thought for more than 15 centuries.

Originally posted by Unexpected
Vlad the Impalor, only the coolest guy in history could earn such a great title. That is like saying that Hitler was the greatest man ever. I find it simply disgusting that anyone could think of him as the coolest dude ever. If you have any idea of his atrocities, and sheer evil, I'm sure you wouldn't feel this way.

Let's see...

Homeros
Herodotos
Diogenes
Leonides
Copernicus
Galilei
Leonardo da Vinci
William of Orange (nationalistic as I am)
John Locke
Jean Jacques Rousseau
Peter the Great
Montesquieu
Thomas Jefferson
Bismarck
Winston Churchill

I have little sympathy for world conquerors like Alexander, Caesar or Genghis Khan (althoug I admire their accomplishments). How great their conquests may be, they're still waging war and that's not so 'cool'.

Originally posted by Packer-Backer

Now my ten most un-cool people of all time:
1. Lenin, what more can I say, he caused the deaths of millions upon millions upon millions of innocent people who only wanted the freedom that they were promised.
2. Muhammad. I don't want a ban. :p
3. Iosef Stalin. Do you even have to ask?
4. Adolf Hitler. Do you even have to ask?
5. Nero. Burned his own city and then blamed the Christians.
6. Uday Hussein. He tortured his soccer players when they were too hurt to play. I'll spare you the rest of his horrific evil.
7. Saddam Hussein. Do you even have to ask?
8. Osama bin Laden. Do you even have to ask?
9. Napoleon. He isn't cool, they is some evidence that he was a Satanist, he was probably a communist early on the revolution but then turned into an emperor, and was more imperialistic than even those kings of Europe who he hated.
10. Whoever was the woman that accepted Solomon's test to cut the baby in half. Not only was she stupid but who can you even think of something like that?

You defend a religion's founder and then attack another? I do not see why he is not being warned after Xen was. If Xen can't say what he said then by all means Packer-Backer should not be allowed to say what he said. What you said was pure hate, and amazingly hypocritical. In case you didn't know, Islam and Christianity are very similar. They both worship the same God! How could you possibly justify attacking Islam?

I'd say that it was Lincoln, since he was cool enough to free the slaves. I think it was someone elso who signed the 14th Ammendment, but it never would have happened had it not been for Lincoln.

Slavery was abolished in many other civilizations(China, for instance-forget which dynasty-Ming?) long before Lincoln did. He wasn't that great.

(referring to Gandhi)not to everyone, he got shot.

Forget where I heard this, but I remember there is somebody or something that said-

"It's like my father said. Sonner or Later, eveybody gets shot"(talking wistfully)

Hammurabi of Babylonia was a pretty cool dude.

Not that I know him personally.

i would say steve mcqueen or james dean

Originally posted by General Porkins
i would say steve mcqueen or james dean



Who?

Alkibiades was the coolest of them all. Cool as cool can be. Handsome, loaded, bright, extremely well brought up, very capable as a leader in any aspect, is the man that alone sealed the fate of Athens in the pelloponesian war - and he didn't even led one man against his country.

He was also immoral as immoral can be, swift, treacherous and lethal... and a great lover too, who managed to ruin his chances at Sparta (not before winning them the war) by seducing the wife of one of the kings...

Not to mention that his next stop was Persia... where he tried to play the Persians against his own people, for his own gain, and at the same time he was scheming to get back his Athenian citizenship! :rolleyes:

An outrageous person and one that would make a great hero in a Tom Robins book ;)

im not sure if i spelled macqueen right or not...they were actors.

Originally posted by General Porkins
im not sure if i spelled macqueen right or not...they were actors.



I know James Dean but never heard of the Steve guy.

http://members.tripod.com/~stvmcqueen/papi.jpg

there he is...

and here is the site it came from (http://members.tripod.com/~stvmcqueen/)

Originally posted by General Porkins
http://members.tripod.com/~stvmcqueen/papi.jpg

there he is...

and here is the site it came from (http://members.tripod.com/~stvmcqueen/)


I read the list of films. I only know Pappilon. And that was a good one.

i had to take the English Language Arts section of the California High School Exit Exam(CAHSEE) today. The essay topic was to describe a "natural leader". I wrote about Alcibiates.

Common guys aren't you forgetting George W. Bush. :lol:

Anyway, I think I would have to go with Julius Ceaser.

Originally posted by Syterion


You defend a religion's founder and then attack another? I do not see why he is not being warned after Xen was. If Xen can't say what he said then by all means Packer-Backer should not be allowed to say what he said. What you said was pure hate, and amazingly hypocritical. In case you didn't know, Islam and Christianity are very similar. They both worship the same God! How could you possibly justify attacking Islam?



Slavery was abolished in many other civilizations(China, for instance-forget which dynasty-Ming?) long before Lincoln did. He wasn't that great.



Forget where I heard this, but I remember there is somebody or something that said-

"It's like my father said. Sonner or Later, eveybody gets shot"(talking wistfully)
i see a hot topic comeing soon!

Which one?

Solano López. He was a great leader of the Paraguayan people, and tried to make his country industrialized, but failed because of British support of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay to invade it and take him out as a leader. Not to mention his people preferred dying than loose the war(96% of the Paraguayan men died in that war).

I find it hard to fathom how someone can be considered cool when he helped cause 96% of the men in the country to die? :confused:

Alexander the Great. Who else could conquer the known world and not lose a battle in their twenties?

Originally posted by privatehudson
I find it hard to fathom how someone can be considered cool when he helped cause 96% of the men in the country to die? :confused:

Because they died for him. They refused to give up, and that's pretty impressive. If he was a bad leader or even a normal one, the people, wouldn't have cared so much about it.

I still think alcibiates owns all.

Originally posted by Androrc
Solano López. He was a great leader of the Paraguayan people, and tried to make his country industrialized, but failed because of British support of Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay to invade it and take him out as a leader. Not to mention his people preferred dying than loose the war(96% of the Paraguayan men died in that war).
Err.... I think you should read Kafla's article on him - he was a sickening leader.

Here we are: Source (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=46386)
One of the worst rulers of all time, young Francisco watched his father steadily build up Paraguay's military power, and became over-confident. Pausing briefly to marry Eliza Lynch (an Irish prostitute) he started making aggressive interventions in the war between Brazil and Uruguay, which resulted in him declaring war and invading Brazil in 1864. When Argentina refused to allow Paraguayan troops to move through their territory, Lopez declared war on them too. Finally the new Uruguayan puppet government declared war on Paraguay, which meant that Paraguay was at war with nearly all of its neighbours simultaneously, hopelessly outnumbered and out-gunned.
Within two years, suicidal attempts to invade Brazil and Argentina had shattered the Paraguayan army and the country was being invaded from all directions. Massacres and disease decimated the population. Frantic Paraguayan Generals tried to persuade Lopez to seek peace, but he refused to stop fighting and had them all executed (usually by having them tied to anthills to be eaten alive by the ants). When his 70 year old mother and two sisters tried to make him see reason, he had them all repeatedly beaten savagely and kept them nailed into wooden crates, from which they were only removed for further beatings. His two brothers and two brothers-in-law were executed.
Finally, and mercifully, Lopez was killed in battle. The War of the Triple Alliance caused the death of an estimated 80% of Paraguay's population, making it pro rata the bloodiest war ever. By the final days, the Paraguayan army consisted of children as young as six attacking enemy artillery placements with clods of earth.

Because they died for him. They refused to give up, and that's pretty impressive. If he was a bad leader or even a normal one, the people, wouldn't have cared so much about it.

:rolleyes: Interesting logic, I still fail to see why someone's cool for getting his people to die. Thanks gingerbread man, that's perfect. So we have a homicidal lunatic who manages to literally decimate his male population and has no reason.

Yeah. Cool or what? :rolleyes:

Someone else proposed Xenophon. I'll second that proposal.

Xenophon rose from humble beginnings to be acknowledged by all of history for his deeds. He's known primarily for 2 things.

Taking a ragtag group of Greek Mercenaries several thousand miles out of Persia after ALL of their leadership had been murdered. This is a feat of military and logistical genius that IIRC has really never been done since.

After retiring from the life as a mercenary became a prolific writer of essays. Modern historians love Xenophon because he wrote about common things like raising sheep and building houses.

My list is this
1.Rommel
2.Fredrick the Great
3.Carl von Clauswitz
4.Gerhard Blucher
5.Gustav Horn

Johnny America!!!
And if you wonder who that is don't ask.
:rotfl: :rotfl: :splat:

1. Alexander the Great

How can you say that conquering the known world then dying before reaching middle age is not cool?

2. Sun Tzu

Books about how to beat up your enemies are cool.

3. Gaius Julius Caesar

More conquering of the known world.

4. Emperor Trajan

Even more conquering of the known world.

5. Ghengis Khan

Even more conquering. Cool, but with bad teeth.

Do not take anything written here seriously.

Atilla, the Huns were some bada$$ sh!T

just as a note, this is probabley the single longest thread i have ever started and never actually given my opinion on the subject I started it about ;)