It is a bit not enoght troops, as allways...

@King Alex
One thing may be resonable to declare earlier: If Russians will have troops we may ask them "remove or Declare" If they declare, war happines will compensate WW of longer war. Cetarnly our City under tread should be defended...

I'm going to play soon.

As I see the save, we're not in position to declare before we build our army.

It's difficult for a player in a SG to have a clear plan of moving his few units constantly for war and the planning takes too much time that I can't afford. I'll not go for a war in my turns. I'm not feeling safe to do it. I'll focus on your suggestions, though.

I'll play my turns and we see what'll do.

Good luck. Start Moscow Settler Factory. Settel North and NW.

Pre-turn
Set science to 100% and Mcmg Berlin to get Engineering in 1 turn, but Leipzig is going to riot the next turn(no matter how I set the citizens).

260AD (1)
We get Engineering, set to Feudalism with a single scientist in Nuremberg. Leipzig riots. Raise Lux back to 10%.
By the way: Rouen(French) has iron inside it’s borders.

270AD (2)
We find Bremen. “Transfer” our single scientist in Leipzig.

280AD (3)
Change Moscow from worker to library: other workers coming soon.
Chinese know the Republic, Monarchy and Currency: Soon they’ll trade them with India and Japan. India knows Monarchy. Japan doesn’t know the previous techs yet. I don’t want China to make extra cash, so I’ll trade the Republic to India and Japan.(in any case, I won’t sell communications).
Trade Monarchy to Japan for 4g + WM.
Trade Republic to India for 6g + 7gpt + WM.
I rush a library in Moscow for 140g.

290AD (4)
We find Stuttgart. Liz knows Feudalism, is behind in Republic, Monarchy, Monotheism and Engineering. I won’t make a trade.

Ibt
Ebgland start Sun Tsu’s, Japan starts Hanging Gardens.

300AD (5)
Nothing

Ibt
I’ve taken out the north-east barb camp, but 2 barb horses are heading for Stuttgart(undefended) and we can do nothing about it: next turn they’ll do some damage.

310AD (6)
Berlin: marketplace -> sword. Hurry library in Paris for 124g.

Ibt
We lose 17g from the barb horses in Stuttgart.

320AD (7)
Hurry library in St.Petersburg.

Ibt
We learn Feudalism, thanks to the GL! Set science to Invention.

330AD (8)
England is in Anarchy(because of war, or it’s changing government?)

340AD (9)
Gathering units, but it’ll take a few turns to be in position to strike Russia.

350AD (10)
Nothing.

Summary:
1) I have a settler going to settle right east of Berlin(on the coast). 1 settler comes out of Moscow next turn. Heidelburg(pop5, grows in 3) completes another settler in 3 turns, same with Konigsberg. We can settle the north area quickly enough, while England is busy with the war against France.
2) We now have a lot more workers to improve the terrain and to connect our new cities after a while. I had Nuremberg produce only workers, since it hasn’t enough shields and grows quickly. I also have 2 worker groups to improve the terrain of Berlin and Hamburg. We need 2 more wokers for Frankfurt, since it’s a strong shield city and could become stronger.
3) I have a SoD near Sverdlovsk fortified(could go up to Odessa) and a smaller one near Kiev. A SoD of horses is at Tblisi. We need to wait for a few more turns to gather more units and to take Sverdlovsk, Odessa, Sevastopol, Minsk and Kiev; we can do it(all we need is a little patience to gather our units).
4) Russia started settling to the south, but it doesn’t matter. They’ll have no hope left after we strike their border cities(the new cities would need MANY turns to be connected and improved).
5) I really think that England is going to be a threat in the future. Sometime later, when we have enough units, we can strike them and take them piece-by-piece.
6) Our priority should be to settle the north land and to build our army from our core cities. Then we can strike England while we continue to settle to the south(before India/China/Japan claim a piece from our continent). Maybe we offer them trades to declare each other, but don’t forget: India pays us 7gpt for the moment. Or, maybe we decide to trade them techs(while the GL is in effect) and take their money to rush buildings in our cities. We’ll see.

The SAVE (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm2/Ankka_SG002_AD0350_01.SAV)

EDIT: It's good to keep the 2 swords and the horse near our new cities to the north to face barbs and to secure that our settlers don't die. Maybe we send there 2 more swords or Pikes. Make sure that after 2 more workers fo to Franfurt, the new workers go to connect/improve our north cities, so settle faster.

280AD (3)
Change Moscow from worker to library: other workers coming soon.
Chinese know the Republic, Monarchy and Currency: Soon they’ll trade them with India and Japan. India knows Monarchy. Japan doesn’t know the previous techs yet. I don’t want China to make extra cash, so I’ll trade the Republic to India and Japan.(in any case, I won’t sell communications).
Trade Monarchy to Japan for 4g + WM.
Trade Republic to India for 6g + 7gpt + WM.
I rush a library in Moscow for 140g.


Very bad idea indid! We should dominate population and with Monarchy Japan will grow faster then we are! you may use it to drug them in war at least not let to trade between each others...

Very bad idea indid! We should dominate population and with Monarchy Japan will grow faster then we are! you may use it to drug them in war at least not let to trade between each others...

Yes, I think that was a bad move. But, what are we going to do now? Gift Japan and China a tech to fight India? What do you think?

EDIT: Maybe it wasn't a bad move after all. Here's what I was thinking: India is the same size as Japan and China together. With Monarchy, Japan and China can fight India better. So, are we going to wait until the deal with India expires, or give Japan time to built it's Samurai and, therefore, have a better chance?

EDIT 2: Japan is a small civ compared to India and China(who already knew Monarchy), so it's not going to play any role. Better for them to have Monarchy, to fight India.

We have gpt with India we lose it then...
My Idea was to fight against India and demand some Cities at the end of war...

Our military strong vs India and weak vs Japan. So we can demand from India only...

We can wait 10-15 turns, so we don't lose our deal with India, and gift a tech to Japan and China to fight them, what do you think?

EDIT:Ok, give your thoughts/suggestions about what we should do, and we'll see how it goes.

Look at save. We should rush settlers from MOSCOW ONLY! Core Cityies should build Markets for cash flow! Scietist in Leipzig - redicules! You may use clown in Tours for that. Berlin and Leipzig lose 13 and 7 Shield when produce unit. you should Mcmg berlin for 15 and Leipzig for 10 not to loose.
Also McMg Moscow 10 food surpluss to rush settlers each second turn...

We can wait 10-15 turns, so we don't lose our deal with India, and gift a tech to Japan and China to fight them, what do you think?

EDIT:Ok, give your thoughts/suggestions about what we should do, and we'll see how it goes.
May be. But I'm not sure that we want gifted China. Japan is enough.

After markets, we should go for units from those cities? We could rush markets there, since we have a good cash per turn.

EDIT: Maybe we can allow those 2 cities cities just to build their settler: they both have pop5 and grow soon. After we can build markets. That way, we'll settle sooner and have plans for the south as well.

After markets, we should go for units from those cities? We could rush markets there, since we have a good cash per turn.
Cash was just enough to rush settlers and Libs at the end of 40 turns.
You put Stuttgard too close, we need big distance between cities to cover as much land as possible... we need barracks in Peterburg to upgrade warriors and send them to fight...

EDIT: Maybe we can allow those 2 cities cities just to build their settler: they both have pop5 and grow soon. After we can build markets. That way, we'll settle sooner and have plans for the south as well.
We do not need settle "soonner". All we need to grab continent at turn 80. Suddenly.

What we need "sooner" is cash for everyting.

Ok, then. Are you going to give mabellino suggestions, so she knows what our plan is?

Dear Ankka (or Mabelino) Please
Put all cities for Maximum growth. Irrigate grasslands.
We need population domination. Settele as remote as possible in parquet mode (37 tiles square) Change scietist in Leipzig to normal, it will grow in one turn. Use Clown in Tours for that.
Next turns Mcng Berlin and Leipzig to produce HORSES each 2 and 3 turns.
Do not build settlers anywhere except Moscow! Micromng Moscow to have 10 food surplus not to loose population. Cash rush settlers each 2 turns.
DO NOT BUILD WALLS IN PARIS If it flips we will fight agaist it.
Put Paris swords from hill on oposite tile place not to attack across the river.
Reposition troops near Kiev again, not to attack across the river. Do not Irrigate deserts it is vest! Build/rush harbor, Library in Nuremberg, it will grow
I think you should start fight with Russians. We should finish them asap to regroupe for English. We may begin Kiev and Sverdlovsk and leave Minsk Sevastopol later.
Good idea: to settle to open access to close sea (rush Galley in Smolensk) it will help for next settelment and war with Russians.
Bring Pickmen from Nuremberg to Hamburg. Lot of things you can do...

Move worker from Moscow Ivory to cut forest near Tbilisi, Do not cut forest near Berlin: shields will vested.
If new GL appear build FP in Peterburg.

Send Elite horse fron Kenig to front... We need GL. Better send horse from Berlin NW.

mabellino may play.

Nice planning, Ivan. :)

Hi Guys
I'll try to play tonight but might not be able to since my parents are coming for a visit and I need to get my house clean! lol!
If I can't play tonight then it will definately be on Saturday... hope that's within the 72 hour rule...
The game seems to be getting harder... more cities=more micromanagement but hopefully Ivan's plan will mean we're finished soon.

Did anyone else notice Karasu's post? That means he's been reading our thread! Let's get him! :lol:

I'm going to have to print out all of the above posts and keep them handy when I play... there's loads to remember!

Speak soon
Mab

Did anyone else notice Karasu's post? That means he's been reading our thread!

Of course I am! :D I am the Staff secret spy into everyone else's thread :D :joke:
...or rather, trying not to let you miss Mad-Bax too much while he's away

Of course I am! :D I am the Staff secret spy into everyone else's thread :D :joke:
...or rather, trying not to let you miss Mad-Bax too much while he's away

But you have been exposed now :lol:
I mean, don't you, spies, are supposed to be well trained, both physically and psychologically, so you don't expose who you are? :crazyeye:
That training goes double for double agents as Karasu :scan:

EDIT: I hope, you're in no way "connected" with Staff Team, so you tell them what our plans are! :eek:

mabellino may play.

Nice planning, Ivan. :)
So, what roster is? When Ankka will play?

Probably after mabellino, as the roster is. If I understood correctly from her post, that was her "got it", since she mentioned the 72h rule.

Inspite my emotional critics of King Alex, I must say, that he played well in general and did nothing wrong that will make my plan impossible. 5-6 turns delay is resonable, and probably more unforseeing things will happend next.
I also must notice his very wise decision
NOT to declare war to Russian. I think we should not at this stage.
They already got Monotheism and nothing we can do if they trade it to English.
Our treaty with French expire in 7 turns and i see no reason to leave them alive. Send swords and catapults back to France. (It takes 8 turns actually). Our next target England (or troops they send to France). We should prepare "mouse trap" for them and destroy.

So, what roster is? When Ankka will play?


I will play as the roster is. Sorry for any confusion caused.

I think we should stic with this plan of settelment. I'd stress:
1) All settlers should come from Moscow
2) position is important (order of Build less important)
Cost of the project (Settlers, Libraries, harbors) about 3600 gold.
It is just what we make in 40 turns.
We should NOT build settlers in our core cities but MARKETS to ensures some surplus of income.
I try to cover almost all land. We, probably will need 1-2 more cities.

Dear I.Larkin: you're going a little emotional some times, but I can see your concern of not ending in the last place! (I play just for fun, not for the competition).
You know, you're a better player than me, especially in Mcmg, and maybe I did stupid things in the previous area(and maybe you got furious with my actions, as a better player you are, but that's ok), because I'm still forcing myself to take a look at every turn in every city :eek:

Finishing off France is an considerable option, but can we make it? I mean, England has sent there too many swords and France will probably won't last long(from the fights I watched in my turns, England lost NONE, even against spears: I guess they got super-lucky), BUT, we can try.

What made you change your plan and propose that we should strike England next? Aren't we going to settle as much land from our continent as we can?
We could do what I've said: Have a STRONG force in all our border cities with England, while we continue to settle the land.

Then again, England WILL declare sometime in the future, because they have more units, and we are right at their borders. I'd worry about our "French" cities(mostly Paris), when and if we're going to declare England. We'd need to send there A LOT of pikemen and catapults, just to defend our cities, while we launch our attack from the east.

Another plan: we declare to France(after a few turns), next we position our troops to take 4-5 Russian cities in 2-4 turns and get England to help. They're going to go to those new Russian cities to the south, so, we have time to send a lot of pikes/swords to our border cities with England and be in position to strike when we have a GOOD force in waiting. Anyway, after Russia is eliminated, England is going to declare on us, sooner or later(because we'd be the only one's left in the continent). By this way, we buy time to built more pikes/swords(and gain 5 more cities), so England won't even think to declare on us while we're in alliance. I'd say to plan to take only a few cities, and then watch England's swords to be defeated by our pikemen/catapults(we'd need enough of them), while we continue to build our army for a later invasion.

Choose what you think is best.

EDIT: Ok, you've decided. Let's go with your plan.

@King -just to be clear: I do play in the staff team, but I am not browsing the threads to steal information.
I am simply helping Mad-bax to run the SGOTM, and I have been looking around to make sure things run smoothly, and help deal with such issues as people missing in action, fighting, screaming, needing information or moral support. :)
And believe me: even though there have been very few problems, simply browsing through the threads takes a lot of time and is not the most exciting thing one could do. So don't worry for your plans -I wouldn't remember them even if I had actually read them :)

@ mabelino. Better to use Hamburg's horses against barbs: may be they'll train to elite. If GL appear again rush FP in S-Ptb, please.

@Karasu: I was just j/k! Never expected to take it seriously. If mad-bax left you in his position, you probably are a responsible person. So, all it's ok!

1) Finishing off France is an considerable option, but can we make it? I mean, England has sent there too many swords and France will probably won't last long(from the fights I watched in my turns, England lost NONE, even against spears: I guess they got super-lucky), BUT, we can try.

2) What made you change your plan and propose that we should strike England next? Aren't we going to settle as much land from our continent as we can?
We could do what I've said: Have a STRONG force in all our border cities with England, while we continue to settle the land.

3) Then again, England WILL declare sometime in the future, because they have more units, and we are right at their borders. I'd worry about our "French" cities(mostly Paris), when and if we're going to declare England. We'd need to send there A LOT of pikemen and catapults, just to defend our cities, while we launch our attack from the east.

4)Another plan: we declare to France(after a few turns), next we position our troops to take 4-5 Russian cities in 2-4 turns and get England to help. They're going to go to those new Russian cities to the south, so, we have time to send a lot of pikes/swords to our border cities with England and be in position to strike when we have a GOOD force in waiting. Anyway, after Russia is eliminated, England is going to declare on us, sooner or later(because we'd be the only one's left in the continent). By this way, we buy time to built more pikes/swords(and gain 5 more cities), so England won't even think to declare on us while we're in alliance. I'd say to plan to take only a few cities, and then watch England's swords to be defeated by our pikemen/catapults(we'd need enough of them), while we continue to build our army for a later invasion.

Choose what you think is best.

EDIT: Ok, you've decided. Let's go with your plan.
1-2) My idea was to fight to Russians in 20 turns breake. Army should work... But we have only 7 turns left. Just to move troops back. Looks stupid, but it's life. You know value of Paris, but we can't build barracks and walls now, only after we destroy France.

3) I often use this trick in my Diety games. Did you notise if England send any Pickmens to France? I belive not. It is very easy to deal with swords on own land with catapults and horses. I think one Pickman per City is enough. Also Englis in Anarchy now, and it will be pause, when they send troops. I'd even take a risk to declare both England and France. But may be for sucsession game it is to difficult. I think Mabelino and Ankka should take a decision declare England after France or not. Did you see, how many swords come to France? They should losee 1-2 for each French City. But the rest is ours. The question is will we let them to return home or will try to kill them in France?
4) Francly spiking I have no clear military plan yet... let's try to work out...

I don't remember exactly how many swords England sent, but I counted AT LEAST 10-12(and others were coming).
I didn't see any pikes, only swords, 1 archer, and 1 horse.

If we're going to declare England, we'd need much more pikes/catapults in the former "French" cities. As the situation is now, it would be impossible to resist an attack from them.

EDIT: Maybe we think to gather a really strong SoD near Paris(or another "French" city), and we launch our attack from there, because it would be close to England's core cities. We should have time to defend OUR core cities, or build another SoD coming down from the east.

I think war with 2 civs at once might be a bit difficult. The English are our biggest threat and we need enough power to take them out quickly without too many casualties. Considering my battle plans usually end in disaster I would rather not be at war with both the french and English. Russia shouldn't be a problem, they're small and poor and don't have their UU and the French have been weakend by almost 40 turns of war.
I'm now at home and am about to open the save so I can check things out.
I'll post again in a few minutes... hang in there and don't go away yet... especially Ivan!

OK I count 6 english swords and 1 archer plus 1 spearman.

Culture Flip issues
I've done some quick calculations and I don't think we are at risk of Paris flipping just yet. Our culture is more than double the French (around 2.3X) and our adviser says they are "admirers". Paris is a pop2 town with 1 foreign national. The biggest risk of culture flips are when there are a lot of foreigners and the difference in culture isn't that great. I think it is important to defend Paris and for that we need Pikes and a wall. Possibly even a barracks for upgrades and 1 turn healing. We do not want to lose the pyramids and GL to the English/French!

Moscow
A 2 turn settlerfactory is intriguing. I like it! Food surplus of +10fpt is easy to achieve since we have tonnes of flood plains (but watch out for disease!) and the +80gpt we're currently making almost makes up the cash rush cost in 1 turn (IIRC 96gold for 24 shields at the moment) Moscow is hopelessly corrupt and only 1 of it's 4 shields is going towards production each turn. Maximising food is the best way to use this city until we get an FP. Come on leaders!


Domination
I assume that I.Larkin generated his world domination plan 10 turns ago which would make 70 turns left. That puts our finish date at 1050AD so I think we can pull ahead in the scoring with this. That is as long as the other teams don't all have the same idea! :p
We need loads of coastal towns and we need them fast... who cares about how hopelessly corrupt they'll be! I don't think city layout is too crucial now, just need to minimise tile overlap so fewer settlers are needed. Hopefully we'll be able to set up another settler factory when we grab some more English land. The other continent can't reach us until Navigation/Astronomy right? So no tech trading unless we need the cash or they'll all be jumping in boats and innundating us cos their land is overcrowded.

War!!!!!!!!
Peace treaty with French ends in 7 turns. Units will take 8 turns to reach them. Nuff said! No point declaring until we're within striking range. No need to worry about a rep hit as all the other continent don't know them yet, lets play dirty for a change and make false peace treaties with the english to exhort cities from them and finish them off that bit quicker! And reach the domination limit quicker :hammer: :spank:

Right I'll hit submit and hang around to see what you think before I play...

Could someone check with mapstat or something that we'll really get enough area with only our own continent?



Moscow
A 2 turn settlerfactory is intriguing. I like it! Food surplus of +10fpt is easy to achieve since we have tonnes of flood plains (but watch out for disease!) and the +80gpt we're currently making almost makes up the cash rush cost in 1 turn (IIRC 96gold for 24 shields at the moment) Moscow is hopelessly corrupt and only 1 of it's 4 shields is going towards production each turn. Maximising food is the best way to use this city until we get an FP. Come on leaders!


Whoa! 2 turn settler factory? That rocks! :D

@mabellino: Move our units in position to strike after 7-8 turns(if there's any French city left, that is). Proceed with Ivan's previous suggestions(after my turns). We'll see how it works, before thinking of declaring at England. As I've said, I don't think we could survive and English attack in the former "French" cities: Just look at our forces there! Anyway, if you want to wait for Ivan's final word/suggestions, do it.

@Ankka: We haven't "uncovered" the entire map, so Mapstat is forbidden(palace=j/k), but we'll do it eventually in the future.

EDIT: Now excuse me for a moment: I have to post my 300st post in the OT [dance] :band: [party]

@Ankka: We haven't "uncovered" the entire map, so Mapstat is forbidden(palace=j/k), but we'll do it eventually in the future.


Oh, that's the reason... Didn't think of that.

OK I count 6 english swords and 1 archer plus 1 spearman.

Culture Flip issues
I've done some quick calculations and I don't think we are at risk of Paris flipping just yet. Our culture is more than double the French (around 2.3X) and our adviser says they are "admirers". Paris is a pop2 town with 1 foreign national. The biggest risk of culture flips are when there are a lot of foreigners and the difference in culture isn't that great. I think it is important to defend Paris and for that we need Pikes and a wall. Possibly even a barracks for upgrades and 1 turn healing. We do not want to lose the pyramids and GL to the English/French!

Moscow
A 2 turn settlerfactory is intriguing. I like it! Food surplus of +10fpt is easy to achieve since we have tonnes of flood plains (but watch out for disease!) and the +80gpt we're currently making almost makes up the cash rush cost in 1 turn (IIRC 96gold for 24 shields at the moment) Moscow is hopelessly corrupt and only 1 of it's 4 shields is going towards production each turn. Maximising food is the best way to use this city until we get an FP. Come on leaders!


Domination
I assume that I.Larkin generated his world domination plan 10 turns ago which would make 70 turns left. That puts our finish date at 1050AD so I think we can pull ahead in the scoring with this. That is as long as the other teams don't all have the same idea! :p
We need loads of coastal towns and we need them fast... who cares about how hopelessly corrupt they'll be! I don't think city layout is too crucial now, just need to minimise tile overlap so fewer settlers are needed. Hopefully we'll be able to set up another settler factory when we grab some more English land. The other continent can't reach us until Navigation/Astronomy right? So no tech trading unless we need the cash or they'll all be jumping in boats and innundating us cos their land is overcrowded.

War!!!!!!!!
Peace treaty with French ends in 7 turns. Units will take 8 turns to reach them. Nuff said! No point declaring until we're within striking range. No need to worry about a rep hit as all the other continent don't know them yet, lets play dirty for a change and make false peace treaties with the english to exhort cities from them and finish them off that bit quicker! And reach the domination limit quicker :hammer: :spank:

Right I'll hit submit and hang around to see what you think before I play...
Culture Flip issues
It is safer to buld catapults in Paris however...
Moscow
A 2 turn settlerfactory is intriguing. I like it!
Good!. Go for it! did you see my picture with City planing? Not costal City, we need Land, not a sea, but it was In avoidable... Some Cities may be not corrupt. (#2 for example).
B]Domination[/B]
I assume that I.Larkin generated his world domination plan 10 turns ago which would make 70 turns left.
Since King Alex did not produce 5 settlers but only 2 it posponend for 6 turns. (He save cash, however). But it may be some other un forseeing difficulties.
War!!!!!!!!
Exactly! If they discover Chivaliry we take it for gpt deal and declare. But before better to keep reputation clean...
Upgrade some warriors and vet spear...

<snip>
Not costal City, we need Land, not a sea
<snip>


Also coasts count into the land area and domination limit AFAIK.

Better we keep continue producing horses to upgrade them to knights once we know Chivalry.

@mabellino: Move our units in position to strike after 7-8 turns(if there's any French city left, that is). Proceed with Ivan's previous suggestions(after my turns). We'll see how it works, before thinking of declaring at England. As I've said, I don't think we could survive and English attack in the former "French" cities: Just look at our forces there! Anyway, if you want to wait for Ivan's final word/suggestions, do it.


War with English: Defenetly not at mabelino's turns. We start war with French at turn 8-9. (If English left them...)

Also coasts count into the land area and domination limit AFAIK.
Are you sure? I should re-think my "parquet" then...

Better we keep continue producing horses to upgrade them to knights once we know Chivalry.
Yes, and in our land with roads horses are more effective then swords.

I checked my parquet. SE looks OK even if Costal tiles count.
But NW not optimal. Because of North Island it is better to check by Galley.
How many costal tiles on the North. Anyway we may close gap with City without Library...

Land and coastal tiles count towards a domination victory BUT we also need 66% of the world's population! That means a few large cities as well as loads of crappy tundra towns.

@King Alex
Congrats on your 300th post! I've been a member here for nearly 3 years and haven't made 200 yet! :blush:
So have you got a custom avatar in mind?

I'm going to play now... wish me luck... :crazyeye:

EDIT: It's Alex not Ivan with the 300posts :blush:

1) Land and coastal tiles count towards a domination victory BUT we also need 66% of the world's population!
2)That means a few large cities as well as loads of crappy tundra towns.

@I.Larkin
Congrats on your 300th post! I've been a member here for nearly 3 years and haven't made 200 yet! :blush:
So have you got a custom avatar in mind?

I'm going to play now... wish me luck... :crazyeye:
1) that mean, that we should scout NW bit better. May be sencible idea to send horses there (not elite, of course to find out) It is difficult to plan parquet without border.
2)you are right. we should irrigate only (grassland as well) and micromanage to get maximum food. also it is good idea to make overseas fight (Japan vs India) and demand some Indians Cities. (Currently we have gpt from India, "unfortunately")
3) What is the "custom avatar"?

Good luck.
Ivan

@I.Larkin... oops I meant King Alex!

I've just played my turns... the French have almost been wiped out but there's a pesky settler somewhere we'll need to watch out for. I haven't declared war as there didn't seem much point... the English would have beaten us to it no matter what we tried. Better to save troops for Russian war.

Quick Summary
Score 607 (now 2nd behing Japan+680) We're catching up!
We have largest land and population so well on way to domination victory
I built 5 settlers who are now on route to locations marked on I.Larkin's map (in number order so we don't get confused!)
Full turn log to follow tomorrow cos I'm going to bed now... night everyone!

Military advisor screen:

Ok heres the save (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm2/Ankka_SG002_AD0450_01.SAV) and a minimap showing where the settlers are going/gone to

Nice job. :)


I think I'll be able to take it today.

Ok here's the turn log:

Pre turn 350AD
Cash rush settler in Moscow, adjust citizens to make +11fpt
Change prod in Paris to Catapult
Change Bremen and St Pete's to barracks
Rush library in Lyon
Change entertainer in Tours to scientist, put leipzig scientist to work on mined plains
Give troops go to orders to regroup near Paris and St Pete's. I really miss the stack command from PTW, it took me a while to realise I could use ctrl+j!

360AD (1)
Build settler in Moscow
Told governor to emphasise production in all cities but still check citizen placement after growth. Free shields are nice remember!
Changed production in all non corrupt cities to markets
Send new pikeman to protect Rheims (12 turns journey time)
MM Munich to take advantage of gold resource (adds +4gpt)
Rush catapult in Paris
Rush barracks in Bremen

IBT
Trade WM with Cathy for her WM+1g
Barbs kill injured sword in NE territories, horseman set to avenge!

370AD (2)
Workers sent to complete road network where required (eg near smolensk etc)
Horseman in NE avenges the death of his brother sword and moves to mountain... reveals 5 conscript barb horses... showtime!

IBT
Barbs attack horseman, promotes to elite and only loses 1hp

380AD (3)
Berlin builds pike (sent to moscow) -> horse in 2t
Rush 2nd settler in Moscow
Rush barracks in St Pete's
Rush lib in Chartres

390AD (4)
Nothing interesting

400AD (5)
Vet sword attacks barb camp, promotes to elite +25g :D
Bonn founded as marked on map earlier
Rush barracks in Lyon
Rush settler in Moscow

410AD (6)
Galley spots island to NW with 2 goodie huts
Trade WM around to everyone for their WM's and 60gold :D

420AD (7)
St Pete's riots (d'oh!) :blush: Decide it could use a temple (4turns)
Spot Russian settler/spear on way to settle near Frankfurt, our settler almost there so use units in the area to block Russians.
Rush settler in Moscow

IBT
English capture Grenoble, french only have 3 cities now

430AD (8)
Rush lib in Bremen
Nuremburg riots... double d'oh! :blush: :sad:

440AD (9)
Rush settler in Moscow
Nothing else interesting, previous settlers almost at their designated spots.

IBT
French request audience and offer all they have for an alliance against the English. I tell them to get lost!

450AD (10)
Moscow builds settler to go to location 6
Pop another barb camp for 25 gold
Rush library in Rheims

Trade WM around for Liz, Ghandi and Joans WM's +30gold
Trade TM to Japs, chinese and russians for their WM's and 1gold

There were loads of horsemen and pikes/swords built but I didn't take detailed notes. I built a couple of catapults too.
We had a few culture expansions too. I can't remember if I upgraded any troops, think I might have using a new barracks. I buikt barracks at strategic spots for one turn healing since the shield waste is a bit high to use these cities for vet units.
Checked F11 and we're #1 in most things including land area and pop.

I'll propably play in the evening today... any ideas or suggestions?

@mabelino.
Have not seen save yet, but turn log looks fine. Why you did not start war with French? i don't mean, you shuold, may be you see reason?

I am very sorry and apologise this, but I need a skip again. Summer vacation is cruel. I have more goings than during the schoolyer...:rolleyes: :(


So, I guess Ivan gets it again.


I'll be away the weekend from the 5th to 8th of June.

I.Larkin: Ok, you're next, since Ankka wants a skip, and he'll be away from 5th to 8th June.

Play your turns, and, after, post our new plan/strategy.

I am very sorry and apologise this, but I need a skip again. Summer vacation is cruel. I have more goings than during the schoolyer...:rolleyes: :(


So, I guess Ivan gets it again.

Thanks. [it is simpler to play myself, then explain to others, how to play] However before I play I want discuss things. I think my parquet plan is exelent and only not enogh cash may cause delay. We know whole map now and Land domination will not be a problem.
@Ankka could you please confirm information that sea tile count?
Problem is population and war. In fact, it is better to eleminate them in 30 turns (if 70 turns left) to bild Libs in some English/Russian Cities. We are 23 turns in peace already and it is not good. I think I'll start war with English first and then we will see, how things will go.
Any ideas? I only thought to take Countebury and stay in defence mode, and make peace for 20 but now it is too late we have to go and kill them now, but dont ask me how. I don't know. May be we postpone our 80 (60 turns left) turns project and make it 100, say? Than it will be relif...
Ivan

@I.Larkin: From what I've read, only ocean tiles don't count.

I don't know what to suggest, since my approach to our situation would be a little different. Let's stay on your plan, and follow it.

Decisison I try to make is will we come to long war with English or short war?
My thought is short war better, before we have knights. I even think to "gift" monoteism to Cina, to have chanses to get it sooner.

Ivan, you have a plan in your mind and maybe it's good. I have my plan. Since now, we go with your plan, so I think it's better to focus on your plan. I'd say we'd come in a long war with England because they have enough cities and they have a good army. But, that's just my opinion. If you think that you can succeed in your plan, I'd be happy to follow you.

@I.Larkin: From what I've read, only ocean tiles don't count.

I don't know what to suggest, since my approach to our situation would be a little different. Let's stay on your plan, and follow it.
So, not only coast, but sea tiles as well? Then it might be a problem.
BTW, do we need 60% of all land or 60% of "populated" land? what do you think about war with English? Our military strong...

Ivan, wait a little until I confirm it(what tiles count).
We need both 60% of the land and 60% of the entire population(I guess, we'd need to settle the entire continent).

If you feel that you can make them a good damage( take 3-4 cities), then go ahead, but you must defend those cities and defend our "French" cities.

Ivan, you have a plan in your mind and maybe it's good. I have my plan. Since now, we go with your plan, so I think it's better to focus on your plan. I'd say we'd come in a long war with England because they have enough cities and they have a good army. But, that's just my opinion. If you think that you can succeed in your plan, I'd be happy to follow you.
My approximate plan is to start war with English in turn 5 or 6 and see, how things will go. Actually you will have to make a desision will this war short or long. I think I will not play today, I had tooth extraction...

Ok, play tomorrow. I'll edit my post and let you know what tiles count for sure. But, take a look at my previous post(second part).

EDIT: I meant 2-3 cities(and defend) and not 3-4.

1. No!

2. No!

1. Sea squares DON'T count towards the Domination Limit. (Coast squares do.)

2. Depends on what version of Civ you're playing:
A. Vanilla Civ & PTW: 2/3 (66.6667%) Land + Coast, Population
B. C3C: 66% Land + Coast, Population


Thanks to EMan, I got this reply in the Quick Answers forum. So, now we know for sure what we need for Domination Victory.

EDIT: @mabellino: thank you! I've crushed the 300posts limit [dance]
BTW, I have something in my mind for a custom avatar.

That's what I was saying. Coasts, not sea... good luck, Ivan. :)

Our military is now rated "strong" against the english so we're in a good position to strike now before they can replace their losses from the french war. I saw quite a few swords killed by french spears and didn't see a single horseman.
War with english appealing now as they can only drag the russians in as allies and they're really weak! We need to send our horsies to pillage their resource squares (eg iron) and if we can we should try and take london asap as this will cause the most damage quickly.
Most of our troops are now in position for a strike against england and we have several cities capable of churning out vet units in 2 turns.
If we get a leader use him to rush the FP in St Pete's then we'll have loads of productive cities and the war should be quick. I think that London built the Great Wall so we should try and grab this city asap (perhaps raze it in case of flips)
Any other leaders should be used to build armies and Sun Tzus.

I propose that I.Larkin should play 20 turns this time as he seems to be the best at war strategy. I'm willing to skip my turn next time to donate it to him!

@mabellino: I don't think that's neccessary. Ankka is away, and has been skipped twice. I think, I.Larkin CAN play 20 turns, since the majority agrees!!!

@mabellino: I don't think that's neccessary. Ankka is away, and has been skipped twice. I think, I.Larkin CAN play 20 turns, since the majority agrees!!!
I think for education purpuse of SG better if I play 10 turns (or 12, say if I found it neccessary). War with French showed that you and mabelino fight well enough. I with Alex do better micromanagement Moscow is MUST. I think I will prepare plan soon and then will play.
Ivan

Our military is now rated "strong" against the english so we're in a good position to strike now before they can replace their losses from the french war. I saw quite a few swords killed by french spears and didn't see a single horseman.
War with english appealing now as they can only drag the russians in as allies and they're really weak! We need to send our horsies to pillage their resource squares (eg iron) and if we can we should try and take london asap as this will cause the most damage quickly.
Most of our troops are now in position for a strike against england and we have several cities capable of churning out vet units in 2 turns.
If we get a leader use him to rush the FP in St Pete's then we'll have loads of productive cities and the war should be quick. I think that London built the Great Wall so we should try and grab this city asap (perhaps raze it in case of flips)
Any other leaders should be used to build armies and Sun Tzus.

I propose that I.Larkin should play 20 turns this time as he seems to be the best at war strategy. I'm willing to skip my turn next time to donate it to him!
Becuse of GW our chances to take London soon is slim.
First Leader defenetly FP in Sptb, and second Leo Workshop. Upgrade horses is very expensive and I even think we should save second Leader until Invention.

Very good Idea to pillage Iron! I think Pickman +horse can penetrate deep enough... My "program minimum" is to take Cantebury and in active defence kill as much as possible to have better deal (Oxford +... ). Program maximum is to take Canterbury, York, Dover and again demand as much as possible. We should keep reputation clean, however, until we get Chivaliry.

I will continue "parquet program", taking into account cost tiles. We should use Galleys to settel remote costal Cities.
Do you want pictures?

A picture speaks a 1000 words!
I think this may well be the turning point of our game. I'm glad I had one good military idea... look how much you guys have taught me already!
Has the parquet plan been modified then? You have at least 4 settlers to play with :)
One request... if you're posting some screenies then please put the grid on for them... makes it so much easier to visualise!

Plan is simple: Concentrate asap and as much as possible troops at point R1 and R2 and attack from point A.

and those lovely furs will make nice mink coats for all the soldiers' wives. Good plan!

1) A picture speaks a 1000 words!
2) I'm glad I had one good military idea... look how much you guys have taught me already!
3)Has the parquet plan been modified then? You have at least 4 settlers to play with :)
One request... if you're posting some screenies then please put the grid on for them... makes it so much easier to visualise!
1,3) I will preapare new parquet pictures after my play. May be not "Final" It is unclear where russians will settel.
2) Another good military idea is road to Dover. May be you mean something else?
Could you tell me why you did not go to war with French? I think it is also good military idea...

I remember from one of your earlier posts that we should go to war with France if there was anything left of them. I didn't think 3 tundra towns was worth potentially losing troops when the English were our main opponents and we needed to conserve strength to tackle them. Besides, moving units down there would mean they'd have to go back on themselves to attack the English. That's why I put most of our units near Paris and St Pete's. I also started roading towards the English because I remember reading that our "military road" was a priority!
One more thing, the more units England sacrificed against French spears (and I saw quite a few!), the less to attack us! The English would have to spend time improving those crappy French tundra towns and it might distract them from building up their military to pre franco war levels (where they would have enough to whip our arses!)

Politics: when gpt deal with India expire we Declare to them and ask Japan and China (Monotheism) to alliance. When China discover Chivaliry we take it for gpt and Declare to China. And ask Japan in allianse vs China. Then all overseas will fight each other, it will decrease total population.

you mean break a deal with china straight away? why not let the GL do all the hard work?
But instigating war sounds good... just better hope they don't turn on us!

1) you mean break a deal with china straight away? why not let the GL do all the hard work?
But instigating war sounds good... just better hope they don't turn on us!
Yes, If we wait TGL, we get it together with English or Russians. Not good.
Also good reason to turn on war Japan-China. We do not need reputation after Knights...
Start to play. Did preturn: most difficult...

uh oh I didn't like the sound of that "pre turn most difficult"! What have you changed? What have I messed up? :p

Not much. Couple workers at NW, tempels (we do not need them...). Most time took analysis how much troops I can send to R1, R2.
Please, do not leave automated moves. Workers and horses run away at turn 1.

Here is the save. I played 6 hours and so exousted that have no power to write turnlog. (If you whant that I describe all elegant maneures I did it will take more then one day). Thanks Mabelino for military road. Helped a lot.
Very brief: I ask Eng remove or declare, they removed.
I declare. War happines appear! Now it is first turn it gone. So it is about 7 turns before WW. With active defence in France English swords were destroyed. I think it is possible to try to take London within next 7 turns. King Alex, please.
I havefinished turn 10 and writing turnlog.
Ignore Midnight save. Regards, Ivan

Team! Where are you? Where is discussion, congratulations?

Suoth East settelment and War preparation with Russians.

Since nobody appear I will finish turn 10 and submit it. I think we should continue game as normal. King Alex?

I finished 10 turns and here is a save

Plan for NW settelment.

00 Each turn I mcm Moscow for food surplus> 10 and rush Settler each second turn.
I trade WM each turn.
0 450 AD
Production changed: Berlin-> Horse, Leipzig-> Horse, (we do not need temples in this game). Nuremberg->Harbor. Mcmg Berlin to gold. Fire Scientist in Tours and hire in Nuremberg. Hire Taxmansin others. Now make 93 gpt vs 85. Send troops to points 1 and R2. Pull swords from hill to road. Send spear to block French Settler/spear. Stop workers near Hannover. One will cut forest, another send to irrigate flood plain for new City.
Bought French and English workers. Send them NW.
IBT
English ask to remove troops. I agree. They send more swords to our land.
Dheli Builds HG. Mao switch to SunTzu. French Settler/spear move NE.

1 460
Desided to try to take Dover with Horses. Pull horses from NW to Heidelberg. New horses from Berlin-Leipzig also will go there. Continue to move troops to R1 R2. Swords behind will control road Paris-Rheims and Paris-Chartres. Send Galley to Nuremberg. Found Salzburg. Return settlers on track.
IBT
Border expand and French Settler/spear will not build a City without war. They move North. 2 English swords go to Ruen, 4 more marching parallel to road Paris Rheims.

2 470 AD
First troops arrive at R1 and R2. Canterbury is defended by reg Pickman. Dover by vet spear.
Found Dortmund. New Barb camp North of Dortmund. Defend Salzburg by pickman and send others back to mainland. Upgrade warrior in Lyons.
IBT
English Swords return from Ruen toward to Lyons. Francfurt Marketplase->Horsman.
3 480 AD
Pull rest of the troops to R1 R2. (6 swords, 5 catapults, elite spear, Pickman and 4 horses)
Also pull horses to Dover.
Our deal with Gandy expire, but I have not enough money for embassy in Peking. Desided to “trade” Gandy Monotheism (WM+25+11 gpt) and start war next turn. Block English swords near Lyons.
IBT
English swords moves through our land. Barb horse and warrior appear near Dortmund.
New barb camp appear again at far NW.
4 490 AD
Establish embassy in Pecking. Declare war to Gandy. Ask Mao join for Monotheism. He agree and pay 19 Gold. Ask Tokugava to join. He is insulted for Literature or Currency and doubt for both. I am not gouing to pay any money for that and decided to wait. Ask Lis “remove or declare”. She said “relax” and remove! 3 swords jump to Warwick, others west of Lyons. That’s relive. Declare war to English myself and move troops to point A. Pull 1 horse back to Rheims, just in case. Kill sword on mount near Rheims, and cover it by pickman. Reg Horse kill barb horse and jump from barb warrior. Found Bradenburg.
IBT
3 Warwick swords go NORTH! 3 swords move toward Lyons. (Looks that English give up to take French, but still at war).
5 500 AD
Siege Canterbury! 3 catapult misses 2 take HP from Pick and Spear.
Fist vet sword redlined Pick and die, elite kill spear, vet kill pickman (1 hp lost) and Canterbury ours! Very promising start… All reserve free send horse to look Newcastle from mount. Reg spear! Horses will take it. (My mistake I have to send spear there and use horse for attack as well…) send Horses and Pickman and spear to attack Newcastle.
Check Japan again. They discover Currency and now ready to fight for Monotheism. I make second alliance… Galley arrives to near Nurmberg. It will carry settler and Pickman along SE Coast. Take barb camp near Dortmund. Concentrate 7 Horses and Pickman near Dover. Pull swords to Lyons and upgrade Pickman there. Kill sword near Canterbury. War happiness! Hire scientist in Chartres and fire all other specialists. Galley wait Settler near Nuremberg.
IBT
English swords move to Lyons. Sword attack horse on mount and kill it. Sword attack siege group near Newcastle and die (Pickman promote to elite.) Archer move out of Dover. French Archer attack English Sword and die.
.
6 510 AD
Siege Newcastle, Dover and active defense Lyons. All 3 swords in France win! 2 Catapuls redlined sword near Canterbury and elite sword kill him. Other cats and swords move to Central position. Horses attack Newcastle, one die one redlined one promote at that’s it. Sword kill horse near Newcastle (no hp lost), another kill sword from York (3 hp lost). Move 3/5 Pick to Newcastle. Cover redlined sword by elite spear. Move 3 catapults to central point. Send Reheims Pick to Canterbury. Dover causes heavy causalities: 3 vet 1 reg horses dies against 2 vet spears. One horse promote to elite, next take Dover, next kill archer. Dover ours. Russians found Vladivostok. (Right name BTW “Have power over East” if translate from Russians). This damage parquet plan… (OK, we take it and use it). Galley sail SE. Rush Galley in Smolensk. We should use our fast ships for settlement.
IBT
Barbarian approach Dortmund. 3 English swords approach Newcastle. Spear move in between our troops.
7 520 AD
Defense of Newcastle and regroup. Bombard 3 swords and kill 2. Kill spear. Decided to siege Coventry from north using Mabelino’s road. Send horses via Heidelberg to Coventry. Kill barbarian near Dortmund. Found New Berlin. (Not good – we are belong OCN and still have no FP). Horses go NW to Barbcamp.
IBT
Looks like English exhausted. 2/3 sword move NW. What for?
8 530
Pull 2 Catapults and elite spear to York. Bombard 2/3 sword and attack 4/5 horse. Horse die. Attack by elite Pickman and win. Pull 2 catapults to central point. Cover with swords. Send Horse to sort out SE barb camp. South Galley sail to found City NW near Yakutsk.
IBT
English ask to talk. They don’t want surrender.
Minsk flip to us! Very good news. At NW barb horse attack reg horse and die.
Russians sort out SE Barb camp.
9 540.
Pull to York 4 Catapults Elite spear Elite and 2 veteran Swords. Left 3 /4 and 4/5 Horse behind for reserve. (may be not enough). Pull 3 horses and elite spear to Coventry. Unload Settler and Pickman at New Leipzig point. South Galley sail…
IBT
Russians found Novgorod. One more defect in my perfect parquet plan. We should sort them out ASAP. English spear run to help York. Too late, I think.
10 550 AD
Siege York. 3 catapult failed, 1 take hp from spear. Vet sword kill reg spear. Another vet sword kill 2/3 pickman and promote. York our with any loses!
Siege Coventry. Vet horse die but 2 reg win and Coventry ours! Catapult bombard spear on mount and vet sword kill him. Send Pickman on mount- this is excellent position and we should hold it until regroup. That’s it.
Move Settler/pickman to new Hamburg position. Please settle there. Another point to settle at NW is Spices forest.
I think we can take London at turn 5 (600 AD) Do you know how? We can bring 9 swords (3 elite, 2 reg, 4 vet) 5 horses 5 catapults, 1-2 Pickmans at 590 AD. I think it is more than enough…
I again start to belive in my 80 turn win plan.
Regards, Ivan

Plan to attack London, Please, go ahead. We should prepare to war with Russians now.

Embassy in Bejdgin.

Very nice job, Ivan :goodjob: .

I'm posting from work now. I've got "hit" by a worm, so, please skip my turn.

Continue with the plan.

Ivan, if mabellino agrees so, you can play my 10 turns(I have NO problem with it).

Wow what a turn log! Amazing turns there! :goodjob:

I have no problem with Ivan playing again... hope you get your worm fixed soon King...

I'm in awe!

Ehm... :) if King Alexander cannot play and needs a skip, then it should be mabellino's turn to play according to the roster -I cannot see any reason to have one player play twice in a row if the next one in the roster is alive.

Ehm... :) if King Alexander cannot play and needs a skip, then it should be mabellino's turn to play according to the roster -I cannot see any reason to have one player play twice in a row if the next one in the roster is alive.
100% agree! Sure, anybody have rights to skip, but me to. It took whole weekend to play and to write the turnlog. So if Alex can't play Mabellino, please. Let discuss things.
Ivan.

Parquet plan. Please refer to pictures at posts #334, #337. At SE area we almost finish. galley will bring Settler at point 1 (red) and Settler will come to point 2 (black) soon. I desided to finish SE asap because Russians interfere. Third Settler will settel at point "Later". Galley may help. At NW area we settle 1 and 2 soon (it is very good points) and will need 4 more to settle far NW (yellow) point and point 3-4 (red). In fact it takes 17 turns from Moscow to yellow point, (North Island closer) so this is earleast time for day "D". At this day we should rush Libs in all 37 tiles Cities and wait 34 turns until area cover. So we may win the game at 52 turns, not earler. However it is lot of things to do in this 17 turns and I am not sure that we can. We should try, however.
1) To finish war with English (capture London) and demand Warwick, Oxford, Leeds, Avingion, Grenobl. (we may sort out the rest after "D".)
2) Start and finish war with Russians and capture Kiev, Sverdlovsk, Sevastopl and demand Novgorod and Vladivostok. (we may sort out the rest after "D".)
3)Start and finish war with French and capture Marssell and demand Ruen.
4) Have enough cash to rush Libs in 37 tiles Cities. We will stop Moscow settler Factory after 8 turns, but it may not be enough.
I can't see what will be main obstacle 1), 2) 3) or 4). It will be clear at turn 7-8 from now.

Precise plan to London.

Here some specifics.
1)We may try to siege London at 590 AD. Only one elite Sword will not come in time at point A1 and 2/5 elite will not completely healed. But we can try. 5 cats + 8 swords+4 horses is very strong task forse. Lis can't rush defenders as Joahn did. She had Feudalism recently and 4 turns Anarhy, she build swords for French war, so 2-3 Picks is a max. Or we will siege twise 590 AD and 600 AD.
2) Important point is York defense. The best plan I see is elite spears at points S1 and S2, not inside York. From S2 we can send to Coventry in 1 turn, and S1 is excelent blockade- observation point. We should stay at S1 S2 until take London.
3) Not sure wich point better to attack A1 or A2 or both. I'd take A1.
4) If English send swords in front of us at open plain groung, better use Horses to kill and save swords HP for siege. Horses can come home, heal and return fast.
5) Defense Paris-Lyons. If English make peace with French they may send someting to us. However horses from core area will arrive soon (Best randevue point is Rheims) and help for defense. It will be also virtual preparation to war with Russians.
6) Better to start it asap, like 1-2 turns after peace with English. Fresh troops should fight, we have no time to wait. I send catapults already from NW, next also should go to front.

Please ask if something unclear. Regards, Ivan

OK I'm on it... I'll probably play tonight but it might be wed night. (Last ever Angel is on tv tonight ;) )
Good, sound plan Ivan.... I'll examine the save when I get home
:goodjob:

Where is Ankka? I haven't seen him for a while

Looks like you guys have done a ice job while I was away... I'm back, BTW. :)

Looks like you guys have done a ice job while I was away... I'm back, BTW. :)
Good. I am away 9-10, But can write "suggestion-recomendations" if Mabellino plays today. Hope Ankka will play 9-10. I think we can quit from war with English taking Leeds and Avingon as a peace deal after Mabelino capture London AND pillage Iron. I think we will sort rest of them out after "D" day. we can preliminary annaunce it on 20-25 turns from now, at my turns, I hope. What is more important now is start and finish war with Russians and eliminate French. (We can substitute Rouen if it will gone).

I didn't manage to play last night so I'll do it tonight instead. Looking forward to liberating Leeds, it's my home town!

Welcome back Ankka!

playing now :)

@mabellino, are you playing?

@ankka: you're after mabellino, right?

Yeah, I'm after mabellino but I don't mind a litle wait... let's see what happens.

Edit: My 5,000th post! :wow: :D :smug: :nospam: :cooool: :twitch: :dubious: :bounce: :shakehead :hatsoff:

Sorry about the delay guys but I've been ill and haven't had time to finish my turns yet. I'm feeling loads better now so will play tonight and submit the turn log

Sorry about the delay guys but I've been ill and haven't had time to finish my turns yet. I'm feeling loads better now so will play tonight and submit the turn log
Dear mabellino: take it easy! I can wait(Ankka is not in a hurry), and I'm sure the 3rd gentleman of the team(Ivan) will agree. Better play tomorrow, no need to rush things. Good recover!(is "recover" the correct word in English?).

EDIT: @Ankka: good job, about your 5000th post! I wish you to make it 10000!!!

I think recover is the right word.


And I'm not so sure 5,000 posts is that good. ;) just 5,000 posts of no life...:p

Sorry about the delay guys but I've been ill and haven't had time to finish my turns yet. I'm feeling loads better now so will play tonight and submit the turn log
Mabellino, if you will not finish your turns today just put sav file at our roster at the point where you are. May be I write something about that.
Ivan

OK here goes...

Turn log:

IBT
England and France make peace

560AD (1)
Attack reg English sword with elite horse, knocks 1 hp then horse retreats
Attack with elite sword, win but lose 2hp
Found New Hamburg -> Library in 40t
Attack barb camp in North -> 25gold no promotion
Send all available troops to "A1"
Settler leaves galley near Yakutsk
Rush Settler in Moscow

IBT
Indians request audience, they want peace but aren't prepared to pay for it

570AD (2)
Troops are nearly all assembled near London
Workers are either building military roads or chopping jungle in our core

IBT
see lots of english troop movement, no immediate threat

580AD (3)
Build horse in Berlin -> Pike in 2
St Pete's riots (oops!) check city view, 3 happy, 1content, 2unhappy + 2 specialists??? wtf?
Konigsberg builds market-> Catapult in 3 (mm to use gold on mt=zero growth)
Heidelberg builds market -> horseman in 5
Attack reg archer with vet sword, win and promote to elite (2hp)
Move troops into position at A1, now have 4 vet swords, 2 elite swords, 1 elite pike, 1

elite spear, 1 reg horse and 5 catapults. Vet pike, vet swords and horses are nearly there.

IBT
English reg archer and sword approach Paris, 3 turns away from attacking

590AD (4)
Build New Frankfurt
Bombard London, 4/5 fail, 1 removes 1hp. London has at least 2 reg pikes and is size 9
Consolidate troops at position A1, defensive are now fortified.
Rush settler in Moscow (forgot to do it before, messed up factory)
Lots more troops are nearly in position
Move spear to protect mined gold hill next to Paris
Send a horse to go pillage iron

IBT
Archer attacks spear and wins (oh no!)
Sword threatens workers

600 AD (5)
Move workers near paris to safety
Bombard English sword, loses 1hp
Move elite spear from chartres to cover catapult
Bombard London 4 fail, 1 removes 1hp. London still size 9
Horseman now on Iron tile ready to pillage
Found New Munich ->Library in 40t

IBT
English sword attacks a lone sword outside London, ours dies
English sword attacks Paris, our spear redlined but wins

610AD (6)
Nuremburg riots
Rush Horseman in Moscow, back to settler farm next turn
Stack of death looks good, ready to begin attack on London! (see screenshot)
Iron is pillaged, move to incense
All 5 bombardments fail!!!

Ok here comes the battle for London in all it's glory:
Decide to attack in this order: Vet swords (x5), elite swords (x3), Horses.
1st vet sword kills vet pike, no damage and promotes to Elite! Nice!
2nd and 3rd vet swords attack vet pike and die , dealing no damage. Not so good!
4th vet sword removes 1hp from vet pike then dies.
1st elite sword kills elite pike and is redlined
2nd elite sword kills vet spear and is redlined
5th vet sword vs reg spear dies without dealing damage.
I'm getting worried at this point!
Move to horses:
1st vet horse kilss reg spear but is redlined
Elite hotrse kills reg sword in open, loses 1 hp
2nd vet horse kills reg spear,loses 2hp
3rd vet horse redlines spear and dies
Decide to use elite 3/5 sword to kill redlined spear, wins but redlined
WE NOW HAVE LONDON AND THE GREAT WALL!
Capture london, starve city, 2 resistors. Move damaged horses inside to heal and quell resistance.
Sacrifice English worker to speed up pike production.
English capital moves to Hastings.
Check cities and adjust happiness. There is no WW, just overcrowding.

IBT
English sword attacks our pillaging horse, it loses and we have another elite horse!
English are building Sun Ztus in Hastings... fools!

620AD (7)
Resistance in London ends
Decide to rush Pike in London
Contact Liz, she'll sign peace for Leeds and Warwick, I decline
Bombard english sword near London, redlined, use elite horse, win but no leader :(
Move troops into London to heal, ready to attack Liverpool.

IBT
Barbs attack, horseman wins

630AD (8)
Send troops to Liverpool.
A few cities riot, I checked them previous turn.. grrr!
I was hoping for a leader to rush the FP but no luck yet...
War weariness starts, adjust lux slider to 20% and create a few entertainers where required.
Pillage incense and all roads surrounding Hastings.

IBT
English move archer near Paris

640AD (9)
Bombard Liverpool, 4 fail, 1 removes 1 hp.
Liverpool has 1 reg pike and 1 or more reg spears.
Liz won't increase her peace offer.
Send more troops to Liverpool (healed elite swords)
Units now mainly around Moscow/Rheims area ready for Russian war.
Adjust lux slider to 30% just in case!

IBT
India and japan sign peace treaty
Japan demand contact with English, I refuse they back down.

650AD (10)
Couple of cities in WLTKD, one or 2 riot. (mainly new ones without roads)
Attack Liverpool with more elites, they all win but still no leader!
LIVERPOOL IS NOW OURS!
Contact liz to see if she'll surrender now, she still only offers 2 cities.
English know theology, no-one else does.
Switch production in a few new english cities to libraries.

End turns!

Our score is 867, nearest rival (Japan) is 781.

The RNG was not my friend this time around... 10 elite victories, no leader :mad:

Next player should probably try and make peace with Liz cos WW is building up.

Here is the save (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm2/Ankka_SG002_AD0650_01.SAV)

I will play tomorrow and post more then.

Very good turns mabellino!!! I hope you feel better today!!!

I'm fine now... I bet you're celebrating tonight eh King? I never would have predicted Greece to beat Portugal! Wish us luck for tomorrows grudge match against the evil French! (joke for all you french lurkers!)

EDIT double post! Mods feel free to delete this one

OK, I think we close to finish. I thought Mabellino will finish war with English (we do not need WW) but at least she captured 2 Cities and did not lost Paris.

1) Continental politics.
We have to finish war with English NOW! Actually we need Leeds and Avinon (NOT Warwick, Oxford, Grenoble) for parquet plan. Ankka, please do not delay. We need cash. You may test Fortune (try to kill English archers with Elite sword(Newcastle) and Spear(Chartress) or horses from York and catapults from Paris+vet horse, but not more, please. Make Peace.


2)Overseas politics.
India has Chivaliry! Time to get rid of our reputation. Also,
Overseas should fight no matter what!
So, please,
1a) Declare war to Chinise.
2a) Bring Japan to Alliance vs Chinise&India (I think Engineering will be enough)
3a) Make false Peace with India (Ask Chivaliry+gold he have for 50-60 gpt, does not matter)
4a) Declare war to India to save gold.
Note, all these steps (1, 2, 1-4a) in preturn! Do not mix steps.

3)War with Russians. Actually we need Kiev and Vladivostok. The sonner the better. No harm if you take more, but this two Cities is a must. You can start war at your turn 3-4 and finish (or I will finish it). Pull Horses from England to S-Ptbrg and upgrade to Knights. Prepare to defend our South Cities. Use Galley for that.

4) War with France. Again asap. (turn 8-9) Pull swords from England and defit all three French Cities.

Also at preturn.
5) Sensible idea to rush Lib in Saltsburg. It will work on fish and Grassland then.
6) Settler in NW moves unprotected toward to barb camp. Send horse from Stuttgard to cover.
7) Set Lux 10% and Mcmng Berlin to work all 12 Labors (See picture, Hamburg will excuse us). When You road forest You may put Mcmng back.
8) Let Kenig and Munich grow. Gold will come soon.
9)Have no idea what workers near Dortmund and SW New Hamburg do. Stop them and let them do something more useful (irrigate). We will "connect" costal Cities via harbors later.

In turns:

10) New Munich was founded at wrong place. So we need 1 more Cities at NW in comparison with my plan. Yellow point is OK but point 3-4 may be shifted (SE?) and one more costal City on Game should be builded.
11) Settle North Island. It is Huge Area with costal tiles to cover just with two Cities.
That's mean we need at least two more settlers from Moscow, I think thats it, we will need money to upgrade horses and rush Libs.
12)Stuttgart and Smolensk need Aqueducts. Not Marketplaces. But we are short of money to rush this bulck improvements. So build workers there.
13)Mcmng all Cities for max growth. Check English Cities: at Peace they will grow better.
14)Please, do not build non-vet Knights.
15)Good luck!

Ok, thanks for the input Ivan. I will most likely be playing today evening, we are going on a hike the afternoon...

I willl be playing soon.. let's hope I don't do any mistakes... wish me luck.

650AD [Preturn]:
Check to see where we are going, lots of skips made it so I haven't got to play for a long time... Gah, Civ crashes. I doubt it's anything serious... restart the comp and resume to the game. Also load the instructions Ivan wrote to me... Start playing.

Start with Ivan's suggestions.

Attack archer near Newcastle with elite sword. We lose. :(
Attack archer near Chartres with elite spear, we win but no leader.
Kill the archer near Newcastle with elite horse, no leader.

Start peace negotiations with Lizzy.

All she will give is a worker, 19 gold and her WM. I thik that is ok, sign peace.

Lower luxtax to 10%, fire clowns etc. Cycle through all the cities to have max food.

Then to overseas politics.

Declare war on China.
Invite Japan to the war against India and China, he agrees for only Engineering. Wise guy.
Sign peace with India for Chivalry, he wants 50 gpt though.
Declare war on India to save money.

Rush library in Salzburg.
Send horse from Stuttgart to cover the settler in the NW.

Do some other stuff. Then press enter.

IBT: Lizzy comes in and yells that I should remove our forces out of her land. I agree, we need those elsewhere...

French troops move.

Cathy comes in and also asks us to leave her territory. Very well...

Berlin pike > knight.
London library > pike.
Leipzig pike > pike.
Salzburg library > pike.

We get a palace expansion! Yay! :yeah:

English start Sun Tzu's...

660AD [1]:
Lots of units movements, workers etc..
Some automated units run around.

IBT:
Moscow settler > settler.
Rheims catapault > pike.
Bonn lib > market.

English tart Sistine's.

670AD [2]:
Loads of units movements...

IBT:
Hamburg pike > pike.
Frankfurt pike > pike.
Heidelburg pike > pike.

6880AD [3]:
Build Domina > library.

It's getting late, so I decdied to pst this here so Ivan can comment if he wishes. I will play the rest tomorrow after some rest. Now I need a good :sleep:.

@mabellino: I surely enjoyed Greece's win over Portugal. England was a bit unlucky yesterday: 2 goals in 2 minutes?

Posting from work now:
To the Team: I'm sorry that I have to withdraw from this game. My new computer has serious incombatibility issues(my WinXP Pro fell apart after a few days, now I can't even install them, so my Pc at home is completely useless), the store that I bought the PC doesn't help any more, and my nerves are almost broken down from their behaviour! I don't know how long it'll take me to find by myself what's wrong, so, I think it's better for you to find another player. Sorry............................................. .................................................. ...

680AD [3]:
Build Domina > library.

Upgrade 8 vet horses for most of our gold. Next turn I shall attack Kiev.

Fre some clowns where possible and hire tax collectors instead, we now get over 150 gpt.

IBT:
Leipzig pike > pike.
Konigsberg pike > pike.

Palace expansion! Yay! :yeah:

690AD [4]:
Demand all of Cathy's cash (55gold). Then declare war.

Bring some 8 knights and an elite horse to attack Kiev next turn, attack on Vladivostok will be some turns later due to lack of attack forces on that area.

Disperse a barb camp for 25gold.
Capture a Russian worker.

IBT:
2 Russian archers approach from the area of Vladivostok, no danger.

Berlin knight > knight.
Mocow settler > settler.
Some other stuff also...

Some former Russian cities riot. :cringe:

700AD [5]:
Siege of Kiev:
Vet knight vs reg spear, knight retreats without doing any damage.
Vet knight dies to reg spear, -1hp.
Gah.
Attack next turn again.

IBT:
Paris riots.

710AD [6]:
Siege of Kiev:
Vet knight attacks reg spear > knight wins, loses 2hp.
Vet knight vs reg spear > knight wins, -1hp.
Vet knight vs reg spear, knight ins without a scratcch and takes the city.

IBT:
Moscow riots. Oops...

720AD [7]: Move lots of troops.

730AD [8]:
Troops move a lot.

740AD [9]:
More troops run around.

750AD [10]:
I'm very sorry for the lousy playing, I was in half a rush. :(

I thought I didn't have enough troops to attack France, so I left it to you, Ivan. I hope you can fix my mistakes, and I hope I didn't destroy all your plans. :suicide:

Next better player. (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm2/Ankka_SG002_AD0750_01.SAV)

@Alex
Your input is still wanted! Don't quit just yet... we're only a few turns away from victory (player turns not game turns!) :D
And as for those lousy french footballers :mad: :mad: :mad:

@Ankka
Well played, Ivan will come in and storm the French and Ruskies and we'll be laughing all the way to the winners' enclosure!

@Ivan
Go on! Show us how it's done! We're almost there.... :king:

I hope I settled the cities in the NW area in the right places.

1)I hope I settled the cities in the NW area in the right places.
2)All she will give is a worker, 19 gold and her WM. I thik that is ok, sign peace.

1) Yes, but very slow.
2) Why you did not demand Avingon and Leeds???!!!

@Ankka
Lux 30% again. What for? You did not wrote about that.
Invention still 8 turns... It is minor, however.

Will think.
Without Leeds I am not sure that domination plan will work.
(I hoped to finish game at 40 turns from now, but now I am not sure that 55 turns will be enough).

2) Why you did not demand Avingon and Leeds???!!!



Because I didn't think of it! :suicide:

And I am very sorry about that, was a big mistake. :wallbash: Should have remembered that.

@Ankka,
where are catapults from NW (that bombard Kiev)? Can't find...

I didn't use bombardment there, because they only had spears and knights trample them easily. Most of the catapaults are in the South ready for France.

I didn't use bombardment there, because they only had spears and knights trample them easily. Most of the catapaults are in the South ready for France.
I see. Almost finish preturn.
I think I'll declare to French next turn.

Here is the save. Fill free to comment. Have to calculate date of "D" day. And make a plan to win. Have no power continue to play today.
Regards, Ivan

@mabellino: believe me, I'd really want to help you, but, I can't "open" any save, since my computer at home is "dead". Maybe it'll be fixed soon, maybe not; that's why I think it's better for the team to move on. You're all good players; mabellino, soon you'll achieve some other type of victory than your previous one's!

I'll be watching the Team's progress; I won't "leave" you. :)

Maybe in the future I'll have the opportunity to play again with all of you. :king:

Bad luck, King!

@Team, do you think you'll have problems wiht a shorter roster?

I think we'll manage, as the game is near to end, If Ivan gets his planning done again after my messing up.

I think we'll manage, as the game is near to end, If Ivan gets his planning done again after my messing up.
Exactly. I guarnty win in 30 turns (1170 AD) and if Mabellino and Ankka will play good (better, then before) in 21 turns (1080 AD).

Here is the save. Sorry, if I will not finish turnlog today.
Ivan.

Congatulations! We at least get out of last position at SG2 (our line intersect Alamo graph).

With FP situation changed from good to excelent and I have no doubt that game will be over in 21-27 turns. May I suggest that Mabellino and Ankka (if Alex skip) will play 9 turns each? Our "home" AIs have 4 Cities only and we can eliminate them in 1 turn (just to bring knights at the position). Don't know what the best moment to do that (they pay gpt to us, but we need their land). I think turn 10-12 will be optimal, but defenitly not later then 1000 AD. We are making now 411 gpt and in 20 turns we may rush 2030 shields for impouvments. (Libs, Temples, Harbors, Aqueducts, Markerplases, Cathidrals ). We also may disband Catapults, non-elite swords, some reg Spears and Picks. The question is how many impouvments we want and what order of rush. Try to work out best plan for that, but too many Cities we have...

00 Each turn I mcm Moscow for food surplus> 10 and rush Settlers each second turn until factory close.
I trade WM each turn.
Pre-play plan. (Very ambitious): 1) To finish war with Russians ASAP with best possible result. 2) Eliminate French (or at least drive them to the Sea.) 3) Break through Englis and capture Norwich and Leeds. 4) Settle NW and N Island and launch “D” day. Main problem is where to get Gold (to upgrade, to rush…)
0 750 AD Pre-turn: most difficult – where troops are? What to do next? What plan Ankka had and had he any? Anyhow…
Lux to 10%. Circulate over Cities and hire 1 Scientist. Invention 8 turns… (very funny).
Now make 161 gpt. Production changed mainly to Libs and Harbors. Rush harbors in Dortmund and New Leipzig, take loan from Lis (WM+85g for WM+5gpt) rush Aqueduct in Stuttgart. Send Knight and Elite horse from Kiev to Tbilisi. Send Knights from Kiev to Moscow to attack Sverdlovsk next turn. Also send elite spear to Sverdlovsk (fishing for GL). Upgrade reg horse in Lyon. (War with French next turn). In a view of war with English send Rheims Catapults to London. Kill spear in Vladivostok. Cover workers with Minsk spear. (Russian spear nearby) Send Pick from Frankfurt to cover Frankfurt’s workers. Move Sptb archer and Smolensk horse toward to Odessa.
IBT
Barbs attack at N Island. Pick promote to elite with no HP lost. Russian archers get back to sverdlovsk. Spear/Settler move North.

1 760
Capture Vladivostok. Capture Sverdlovsk. Elite spear dies vs archer. Knights won with some casualties but without loses. Knight attack spear in Odessa, won, yellow lined jump to our archer. Fortify horse where it is. Send spera toward to Yakutsk to “defend” 2 Cities.
Declare war to French and enter to district of Marssiell and Besancon.
Upgrade 2 horses in Lyons.
IBT
Chinese ask for peace. But don’t want to give any substantial. Decline.
Russians ask for Peace. Decline. Archer from Odessa killed our Knight.
French Galley sail near New Heidelberg. Tokyo Build Sun Tzu. Mao cascade to Leo.
2 770 AD
Bombard Marssiell and Besancon. Marssiell defended by 3 reg spears Cats took 1 HP from each. Reg Knight retreat. Besancon defend by 2 reg spears. All Cats hit! 1 Horse retreats, another won. Spear dies, French spear promote. Send Pick to (cover-attack),
Send knights to Marssiell. All French Cities virtually undefended. (Though elite swords nearby). Capture Sevastopol. Kill archer. Ask about peace. Cathy gives 1 City and 10 g+5gpt. Decided to take. Chose Novgorod because Krasnoyarsk easer to attack later.
Ask India and China about Peace. They pay 63g +8gpt and 18 g+5gpt. They have more, but don’t want to give more. Trade Engineering to India for 27 gpt. Mao pays only 7 gpt for Chivalry (have no more) Decline. Pull knights to England. Founded New Cologne (N Island).
IBT
London riot, Nuremberg riots. Kiev WLPD. French galley sails to Orleans. Archer appear near Lyons.
Cathy ask to remove troops. I agree.
3 780 AD
I really underestimate French. Elite sword killed archer near Lyons, but Marssiell and Besancon still French! Horse redlined, Pick dies, one Knight dies. Only Cats bombard good. 4 catapults arrive London. Decided to close Moscow Settler Factory. Change Tbilisi to settler (It is miles to build aqueduct).
IBT
English archers move. Barb attack Galley (but Settler/Pick unloaded) Our Galley won. Saltsburg riots. WLKD in Kiev ends.
4 790 AD
Check Nottingham (reg Pick) and Hastings (reg spear). Good. Desided to declare English when sort out French. Capture Marseille. (Knight promote to Elite.) Two elite swords arrive to Besancon. Regroup cats Swords to attack Rouen.
IBT
Engish ask to remove troops. Yes-yes…
5 800 AD
Capture Besancon. Decided to make false peace with French. Demand Orlean and worker. Trade other two for WM and 26 gold. Since it is last turn of our clean reputation I ask last loan from Lis (WM+51 g for WM and 3 gpt). Bring troops to Rouen. Put pick to Orleans. Elite Pick got 50 gold from g-htt.
IBT
French ask to remove. I declare. Marseil and Rheims riot.
6 810 AD
Capture Ruoen. French still alive (on Galley). English is next target. Concentrate Knights in London. And around Grenobl.
IBT
Rouen and London riot. French Galley sail around east point. Barbarians galleys sail.
Mao finish Leo’s workshop.
7 820 AD
Declare war to English and capture Hastings. 3 Knights lost 1 hp each. Found New Bremen.
IBT
Liverpool riots. Discover Invention. China and India sign Peace treaty. (They change Invention-Chivalry as a result.)
8 830
Bombard and capture Nottingham. 2 Knights kill Pick and spear and elite spear killed archer. Very simple. Capital jump to Brighton. Since many knights left free advanced to Brighton. 2 vet Knights die against non-fortified English sword in open ground!!! Third kill and promote to elite. Pull troops forward… Decided to launch “D” day… It needs lot of calculus. We have 921 gold but need lot of Libs…

Nice job, Ivan. :goodjob:


Go for it Mabellino!

I must apologise and say that I will be away the next week, like it says in my sig. So you'll have to complete it on your own. Unless you want a long wait...

@ Ivan
Have you used Mapstat yet? It might help with your calculations. I can also have a go if you need any help.

@Ankka
Shame! You're going to miss all the glory! I could play my turns tonight if we get a plan agreed and that could mean you will be able to play tomorrow then Ivan can lead us to victory!

I'll look at the save when I get home (in approx 5 hours) and post any suggestions...

Great job Ivan! we'd be lost without you! :goodjob: :hatsoff: :thanx:

I will be gone tomorrow. And no time today, I think. And I think the glory goes to you three more than me, I have played only three sets of turns due to skips. :(

@ Ivan
1) Have you used Mapstat yet? It might help with your calculations. I can also have a go if you need any help.

2)I'll look at the save when I get home (in approx 5 hours) and post any suggestions...


1) No. Actually we need to know areas of each continent. Also, I am not sure about conditions: Do we have to have 66% of Total land (known and unknown) or 66% of "land covered by culture borders" from all civs?
2) Yes, please. I'd like to finish it ASAP, and we can combine Libs+Temple+Cathidral, but 411 gpt not so big income to build them in all 37 tiles cities. Also we can settle in between to patch "culture holes" in the middle of continent it is cheaper, then temple. (again problem : where.
Since only 2 of us left in roster let's discuss things to play consistently.

Here is my suggestion... but how fast we can do it?

Continued… 830 AD
Have 921 gold but needs lot of Libs…
Disband reg Pick in Dover (Lib next turn) Disband reg Pick in New Hanover, rush lib, rush libs in Vladivostok, New Heidelberg, Marseille, Rouen, New Cologne. Take G-htt: barbarians… move knight to East point to observe French Galley.
Put Hastings Knight on Galley… Send Catapults to Nuremberg to bombard French Galley when it sail by...
IBT
Palace improved. Pick at N Island win vs barb. Canterbury and Moscow riot.
9 840.
Move Pick to Brighton. It defend by Reg Pick. Attack with vet Knight, won. Reg spear… 4/5 Knight retreats. Elite horse won, take Brighton and got GL. Great. It takes 3 turn to Sptburg and 2 turns to Canterbury. Decided Canterbury. It riots, however. Switch to settler. Move troops toward to Warwick, Norwich and Avignon.
IBT
Nothing.
10 850 AD
Rush FP in Canterbury. Rush libs in Hastings and Brighton. Capture Avignon. Prepare to siege Warwick, Norwich.
IBT
English want peace. Next turn, OK? French want peace...
11 860 AD
Capture Warwick and Norwich. Make peace with English. She gives 2 workers, Leeds, 10 gold+7gpt, WM. Micromanage Cities and now make 411gpt. Great. Disband some troops in Nottingham (lib), Chartress (harbor), rush libs in Avingon and New Hamburg (mistake…). Kill French Galley. No French anymore...
That’s it…

Situation is: we have fifteen 37 tiles Cities that need 100 Culture points:
New Cologne 9
New Hanover 9
Dortmund 9
Dover 9
Coventry 9
Norwich 0
Brighton 3
Nottingham 0 (Lib next turn)
Hastings 6
Avingon 0 (Lib next turn)
Rouen 9
Marseille 9
New Berlin 15
New Heidelberg 9
Vladivostok 9.
Our income permits to rush 2 temples per turn or 5/8 Cathedral per turn. We may disband some troops, also.

I assume the numbers refer to culture per turn? or is it total culture accumulated? I hope it's the former!
I'm going to have a long think before I play my turns, don't want to mess up and it would be nice to be able to contribute to our war plan! Is it ok if I delay playing my turn till saturday? I'll post some more thoughts tomorrow during my lunch break!
Excellent that we finally got another GL! That FP will sure make a difference!
I'm also going to practice using Mapstat until I know exactly what we can gain from it.
Thanks again Ivan for all your hard work, I'm sure I'd have lost this game if I'd been playing it on my own.

@Ankka and King Alex
Hope you're still following this thread.... if you really want us to, I'm sure we can delay victory until you're both back/computers fixed etc... as long as you don't make us wait too long! ;) I sense Ivan's growing impatience! joke!

Night folks... it's sleepy time in Blighty

Mabellino, please, do not play until our plan to finish game will be work out!
Figures is after Cities is culture accumulated. My preplan is (for rush order)
Plan for
fifteen 37 tiles Cities that needs 100 Culture points:
New Cologne 9 temple (4) ->harbor
New Hanover 9 temple (2 disb spear) ->harbor
Dortmund 9 temple (1 disb sword) -> Settler
Dover 9 temple (1 disd cat) ->catapult(?)
Coventry 9 temple (4)-> worker
Norwich 0 Lib (5) Temple (x) Cath (y)
Brighton 3 temple (x) Cath (y)
Nottingham 0 (Lib next turn) Temple (x) Cath(y)
Hastings 6 Temple (x) Cath (y)
Avingon 0 (Lib next turn) Temple (x) Cath (y)
Rouen 9 Temple (3) -> worker
Marseille 9 Temple (5) -> worker
New Berlin 15 Temple (6 disb something …) ->harbor
New Heidelberg 9 Temple (2 disb spear) ->harbor
Vladivostok 9 Temple (3 disd pick)->harbor
Figure in brackets is turn number (your turns) to rush.

New Cologne 9 temple (4) ->harbor
New Hanover 9 temple (2) ->harbor
Dortmund 9 temple (1 disb sword) -> Settler
Dover 9 temple (1 disd cat) ->catapult(?)
Coventry 9 temple (5 or 4)-> worker
Norwich 0 Lib (4) Temple (6 disband cats) Cath (9) 3(5); 30(10)
Brighton 3 Temple (8 disb cats) Cath (14) 18(5); 37(10)
Nottingham 0 (Lib next turn) Temple (7) Cath(13) 15(5); 36(10)
Hastings 6 Temple (8 disd something…) Cath (15) 21(5); 39(10)
Avingon 0 (Lib next turn) Temple (7) Cath (13) 15(5); 36(10)
Rouen 9 Temple (3) -> worker
Marseille 9 Temple (5) -> Cath(17) 24(5); 49(10)
New Berlin 15 Temple (6 disb something …) ->harbor 30(5)
New Heidelberg 9 Temple (2) ->harbor
Vladivostok 9. Temple (3 disd pick)->harbor
It seems to me that it should work. It will give domination at 18-20 turns...
Figures is culture accumulateted after 5 and 10 turns.

Better finish with Russians ASAP and disband 6 Knights in their 3 Cities for Libs. And the same with English and use Knights to rush improuvments...
May be it will be faster then 18 turns than...

@Mabellino
Simple plan to eliminate Russians. Just bring Elite swords and 1 Pick to A0, 3-4 Knights to A1, and 6 Knights to each A2 and A3. I think it is enough. We may disband knights in Norwich, I think.

@Mabellino,
did you run Mapstat? Anyway, I think it is good idea for preturn to disband 2 Knights and vet Pick in Norwich, Lib will appear next turn then. Also, I think it is resonable to cross out Nottingham and Coventry from list of 37 tiles Cities (black line show their 21 format)and build 21 tile City at red circle (or dot). Settler in York exists.

@Mabellino
Some tips to increase income:
Disband Units vigorsly! The less unints we have the more income. (French catapults in Rheims, archer and Cat in Ptrsbrg, Knight and Pick in Vladivostok, Units in Norwich ASAP, etst..) Continue scouting with Galleys and trade WM. Use Sea tiles, barb Galleys will not attack then. Settle ASAP (North of New Hamburg and between Coventry-Leeds- Nottingham). Hope you have your ideas, write, please.
Ivan

@mabellino: I'm following this thread, don't worry! I guess, I had bad luck. Ivan knows what he's doing; I think you can make it! Victory is not far away!

I ran mapstat and it says:
Dom limit: 1641
Acqu tiles 992
Tiles to lim 649
Population:
Dom limit: 401
Pop 340
Pop to limit 61

I ran mapstat and it says:
Dom limit: 1641
Acqu tiles 992
Tiles to lim 649
Population:
Dom limit: 401
Pop 340
Pop to limit 61
Actually that makes Domination problematic. Since total area of standart map 5000 tiles this Domination limit asume that total "Land+coast" approximatly 2500, so it is 50% land, not 40% as I thought before. Looking by eay that mean that there is some unknown land at black area of about 100 tiles. My parquet plan will gives us about 350 tiles but I have no idea how to get extra 300. We can settle inbetween India-Japan, but it will give about 100 tiles only. It looks that for domination we have to consider some overseas war and/or find unknown land and settle there.

@Mabellino. Some smal tip to increase income:
Settle French workers in Kenig. Mcmng Munich-Kenig to 0 growth and max gold. When you will play?

Oh no that domination limit is going to be a problem!
Sorry you've had no feedback for a few days :blush: I've been addicted to BigBrother! I'm in the middle of some planning for this game... I'll post it this afternoon and we can discuss it before playing.

Hi Alex! glad you're still keeping an eye on us!

Actually that makes Domination problematic. Since total area of standart map 5000 tiles this Domination limit asume that total "Land+coast" approximatly 2500, so it is 50% land, not 40% as I thought before. Looking by eay that mean that there is some unknown land at black area of about 100 tiles. My parquet plan will gives us about 350 tiles but I have no idea how to get extra 300. We can settle inbetween India-Japan, but it will give about 100 tiles only. It looks that for domination we have to consider some overseas war and/or find unknown land and settle there.

I've just spent a few hours playing with photoshop and I count 319 available land tiles and around 155 coast tiles just on our continent! Total=474.
We need 173 tiles and I think these can be obtained by settling in the unclaimed areas on the next continent and possibly on the island I see lurking off the coast near New Nuremburg. War might not be necessary but if it is, the Indians have enough tiles and are fairly weak.

Bring on operation culture rush!

See attached jpgs for how I worked it out...

Guys I've managed to run my computer again(though, I'm not sure for how long!!! After so many problems in the past months, I don't trust my computer anymore!).
I could play after mabellino, if you haven't found another player(I just hate to leave something in the middle).

[party] [dance] :yeah: :banana: Hooray King Alex is back!
Right first assignment... look at the pics in my post above and tell me if I've missed any claimable tiles! Next see if you can work out how many coast tiles we will gain access to.
Glad you've got your PC fixed.... nothing worse than some little b@stard virus writer spoiling all your civ related fun... grrr!
You can play before me if you want? I'm a bit tied up with some real life stuff (like my upcoming wedding!) that needs attention so I think both Ivan and I will really welcome some extra input.
All we need now is for Ankka to come back from his jollies and the whole team will be able to submit that victory save! :goodjob:

@mabellino: I didn't knew that you're going to be married! That leaves me out of the picture! :cry: :suicide:
:joke: I wish you the best and may you be happy with your knight forever! :goodjob: :clap: :clap: :love:

I'll take a look at the save tomorrow, and read your comments/suggestions.

As for my PC, it's working ok for the time being, but I wouldn't be surprised if anything else happens :( : I just had too many problems in the past few months to trust it anymore.

EDIT: I can't play today, and I'm not sure for tomorrow(Monday). Can you wait, or Ivan wants to play?

EDIT:[/B] I can't play today, and I'm not sure for tomorrow(Monday). Can you wait, or Ivan wants to play?
Why Ivan? If Alex can't Mabellino will play. Moreover, I have no objection if Alex will play after Mabellino. Please, go ahead, I submited my file June 15, 5 days ago...

Ok, Ivan, mabellino could play: if she can't, I'll play tomorrow or Tuesday.

1)I've just spent a few hours playing with photoshop and I count 319 available land tiles and around 155 coast tiles just on our continent! Total=474.
2)We need 173 tiles and I think these can be obtained by settling in the unclaimed areas on the next continent and possibly on the island I see lurking off the coast near New Nuremburg.
3)War might not be necessary but if it is, the Indians have enough tiles and are fairly weak.

Bring on operation culture rush!

See attached jpgs for how I worked it out...
1) Grate work, Mabellino!
Did you count Oxford area? (I think yes, if you count 319). I checked your pictures and found 34 more costal tiles wich will covered when Cities reach 37 tiles border. So total is 508 and we need 139 overseas tiles.
2) Barbarians Galleys come from New Hannover area, so Island with barb camp should be somewhere around. Check this area first.
3)Since it will take some time (more then 34 turns, I think) to settle overseas I suppose that we do not need Temples, just Libs in each Cities. (Acctually not, Orlean for example do not need Lib). It needs modest income to rush Libs..
Therefore we can increase research rate to 30-40% say, to get GP and MT soonner (just in case...)

I'm pleased I've been able to contribute some meaningful discussion at last!
I'll be able to play next as long as we can agree on our next priority. I agree we should think about increasing research soon so that we can have cavalry to take out any rebels that will not bow to our superiority!
Monday nights are difficult for me but tuesday should be fine. I'll probably be taking a day off work this week (wed?) so if all else fails I'll be able to play then.
I counted all the tiles that have been marked with red/blue dots. I had to use screen grabs cos it was impossible to do it on the civ 3 screen, my monitor still has lots of little blue biro dots on it! :lol: Still I'm sure I'll find something at work tomorrow to get rid of them! (I work in a chemistry lab btw)

Has anyone else been having civ dreams recently?

@mabellino: I didn't knew that you're going to be married! That leaves me out of the picture! :cry: :suicide:
:joke: I wish you the best and may you be happy with your knight forever! :goodjob: :clap: :clap: :love:


Knight???? Only the best Sipahi for me!

I'm joking too!

Alex, if he jilts me I'll come a looking for you!
We'll be honeymooning in Cyprus next May ;)

Has anyone else been having civ dreams recently?
I'm having civ dreams while I'm awake!!!! :eek: Should I go to a doctor?(mad-doctor, that is...) :scan:

Alex, if he jilts me I'll come a looking for you!

Does this mean that I have a chance? :thanx: :bounce: :banana:
I'll be waiting for you until my bitter end comes!!!!!!!! :king:

Ok, let's get back to topic.

Oh but off topic is so much fun.... watch out for the mods though!

Seriously now, have you had any thoughts on what our next plan should involve? I think Ivan's plan for the settling/library rush is still doable but do you guys think a conquest victory might be quicker?
We have the great lighthouse which gives us a huge advantage over the other continent. Indians will be wiped out soon by the japs/chinese and the English/Russians won't last long against our units. What do you reckon? (both of you?)

I haven't thought much about our situation. Let's proceed with Ivan's plan and if need more land for domination, we'll have to fight someone :evil:

First we'll need to expand to our continent and occupy all the land, make strong cities, able to support a good flaw of military units and then we can start thinking about taking on someone else. :)

btw: I haven't yet looked at the save. I'll take a look tomorrow, though.

1)I'm pleased I've been able to contribute some meaningful discussion at last!
2)I'll be able to play next as long as we can agree on our next priority. I agree we should think about increasing research soon so that we can have cavalry to take out any rebels that will not bow to our superiority!
3)Monday nights are difficult for me but tuesday should be fine. I'll probably be taking a day off work this week (wed?) so if all else fails I'll be able to play then.
4)I counted all the tiles that have been marked with red/blue dots.
1)You say very little, but meanigful, belive me. I really need constructive feedback, you know.
2) Preorities
2a) Rush libs (It is only few left)
2b)Scouting around New Hannover
2c) Eleminate Russians
2d) Eliminate English
2e)Research (I checked 40% -GP 5 turns 50% 4 turns, so we 22-30 turns from MT!
3) 8 days it is very long break. If Allex will not play tomorrow before his midnight I will consider it as "All skip" and will play myself my Monday night. If he will play Monday you will play Tue-Wed.
4) there is no picture with Oxford, because of that I asked.
Edit: Found it now.
I add yellow dots that you missed. And cross black that appear at another picture...

1)Seriously now, have you had any thoughts on what our next plan should involve?
2)I think Ivan's plan for the settling/library rush is still doable but do you guys think a conquest victory might be quicker?We have the great lighthouse which gives us a huge advantage over the other continent.
3) Indians will be wiped out soon by the japs/chinese and the
4)English/Russians won't last long against our units. What do you reckon? (both of you?)
1) Edit: Hastings, (not Leeds) is a key City for our next. We should rush Harbor, Lib, and Galleys there.
2) Conquest will take 50-70 turns, (or longer, if we will conduct wars with long pauses as before). I hope domination needs only 40-50 turns.
3) Indians in Peace with Chinese. And they fight good against Japan. (I saw, the capture back Madras for example). Indians Knights (Elefants) do not need resourses for support, also they may have GP soon. Even for us it will be a nut, but we may try to capture some their Cities (after "paecfull" settelment).
4) Exactly. Better to finish them ASAP to have "hands free"

@Ivan
I can certainly start my turns on monday, but might not be able to finish and post the turn log until tuesday. If that's ok then that's what I'll do.
Sorry if you think there's been too long a delay but I think our extended dicussions have allowed us to come up with a better and more refined plan.

Have you looked at the score submissions recently? 3 teams have now finished but we're not in last place (I estimate 3rd/4th from bottom).

Looks like I'll be delaying GOTM32 for another week! Will you be playing?

EDIT: Eeep elephants! where did they come from all of a sudden? Have we had any tech from TGL recently?

@Ivan
1) I can certainly start my turns on monday, but might not be able to finish and post the turn log until tuesday. If that's ok then that's what I'll do.
2) Sorry if you think there's been too long a delay but I think our extended dicussions have allowed us to come up with a better and more refined plan.

3)Have you looked at the score submissions recently? 3 teams have now finished but we're not in last place (I estimate 3rd/4th from bottom).

4) Looks like I'll be delaying GOTM32 for another week! Will you be playing?

5) EDIT: Eeep elephants! where did they come from all of a sudden? Have we had any tech from TGL recently?
1) OK, if I will see tomorrow before UK midnight msg from you or King Alex "playing now" I will not play. Please, sort out who will play first.
2) Discussion might be more intensive... I hoped you will run mapstat but finally instal and run it myself.
3)Good. I wonder why Atkos so parallel to us? They play AW...
4)No. I don't like low difficulty levels and still can't instal software they requied...
5)Elefants come from Chivalry. Indians got this tech first. We got Chiv from India as a result of false Peace Treaty. We did not get any from TGL. I think computer sipmly wait, when we research something ourselfs. Just the same turn we discover Invention India and China make a peace and exchange Chiv-Invention.

Sorry, mixed Leeds and Hastings some posts ago.
Here is a plan how settele in India. Rush Settler in Liverpool, (may be even at preturn) and sail to red dot 1 (Japanise culture border will not expand, but If India capture Bengal back, then to red dot 2) I think 2 also resonable to settle after 1. We will think about overseas war later.

sounds good to me. I assume settler plus pikes for each galley?
As for the mapstat thing, I did run it but only after you had! That's how I managed to work out how many tiles we needed.

Akots are playing AW? Well we have been at war for most of the same time frame... perhaps that will explain it. They will not have had the same chance to build up their military as we had and that will offset the earlier gaining of territory.

I'll be playing in 7 hours or so. I'll post a quick update before I go to bed, then if I'm not finished I'll play the rest tomorrow night.

sounds good to me. I assume settler plus pikes for each galley?

Or Knight instead of Pick.
Disband Pick in Liverpool and rush settler. Send knight or pick to cover and Galley to pick up...

playing now :mischief:

Good Luck!

I've played 5 turns, here's a quick summary:
Cultural expansions and 1 new city mean we now have 1185 tiles and are 456 away from domination. There are 449 unclaimed tiles left , obviously we'll need all of these and 7 from another civ! Scratch that, just realised that the english and russian tiles will give us enough! :blush:

Troops are almost in position to destroy Russia, next turn I'll declare.
I've increased the tech rate but we're still pulling in enough cash to be able to rush 2 libs and a unit each turn.
Almost all cities now have libs, those building temples ahve been changed to other things.
Our military is strong against everyone except the japanese (average).
Settlers are ready to build first cities on new continent, just waiting for a knight escort.

I'll finish tomorrow night and post a full turn log then.

Night folks

Ok I've finished playing now.

Quick summary:
Score 1487, russians and english are both toast, loads of libraries rushed and borders have expanded rapidly.

Minimap:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/minimap_860ad.jpg

I can post a detailed turn log if you wish? let me know and it will be done!

here's the save (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm2/Ankka_SG002_AD0960_01.SAV)
Mapstat says 332 tiles to domination, 46 pop required.

Ok I've finished playing now.

Quick summary:
Score 1487, russians and english are both toast, loads of libraries rushed and borders have expanded rapidly.

I can post a detailed turn log if you wish? let me know and it will be done!
Mapstat says 332 tiles to domination, 46 pop required.
Detailed turnlog not nessary, just summary of each turns:
Like destroy Russians this year, destroy English this year, rushed Libs here and there... Could you tell me why you bring settler to India so late? Why you did not rush settler in Liverpool as I recomended? Or you did? Why you did not settle in between Leeds Coventry? (It's ok, we can do it later.) We also needs Libs in New Bremen amd New Leipzig ASAP. This is 37 tiles Cities!! I recomend to low research for 20% for 1 turn and rush it next turn.

King Alex, who will play next? You or me? I think me, as you skip, and you will play after me. Anyway, I got save.

Here is how we can settle far -far North-West. I wonder will single tiles "culture Islands" (egg-yellow circles) glue in or will remain?

Good turns mabellino. Ivan, good luck. I'll play after you.

1. Could you tell me why you bring settler to India so late? Why you did not rush settler in Liverpool as I recomended? Or you did?
2.Why you did not settle in between Leeds Coventry? (It's ok, we can do it later.)
3.We also needs Libs in New Bremen amd New Leipzig ASAP. This is 37 tiles Cities!!
4. I recomend to low research for 20% for 1 turn and rush it next turn.

1.
I couldn't rush a settler on the pre turn as we didn't have enough money so it was rushed on my turn 1. Hastings had a lib and needed a harbour (as we discussed earlier) to build vet galleys so it got a harbour instead. My priority was to get libs rushed in cities without them and I kept running out of cash before a galley could be rushed in Hastings. The settler was in hastings awaiting transport and an escort and set off on it's epic journey on turn 6. (920AD).

2. Guess I forgot about this one! I did find a settler fortified in the open near Konigsberg on around turn 6 and sent him to one of our port towns in the far north west (to head for the island!)

3. I thought they already had them? hmmm must have overlooked that one too :blush:

4. We learnt gunpowder on turn 9 with chemistry in 6 turns @39gpt and lux tax at 30%. WW was a real problem in the last few turns but should go back to normal on the next turn (as we're no longer at war)
We will get Theology from TGL next turn.

I'll post a shortened turn log to explain some of my decisions....

Turn 0 860AD

Change production in hastings to harbour, Liverpool to settler (not enough gold to rush) and change cities building temples to more useful items as we decided we no longer needed them. (eg knights and marketplaces)
I spend a while hunting for our FP and change "Canterbury" to "FP_Canterbury" to help with future identification.
Notice a few cities getting edgy so increase lux slider to 20%
Science to 20% to give GP in 9t @ +236 per turn.

Turn 1 870AD
Culture expansion of around 10 cities :D
Palace improvement :D
Rush harbour in Hastings, settle New Salzburg.
Send units to battle points discussed earlier

Turn 2 880AD
York builds lib ->marketplace
3 more cultural expansions :D
Rush 2 libs, watch units on "go to orders", get lazy workers to build roads/irrigation as needed. We have loads of workers!

Turn 3 890AD
More cultural expansion, rush 2 more libs

Turn 4 900AD
Decide Berlin could use a temple to help with happiness and culture.
4 more cultural expansions.
Rush a few more libraries. Units almost in position to begin war.

Turn 5 910AD
2 more cultural expansions.
2 settlers now in hastings awaiting escort.

IBT
Japan and India make peace
Russia demands we move our troops :mischief:

Turn 6 920AD
3 more cultural expansions, 2 libraries rushed.

Declare war on russia
Attack RUS elite archer with vet knight, win lose 2hp
Attack Krasnoyarsk (elite spear) with vet knight, win promotes to elite, lose 2hp
Reg spear vs vet knight, win lose 2hp
Capture KRASNOYARSK, 1 resistor ->lib

Attack YAKUTSK
elite spear vs vet knigh, lose but do 3hp damge
reg spear vs elite knight, win, lose 1hp
reg spear vs vet knight, win but redlined
elite 3/5 spear vs vet 3/4 knight, win -no damage
Capture city, no resistors ->lib

Attack ODESSA
reg spear vs elite knight, win lose 1hp
Capture city, no resistors -> lib

RUS settler/spear near hamburg, knight to attack next turn :mischief:

Turn 7 930AD
Kiev, Minsk, Sevastopol and Svedlorsk riot
English are building sistine chapel (in their one and only town! ha ha ha!)
Chinese have gunpowder.

Attack russian reg spear with vet knight, killed and spear promotes (ah well it was on a mountain!)
Attack russian vet archer with elite horseman, win but lose 2hp
More cultural expansions and libs rushed.
Indian borders have expanded but proposed city site still available, galley is on the way.

Turn 8 940AD
Adjust sliders to get GP in 1 turn @10%sci +231gpt
Oxford's borders expand
Explore northern island, larger than I thought.
Longbowman in position to wipe out russians. Troops amassing near Oxford to take out English.

IBT
Barb galley kills ours grrr! :mad:

Turn 9 950AD
Learn gunpowder -> chemistry in 6t (+39gpt). Lux tax at 30% due to WW
We have i saltpeter connected and 4 more on our continent. :D
Longbowman destroys russians!

IBT
Indians ask us to remove galley

Turn 10 960AD
Palace expansion
Demand theology from english but they won't give it to us for anything.
Declare war and attack Oxford. Elite knight vs spear, wins no damage.
Capture OXFORD. Former english cities unhappy but should be ok next turn.
Reduce lux to 20%.
Operation disband! Disband a load of weaker troops in corrupt cities to rush build libraries etc.
Quite a few more units to disband for next player.

I've sent all our elite/vet knights to harbour cities (eg Hastings) ready to fight other continent.

Score 1487

helloooo? is there anybody there? Where are you guys?

@mabellino: We're still here!!!
I'm waiting for Ivan to play, and post his suggestions.

Will play soon.

Here is the save. Again, game took too much human power. (Too many units to transfer). I will write turnlog later. IBT 2-3 Japan declare war and attack new City at "India". Althogh it wistand first attack I gifted it to China, make Allianse vs Japan and sign RoP with India. Also I invent very efficient way to transfer army to another continent No ship caining! It against RCB rules. Each galley goes 4 turns anticlockwise and 4 turns clockwise. You see result... Last turn Samurais apperar, otherwise Japan would be a toast. Knight tipically lost when attack Samurai. I think it is better to hold army at the position where it is. It is important to hold this chock point. (Fortify army, do not attack). Knights may capture Hyberbad until Cavs arrive at India. (We will have MT next turn, Upgrade Knights in Hastings...).
Dear Alex, could you look at save and decide what to do and ask what is unclear. It is easer to explain things if somebody ask...
Regards, Ivan.

Mapstat: Tiles to limit 210, pop to limit 28.

For illustration Emassy in India. Note, they have no Iron and saltpeter, and trade with japan.

Ivan, good planning. I'll have a look when I go home and ask about everything that I have questions! I'm at work now. I'm in no hurry to play before we decide our plan. Probably I'll play tomorrow, if not today.

Dear Alex in 1160 AD I expect massive culture border expantion. If you have time, could you calculate will it be enought to Domination? Probably it is sensible idea to rush temples somewhere (Avingon, Norwich, New Hamburg, new Munich)?

Here is our situation in India. Picture shows Galley circulation. Currently we have more ships then troops will appear in Hastings.
Therfore all trops should go to Hastings. Note we can only upgrade archer in India, so Cats and Knights should be upgrated in Hastings. Settel New city at red dot. Bengal is ours now, so it push culture border wider when Libs will work. I think we can siege Ismuno at turn 3. (Army, 2 elite and 5 vet Knights is enough, I think). Fortify Army before that. Ignore Hybebad, it is unroaded and take too much time to deal with (or may be swords take it later). Since after MT our research will be 0% we may rush LB in Jaipur any second turn. Lib in Japur also good idea.

Here is "final" plan to settle NW area. Since Lib in new munich was too late it is cheaper to patch culture holes with new cities. My plan at 830 AD was domination victory at 34 turns (1170 AD), but it is still unclear for me will it be the case or not.
First of all we need Temple at Norwich (turn 1) and Avingon (turn 2). then we needs Libs in all 21 tile Cities (NW Island). Since we will gain 660 gpt it is possible I think. We also have to rush settler in size 3 City at N island to cover "uncovered" coastal tiles. Also we may build settler in Moscow and Kiev to patch culture holes near Oxford.
@King Alex. Could I suggest that you will play 6 turns and then put save at the roster? It will easer to see is Domination possible at 1170 AD, and what have to be done for that.

>>SAVE (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm2/Ankka_SG002_AD1120_01.SAV)<<

1070AD (1)
Hurry temple in Norwich, settler in Liverpool,.

1080AD (2)
Hurry temple in Avignon, settler in New Bonn, library in New Dortmund. Troops in position to attack Izumo next turn. Hyderabad was captured by the Chinese IBT.

1090AD (3)
Hurry library in Jaipur, Konigsberg 2, New Brandemburg, harbor in New Cologne, barracks in Bengal, settler in New Hamburg and New Munich.
Izumo holds with 1 pike remaining.
The Great Library is made obsolete.

1100AD (4)
Raise science to 10%(minimum research – 562gpt).
We found Frankfurt 2 west of Oxford, Heidelburg 2 and Nuremberg 2 east of Vladivostock . Hurry library in New Bonn.
We found Munich 2 in the other continent. We capture Izumo and 7 Japanese workers, but we don’t get any GL...

IBT
I had 5 knights on their way to Nagoya, but the samurais killed 4 of them, 1 redlined!

1110AD (5)
The 2-tile island near New Hannover, it’ll have to wait: the settler is going to New Nuremberg and he’ll get to his destination with the galleys there, see, there were 2-3 barb galleys nearby and I don’t want to risk it.
War Weariness is becoming a major problem: I was lucky that I noticed that, because almost all big cities would riot the next turn: I decided to change to temples were necessary.
We found Cologne 2 north of Krasnoyarsk.
I have 2-4 settlers(I don’t remember exactly), on their way to Hastings, so they can found more cities on the other continent.

IBT
3 samurai attack Izumo: the Army got redlined(!), but survived the attack.

1120AD (6)
Berlin completes the Heroic Epic, starts Military Academy.
We found Hannover 2 north of Hannover.

Plan
I’m going to build 2 more cities: 1st east of Rouen(on the hill), 2nd south of Brandemburg.
I think we should stop at some time with our war against Japan. WW is becoming much of a problem, we need more units over ther, and we don’t have ANY units on our continent: if India or China would declare at some point, how would we defend?
Ivan, I’ll wait for your suggestions before I play 4 more turns, as you said so.

I'm back. :)


Looks like this will be a tight fight to the end... how much left on MapStat?

Welcome back, Ankka.

P.S.: I forgot to write in my log: In turn 4, I had raised the science to 10%, but only for 1 turn; in turn 5, I dropped science to 0%, and I made a single scientist in Izumo.

I have 4 more turns to play: any suggestions are welcome.
On the other continent, we can settle 3 more cities: west, east and north of Jaipur: the west area(above Hyderabad) it's an open area, where the other 2 cities would aim to capture mainly more coastal tiles. I have already a settler that is going to settle WEST of Jaipur, and 3-5 cavalries are on their way to defend the city(I wish we hold until they come!).

Ivan, when we'll stop the war? The samurai's almost captured Izumo the previous turn: knights cannot defend very well against them and they cannot retreat(due to samurai's high movement).

Nice one! I downloaded the save and plugged it into Mapstat: 138 tiles to limit and 238 unclaimed tiles left.
Alex, how high is the lux slider? and how bad is WW? (the % when you click on the ungrateful citizens)
Looks like we'll be finished soon!

Hold on a moment to take a look.

EDIT: Our lux is set to 10%.

1) 2 settlers are already in the big north island to settle where Ivan suggested.
2) 1 settler is going to settle the 2 tile island next to the north island.
3) I have 1 more settler on his way in the big east lsland.
4) We get 1 more settler the next turn and he's going to settle south of Rouen (on the hill)
5) 1 more settler can go right west of Brandemburg.

4-5 settlers are going towards Hastings to settle the other continent(and to be in position if we declare again after a while).
1 settler is already on his way to settle east of Hyderabad.

EDIT 2: I forgot: 1 more settler is on his way to settle east of New Munich(under those mountains).

EDIT 3: I saw that we have no harbor on the other continent, so, I'm going to hurry one when I'll play my 4 remaing turns.

@mabellino: I think the cities that we're going to find are enough for domination.

I'll correct what a few cities are currently building when I play again(my mistake).
I'll hurry a few temples in small coastal cities for expansion(thet already have libraries)

We'll wait for Ivan's opinion(as he said)? Maybe Ankka can also say his opinion?

OT: mabellino, Have you found a best man yet?(j/k).

I think it should be enough if you just settle the settlers on the spots you said they were going for and rush a library in them.

Don't trust this, though, I didn't count or anything, just suspecting.

my gut feeling also agrees with Ankka, a few turns ago there were enough tiles available without taking too many on the other continent, since then we now own our continent, have discovered a new island (and colonised it) and have captured a few cities from the other continent. I think that when Ivan comes back he will say that domination is possible in 1170AD (?) think that was the date??
Anyone playing GOTM32?

@ Alex
You can be the virtual best man if you want! ;)

>>SAVE (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm2/Ankka_SG002_AD1170_01.SAV) <<

Ok, I’ll play my remaining 4 turns now that I can.
Pre-turn
I changed many coastal cities to temples, rush walls in Izumo, harbor in Bengal.

IBT
Japan asks for audience, he gives nothing more than peace treaty: I’ll wait a little more.

1130AD (7)
We find Bremen 2 in the 2 tile island, Stuttgart 2, in the big eastern island.
Hurry harbor in New Stuttgart, library in Berlin 2, temple in Hamburg.

1140AD (8)
We find Bonn 2 west of Hamburg , Salzburg 2 east of New Munich.
Hurry library in Izumo.

1150AD (8)
Hurry library in Bremen 2. We find Dortmund 2 east of Rouen.

1160AD (9)
We find Brandemburg 2 on the other continent.
We find New Berlin 2 on our continent.
We find New Leipzig 2 on the big northern island.

1170AD (10)
Hurry library in Brandemburg 2, Dortmund 2.
We find New Hamburg 2.
We find New Conigsberg 2 in the big northern island.
Hurry a few temples.

I think we're very close to domination victory :goodjob:

P.S.: We have 4 more turns with our alliance with China against Japan: micromanage and/or hurry temples/markets/cathedrals were neccessary or increase our lux(so we keep our pop when we make taxmen/entertainers) and get us out of this war immediately after the 4 turns.

EDIT: The only thing that keeps us from domination is the population we have: I think the next player should finish the game. Make sure to watch out for our pop!

@Ivan: Sorry that I played my remaining 4 turns, but I had the time to play and took the opportunity. Your plan is just a few turns away to lead us to victory(we need more pop) :goodjob:

I hope you MMed the cities for pop growth everywhere.


I am up? I will try and get it today. :)

I hope you MMed the cities for pop growth everywhere.


I am up? I will try and get it today. :)
Ankka, if you're going to play next, PLEASE have a look at ALL our cities and make sure that they're set for maximum growth asap. Sorry, if I missed something!
If neccessary, hurry improvements or raise our lux, so we don't lose any pop if we're forced to make taxmen/entertainers.

Now that I think of it again, we have a few entertainers in our cities(WW was becoming a BIG issue): we needed to hurry libraries in the new cities(that's why I needed the money to rush them and I couldn't afford to raise the lux) and a few temples to others(they already had libraries, but they got greater border expansion after I've rushed temples).

It's up to you(if you'll play) to raise the lux and/or hurry temples were neccessary and to make all those entertainers to work again...

I think I'll wait fr Ivan to say something. I also have another SG to play...

Sorry, that get lost. Internet at home did not work and I was disconnected.
Ivan.

No problem.

looked at save. we got 12 more tiles above domination limit, but need 14 population I think we can add some workers to Cities...

Ok... do you want to end the game? I think the honor would belong to you...:)

yes, we win nex turn. Put lux 50-70%, stop all Workers and add to nearby Cities. also cavs in Ismuno may try to capture one more Jupan City.

Ok... do you want to end the game? I think the honor would belong to you...:)
OK, I'll do it (just one turn). All skip...

*waits eagerly for results* :) :D :yeah:

Here is final save. Just hit Enter.

Ivan, History will remember you as "Ivan the Magnificent!" :goodjob:

It was an honor to play with you, ladies and gentlemen! :)

What we do now that we've finished the game? Can we look at other threads?

yes, we bit above hady team.

It was a good experience, my first SGOTM!

Ivan, you're a very good tactician! The glory should go to you for all the effort you put into the game.

EDIT: mabellino: happy wedding!(I don't know what they say in such cases!)

Ankka: nice to play with you.

Ivan: I already gave you the glory!!!

Look at my article at Spoiler 2. this is not our summary, but give better comparison with other teams.

Great time playing this with all of you. :hatsoff:

And a big :thumbsup: to Ivan for all the planning. :D

It seems yet again I've missed a crucial day! Bloody work interfering with my free time!
Huge congratulations to all of us but especially to Ivan for all the planning he did. :beer: [party] :banana: :salute:
I'm off to read how the other teams are doing! snigger!

You guys have all taught me a new thing about this game, I'm going to go and whoop some ass in the GOTM32, anyone care to join me?

I'm too lazy to play the GOTM, even though it requires no dl:s this month. :p

I submited Summary in Spiler 2

Ivan, I've read your summary, nice one! It gives all the relevant stuff and some reasoning for our moves without being too long and drawn out. One thing though, I notice you blamed yourself for miscalculating the 80 turns to domination thing. I think I speak for all of us here when I say DON'T WORRY ABOUT IT! Without all the forward planning this could quite easily have degenerated into 4 people all pulling in different directions. I have to take some of the blame since I let us down on a few occasions with lousy fighting and weird build orders.

So crunch time, anyone want to play as the same team again?

@Mabelino,
I did not "blame" myself, I simply try to explain why our actual win come later, then my ambitious 80 turn plan. I am quite happy, that it was almost exactly 34 turns after "D" day. BTW, at the very beginig I bet about 1000-1200 AD win, it also get true. Did you saw my plots in Log scale?

@mabellino: I'd be happy to play again, but I don't think I'm that high level to compete in these team-competitions and one mistake can be disastrous. I'll continue with SG's to gain more experience.
Anyway, it was a pleasure to play with all of you.

I don't think I'm that high level to compete in these team-competitions ...

I don't understand this comment. You are playing in deity level SG's right now AFAICT. Because the teams are all of mixed ability you may be in the winning team next time. It's up to you of course... but personally I wouldn't want to miss the next game.

I don't understand this comment. You are playing in deity level SG's right now AFAICT. Because the teams are all of mixed ability you may be in the winning team next time. It's up to you of course... but personally I wouldn't want to miss the next game.
Yes, I'm playing a deity SG, but it's my first! :crazyeye:
mad-bax, it's not that I'm being dissapointed by our team's result: First or Last place means nothing to me, because I always try to give my very best when I play and someone can learn a lot from victories and defeats as well.
A SGOTM is different from a SG, because some mistakes could drop the team's final rank, and I wouldn't want to be the reason for this, where in SG's it would take more turns to achieve victory. I mean, it's not that I do mistakes on purpose.
Every player has it's own style, of course.

Ok, I'll reconsider your suggestion, after all.

Yes, I'm playing a deity SG, but it's my first! :crazyeye:
mad-bax, it's not that I'm being dissapointed by our team's result: First or Last place means nothing to me, because I always try to give my very best when I play and someone can learn a lot from victories and defeats as well.
A SGOTM is different from a SG, because some mistakes could drop the team's final rank, and I wouldn't want to be the reason for this, where in SG's it would take more turns to achieve victory. I mean, it's not that I do mistakes on purpose.
Every player has it's own style, of course.

Ok, I'll reconsider your suggestion, after all.
Don't worry for final rank. The main purpuse of SG is to share experience. You are welcome to play in my team (Ankka and mabelino as well) in SG3. The only thing I want to have in our team one more team member of about my rank, I really need sometimes to discuss things to make a decision.

Yes... I can understand how you feel Ivan. Unfortunately the numbers of players at varying levels were not equal.

I am keeping a record, and as time goes by the team building process will get better as I get more data about the players.

If this team (or part of it ) stays together then I will attempt to include another strong player on the roster. I have a good idea who it might be, but I can't say in case he/she decides not to play in the next game.

You don't have to stay together anyway. If I could play, I think I would play in a different team each month. You learn more that way. Though I do have regular playing partners for SG's too, and they are like family to me now.

Either way is good.

@ Ivan
I saw your log plots but I'm afraid maths isn't one of my strong points :blush: I did get the impression it was comparing teams by score/turn and it showed that some teams had "blips" in their progress (mainly us!) and other teams just powered ahead. The actual plot on the scores page was great for this at first, but then as the scores differentiated it was harder to see small details.

@Everyone (inc Mad-Bax)
I am happy to play with you guys again but I also think 4 players is too few and we would benefit greatly from another deity/emporer player on the team. I usually play regent but have been venturing up to monarch every now and again . This time last year I was struggling to make the transition from chieftain to warlord! Progress has been mainly down to the GOTM and the war academy but this SG has taught me sooo much more. I've never reached the domination limit before!
So thanks to my teamies and to the staff, roll on SGOTM3!
I have a feeling it'll be a good one!

Side note: I think I might prefer to play PTW cos I really miss the rename units and "stack commands with one click", but if that isn't an option for you guys it's no biggie. :crazyeye:

Yes you did need another Strong player. But there are a limited number of "vanilla" players. I'll try to do better next time. In any case, as I said I have someone in mind, who I rate in the top 5 of all players I've ever played with. Just a question of whether he chooses to play. :)

...And yes GOTM3 will be something else indeed! I just wish I could take credit for it....

Yes you did need another Strong player. But there are a limited number of "vanilla" players. I'll try to do better next time. In any case, as I said I have someone in mind, who I rate in the top 5 of all players I've ever played with. Just a question of whether he chooses to play. :)

...And yes GOTM3 will be something else indeed! I just wish I could take credit for it....
Unfortunately my PTW do not run properly. It often crashes at diplo screen and also I can't open input from other SG. So I stick to Vanila.
I looked at the picture of SG3. If we will not play sponsor variant I think we can manage. But we need five players anyway.

@ Ivan
1) I saw your log plots but I'm afraid maths isn't one of my strong points :blush: I did get the impression it was comparing teams by score/turn and it showed that some teams had "blips" in their progress (mainly us!) and other teams just powered ahead. The actual plot on the scores page was great for this at first, but then as the scores differentiated it was harder to see small details.

2)I am happy to play with you guys again but I also think 4 players is too few and we would benefit greatly from another deity/emporer player on the team. I usually play regent but have been venturing up to monarch every now and again . This time last year I was struggling to make the transition from chieftain to warlord! Progress has been mainly down to the GOTM and the war academy but this SG has taught me sooo much more. I've never reached the domination limit before!
So thanks to my teamies and to the staff, roll on SGOTM3!
I have a feeling it'll be a good one!

3) Side note: I think I might prefer to play PTW cos I really miss the rename units and "stack commands with one click", but if that isn't an option for you guys it's no biggie. :crazyeye:
1. I add some comments - answers at discussion thread not sure it will help...
2. You were most relible person in our team: micromanage carefully, carry war acurately, listen nicely. What I really want to point out your intuition that English getting to declare first war and build some defense in advance.Also, greate work of counting tiles of our counting tiles of our continent. I can't remember other smaller things, but my general impression that you did nothing upseting. (BTW I never reach Domination before...)
3. Sorry, can't run PTW, don't know what problems are...

...And yes GOTM3 will be something else indeed! I just wish I could take credit for it....
Don't worry: those who know to appreciate things can appeciate your work and effort NOT only in SGOTMs, but in SGs as well, with your maps :goodjob: and the time needed to watch out if all is going well.

The team remains the same for SGOTM3?

You can sign up as a team. Sure. I will add an Emperor/Deity player, then you will be set. You can PM each other and then sign up in the "Sign-up" thread. If there are only 3 of you, then I will add two players. It's not all or nothing. :)

All the same for me. :)

I'm in! see you in the sign up thread!

I'm in! see you in the sign up thread!
Excelent.
So I officially aplly to the game as a team leader with requiest to include one strong player in our team. I prefer non-variant game, as King Alex.

variant seems way too hard for me! I'll even play vanilla...

I looked at other team’s threads and decide to summarize our game. Instead of critics that I did during the game I want to highlight most smart thing that we did and what let us win fast in spite of our mistakes.
1. At turn 27 I did not trade tech with Lis and wait for next contact.
2. At turn 37 chain trade let us establish Tech parity with English and Russians: non of the team had this result that early.
3. Trade IW for cash. This was possible in combination with 9 gpt I did at turn 37 (Mcmg Berlin).
4. Tech research sequent was optimal (Poly was small deviation, I think Currency might be better choice).
5. Libraries in all core Cities. It give culture supremacy and make wars lot easer, compare to handy or bagsy teams. (They had a lot of flip back).
6. Clear and simple military goal for first stage of the game.
7. War with French in Alliance with English. Without Alliance we may not win this war that fast.
8. Cologne on Horses.
9. Early research of Republic. I think we might revolt straight after, the war might be few turns longer, but we gain more cash.
10. Lighthouse. FP was a real alternative, but it was risk that somebody else will build Lighthouse.
11. Demand of Rheims and control of center part of the continent.
12. Parquet plan and 2 turn settler Factory in Moscow.
13. Organization of overseas wars.
14. False peace for Chivalry.
15. Good timing of “D” day (830 AD).
16. Fast transfer troops to India-Japan.

May be I miss something, but I thing similar strategy for SGOTM3 will also work.

The thing I remember most about the early game was when I managed to trade communications between the 2 adjacent civs (Russia and English?) the turn before they would have met! I was very proud of that! he he he!
I am also pleased to have got our first GL and that we all agreed the lighthouse was our best option. We acted as tech brokers for much of the game and prevented the two continents from meeting, so our trashed rep with the home continent civs didn't matter for our relations with the other continent. The lighthouse was essential for this since the other civs would have met each other if they had built it instead.

We'll all be able to apply this experience to our next game and I'm sure our team's ranking will improve.