http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/images/newlogo1_alt_CFC.jpg

BASIC MOD -> Post #2 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=1574332#post1574332)

EXPANSION PACK -> Post #3 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=1574334#post1574334)


Last update: January 14, 2005: Expansion Pack update v1.23 released

THE BASIC MOD

This modpack attempts to make a realistic and historically correct Civ3 game based on an Earth map. It also seeks to reduce the “time boredom” often caused by large maps.
This is not a scenario: just civs beginning in 4000 B.C in their correct starting locations. If you miss Civ2 world.mp, this is the mod for you!

The aim of this mod is different from other similar modpacks in that it attempts to achieve this being still as close to original game play as possible.
If you have some experience with some mods of this forum (for example DyP and TET's ToT) you'll find that this mod has pretty unique traits. Their philosophy is more units, more techs = more fun, no matter if they are incomplete, redundant or inaccurate.
But what's the difference in having for example a swordsman, a longswordsman, a broadswordsman and a swordswoman?

Instead in this mod any addition of wonders, techs or units has been carefully considered. Nothing was added unless strictly necessary. The tech tree has been slightly edited, there are no inaccurate units (like dinos), and each addition has its own civilopedia entry, just like the original game. No animation has been used twice to represent different units or leaderheads.
This standard of quality applies to the map, too: more cities = more fun is not true! Huge and giga maps are unplayable. The innovative rules, combined with this specific Earth map cut the loading times (even the slowest computers will afford 31 civs in the same time) and make a game with this mod a fast and fun experience.

In brief, this mod features:
· A 170x170 world map made specially for this modpack
· Special rules for speed improvement: loading times are reduced up to 95%
· New graphics: an enhanced version of Rhye’s terrain and new team colours
· Some additions, including Austria, Ethiopia and Israel
· New resources system and many other innovative rules

This mod needs the Conquests expansion.


Now, let me show you why this is called "The fastest loading mod":

In green - percentages of time saved between Rhye's of Civilization results and the other columns results.
Tests were done with Monarch level with a Pentium IV 1700 MHz - 512MB RAM DDR. More detailed report in the readme or in the official site (http://rhyesciv.uw.hu)

http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/images/loadingtest_b.jpg


The README:
Please download this BEFORE the mod (updated in January 14, 2005 after 10527 downloads!!!!)

THE EXPANSION PACK

http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/images/pacco4_700_30_CFC.jpg

This expansion, developed by Rhye and the Rhye's of Civilization testing team (composed by Aeon221, Asclepius, Beernuts1987, Blasphemous, Chutchy Husky, EL-OSO, Horton, Jaguar, Lachlan, Ville, Vostos), makes up for the lack of additions with a 85MB pack. If you want the raw numbers, here they are: 145 units and 25 wonders added, a totally redesigned tech tree and religions! But it's not the numbers that matter, it's the quality. Every addition has had to meet the same exacting set of criteria (historicity, utility, speed) that made the original RoC so great.

Rhye's of Civilization "basic" fully updated is required.


THE README (installing instructions inside): (updated in January 14, 2005 after 2331 downloads!!!!)

THE FILES

COMPLETE INSTALLER:

Here's the installer of the "Expanded" version (basic+X-pack). It is updated, and it contains its own readme:
http://www.3ddownloads.com/civfanatics/civ3/modpacks/RoCX123_Setup.exe



You can instead choose to download in parts:




BASIC MOD: (readme not included)

You can download the whole basic mod already updated to v2.69, divided in four parts:

Part 1 (14 MB) (http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/files/RoC_v269_part1.zip)
Part 2 (18 MB) (http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/files/RoC_v269_part2.zip)
Part 3 (20 MB) (http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/files/RoC_v269_part3.zip)
Part 4 (21 MB) (http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/files/RoC_v269_part4.zip)


Out of date?
If you've got 2.62, 2.65, 2.66, 2.67, 2.68 -> Download this patch: Update v2.62_to_v2.69 (3 MB) (http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/files/RoC_PATCH_v262_TO_v269.zip)
If you've got 2.61 -> Download only part 1.
If you've got 2.60 -> Download only parts 1 and 2.
If you've got 2.50 or 2.51 -> Download only parts 1, 2 and 3.
If you've got 2.49 or older -> Download the whole mod again.





EXPANSION PACK: (readme not included)


You can download the whole pack in five parts, already updated to 1.23...
Older versions downloaded 1508 times.

Out of date?
Update the X-pack with the lastest patch (v1.23, 4.5 MB) (http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/files/RoCX_PATCH_v123.zip)




and the five parts:

Part 1 (5 MB) (http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/files/RoCX_v123_part1.zip)

Part 2 (30 MB) (http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/files/RoCX_v123_part2.zip)

Part 3 (26 MB) (http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/files/RoCX_v123_part3.zip)

Part 4 (24 MB) (http://www.civfanatics.net/~rhye/files/RoCX_v123_part4.zip)

Part 5 (0.5 MB)

First post.. wooh!

I'm gonna download this ASAP.. the readme which I corrected made me really crave this. Your rules are very good and your hard work amazes me. :goodjob:

Will download when back home

Mobilize -> Readme has been changed since your correction

Cool! Its my Birthday on Feb 7th!!!

Thanks Rhye for my present!

Later

HOT

WOW!....This is one good map! I love the graphic pack. Only thing so far is color of starting nations are wrong. Like England being red? I would rethink the starting colors. But so far very impressed!

GOOD JOB!

Later

HOT

Originally posted by HeartOfTroy
Only thing so far is color of starting nations are wrong. Like England being red? I would rethink the starting colors. But so far very impressed!


Why wrong? First of all, there's no right or wrong, it's a matter of personal preferences...:)

And, what would you give to England?
English flag is white with a red cross. And think about the Redcoats.
In standard settings it was orange, that no doubt should be Dutch.

Great! It's finished! Downloading...

I like your colors, Rhye... ;) Honestly, Civ needs 2-3 colors per Civ, so the Civs could have their real colors, i.e. the colors of their Flag. And then we wouldn't need all the horrible pinks and purples...

<checking the map>

OK, so you kept America and Korea? America is always a difficult option, wierd in the ancient and early medieval period, neccessary in the industrial and modern period.

Ethiopia is a good addition. :goodjob:

The map and the landmark terrains look great! Their rule effects to.

Me: :goodjob: Rhye: :king:

Gotta go, have a game to play! Guess which?

Good point on the colors. I actually thaught about it after I posted.

Thanks for humbling me... :}

Later

HOT

Hate to say it, but the 1st turn was REALLY SLOW! Yet again, it's most likely the fact that I have a slow computer: Pentium II, 350Mhz, and 128MB RAM...

I agree, the 1st few turns were a bit slow and I have a super fast computer, but its cruising along now. I love this mod!

GREAT MOD...GOOD JOB!

Later

HOT

The more I play this mod the more I love it! GREAT JOB! Im in 10 A.D. and still dealing with the Black Death Plauge...LOL! London was 9 now 7...You B^&st#%d mod maker you Rhye..LOL!

LOVE IT! BEST EVER GAME I HAVE PLAYED!

Later

HOT

Hello and thanks everybody.

The 1st turn is slow because in that turn 31 cities are founded. So, 31 borders must be calculated, etc.
This happens with every map, and depends on the number of civs.

Then, a Pentium II means multiply my loading times X5 or more....

Originally posted by Iztvan
Great! It's finished! Downloading...

I like your colors, Rhye... ;) Honestly, Civ needs 2-3 colors per Civ, so the Civs could have their real colors, i.e. the colors of their Flag. And then we wouldn't need all the horrible pinks and purples...


The 2 colors per civ was a thing I requested to Firaxis 2 years ago, because people said that with more than 8 civs in the same time (as originally planned) there weren't enough colours.
I'd like to find that post, somewhere...I begun the revolt when I saw that only 8 was the limit :ar15:, but no multiple colors or flags (like in civ2) after that :(

Anyway, most of the colours of civs were chosen with a reason. The remaining civs took the remaining colours.

Example:

Germans soldiers used to wear grey uniforms. And the grey fits well austere people like Germans.
French national colour is blue (and their football, rugby, and any other sport shirt, too)
Spain has a red and yellow flag; they are called "furias rojas" which means "red furies", and as red was given to England, I chose that lighter red / darker orange
Arabian national flag is green
Dutch football teams wears orange shirts (and what about William of Orange)
Chinese empire was called the "Celestial Empire" and "celeste" means "pale blue" in italian also.

And so on...


Originally posted by Iztvan

<checking the map>

OK, so you kept America and Korea? America is always a difficult option, wierd in the ancient and early medieval period, neccessary in the industrial and modern period.

Ethiopia is a good addition. :goodjob:


As written in the readme, I removed two civs in very crowded areas. Korea and America instead filled holes.
But if you don't like them you can always play with 29 civs (select NONE instead of them)

Im in 920 A.D. turns loading super fast=ME REALLY HAPPY!

Im playing England and France has pissed me off more then once and caused lots of money problems. I have made it threw those times and the plauge. I have rebuild my nation and settled Ireland. Germany has BORN HITLER early and they have knocked out the Dutch to a small island near me..LOL! They have started war with me and I have settled it with peace. I colonized into Scandinavia were Bergen is in real life. Dam, I love this MOD!

Later

HOT

PS. The Portugese have spread like locus early in the game I was keeping track of there cities like about 7-8 of them and they are not growing anymore. I wish I could see the map...Where are those dam satilites..LOL!

23:00 I'll just try out the mod as the new Civ Austria
00:00 Damn French! They declare war and then drag the Portugese & Romans in with them.
01:00 The war keeps raging, but my pillaging troops force the Romans to accept peace, while a lycky archer spawns a leader - Swordsman army, here I come! Peace with Portugese after I kill two settler-teams (jummy, 4 slaves/settler!)
02:00 France is Austrian, just two small french cities way east in Russia. I Build Holy War in Innsbruck (South of alps).
03:00 Spain declares war, but gets hit by Holy warriors & swordsman army. I conquer spanish town where mordern marseilles is and get peace.
03:30 WTF? Is it that late?!? Time to go to bed!

I've got no screenshots. Can you both post some?



Iztvan -> you seem very skilled at playing. You could try Emperor level, it doesn't raise much times (Demigod+ raise them instead)

Screenshots: I not at home today, so I can't pos anything today. Tomorrow, or maybe tonight. How do I do screenshots?

Difficulty: I'm already playing at emperor level... :p I'm considering going up one level, or perhaps try playing as Arabia (and aim for holy war - cool!).

Im not sure how to do screen shots either?

Later

HOT

You can make screenshots with any graphics program like Paint Shop Pro, Photo Shop, Corel Draw, HyperSnap DX, .....

Then they must be saved with a compression (JPG) that allows the file to be smaller than 100kb, to be attached here.

The Germans now know the might of the English army. After taking Amsterdam and Rottenham and waiting the time of my alliances with the Dutch & Vikings, I sued for peace and the Germans quickly accepted. England then flurished for sometime and built a huge Navey and a massed a huge army on the shores of England south just enough distance so the French could see what was coming for there terrible attitude towards the English.

LOL!...Wish I could show a screen shot!

Later

HOT

PS...Around 1390 A.D. and turns super fast still.

I have been playing for a while now and Im in 1800 A.D. and have noticed as Im Monarch government that it doesn't matter if I lower my tax rate from 50% and raise the science rate 60-80% the tech speed doesn't change???

Later

HOT

PS...Wish you could see my game... THIS MOD ROCKS!

Min research turns = 8, to avoid that one civ takes the lead too much.

Why don't you post some screenshots? Download Paint Shop Pro (it's shareware), capture the screens you want and save them .jpg

Then attach them here with the slot when you reply.

If you want I could post here an old version of Paint Shop (4) which was freeware.

I have a lot of screenshots, but they are above 100kb. Should I cut out a part of the pucture, or is there a way to reduce resolution -> size? I have Microsoft Paint.

Try this link (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=957097#post957097)

The Glorious Austrian Empire, just after the war with the Tripple Alliance (France, Spain & Rome). It's 700ad, we're in the early middle ages and the pagan French have paid for their aggression.
The army levied by the famous warlord Mack the Great was instrumental in subjugating the Franks and forcing the Spaniards to the negotiating table.

The Austrian Heartland:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/Austria_East_700ad.jpg

The newly conquered Frankish provinces:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/Austria_West_700ad.jpg

The Spanish Marches:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/Austria_SW_700ad.jpg

I have made a small change and want to know if you like it? I did this so the Americans will build New York and Boston is proper areas. I moved the Irquois over a bit west. I added 2 cattle to the north of America starting postion on the east and a whale & fish near where Boston should be built. I think this makes the map better & America grow proper.

Later

HOT

PS...Sorry about screen shots... In future I will post. Game to dam fun to stop to post!


(PSII.... I reuploaded a new version with all the LM tiles in Eastern America removed and redone with normal tiles so America can grow proper. Who ever downloaded the old version please redownload this version. There was only 1 download of the old version!)
************************************************** *

PSIII - I have tweaked the map around England where Plymouth is today and Cario, Eygpt and Moved wheat from Portualguel into Madrid, Spain to slow down the Portugese a bit. A little beefing up at Jerusalem area. I removed the Americans and made the Souix and a new starting location and adjusted barbarians a bit around them. The Souix are alot like the Irquouis. They are more aggressive and have same UU. I wanted to give them the Mounted Warrior but it was removed.

This was posted after 3 more downloads of old file.

Enjoy!

The German Crusade:

The Austrians take religion seriously:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/Templar_&_Fanatic.jpg


Words have reach our ears that German scholars claim the earth revolves around the sun, not the sun around the earth, as is proper(Copernicus)). Not only that, they also claim that the weight of an object doesn't affect it's falling spead (Leonardo !
Such heresy cannot be allowed on the very borders of uor beloved, most holy catholic empire of Austria! Holy war and Crusade is proclaimed versus the German heretics:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/Crusade!_1020ad.jpg

Berlin falls:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/Crusade_2!_1020ad.jpg

Leipzig falls:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/Crusade_3!_1020ad.jpg

Ville -> Thanks!

Rhye -> Do you want more screenshots? Of the same game or another game?

Hi!

First of all, I like your mod very much, I have been playing a couple of games with the first version, too.

Right now I am playing a game with the Germans, only some turns left to industrial age.

I noticed that the AI seems to have big problems with the pop cost of the settlers.

First, they only have small cities, several capitals are size 1 !.

Secondly, they probably can't handle that high pop cost when building: When I found embassies in several enemy cities I found that they often tried to build settlers with cities of very low size, which resulted in their building capacities being blockaded until the city reached size 5... seems like the AI is not smart enough to build other things until the city has grown sufficient (like a human player would).

It seems like this cripples the AI very much. Anyone else noticed that?

dreiche2 -> I've noticed it to. This happens with the unmodded game to, the AI doesn't seem to take account of the pop cost of settlers. This problem is then accentuated by the increased cost in Rhye's of Civ.

The problem is that the increased cost has a good gameplay effect, so I don't know how to work around this. Maybe keep the vanillaCiv popcost of 2, but give it a tremendous shield cost? But perhaps this will cripple the AI too??

I've actually been toying with an idea: Make Settlers unbuildable by all civs, and make the Palace, or some other appropriate building(s), generate a settler every X (10? 20?) turns, like the Knights Templar generates Crusaders.

But this small problem should not cast a shadow on this Mod, it is excellent in to many ways to mention.

Yes and no. I do believe that it some what cripples the A.I. but in the end its all good.

Later

HOT

Your mod is :love:

One problem : Arabs should have Holy War for themselves only

Why not a "Holy war" wonder type for each civ ?
For different periods and epochs ...

UU wouldn't longer builded, this wonders should be the ones only abilited to produce UU ...

Example : "Legionaries School" GWonder give Legionary each 1 turns and obsolete with Feodalism
This wonder came with Bronze Working and cost 100 shields and need "Romans" ressource

"Panzers Workshop" GWonder give Panzer each 1 turns ... and obsolete with tech which allow modern armor
This wonder came with Motorized Transportation and cost 100 shields and need "Germans" ressource

For make it : create 31 ressources placed beneath the capital called "Romans" "Germans" "Japan" etc ... :(

All civs build generic units and their specific wonders build theirs UUs .... War should be greatest in Regent Level :) (my level)

Or create 32 tech researchable only for one civ for this wonders :)

Example : "Roman" --> allow the wonder "Legionaries School" which build Roman UU : Legionary ...

Bronze Working --> Roman Legionaries --> Iron Working
for Romans only

Bronze Working --> Iron Working
for the 30 others

"Romans Legionaries is an Hidden Techs for non Roman-Civ

I have started a thread with an alternative 170x170 map for proper growth in North America and other world edits.

Later

HOT

A new thread? This will confure people. The biq only doesn't work because it needs the extra units.
Make any change you want, but in my opinion it's better if we keep all the modifications inside here.
BTW, North America had so many LM terrains because in the games I watched, America growed too fast and colonized South America before Europeans arrival; but with Sioux it's not a problem anymore. Instead, Iroquois need LM terrains!!
Look at the readme: somewhere I wrote that the Great Lakes make Iroquois a settlers factory! There's no way to stop them except removing some shields.

Rhye -> Do you want more screenshots? I can keep them coming!
I have started a new game as the Spanish, since victory seemed assured for the Austrians. I can keep playing the Austrians for screenshots and playtest if you wish, otherwise I'll try to play the Spanish as a colonial power, and see how it goes and how non-european civs are doing.

Originally posted by Lachlan
One problem : Arabs should have Holy War for themselves only


Why? Pyramids are for everyone but should be Egyptian, Crusades should be European but are for everyone.
I know that it would be better, and I tried to to that: if you look at the editor, I added flavuors, that SHOULD make some civs more likely to build something instead of other.
But it doesn't seem to work.

Originally posted by Lachlan

Why not a "Holy war" wonder type for each civ ?
For different periods and epochs ...

UU wouldn't longer builded, this wonders should be the ones only abilited to produce UU ...


That's an alternative. You could try that, and see what happens.
I think the added resource is better than messing up the tech tree.

Ok I tried this mod out. I havent read the whole thread, so I dont know what has already been suggestet, but this is what I came up with:

I see you are using my Fanatic, did you notice that an update has been made with civiliopedia icons?

Shouldn't the Hussar upgrade to Cavalry?

Why dont you add more different resources? You dont have to worry about them showing up since you have them all preplaced anyway. You could also have more specific resources(Rice for asia, Maize for america etc.)

When playing world maps I usually move Chinas starting location and change their capital name to one of their older capitals. This way China expands more like they did in real history. Here is the two best possible locations IMHO:

Xian/Chang'an/Xianyang: X:144 Y:54 (the best from a historical point of view)
Nanking/Nanjing: X:151 Y:59(the best from a realistic expansion point of view)
Ofcause its up to you if you want to change it;)

Why not change Holy War to Jihad? Thats afterall what it represents.

I dont see a reason to build the Holy War when I can get Knights Templar. They produce a unit each 5 turn both, but the Crusader is better than the Fanatic. I suggest making Holy War produce a Fanatic each 4 turn, but at the same time lower the Fanatics defence to 1. That way they are only offence, which is more realistic, and at the same time creates some difference bewteen Knights Templar and Holy War.

Im not sure I understand your civ choices. You have one good addition, Ethiopia. But at the same time you have both Ottomans and Byzantines, Sumerians and Babylonians. And all those european civs! I suggest you move some of these civs that cant expand properly because they are crammed together, and add some new civs in other parts of the world. Khmer in Indochina and Mali in Africa are my two best suggestions.

Finally the map takes too long to load for my computer so my games werent very long or big, but I really like the way you put the map together, and I would be very happy if you made a 140. 140 or 130 130 version of it;). Edit: I might want to add that I get very easy bored, 3 seconds is the longest loading time I can stand.

Oh and did I mention this mod is nice:goodjob:

Originally posted by Iztvan
Rhye -> Do you want more screenshots? I can keep them coming!
I have started a new game as the Spanish, since victory seemed assured for the Austrians. I can keep playing the Austrians for screenshots and playtest if you wish, otherwise I'll try to play the Spanish as a colonial power, and see how it goes and how non-european civs are doing.

Do what you like ;)
I'm more interested in seeing the Spaniards, but don't play with the purpose of making screenshots, play to enjoy yourself and if you have some good screenshots, post them. I don't think I'll make any change to the mod, unless you all find some bad bug.
I begun working on this new version at the beginning of December :whipped:, so I'm having a vacantion now :sleep:

Originally posted by Yoda Power
Ok I tried this mod out. I havent read the whole thread, so I dont know what has already been suggestet, but this is what I came up with:


Reading the readme is more important than reading the thread (for now)

Originally posted by Yoda Power
Shouldn't the Hussar upgrade to Cavalry?


Didn't they coexist?

Originally posted by Yoda Power

Why dont you add more different resources? You dont have to worry about them showing up since you have them all preplaced anyway.


? What do you mean? (sorry for my English)

Originally posted by Yoda Power

When playing world maps I usually move Chinas starting location and change their capital name to one of their older capitals. This way China expands more like they did in real history. Here is the two best possible locations IMHO:

Xian/Chang'an/Xianyang: X:144 Y:54 (the best from a historical point of view)
Nanking/Nanjing: X:151 Y:59(the best from a realistic expansion point of view)
Ofcause its up to you if you want to change it;)


Good ideas. I did that with Ottomans, but there was a problem with them (shared starting location). China right now develops O.K., conquering the regions they rule nowadays. I fear that moving them south may cause Koreans to be in the middle of China and Mongolia, disturbing a possible war between them.
But it's worth a try.

Originally posted by Yoda Power

I dont see a reason to build the Holy War when I can get Knights Templar. They produce a unit each 5 turn both, but the Crusader is better than the Fanatic. I suggest making Holy War produce a Fanatic each 4 turn, but at the same time lower the Fanatics defence to 1. That way they are only offence, which is more realistic, and at the same time creates some difference bewteen Knights Templar and Holy War.


You are right. If I post an update, I'll include this.
BTW, Jihad or Holy War, is the same; I only feared that someone could not understand the first word


Originally posted by Yoda Power

Im not sure I understand your civ choices. You have one good addition, Ethiopia. But at the same time you have both Ottomans and Byzantines, Sumerians and Babylonians. And all those european civs! I suggest you move some of these civs that cant expand properly because they are crammed together, and add some new civs in other parts of the world. Khmer in Indochina and Mali in Africa are my two best suggestions.


The main reason is that I can't find a good leaderhead for those civs. A good UU and KU is needed. If you look in the civilopedia, you'll find that there's no civilopedia entry missing: everything is in its right place like the standard game.
In the readme I wrote why I removed Hittites and Celts: they were the less important civs in the most crowded regions (France/Spain/Rome and Byzantines/Ottomans/Babylonians)

Then, in History happened wars between Ottomans and Byzantines. So why not having them both?
I don't like Sumeria but I've no good replacement
Europe is crowded like in real life but I think I can affort that as long as every civ develops. With this map, I can afford that. I couldn't do that with ANY other map, expecially the Miller's projection maps.
And, to say the truth, I prefer playing with the Portuguese instead of the Khmer. It's a matter of historical importance, too. You can't exclude Byzantium or Ottomans.

Originally posted by Yoda Power

Finally the map takes too long to load for my computer so my games werent very long or big, but I really like the way you put the map together, and I would be very happy if you made a 140. 140 or 130 130 version of it;).


:eek: what computer have you got??

Didn't they coexist?Yes, but for a playability reason I would make them upgrade.
What do you mean? (sorry for my English)I mean that in the normal game there is a limit of how many resources that will show up, but since you preplace all your you can add as many as you want.
I fear that moving them south may cause Koreans to be in the middle of China and Mongolia, disturbing a possible war between them.Well that didn't happen on the other maps I tried it on, but then this map is a bit different.
BTW, Jihad or Holy War, is the same; I only feared that someone could not understand the first wordNo they dont Jihad is a muslim holy war, while holy war is more generic.Then, in History happened wars between Ottomans and Byzantines. So why not having them both?
I don't like Sumeria but I've no good replacement
Europe is crowded like in real life but I think I can affort that as long as every civ develops. With this map, I can afford that. I couldn't do that with ANY other map, expecially the Miller's projection maps.
And, to say the truth, I prefer playing with the Portuguese instead of the Khmer. It's a matter of historical importance, too. You can't exclude Byzantium or Ottomans.
Byzantium was essentially just a mix of romans and greek, I think having the greeks in Athens and the Ottomans in Constantinople will create this conflict, but again its your mod.
If you were to remove any european civs it should probably be Austria, as they were IMO the most less important from a "world map" point of view. You should remove Sumeria, you could use their leaderhead for Mali. Mali's UU would be Haevy Horseman, using Kinboats Cataphract graphics. I strongly suggest you do this!what computer have you got??A pretty good one, but check out my edit in the last post;)

Last night I bought a world map from the English - and noted that the Dutch had built cities in Namibia and South Africa - one of them was at the exact same spot as Johannesburg, iirc! History repeats itself! :)

England, Germany and Austria seem to be managing fine most of the time. Russia, France and Rome not so well... The Greeks don't do well, either.

Everyone seems to have an opinion on how the mod should be tweaked - the Civfanatics are a hard bunch to please! ;) But that's the way it is, you can't please everyone and there is always something that could be done different.

About Civs and starting positions, my only concerns are thet Central Asia ans southeast asia needs a civ and maybe westafrica, and the ethiopean starting position is very hard. Sure, Europe is crowded, but the terrain is good, so they can still thrive.

Originally posted by Iztvan
dreiche2 -> I've noticed it to. This happens with the unmodded game to, the AI doesn't seem to take account of the pop cost of settlers. This problem is then accentuated by the increased cost in Rhye's of Civ.

The problem is that the increased cost has a good gameplay effect, so I don't know how to work around this. Maybe keep the vanillaCiv popcost of 2, but give it a tremendous shield cost? But perhaps this will cripple the AI too??

I've actually been toying with an idea: Make Settlers unbuildable by all civs, and make the Palace, or some other appropriate building(s), generate a settler every X (10? 20?) turns, like the Knights Templar generates Crusaders.


If a wonder produce settlers for everyone every civ would have always the same number of cities.
Instead, a shield-only solution would cause: 1) Starting locations to be edited, because some civs like Egypt don't have many shields near. 2)That wouldn't be so effective, because more a city grows, more the shields cost isn't a problem


About Artificial lack of Intelligence, I don't know what to do. If high population cost is an advantage for the player, try raising difficulty level.
Monarch=9
Emperor=9
Demigod=8
Deity=8
Sid=7

This is %cost. Setting 8 or less will cause every other civ build faster (8/9 of the time they used to spend), research faster, etc.
And timeline could not fit the discovers anymore. But you want to try to find an harder challenge (and I think you would need that, considering his screenshots ) try that. Or try playing with a non-european civ. I think American civs are the hardest choices.

Mmm. Mali or a S-E Asian civ instead of Sumeria isn't a bad idea. I'll remember that if I release an update

Originally posted by Rhye
Mmm. Mali or a S-E Asian civ instead of Sumeria isn't a bad idea. I'll remember that if I release an update

I was going to suggest switching Sumeria with Mali/Songhay. Gilgamesh looks very nearly black, so you could use him for a leaderhead. A UU might be a problem, however.

If you want yet another European civ, here's an idea - add Poland, give them the original Hannibal as a leaderhead, and make Mursilis of the Hittites the new Hannibal. Make Shaka the leader of the Ethiopians and ditch the Zulus, since historically, they were very short-lived as anything that could be called a "civ". That would also free up the Impi for another African UU.

I have an idea that could give you an African UU - use the Mayan Javelin Thrower. I think he could pass for an Ethiopian Javilineer. If you want to keep the Mayas, Kinboat has made a lot of awesome Meso-American units.

You could change Korea to Siam or Khmer(I prefer Siam - it sounds cooler. :)), just to have a civ to fill SE Asia.

Okay, here is my last African UU idea. Since you got rid of the Celts, you could give the Gallic Swordsman to Carthage and give the Numidian Mercenary to an African Civ. Hannibal recruited a lot of soldiers from Gaul - probably more than he did from Libya. The problem is, it might look funny having fair-haired white guys running around Africa! :)

Anyway, great looking mod!

Originally posted by Yoda Power
Byzantium was essentially just a mix of romans and greek, I think having the greeks in Athens and the Ottomans in Constantinople will create this conflict, but again its your mod.
If you were to remove any european civs it should probably be Austria, as they were IMO the most less important from a "world map" point of view. You should remove Sumeria, you could use their leaderhead for Mali. Mali's UU would be Haevy Horseman, using Kinboats Cataphract graphics. I strongly suggest you do this!A pretty good one, but check out my edit in the last post;)

The Greek/Byzantium/Ottoman question is a damn hard nut to crack in a game that goes from 4000bc to 2050ad. There is no "right" way of doing it, just different ways of doing it "wrong". :confused:
If a civ-slot is needed to fill a hole in SE asia, west Africa or poland/ukraine/central asia, I'd vote for ditching the Greeks or Byzanties... but I'd do so with a heavy heart. :(

Revome Austria? Heresy! ;) Seriously, this map is made to be able to handle a lot of euro civs, so i think it fills a spot... unless perhaps you add Poland as theStonesFan suggested
Mali, though, would fit perfectly. I think I'll try out that change the next game I play.

Originally posted by thestonesfan

If you want yet another European civ, here's an idea - add Poland, give them the original Hannibal as a leaderhead, and make Mursilis of the Hittites the new Hannibal. Make Shaka the leader of the Ethiopians and ditch the Zulus, since historically, they were very short-lived as anything that could be called a "civ". That would also free up the Impi for another African UU.

I have an idea that could give you an African UU - use the Mayan Javelin Thrower. I think he could pass for an Ethiopian Javilineer. If you want to keep the Mayas, Kinboat has made a lot of awesome Meso-American units.

You could change Korea to Siam or Khmer(I prefer Siam - it sounds cooler. :)), just to have a civ to fill SE Asia.

Okay, here is my last African UU idea. Since you got rid of the Celts, you could give the Gallic Swordsman to Carthage and give the Numidian Mercenary to an African Civ. Hannibal recruited a lot of soldiers from Gaul - probably more than he did from Libya. The problem is, it might look funny having fair-haired white guys running around Africa! :)

Anyway, great looking mod!

Poland or Ukraine or something to represent the non-russian slavs wold be nice. Just dont go and remove the Austrians! ;)

Moving & renaming Korea is somexthing i've played around with in the PTW version of this mod (using kal-els 180x180 earth map), and it's not bad to have something between China and India.
In that mod I moved the Turks to central asia (just east of the urals), since this area is always empty and gets colonized by various european powers... and it's the Turks historical home to, they only arrived in anatolia during the early middle ages. In civ that happens sometimes to, a civ gets its heartland conquered (in this case by mongols and later russians) and continues existing somewhere else.

The problem is, the more you start changing the Civs and UUs, the more you are moving away from "standard Civ". In the beginning this was a purely "Fast loading earth mod" without extensive tweaking and flavour, and that has it's advantages. If Rhye decides to implement some of the changes that has been suggested, the mod will be moving further away from "standard c3c civ" and become an extensive modification. This isn't neccesarily bad, but it is something completely different. Maybe a "speed only version" and a "heavily edited version" would be the sollution?!? :confused:

Originally posted by thestonesfan
You could change Korea to Siam or Khmer(I prefer Siam - it sounds cooler. :)), just to have a civ to fill SE Asia.
ehhh, but historicly the Khmer empire have had far more impact on the world than Siam. The capital Angkor Wat was once one of the biggest cities in the world with a million citizens. The Khmer empire was a cultural mix between China and India. No offence, but thats a bit more important than the cool name of Siam;)

For Mali again I would say that their UU should be Heavy Horseman(I could try to find a better name), as that was really their main soldier.
Originally posted by Iztvan
The problem is, the more you start changing the Civs and UUs, the more you are moving away from "standard Civ". In the beginning this was a purely "Fast loading earth mod" without extensive tweaking and flavour, and that has it's advantages. If Rhye decides to implement some of the changes that has been suggested, the mod will be moving further away from "standard c3c civ" and become an extensive modification. This isn't neccesarily bad, but it is something completely different. Maybe a "speed only version" and a "heavily edited version" would be the sollution?!? :confused: But changing some civs arent really the same as changing the game. Only the look of it. + I belive that people would be happy to try a few different civs than the usual 31.

hi

I think this is a very good mod. I like it. But have some problem:
- in Europe the river Rhine and Danube not correct.
- Why u chooesed Austria?
- I think Hungary is better :)
- I dont like Byzance if there are Roman civ in the game. I think only need Ottomans.
- Summer don't need too.
- Hussar was develobed by the Hungarians.
- What if Holy War need Incene?

Originally posted by Iztvan
The problem is, the more you start changing the Civs and UUs, the more you are moving away from "standard Civ". In the beginning this was a purely "Fast loading earth mod" without extensive tweaking and flavour, and that has it's advantages. If Rhye decides to implement some of the changes that has been suggested, the mod will be moving further away from "standard c3c civ" and become an extensive modification. This isn't neccesarily bad, but it is something completely different. Maybe a "speed only version" and a "heavily edited version" would be the sollution?!? :confused:

You've hit the nail on the head.
The more you add/remove something, the more you risk to dissatisy someone. I could remove Korea and then a korean comes out demonstrating how important Korea was....
A friend of mine turned angry when he knew that I didn't put Macedonia in the mod, as he suggested (He studies History and wanted to distinguish them from Greeks)
I've been very careful adding civs, removing civs and adding techs/units/wonders.
If you want to know, my personal preference goes to static leaderhead because I can't stand bald Joan of Arc or other inaccuracies like Theodora. But I can't expect that everybody likes static paintings or flags, so putting them in this mod would be a mistake.


Originally posted by habee
hi

I think this is a very good mod. I like it. But have some problem:
- in Europe the river Rhine and Danube not correct.
- Why u chooesed Austria?
- I think Hungary is better :)
- I dont like Byzance if there are Roman civ in the game. I think only need Ottomans.
- Summer don't need too.
- Hussar was develobed by the Hungarians.
- What if Holy War need Incene?

As written above, an Hungarian asks why not Hungary....
Austria was Austria-Hungary at its peak, so they are in a certain meaning included.
Hussar was developed there but used by many European nations, as an army corps. Willing to expand the XVIII Century a bit, I think that adding the missing flintlock infantry and light cavalry for everyone, and then adding Grentzer for Austria (or Austria-Hungary) and Shifta for Ethiopia is still historically accurate.
Incense...why for Holy War?


Anyway, thank you all for the suggestions, but if you like the mod as it is please go to the polls!

Originally posted by Rhye

You've hit the nail on the head.

It was bound to happen one day... :p

I guess the best thing to do is move/change as little as absolutely possible, and then leave the tweaking to the players?

You can modify a mod/scenario for ages and never be quite finished or satisfied... ( like longbows and medieval infantry existing until Replaceable parts :rolleyes: ) ... but then the scenario needs to be finished before Civ4 is released, so getting finished priority #1!

In the new thread I have left details on how to install, so it should not be confusing. I also agree change less or the feel of this MOD will change. Rhye...Can you put back the Mounted Warrior?...I want to give the Sioux a UU different then the Irquious.

Later

HOT

OK
I'm from Hungary :-) And like my counry, and Hungery is older civ (895 AD in Europe) And Hungary was an important country in 1000-1526 AD, when the Ottomans invad it

Rhye...

There is a cost problem with Feudalism Government. It is charge 3 gold upkeep on units per turn. In my thread I have fixed this to 1 Gold upkeep per turn.

Later

HOT

Originally posted by Yoda Power
(...)Finally the map takes too long to load for my computer so my games werent very long or big, but I really like the way you put the map together, and I would be very happy if you made a 140. 140 or 130 130 version of it;). Edit: I might want to add that I get very easy bored, 3 seconds is the longest loading time I can stand.(..)

This this my problem too, plus, not a big fan of huge maps, but your map is great! :goodjob:

Originally posted by HeartOfTroy
There is a cost problem with Feudalism Government. It is charge 3 gold upkeep on units per turn. In my thread I have fixed this to 1 Gold upkeep per turn.


Uh....is it a bug of my mod or of conquests?



Originally posted by HeartOfTroy
In the new thread I have left details on how to install, so it should not be confusing. I also agree change less or the feel of this MOD will change. Rhye...Can you put back the Mounted Warrior?...I want to give the Sioux a UU different then the Irquious.



You can do that very easily:

Copy all the settings (from the units tab inside the .biq) Mounted Warrior has (except "available to") from a standard .biq and overwrite the F-15 in the modded .biq
I did not delete the Mounted Warrior pediaicons.txt entries, so it should work. If it doesn't, tell me what error message it gives.

This is my 1000th post!!!

:grad: :band:

I have posted version 2.0 of my Mod that has a new idea to test. I have made all settlers 2 population cost and doubled the shield point cost. There is a readme on the post. Please go and check it out and tell me what you think?

Later

HOT

PS.. Rhye, I'm just trying to help test new ideas for your mod and make it even better.

Sure, you are putting good ideas.
In spite of my thoughts about the shield solution
Originally posted by Rhye
a shield-only solution would cause: 1) Starting locations to be edited, because some civs like Egypt don't have many shields near. 2)That wouldn't be so effective, because more a city grows, more the shields cost isn't a problem
It's something worth a try. I recommend you adding some LM desert near Egyptian and Arabian starting locations. Then, play a game with visible map to see what's happening.


Ah, about the curraghs.
I changed that after having played a standard game with a seafaring civ and noticed that Trireme was useless.
Attack 1 defense 1 moves 2 become for a seafaring civ 1/1/3. I did not use any trireme, only that small boats (and I ask myself how that boats could be armed). And I think Alphabet is a non-sense prerequisite tech. Pottery means water-proof containers: it makes more sense.

HeartOfTroy shouldn't disturb your topic :(

Rhye, i'm not a advanced modder, i'm appaling in graphics

Don't worry, he isn't disturbing. If nobody post, I guess people don't like it :)
Every kind of suggestion is welcome

Congratulations to the 1000:th post! :cool:

Originally posted by Rhye


Uh....is it a bug of my mod or of conquests?

It's in Conquests. During playtest feudalism was intended to have free city improvements & 3gold unit support. The free buildings didn't make it to the release, but the 3gold/unit was left/forgotten.

Curraghs -> But they can't transport troops, so Triremes are not useless.

But the naval aspect of Civ is wierd in many ways, both the boats and the Harbour.*

On another note: Corruption feels very low when I'm playing.


*) inreased food, resource trade & veteran ships with one building. Should be three: mil harbour (veteran ships), commercial harbour (overseas trade with resources + extra trade like the Commersial docks no-one ever get's to build) and fishing docks (extra food from water)

I will be finished with my scenario for Rhye's mod tonight. Its based on the 170x170 World map but has been tweaked. Fedualism Goverment is fixed. Curragh ship now attacks and defends and transports 1 unit. Settlers cost 2 population points and double Rhye's shields(x2) to build. All nations have extra cities. The game scenario is developed on the game starting in 10,000 B.C. and you pick up at 4000 B.C. . Some nations are stronger and other are weak. A few nations that start out looking stronger may not be able to build settlers so they will focus on armies and wonders.

I will post it later tonight under a new thread! You need Rhyes mod to play it!

Later

HOT

i will donload it when 15 peoples will are downloaded it ;)

LOL...No problem! I think you will like it. I'm just fine tuning it. It's to make the world unfold closer to history...not perfect but fun!

Later

HOT

Hi, I have posted the scenario in a new thread. Please download and enjoy it!

Later

HOT

PS...Not perfect, but fun!

Originally posted by Iztvan
On another note: Corruption feels very low when I'm playing.


Is it too low? It should raise with 10+ cities.



Originally posted by HeartOfTroy
I will be finished with my scenario for Rhye's mod tonight. Its based on the 170x170 World map but has been tweaked. Fedualism Goverment is fixed. Curragh ship now attacks and defends and transports 1 unit. Settlers cost 2 population points and double Rhye's shields(x2) to build. All nations have extra cities. The game scenario is developed on the game starting in 10,000 B.C. and you pick up at 4000 B.C. . Some nations are stronger and other are weak. A few nations that start out looking stronger may not be able to build settlers so they will focus on armies and wonders.

I gave a look at it.
Yes, there are some inaccuracies, first of all in 4000BC there were no Roman or Egyptian cities. But there weren't Paris or London, too, so we're looking for perfection.
The food/shield thing must first be tested, so nothing to say.
The good thing is the 10000/4000 idea: in fact I never thought that this map could be used to create scenarios beginning, i.e. in 1000BC or in 0AD or in any other time. Of course, a good work needs new civs, units and a correct techs and cities assignment. An atlas of history is all that's needed

Thanks. Its built more for fun then accuarcy. I want people to be able to build up armies and wonders and have wars.

Later

HOT

i just cant wait to use it!! must be very very good :D
thanx rhye.:D

btw, does anyone know whether it is the biggest "actively" (i mean, the way people adds so many excitingly new things) user dominated game website or not???
im proud to be a civ :) i already downloaded it. just had a look...looks amazing!!
great work rhye!!!

rhye its a nice work for sure but it was toooooooooooooo slow in my pc (p4 2.4Ghz, 384 meg ram on laptop). i dunno what happened but its too slow to play :(:(

Originally posted by Rhye


Is it too low? It should raise with 10+ cities.

OK! I'll build the Holy War and grab me some more cities and see if corruption kicks in! :D

Stupid AI settler burnout:
Portugal:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/AIburnout1.jpg
Lisbon:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/AIburnout2.jpg

Building a Settler in a size 2 city... when you already have two settlers in that sity... and you're surrounded by a big agressive nation? :mad: I got so P_O:ed that I had to invade... 4 free slaveworkers, and no annoying stupidity in on my dear Iberian peninsula. :king:

Another example of stupid AI:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/Stupid_AI.jpg

Rhye,
I tried your mod, and there are lots of things I like about it. Great work! However, one can easily win on the emporer level by being aggressive at the beginning. For example, I played the Germans and built nothing but archers. In quick succession I destroyed 3 civs before they even built a second city. The AI concentrates on building a settler and only has warriors to guard their cities. Perhaps a starting defensive unit for all civs would help, since without an actual defensive unit the difficulty setting defaults to the warrior. Just some thoughts...

If you want a challenge try my thread. The (HOT) Rhye's Ancient World 170x170 Scenario. It want be so easy!

Later

HOT

Originally posted by HeartOfTroy
If you want a challenge try my thread. The (HOT) Rhye's Ancient World 170x170 Scenario. It want be so easy!

Later

HOT

Where is your thread ? :confused:

OK.

I'll start gathering information for a v2.1, without hurrying (more I wait, more I gather):

to do:

- try changing the food/shields cost
- correct LM terrains close to starting locations to fit new shields cost
- make AI more protected at the beginning. It could be a bonus unit, or town default defense, or a palace bonus if possible.
- make fanatic every 4 turns with reduced defense
- should I change feudalism?? I'm not into it and I don't know if it is HoT personal choice or it is a bug to be corrected.
- same with Forbidden Palace: I've heard a lot about it but don't know what's the problem. Can anybody explain me?
- Perhaps some corruption setting changes to help AI
- ....
- ....
- ....

and of course test if it's all ok

Originally posted by thasan
rhye its a nice work for sure but it was toooooooooooooo slow in my pc (p4 2.4Ghz, 384 meg ram on laptop). i dunno what happened but its too slow to play :(:(

I don't believe it, you've got a faster computer than mine!
In first page there's the table with the precision timing. The only way to raise them considerably is playing with Sid difficulty level

Originally posted by Iztvan

Building a Settler in a size 2 city... when you already have two settlers in that sity... and you're surrounded by a big agressive nation? :mad: I got so P_O:ed that I had to invade... 4 free slaveworkers, and no annoying stupidity in on my dear Iberian peninsula.

That happens with standard games, too.

I thought you were going on a vacation? ;) Let me know if you want any help.

Food/shield cost & changed landmark terrain: Hope it will help. I don't know if it will, but it's worth a test.

AI protected beginning: I think it might be neccesary. A good defencive bonus to the Palace, maybe? I can see that you give the AI less bonus starting units on the higher levels that in the ordinary game. This is probably neccessary, since the AI and player start so close to each other - the player could be overwhelmed with to many strong AI:s so close to him. But it has the drawback that a smart player can swarn the Ai more easily than in the normal game. So some kind of bonus so the AI:s stay in the game longer is probably a good idea.

Fanatic: I think it's fine as it is. What's the difference between def 2 and def 3? It usualy means that when you stack fanatics and pikemen are stacked together, you are sure that the pikemen will defend first, so that the fanatics are unharmed when they attack the next round. But with Templars, your Elite templar will defend before your veteran pikeman, wich is not good! So, sometimes, defence 2 is better than defence 3!

Feudalism: I believe it's generaly considdered a bug. Might even be changed in the next patch.

Forbidden palace (and Secret police HQ) bug: This is a bug, and will be corrected in the patch (it's already corrected in the beta-patch afaik).

Corruption: Interesting! Tell us more! :)

Originally posted by Rhye

That happens with standard games, too.

Yes... :( It's critisism of the ai, not the mod. The ai is settler crazy.

rhye, i didnt believe it as well. i was connected to internet, i even shut that down! i know desktop has much better performance than laptops but does it have anything to do with such aa high number of nations? i usually play with 8/8+ nations only...but as i said, i liked it pretty much..:D

In my scenario of Rhye's mod, I find that the shield cost for settlers does work. It at first builds a little faster then the old style then levels out. I find the computer plays alot better too.

I have posted version 1.02. The thread is under MODS.

Later

HOT

Originally posted by thasan
i usually play with 8/8+ nations only...but as i said, i liked it pretty much..:D

Mmm. Try any world map and 31 civs. You'll find loads of that kind of mods in the forums. Let me know how it goes.

P.S. Good luck! :)

You wrote that you don't like a tech-rush. I thinke every civ can start with 2 tech. but this tech have "canot be trade"

Originally posted by habee
You wrote that you don't like a tech-rush. I thinke every civ can start with 2 tech. but this tech have "canot be trade"

Oh, I didn't know that! Well, it's a bit late now to correct, as timeline and tech rate fit the old settings.
Thank you anyway

Hello Rhye, it is wonderful fastet MOD, with a beautifully Map.

After 10 Rounds come the Message:
File not found: Art/Units/Swordsman/SwordmanFortify.wav
Game over
The File "Swordsman" is correct within all Directorys
CivIII, Conquest
I play with CivIII goldversion US or German with translatet Germ-US

Can you help me?

That problem never happened to anyone.
You may try to reinstall the game, or you may edit Swordsman.ini and delete the Fortify sound entry

brausemaus the swordsman fortify bug was fixed in a patch some time ago. Make sure you have the newest patch.

BTW the mistake lies in the writing, Firaxis accidently added a space between SwordsmanFortify and the "." So it says SwordsmanFortify .ini

Thanks, Rhye and Yoda,
the Problem is hystory. the interval between" . wav" was incorrect.
correct ".wav"
all is OK. the Game play furios

Originally posted by brausemaus
Thanks, Rhye and Yoda,
the Problem is hystory. the interval between" . wav" was incorrect.
correct ".wav"
all is OK. the Game play furios Oh yeah, I also wrote ini instead of wav:wallbash:

The terrain is great as per your previos mod Rhye.

I started playing with India and found the inability to cut down jungle/swamps a significant. Maybe the cut down ability could be enabled with a tech or jungles/swamps could provide some limited food/shields maybe commerce which might increase with tech similar to centauri techs in smac on fungus to represent the growing knowledge of nations how to make use of the jungles/swamps. I might attempt this myself somehow.

Also you mentioned zulus are one of the hardest to play as a human? Why is this, the isolation? Obviously they are very crippled when played as comp.

I seem to have trouble buying techs of the AI. When trading techs they have are not shown for trade even though I know I do not have them and I know they have them because of the wonders they are constructing or the age they have reached?

For anyones interest in my game France, Germany and China are strong.

Babs, Persians and Sumerians are weak. They have real crammed in dry start locations but I guess this mod wasn't supposed to represent balance and those civs aren't around today :D

Yes, the aim wasn't balancing all the civs but the opposite: make the game develop like the real world.

About that jungle thing: I removed the cut down ability (in old version there was, with a hundred of turns to complete - a suicide!) because wasting a worker for that time is a stupid thing that nobody would do - except AI. So, this was a clear advantage for the player.

Strange the fact of the techs: maybe you are behind? For example, if you've got only Alphabet and AI has mapmaking, you won't find mapmaking in their techs but only writing instead.

I also had the impression in my german game that sometimes techs don't appear in the trading dialog. Mabye I'm just hallucinating...

Anyone else having problems as America. Played it as the Austrians and no problem building settlers. But as America, I had to wait 50-100 turns before I could make a settler. Anyone else have that problem ?

I've just checked. America can build its first settler in the 40th turn. Every civ have a slow start, expecially extra-europeans. But it shouldn't take longer than that. You should manage the fact that a settler cost is much raised in this mod.

Ok thanks,Ill give it another shot. LOVE the mode , great work and thank you!

However I'm testing v2.1 right now. I'll probably post it tomorrow.
Settlers cost was edited, but I'm not completely sure it's better now. I'll let you all decide.

Oh, by the way: rate the mod in the poll!!

Changes in 2.1 ?

I suggest to make possibility of randomize map ...
It's possible ? I would play on a 100x100 map :)

Can you convert your first map of PTW Version ?

Because with you current map, game slow down near 1800 AD

I prefer "Ancient" map and "Modern" map

1. : Sorry for my bad English

2: : This is a good mod, I'm using some rules changes in my scen.

3. : For The Statue of Zeus Wonder you need Ivory, so Rome or Greece can't build it. But you don't need nothing for the HolyWar or Knights Templar , so everybody can build it. For example I played with Ottomans and I built this 3 wonder and I had many units...

4. : I think the Dragoon is better units for Military Tradition .
And un can give Huszár for Hungary.(And Make Hungary for the mod, i can halp if u need something for this, or see the TET mod, it has Hungary )

5. : Ottoman UU is earlier units. Place to Military Tradition.. I think.
In 1526 AD Ottomans use this units when invaded Hungary. Hungarians used Huszárs in the Revolution in 1848.

6. : I voted for you Mod :-)

7. : The capital of Sumers don't have any shild only food.

8. : Why I can't Build Irgantion in Flood Area?

9. : Now thats all...

By

Originally posted by habee
1. : Sorry for my bad English

2: : This is a good mod, I'm using some rules changes in my scen.

3. : For The Statue of Zeus Wonder you need Ivory, so Rome or Greece can't build it. But you don't need nothing for the HolyWar or Knights Templar , so everybody can build it. For example I played with Ottomans and I built this 3 wonder and I had many units...

4. : I think the Dragoon is better units for Military Tradition .
And un can give Huszár for Hungary.(And Make Hungary for the mod, i can halp if u need something for this, or see the TET mod, it has Hungary )

5. : Ottoman UU is earlier units. Place to Military Tradition.. I think.
In 1526 AD Ottomans use this units when invaded Hungary. Hungarians used Huszárs in the Revolution in 1848.

6. : I voted for you Mod :-)

7. : The capital of Sumers don't have any shild only food.

8. : Why I can't Build Irgantion in Flood Area?

9. : Now thats all...

By

2. Quote me ;)

3. So, would you add a resource to holy war or remove ivory (which is a standard civ3 setting) from statue of Zeus?

4. The problems are: 1 - In these forums there are no good Dragoon user-made units in my opinion. 2 - In these forums nobody has ever poster an Hungarian leaderhead.

5. Thank you; I didn't know that. But now, if I place Sipahi to military tradition, what will I do with cavalry? Anticipating it would create a double unit with Hussar.
I could anticipate only Sipahi, but I'd have to decrease its stats to make it an upgraded Hussar. After all, they carry pistols and swords, while cavalry and cossacks carry rifles.
But wait, should the Hussar be placed to Nationalism maybe? I don't know any dates for Hussars, can you tell me some?
I must think about it. I'd like to hear more opinions.

7. That is intentional. I want to see an early end for Sumeria.

8. Because it would overpower civs like Egypt and India, which already have much food.



Originally posted by Lachlan
Changes in 2.1 ?

I suggest to make possibility of randomize map ...
It's possible ? I would play on a 100x100 map :)

Can you convert your first map of PTW Version ?

Because with you current map, game slow down near 1800 AD

I prefer "Ancient" map and "Modern" map

With habee's suggestions I might wait some more days before posting v2.1

A random map is something I thought. But how can I do that if I'm not sure that a starting location is good enough to allow a civ the production of settlers (remember they cost more)? Furthermore, I don't think that with (small) random maps there are speed problems. Not the same as Earth maps.

My PTW version used Kal-El's 140x140 map and I prefer using things made by myself. Thus, his map can't handle a lot of civs in Europe (try to put Spain AND Portugal in it: the ancient/modern division can't help!). So, I'd need to convert myself my 170x170 to 140x140. But I can't do that until DrAlimentado updates his utility with the resize feature. (Otherwise I'd have to draw it from the beginning! :undecide: ). If I make a decent Earth that can handle lots of civs, I'll make the "smaller" version and make it available for Vanilla and PTW, too.

Thanks for your answer :) and :(

No !!! Post your 2.1 and call the Habee's changes 2.2 :o

Dragoons

Their history begins with infantrymen mounted on horses. However, as this force was developed, more and more attention was paid to riding drills. This resulted in a force that could fight both in mounted and foot formation. They yielded to heavy cavalry in hand-to-hand fighting, but with sufficient training they could accomplish the same missions. Dragoons were armed with a musket (later a musket with a bayonet), a sabre or a broadsword and a pair of pistols. Dragoons had no armour. Their equipment was very much alike to that carried by musketeers, except for the fact that dragoons wore jackboots. In a foot array, they fell in 3 ranks like linear infantry. When mounted, they charged in a tight array like heavy cavalry. As the cavalry developed, dragoons were used less and less as infantry.

Hussars

Hussars constituted a light cavalry force used for bold raids to the enemy's rear, reconnaissance, manning outposts and frontier service. In the period of linear tactics, hussar squadrons took on a special significance. They escorted infantry squads and intercepted deserters. This way they helped maintain discipline and order in the infantry, which often consisted mainly of riffraff. Hussars were usually regarded as adventurous people. The main features of this force were its speed and manoeuvrability. They were excellent horsemen capable of performing numerous tactical moves in a battle. Naturally, they were inferior to heavy cavalry concerning attack power, but that was easily countervailed by their maneuvers, ambushes and sudden charges to the rear or flanks. Hussars were armed with a sabre, a pair of pistols and a short flint musket or blunderbuss (for short-range buckshot fire). Their equipment had many traditional Hungarian features and comprised a dolman (a jacket embroidered with gold or silver cords), a pelisse (an outer jacket with fur worn on the left shoulder), chuckchirs (leather-cased trousers) or riding breeches, boots with tassels and a sabretache worn on the left side.

Spakhs (Turkey)

Along with the janissaries, these troops formed the core of the Turkish army. Spakhs comprised a heavy feudal cavalry settled at the European border of the Turkish Empire. They were perfectly skilled in combat and riding, as well as in hand-to-hand fighting. Their entire life was devoted to soldiering. They constituted a kind of warrior caste which was, in a sense, comparable to European knighthood. Spakhs wore armour and wielded varied weapons.

Cossacks (Russia)

These Cossacks were an irregular cavalry with an original structure and unique administration system. Their ranks were beefed up with fugitive serfs and militaries sent to defend the frontiers. The largest Cossack associations were formed at Dniepro (Zaporizhzhya Sich), Don and Yaik (river Ural). As the Russian monarchy grew stronger in the 19th century, Cossacks gained the status of a regular army. Their weapons and equipment were manifold, but mainly they were armed with a scimitar, pistols, a musket and a lance. A Cossack used no armour except for the occasional light chain mail, and wore a long caftan without buttons and a tall fur cap. Like the light cavalry, Cossacks attacked in an extended array. They were quick and manoeuvrable, successful in raids to the rear, good at outflanking maneuvers and were often used for gaining new territories and performing frontier duties.

By the 17th century, the classic regular cavalry had been formed. Basically it was divided into heavy and light cavalry. The difference between them lay in the quality of their horses and their combat tactics. Heavy cavalry had big, strong horses, were slower during the attack, but inflicted mightier strokes.

Light cavalry horses were faster and more manoeuvrable. Heavy cavalry charged in tight formations and heavy riders wore cuirasses, protecting them from splinters and bullets fired from more than 50 steps away. Units able to preserve their tactical array during an attack had a great advantage. After a hand-to-hand fight, the quick restoration of their array was essential, while the enemy could send fresh cavalry units into attack and annihilate the new victors.

Militari trad:
-Hussar (Light Cavalry A/D/M 5/2/3 ,Blitz )
-Dragoons (Heavy Cavalry A/D/M 5/3/2)
-Spakhs (Ottoman Heavy Cavalry A/D/M 7/3/2 ,+10Cost)
Nationalism
-Cavalry
-Cossacks
____________________________
Hussar obsolte Horseman
Dragoons obsolte Knight
Cavalry obsolte Dragoons
Tank obslote Hussar and Cavalry (But don't have upgrad ability)

Scot leadershead but u can use it for Hungary as King Luis

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=29852

And some Units:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=50408

Thank you for the info, habee; it has been very useful.

I'll change something in the Military tradition area, and other things, too. I'm not sure it's ok but I think I've found a good compromise between History and "not tweaking too much".

I'm sorry for Hungary, but I don't think that everyone else would be happy if I removed Austria and put Hungary with a leaderhead with scottish flag on the background and so a 20MB download only for the patch.
I suggest you to try to do it (if you don't know how to, I'll explain you)

I thought of doing this:

Mil. Tradition:
Hussar 5/3/2/80 + blitz
Sipahi 7/3/2/80 (no blitz as it's heavy cavalry)
Shifta 5/2/2/80 + blitz + ignore hills/mountain

Nationalism:
Cavalry 6/3/3/80
Cossacks 6/3/3/90 + blitz

Ok, no problem about Hungary...

I'm waiting the patch (2.1)

P.S.
- I'm can put Hungary for me. I have played civ since 1996 and can make scenarios :-)

The 2.1 version is soon ready ?

1. Too many civ's are in Republic in Ancient, Middle and Industri ages:
-Republic is usefuly because there are many lux resource in the begining of the game -->1-2 Eu. resource change to Bounus resource, and 1-2 American resourece are add with Navigation (Tobaco).
-Everybody can use it, it is a Greek-Latin tech, and need an "Cannot be Traded Flag"

2. Feudalism isn't useful:
-
- High Units support cost (3) pls change to 1

3. In Industry and Modern age everybody are in Democracy so there are many units Low the units support cost. If u put Higher (2-3) The game will faster and handle.
4. I can't Build the Suez-chanel pls. correct the map.

5. I find this in civ3.com in UUR mod:

Simple mod to rebalance a handful of the unique units:

Jag Warrior: Added ignore forest/jungle move cost
Legionary: Added build roads/forts
War Chariot: Added 1/0/1 defensive bombard
Hwach'a: Removed lethal land bombard (but kept lethal sea bombard), increased bombard stats to 10/1/2
Keshik: Added 2/0/1 defensive bombard (Bad Brett gets credit for this idea)
Chasqui Scout: 0/1/1, ATAR (Incans start with one)
Enkidu Warior: 3/1/1, 25 shields, requires Mysticism (Sumerians can build warriors and spearmen)
Crusader: Added build barricades and enslave to worker ("converts") :)

6, If u change the leadershead to flags u dont need to make a XXXMb mod when add some new civ (In africa or Asia) and it can change in evrey age (Babylon's flag to Iraq Flag). But this change not important.


I like the change with cavalry.
If not problem i ,will write for you more changes (whenn will I have something)

Rhye, is there a place where you discuss the "special rules" you used to minimise load times? I'm gearing up to start modding my personal mod (once C3C arrives), and I'm interested in implementing some of your ideas so that my games don't take as long to load, etc...

1 - I haven't studied much the governments, and I didn't know most of the civs use Republic. But with the changes you suggest, will the number of civs reduce? Mmmh. However, I've corrected some favourite & shunned gov'ments

2 - I've already been told. Done.

3 - ?? I didn't understand what you mean

4 - I forgot to do that before. It doesn't look as I wished, but it's done and it works.

5 - The legionary already does that. Same for Crusader. I fear that adding Crusaders and Fanatics the enslavement ability may make that wonders too powerful
Jaguar Warrior -> it's wheeled! I can't do that!




Lachlan -> Sorry for the delay. The food/shields thing made the game slower, and i had to work around that (my last test game now was even faster!). Furthermore, new things were added (not only those mentioned in these posts) these last days and I'm testing (again) now. If nothing is added by now, I guess it'll be ready in 2 days.

Originally posted by Mithadan
Rhye, is there a place where you discuss the "special rules" you used to minimise load times? I'm gearing up to start modding my personal mod (once C3C arrives), and I'm interested in implementing some of your ideas so that my games don't take as long to load, etc...

It's all explained in the readme.
If you use some concepts from it, quote me ;)

Originally posted by Rhye
It's all explained in the readme.
If you use some concepts from it, quote me ;) Ah, thanks, good to know. I will certainly quote you! A man has got to give credit where credit is due. :)

Too many units = slowing computer

I should uploaded my save :(

In the next occurence i will upload my 1800 AD 2.0

v2.1 released (see first page)

- Updated some settings to Conquests v1.15BETA.
- Ancient settler costs 120/3; Medieval settler costs 180/4; Modern settler costs 260/5: AI should be less hampered while game speed should not be affected
- Changes to the map: added and removed many resources and LM terrains to rebalance the game after the settlers settings change
- Modifiez Suez region
- Added maize and rice bonus resources (same as wheat: 2 food)
- Fanatic stats changed to 5/1/1
- Edited difficulty levels (now the game is more difficult and the AI is more protected at the beginning)
- Feudalims government cost/unit: 1
- Updated civilopedia Forbidden palace and Secret Police HQ entries to v1.15
- Fixed some errors in civilopedia
- Corrected civilopedia resources and terrains entries
- Corrected civilopedia entries for wheeled units
- Palace gives a 50% bonus defense in its city
- Town/city/metropolis bonus defense: 20/40/60
- Cheaper upgrades (2)
- Colossus requires Iron Working (it had some parts made in Iron)
- Pyramids require incense; Holy War requires incense; Oracle requires incense (needed in cerimonies); Hanging Gardens require wine (the gardens contained vines)
- Pyramids cost decreased to 20 (it was the first wonder to be built); Hanging Gardens cost decreased to 20; Colossus cost increased to 30; Oracle cost decreased to 20; Statue of Zeus cost decreased to 15; Holy War cost decreased to 25
- Swapped internally Feudalism and Monotheism (no effect in the tech tree: the only effect is that AI researches Feudalism first and Medieval Settlers enter in the game some turn earlier)
- Mathematics cost decreased to 6; Monarchy cost decreased to 14; The Republic cost decreased to 16; Construction cost decreased to 18
- Feudalism cost decreased to 26; Monotheism cost decreased to 34; Chivalry cost increased to 44; Printing Press cost increased to 40; Astronomy cost decreased to 54; Military tradition cost decreased to 48
- Shifta no longer wheeled
- Hussar 5/3/2/80 + blitz; requires Military Tradition
- Sipahi 7/3/2/80 (no blitz as it's heavy cavalry); requires Military Tradition
- Shifta 5/2/2/80 + blitz + ignore hills/mountain; requires Military Tradition
- Changed some favourite or shunned governments (Byzantines, Portugal, Arabia, France, Germany)
- Republic free units changed from 1/3/4 to 1/2/3
- Plant forest turns increased to 32

As usual, keep posting here feedback, as I have tested the game only till 1500 AD.

The patch won't overwrite the biq v2.0, so you can still play with it if you prefer the old food/shields settings. But as you can see, many things have been changed thanks to your feedback after v2.0 release,

Units are still numerous :( ?

I love this mod! :goodjob:

It really adds alot of realism to Civ3.


Keep it up!!

I also love this mod, but would like 2.1 better if the Reveal Entire Map box was uncheked...

Just a little heads up! ;)

Oh!! Sorry I forgot to uncheck the reveal!!!!! I use it to test AI...
I'll correct at once! Sorry, please re-download!

I prefer revealed because AI has not unexplored map :lol:

Seriously Rhye why handicapind human player with "Unexplored Black Tiles" while AI see you in any circonstances ?

It add more fun to see whole map, and your rules are efficients with "reveal entire map" ...

If revealed, i can see as AI see ...
The scouts doesn't longer works in automove
This is the only minus ...

Rhye i suggest to you that you propose two versions of this biq :
revealed for them want a few fun and unrevealed for purists !

What do you think ?

mmm....
It has been said that this mod is easy. Checking that option is another help for the player.
IMO it's unrealistic, but if you prefer that, do it. After all, we all know the world map very well; no need to explore it!

About the number of units: i can't see if there's an excess of some type of units without SpiderZord's PwerBar Utility (which doesn't work with Conquests). And if I can't see that, all I can do is reducing the number of cities (that produce units), and I've already done this.

I have a confession to make. I'm hopelessly addictied to this mod. I appreciate the amount of time and effort you took into creating it. I'm not into the randomly generated maps anymore. I used to play the Test of Time mod but that thing is really a resource hog and becomes completely unplayable at around the middle ages and remains that way for the rest of the game. You've accomplished the fastest loading world map mod. I'm using an AMD XP 1800 with 2 GB of RAM. I can complete a game in 1/3 the time that I could on the Test of Time mod (around 20 hours versus the 60 hours for the other map). My compliments to the new terrain and the modifications to the existing ones.

I've been playing random nationalities so far. The first game I played as the Chinese. I coerced the Koreans and Mongols out of their techs before quickly eliminating them. Then I noticed Japan was settling in the lower mainland of China which I had to eradicate. Our relationship remained sour for the rest of the game. The jungles and mountains provided a nice barrier but also prohibited my expansion. I made the grave mistake of switching to a Feudalistic government without realizing how it would cripple my empire. It wasn't until I learned Communisim that I recovered from this. I ended up losing the game to the Arabs in due to their high culture. One of the things I noticed in this game was that the Arabs had bombers in the late 1400s which I thought wasn't supposed to happen.

The next game I played was with the Babylonians. This game lasted about 20 minutes after my failed strike on Sumeria. The Arabs declared war on me a few turns later and I couldn't keep up.

The following game was really interesting. I played as Rome and conquered the globe on turn 2049. My best unit was the Cavalry. The 8 turn minimum research time really crippled me from advancing but my military was unstoppable. I ended up building the Holy War, Knights Templar, and the Statue of Zeus which really helped to crush the European opposition. I would like to mention something to the fella who says you need Ivory to build it. You can either contact the Indians and trade for it or conquer Carthage. There is Ivory close to Rome which makes this possible. I also noticed in this game that I couldn't build the Suez Canal which meant my navy had to go around the Horn to strike at the Far East.

The last game I played as the Persians and it was by far the most fun I've had at civ in a long time. I got lucky and found a settler on the goody hut near Turkey early on. I was going to complain that the Immortal has been reduced to a Spearman but noticed that the shield cost is half. I'm not sure I agree with it 100% but I didn't need them for very long anyway. The Arabs and Babylonia declared war on me almost immediately after I got the free settler. Sumeria didn't want to let me move through their territory so I eliminated them with the force I was sending to Arabia. Babylon must have panicked and sued for peace immediately. I accepted their terms but declared war on them as soon as the Arabs were eliminated. I noticed the Ottomans only had 3 cities so I decided to take care of them because I've seen what the Sipahi can do. Egypt ony had two cities and fell right after that. By this time the middle ages had rolled around and I built up my Knights. I noticed that India was developing slowly and crushed them before they could build the War Elephants. Now my empire was huge and the effects of corruption set in. The Europeans were advancing quickly in the tech area so I decided to dig in and hold out for the industrial age. I knew I was sitting on the gold mine with all the resources that I would need. I generated a lot of income from the Europeans by selling my incense to them. It was interesting to watch Spain rise to power and colonize South America and the Gold Coast. The game really got hairy when everyone learned Nationalism during the late 1800s. The whole world erupted into a series of wars which was really cool to sit on the sidelines and watch them beat on each other. Spain was reduced into a size of what it is today and Germany gained a lot of power. I was about two techs behind Germany and England and it was looking bleak for me. I missed building the Theory of Evolution by one turn which would have put me right back into it. I switched my government to Facisim to get the worker bonuses and prepare for an all out war. England tried to plant a spy on me and I got ticked. No one would sign an alliance which furthered my anger. I've never been successful planting spys before this game. I took the gamble and got one in England. Now I began to sabotage production and steal tech from her. :cool: Germany got very upset when I got caught spying and declared war on me. I called favors on all the civs which I was being nice to for the whole game to help and they came to my rescue. A few turns later I finished the UN and was voted in almost unanimously.

I started a game as the Americans but I don't think they really belong in this mod for the following reasons. North America is an extremely resource rich continent and on this map it is way too small. You've also got marsh where Virginia and the Carolinas are which is higly innacurate. Those are tobbaco rich areas with lots of farmland. My suggestion would be to get rid of the Americans altogether. After all, America was created by the Europeans and as it is set up now, there really isn't a way for them to develop into a Super Power. So far, I've eliminated the Iroquois because they wouldn't trade tech with me and spent the whole time fighting barbarians. There isn't one single horse resource in America (I'm aware that they weren't here until Europe arrived), but the Americans defeated the Indians with the Cavalry. By the time America makes contact with Europe it is way behind on the learning curve which makes the end game unrealistic as far as tech goes. It's around 1400 and I just learned Chivalry and Invention. Europe will be here in a couple 100 years and in entering the Industrial age before I'm halfway done with the middle ages. There is a slim chance of getting into the game at that point. Most AI civs are reluctant to part with their precious technology and I'm a sitting duck for a number of large scale invasions.

I would replace America (keep in mind that I'm American) with a Plains Indians tribe with the mouted warriors to keep the Iroquois and Aztecs in check. You could cripple them further so they're not too strong when the Europeans arrive.

I think this mod is way too easy if you have a civ in or close to Europe and too hard if you start far away from it. I would prefer it to be challenging no matter which nation I start with. Berlin has the best starting spot and always grows huge. I really think they have a good advantage being Scientific and Miliarious. I'm not sure what you can do to balance that out. Maybe make techs not tradeable. 90% of the time the AI won't trade it with you unless they get an advantage but they'll trade it freely amongst themselves.

Anyone can argue the inclusion or exclusion of certain civilizations because of the nature of the game. In all reality, northern Europe didn't really exist as civilized nations until the late middle ages and by that time the great civilizations of the middle east had already peaked. It's too bad that there isn't a way to simulate that on a world map.

I'm going to download the new version and start plahing it right away. Despite any of the small shortcomings, this mod is top notch and a lot of FUN to play.

Originally posted by EL_OSO
I have a confession to make. I'm hopelessly addictied to this mod. I appreciate the amount of time and effort you took into creating it. I'm not into the randomly generated maps anymore. I used to play the Test of Time mod but that thing is really a resource hog and becomes completely unplayable at around the middle ages and remains that way for the rest of the game. You've accomplished the fastest loading world map mod. I'm using an AMD XP 1800 with 2 GB of RAM. I can complete a game in 1/3 the time that I could on the Test of Time mod (around 20 hours versus the 60 hours for the other map). My compliments to the new terrain and the modifications to the existing ones.


Thank you very much. :thanx:
This is what brings to me the motivation to spend my time on the mod.


Originally posted by EL_OSO
One of the things I noticed in this game was that the Arabs had bombers in the late 1400s which I thought wasn't supposed to happen.

Strange. Never happened in all my test games (all at Monarch level). With what difficulty level were you playing?

Originally posted by EL_OSO
I started a game as the Americans but I don't think they really belong in this mod for the following reasons. My suggestion would be to get rid of the Americans altogether. After all, America was created by the Europeans and as it is set up now, there really isn't a way for them to develop into a Super Power.
I would replace America (keep in mind that I'm American) with a Plains Indians tribe with the mouted warriors to keep the Iroquois and Aztecs in check. You could cripple them further so they're not too strong when the Europeans arrive.


I know very well the problem. With a stronger America, they reach South America before Europeans and colonization won't happen. To avoid this, I prefered having them a little weaker and I hope that being alone and far from wars and with much commerce, they could reach European tech level in 1800.
I never knew if it has happened, because in my test games I don't play, just watch and so have no gold to spend on espionage. (And PowerBar utility doesn't work with Conquests for now).
Getting rid of America is a possible way if I find a good user-made animated leaderhead. And for now there aren't. There's no problem for UU instead (Mounted Warrior for Sioux)



Originally posted by EL_OSO
North America is an extremely resource rich continent and on this map it is way too small. You've also got marsh where Virginia and the Carolinas are which is higly innacurate. Those are tobbaco rich areas with lots of farmland.


Mashes are on my atlas. Maybe I've put too much...anyway I'll remember this, in case of another update.


Originally posted by EL_OSO

I think this mod is way too easy if you have a civ in or close to Europe and too hard if you start far away from it.

In all reality, northern Europe didn't really exist as civilized nations until the late middle ages and by that time the great civilizations of the middle east had already peaked. It's too bad that there isn't a way to simulate that on a world map.


In v2.1 I've decreased food importance and raised shields importance (see new Settlers costs). This caused a mess with the strength of some civs. I hope that my re-balancing was better this time.
Furthermore, there are some new changes with the wonders. Some resources are needed and in this way some ancient wonders will probably not be built in Europe. In this way the game is more realistic and a little less Euro-centric in Ancient age.
I recommend you to re-download patch v2.1 if you did before this morning (27/02).
Hemmmmm......*this* morning means your night ;)

I've played all of them at Monarch level as well. Keep in mind that I didn't realize there was a patch already when I was writing the first post. Maybe that game was an oddity. All of the other games I played were pretty much on par with normal world history. I've played games at higher levels on randomly generated maps and got the feeling that I was playing against a stacked deck most of the time. I'm most comfortable at Monarch level.

I've already started a game on the new patch and it is hard to say what's going on at the moment. I picked random and ended up with the Japanese so I'm pretty isolated. I've colonized Hong Kong, the Phillipines, and northeastern Australia. I've built a large navy and have had to combat multiple barbarian ships in the South Pacific with my galleys. Korea got a little ambitious and tried to run through my naval blockade after I told him to stay out of my territory so naturally I had to go to war.

Here is a screenshot of the start of hostilities:
http://eloso.3dretreat.com/civ/koreainvasion.gif

My samurai warriors sliced through Seoul like warm butter. He built Wonson on the coast of mainland China and I wasted about 20 samurai attempting to take the city with the aid of the Chinese. That battle didn't go so well for me and war weariness started to set in. My golden age ended before I could take the city (I suspect it is his last) and sued for peace as soon as China bailed out of the war.

Here is a screenshot of the end of hostilities:
http://eloso.3dretreat.com/civ/koreapost.gif

Spain came around and visited my Australian colonies and now I have contact with several European nations. It is the mid 1700s and they are in the Industrial age already. They are trading communications which gave me the hint but refuse to trade any tech with me. I've managed to steal a couple of techs from China to stay even with him but I'm broke at the moment so I'll have to rebuild my economy over the next hundred or so years. I've already got a naval force ready with settlers and Musketmen to jump on Alaska as soon as I get Magnetism which is a good 12 turns away unless I can get lucky. After that, I still have all of the other upper Middle age techs to learn (Printing Press, Banking, Economics, Navigation, etc.) I'm not sure if I'll be a contender in the end with my current situation but I'll ride the storm out.

The funny thing I noticed so far is that China and Korea always have had the same tech as I plus a couple more. I think they are stealing it from me but I haven't caught them yet.

I really get a kick out of all the advisors and how the game plays out. Sometimes it gets difficult to keep track of what is really happening or has happened in a chaotic game. For example, Korea violated my territory and I asked him to leave. His non-compliance with my wishes led to a war. Now he has run off and told China that we had a Right of Passage agreement. The Chinese nearly had a fit when a worker accidentally stepped out of bounds. I really like this feature in the game, but I think in a future release they should allow more interaction at the diplomatic level and let the player initiate these "false" propoganda campaigns.

Ok enough talk. Now I have to go play a few more turns. :)

Any patch-related feedback?

The new version is better, is played with Spanish and I can creat the Colonial Empire about 1500 AD - 1600 AD but then the English bought (1600AD+) many ships and colonis and wonders and i lost. :-(

- Americans colonize in south-america
- the Iroquis Start Position is ok?
- i like the changes God Work....

Originally posted by Rhye
Any patch-related feedback?


This Japanese Empire is being played on the 2.1 version. I personally think the defense bonus for the capital is too much and has led to an extreme slowdown in play. I'm going to switch mine to 25% for the next game and let you know if that helps.

It is currently 1972 and no one is in the modern age yet. I still have a naval force of frigates. Korea, Russia, Austria, and the Scandanavians have been eliminated. The rest of the civs are still present. The only thing I see that changed that could cause this would be the increased palace defense bonus. The map used to be somewhat slow between 1400 and 1800 and then leveled off, but I don't see that happening now.

Another example of the palace defense bonus being too high is the second time I attacked Korea it took 12 turns and roughly 12 frigates bombarding, 6 knights, 3 hussars, and 30-40 Samurai to eliminate the 2 elite pikeman in his capital :( (all of my units were veteran).

Austria grew rather nicely. I'm not on that side of the map but would suspect it is over the Romanian oil fields that caused the war to eliminate them. Germany is still way too strong. There really isn't anything to stop an eastern expansion. The second big world war started in 1962. I've also turned my science research down to nothing since it is more cost effective and faster for me to gain technology by stealing it. I've switched to a democracy and am gaining about 350 gold per turn.

Hopefully some more civs are eliminated in this war to help speed things up. Almost everyone is at war with Germany so we'll see how that goes.

Originally posted by 123john321
Hate to say it, but the 1st turn was REALLY SLOW! Yet again, it's most likely the fact that I have a slow computer: Pentium II, 350Mhz, and 128MB RAM...

your computer slow mine is 200mhz, 64 ram and conquests works fine on it

I propose than planes and boats play as in Civ 2

For boats it's ok but for planes you must find the separation beetwen planes' moves and road moves ...

Originally posted by hoplite505


your computer slow mine is 200mhz, 64 ram and conquests works fine on it

:eek: What ! I have a 2.4 Ghz with 512 Mo of Ram !

Error report: I tried to load the rsources section of the Civilopedia, but it cfrashed, saying it couldn't find the small civilopedia icon for rice. I couldn't find it either...

Also, every unit except the settler and worker appears to be wheeled. Is that on purpose?

The rice icon works. Just checked. Have you installed the patch correctly? Nobody has told anything about that until now.



About the wheeled thing, that is on purpose: mountains shouldn't be crossed without a road

I recently installed the 2.1 and everytime i try to build a settler it gives me this error.Anyone know how to fix this? Your help is greatly welcomed!

Originally posted by Rhye About the wheeled thing, that is on purpose: mountains shouldn't be crossed without a road [/B]

Yes, but plateaus seem to be impassible also. Is that really realistic?

Originally posted by jalapeno_dude


Yes, but plateaus seem to be impassible also. Is that really realistic?

That depends on what your perception of what a plateau is.

My perception is a flat hilltop surrounded by steep sides, almost like a cliff.

Using that perception I would say it is realistic.

Originally posted by hiya1
I recently installed the 2.1 and everytime i try to build a settler it gives me this error.Anyone know how to fix this? Your help is greatly welcomed!

You've probably messed up the Conquests. Check that every folder is in its right place. In this case, it seems that your Age of Discovery conquest is no longer in its place.


Originally posted by jalapeno_dude


Yes, but plateaus seem to be impassible also. Is that really realistic?


Well, that depends. I've put it in the mod to create an alternative to the mountains (to make more variation to some territories like Tibet or western USA and not using hills), so plateaus should share Mountains flags. They should represent very high useless rocks, or simply the connection between desert and mountains.
It's not bad refle