1.0 gram: Ancient Age All-Stars (C3C 1.22f Modified Rules)

The idea of this game came from gozpel in Hooray’s discussion thread. The mod to the rules is an effort to make the Ancient Age of C3C last as long as possible, allowing the players to use Ancient Age units almost exclusively. Horseman and swords will rule for most of this game :)

The rules have been modified as follows in an effort to do this:

All AA tech costs doubled
Monotheism, Engineering, Feudalism, and Chivalry tech cost 5X normal (balancing issue due to free tech receive by Scientific civ's)
All other MA tech costs 1000 (max). That means we will have to invest 10,000 gold to get the tech.
All IA+ tech costs are set to max (1000)
Max research time is 120 turns
GA increased to 30 turns
Galley is safe in seas and oceans (allows us to use a continents or island map if desired)
Great Lighthouse adds +2 movement and increases commerce in Water around that city
Map Making allows trade over sea tiles.
Plagues are on (max 2) (I never saw a plague in the game and thought it'd be cool)
edit (thanks microbe :) ):
ToA doubles the effect of Temples
SoZ expires with Fuedalism and produces 1 AC every 20 turns
Knights Templar expires with Gunpowder, costs 600 shields and produces 1 crusader every 20 turns



I would like to try this on Demi-God to keep it interesting but will go with another difficulty if others want something else.

Version: C3C v1.22f and v1.15b :cry:
Mapsize: standard
Landmass: Pangea, 60% water
barbs: restless
climate: normal
temperature: warm
world age: 5 billion years


I would like to limit the choices of Civ’s to ones that have Ancient Age unique units (hence the Ancient Age All-Star’s name ;) ). That means we can choose from the following (opponents will be drawn from this list as well):

Name – Unit name, attack.defend.move/shield cost
Aztec – Jaguar Warrior 1.1.2/10
Zulu – Impi 1.2.2/20
Greek – Hoplite 1.3.1/20
Carthage – Numidian Mercenary 2.3.1/30
Babylon – Bowman 2.2.1/20
Maya – Javelin Thrower 2.2.1 (enslavement) / 30
Rome – Legionary 3.3.1/30
Persia – Immortal 4.2.1/30
Celts – Gallic Swordsman 3.2.2/40
Egypt – War Chariot 2.1.2/20
Hittites – Three Man Chariot 2.2.2/30
Iroquois – Mounted Warrior 3.1.2/30
Byzantines – Dromon 2.1.3 – 2.1.2 bombard/30
Sumerians – Enkidu Warrior 1.2.1/10

I don’t want civ’s with Chivalry related UU’s as this might unbalance the game by not allowing the AI to get to a golden age. The other thought was that this would allow the knight to be the ultimate unit and everyone would have access to it.

We can probably do 2 more players however, if enough are interested (though not really sure why :) ), I can open another thread.

Standard 24hrs got it, 72hrs played, ask for more time and you will get it :) let’s just try to keep each other informed as best we can.

We can start the discussion now and I’ll generate maps tonight based on our preferences.

Conquest or domination are obvious win objectives. All others will be impossible or impossibly long.

Roster 1.22f
sir bugsy
denyd
ankka
6thGenTexan
mitsho
grahamiam

Roster 1.15b
gozpel
GK
scoutsout
conehead234
bede

I think the players listed know what rules to play under ;) However, if it needs clarification, we can do that too before we start.

20 turns starts it, 10 turns thereafter.

You'd better just get rid of some wonders. ToA will almost never expire. Zeus will be much more powerful. This will make it too unbalanced.

good points, we can consider that.

a couple idea's about the ToA and SoZ...

i can check the editor tonight to change the tech that makes them obsolete. it should be a useful tech that is required to get to the MA, say currency for ToA (nobody goes to church when they can make money :D )

another idea is to make the SoZ produce an AC every 20 or 25 turns instead of every 5 turns. Same deal with Knights Templar.

Checking in

Before selecting a tribe, any thoughts on map type/size (Dromons in a panagea or Jags & MWs in islands are wasted)

I prefer 1.22

I'm playing a game as the Celts and it's got great traits as does Persia.

Also, any thoughts on desired victory condition?

Obviously not Space or UN, unless you want to hit Histograph along the way

So that leaves (tribes I've played):
for Cultural my choices are 1. Babylon 2. Egypt 3. Aztec
for Conquest/Domination 1. Celts 2. Persia 3. Iroquois

I've never played the Mayans, Incas, Hittites, Sumerians or Byzantines, so those could be fun. I don't think commercial or seafaring, would help that much under these conditions. Scientific gets a big boost due to the bonus tech.

Edit: As for the temple wonders, how about having them both expire with Philosophy and have Knights Templer expire with Education.

ok, great! still waiting on gozpel and ankka.

regarding map size, i think "standard" should be the way to go. for me, these "large" SG's tend to take too much time when the game gets to the 250-300 turn stage.

VC seems to be conquest or domination, i'm not sure how to get cultural with all those MA and IA techs essentially cutoff. we won't be able to really research very fast on the MA tech tree with those tech costs. the AI will have just as much trouble.

as for tribes, i'm not too picky, though i have probably played too many persian games :) for me, the Maya seem attractive with thier enslavement ability.

for the wonders, i will take a careful look at the editor and post later.

btw, we are still looking for 1 or 2 more people assuming gozpel and ankka want to play. i would gladly have microbe but i don't think he was signing up ;)

ok, here are the proposed changes that I think will even out the advantages of the ToA, SoZ, KT wonders:

for the ToA, it doubles the happiness of all temples (similar to the effect Sistine's has on Cathedrals). it will no longer produce temples in all cities. Still expires with Education.

for the SoZ, it will produce an AC every 20T instead of every 5T. it will expire with Fuedalism (prerequisite for knights) instead of Metallurgy.

for the Knights Templar, cost is 600 shields, produces a Crusader every 20T. it will now expire with Gunpowder (tough tech to research in this mod but seems reasonable).

Let me know what you think.

Any chance I can talk you guys into going with 1.15?

I'm very interested in this one, but 1.22 has given me nothing but a headache.

If not would running parallel games using the same mods(both set up by you since you have both, of course) be possible?

Ancient Age "sticks and stones" slugfest... if someone wants to crank up a secondary 1.15 thread, I'd love to get in on this. If you haven't run out of fingers, count me in! :wavey:

I'll join the team.

As for Civ, NOT the Byzantines. If we are doubling the research costs, it will take a long time to get to map making and give us a late GA. I'm leaning to Rome, Persia, or the Celts. Rome has the best balanced unit, I have not played the Romans in ages, only one unit to build for attack of defense. Perisian Immortals are just that, immortal. Their only problems will be Rome or Carthage. On the down side, I have played them a lot and know they can run over the rest. Celts have the advantage of speed. If the game hinges of resource denial, they will have the speed and strength to pillage. Their down side is the highter unit cost.

As for map, I/d Prefer a Panagea. Otherwise it will be a long time before reaching others unless you make the Carracks carry units.

Either version will work for me.

6gntxn

ok, cool! if the 1.15b crew gets enough friends, i'll start another thread. i think you'll have at least 1 more that I know :)

i'll edit the opening post with the 2 rosters for the moment.

Thanks graham, if the 1.15 group is short a person or two I'll dig a couple up.

You want both teams to play the same Civs, or can we play different ones(would be intresting using the same map, but different Civs).

1 other thing. i don't want the players to have a scientific civ. I would rather have the AI gain that advantage. also, it would be best if both teams played the same civ.

Therefore, the voting is as follows:

Maya - grahamiam
Celts - denyd

please provide your preferences and I will update this post :)

@gengis -> the mod is rules only so the maps must be drawn up randomly in v1.15b and then in v1.22f. therefore, it will be impossible for me to use the same map for both teams without spoiling myself. however, in an effort to get them similar, i will generate the maps using the same settings. i will do my best to balance both but no promises :)

I would be interested in a 1.15 game.

ok cone, your in. looks like i'll have more trouble finding 1.22f people :lol: i figured by now people would have grudgingly accepted thier fate.

need votes on civ's from all of you, btw. otherwise, were playing as the Maya ;)

NOOOOOOOOO!! Why do you have to take my precious away from me, Immortals would be perfect this game.

Although I have to disagree about Sci being an advantage on this one, I think Mil/Ag/Ind will all be much more powerful then Scientific will ever have a chance of being. Due to the increased tech price we really won't have much of a shot of getting a SGL, scientific or not. Libraries might be a bit benificial if we decide to do our own research, but that wouldn't be for a while, and the free tech comes too late to be game breaking(or that much of an influence for that matter).

In a game that spends 75% of the time in despotism, I think Ag will be the game breaking trait, that bonus food is huge. Ind, is of course, strong as always(or even more so). Militaristic is obviously a good choice. Religious is next to wasted do to maybe having 1 revolt, and it won't be for a loooong time. Seafaring, depends on the map. But at the very worst it gives us 1 less border to worry about. Expansionist, again on the map, but with Demi it could be huge because we have a better chance of popping techs from huts and not getting barbs.

Have you considered the goody huts? A civ getting 2-3 techs from huts is absolutly huge with the tech cost we'll have to pay. I want barbs around for added fun, but the huts will be killers.


If this post has changed your mind on Scientific being an advantage at all, my vote goes to Persia. If not, I'll have to think about it some more.

[edit- It might be possible to get the same map, Ainwood has a utility that will extract the seed of a random map. If patch version doesn't change the seed you can make one of them, extract the seed then start the other using the same seed & see if it's the same. Just an idea that might work.]

imho, it'll be more difficult fighting the Persians than being them which always makes them an interesting opponent. Also, when I was 1st playing civ, i used to do them ad nausia so i tend to avoid them now. Finally, Ankka, Denyd, Cone, Gozpel and I just finished a Persia SG so I want to try something different.

However, I am not the sole chooser of our civ so your vote counts the same as mine :)

Civ votes:
grahamiam: maya
denyd: celts?
gk: persia

i figured by now people would have grudgingly accepted thier fate.well... at least I know of somebody involved in Bugs1 that wasn't surfin' the other thread for spoilers... :mischief: ...

...accepting one's fate...poo, feh... :ack: l'audace, l'aucace, toujours, l'audace! :p

...accepting one's fate...poo, feh... :ack: l'audace, l'aucace, toujours, l'audace! :p
hahahaha, now please vote for a civ :p :D

GK, Rome rules as well. I'd suggest no scientific civ in this game, even for the AI.

Not a sign-up though. ;)

hahahaha, now please vote for a civ :p :DOkay then, my vote goes for the ultimate noob civ: Egypt. War Chariots rule. And I wanna return to my "Regent Roots". :D

Well I would have to vote for the Iroquois. The commerial and agriculture traits would be good.

@microbe -> ok, thanks for the tip regarding the wonders ;)

@scoutsout -> thanks

@cone -> thanks

civ votes as follows:

grahamiam - maya
denyd - celts?
gk - persia
scoutsout - egypt
cone - iroquois

looks like were headed for a deadlock :lol:

[edit- It might be possible to get the same map, Ainwood has a utility that will extract the seed of a random map. If patch version doesn't change the seed you can make one of them, extract the seed then start the other using the same seed & see if it's the same. Just an idea that might work.]

thanks. i just tested it very briefly and it seems to work like a charm. :thumbsup:

Can I get the tie-breaker vote? ;)

Can I get the tie-breaker vote? ;)No. I'm the one who lives in Florida, therefore I get to hang Chad. Just as soon as somebody tells me where I can find him.

My choice is Rome or Celts and leave the over played Persians to the AI.

My choice is Rome or Celts and leave the over played Persians to the AI.
ok, thanks. i will put you in for celts for now since no other votes are for the romans. of course, if i didn't guess denyd's wish correctly, then that changes :)

civ votes as follows:

maya - grahamiam
celts - denyd?, 6gntxn
persia - gk
egypt - scoutsout
iroquois - cone

If there is still room in the 1.15 roster, sign me up, grahamiam.

Celts are good.

Thanks.

Checking in, 1.22 is the only version I can play.

Like Ankka, I'm locked into 1.22

Correct on Celts at my choice, though one of the new AI (Hittite, Sumerian, Maya would be fun).

I also like the idea of no expansionist in the game. Popping 3-4 techs might be game breaking either way. The no scientific is ok, but the Persians are always fun to have to deal with (It's alot of fun to :spank: X-man & Shaka)

ok, good to hear from you all :)

bede, your the last spot in the 1.15b team(well, unless you guys don't mind playing with 1 more, but 6 should be the limit). we still need 1 for the 1.22f team.

civ votes as follows:

maya - grahamiam
celts - denyd, 6gntxn, bede
persia - gk
egypt - scoutsout
iroquois - cone

ankka, need your vote :)

An expansionist civ would be ultimate if getting free techs from huts would be a huge advantage.

In that case, hittites or the inca would be good.


I still don't know who to vote for... I think I'll go for the Hittites. They also have a cool UU.

On second thought: the Maya are also very powerful with agr/ind trait.


I'd like a AA all-starts game with only mediterranean civs, that would be even cooler, BTW. :D Greeks, Persia, Rome, Egypt, Sumeria, Hittites, Babylon... all in one. :D

thanks ankka, i'll keep those civ's under consideration for opponents :)

civ votes as follows:

maya - grahamiam, ankka
celts - denyd, 6gntxn, bede
persia - gk
egypt - scoutsout
iroquois - cone


i'm gonna close the voting and say the celts have it. will try to generate some saves later and post starting positions before tonight.

But if those are the opponents, what's the point in playing the Maya ourselves? I think we should also be a mediterranean civ.


There are many:

Greece
Rome
Persia
Hittites
Sumeria
Egypt
Carthage
Arabs
Ottomans (?)
Babylon

Those would be enough for a great game. And if we add the Byzantines and India, we' get a whole Large map with these Ancient civs only.

But if you don't want to do it... maybe I had the wrong idea about this.

there are enough votes for the celts that i think we'll settle on them, we will not play as the maya. i wanted to keep this at a standard map size and limit us to the standard number of opponents (qty 7). however, i can change it if desired.

the ottomans will not be included as an opponent as they will not be likely to get to thier UU before the game is done.

Oh yeah, forgot that on the Ottomans. :blush:

i thought i'd have some time this afternoon to generate saves but I will not. also, tonight will be busy as my parents are in town with my godson (2 three year olds in the house! where's my asperin? :lol: ). hopefully, i will be able to post a couple of screens tomorrow that we can vote on (EDT, USA). Sorry about the delay.

No problem. :)

Yay, it only took me erhh...12 minutes to open this page. Seems like my internet is finally working again :)

Since grahamiam already picking maps for Celts, I cast my vote and say Maya, just to throw in a spanner in the works.

Just kidding, celts are fine.

12 minutes? What have you done? :wow:

ok, got some time this morning while the parents are at church and the kids are watching a cartoon :)

start #1

#2 - flood plains-r-is

#3 the highlands, with friends :)

Both look good, I'd go for #1 though.


Edit: I see you posted more, I'd go for #3 or #4.

#4 - i sell sea shells down by the sea shore

hold on ankka, i got 6 to vote from :p

#5 sugarland

I like number 3.

Edit: number 4 is also good.

#6 cow and river

Won't venture an opinion. My last starts were less than promising,

Now as you posted them all, I think I like #3 the best.

ok, friends, post and let me know. i'll check in later (around 8PM) so we can start this.

btw, i survived last night just fine, in fact, the p's brought lobsters and beer! might wanna keep them around, eh?
:beer:

I like 6 and 3 the best.

Yes, they have a possibility of a settler factory of 4 turns If I don't look wrong.

Okay, having seen them all, have to go with 6.

My choices would be:

1 - Sea Shore (#4)
2 - Cow & river (#6)
3 - Sugarland (#5)

Start Position Thoughts:
We need Iron and a lot of shields to crank out Gallic Swordmen.
Judging by the mini-maps, it looks like we are on continents. Any mod to the Carracks?

1.Coast/River/GameForest...good mix of food and sheilds but where would the iron be?

2.River/FloodPlains...good mix of food and shields but no coast in sight and only 2 hills for iron in sight.

3.River/Wheat/Mountains/Hut...High probability for close Iron, coast/lake 2W of start, and a second river SE of hut. Worthy of consideration.

4.River/Coast/2 Heards/Hut...Food,Shields,Iron deposits, 3 river townsites in picture but one drawback, best capital is 1N delaying use of cows by 10 turns.

5.River/2Sugar/GameaForest...Higher on food than shields with no clear direction for Iron or settlement.

6.River/Cow...Balance of shields and food until forests are cleared. Nothing special at all.


My vote is for #4.

@6gntxn -> all maps were generated using the same settings listed in the 1st post. all landmasses are pangea, 60% water.

current count (taking only 1st votes):
#3: 1 vote
#4: 2 votes
#6: 2 votes

i'll throw in the tiebreaker if it comes down to that :)

I never looked back at the first post to see the change. :blush: That means there is a large lake or big bay to the east of the start. I'd still vote for #4 and unless we want to go for Colossus, do not move the settler. Another benefit to #4 is the cental start location on the map.

Is the place still free? Can I participate?

And now I'm going to read the thread... :)

So, for the start place, I would propose #3 or #4, #4 looks easier to start, but #3 more special. Therefore I would vote for #3, but then we have a 2-2-2 vote... :) so take #4..

and for the civ, I would have voted for the romans (:p), but celts are ok too.

mfG mitsho

mitsho, we have room in the 1.22f team. is that were you want to play?

Oh, yes, forgot to mention in which team. Isn't this the thread for 1.22f?

mfG mitsho

EDIT: erm... sorry, I'd like to participate in the 1.22f team. ;)

ok, great! 2 complete teams :D

i'd like to get things setup now since there are massive thunderstorms on the way here and i don't want to be online then. they're expected to last most of the day. i'll generate the saves and create the 1.15b thread shortly with the #4 save.

edit: i apologize to those that didn't get a chance to vote but if i waited, i'm afraid i would hold everyone up till tomorrow night

ok, the 1.22f team is as follows:

denyd
ankka
6thGenTexan
mitsho
grahamiam

attached is the save. i would ask that neither team looks at the other's thread till the following has been completed:
1. entire landmass is explored
2. all 7 civ's are met
3. IW (iron) and The Wheel (horses) are researched.

Thanks!

link to the 1.15b thread -> http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=1883027#post1883027

Lurkers comment here...

Are you going to change anything to allow cities to grow beyond size 12 or size 6? It's going to take a long time to get aquaducts through cities, and even then you're stuck at size 12 unless you lower the city size in the editor.

no, but i rarely find us for cities greater than size 12 anyways :)

Okay... hope you guys have alot of rivers around.;)

just to be clear, denyd is up!
we should discuss how we're gonna handle the extended research times and what techs to go for.
Celts are agricultural and religous and we start with Pottery and CB? Our UU is fast (3.2.2, speed kills!) and comes with Iron Working.
our starting position is very strong, with 2 cows and a river. our city center will give us 3 fpt and 1spt while the cows will give 3fpt and 2spt each when irrigated. the forrest will give 1 food and 2 shields. therefore, imho, the setup for the land should be as follows:
irrigated cows (2x) for 6gpt and 4spt
irrigated plains (2x) for 4fpt and 2spt
city center (1x) for 3fpt and 1spt

total @ size 4 = +5fpt and +7spt
@ size 5 (working another irrigated plain) = +5fpt and +8spt
@ size 6 (working another irr plain) = +5fpt and +9spt

so, we could do a 4-5 settler factory (assuming the computer jumps to the forrest during growth) or a 5-6 to get more gold.

Ok, I got it, probably won't get to it tonight (SGOTM 2 is ahead) and I'm just starting.

Lots of time to talk about research and builds.

I haven't looked who the opponents are, but The Wheel is normally a safe research bet (unless the Japanese are around). Bronze working & Alphabet would be good but probably only be available at minimum (120 turns)

I'll start by settling in place, moving the worker across the river to irrigate & road the cow, building a pair of warriors for scouting and then a granary.

I assume the opener plays 20 and the rest play 10.

yep, start with 20 turns.
i have not told anyone the opponents yet. do you feel that should be common knowledge or should I let everyone find them out themselves? if we were only doing 1 version, i would have had random civ's (eliminating the ones not listed on the 1st post) so even I would not know. however, in order to get the games as similar as possible, I had to list the opponents when generating the saves.

It does not matter if you list the other civs or not. We will be told who they are @3000BC. Japan does not have an AA UU so they should not be here but won't the Iroquois bee line to their UU also? I say go for the highest trade value and go with Alphabet or Mysticism.

ok, we can go for either of those, but i think a min research rate is out. If we want to buy the techs, we should just do 0% to accumulate as much gold as possible. if we go min (say 10%), it will take us 120 turns and I think there are only about 500 turns in the entire game.
imho, the key here is to expand fast, getting as many people paying taxes as possible to speed up research to a decent level. follow the rivers!

the civ's are drawn from the list on the 1st post.

I was also thinking this, min. research is out of count... totally useless.

From my (very hazy) memory, whenever you try to research a 2nd level tech with only 1 city, there are really only 2 settings on the slider, off (0%) and on (10%-100%) 40 turns (max rate). I'm not sure how much that will change, so I'm thinking that Alphabet is probably the best tech. Of course, we've probably got 2 commercial neighbors (Greece, Hittite, Iroquois & Rome are commercial). Any thoughts on Bronze Working (Sumeria, Persia & Babylon get this), as it's on the road to our UU?

well, we'll have 120 turns to "grow into" our research rate so, if we still 100% into it from the beginning, the turns will come down as we expand. it'll probably end up like a 40T research and then we'll find we're way behind and broke :lol:

I suggest we don't research at all, let's get cash and buy them from the AI.

Ankka's got a pretty good idea - I was also thinking that the Great Library might be a key to winning this game.

So what's it going to be:
1. Alphabet
2. Bronze Working
3. Mysticism

Research at Max or Minimum or no research at all.

I vote for no research, just trading & the pointy stick kind

I agree, no research. Let's hope we have luck on huts... ;)

ok, i'll try no research for the beginning. we will need to do some lifting later, though.

The problem is that we'll be wasting lots of gpt if we research in the beginning, but as the research times have been set up so high the AI will value the techs much more. So trading will also be hard. This will make the tech pace even slower than you would suspect with only highered tech costs.

Too bad we won't be an expansionist civ, we'll have some hard time with huts etc... also we won't find the others so easily..

yes, but i have a feeling that we'll quickly regain equality with the AI since our expansion will be much faster. in fact, getting that granery up so we can start the 4T settler cycle will be very important.

And the AI will propably waste most of it's gpt to science as usual... which is another thing we can benefit from.


My brain still somehow hasn't got the point that this will be an all- AA game...:rolleyes: Somehow I'm still thinking that we'll be researching like normal etc... :rolleyes:



Edit: just realised that we're on page 5 and the game hasn't even begun yet...:lol:

hmm, I myself have play all my games similar like this. I really like the ancient age, so I prolonged (correct word?) it the way we do now here. The problem with this style is that the more AI-civs there are, the more difficult it gets. Because when we research a 'wrong' 'un'tradeable tech, we will get stuck far behind. So, don't research the techs the AI will, in any case not bronce working. that's perhaps as good as suicide... ;) (ok, I'm overrating it, but you know what I mean).
We will see this happening when an AI-civ won't get fast contact! (in my last game, the mayans were still in the ancient age, when me and the others reached the industrial.... :rolleyes:)

but ok, let's try with no research at all :)

mfG mitsho

ok, so we settled on no research for the beginning. however, please keep in mind we get a free tech from philosophy so if we get alphabet quickly and have 3 or 4 cities up, it will probably be better to change course and research writing than to save up the gold to buy the other 1st tier tech's.

I agree, researching will get better when we get more cities. And philly has a lot more power now, and I don't think the AI is clever enough to beeline for it...:hmm:

I also think the Great Library will prove to be more powerful in this game than in most others. We should be sure to have a pre-build going to get it ASAP.

Tonight I'll found in place, build 2 warriors then start granary, worker to cow across river to irrigate & road then to other cow for same - research at 0% researching Warrior Code (that way if we pop a hut, we can get one of the more desirable techs).

Sounds good... :)

I'm on board with the Alpha--Write--Philo--Lit path. The rivers around our start location will be a big help. I think we should save our $ until we buy Alphabet to ave enough to do some deficit research to Philo.

@ Denyd Seeing that you were going to start last night, this won't help now. I'd road/irrigate the cow on the same sice of the river first to save a worker turn. Going from the cow on our side with a road to the cow across the river will take one turn. The other way around it will take two turns. Building the road before irrigation, will not cost us the gpt, just a couple of food.

Sorry for the delay, uploading was taking forever last night, so I brought the files to my office to upload.

FIRST THE SAVE (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Gram1_3000BC.SAV)

Turn Log 1

Turn 0 – 4000 BC – First off the opponents: Rome, Maya, Greece, Babylon, Persia (not those damn Immortals again), Hittites & Iroquois), so just Hittites are expansionists – Enya (worker) moves to cow – Settler founds Entremont – pops hut for 25g - starts warrior – just in case anyone was interested: max research for Bronze Working (52) – Masonry (69) – Alphabet (86) – The Wheel (69) – Warrior Code (52) – Science to 0% will make 4gpt

IBT: zzz

Turn 1 – 3950 BC – Enya starts road

IBT: zzz

Turn 2 – 3900 BC – nothing

IBT: zzz

Turn 3 – 3850 BC – nada

IBT: Entremont builds warrior starts another – Enya completes road starts irrigation

Turn 4 – 3800 BC – Enya starts irrigation – William (warrior) SW

IBT: zzz

Turn 5 – 3750 BC – William SW spots a FP area

IBT: zzz

Turn 6 – 3700 BC – William W spots coastline & incense

IBT: Entremont builds warrior starts granary – Entremont grows to size 2

Turn 7 – 3650 BC – Wallace (warrior) N – William SW – raise luxury rate to 10% (costs 1gpt)

IBT: Enya completes irrigation

Turn 8 – 3600 BC – William SW – Enya moving to 2nd cow – Wallace N finds woods

IBT: zzz

Turn 9 – 3550 BC – Enya reaches 2nd cow – Wallace N finds game next to marsh along coast and spots another island (?) across the water – William W finds more coastline

IBT: Entremont culture expansion

Turn 10 – 3500 BC – Enya starts road on cow – Wallace W to game along coast – William SW to coast

IBT: zzz

Turn 11 – William S spots Orange Spearman & oasis – Wallace NW spots possible land bridge – Persia (Orange): Annoyed, up Masonry & Bronze Working, down Pottery & Ceremonial Burial, 10g, has 2 cities – Trade for BW is available (both our techs) – I’ll wait

IBT: Persian Spear moves N – Entremont grows to size 3

Turn 12 – 3400 BC – Wallace W spots dyes and a land bridge – William S – Slider to 30%

IBT: Enya completes road

Turn 13 – 3350 BC – Enya starts irrigation – Wallace W – William S spots 2 Barbarian Warriors (BW) & wounded Persian Spear – Persia now has wine connected

IBT: Persian spear & settler move S

Turn 14 – 3300 BC – William SW (avoiding BW) spots furs – Wallace W finds another dyes

IBT: zzz

Turn 15 – 3250 BC – Wallace NW – William S

IBT: BW dies attacking William (2/3)

Turn 16 – 3200 BC – William S spots another fur – Wallace N finds what might be the top of the island (great stuck with Persia on an island)

IBT: Entremont granary->settler – Enya completes irrigation

Turn 17 – 3150 BC – Wallace NE – William S

IBT: Entremont grows to size 4

Turn 18 – 3100 BC – Enya starts road to 2nd city site – Wallace E confirms top of island – Trade Pottery + Ceremonial + 52g to Persia for Bronze Working + worker – William S – Sasha (Persian Worker) moves to join Enya – Slider to 40%

IBT: zzz

Turn 19 – 3050 BC – Wallace S – William SE spots edge of tundra – Sasha helps Enya road

IBT: zzz

Turn 20 – 3000 BC – Wallace S – William E

Notes: Treasury: 72g +4gpt – Settler due next turn, Entremont to grow in 2 – Wallace heading back to Entremont to MP, which will allow reduced luxury spending – William heading E looking for Persia – Persia has a worker for sale (72g + 3gpt) if you want to buy her – Persia is ahead Masonry – It is possible that SE of Entremont is a land bridge to the rest of the world (I hope) - I'm hoping my N & W exploration choices haven't screwed us over for the rest of the game. I am worried about being alone on an small island with Persia, if X-Man gets Immortals (in about 30 turns he'll have iron working) when all we've got is spears & warriors, it might be worth it to buy that worker, just to handicap him a little.

I've tried a couple of times to upload a picture, but it kept failing. I'll try to add it later.

Edit: 6thGenTexan, didn't think of that, next time I will, thanks.

Edit2: Just checked my .jpg and that's the problem, a corrupt file, I'll try to use CRPrings for a picture

Edit3: It turns out my CRPrings doesn't know how to read C3C 1.22 files

nice set denyd. :thumbsup: i'm very suprised we are on an island? setup was pangea with 60% water so if we are on an island or continent, we should be close to another. galleys are ok on sea and ocean so that shouldn't stop us. however, living with the x-man alone could spell trouble.

edit: i believe a new version of rings is out if you have the time to download it

denyd
ankka <- UP
6thGenTexan <- On Deck
mitsho
grahamiam

If we are alone with Persia, that will put us behind the tech pace. We will not be able to do any sea exploration to find the other civs until we get Alphabet but we will not get Alphabet until we meet the other civs......nice Catch 22 we've got working here. Let's hope that is not the case. If we are alone, Max down our research path for the Great Library.
Regarding Persia as our first advisary, retreat and resource denial are the keys to success. We will need to get IW from them as soon as they get it to make sure we have it and they do not.

got home a little early so here's the map at 3000BC

Nice job denyd, any ideas on what I should do?

edit: i believe a new version of rings is out if you have the time to download it



What are you talking about? :hmm:

What are you talking about? :hmm:
that rcprings program that denyd uses.
as far as your turns, ankka, expand and explore. looks like everything that is interesting is to the east. hopefully, you can found a couple of towns during your turns. the river to the SW looks ok or you can also follow the river the the SE. i would try to expand enough to block off those lands to the north so we can call them our own.
good luck :)

I had also LK69, so I'll play this later in the evening...

Ok, Expansion...

I'll play now.

3000BC [Preturn]: Now let's see where we are going.. so far looks good.


I just noticed a funny thing: time will be AD after a while, but we'll still be researching the AA techs... :lol:

Reset personal prefs and press enter.

IBT: Entremont settler > settler. Not sure if this is the right choice... but I'm hopeless in counting on when the settler factory starts. Let's hope I'm right this time.

2950BC [1]: Settler SW, worker irrigate plains.

William finds the Persian border in a quite straight line South from Entremont.

2900BC [2]: Settler S, Wallace S.

2850BC [3]: Exploration, settler S.

2800BC [4]: William heals for one turn, it was wounded for some reason.

IBT: Entremont settler > warrior.

2750BC [5]: The first settler will settle S-S-SW-SW from Entremont, on a forest at a river. Let's hope I don't mess up these totally...

2710BC [6]: Alesia founded. > warrior.

The newer settler goes SE to a mountain and sees a Persian warrior - spear pair. Also a cow is seen and the rivr where Alesia is continues in the South. I'll go for the cow.

Change Entremont to settler.

Lower luxtax to 20%.

2670BC [7]: Gah! The Persians moved just to where I was gonna settle...! Ohwell, move the settler to the South, next one may settle there.

Lower luxtax to 10% as Wallace now arrived to MP duties in Entremont.

IBT: Persia starts to build the Pyramids...

2630BC [8]: Enya and Shasha are now roading the tile S of Entremont.

The settler explores a bit to see where would be the best settling spot... Looks luike there are a nice amount of rivers here. :)


2590BC [9]: Settler moves towards possible settling spot. Now let's hope those idiotic Persians don't move into the way again...

IBT: Ah, they don't.

Entremont settler > settler. Looks like a great 6- turn settler factory. :D

2550BC [10]: New settler NW, the old SE one N.

Celtica in 2550BC:


I suggest settling the Eastern settler where it is, a good defensive position and also a cow and acess to the sea.

The other settler could go perhaps NW-NW-W-W.



Just ideas, though.

And the known world in 2550BC.

Oh, and the save to next better player. :)

ok, nice set ankka. looks like a land bridge to the east. next player should try to get that pump setup for 4T cycle as the persian are coming north :)

Pump set up? I missed something? Oh dear. :blush:

Pump set up? I missed something? Oh dear. :blush:
sorry ankka, it wasn't meant as a criticism, just a note. you got 3 settlers during your turns so that means you were doing great. it's just that now were down to size 2 and we can't keep that rate up too much longer. a steady 4T rate will help for the long haul. probably 1 or 2 warriors between the next 2 settlers is all it takes, and we could use the MP's right now :)

IIRC we had a prefct 6- turn SF up now. Not sur, but I think so. :hmm:

Oh well, if I didn't mess up more than that... good. :) I'm terrible in counting something like the shields & food for a SF.

IIRC we had a prefct 6- turn SF up now. Not sur, but I think so. :hmm:
Oh well, if I didn't mess up more than that... good. :) I'm terrible in counting something like the shields & food for a SF.
no, if we maintain size 4 & 5, we can get a settler every 4T (see my notes/calc's last page before starting). later, if we get some lux and a couple MP's, we can probably maintain size 5 & 6, getting some extra gold in the process. all's well though, we are expanding nicely right now :)

roster update:

denyd
ankka <- Just Played
6thGenTexan <- Up
mitsho <- On Deck
grahamiam

I was meaning that it worked also as a 6- turnSF, but 4 is always better. :)

I've got it.

I've got it.
good luck! 2 cities are up with 2 more to follow so we should check on our research capabilities. maybe we can start towards the GLib or to IW. Like you mentioned earlier, we want to make sure we get the iron and not the persians :)

2550BC Opening Thoughts. We will never be larger than size 12 so there is no need to give every town 21 squares. I would have moved Alesia closer to Entremont but that is the fun of these SG's. Eastern settler will move to river plain by Incense. Northern Settler will continue north and settle on Hill by lake. This will be our Great Library home with 3BG, 2nd Hill and 2 forests. Wallace leaves Entremont to explore Eastward. William will complete scouting south of the Persians. Alesia swapped to Temple. The long range benefits are greater with the temple than a regular warrior.

2510BC

2470BC Persia founded Antioch in a bad location....off of river next to a hill. Growth in Entremont raises tax back to 20%. Third worker defaults to forest but we need to move it to the irrigated plain.

2430BC Lugdumum founded 3 from Alesia and Entremont and starts a temple. Workers split so Enya can connect the Incense and Sasha will connect Alesia.

2390BC Following the Persian Pair east, we meet the Babylonians after they do. (Only up WC) Camulodunum founded and starts a warrior. Barbs in the area. Entremont hits 4 but settler next turn. Have to raise the taxes again w/o MP or Lux.

2350BC Entremont settler-->temple It will help happiness when we get a little larger for the 4-turn settlers. The Babylonian warrior was killed by barbs. Persian Pair take a step back. I hope the do not have more people exploring. See a hut in the south. Drop taxes back to 10%.

2310BC Hut had barbs. Persian Pair is even with us now. Alesia grew and temple is whipped. I would have to rais taxes otherwise.

2270BC Alesia temple-->warrior One Barb was defeated by William between turns. Raise taxes for Entremont.

2230BC Persian Pair is hunting barbs and I see a big empty plain to the east.

2190BC Camulodunum warrior-->temple Richborough founded SE of Alesia by sugar and starts a temple.

2150BC Incense connected. Entremont temple-->settler. Growth in 3, settler in 4. See a Babylonian border in the East.

Eastern explorer,Wallace, should head straight north. Southern explorer, William, can head back home to be a MP. Lugdunum can go to barrack next (use the whip) and start providing for our defense. Walls in Richborough would be smart being the closest to the Persians. Alesia could be used to farm workers with some irrigation. Sasha is set to road a forest that is being used and Enya is heading to connect Richborough.

What to do with the next settlers? 1.SE of Richborough on rivers but getting close to the Persians. 2.Coastal river east of Lugdunum. 3.West of Alesia to claim rest of Incense. 4.North of Entremont on coast. 5.SE of prior settlements on rivers towards Persians or on Eastern Lakes. 6.NW of Camulodunum on lake claiming silks.

I did not think about starting reseach on my turn. Check and see if any of the other civs start with Alphabet. If someone does, find them and buy it to research Writing. The Persians do not have IW yet.

I neglected military this turn so Persia my demand some $ soon. I'd give in. 20g is not much at this point in the game.


The Game (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Gram1_2150BC.SAV)

nice turns. looks like i forgot about the happiness factor. usually, during the expansion phase, i don't care and just adjust the lux tax for the settler factory, even up to 30% or so if needed. however, having the temple is nice and the lux hooked up will help as well. your note about city size is right on, we will never grow beyond size 12 so we can pack them in if we want. in fact, for this scenario, that is the best option.

roster update:

denyd
ankka
6thGenTexan <- Just Played
mitsho <- Up
grahamiam <- On Deck

I'll get it in a few minutes (if heaven hasn't crushed down by then ;) )

mfG mitsho

EDIT: And heaven crashed down on me... No, I 'm sorry, but I wasn't able to download the save. I'll try later on again. mfG mitsho

ok mitsho, just let us know when you get it. if you need a swap till you get to a good connection, let us know :)

Just bumping in and informing you guuys that I'm back home again...

Swap me, (my comp is away for a day and then I have to get the normal civ cd (lent away... :)) and then I can play...)

mfG mitsho

That puts the lovely Grahamiam, our benevolent host at the controls, put your Enya CD in the machine and :rockon:

roster update:

denyd
ankka
6thGenTexan <- Just Played
mitsho <- On Deck
grahamiam <- Up

got it. will play and post tonight. mitsho, please post an eta if possible. if it's gonna be a few days, maybe we can do the skip this time as I know denyd is just itchn' to get back at this :)

enya? just googled her and now i see she's a celtic musician :lol: not for me. i want to be stereotyped, i want to be classified ;)

first, the 1750BC save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Gram1_1750BC.SAV)

Preflight check: Things look nice with 5 cities already :) Sacrifice some growth in Lugdunum to get Entremont into 4T settler mode by MM Lug off irrigated river plain and onto hill incense (nothing else is irrigated atm) and letting Entremont use the tile.

Research notes: At 80% research, we can do IW in 26T, Alpha in 22T, Masonry in 16T, the Wheel in 18T, or WC in 11T. Therefore, I set research on IW as we need to know where that iron is located and I don’t think it’d be wise to wait for the Glib on this tech. Switch Richborough to a warrior from Temple (it’s closest to Persia atm).

IBT: Alesia’s borders expand.

T1: 2110BC Wallace heads N to meet new friends (barb hut due east) William starts the trek home to provide MP duty.

T2: 2070BC Adjust lux slider to 20% for Entremont. Bahh, we need 1 more tile irrigated for a 4T factory! Move worker- Enya near Lug up to help out the slave. Camulodunum changed to worker from Temple. Need more workers to help do the laundry.

IBT: William is ambushed and redlined but survives; Alesia warrior -> worker

T3: 2030BC Enya arrives to help, William moves to a hill to get away from another barb. Wallace heads north, ends up next to a 1warrior barb camp.

IBT: Entremont settler -> warrior; Lug temple -> warrior; Camulondunum worker -> temple

T4: 1990BC Settler heads towards SE river; Wallace continues north, ignoring the barb hut; Enya irrigates; William fortifies. MM Lux slider to 0%

T5: 1950BC Wow, Babylon is now up Mas, Alpha, the Wheel, WC, IW, and Myst. Persia is up Mas, the Wheel, WC, and IW. Wallace meets the Romans. They are up Mas, the Wheel, Alpha, WC, IW, and Myst. This is bad.

Babylon: Myst for 7gpt and 165g.
Persia: IW for Myst, 2gpt and 21g
Research is off again. Treasury down to 13g and +5gpt.

This should keep them off us while we expand and find iron. The only Iron I see is to the far east, near Babylon :(

IBT: Entremont warrior -> settler

T6: 1910BC William kills barb horse and we get 25g. Persia beat us to our SE location. Turn down lux tax due to warrior in Entremont.

IBT: Lugdunum warrior -> warrior; Richborough riots

T7: 1870BC Raise lux tax for pop in Entremont; Wallace continues north; Warrior moves out of Lug to cover new town to SE.

IBT: Alesia worker -> warrior Romans are building the Pyramids

T8: 1830BC Found Verulamium near cow to the SE -> warrior. Wallace continues north

IBT: barb warrior attacks Camulondunum but is defeated without a scratch; Richborough warrior -> warrior

T9: 1790BC Workers irrigate plains between Lug and Alesia. Lug will have to work one of these new tiles to allow Entremont to go 4T. Move warrior out of Richborough to investigate the mountains to the south (hoping for iron).

IBT: Entremont settler -> settler (MM to get +5fpt and 7spt); Lug warrior -> warrior (next player may want to change to a barracks)

T10: 1750BC Move warrior in Alesia towards Richborough. Settler left in Entremont for the next player. Lux tax is at 0%. Not really sure what we can do with this start as it appears we are up against the wall big-time. Growth can still be had but our empire is going to be weak.

Settler factory is setup now. Lug must come off the irrigated plain near Entremont and onto the irrigated plain due next turn near Alesia. Grow is probably limited to the north to the dyes and west to the ocean. The good news is that Persia does not have iron either.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/gram10-1750bc.JPG

roster update:

denyd <- On Deck
ankka
6thGenTexan
mitsho <- UP please let us know if you can take it or need a skip
grahamiam <- Just Played

Looks like we are alone here with Persia... not so good.

Looks like we are alone here with Persia... not so good.
sorry, i didn't make it clear, but the Roman warrior was met to our far NE and the Babylonians at to the E, so yes, we are basically alone with Peria atm but they don't have iron hooked up yet.

this may sound foolish, but we could research or buy WC fairly quickly, then maybe do an archer rush on the Persians. I haven't done this too many times but enough to know that it is very bloody. If this sounds feasible, next player may want to switch some of those warrior builds to spears in anticipation of this.

Maybe I hould have read the turnlog. :blush: :lol:


Ok... I think swords are the word of the day, though. If we get them, they'll almost ever be obsolete... we could rule the world with them, the archers wouldn't be good for long, and we couldn't really upgrade 'em...

Nice turn set Grahamiam :clap:

Those trades were well made, buying techs is probably the way to go for quite a while.

Looks like we might need those archers after all. For now, it's probably best to keep adding cities and improving land. Once we've filled all of the available land, if no iron or horses are available (does anyone have the Wheel yet?), we'll probably have to fall back on the Plan B of barracks and mass archer production to overrun Persia with arrows. (Why do Plan B's always suck?)

It's a good thing I'm playing DD01. The bows only limitation gave me some practice for this. As long as the opponent is defending with spears (not on a hill or across a river), archers vs spears need about a 2 to 1 ratio for sure success (less if the archers are vets and the spears are regulars). If we can cripple X-Man, then we've still got to deal with Caesar's Legions and Hammurabi's Bowmen. How come the only guy who doesn't need iron for his UU gets it?

I've got SGOTM tonight, so there's no reason for Mitsho to rush with the skip.

If you don't mind a piece of unsolicited advice...get to Mathematics ASAP and build catapults, catapults, catapults. A stack of archers, spears, and catapults will roll over any AI city. That's the way to keep your casualty ratio acceptable.

Arathorn

If you don't mind a piece of unsolicited advice...get to Mathematics ASAP and build catapults, catapults, catapults. A stack of archers, spears, and catapults will roll over any AI city. That's the way to keep your casualty ratio acceptable.
Arathorn
that's excellent advise. thanks for adding it. sometimes the most obvious is easiest to miss. not too many mountains around Persia either. however, it will take more than a few pounds of gold to get math with these rules :)

hmm, it's nopt really probably that I can play today or tomorrow, so sorry. another skip for me (I hate it.... )

mfG mitsho

ok mitsho, thanks for the update. hope you get things worked out before your next set :)

roster update:

denyd <- Up
ankka <- On deck
6thGenTexan
mitsho
grahamiam <- Just Played

Checking in. I'll need to read the entire thread before I'm up to speed.

Looks like I'm not up yet in SGOTM2, so this one's at the top of the list.

A couple questions for the team, with no iron should we:

1. Start building barracks & archers
2. Keep building settlers and expanding
3. Research The Wheel and hope for horses
4. Research Writing for trading

I probably won't start for 8 hours or so, so post your opinions by then,

Thanks

I like Arathorn's idea. research math. Go with rax and archers.

i'll slot bugs in after denyd then

roster update:

denyd <- Up
bugs <- On deck
ankka
6thGenTexan
mitsho
grahamiam <- Just Played

Better start reading fast. :crazyeye:

Better start reading fast. :crazyeye:
i can move you down further, say behind 6gntxn if you want.

Bugsy, why don't you take it now and I'll take SGOTM2 and then I can pick up once your done?

Edit: So read really fast (Evelyn Woods are you out there somewhere :scan: )

Alright, I'll take it. It might be tomorrow before I get it posted.

Some observations.

1. We need to meet the remaining civs.
2. For a game that is supposed to have expensive techs, civs certainly are researching pretty fast, or may that be due to goody huts?
3. research math and prepare for an archer rush?
4. See if we can find iron somewhere. This would stink if we can't find iron for our UU, an AA dominator IMHO.

Any thoughts are welcome. I won't be able to start play for another two hours or so.

this is demigod, so they research fast and trade cheap among themselves. for you, they want both arms and all your children. however, keep your eyes open for trades (gotta ruin that F4 button) as the tech costs will go down as we meet everyone else.

buy WC but we probably will need to research math. gpt should go up with the 4T factory setup, remember to get Lug off the river tile near Entremont and onto the one near Alesia that will be done in 1T. That way, Entremont can work that tile at size 5. barbs are to the NW so try to get lug to provide an escort for the settlers.

good luck.

If the only iron around is near the Babylons, we should settle in that direction to make it easier to connect once captured. Sending the settlers this way, we may have one that can hike to the next iron deposit instead. Build barracks and research math so we can take the iron if need be. I think we can give up on the Great Library. By the time we get it, there will be so few techs to learn.

Here's a partial turn log. I'll have the rest later.

Pre-flight – 1750 BC – Check in with the other civs. Roman won’t discuss selling us WC. Good news => he doesn’t have iron yet.

Hammy doesn’t have anything hooked up, won’t sell.

X-man has wines, but no iron. No sale there either.

We have a settler in Entremont. Where? Go back an reread the game thread. Tex has a very good idea. Settle towards the iron. Towards the iron it is.

We need some more intel on Persia’s lands. Wake up a warrior in Alesia and head him south. We’ll do some probing. :D

City check – four turn settler factory is up and running.

Three food in city center? Ah-Ha! That’s right we’re agricultural. That ought to help us in the long run.

Sliders at zero. :hmm: 10% science gets us a tech in 120 turns. Sliders stay at zero. :D

Looks like we’re ready to rock and roll. Since we’re the Celts. U2, Van Morrison, and the Corrs go into the CD player.

IBT – Four barb horses ride out of the north.

1. 1725 BC – We climb a mountain to peek into Persia. No iron in that mountain. Our dude wandering the far east – Wallace (that’s a Scottish name, we need some Irish names), spots a light blue boarder=> Hittites. Go a wake up some unnamed warriors and give them proper Irish names, Seamus, Sean, Liam and Padraic.

Move two workers to start a road to the east.

IBT – The four barbs continue south. The Iroquois complete the Oracle.

2. 1700 BC – Our northerly worker can be hit by the barb horses. Colleen runs to the safety of Entremont on her newly completed road.

Meet Mursalis. He’s annoyed at us. He has five cities including his capitol, 442G, and is up Masonry, Alpha, WC, & Wheel, so no chance for two-fers. He doesn’t have anything hooked up.

MM our settler factory, and bump the lux to 10% to accommodate the growth.

Step into Persian lands to have a peek.

IBT – X-man asks us to leave. Sure thing. :D
The four horsemen set up on the hill west of Entremont. If they pillage, there goes our factory for a while.
Alesia: Warrior=>Barracks
Ludgunum, Verulamium: Warrior=> warrior (for exploring)
The Hittites start the Pyramids.

3. 1675 BC – William (that’s a British name!) climbs a hill and have a peak into Persepolis. No iron yet. Wallace does the same over by the Hittites with the same result.

Dub one of the new warriors McGuire, in honor of the gent who fed me too many beers down in Pensacola. The other is named Brian in honor of my Pop.

IBT – X-man kicks us out.
The four horsemen run across Entremont tiles which cause the factory to break slightly. We get the settler, but not the growth.

4. 1650 BC – Since Sasha is threatened by the barbs, I stop her from working and send her.

See if we can keep the barbs away from our cities. Send Brian right out next to them.

Lux back to 0.

Mursalis, Julie, and Hammy will give us WC for our entire economy. X is a grouch. Let’s wait.

IBT – The barbs just sit on the hill. :hmm:

5. 1625 BC – It doesn’t appear that Persia is going to have iron. Talk about good news.

To be continued….

Sounds good so far. :D

5. 1625 BC – IBT – The four horsemen are on the move again, they move right next to Ludgunum.
Ludgunum: Warrior=>warrior
The Babs start the Pyramids.

6. 1600 BC – Name the new warrior Conor. Now that the four horsemen are on level ground, and they are within range of three warriors, it is time to take them down. Conor takes one out and is wounded. Brian takes out another, is wounded and given veteran status. Seamus is wounded taking out a third. There is one left to cause problems.

Richborough will probably end up with barbs riding through the streets.

IBT – Sure enough, the remaining barb horse rides into Richborough, ravishes one of our fair young maidens and slits her throat. That barb tribe will pay for this atrocity!
Camulodunum: temple=>warrior

7. 1575 BC – McGuire, who is escorting a settler in the east, reports seeing some strange beasts with very long noses and tusks, and a fertile river valley.

Brian begins a trek in search of the murderous barb tribe.
MM Entremont and Ludgunum for the factory. Lux to 10%.

The best deal I can get for WC right now is 114G & 5gpt from both Hammy and Julie. Murasilis is 1G more.


IBT – Entremont: Settler=> settler
Verulanium: warrior=> warrior

8. 1550 BC – Found Gergovia to the east, start a temple to get a cow.

Wallace, moving through Hittite lands, has a purple boarder in sight => Iroquois.

McGuire and his settler find the Hittites just north of the fertile valley.

Lux back to 0. I guess we still have a four-turn factory. It is just jumping between 3.5 and 5.5.

WC can now be had at 132G & 4 gpt.

IBT – Mursalis kicks us out, right next to the Iroquois boarder. Thank you very much.
X-man kicks our dude out too.
Ludgunum: warrior=>warrior
Richborough: warrior=>barracks

Mursalis builds an embassy in our capitol.

9. 1525 BC – McGuire and settler move next to the funny creatures with the tusks.

Wallace greets Hiawatha on our behalf. He is annoyed with us. He has furs hooked up, nine cities including his capitol, 128G, and iron hooked up.

By meeting Hiawatha, the cost for WC has gone down. The Iroquois will sell for 3gpt & 128G, which is the absolute best price of anyone we know. I execute that deal. Change our warrior builds over to archers.

MM the factory.

IBT – The Persians send a settler pair to the west, I imagine to grab those incense tiles to the west.

10. 1500 BC – Found Augustodurum, next to the ivory.

AHH! I spot some iron in a mountain next to Bactra. A Persian worker is working the tile next to it..

Wallace spots a darker blue boarder=> Mayans

After Action Report: I think we will need an archer rush to grab the iron at Bactra. Keep exploring. Despite being down in science we’re in really good shape. The AI haven’t researched anything new, the high cost is slowing them down also. I have a feeling that goody huts helped them out early, plus they trade with each other so nicely.

Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Gram1,_1500_BC.SAV

Here's a screenshot of our world, the iron is circled:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Gram1_-_west.jpg

And here is what Wallace has discovered:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/gram1_-_east.jpg

Some thoughts:
Looking at the minimap, I'm thinking the other civs are on a seperate continent to the west. I'd send Wallace west to make sure there is no land bridge up north. I doubt there is any one SE of Babylon.
When we have 6 archers, 9 if they are regular, attack
Bactra. It would be good if we can start their GA before we get peace, but don't wait.
We may want to drop a settler in the middle of the desert ENE of Augustodurum. We may get lucky and grab some saltpeter. Forget this. :crazyeyes: We will not get that far.
Wheel should be our next tech to purchase to find the horses. After that we need Alphabet to get to Math.

Nice work Bugsy - I got it, will start tonight.

Looks like I'm in Archer building mode. Agree about taking Bactra (maybe Arbela too). Not sure Persia will have many Immortals by the time we get there. The AI seems to use only 1 worker per task and it takes a long time to road a mountain.

Nice job Bugs. :clap:

I think you will be able to prevent Persia from ever building an Immortal. No immortals, no combat GA. We will be able to build some GS and get ours going.

I would like to know if there is anyone east of Rome and west of the Hittites. Just keep exploring.

Edit - what tech do we need for a Curraugh? A curraugh would be nice for some exploring.

Alphabet is needed for curraghs.


Are we gonna build archers and then warriors for GS upgrading?

I agree with Tex. The wheel should be our next tech purchase. We need to find those horses, although with a fast moving UU, we don't need to build horsemen. It is more of a resource denial move.

nice set bugs :thumbsup:

horses are a little cheaper than our UU but are also a cheap upgrade from chariots (10*3=30g each) so no harm getting it. plus, we can use them to assist our fast moving swords, doing the easy stuff like cutting down archers and exposed swordsman/horsemen.

we are extending out to the west nicely but we could help ourselves by getting those dyes to the NW hooked up. we'll claim the land from barb huts and get a lux for our troubles. imho, not a bad deal.

good luck denyd :)

If I'm right claiming dyes would give us three luxuries (ivory & incense already).

I was thinking, instead of The Wheel, how about Alphabet (either by trade or research) and Mathematics to allow for Statue of Zeus. We've got the ivory already and Ancient Cavalry with Gallic Swordsmen would be an overpowering combination in this variant. A well timed pre-build (make sure the city has a barracks) and were all set.

SoZ is nice but will only give us a unit every 20T so, imho, don't invest in it unless we got a city with nothing else to do.

I forgot you mod'd from every 5 to every 20, SoZ not as valuable as I thought.

Back to stringing bows and looking for arrow feathers.

We'll have to get the ivory hooked up. I was trying to get something out towards the iron in the far east, but now that we have some a lot closer :satan: we can go for the dyes.

ok denyd, good luck :)

roster update:

bugs <- just played
denyd <- Up
ankka <- On deck
6thGenTexan
mitsho
grahamiam

Got busy launching the Hittite spaceship - I'll play & post tomorrow (Saturday)

THE SAVE (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Gram1,_1275_BC.SAV)

Turn 0 – 1500 BC – Switch Verulamium build to temple to hurry culture expansion for the ivory – Switch Lugdunum & Camulodunum to barracks to we produce vet archers

IBT: McGuire (1/3) survives BH attack – BH shows up NW of Camu…

Turn 1 – 1475 BC – Brian goes hunting that BV – Kevin (Warrior) E through Babylonian lands – Wallace E to Hittite borders – Kevin (Warrior) heads back to V-town to MP – William hunting Barbs – Dennis & workers move to connect August… - Miles (Warrior) to hill – Liam spots a BV and moves for it – Settler heading to city spot – Nobody willing to trade the wheel (start researching it 30% due in 20) - Lux to 10% to support growth

IBT: McGuire (3/3) defends against BH – Entremont settler->settler

Turn 2 – 1450 BC – New Settler heads for dyes – Kevin N into Persian lands sees a spear in Bactra – EMC (Enya, Maureen & Colleen build a road – Connor moves to defend new city – Miles N to explore – Old Settler E – Liam to BV – Kevin moving E spots Babylon – William W spots nothing new – Brian W next to BV & BH – Wallace E spots silks in Hittite land

IBT: X-man complains about Kevin

Turn 3 – 1425 BC – Wallace E meets a Roman Archer – Miles NW – Sasha moves to connect Ivory – EMC moves to connect A-town – William NW spots nothing new – Liam (4/4) kills BW and promotes, but there’s still a BH in BV – Brian (3/4) kills a BW but there’s a BH in BV – Kevin NE to Puhar (probably gets kicked out next turn) – Lux back to 0%

IBT: Kevin kicked out of Hammi’s lands

Turn 4 – 1400 BC – Wallace W meets a Mayan & Greek warrior – nobody wants to trade – Miles NW spots BV next to spices – EMC connects A-town – Settler founds Agedincum starts temple – Kevin MP in V-town – Conor moves to Entremont – Sean moves to C-town – Settler & Padriac leave C-town – Mouse slip ends turn early

IBT: William spots Persian settler/spear – Wallace watches warriors split

Turn 5 - 1375 BC – Wallace NW to some plains – EMC moves to connect Ivory – Sasha moves to connect to Hittites for luxury trading – Sean in C-town – Conor MP in E-town – Padriac & Settler N – Brian kills a BH and there’s at least 1 more – William N – Miles to BV – Liam kills BH & BV (+25g) – Kevin NE spots Akkad – Connor moves to Aged-town to MP – New contacts allow slider of 3-7-0 to get The Wheel in 6 turns

IBT: Connor spots a Babylon spear/settler pair go NE – New Roman city has claimed the eastern iron Miles (3/3) defends against BH (still a BW there) – Entremont settler->warrior – V-town temple->barracks

Turn 6 – 1350 BC – EMC connect Ivory – Miles kills BW & BV (+25g) – New settler sent N – Sean MP in C-town – Padriac & Settler NW – Brian (1/4) kills BW & BV – William N – Kevin E into Babylon lands – Connor to Aged-town for MP – Liam N – Wallace E spots green border & tobacco – Switch slider to get The Wheel in 4 (barb gold allows deficit spending) – Not much trading available

IBT: Hammi complains about Kevin – BH kills Brian

Turn 8 – 1325 BC – Padriac & Settler NW – New settler NW – Connor MP in Aged-town – EMC move to connect 2nd ivory – Liam NW – Miles N – William NE – Kevin SE out of Babylon lands – Wallace E sees lots of grasslands

IBT: X-man demands 23g and I give in (not ready to fight him yet) - Entremont warrior->settler – Alesia barracks->archer – Mayan’s build the Pyramids

Turn 9 – 1300 BC – EMC connects 2nd Ivory – Liam N – Kevin E – Miles N – Pete (new warrior) N chasing settler – William NE – Wallace E – Padriac & settler to coast

IBT: Padriac (1/3) defends against attacking horse – L-town barracks->archer – C-town barracks->archer

Turn 10 – 1275 BC – Settler founds Eboracum starts worker – Padriac MP in E-town – EMC moves to connect Aged-town – Liam N spots another iron – Miles NE spots silks – Pete to C-town – Sean leaves to chase settler – Kevin NE – Wallace NE – Lots of people will trade us The Wheel now (it’s due next turn :D ) – Not much to say – with the new barracks lots of Vet archers are in our future (and Persia’s) – the NW settler is scheduled for one of the dyes – have Sasha connect to the Hittites and maybe we’ll be able to trade some extra luxuries (we’ve got extra incense & ivory if we get the settlers to claim it) – the next settler should head E trying to grab land before Rome, Babylon or Hittites get there first – try to set up worker teams of 3 to get stuff done faster – we should probably try to slip in a worker every now and then in each city builds – with the 3rd luxury on line we shouldn’t need any luxury tax for quite a while.

Nice job, denyd. :goodjob:


I will most likely be playing tomorrow, other SG and RL today.

nice set denyd, any chance for a screenshot? :) Ok Ankka, looks like your the setup man for 6gntxn, good luck :thumbsup: keep an eye out for tech trades. it would be nice to get math 1st and leverage that into something.

roster update:

bugs
denyd <- Just Played
ankka <- UP
6thGenTexan <- on deck
mitsho
grahamiam

Okay... so archers a lot to get the Iron away from Persia? And tech trades.

Any hints or tips before I start tomorrow?

Keep exploring.

Denyd - good job finding the Greeks and Mayans.

Ankka - figure you'll need two archers for every defender and figure you'll see three defenders. There will be two there and they'll rush one as soon as you declare and move next to the city. Then stand by for some counterattacks from some archers.

So I should build the archers so Texan gets the fun? Suits me, I've always actually disliked ancient warfare. :ninja:

Gather the archers on the mountain next to Gerovia as they are built. I will be attacking the city from the hill. I would also see is you can have one or 2 spears (horse/chariot will work) ready to disconnect the road from Bactra to Arbela. If the iron is not connected yet, I can kill the worker on the mountain. If not, I will need to disconnect it from the rest of Persia.

See if we can buy Alphabet before the wheel arrives. I'd try to use the wheel in a trade for Writing. Save me enough cash or establish an embassy with Babylon. They can help put the squeeze on Persia.

Pretty much everyone already has the Wheel - we're at the bottom of the heap in tech (not that is matters very much this game) - we should probably go for Iron Working next and try to conquer the world before pike show up

Pretty much everyone already has the Wheel - we're at the bottom of the heap in tech (not that is matters very much this game) - we should probably go for Iron Working next and try to conquer the world before pike show up
we got IW buddy ;) i did a twofer (IW and Myst) during my turns. and yes, everybody already has those :) imho, alpha and math are the way to go. if we get alpha and no one has writing yet, well, maybe that changes things but for now, our best bet is probably math. we need to know how count all those pretty cities anyways :)

:blush: I'm thinking if we know Iron Working, why are we messing around with archers, then I my brain turns back on and I realize we don't have any sources of iron (yet)

Looks like we in the build archers and settlers mode, we should be able to hit Persia for 3-4 cities (razing most) and then try for a quick peace (getting a tech). Then hook up the iron and see how these Gallic Swordsmen do.

Sounds good, I'll try and play today evening after SGOTM2.

Actually, we need to figure out the ballistics of rocks as they are tossed from a catapult. :D

is there any chance to pinch the iron with a settler?

It would probably cause an immediate war with Persia. The iron in adjacent to a Persia city and we'd be stealing a primary tile, an offense X-Man would not tolerate if he didn't have to (and he doesn't).

I don't think we could poach it with a settler. Slings and arrows are the only way.

ok, just thought that maybe a town on both sides of the mountain would do the trick. probably just as easy to take it from him with an archer rush. just hope they accept peace after losing a city or 2.

Technically you could poach it if you built a cultural building in the city (only 1 required), but it would be a culture push.

Well, I played the turns.


1275BC [Preturn]: Check to see where we are going... reset personal prefs.

No one is willing to trade us the Alphabet, sorry Texan. And we will be getting the wheel in 1.

What has been done, most of the guys are annoyed at us. :hmm:

One thing I notice is that we lack workers badly. only 3 and a slave? Not nearly enough.

Do some MMing, then press enter.

IBT: We research the Wheel, start horseback on 50%, due in 11 @ -2gpt.

1255BC [1]: Some exploring, and MM Entremont to build the settler in 2 and also grow then.

IBT: Mayans build the Colossus in Palenque.

Many start ToA.

1225BC [2]: Some barbs appear on the way the settler was going, settling is delayed because the settler waits for the warrior to catch up.

Able to rise sci to 60%, 0gpt, Horseback in 7.

IBT: Persian spear-settler pair in theSWarea is spotted, but the area is useless wastelend without water.

Entremont settler > settler.

1200BC [3]: The barbs block the settler-warrior pair, warrior fortifies for combat.

I'm sending the new settler to the ther side of the gulf, it's actually near Entremont and good land + a luxury.

IBT: Camuloduum archer > archer.

1175BC [4]: New archer ius sent to disperse the barbs in the NW.

IBT: Lugdunum archer > archer.

1150BC [5]: Warrior attacks barb warrior in jungle, but loses without doing any damage. :(

IBT: Lookslike Rome and Babylon are at war. Romans have legions.

Our archer in the NW kills 2 barb horses without a scrath and promotes to elite. :D

Alesia archer > worker. We need these big time.

1125BC [6]: Defeat a barb warrior with the archer.

IBT: Some more battles between Rome and Babylon. a nice view our warrior caught there.

Entremont settler > settler.
Verulamium rax > worker.

1100BC [7]: The new settler also heads for the other side of the gulfand the nice lands there.

IBT: A Babylonian bowman wins a battle...

Camulodunum archer > archer.

Hiawatha builds an embassy in our capitol.

1075BC [8]: Still no way of getting Alphabet. :(

Build Burdigala > warrior.

IBT: Rome demands 21 gold. I pay. Looks like he is kind of smashing the Babylonians. Our possible ally has got hard times...

We research HBR, start Alphabet on 40% sci to get some income, this is currently +9 gpt.

Lugdunum archer > archer.

1050BC [9]: Disperse a barb campment in the NW, get 25 gold.

IBT: Some Rome vs Babylon battles.

Alesia worker > archer.
Richborough rax > archer.
Verulamium worker > archer.
Eboracum worker > temple.

1025BC [10]: Build Cataractonium > warrior.

To next better player. :)

Nice work Ankka - Lets hope the AI beat each other silly while we get iron and beat up Persia.

The Romans were a little on the upper hand, thats what feeling I got, but the battles were really only one vs one, no big combats. Romans had the Legions, which were far superior to bowmen, though... we'll have to also face them sometime. Difficult, the extra defence makes them hard battlers.

ok ankka, nice set. what's the size of our military atm?

roster update:

bugs
denyd
ankka <- Just Played
6thGenTexan <- UP
mitsho <- on deck
grahamiam

I've got it. I'll put our workers to work and remove the iron from Persia.

We have 3 or 4 more workers, IIRC 5 archers, 15 or so warriors.

I wonder if that will be enough archers. How far have the Persians gotten in hooking up their iron? If they are hooking it up, we'll need to start a war, to keep it from happening.

Camulodunum and Lugdunum can make 1 every 4T (ie, 5spt). if we can get our other 2(?) barracks towns up to that or 7spt (archer every 3T) we'll be in good shape to take on Persia in the middle of 6gntxn's turns.

we could use a spear or 2 as well to cover the archers. just a thought, but imho, some prebuilds could start for the UU before the 1st turn of the war so that as soon as the city is captured, we can begin pumping out Gallic swordsman.

Good idea with the pre-builds. I'm sure Tex won't have a problem.

I'll probably play tomorrow not tonight.
Pre-building for the UU never crossed my mind. With 15 warriors, what is the upgrade cost vs. gold on hand? Another question is do we want to settle all of our area before our GA to make better use of it? If so, I can take the iron now with archers/spears/warriors and in 20 turns run over Persia with our Gallic Swordmen.

upgrade cost calc is the delta shields x 3 for C3C so it will be (40-10)x3=90g each. you may have a point regarding holding off on the GA. imho, your plan (take iron and hold of on GA till bigger) is probably the best in the long run, but i'm not sure if it will be possible if persia comes at us with immortals and all we have are archers and spears.

but i'm not sure if it will be possible if persia comes at us with immortals and all we have are archers and spears.

This would be a very bad situation. :cry: :cry:

Can you say "Deep Kimshi"?

Stating Status:
Everyone is up Alphabet, Masonry & Polytheism
Alpha in 5 @-7GPT
Cities:
Entremont set to for settler next turn, grow in 2 to save shields.
Richborough clown becomes a taxman and citiy works on a spear.
Berdigala switches to Temple. Barb killing archer will be the MP.
Cataractonium starts a temple. It has a warrior already.
Agedincum and Augustodurum are completely currupt.

1000BC-1 Entremont settler-->settler move people

975BC-2 Camulodunum archer-->worker Gergovia temple-->worker See first immortal (reg). :eek: Verulamium switched to spear.

950BC-3 Lugdunum archer-->archer Persians start ToA. Lugdunum is hit by the Black Death and looses a pop point!!!! :aargh:

925BC-4 Hittites and Rome form an alliance against the Mayans. Camulodunum worker-->worker Persian imortal, archer, warrior headed to the Babylonians.

900BC-5 Hittites bring in the Greeks versus the Mayans. Mursilis then asks us to help out too. He will pay with Masonry and RoP. I cannot turn it down. I'm about to found a city near him that will poach some iron and we can use the free tech. Entremont settler-->settler Verulamium spear-->spear. Wallace is threatened by 2 jav throwers. He runs for now. Alphabet arrives and everyone knows Writing, and Math. 70% is break even for 12 turns to math.

875BC-6 Camulodunum wrker-->archer The Plague has spread to Camulodunum loosing a pop and Burdigali!!! :confused: I did not send any one from Lugdunum that direction. William runs to Greek land hoping the Hoplites can protect him.

850BC-7 Alesia archer-->archer Gergovia worker-->barrack The Plague has ended. Lapurdum founded in an ugly spot but we have iron in our borders.....only a long way to connect.

825BC-8 Horses connected. Hammurabi gets 20g to be taken back later. Lugdunum archer-->archer Ratae Coritanorum founded 3 from Entremont and Alesia and starts a worker.

800BC-9 nothing happened

775BC-10 Tolosa founded on western point. I start it on a Curragh. Rush temple in Cataractonium because it will need a specialist. Requires a taxman this turn until temple opens to the public. Temple also rushed in Eboracum.

Archer and spear set to move to cut of iron and seven archers stand ready to move on Bactra. Movement available if you want to attack now or wait a turn or two more. There is a settler pair east of Alesia and tow more norht of Agedincum in the fog. The immortal is somewhere south of Agedincum. The next spear from Verulamium may need to go here.
I want Wallace to pillage a square to make sure Mursilis gets his value from our alliance.
Math in 6 at +3 with 12 in the bank.
Settler N of entremont is heading 2 more north on coastal forest. Next settler can go west 4-5 to the coastal desert square. There is room for one more fishing village in the NW.

Here's the game...

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/gram1_775BC.SAV

nice set tex :thumbsup: imho, you made the right choice to go for the tech and getting us into a war.

looks like i was a little too optimistic regarding the readiness of our troops. one question: if we're going to hook up iron to the west, does it make sense to attack persia with archers and spears or are we better off waiting for a handful of gallic swords? we could use the GA to push persia off the map and establish our hold on the choke. not a bad way to use a GA in a game where we'll be forced to live as a despot for most of the time.

roster update:

bugs
denyd
ankka
6thGenTexan <- Just Played
mitsho <- UP
grahamiam <- on deck

Nice job, Texan. :goodjob:


Too bad we got hit by the Plague.

Glad you took those techs for the alliance Tex. Given the cost of these things, we should take one every chance we get.

So X-man has immortals already. :hmm: stand by for heavy rolls when we go to war. We should have some GS pre-builds going to we can have some fast movers ready to go when the immortals come knocking on our gates.

looks like i was a little too optimistic regarding the readiness of our troops. one question: if we're going to hook up iron to the west, does it make sense to attack persia with archers and spears or are we better off waiting for a handful of gallic swords? we could use the GA to push persia off the map and establish our hold on the choke. not a bad way to use a GA in a game where we'll be forced to live as a despot for most of the time.


But we are already at war with them, or are we? And it will be faster by capturing the city, it is already connected to our network, or can be in 1 turn instead of ten's of turns of waiting when the road would be built through jungle.

To answer g-man's question, I think if we have some warriors ready for upgrade and some pre-builds going, plus some workers standing by to connect the iron, we'll fair nicely against the immortals. The two-movement of the GS is very nice. We'll be able to have a nice skirmishing demonstration that scout can read about some day. :D

Nice set 6GenTex :thumbsup:

I'm thinking along the lines of Ankka & SirBugsy, take Bactra, upgrade 6-8 warriors and start in on Persia. As gold becomes available upgrade more warriors to GS and add them to new builds to take out X-Man. I think he is the #1 threat to victory in this game (Rome #2).

But we are already at war with them, or are we? And it will be faster by capturing the city, it is already connected to our network, or can be in 1 turn instead of ten's of turns of waiting when the road would be built through jungle.
we are at war with the Maya but preparing for Persia, who seems to be busy attacking someone else atm. therefore, i was thinking that maybe we had the time to get iron connected rather than rushing into war. imho, the gallic sword is much more deadly than an immortal due to the extra movement point but, unfortunately, are 25% more costly so they come to the field slowly.

How much gold do we have on hand at the moment? GS are going to be expensive to upgrade. A GS costs 40 shields in C3C, a warrior 10. So that's a 30 shield difference => 90G (Edit: g-man already figured that out :blush: ) Do we 540G (6 warriors) lying around?

Last time I looked, our treasury was under 50 (so no upgrades)

With the exception of Mathematics (for catapults) is the any reason to be researching ourselves. Wouldn't pointy stick science serve us much better at this point.

I propose we turn off science and use the gold to upgrade warriors and use the Gallic Swords to do our research for us.

Settlers would be perhaps one of the best prebuilds for the GS. Have some ready, blitz Bactra, get Iron, build GS, have a few in place in 1 or 2 turns from the beginning of the war. Or then we could use something like a Granary, so we wouldn't need to wait so long. Something more expensive than the GS would do good. Well- timed this manouver would be deadly.

If it works, that is. ;)

I will be away from the 17th to the 27th of June 2004. Skip me if needed.

Oh hi, When I don't write, it doesn't mean that I am away, so you don't have to pm me, grahamian, but thanks. :)
But I got another problem. I never bought Civ3. I lent it and installed C3:C over it. This way I saved money for me. But the problem is that I had to completely clear my computer some days ago and I can't get Civ3 now (because the library is unable, etc etc).
Therefore I fear I have to buy it, and I don't think I can do this in a good time. So perhaps it is the best to drop me out of this sg although I hate it :(.

mfG mitsho

Too bad. :(


And there's a reason to buy the games instead of borrowing. :p

Therefore I fear I have to buy it, and I don't think I can do this in a good time. So perhaps it is the best to drop me out of this sg although I hate it :(.
mfG mitsho
ok mitsho, thanks for letting us know. check back in once you buy it and i'll slot you back in ;) we'll keep the spot warm for you :)

guess that means i'm up again. i'll play and post tonight.

roster update:

bugs <- on deck
denyd
ankka
6thGenTexan <- Just Played
mitsho <- :( out till further notice
grahamiam <- UP

I'll get it perhaps that weekend (or 3-4 days later) We'll see.

mfG mitsho

A lot of talk happens when you miss a day online. We are NOT at war with Persia now. We ARE ready to take their iron in 2 turns: 1) declare & move into position 2) take town and disconnect from Persia.

It will be a long time before we connect our other iron, jungle and mountains.

We can take the iron and hold our own until we can get peace. Wait 20, then destroy.

A lot of talk happens when you miss a day online. We are NOT at war with Persia now. We ARE ready to take their iron in 2 turns: 1) declare & move into position 2) take town and disconnect from Persia.

It will be a long time before we connect our other iron, jungle and mountains.

We can take the iron and hold our own until we can get peace. Wait 20, then destroy.
thanks, but it was quite clear to everyone that we are not at war with Persia yet. we straightened out Ankka earlier ;)

in regards to the war that will be started, you noted a Persian immortal already so I think its going to be a little delicate. I'll try to hold off on using GS's but no promises. If we had horseman, then I would promise :)

What are we looking to do with our GA that we would like to hold off on it right now? Using it to wipe out the Persians is not too bad for this varient.

first, the 570BC save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/gram1_570BC.SAV)

Preflight check: See the Persian settler W of Alesia. Move the elite archer (barbkilla) out of Burdigala. I don’t think we need him performing MP duties atm ;) Fortify group of 7 archers and the spearman/archer pair. I want the spearman from Verulamium to help here so I must wait another 2 turns. Sugar near Richborough is irrigated but should be mined (no food bonus in despot so it works like a BG). Looks like there are some workers in town so I click on them to make sure they stick around to do the work

Look at the towns to see what can be done to speed up unit builds. MM Alesia onto a river plain to shave 1T off archer build. MM Camulodunum off fish and onto forrest to cut archer build in half (6 to 3) with growth still in 1T. Can MM Lug but it causes us to lose 1T of research.

IBT: Persian spear/settler pare W of Alesia head back; New Persian warrior/settler pair end up on iron mountain.

Verul: spear -> spear; Ebor temple -> barracks; Augustodurum temple -> worker; Cataractonium temple -> barracks

T1: 750BC William moves into Mayan territory. We now make -2gpt (Math in 5T); Move William from desert spot to see if I can yo-yo the Persian spear/settler pair

IBT: 4 Mayan javalen throwers move next to William; spear/settler pair does not yo-yo

T2: 730BC William is dead meat so I fulfill our deal with the Hittites by pillaging the road he’s on. 3 archer builds due in 1T so I declare on the Persians. Move stack of 7 archers and 1 spear N of Bactra and archer/spear pair onto iron mountain.

IBT: no nasties show up, see some Roman fights, William is now deceased (RIP)
Alesia archer -> archer; Lug riots (damn); Camulodunum archer -> archer

T3: 710BC Attack on Bactra: (all vet archers): archer kills spear, dies to spear (2/3), archer kills reg immortal; archer kills spear, goes elite, and we take the city. Spear and archer fortify on mountain.
Found Lindum -> temple

IBT: we are booted from Iroquios territory; single Immortal coming N towards Alesia from the SW; Lug archer -> horseman; Resistance in Bactra ends; Maya building Hanging Gardens and they are a Monarchy

T4: 690BC Tax-starve Bactra so we make some money. Move 2 more archers onto iron mountain. Move worker to connect Bactra to empire and move archer in to protect him.

IBT: Single immortal continues N; a spear shows up S of the horses, a single immortal shows up 2T SW of iron mountain; Entremont settler -> settler; Agedincum temple -> spear

T5: 670BC Lone spear moves out of Richborough to protect the horse since archer can’t get there this turn. An elite and vet archer arrive in Alesia to deal with the immortal; settler goes to fishing village location in the NW. Move a couple more archers, including an elite, onto iron mountain. Math due in 1T so MM slider to gain an extra 1g.

IBT: Persia and Iro sign vs Rome; reg immortal impales himself on our iron mountain spear, an immortal and warrior show up 2T S of iron mountain; Rome boots our warrior
Math -> writing @ 0% +25gpt; Babylon building the Great Lighthouse

T6: 650BC Spear back into Richborough to protect against spear; Archer moves to protect horse; warrior near Alesia moves out of the way of the approaching immortal

IBT: iron spear defends against another immortal; watch Persian archer die near Agedincum (lucky because we only have a warrior there.; Immortal approaches iron mountain from the S (warrior goes somewhere else)
Lapurdum warrior -> temple

T7: 630BC Barbkilla needs to be renamed immortakilla as he takes down the one near Alesia without a scratch. I want to attack with the elite archer on Iron mountain but if he wins he’ll be exposed so I hold off. Persia still doesn’t want to talk

IBT: Hittites and Rome sign MA vs. Greece and Persia; Iron spear finally dies; Immortal approaching Gergovia; iron connected to the empire; Maya building GLight
Camulodunum archer -> GS; Verulamium spear -> spear; Ratae worker -> temple

Gov’t Notes: Rome is now a republic, Maya are Monarchy, Hittites and Iroquois are in Anarchy

T8: 610BC Elite archer on Iron Mountain kills an immortal but does not generate an MGL.

Talk Persia into Peace giving him 5gpt for writing. Also trade ivory, dyes, 5gpt, and 74g for Poly. A couple of civ’s have construction and Republic. All of them have philosophy, MM, CoL. Maya have Monarchy.
Change Lug to a GS

IBT: Iro and Maya sign vs Greece

T9: 590BC Moving Archers out to the East as things are getting sticky out there.

IBT: Persians move very strongly into our territory with 2 immortals, 1 warrior, and 1 archer near Bactra, 1 immortal near Gergovia, 1 spear near a worker S of Vera, and 1 archer SW of Agedincum :( Damn, I thought the 10gpt would satisfy them. I pray that they are just taking a direct route to the Hittites.
Entremont settler -> settler; Alesia archer -> archer

T10: 570BC See the 1st Persian horseman. Move some units around to ensure we are strong enough against this incursion. Have 1 spear, 2 archers and 1 warrior in Bactra, 1 archer, 1 spear and 1 warrior in Gergovia. This should be strong enough but you never know. Also, a few more archers are rotating E from the core to help out. 1st GS due in 1T so all is not lost :) MM Entremont and Ratae between the cow since Entremont got 4 extra food with the last settler and only needs 3fpt to grow in 2T.

Notes: Lug can make a GS every 7T, Camulodunum every 8T. Entremont has the most potential so maybe we should turn off the pump and build a barracks there to start pumping them out. Could do 1 every 5T at size 5 but would need the 2 river plains to the NW irrigated to do so. Probably could do 1 every 4T at size 6 but I’m not sure if there’s enough food.
Settler is in place to build a city in the NW and 2nd settler can go to the desert tile 3T NW of Ratae.

re: research... imho, I think we should save our money to buy Monarchy next. All other usefull techs take forever to research.

I'll pick up the game in the AM.

So do we want to save for Monarchy? It is going to be expensive.

Looks like we've met all civs now. Probably need to kepp exploring a little for the map benefits.

What is our medium range plan (30-50 turns)? Sounds like it is:

1. Build GS,
2. Go to war in 20 or when we are a Monarchy whichever comes last.
3. Wipe out Persia

Well executed war G-man! Set our goals, met our goals, executed an very good exit strategy. I wish you worked for the Pentagon.

we should be able to gather 300+g in 20 turns so maybe we can afford to buy monarchy with some gpt thrown in. we'd only have to buy 1 tech to get it. if we want republic, that's 3 techs.

my biggest fear is that the Persians are indeed on a sneak attack vector. of course, this will give us 10gpt more but still, i'd rather they didn't right now. 20T of building GS's is what we need atm before we take on the Persians again. they don't have iron atm so they can't build immortals. i was really hoping for a MGL during my turns as I think a GS army would be virtually unstopable.

roster update:

bugs <- UP
denyd <- on deck
ankka
6thGenTexan
mitsho <- out till further notice
grahamiam <- Just Played

I think a sneak attack could ruin my whole day.

Ideas for a sneak attack: Pulling the Babylonians in wouldn't help much since they have a very narrow front. Whipping GSs out would be prudent, but may be an extremis move. Looks like we still have most of our military near the potential front. I'll just keep my fingers crossed... all 10, plus some toes, then a sacrifice to the RNG god, we're still pagans right? Mishto! Oh, Mishto

one other note, the area around camul. really should be improved. right now it's doing ok but with a couple of mines it could become a city to rely on. those workers in the NW should come down and help out once thier done with that BG.

@sir bugsy, what do you mean with your last sentence? Could you explain it to me :)

mfG mitsho

I was joking that we would make a human sacrifice to the RNG gods, because we are pagan. Plus I spelled your name wrong. Oh, never mind, I'll just hide in the corner. :blush:

I've been trying to get the save, but the uploads server is acting up.

sorry, i'm at work and i don't have a copy of the save. not much i can do for another 6 hrs.

Thoughts on the short term goals.

We need to be a Monarchy before starting our GA.
It looks like the increased costs have not slowed down the AI at all. When we do take on Persia, get peace when they are down to one city for all the techs we can. We can repeat with the Babylonians next.
It is a good thing we have a UU that will be good until Knights arrive.
We may want Entremont to build us some workers that are seriously lacking, or use the ones we have to develop our barrack towns. (Mines near Camulodunum,Lugdumun & Verulamium)
We need to identify what buildings our towns need. I'm thinking temple/barracks with granaries only in our fresh water locations. When CoL arrives, we can add a few courthouses where they will help the most in producing GS's.
Take over the world!

6gntxn

Thoughts on the short term goals.

We need to be a Monarchy before starting our GA.
It looks like the increased costs have not slowed down the AI at all. When we do take on Persia, get peace when they are down to one city for all the techs we can. We can repeat with the Babylonians next.
It is a good thing we have a UU that will be good until Knights arrive.
We may want Entremont to build us some workers that are seriously lacking, or use the ones we have to develop our barrack towns. (Mines near Camulodunum,Lugdumun & Verulamium)
We need to identify what buildings our towns need. I'm thinking temple/barracks with granaries only in our fresh water locations. When CoL arrives, we can add a few courthouses where they will help the most in producing GS's.
Take over the world!
6gntxn
Agree with most of that though I think Entremont, after a couple of workers, should get a barracks and then start pumping out GS's. it's by far our best town. we will have 4 lux's hooked up shortly so I think we can let her get pretty big, really pumping up the shield output.

As far as tech speed goes, all things considers (pangea, demigod, AA golden ages), the tech pace is slower than normal. Usually in DG games, i'm in the MA by now, well into the 1st tier and even on the 2nd if the AI's doing a good job. one thing that is interesting for the next player is all the gold laying around. looks like pretty much everyone is in thier GA right now so they will have lots of money for our lux if we can hook them up.

They don't look like pedestrians to me... Rock on!

I have one turn left, to be completed in the AM. Let's play TedJackson's game again. Can you guess what happened:

A. Persia sneak attacked us.
B. Rome sneak attacked us.
C. Iroquois declared war on us and then chickened out.
D. We are a Monarchy
E. We are a bunch of boring, :beer: drinking Celts who can't buy a tech to save their life.
F. The Mayas sacked Augustodurum.

Ever the optimist - D & E

a, b, c, and d for me :)

c-f, or can I chose only one?
then of course d :)

mfG mitsho

You can chose as many as you want. The correct answers are C and E.

Pre-flight – 570 BC – There are four Persians outside of Bactra and four defenders. Hope it stands. Can’t get a fifth defender in there in time.

Four turns left on our MA with the Hittites.

Change Entremont to a barracks (8), Alesia to a GS (14),

Caesar has two workers for sale, but he wants just about our entire economy for one.

The Mayas will give us peace, but nothing else.

The Persians are at war with the Hittites, let’s hope that’s where X-man’s troops are headed.

IBT – No attack. But three more units waltz into our lands.
Lugdunum: GS=>GS
Augusto: worker=>worker
Babylonians start on Great Wall.

1. 550 BC – I think this is Sirian’s Diety ROP™ in progress. I’m going set up some blocks to keep the Persians mostly out of our lands.

Check G-man’s write up to see where he was intending the 2nd settler to go. 3T NW of Ratae.

Found Nemausus in far Northwest. Start a temple to pull in the whale.

IBT – Iroquois and Hittites sign an MA against Persia.
The block has the desired affect of pulling most Persians out of our lands.
The Mayans pull the Iroquois into the war against us. :rolleyes:

2. 530 BC – The good news is that the Mayans are still talking to us and are willing to betray their Iroquois brothers right now. We still have two turns left on our MA with the Hittites so, we’ll allow the MA to expire and then allow Smoke to betray his friends.

Start moving some archers to the northeast. I’m going to hold the GS back so that we don’t spark a GA. This could be :smoke:


We now have spices hooked up to most of our kingdom.

After studying the situation. I think I’m going to gather our archers for a rush on Centralia. Maybe I can bring Hiawatha to his senses. Move to the mountain next to Centralia.

IBT – An Iroquois sword kills our warrior.
The Hitties and Romans sign an MA against the Iroquois. Is there no honor amoungst these civs?
Verul: spear=>GS

3. 510 BC – Found Curovernum. Start temple.

One nice thing about this game. Not a lot changes on the diplomatic front, except for wars.

Make a Lindum lady, a tax lady.

Persia no longer has iron, but did they crank out the Immortals while they had it. I see five immortals right now. Maybe they can get killed up in Iroquois or Hittite land.

Check in with Smoke. He’ll still give us peace. In fact, he’ll pay us 20G for it. Next turn dude.

IBT – Richborough: temple=>GS
Burdgalia: temple=>catapult

4. 490 BC – I try to get Smoke to sell us Monarchy in the peace treaty, but no dice. So I take the 20G and run away with my treaty.

The word hasn’t gotten to the Iroquois yet, since they won’t acknowledge our envoy.

The Mayas still have a monopoly on Monarchy.

MM our cites. Lugdunum now produces 8 uspt or a GS every 5 turns.

5. 470 BC – Working and marching.

IBT – Camulo: GS=>GS
Tolosa: curraugh=>curraugh

6. 450 BC – Start our great voyage in the curraugh by sailing due west.

Kevin climbs the heights next to Veii to look down on the city.

Hiawatha still won’t talk to us. Smoke is still insulted with our entire treasury (195G) and our economy(27gpt) for Monarchy.

IBT – Two Hittite archers get whacked. The Persians attack the Hittite city across a river a lose. The Hittites and Mayas sign a peace treaty.
Watch a legion kill a Bowman.
Barb galleys can sail on sea tiles :eek:
Entremont: Rax=>GS(5)
Lugdunum: GS=>GS(5)

7. 430 BC – In a move of self preservation our curraugh sails along the northern coast.
Kevin steps further into Roman lands.

IBT – The Persians and Hittites kill each other.
Kevin is killed out of Roman lands.
The Romans and Babylonians kill each other.

8. 410 BC – I have most of my Centralia assault team together.

Hiawatha still isn’t speaking to us. Smoke is still insulted.
Mursilis has two workers for sale.

I’m using the GS for MP duty right now. At least they’re working.

We’ll probably lose our curraugh next turn.

IBT – A single Iroquois sword heads south out of Centralia.
The Persians capture the Hittite city of Hattusha. Watch a bunch of battles. The Babs get stomped. Our curraugh is sunk by the barbs.
The Hittites start the GL.

9. 390 BC – Start maneuvering towards the Iro sword. If he steps off the mountain next to our stack of archers, he’s toast.

IBT – The Iro sword runs away.
A lot of orange moving northward.
Smoke Jaguar demands 32G. :cringe: That’s more than a single year’s income!
“Write his name down in my book.”
“Did you write it down?”
“I did”
“Now cross it off. :gripe: [pissed] “

The Maya start the Mausoleum.

10. 370 BC – Maneuvering. Move our stack of 8 archers lead by Barbkilla up to the Iroquois frontier. Hiawatha will now talk to us. He’ll pay us 200G for peace. OK if you insist. Take the money and run.

Smoke is still insulted by our 473G and 30gpt off for Monarchy.

We now have two sources of iron.

I’m gonna play 11 turns to put us at 350 BC.

IBT – The Persians are suddenly headed east.
Alesia: GS=>GS
Augusto:worker=>worker
Cataract: rax=>GS
The plague hits Ratae.

11. 350 BC – Move our MP out of the plague city. I think he can die.
Start pulling the troops back from the Iroquois campaign . They’ll be needed for the Second Persian War.


All our cash and income is now making Smoke doubtful. So this is good news.

After Action: If we could actually get Monarchy, we could probably get five techs for it.

Our army is starting to be a force. We have 4 GS, with another five graduating from boot camp in the next five turns. By the end of Denyd’s turns we’ll have at least a dozen.

Time to start thinking about how we want to prosecute the Persian war. The next post will have some screenshots so we can plan this out.

My initial thoughts: we’ll want to have a force of at least four GS to start at Ergili and sweep southward towards Gordium and the hidden city on the coast. A second force to start at Arbela and sweep to the southwest. We will also need units to clean up the Persian forces scattered across our lands. Some of those are coming back from the Iroquois campaign, but we’ll need more.

Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/gram_10,_350_BC.SAV

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/gram_10_350_BC_Persia.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Gram_10_350_BC.jpg

Looking at the screen shots and then going back to look at the game, it looks like the Hittites have had a city raised between Niagara Falls and Centralia (I'm pretty sure the city was theirs) The Hittites are going to quickly become a non-factor in this game.

maybe we ought to declare war on the Hittites and take/threaten 1 city, then sue for a tech or money? it will put that stack near Lapurd to some use.

i put the plague in this scenario cause i never saw it. looking at bugs' screenshot, are those buzzards flying over ratae? :lol:

A little plan of attack for Persia:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/gram350.jpg

After declaration of war:
Red Army:
Turn 1: Take Ergili and moves along road ending on the mountain next to Gordium (we should have a road to Ergili pre-built)
Turn 2: Take Gordium and available troops move to hill N of Sardis - healthy units from Ergili move to Gordium, wounded stay and heal
Turn 3: Take Sardis troops wait for reinforcements to heal & catch up
Turns 4/5 heal & regroup for advance on Antioch

Blue Army:
Turn 1: Take Arbela (hopefully a road can be built to connect it before the war begins) and then move towards Persepolis
Turn 2: Position & regroup
Turn 3: Take Persepolis
Turn 4/5: heal and join with Red Army (now Green Army) and advance & take Antioch

At that point the capital should bounce to Pasagarde. We should be able to get Hamadan, Sidon & Tyre (plus any tech & $) from X-man for peace. If not go after Pasagarde.

Note: I agree with ally against Hittites, hopefully getting gold or a tech for gpt in the deal. We might be able to take Harran and raze Kadesh to give Mursilis a little incentive to give something for peace (making sure to wait for the alliance to end first).

Edit: The units used against the Hittites should then be sent to take Hattusha & Ghulaman from Persia

looks good. might want to connect that road between Ratae and Ergili to speed the flow of troops on that front. try to get monarchy 1st and revolt before starting our GA. we've waiting this long so there's no need to rush now.

roster update:

bugs <- Just Played
denyd <- UP
ankka <- on vacation 6/17-6/27
6thGenTexan <- on deck
mitsho <- out till further notice
grahamiam

@ G-man - Buzzards or vultures. They're nasty whatever they are. "Bring out your dead."

@ Denyd - there is a Persian city west of Gordium, that one can barely make out. Other than that I think you mapped out what I was thinking about. We'll also want to bring some settlers along to settle the furs.

I don't think I would worry about the Hittites just yet. By owning Hittite cities we create a large salient that we'd have to defend. We already have a less than optimal front. By concentrating on the Persians we can reduce our exposure and eliminate our number one threat.

I don't think I would worry about the Hittites just yet. By owning Hittite cities we create a large salient that we'd have to defend. We already have a less than optimal front. By concentrating on the Persians we can reduce our exposure and eliminate our number one threat.
actually, bugs, i don't think we even care if we get a city. i'd just like to threaten them into peace for a tech if possible :evil: not that it's supposed to but our research isn't exactly setting records here :lol:

Bugsy: I was hoping to get that one as a peace tribute. Excellent point about having too much to defend. We've got some nasty neighbors and should try to keep their attack area to a minimum. BTW: After Persia, Babylon or Hittites?

I would vote Babylon. We could have a nicely concentrated front.

I think we would want to keep hammering on Persia until they are left with their far eastern city (Ghulaman) and their Hittite city. We don't want them anywhere behind us.

It is a little late buyt if you haven't played yet, Gordium, Sardis and Arbela can be attacked from mountains. Antioch and Pasagardae can be attacked from hills. The problem will be Persepolis. The picture does not show any high ground and the Red Army will have to cross a river before attacking.

THE SAVE (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Gram1,_150_BC.SAV)

Before we start

Guess which are true:

A: We are in the Middle Ages
B: Persia is in ashes
C: The Mayans are building lots of Wonders
D. Rome is kicking Babylon's Butt
E. The Hittites are on the ropes

.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.

And the answer is A - C - E

for the gory details:

Turn Log 3

Turn 0 – 350 BC – Reset Personal Preferences – Checked out all the cities and everything looks fine except change Cataractonium to spear so he can relieve Liam and let him upgrade – Looking at the available troops, I won’t be able to start the offensive

IBT: Lots of Persian units moving through our land – Kevin has quite a seat for 5 Roman-Babylon battles – Entremont GS->GS – Lugdumum GS-GS

Turn 1 – 330 BC – SOD in the north moves to iron hill – Kevin NW – Start collecting GS near Ergili – NW workers sent to road for NW assault on Ergili – A couple of trades to buy techs are available, but I think I’ll wait for the pointy stick research

IBT: Persia has a lot of units heading N – Kevin gets to see 4 more battles – Camuld… GS->GS – Mayans complete Hanging Gardens

Turn 2 – 310 BC – Decide to get a little piece of Hittites – Alliance with Iroquois getting Construction and giving 500g + 15gpt – Trade Construction to Persia for Code of Laws + Philosophy – Trade Construction + Code of Laws to Maya for Map Making + 350g – Trade Construction to Greece for 272g + 5gpt – SOD moves next to Tyranna – Keep moving GS to staging point for Ergili – Kevin moves into Roman lands – Now have 6 GS ready for Ergili – research for currency (last AA tech) – slider at 3-7-0 due in 20 turns – Treasury is 680g -25gpt

IBT: Kevin gets yelled at by Caesar while watching a couple of battles – Ratae temple->catapult – Maya & Persia begin Great Wall

Turn 3 – 290 BC – Assault on Tyranna:
Elite Archer (1/5) kills Vet Spearman
Vet Archer loses to Reg Spearman (2/3)
Vet Archer (3/4) kills Reg Spearman
Barbkilla (5/5) kills Reg Archer and captures Tyrana with 2 slaves - Worker team 1 reaches GS SOD to road – start collecting workers into 3 unit groups – Buy Currency from Iroquois for 10gpt + 655g – Trade Currency to Babylon for 304g – Trade Currency to Rome for 115g

IBT: Kevin kicked out of Rome gets to watch some more battles – Richardborough GS->GS – Veral… GS-GS – Aged…Spear->Worker

Turn 4 – 270g - Trade Currency to Greece for Literature + 15g – trade Literature to Babylon for 8gpt + 94g – Ergili Army now with 8 GS (complete) - Kevin still exploring – trying to setup work crews

IBT: Kevin yelled at again – Lots more Persian troops heading N – Entremont GS->GS – Bactra temple->catapult – Lapr… temple->spearman – Greeks start Great Library –

Turn 5 – 250 BC - First GS arrives on station for eastern spot – 7 Archers in route to join eastern army

IBT: Lots of Persian troops (I know you’ve heard that already) – Maya start Great Library

Turn 6 – 230 BC – 2nd Worker Team assembled and another will be next turn – Have to move Eastern spot due to Arbela culture expansion

IBT: Just more Persians

Turn 7 – 210 BC – New Eastern rally point (on the iron) has 1 GS + 1 Archers – 3rd Worker team complete and a slave 3-man team is setup

IBT: Extend the Peace Deal with Persia (I got caught by surprise on this one, sorry) – Alesia GS-GS – Lug… GS-GS – Camul… GS-GS – Maya establish an Embassy in our Capital – Persia starts Great Library –

Turn 8 – 190 BC – 3 New GS heading for Eastern Rally point

IBT: Hittites lose Kadesh (razed by Persia) and yes more Persian troops passing through (mostly horsemen) – Entremont GS-GS – Basra expands and gets back rally point - Greeks start Great Library – Iroquois builds Temple of Artemis

Turn 9 – 170 BC – 3 GS at RP – 2 more on the way + 6 Archers

IBT: Persian horsemen are running through our lands in large numbers (2-3 new ones each turn) – Ebro.. barracks->spearmen – August… worker->worker – Cata… spear->GS – Tolosa curragh ->catapult – Maya start Great Library & Great Wall – Mayans build Great Library – Greeks build Great Wall – Persians build Mausoleum (how appropriate)

Turn 10 – 150 BC – Babylon is now connected to our trade network, we can trade them dyes, ivory, iron. – Hittites are now only 2 cities – Western Army is ready (8 Vet GS) – Eastern Army almost there (5 Vet GS + 1 Vet Archer on station) with 5 Vet Archers + 2 Elite Archers in route (2 turns)

Not much in the way of post turn notes. There are 7 archers almost to the rally point. Liam is ready to be upgraded to GS. Use those 3 workers near Babylon to connect Rome to the trade network – Use the 3 workers in the Eastern Army stack to connect the Incense SE of Vera… - Our slaves in the north are connecting the extra gems anticipating the cultural expansion of Tyrana – I set research to a minimum hoping to get tech from peace settlements - I also see a problem holding those northern cities once the war begins

Edit: 6thGenTexan: I never got the war started

Seems ok, :)

I just want to say that I bought the game :) SO I am again able to play civ3:c!

does anyone know the roster?
I scroll up and here it is:

bugs <-
denyd <- Just Played
ankka <- on vacation 6/17-6/27
6thGenTexan <- UP
mitsho <- on deck
grahamiam

Is this ok?
mfG mitsho

ok denyd, looks good. seems like tex gets to :hammer:

ah, i see mitsho has layed out the roster so i take a rest this turn :)

We'll wreck our rep if we attack before the peace is up. I think we'll have to wait until 110 AD.

I'm up already? It seems like I just set us up to take the Iron. Unfortunately I do not have the time to play 10 turns of war this weekend. I've got company comming and a 2 yeards olds birthday on Tuesday so please skip me.

If the peace with Persia is straight up, it should not hurt our rep. To be sure just demand that he leaves until he declares on us. Check our lux trade routes first.

6gntxn

The peace was straight up - I got caught by surprise that the peace treaty was up for renewal. If I didn't renew, Persia had 4 horse + 2 Immortals next to a pair of cities defended by a single warrior. We'd probably have lost both and connection to the gems in the north and our second iron source.

Aside from that I was pretty happy about the tech progress. I'm not sure that the tech pace in this game is slower than others I've played, in spite of the raised tech costs. It probably has to do with the Demi-God discounts.

roster update

bugs
denyd <- Just Played
ankka <- on vacation 6/17-6/27
6thGenTexan <- skipped (as requested)
mitsho <- UP
grahamiam <- on deck

@ Bugs -> We'll need to "trick" Persia into war if we want to start right away so just get him furious (if he isn't already) then demand he leave or declare. He's sure to declare, killing his rep, not ours.

G-man - good point. He'll declare on us as soon as he can.

Beware though, there are quite a few Persian units (Immortals & Horsemen) near our northern cities anrd a couple are defended by Warriors (this isn't going to be pretty)

Has anyone else noticed that the tech pace isn't anywhere near as slow as I thought it would be. At the rate were going muskets will be appearing soon.

Beware though, there are quite a few Persian units (Immortals & Horsemen) near our northern cities anrd a couple are defended by Warriors (this isn't going to be pretty)

Has anyone else noticed that the tech pace isn't anywhere near as slow as I thought it would be. At the rate were going muskets will be appearing soon.
yes, it's fast for this mod, but remember everyone is in their GA atm and we are close to 0AD, still in the AA. Not typical for a demigod game. hopefully, with gunpowder approximatly 5x the cost as Sattilites, things will slow down to a screetching halt ;)

hopefully, with gunpowder approximatly 5x the cost as Sattilites, things will slow down to a screetching halt ;)

Are all the Middle Ages techs that expensive? Where do costs return to normal?

Are all the Middle Ages techs that expensive? Where do costs return to normal?
never. the 1st tier MA techs and chivalry are 5X normal. the rest are set to the maximum value of 1000 in the editor. I think my approximation was a little off but sattilites, for instance, is set at 320 in a normal game. tech's cost 10X this value in terms of gold.
the idea of this game is to be stuck in the AA, duking it out till the end with knights as the ultimate unit.

hmm, I got it. But I can't play tonight. I'm sorry, but today Switzerland will beat France and so I have absolutely no time to play civ. ;)

But I'll play tomorrow.

mfG mitsho

mitsho - sorry to hear about Switzerland. :( How goes the game?

YOu don't have to be sorry. For us it's great to participate in a EM. But back to topic. I'm gonna play now and post a bit later. 10 turns as best as I can.

mfG mitsho

EDIT: I just saw that I forgot to download the latest patch :wand: I'm sorry, but is tomorrow afternoon soon enough? (that is in about 18 hours ... :)) But perhaps I can play it tonight :)

mfG mitsho