In this game we'll be playing as Chinese, emphasizing the 3-move UU we have. The variant rules are:

1. We cannot attack cities within that AI's territory.
2. Slow units cannot enter enemy territory, nor can they attack outside of our own territory.
3. We have to accept peace as soon as 1) we are at at least 10th turn of the war and 2) AI is willing to pay for peace. This means we have to be well prepared before declaring and take as many cities as possible at the beginning of the war. A lightning profitable war is the idea.
4. No MA or MPP is allowed.

It's on Emperor standard pangea. Victory is Domination. Conquest is OK if we could do it, but AI may have cities burried inside mountains or hills which would make this almost impossible, but we can try. I hope we can finish it before Industrial Ages.

It emphasizes middle ages war and we'll need combat settlers a lot I would assume.

Roster:
- microbe
- gozpel
- grahamiam
- Aggie
- grs

2. We have to accept peace as soon as AI is willing to offer to pay us. This means we have to take as many cities as possible at the beginning of the war. A lightening profitable war is the idea.

Do you mean we must take peace as soon as the AI initiates dimplomacy, and it willing to give us peace, along with something else? Or if they are just willing to give us straight peace?

Checking in.

Standard map is alright.

I think we should set a limit too, when to take peace. So if we say 10 turns, then is the time we WILL talk. Before that we just ignore the request?

I think we should set a limit too, when to take peace. So if we say 10 turns, then is the time we WILL talk. Before that we just ignore the request?

Sounds good to me at least.

Basic rule: no exploits and cherish your rep. I'll adopt Aggie's ruleset for now as I am lazy to write my own:

BANNED TACTICS
These are the exploits that I want to avoid in the game:

"Phony Peace Treaty": Making Peace Treaties without having the intention to stay at peace, just to get cheap techs or money.

"Palace Jump"; Jumping the palace by disbanding the capital. Rushing a palace or building it brick by brick is OK.

"RoP Rape": Using Right of Passage to move whole armies into attack position.

"Resource Piracy": Sitting on resources or deny a civ access to a tile inside the borders of the rival while at peace.

"Dogpiling": Adding multiple workers to cities to increase population beyond the food supply.

"Seed Corn": It is not allowed to buy the LAST TWO workers from the AI before 1000 BC.

"Negative cash research": The penalty of negative cash is only one unit/improvement. So there are cases where this can be worthwile. Science spending must be lowered when the cash would go below zero.

"Seed Corn": It is not allowed to buy the LAST TWO workers from the AI before 1000 BC.

Could you please elaborate on this?

Since I copied it from Aggie, he might have an authorative answer. My impression is that we cannot buy all the starting workers from AI before 1000BC.

Under Emperor AI gets one additional worker. So it means we can only buy 1 worker from each AI before 1000BC.

Under demigod we can buy two, because AI gets 2 additional worker at start.

This rule is not very important to me, as I think it was meant to address the original game's problem of AI selling workers too cheaply. In C3C every worker costs about 110g, so I guess we may just want to get rid of this rule?

EDIT: I also get rid of the "throw away cities" rule. We'll use combat settlers for sure, although I don't see we abandon the cities.

checking in :wavey:

looking at this roster, maybe we should bump up the diff. and play dg?

Checking in :)

Regarding a: I would limit slow units to only allowed to use them in our territory. But any decision is ok :)
Regarding rule 2: I think that it would be challenging to keep it strict. So when an AI wants to talk and give cities for peace, you have to take it. Note that the AI will be more and more reluctant to talk when you are at war with them more than once. I once had to wait 18 turns before the Zulu would talk, despite my gains (3 cities).

I'd like to be at the end of the roster :)

Could you please elaborate on this?

This rule is included to avoid an easy way to cripple the AI. By buying their workers they have no possibility to work their lands and grow. Workers are vital in the early game and the AI doesn't know it. I think that 110 gold is very cheap for early workers. The gains are far bigger than this.

So I 'copied' the rule from RBCiv and kept it in my list: You are not allowed to buy the last two workers of an AI before 1000 BC.

Checking in :)
Regarding a: I would limit slow units to only allowed to use them in our territory. But any decision is ok :)

OK. Since this is just emperor let's have some more challenge.

I'll also allow them to be in neutral territory (including AI territory which we have RoP with) in case they have to do so to move to other cities. But they may only attack when inside our territory.

Regarding rule 2: I think that it would be challenging to keep it strict. So when an AI wants to talk and give cities for peace, you have to take it. Note that the AI will be more and more reluctant to talk when you are at war with them more than once. I once had to wait 18 turns before the Zulu would talk, despite my gains (3 cities).


Hmm, as I envision the major war is after we get our UU, at that time the AI's towns will be reasonably big. I don't think it's that easy to make them give cities for free thus I'm worried it would make the variant irrelevant. I want the war to be short and fast.

I think I'll just make a 10-turn grace period during which we can ignore the AI offer.

So in short: we must make peace if 1) the war is at or after the 10th turn (the turn it's started is turn 1) and 2) if AI agrees to pay us anything for that.

If people agree I'll update the rules.

the rules sound good to me

This rule is included to avoid an easy way to cripple the AI. By buying their workers they have no possibility to work their lands and grow. Workers are vital in the early game and the AI doesn't know it. I think that 110 gold is very cheap for early workers. The gains are far bigger than this.

So I 'copied' the rule from RBCiv and kept it in my list: You are not allowed to buy the last two workers of an AI before 1000 BC.

Well, what AIs would leave all of their workers in their cities? I thought the AI was at least smart enough to send out its workers.

The ten turn grace period sounds great, IMO.

I updated the rules and will play the first 20-25 turns tonight.

EDIT: or tomorrow if I don't have enough time.

@Gogf: AI may temporarily have workers in their capital. You'd have to check F3 every turn to catch that.

4000BC: We found Beijing directly. Set min research to Alphabet. We have ivory next to our border. Ancient Cavalry would be good to have!
3600BC: Warrior reveals furs in our north. :D
3500BC: Beijing grows and lux to 10.
3450BC: spot a green border. MM to get warrior one turn faster.
3400BC: We meet Greece. We are up Warrior Code and he is up Bronze Working, Alphabet and Pottery. I'll meet someone else before I trade techs. From F11 seems we are the only Militaristic civ..
3300BC: incense in the west.
3200BC: We meet Spain. She is up BW, Alphabet and CB. Greece now has BW, Alphabet, Pottery and CB.

So WC+1gpt+60g to Greece for Pottery. WC+Pottery to Spain for Alphabet+19g. Min research set to Writing.

3100BC: Greece gets the Wheel.
3000BC: Our opponents: America, Mongols, Spain, Greece, Egypt, India and France.
2900BC: settler goes west. Silks found somewhere to our north.
2750BC: Greece settled close to the silks.

I leave the settler unmoved this turn. I am not sure whether to settle directly there or one tile west. I prefer one tile west as that would claim the incense too. Maybe someone comes up with a dotmap and the team can decide. We need to settle toward west and north first.

I hope we have horses. If we don't, we can use foot units to capture it from AI, but that's about it.

EDIT: we are doing min research on Writing but since our income is very low 10% sci doesn't do research at all. You may want to raise it to 20% or more to make it non-zero, and drop it back to 10% as soon as possible.

Roster:

microbe
gozpel - up (play 15 turns, then everyone plays 10 turns)
grahamiam - on deck
Gogf
Aggie
grs (to be confirmed)

Someone comes up with a dotmap please. I am normally wrong about it. ;)

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MIC2-2750BC.jpg

I got it.

Will play as soon as possible.

Signing in. Will post my thoughts later.

Not happy, Jan!

I really hate the AI sometimes, with enough meditation I will learn foresight!

Pre-turn - Set Writing to 10% since we've been researching already for 9 turns. And it cost us a gold per turn.

Shanghai founded on the right side of the river -> barracks. I thought of moving one step further for the incence, but this was my choice.

We make 5gpt atm.

Change the warrior to barracks in 4t in Beijing and save 2 shields.

2710bc - Warrior near Greece spots GH.

2670bc - We meet America (3 cities) north of Greece, they are up BW, CB and the Wheel, same as Greece. I could buy the Wheel for all our gold and gpt, no deal.

2630bc - Worker done roading to Shanghai, start chop.
Warrior near Greece can't resist goodyhut and of course find barbs.

2590bc - Barbs ignore our warrior

Beijing barracks -> warrior

2550bc - A bit of tundra south of Shanghai, but we find furs! And a cow nearby.

2510bc - With the chop Shanghai produce barracks -> warrior

2470bc - Beijing warrior -> warrior. Send him to check out GH near Beijing

2430bc - Not much

2390bc - We get 25g from GH. Switch beijing to archer to save 2 shields since GH was ok.

Buy the Wheel from Greece for 2gpt and 123g, and Alex is only cautious now.
I give the Wheel, 4gpt and 4g to Isabella for BW and CB.

That leaves us with 0gpt and 6g in the kitty. We have 1gpt as a buffer in research if we would need it.

Switch both cities to archers to save 2 shields in each city. Archers are better then spears in my world and we might have to fight for horses later. Spain and Greece will probably take the 2 visible sources.

2350bc - Not much

2310bc - Southern scout find a barb. A greece worker stands on a mountain outside their borders?

2270bc - Beijing archer -> settler

Nice AI trading, they all knows IW and Mysticism now.

2230bc - What are those Greece workers running around in the wild for?

Barb approaches Shanghai.

2190bc - Shanghai archer -> settler

Warrior takes out barbcamp and 25g.

2150bc - I think the Greece worker wanted the furs as colony, our warrior stands on it.

Ah well, I wouldn't be able to get IW or Myst even without the Wheel-trade. They traded IT between each other and at least we CAN build spears if we need it.

The problem is to get to the horses, they are a bit away from our "core"

Settlers are due in 5t in Beijing and 9t in Shanghai.

Settlers to horses, please.

Dotmap on beer:

The text is supposed to say Horse, I will use larger fonts next time.

We need those horses, or we're toast until we can trade for them.

shanghai settler gets the one to the left,
beijing settler gets the one to the right,
everybody else get ready for a fight,
doin' the chinese 2-step tonight
one, two
one, two
one, two
one, two

(ahhh!, living in the sticks too long :D , gotta get outta here!)

roster:

microbe
gozpel - just played
grahamiam - up
Gogf - on deck
Aggie
grs

Compare to mic1 we have a tough start. :) But that's OK. The serious war will start in Middle Ages so expansion can take its time.

(ahhh!, living in the sticks too long :D , gotta get outta here!)

Just watch out for the kid with the banjo sitting up in a tree... :lol:

i got the save just in case the jumpy CFC server acts up. will play and post tonight.

So there is a worker right? What would ppl feel if we declare war and capture it? :) Then sign peace afterwards. A worker would be good to have! Assuming no Greeks closeby?

Heh, we can get a dogpile on us, I strongly object :)

save attached at the bottom

Preflight check: Everyone we know is up IW and Myst.

IBT: nada

T1: 2110BC Greek worker goes N away from furs; wanderer warriors look for new friends and future foes.

T2: 2070BC A hoplite shows up W of Shanghai; Beijing grows so I MM off grass and onto river ivory to shave 1T off settler build. Get a couple more coins for my trouble. See a purple border N of America.

T3: 2030BC ditto; worker is moving over to irrigate the river plain ivory so we can get an extra gold when Beijing is size 2.
IBT: Beijing settler -> archer; Spanish building the Oracle

T4: 1990BC Meet Gandi. He is up IW but down Mas. Will not part with IW for Mas and 52g so we move on. Settler goes E; worker irrigates ivory

T5: 1950BC Spanish plop down 2 towns to our West, taking the horses but not quite getting the incense.

IBT: Spanish building the Colossus; barb finally moves from mountain N of Shanghai so Spain must have more units close. However, this is good as the settler due in 2T and I want the cows.

T6: 1910BC settler/warrior pair continues to the horses in the East.

T7: 1870BC Indians have Masonry but they never had any gold so they must have researched it themselves. I don’t want the worker to go too far away without an escort so he does some mindless tasks around Beijing

IBT: Shanghai settler -> archer

T8: 1830BC Settler and archer leave Shanghai headed for the cows.

T9: 1790BC Settler/warrior pair arrive at horse location. Notice a barb warrior and barb horse on hill to the E. 2 warriors are covering this settler right now so it should be ok but, based on the movement I saw in the IBT, there is a barb hut around that hill.

T10: 1750BC Found Canton next to horses -> worker Meet the Mongols. Surprise! They are up IW and Myst too. Americans are up Math now as well (monopoly). Probably a twofer out there if we could just garner some cash.

our land as we see it. Settler/archer pair going for cows so we can get some more settlers.

I see we are building archers. I think we should only build defensive slow unit, as we cannot use archers for offense except inside our own territory. Thoughts?

Also we need to settle the insense asap, probably before the cow? At least, send some units to protect it from AI's settlers? For that reason, I think we should build warrior in Shanghai.

roster:

microbe
gozpel
grahamiam
Gogf - up
Aggie - on deck
grs

it's 1750bc and we only have 3 cities. i was thinking we needed cities more than lux atm. at least the cow town could grow faster and push out more settlers than our other 2 cities which are growing extremely slow.

edit: also, do we want the greeks or spaniards to have that cow spot? it's a very strong location, with 2 cows, 7 river tiles, and a gold hill. this spot will be a real powerhouse in the future

shanghai archer can be a warrior in 1T, beijing archer can protect the worker from barbs and do some barb hunting if we get lots of them poping up

Gogf, you are up.

You guys should consider building the Statue of Zeus considering your situation. That way, you'll at least be able to go on the offensive and take Toledo so you can build other mounted units.

I'm up already? Wasn't I last in the order?

Okay, got it.

You guys should consider building the Statue of Zeus considering your situation. That way, you'll at least be able to go on the offensive and take Toledo so you can build other mounted units.



The Statue of Zeus is always a nice idea; we already have horses in our borders though.

:crazyeye: Oops, didn't see that horse on the hill up by Canton.

The SoZ would still be nice, for the extra attack and defense though.

Yeah, but Aggie asked me to put him at the last.

Zeus would be nice, but we need to expand first.

Okay, I'll be done by the end of today.

Sorry, I can't play. I've been doing something with the family for most of the day, and am dead tired right now.

Could I please get either a skip, or a delay? Thanks.

Thanks for the update, Gogf, I hope you can play next round. Or whenever you feel like playing, please let me know and I'll try to reshuffle the roster.

roster:

microbe
gozpel
grahamiam
Gogf - skipped
Aggie - up
grs - on deck

Got this one as well.

IHT: Beijing switched to spear, Shanghai to warrior. We have an awful lot of military and only one worker... I up the science to 10% to get our min science run up to speed again. We didn't seem to have lost a turn on it.

IT: Beijing: spear->spear. It's too small to build a settler next.

Turn 1 (1725 BC) Nanking founded near the cattle. Starting with a granary. Military goes to the furs as microbe suggests.

IT: Shanghai: warrior->worker.

Turn 2 (1700 BC) America and Mongolia know Writing. Our income is not good enough to profit from the tech situation atm.

Turn 3, 4 (1675, 1650 BC) :sleep:

Turn 5 (1625 BC) Our income increased to 12 gpt. I buy Writing from Mongolia for 11 gpt and 1 gold. Spain gives us Mathematics for Writing and 13 gold. Greece gives us Iron Working and 14 gold for Writing. India gives Mysticism for Writing. We are level in tech, have 66 gold, but only make 1 gpt. Not enough -imho- to go for the Philo run (we would need 30 turns). I start min science on Literature instead.

There is iron to the east. We should be able to grab it.

IT: Shanghai: worker->spear.

Turn 6 (1600 BC) :sleep:

IT: Beijing: spear->settler.

Turn 7 (1575 AD) Spanish warriors are very close to Shanghai. I send the spear of Beijing there.

Turn 8, 9 (1550 AD, 1525 AD) Spain, America and Mongolia know HBR.

IT: Canton: worker->barracks.

Turn 10 (1500 BC) Spain only goes barb hunting. Greece and Mongolia know Polytheism. Freece also learned about HBR. We are very small as an empire. This will not change soon I'm afraid. We might even need to swap Beijing to a granary instead of a settler. It will otherwise take too long to grow.

Our lands:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MIC2-1500BCempire.JPG

The Spanish troops in the SW are two warriors. I haven't seen a settler there yet.

Looks like a challenging game, but I'm confident in the team's skills. It's just emperor. :)

microbe - on deck
gozpel
grahamiam
Gogf -
Aggie -
grs - up

Got it! I agree with changing Beijing to a granary and starting a settler after it.

I really want to secure the iron asap. If we switch to granary, any chance to lose it? If we have enough warriors to block the AI then fine, but we have warriors blocking the incense as well I think?

I don't think we have too few. If we miss it there would be another to the south, but I doubt we will.

Got it! I agree with changing Beijing to a granary and starting a settler after it.
perhaps canton should get a granery instead of a barracks. it has a lot more food potential than the others. 2 irrigated FP, a mined sugar, and 2 irrigated plains will give us +4fpt and +4spt (5-1 for corruption). we can MM off 2 of the FP at turn 3 to 2 irrigated plains for extra shields (extra plains available due to settler near iron hill). probably could do 1 settler every 6 or 7T, depending on corruption. not great, or even good, but better. if we whip a temple as well, we could probably get 2 sugars which would make things better and, based on some rough corruption calc's, we should be able to do it in 6T. getting connected to the capital via road will help too. Nanking will have lower corruption so the granery there will work even better but will have food issues. 2 cities doing 1 settler each every 6 or 7T with all the other cities also contributing will work pretty good.

the reality is that we don't have an ideal settler "pump" location so every town will have to make settlers once they get in pop range. it'll make things slow but we'll multiply like bacteria (good thing microbe started this game :) )

PreTurn: Beijing switched to granary, wake Shanghai spear and move it towards Nanking to free archer
IBT: Abe is angry about our warrior
1475BC: moving
IBT: Abe demands us to leave or declare - we automove; a barb nears Beijing
1450BC: we spot a barb camp se of Beijing
IBT: a spain warrior clears the lone barb near Canton; Abe demands 22 gold, no way - he declares; Shanghai spear-warrior
1425BC: war happiness helps us; we remove a barb near Beijing
IBT: nothing
1400BC: disperse the barb camp se of Beijing
IBT: a volcano near Delphi becomes active
1375BC: movement
IBT: Isabella wants 24 gold - we give in as her forces are to close to us
1350BC: movement
IBT: Shanghai warrior - warrior; Abe shows us his archers
1325BC: movement
IBT: the volcano near Delphi erupts
1300BC: lure Abe's archers around
IBT: a barb nears Shanghai, Beijing granary-settler, Spain beats us to a barb camp, Abe moves his archers back to Washington
1275BC: movement
IBT: nothing
1250BC: movement, protect the worker near Shanghai with an archer

Block for Spanish settler (not seen yet) is in place - we have 6 units. Nanking is about to riot, clown will be cheaper then lux. We have 2 warriors near Philadelphia, maybe hit Abe once and extort? Settler from Beijing in 6.

Map with proposed next settling points.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/mic2-1250.jpg

Block for Spanish settler (not seen yet) is in place - we have 6 units. Nanking is about to riot, clown will be cheaper then lux.

Nope, no clown please. We need the production. We can also move a warrior there as MP.

I don't like the red dot - it's too agressive and AI will not like it. One tile SE is better.

microbe - up
gozpel - on deck
grahamiam -
Gogf -
Aggie -
grs -

Red dot one tile south also looks good. It gets the cattle in expanded borders.

I don't like the red dot - it's too agressive and AI will not like it. One tile SE is better.

may want to look at 1T south. river and coast to get a dingy out looking for new buddies. plus we'll get more food from the coast tile when we get a harbor built.

edit: x-post with aggie. seems we agree :)

Agree that's better. Also the blue dot I'd prefer on the incense hill directly, or one tile west to be next to river. That would be the two highest priority spots for me.

preturn: fire clown in Nanking and raise lux to 30 instead.

I switch Canton from rax to settler.

IBT Spain builds Colossus. Also sends a settler.

(1)1225BC:

I establish an embassy with Greece. Athens is size 1 with 2 hoplites and 1 settler. One lux. Another settler is due in 2 turns. No resources connected yet.

America asks for Canton for peace.

(2)1200BC: The spanish settler goes north.

(3)1175BC:
(4)1150BC:
(5)1125BC:
I'm really worried about America pulling MA against us - it has over 300g! And I don't see we have anything to offer for peace. We should not have refused the demand.

We have a 2-fer opportunity, and I'm more worried about Spain than Greece, so
113g+10gpt to Spain for Polytheism.
Polytheism to India for HBR+37g.

IBT 2 American warriors appear at Canton.
(6)1100BC: We have 2 warriors in Canton and AI would have to attack across river, but I switch Canton to spear due next turn, to be sure.

IBT Mongols builds Oracle.

(7)1075BC: Vet warrior kills reg warrior.

IBT another American warrior shows up.

(8)1050BC: Lux can drop to 0 this turn..

(9)1025BC: Totally 4 American reg warriors around Canton. No worry here.

We just got to the iron spot before Spain.

IBT One American warrior dies to our reg spear taking one hp.

(10)1000BC: Tsingtao is founded. We have incense! I found Tsingtao next to the river instead of the hill. We can launch attack to 3 cities from here. The only drawback is that the second incense isn't secured yet. But I expect us to take those cities anyway. You can also set Tsingtao to temple.

I set Canton to worker.

American is still asking for quite some gold for peace. I don't know why it doesn't MA with Greece, maybe it doesn't have embassy yet. America also has horses, I hope it won't send horsemen so soon.

We need to connect horse asap, then we can prepare some attack against Spain!

Remember: slow units cannot attack outside our territory.

microbe - just played
gozpel - up
grahamiam - on deck
Gogf -
Aggie -
grs -

I think next up we should set a settler north to our capital for the furs? Only to be aware of the Americans..we need at least two spears..then next up to the east.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MIC2-1000BC.jpg

fire clown in Nanking and raise lux to 30 instead
I just suggested the clown because we already were in overproduction.

Remember: slow units cannot attack outside our territory.
Oops, my idea of attacking an American city did not comply to that rule - I see.

Ah well, another tricky situation, right?

I got it, and will play tomorrow
(plus the other one, microbe, been a mighty busy couple of days RL)

We really might want peace, if it's staight gold I'm for it. GPT is not in my book if we're not overrun by superior units, and it doesn't look like that yet. After all, gold is just that, gold.

You have a halfday to state your comments before I play.

only comment i got is to connect those horses :) peace with america sounds fine or you can sign greece to an MA and let them chew each other up. that should give us some breathing room to settler our area.

MA with Greece isn't possible.
Peace with America requires quite some gpt.

I suggest we send some archers other there and kill those warriors. Then the price may drop. I don't want to face horsemen.

We got into war by refusing a tiny 22g tribute demand. I would suggest ppl not be so defiant.

Yep, I agree to that. A gold per turn is money well spent to keep the peace until we are done expanding.

But it can have its good sides as well, if our archers are lucky enough to create an elite or two and maybe a leader :)

Still, please give in to demands if they are not outrageous. We need our production to be concentrated to get more settlers, not military.

Pre-turn - All is good.

Whip an archer in Canton

975bc - IT - American warrior defeats our spear in Canton without a scratch. Over a river, mind you :( The next warrior dies against our warrior.

Canton archer -> worker

Xinjian founded -> curragh

Archer kills a barb

950bc - Move some troops around

American horse moves next to Canton

925bc - American warrior dies against our warrior in Canton.
The ugly horseman kills a warrior

Beijing settler -> archer

900bc - Shanghai spear -> archer
Nanking settler -> barracks

Archer dispose a barbcamp for 25g

875bc - American warrior dies against our warrior in Canton, who promotes to elite.

Spanish settler-pair near southern iron

850bc - Spain found a city one turn befor my settler reached his spot.

American horse dies attacking Canton.

Found Chengdu ridiculously close to the new spanish town -> temple

Archer lose 3 hp, but kill American horse.
Southern archer moves out of spanish territory and finds a GH and barbcamp.

A few civs knows Construction, no deal possible.

825bc - IT - Greece wants 25g, which they get.

Shanghai archer -> Statue of Zeus

Hangchow founded -> worker

800bc - Beijing archer -> settler

American warrior walks past Canton, possibly on pillage mission.
Attack the warrior with our elite warrior and we get a leader! Send him to Canton and create army. Won't fill it yet though.

775bc - Xinjian curragh -> barracks

America accept peace straight up, deal.

750bc - Nanking barracks -> worker
Tsingtao barracks -> archer

Archer takes out barbcamp and gets 25g

Start connecting horses by Canton.

Spain knows Monarchy.

Wow, nice job! A leader? Maybe we can wait for riders.

We still need to settle. I'm not sure if we want to build Zeus now, or switch to settler first. We seem to have monopoly on ivory (if we grab those ivory in the east fast - that's a very nice spot btw), so it should be safe to get.

microbe
gozpel
grahamiam - up
Gogf - on deck
Aggie -
grs -

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MIC2-750BC.jpg

ok, got it. dot map looks good though we only have 1 source of iron and it's not firmly secured. any thoughts on getting the one SE of Canton secured 1st (also, i would settle next to it, not on it, so we get the extra shields)?

The other iron is secured. It's within the town's first ring so we are safe.

We need to settle our first ring cities and get the income/production up. Murcia is going to be captured anyways.

By the way, I think we should start curragh in Xinjian? We still have some guys unmet yet..

Also I would probably switch Canton/Nanking to settler too..

We have a curragh out already.

And we can switch SoZ to settler, but beware, Spain got galleys and ship settlers with them.

I would continue SoZ. The sooner the better.

i'd like to stay on building the SoZ as well, we could us the units as we settle more land. the other cities microbe mentioned can build the settlers.

the iron i was refering to is not near Xinjian or Murcia, but 3T SE of Canton, under one of microbe's purple dots. I was thinking Xinjian may be a little tenuous but a town near Canton would be much more stable and productive.

i'll prioritize settling on the red dot then on another sight NE of Beijing so we get another core town on a river. any other priorities? what goverment are we aiming for (i'm guessing monarchy but we should decide)?

Republic. Remember we will most likely only have 10-turn wars..

EDIT: keep building SoZ is OK, as long as we have enough towns on settlers.

Republic. Remember we will most likely only have 10-turn wars..
ah, excellent, i prefer republic as well, glad i asked :)

Preflight check: Tele on. Scroll thru cities/screens to check up on how we’re doing. Interesting in that we could undo our min research gambit and do max research to get lit in 8T @ -16gpt but I hold off on doing that. Nothing to MM.

Nobody willing to sell construction to setup a twofer

Switch Canton to a settler as agreed but leave Nanking as a worker as it’ll be done in 2T and then I can go get the settler.

IBT:

T1: 730BC Move spear from Canton N to protect worker roading the horse.

IBT: Nanking worker -> settler (MM off mined grass onto forrest to shave 2T off settler build and still get growth in 2T)
Spanish are building HG; Spanish border expansion takes 1 of our incense hills near Xinjian

T2: 710BC not much except finding out no one wants to sell us Construction

IBT: Spanish building MoM

T3: 690BC We can get Construction for 229g and 14gpt but then with the settlers coming we won’t be able to pay that debt so I hold off for now.

IBT: horse road done; we are kicked out of Mongol land; Beijing settler -> horseman; Massive barb uprising near Beijing (guess someone went MA)

T4: 670BC move settler towards the dist 4 point NE of Beijing so we don’t run too close to the barbs; Send the reg archer down from Canton to take a look. Change Beijing to spearman. Looks like America went to the MA as well as India (both got currency). Spain has 1281 gold and is down techs!
Well, with all that gold, time to make some trades :)
Trades: India: Currency for 244g and 10gpt
Mongols: CoL and 72g for Currency
Spain: 491g for CoL and Currency
Greece: Constr, MM, Phil for CoL, Currency, and 358g. Greece gains Mono as their free tech.
We are in the MA and have 205g in the bank make +1gpt

T5: 650BC A deal expired and we now make +11gpt. Greece sold Mono to Spain for Monarchy but I can’t buy either right now. Archer from Canton spots the barb menace. There are 8 on a hill 4T SE of Canton

IBT: a barb galley sinks the dingy. Shanghai riots (damn) so I up the lux slider to 10%. Barb Horses move out towards Canton

T6: 630BC Rotate troops up to Canton

IBT: Barb horses split into groups of 4 around Canton; Hangchow: worker -> temple

T7: 610BC Tientsin founded -> barracks; 2 of the archers in Canton kill 2 BH’s, 1 promotes to elite. Move the third into town. Worker continues to run away. MM Shanghai of grass and onto river forest to cut 3T off SoZ build (17vs20).
Canton has 5 units inside vs 6BH in range; Tientsin has 2 BH in range and 1 archer inside. Hope this is enough.

IBT: Lincoln demands 30g, sure buddy boy; Greeks building HG; Spanish warrior kills 1 BH near Canton and the other 3 move N towards Greece; Greece begins HG and MoM

T8: 590BC reg Archer kills frozen BH near Canton (2/3); vet archer kills the last BH in that stack and promotes (2/5); Switch Tsingtao to a temple to help alleviate the cultural pressure.
Everyone has Lit now (damn); buy from India for 99g. Unfortunately we can’t research Republic very fast right now (45T, -2gpt @ 50%) so I set it to Min. It may be possible to grow into this research by changing some builds to Libraries but I’ll leave that for discussion.

IBT: Spanish warrior kills another BH and I watch the last 2 ride of towards the Greek town N of Hangchow (Knossos); Beijing spear -> settler; Nanking settler ->settler; Mongols and Greeks are building the Glib.

T9: 570BC Spear moves into Shanghai and I drop the Lux tax to 0%; Settler moves S to get to the Whale location

IBT: Canton settler -> Library (next player may want to change); Xinjian barracks -> horse; Spanish are building GLib

T10: 550BC Settler/Bubba move S from Canton; Hangchow connected to empire; the other settler moves from Shanghai to Beijing

empire in waiting

Good job!

After Zeus is completed, time for some wars against Spain maybe. It has the same size of military as we do.

We should start moving the army to our capital. AC army is OK if we can't wait for riders.

Gogf, check the previous dotmap. Found those nice spots in the east (red dot being the highest priority, then the iron).

microbe
gozpel
grahamiam - just played
Gogf - up
Aggie - on deck
grs -

thanks, but do we want to settle directly on the iron? (recommend NE of the iron to preserve the other purple dot in the area) imho, we'd be better off with the extra shield. btw, beware since that is the area that the 8 horseman came from so expect a barb village.

also, what do we want to do about our pathetic research rate?

also, what do we want to do about our pathetic research rate?

If we can continue doing trades like you did I wouldn't worry too much :)

If we can continue doing trades like you did I wouldn't worry too much :)
well, that's fine. researching with markets i presume? in that case, we might as well change that library build to marketplace. However, I don't see the AI getting around to Republic right away as they seem perfectly happy in Monarchy atm :king: :queen:

Tsingtoa should finish it's cultural building though as it's seeing some tough pressure.

Researching is a non-issue once we get to riders. Even with AC we can extort something from Spain.

So that means that we should swap from libasry to something else in Canton. Has it got a temple? If so, then a market is the best choice imvho.

So that means that we should swap from libasry to something else in Canton. Has it got a temple? If so, then a market is the best choice imvho.
no, it doesn't have any culture atm. it was busy with building a settler during my turns.

Gogf, I hope you do check the thread. You are up.

I'd like to skip Gogf. Aggie, are you able to play? You can take it.

Not at the moment. Quarter final Euro Championships :) It will be Tomorrow after MIC1 probably.

OK, I'll give the extension to Gogf then. :)

Well, now I have to recover from the match :sleep: It was nerve-wrecking (but we won :) ). I try to play tomorrow night CET.

What was the match about? Some kind of game? Or sport? Congrats on the win!

Sorry guys, I'm going to have to drop out :(. I leave for four weeks at the crack of dawn tommorow. I'll find out how it turned out though!

@microbe: european soccer championship - and the dutch won their first penalty shoting for ages - if not their first at all
@gogf: sorry to see you go

@microbe: european soccer championship - and the dutch won their first penalty shoting for ages - if not their first at all

Ah, of course, I am so stupid. I thought Aggie was participating in some championship. :)

Gogf, sorry to know you are busy. It means we go back to 5 players.

Could I be swapped? I have to recover from yesterday :D

Could I be swapped? I have to recover from yesterday :D
I could pick it up and play today. In fact it would be much better for me too. So if no objections come soon - I will play later today.

Go ahead grs.

microbe
gozpel
grahamiam
Aggie - on deck (?)
grs - up

PreTurn: Canton switched to temple, moving army back to core, no reasonable way to get republic faster atm
IBT: Spain and Greece fight, India starts Great Library and finishes the Pyramids, Americans start Temple of Artemis, The Great Library and The Hanging Gardens, Spain starts Great Library
530bc: nothing
IBT: Mongols start Temple of Artemis and Great Library; Greeks have a worker settler pair and a galley with unknown load at the se of the isle
510bc: switch Xinjian to galley (where's our curragh gone?)
IBT: Mongols ask for 27 gold...<5 minutes later> I give in...not because I am convinved it is right though; by scanning the Mongols lands I find a fortified warrior, huh!?, greek galley gets redlined by barb galley - so close :devil2: given the knowledge of greeks settling plans I change ours a bit to secure land; one will be founded ne of iron at the coast, the other n, ne of the eastmost elephant and the third at the proposed red dot;
490bc: Tatung founded - starts harbor
IBT: Greek settler is blocked and moves around, ship moves back; we can build the forbidden palace now
470bc: nothing
IBT: Greek settler tries to cross; Beijing settler-market
450bc: "The Weasel is Connected!" (it gets late here)
IBT: Isabella wants 29 gold - she alreay has more than 1500 - how greedy (yes this time I give convinced)
430bc: we found Macao - that was really close as Alex continues to cross towards the elephants, and we may again need to change our building plans, for now I have to try blocking again; I could ask him to leave or declare, but that would be stupid; our army reaches Shanghai
IBT: Alex starts to run around our block; Nanking settler-horse; Tietsin barracks-horse
410bc: block movement
IBT: block evasion movement; Mongols kick our warrior out again
390bc: movement
IBT: Spanish start Great Lighthouse, since they finished the Great Library in Madrid
370bc: ...
IBT: Greek ship is healed and back; Xinjian galley-horseman; Mongols and Indian start Great Wall; Americans the Mouse Tower
350bc: Anjang is founded and starts temple to get the whales; we can trade resources to Spain now, we could trade ivory for cash soon if we want to, we may be one turn late to block the greeks from our elephant shores, though I did all that was possible (I hope at least). I know I settled kind of intuitive, but otherwise the greeks would have - just hope I didn't get to paranoid about them getting behind our line and to the elephants as I am well aware they would never had a chance to connect them in time to steal the ToA.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/mic2-350.jpg

I would have founded Anyang one tile NE on the ivory directly.

microbe - on deck
gozpel
grahamiam
Aggie - up
grs - just played

As I am an idiot (or a bit short sighted) I misread the dotmap - I wanted to settle exactly on the proposed red dot. Sorry, a real stupid error :(

510bc: switch Xinjian to galley (where's our curragh gone?)
it was sunk between turns 5 and 6 during my go. sorry, i called it a "dingy" instead of a "galley" so I'm sure it was lost in the translation. nice set, too bad about the ivory but I wouldn't worry as we should be about 4T from SoZ.

Since Gogf dropped out, one slot is open if anyone is interested.

IHT: Whip the temple in Tsingtao. It had 20 shields left, so the timing is perfect. Tmeple in Hsangchow is whipped with 17 shields left.

IT: The Mongols kick us out. Tsingtao: temple->courthouse. Hangchow: temple->market.

Turn 1 (330 BC) :sleep:

IT: Tsingtao deposed our government and allied with Spain :( We lost our incense. Greece natuyrally doesn't sail for the ivory, but has our southern tip as target.

Turn 2 (310 BC) This was a serious set-back, but we can keep our lux tax on 0%.

IT: Spain starts Sun Tzu.

Turn 3 (290 BC) Xinjian and Nanking swapped from horseman to temple. They are close to Spain as well. Shanghai demands a lux tax of 10%.

IT: Greece appears to beat us to the spot in the south. A redlined barb galley makes our galley promote. We finish the [i]Statue of Zeus.[/i[ Shanghai starts marketplace next.

Turn 4 (270 BC) Greece and Spain have Feudalism. Our settler one tile NE of the original dot, but the Greeks block the ideal place.

IT: The Greeks move the settler pair and allow us to settle instead :) Egypt finishes ToA, The Mongols finish The Great Wall, India finishes MoM, France finishes the Hanging Gardens.

Turn 5 (250 BC) Shantung is settled, starts with barracks.

Turn 6 (230 BC) Our galley spots the French border.

IT: Tientsin: horse->horse. Greece still founds a city in the south.

Turn 7 (210 BC) France is backward and lacks CoL and Literature. They have Monarchy. The galley now also spots yellow borders. Temple whipped in Nanking.

IT: Nanking: temple->market.

Turn 8 (190 BC) We meet Egypt. Also backward. The four civs that know Monotheism now al;so learned Feudalism. Deals were not possible, no money.

IT: We produced our first Ancient Cavalry. Shanghai has an empty army, which should be filled with AC's imho.

Turn 9 (170 BC) :sleep:

Turn 10 (150 BC) Temples whipped in Canton and Chengdu. America, Greece, Spain and India are advanced, Mongolia is equal and the rest is backward.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MIC2-150BCempire.jpg

I would love to play,but i suck.I've been checking the forums daily looking for someone to have an opening.If you guys are ok with a not so great player then I would really love to play.

A bit more info would be helpfull. Which level do you usually play at? Which is the highest level you surely beat?

A flip? :eek: I think I should have founded it a little further from Spain..

microbe - up
gozpel - on deck
grahamiam
Aggie
grs

@Slicknick1136, you should be fairly comfortable with emperor. This is more difficult than a normal emperor game. Have you played any SG before? If so I can then judge your level.

well,i dont think im the person your looking for.I play regent difficulty,i used to do up by emporer a while ago in march,but i stopped playing,i just installed it again a few days ago,only played a game or 2.Even back in march I never did a succession game.I really want to but no ones looking for a regent level player.I dont know how im suppossed to get better.(Self-esteem dropping to an unbelivible level)Im just joking around,no big deal,i was told that it would be a start to do the next SGOTM.So ill just wait a few weeks ai guess.

Yes, it's difficult to find a regent or monarch sg. You COULD start one up yourself :)

good idea,im sure some people wouldnt mind playing a lower difficulty.

Or you can look at this training game (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=81351).

Try to start one yourself might be a good idea too. For myself I also read a lot of SGs before I started playing.

I am looking for a regent/monarch difficulty game, so if you start one, I would definitely play.

A flip? :eek: I think I should have founded it a little further from Spain..

whipping that temple may have helped as well.

whipping that temple may have helped as well.

Well..it needed the culture (we saw that a turn later) and the city had no unhappy citizens at the moment.

EDIT: the only thing that helped the flip was the reduction of citizens after the whip. The same would have happened after completing a worker.

Number of our own citizens doesn't matter. What matters is the number of foreigners. Whipping the temple should have had no negative effect and definitely was a right call because it then increased our local culture vs the surrounding Spanish towns, which is another flip factor.

No worry though. We've got Zeus and I'll probably get some horses running. Next player or two should have some offense to use..

microbe is right. I just checked it in the flip calc and the flip chance was 10% in 10 turns...

EDIT: The flip chance for Chengdu is 6.7% in 10 turns. Xinjian has 7.7% flip chance in 10 turns. We could whip a temple for 2 citizens there...

sorry, wasn't clear or correct :) i though we could have whipped it 10 turns earlier but I was just looking at the maps, not the saves (end of my turns it was 21T till complete @ size 3). obviously, you whipped it at the perfect time (20 shields left) and the flip was just bad luck.

I can only play on weekends for the next 2 weeks, due to work commitments during the school holidays.

preturn: I double whip the temple in Xinjian. We definitely need some culture.

I switch Macao to rax.

(1)130BC: I know it's risky, but somehow I try to steal immediately from Greece by 500g plus change. Although it's close to us, it has no horses and is rated relatively weak. I normally wouldn't take the risk this early but I got irritated by the flip and kinda acted irrationally. We succeed and take Feudalism. :)

I then buy Monotheism from Mongols by Feudalism + 104g + 4gpt. We are level in tech except Monarch, which we can get it now.

OK, so we just need Republic and Chivalry.

We could actually take one incense back by aggressive settling, but we'll just take it THE WAY later.

IBT Spain starts Knight Templar. That's absolutely not good news to us..

(2)110BC: ZZZ

(3)90BC: I establish embassy with Spain. Madrid has two spears in capital, 12spt building KT due in 19 turns. It also has the Great Library and Colossus.

I'm wondering whether we can send an AC army to capture it. It's pretty close. :hmm:

(4)70BC: France entered Middle Ages as well.

I hire a scientist in Shanghai and lower sci to 0 while keeping lux at 10. Shanghai stops growing but it's producing 10spt as a 3-turn horseman factory. This way we make 14gpt more.

(5)50BC: Republic is known. America and Spain exchanged techs. We could use all our gpt to buy it, but then have no money to cover the anarchy, so I hold.

(6)30BC: Greece just got Chivalry, meaning we have some 2-fer chance.

54gpt to Spain for Republic+91g.
Republic to Greece for Chivalry+27g.

With 285g in bank I decide to revolt now.

We draw a freaking 7 turns! We need about 100g more.

I hire many taxmen and we lose -44gpt per turn. I sell Republic to India for Monarchy + 44g (all its gold). We should be OK then.

(7)10BC: riots.

(8)10AD: riots.

IBT Zeus still works in anarchy. Spain completes Sun Tzu's.

(9)30AD: I disband warrior in Mongol territory.

IBT Greece completes Knights Templar. :eek:

(10)50AD: a Spanish spear enters our territory. If you are bold you can try to ask it to leave.

We have 2 turns left in anarchy. 167g in bank and make -38gpt. Let the cities riot.

I think we should get Greece first, unless we can get Spain to declare us first. I expect those AIs have 2 spears in average and maybe plus an archer in their towns. We should have about 10 units before we declare. We already have 3 AC and 2 horsemen (mostly in Hangshow). We probably won't have too much gold for upgrading to riders due to the gpt payment, so we may just connect the iron and build riders directly. I'd rather the army to be filled by riders if possible. Delphi and Knossos would be the 2 target towns. Greece has no resources connected so the only counter will be archers.

Or, we just keep building riders and wait for the gpt payment to run out (in 16 turns) then we take on Spain to extort techs. Probably the safest approach.

Remember, our variant probably requires combat settlers. We need to set some cities up for this purpose.

microbe - just played
gozpel - skipped until further notice
grahamiam - up
Aggie - on deck
grs

Awesome steal ... risky, but nice it worked out. On our next target...
I think we should get Greece first, unless we can get Spain to declare us first. I expect those AIs have 2 spears in average and maybe plus an archer in their towns.
Greece will have hoplites not spears while Spain could upgrade to pikemen (but probably hasn't done with many yet). So we should expect 3 def. units in the cities. As we can build riders now, I would do so and wait till at least the army is filled with them.

ok, got it. nice turns :)

Preflight check: Cities rioting but stopping them will cause starvation. Just hope they don’t break the furniture. We could fit 1 more city south of Beijing at distance 4 (SE of the forest)

IBT: Damn, the mob in Shanghai destroyed the barracks :( ; Nanking riots; Spanish are building Sistines

T1: 70AD I MM Shanghai to stop the riot. We’ll lose 1 citizen but I don’t want them to destroy the market as well.

IBT: Shanghai starves but no more furniture will break.

T2: 90AD Move galley and workers; I have to force Shanghai to riot again as it would have dropped to pop 5.

IBT: Shanghai riots and we become a republic; Egypt completes the Great Lighthouse

T3: 110AD Need to bump lux tax up to 20% to keep Beijing and Shanghai from starving. We now may +12gpt with 0% research. We don’t have anyone near the Iron so no riders are able to be started. No deals available atm

IBT: Beijing horseman -> settler; SoZ makes and AC; Shanghai makes a horseman -> barracks

T4: 130AD worker finishes roading extra ivory and moves to the iron. Spain will give us gpt for ivory but I hold off as I think we want to attack them in the next set.

IBT: Macao worker -> horseman

T5: 150AD Disband a warrior in Nanking

Shanghai barracks -> temple (to help with the happiness issue there)

T6: 170AD Move some more workers

Canton worker -> market; Greeks are building Sistine’s

T7: 190AD A bunch of civ’s are up Theology now. No one has engineering.

IBT: Beijing settler -> horseman; Tatung harbor -> temple

T8: 210AD Move worker movement

IBT: Iron near Tatung connected; SoZ -> AC; Xinjian horseman -> market; Chengdu barracks -> pike; Tientsin horseman -> rider

T9: 230AD Switch Beijing to a rider

T10: 250AD Found Chinan S of Beijing -> temple

There a reg archer in Canton that should be disbanded. We can get 7gpt and 17g from Spain atm for ivory. We cannot trade with anyone else. Riders are being build but none will come online very soon.

We are paying 40gpt for troop support atm but I really can’t see anywhere we can cutback. As the horseman and riders come online, reduce our archer count.

If we go after Greece, we will definitely need combat settlers to grab Athens. WW will be a problem fast since we can barely keep people happy with our current economy. Hopefully, the markets will fix that. Good luck.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MIC2-250AD.JPG

Hmm, I actually didn't know that rioting would cause loss of improvements. I think during my turns maybe we lost something else too. Maybe granary? Not sure about that. :(

Anyway, we are now Republic and we need those towns to grow.

I wouldn't worry about Athens right now. I'd like take the two eastern towns in the first war, then go after Spain. Take a couple towns, sue for peace, and come back. It seems to be the best approach.

microbe
gozpel
grahamiam
Aggie - up
grs - on deck

Up already??? I can't play before tomorrow.

Yes you were swapped with grs and then gozpel couldn't play, so it comes back fast..

Take your time. We are at a crucial time so we shouldn't rush things.

Hmm, I actually didn't know that rioting would cause loss of improvements. I think during my turns maybe we lost something else too. Maybe granary? Not sure about that.

It often does after more than 1 turn of riot in the same city. Speaks good about your riot control you never experienced it before :)

Up already??? I can't play before tomorrow.
No problem with me, I can't play before Friday or Saturday anyways. We have a fine speed though.

I wouldn't worry about Athens right now. I'd like take the two eastern towns in the first war, then go after Spain. Take a couple towns, sue for peace, and come back. It seems to be the best approach.

i agree. take those 2 towns to our NE then sue for peace and hook up lux. we may want the town to our south just because we can get it (MGL hunting). while hooking up the lux, take the spanish towns west and SW of us to gain the incense and an extra fur. everything will definitely be helped by our GA so I expect this game to quickly turn on it's ear soon :)

IHT: We need more troops and commerce. I guess that will be the thing I have to concentrate on...

Turn 1 (260 AD) :sleep:

IT: Shanghai: temple->rider.

Turn 2 (270 AD) :sleep:

IT: Anyang: temple->courthouse.

Turn 3 (280 AD) :sleep:

IT: Nanking: market->Forbidden Palace.

Turn 4, 5 (290, 300 AD) I send our AC's to the future war area.

IT: Spain starts Copernicus.

Turn 6 (310 AD) We get our 54 gpt payment back and now make 85 gpt. I buy Engineering from Mongolia for 46 gpt. Engineering and 6 gpt gives me Theology from India.
Only Egypt and France don't know Education.

Turn 7 (320 AD) A few more troops move towards Greece.

IT: Beijing, Tientsin: rider->rider.

Turn 8 (330 AD) One more rider and we are ready to go :)

IT: Shanghai: Rider->rider, Chengdu: pike->courthouse, Hangchow: market->barracks. Spain satrs Bach.

Turn 9 (340 AD) The rider-army is ready and moves to Knossos.

IT: I let Hangchow riot :(

Turn 10 (350 AD) Greece doesn't want to pay Education for peace. So I declare war.

Knossos:
-Rider army kills a reg hoplite, taking only one HP. We are in the Golden Age [party]
-Rider army takes out a second and 3rd hoplite losing 1 HP both times and we take Knossos.

Delhpi:
-5 HP vet AC takes out a reg hoplite and promotes
-5 HP vet AC takes out a reg hoplite, losing 2 HP's and promotes

We make 110 gpt in our GA. We may want to abandon Knossos next turn, after taking the city in the fog, NE of Knossos. We also should take Mycenae.





http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MIC2greecewar.jpg

Got it, will probably play tomorrow, maybe tonight. Do we really have to fear flips that much that we want to abandon so close to our territory?

I think so. Size-6 is pretty dangerous. But you can try flip calculator and see what it does. By all means only put junk units in it if you want to keep it, and starve it down.

Again, we need some settler factory going..

microbe - on deck
gozpel
grahamiam
Aggie
grs - up

Sorry, I'll have to delay till tomorrow. Will play in about 12 hours. So you get a chance to give me tons of good advice :) Sorry for the delay, but my workday was too long to play a decent game now.

That's OK. Thanks for the update.

This is a break for discussion after 6 turns!

PreTurn: I fiddle around a bit with the lux and specialists, but come to the conclusion it's best as it is, but Tatung, which makes +5fpt while being size 6 and without an aqeduct - mm to temple in 6 at no growth, wake a garrisoned horse and upgrade it and wake an ancient cavalry; I am not that sure with the zero research we are running, move some archers to Knossos - want to keep it and will do my best to do so.
IBT: we can build The Heroic Epic, order restored in Canton, 2 resisters in Knossos quelled - now it riots
360ad: capture 3 slaves, move troops and upgrade a horse
IBT: Isabella demands our ivory - I give in, Hanchow barracks-rider, quell all but the last resister in Knossos, starve it down
370ad: kill a Greek archer; city in the fog is Sparta - size 10, rider army attacks, kill 3 hoplites and captures it - :eek: that was easier that I thought; switch our top shield producer Shanghai to The Heroic Epic - due in 9
IBT: Bejing rider-settler; 3 resisters in Sparta quelled - it riots, starvation at Knossos; Ghandi builds an embassy at Beijing
380ad: upgrade a horse; nothing special (AC is of very limited use to us in mountains :( )
IBT: Greeks land an archer near Anyang, resistance in Knossos ends; it is starved down to 3 now, Sparta down to 1 resister - riots now; we get an AC
390ad: kill 2 hoplites at Mycenae and keep it at size 1 - netting us 2 slaves; AC kills Greek archer; peace made with Alexander for Education - nothing more to get from him; Spain is next; silks colony built - many taxmen fired
IBT: Beijing settler-rider; resistance in Sparta ends; Tietsin rider-rider resistance in Mycenae ends; Americans start Bach's
400ad: troop movement towards Spain
IBT: Starvation at Sparta, risistance in Delphi ends; Tatung temple-aqueduct
410ad troop movement

We now could attack Spain next or 2nd next turn. If all goes well - we could take 4 cities in the first attack wave. Then continue towards Toledo, Salamanca and Madrid. There's nothing worthwhile to do but attack and this will stay for the rest of the game, I would get rolling and the extort for peace. Normally a no-brained, imho, but I had to give in to a demand for ivory so we have a 15 turns rest of a deal with Spain. If this would not be a SG I'd break it - I don't think gpt deals are important for us anymore; but as it is, this is a one-way-deceision.


Some input please.

I strongly object to an attack now, while we are giving ivory.

A bit of reasoning would be nice :)
It's nothing in the rules about not breaking deals, especially since this was rather a demand than a deal. If it's a strategical decesion, I'd really like some details.

Well, our rep will be broken and I always put reputation first. I know that we can win easily with a broken rep, but it's totally against my playing style.

damaging our rep deliberately is against my play style as well.

the only thing i'm hedging on is the fact that is was demanded from us rather than a trade we instigated. spain deserves a bloody nose for pulling that on us during our golden age. if we wait, then we'll be taking on the 2000kg gorilla without the aid of our GA shield boost but with a much larger force than we have now. a very tough call. if we didn't have education, it would be a no brainer (GLib tech boost). what other wonders does she have? maybe those benefits outweigh the damage to our rep.

She has the Colossus and the Great Library in Madrid (not much worth imho), Sun Tsu's in Barcelona (which is probably a bit nw or w of Madrid) and is building Sistine, Copernikus and Bach's. Sun Tzu's would be an awesome gain in a waring game on a pangea - if we can reach Barcelona.

This is in my second post: Basic rule: no exploits and cherish your rep.

What it means is that if we owe per-turn payment (including resources) to others, we cannot declare war. The game doesn't distinguish between whether this was a demand or not, so we have to wait until it expires. You can lure it into declaring war itself by means like asking it to leave, but I doubt it will do so.

We can build more riders and give more damage to Spain in the end. Maybe capture its capital.

...continued after discussion

IBT: Knossos worker-temple; Chinan temple-barracks; Mongols start Bach's
420ad: Tatung rushes a settler to fill the gap se of Sparta
IBT: Delphi worker-galley; Shatung temple-barracks; Tatung settler-aqueduct; French start Sistine; Spanish Magellan's
430ad: rush a settler in Sparta (to fill another gap and to lose greek pop there); last horse upgraded
IBT: Abe offers trade wines for Ivory +8gpt - we settle for 7gpt +2gold; Mongols ask us to leave their waters - we lie about leaving (hope that's allowed ;)); Sparta settler-temple, we get another AC; Xinjian market-courthouse; Chengdu court-market; Anyang court-harbour; Egypt starts Sistine
440ad: nothing special - keep lux at 10% to avoid clowns
IBT: Canton market-court; Hangchow rider-rider, Macao rider-rider; Chinan barracks-rider; Greeks build Bach's
450ad: Kaifeng founded nw of a volcano near Buffalo

We can run zero lux now with one clown in Tietsn, but it won't grow - maybe rush a temple or market there (cant trade for more luxuries). Most AI but France and Egypt are 4 techs ahead, but we will get them all from Spain in 11 turns.

Got it. The plan is to capture the Spanish capital and get techs from GLib. But it will be the next player.

microbe - up
gozpel - on deck (?)
grahamiam
Aggie
grs

Oh my, I just found we have got Education! :mad:

This screwed all my plan. We will not get anything from GLib now. :( Looks like I have more things to do during my turns, however.

We have it long since Aggies last turns (maybe 15) - as grahamian pointed out above. I am sorry if I left the game in a pity state, but please tell me more, so I can do better next time.

We have it long since Aggies last turns (maybe 15) - as grahamian pointed out above. I am sorry if I left the game in a pity state, but please tell me more, so I can do better next time.

You got Education for peace ;)

That's kind of stupid in retrospect - I just took what was there :(

We will conquer the world anyway :hammer:

grs, don't worry. I was not mad at you, just at the situation. :)

We didn't make the GLib plan very clear. I did mention it somewhat in my previous turnlog but we never officially formed a team plan for that.

This will make the game more interesting, so probably a good thing.

mircobe: thanks for cheering me up :goodjob: - could have seen it anyways, even if it was not spoken out. Still think Gozpel or Grahamian get us the techs by pointy-stick-diplo though. We could be up par then again.

preturn: I move spear from Sparta to Kaifeng. We should avoid leaving empty towns.

I switch Chinan and Tientsin to marketplace. During our GA we need some infra push.

I cancel galley in Delphi - this is a pangea map, we don't need it.

Also switch Sparta to worker.

Everything else looks good.

Start min on Invention. It's rather weird in this game that AI all go for the upper branch. This is very good news for a warmonger. :)

(1)460AD: I start pikes in Beijing. We need to cover our empty towns.

IBT Mongols demand TM. I give to him.

Spain starts Smith's. :lol:

(2)470AD: We found Ningpo. Start on a worker.

IBT FP completed!

(3)480AD: Spain has Invention. OK time for a..immediate steal on Spain. Before that I demand Invention from her, of course she refused. But we succeed anyway with 834g.

Mongols get invention too..
Invention+WM+27g to India for Banking.
Invention+silks+2gpt+198g to America for Astronomy.
Astronomy to Greece for Music Theory + 2gpt + 28g. Note this doesn't mean we are tied in 20-turn peace as we do not owe gpt payment.

I don't know why AI haven't traded contacts around..

(4)490AD: ZZZ

(5)500AD: I start banks in our capital and FP city.

(6)510AD: Egypt has Printing Press while still lacks Engineering! Seems upper brach is really attractive. I get it plus 17g by Astronomy.

Finally I know why I couldn't see AI full contact: we don't have all the embassies. But I'll save the gold instead.

(7)520AD: Spain has Gunpowder. This is bad news.

IBT India completes Sistine Chapel.

(8)530AD: Our economy is strong: 301gpt.

(9)540AD: Establish embassy with America. It's size-12 with 19spt, 5 pikes inside. Has iron/horses. JS bach's in 16 turns. It has 5 lux.

(10)550AD: I rush a settler from Sparta. Upgrade two spear to pike.

We can declare on Spain next turn. We have lots of riders and ACs in and around Xinjian, Shanghai, Chengdu and Nanking.

One thing I failed to do is building settlers. I only rushed one in my last turn, which is in the north, and another settler due in 2 turns in Xinjian (you can rush). grs left one settler too. I suggest we raze Seville, take Tsingtao so we can capture Toledo next turn, and abandon Tsingtao afterwards. Then use the settler to reach the capital. I suggest we raze the capital unless it builds a useful wonder like Leo's for us.

In any case put as many units as possible in the first turn in captured cities, and only put 1 unit after that. Raze/replace eventually. Spain culture is pretty high.

There is no nice settler factory so we probably have to squeeze one here and there. For example, Shantung and Xinjian can switch to settler now. With more cities captured things might be better.

Now who is going to have the fun? :hammer:

microbe
gozpel - are you able to play? This turn will be a lot of fun!
grahamiam - on deck, and take it in 24 hours if gozpel doesn't respond
Aggie
grs

I want this!

I played 3 turnsets in different SG's today already, so one more won't hurt :)

And I got it.

ok, let's do an over/under on the number of cities gozpel takes.

the number is 7.5 (so no ties)

i take the over :)

I'd take the under.

Not that I don't think we could take more, but we have very few settlers to claim the razed cities and also very few pikes to defend them. I would say 6 is the optimal.

Pre-turn - Fix some minor stuff in cities. I have to wait a turn before I can declare.

560AD - Cool, I got half a turn of Golden Age and it's over. Nevermind, the real GA starts now :)

Try to extort Gunpowder from Isabella, she refuses and I declare war.

Rider army kill 2 pikes and take Tsingtao.

We kill 3 pikes, a knight and a MI in Salamanca, losing no units as they reteat nicely for once. Take the city with 2 slaves.

We take Seville, lose one rider and kill off 3 pikes.

Take Zaragoza, kill 2 pikes, lose none.

Murcia is a tougher nut, lose 2 AC, but kill 2 pikes. There's 2 LB's and a couple pikes in the city.

570AD - IT - Spain elegantly kill off 2 riders and an AC.

Tatung aqueduct -> barracks.
Hangchow aqueduct -> rider.

Kill all spanish troops in Murcia (2 LB's and 3 pikes) and take the city, togehter with 3 slaves.

Remove 5 interfering enemies from the map.

580AD - Not much, except killing 5 units and healing riders. AC's are pretty useless after all.

590AD - Shanghai rider -> rider
Xinjian settler -> rider

Paoting founded -> worker

No enemy units around this turn, setting up for assault on Toledo next turn.

600AD - IT - A LB kills a rider on a mountain, very realistic.

Beijing bank -> rider
Salamanca worker -> temple
Tsingtao worker -> temple

A super-pike in Toledo takes off 11 of 13hp of the army before he dies.
A rider dies as we kill 3 pikes and take the city, with 3 slaves.

Steal Democracy from India for 900g and sell it to Mongols for Gunpowder, 12gpt and some change plus WM.

We have unconnected Saltpeter outside Delphi and another source outside Salamnca's borders.

Spend 1000 gold to rush riders.

610AD - Nanking bank -> rider
Tatung barracks -> rider
Anyang Market -> barracks

We build 7 riders

Rush temple in Salamanca

Set up assault on Madrid. They have no saltpeter yet, so I better move quickly.

620AD - Salamance temple -> court
Murcia barracks -> rider
Zaragoza worker -> worker
Macao market -> rider

We kill 6 annoying pikes and lose 2 riders, but we take Madrid.

Spain knows Chemistry.

630AD - Nothing really. Egypt lands an archer next to Madrid for some reason, is he able to kill our 15 riders and AC's?

Can't be patient, attack Barcelona with the army and kill 2 pikes
Kill another couple of pikes and lose one rider. We take the city with Sun Tzu'S!

640AD - We renew wines deal with America for 2 luxes, 9gpt and 132g and exchange WM's at the same time.

The egyptian archer scurried out of our territory.

Yangchow founded -> worker

We take Detroit.

650AD - Egypt move in 5 units next to Detroit.

I steal Chemistry from Mongols after establishing embassy.

We take Santiago, killing 3 pikes and a longbow, lose an elite rider. 2 slaves.

We take Vitoria, killing 4 pikes and lose one rider.

Spain has 2 cities left.

Egypt is up to something.

We should research now so we get Cavs asap.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/micmap650ad.jpg

I'm glad I didn't have to attack against muskets, those damn pikes were tough enough.

I think I took 11 cities and we have to take the 2 last cities right away to avoid flips.

But Egypt might put a spanner in the work, they have lots of units by Detroit.

Nice work! Seems our variant rules were too easy for you. :) With only 2 cities left I'd wipe out Spain completely. Rush settler from those cities would help too.

Remember no attack from AI territory.

microbe
gozpel - just took 11 cities
grahamiam - up
Aggie - on deck
grs

haha, always take the over with gozpel, especially when playing emperor ;)

i got it but I won't play till tomorrow. i stained our deck today in the hot sun and only have enough brain power for 1 tonight.

Nice work! Seems our variant rules were too easy for you. :) With only 2 cities left I'd wipe out Spain completely. Rush settler from those cities would help too.

But according to the rules grahamian has to do it next turn?

Yes, make the rule clear:

The turn we declare war is the turn 1. At end of turn 10 (or later) we have to make peace if the AI agrees to pay us.

Gozpel declared at his first turn, so we have to accept peace offer next turn.

Thanks for reminding us.

Then we can turn to Greece, if Egypt turns out to be a good AI.

So we don't have to make peace unless they come with an offer? I am sure that they want to pay for peace should we contact them.

No we have to contact them ourselves.

Then grahamian must make sure that we don't have to contact them and kill them next turn?

Aggie: no, if I understand it correct, we have to ask Spain if it wants to pay for peace - which is sure they will - and take what they give to make peace. Looking at the save its improbable if not impossible to capture Pamplona and Valencia in the next turn. So we have to face a period of hughe cultural pressure on the taken cities for at least 20 turns.
The Egypt stack near Detroit really looks suspicious. We should ask them to leave and have them declare before they do in their turns and get initiative. We'd either need a ROP with France or delcare in them too and France has a really ugly mountain ridge to cross.

I'm only asking to get things 100% clear and there was still room for different explanations of the rules :)

Anyway, we indeed should look at what Egypt wants with us. Demanding them to leave is the logical thing to do.

By the way grs: I don't see cultural overlap with Spain. That cultural pressure shouldn't be too bad.

If I use the FlipCalc correctly I get about 5,5% for Madrid and Barcelona and 14,5% for Vitoria. Sure we can starve them down, but Spain has about 5 times our total culture - that's what worries me a bit because we will not be allowed to recapture! That makes it a hard deceision to garrison or not.

ok, to be 100% clear, i want to confirm that i must offer Spain peace by end of turn date 660AD.

In fact, you have to make peace at the end of 650AD, since that's the 10th turn. But I guess at the beginning of 660AD is also OK?

We should abandon some of the big cities and replace them.

thanks. i wasn't counting 560AD as turn 1 but was just adding 10 to the date. i will offer peace before hitting space.

Preflight check: Set research to 90% (-21gpt) for Metal in 7T.

Investigate peace with Spain. She has Metallurgy but will not give it up for peace & 1231g. Instead, I get Economics, Navigation, and 84g.

Build an Embassy in Thebes to see what the Egyptians have in case they go after us. Thebes is 2T from Copenicus but they only have horses, no iron. Her closest iron is the French city of Chartres. She is also not at war with anyone atm.

Trades: Greece: WM & 42g for our WM;

Egypts forces are meager (2 horseman and 3 archers with 3 more archers on the way). However, conquering their land will mean an amphibious landing due to their lousy terrain. I decide to wait to see if they are just passing thru or want to rumble.

IBT: Egypt declares war; Near Detroit: 1 Horseman dies attacking our Rider, promoting it; 1 archer dies attacking our AC on a hill nearby, another forces the AC to retreat.
Greeks are building Magellans; Spanish building Bach’s; Salamanca’s borders expand, giving us salt.

T1: 660AD Elite AC kills an Archer in No-Man’s land in the center of old Spain, netting us a MGL Sun Tzu. He runs back to Toledo to form a Rider Army. New Beijing founded S of Greek border in the spot he was located.
Detroit: Elite AC kills an archer (5/6); Elite Rider kills an archer; Reg rider kills a horse, promoting to elite (4/4)
There’s a settler SE of Murcia probably there to claim the iron but I rush the Temple in Mycenae for 20g instead to fill in that border.
Elite AC from Santiago kills an Archer; Elite Rider from Barcelona kills an archer.

I sign an RoP with Spain as well as sell her Ivory for 8gpt. This puts El-Amarna within our reach.

Upgrade the spear near our silks to a Pike.

IBT: Santiago flips to Spain, taking 1 2/5 rider with it. Egypt finishes Copernicus; Indian’s building Bach’s and Smith’s and Leonardo’s. American’s building Smith’s; Spanish building Smith’s

T2: 670AD Elite rider dies to War Chariot?; vet rider kills WC; vet rider kills longbow; elite AC kills ¼ WC. Move all Riders out of Victoria into position to take El-Armarna next turn. Hurry settler in Madrid and Victoria

T3: 680AD Attack on El-Amarna: Army kills spear; vet Rider retreats; vet Rider kills spear and we take the city + 3 workers

Moving troops up to the Greek border as this Egyptian war seems to be pretty useless. Most of their lower cities will be blocked by terrain.

T4: 690AD move some more units towards the Greek front

T5: 700AD ditto. A lot of civ’s know Free Artistry

T6: 710AD Move and road @ the Greek front; Peace with Egypt and they pay us 36g.

IBT: Metal -> MT 8T @ 90% (-24gpt); SoZ obsolete but so are the AC’s

T7: 720AD Move all Riders out of El-Amarna since the resistance has ended. Leave an AC behind to keep an eye on things.

IBT: America completes Bach’s

T8: 730AD Continue improving around Greek border. Greeks have muskets so I’m not sure if we want to wait for cav (6T)

IBT: Greek City of Corinth (within strike range) completes Leonardo’s Workshop

T9: 740AD

IBT: El-Amarna flips to the Spanish, costing us 1 AC and our last dye
T10: 750AD Move some more around.

We are pretty much ready to start taking Greek towns. I’m annoyed with the flips but, due to the lack of culture, I can see why they are happening. Well, press on and good luck :)

Flips are annoying, but we'll completely destroy Spain in 10 turns anyway. :)

Not sure about Egypt, but Greece has a lux that we might need..

microbe
gozpel
grahamiam
Aggie - up
grs - on deck

Leo's will just come in time with military tradition - nice!

Got it. I will play now.

IHT: I declare war on Greece. Three riders manage to take Corinth and Leo. That's why I keep the city. Three other riders take Argos. Greece may fall soon. I'm keeping this city as well.

IT: The Greeks kill one rider and take a few crusaders out of Athens.

Turn 1 (760 AD) I HAVE NEVER SEEN THIS BEFORE :eek: One rider is enough to take Athens and the Knight's templar!!
Two riders are killed, but we take out three crusaders. Three riders take Pharsalos. Greece is OCC.

Turn 2 (770 AD) Two rider armies are needed to take Thermopylae. Renamed to Aggieville :p :

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MIC2-770ADGreecegone.JPG

Hmmmm :( We have deals with America. Seems like I have to be a peaceful builder for the rest of my turns :cry:

Turn 3 (780 AD) Science to 30%, Military Tradition still in 1.

IT: Military Tradition is in. Physics in 5 at 100% science. The AI is not far advanced.

Turn 4 (790 AD) Nanking switched to Military Academy. I upgrade 13 riders to Cavalry for 270 gold. Due to Leo.

IT: The Mongols demand furs and I decline. They declare war. This will be a phoney one, too far away. They finish Shakespeare.
India finishes Smith.

Turn 5 (800 AD) We get our first Crusader.

Turn 6 (810 AD) :sleep:

Turn 7 (820 AD) Science to 80%, physics in 1.

Turn 8 (830 AD) Physics is in, at 100% science ToG in 6. We are tech leaders.

IT: We end a gpt deal with America. 3 Mongol UU's near our lands. Spain finishes Magellan.

Turn 9 (840 AD) We kill the Mongol Keshiks.

IT: The Mongols send 8 new Keshiks.

Turn 10 (850 AD) We can attack America now and Spain next turn. The Mongol Keshiks are a bother though.

I like Aggieville better than Thermopylae ;) remind me to set you up again for the next go 'round, excellant work! :hammer:

Got it! I will play in about 48 hours from now.

Just a proposal to think about:
We could get Abe into an alliance vs. the Mongols and meanwhile remove Spain (deals run out next turn). Let Abe fight the Keshiks.
On research I guess we will dash to steam power and shut if off completely then, k?

We will kill Spain in two turns and Abe would be next. I would make peace with the Mongols asap and choose Abe as our next target (after Spain).

We will kill Spain in two turns and Abe would be next. I would make peace with the Mongols asap and choose Abe as our next target (after Spain).
i agree. kill off spain and then america. should be quick with cav and allow us to expand nicely. i have a feeling america will fold quickly as well so we might as well expand thru india(?) too as i believe the terrain starts to become ideal for us up there.

peace with the mongols sooner rather than later will allow us to declare war on them once we're done with america and india.

Ok, you are right. MA with Abe would just slow us down, so I'll hold off the Keshiks and then make peace with Temujin.

a 3-turn war huh? A perfect demostration of "lightning". :goodjob:

Note, MA and MPP are forbidden, due to the 10-turn war rule.

microbe - on deck
gozpel -
grahamiam -
Aggie - just played
grs - up

Sorry, but the power supply on my computer broke and the old notbook I am writing on now wont do, so I wont be able to play tonight. I will have a running machine tomorrow and can play then. So either you have to wait one day more or swap/skip me.

Tomorrow is OK.

Got a new power supply and my machine is up and running. I started playing and will finish tonite. Just a quick report: one turn before their elimination the Spanish built a city on a far away isle :( Think we can get them in our ten turns though.

IBT: Mongols keshiks kill 2 wounded cavalries; peace with Isabella runs out
860AD: war declared on Spain; El Amarna, Santiago and Valencia taken; great leader Quialon rises and forms an army; we now own dyes; Mongols wont talk - kill 5 Keshiks
IBT: Mongols kill a cavalry and a crusader, we now can build The Pentagon; Spain settles on far southeast isle :(
870AD: Pamplona taken, we own Magellan's Voyage; Mongols still won't talk - we kill 3 Keshiks; we rush a caravel
IBT: we learn theory of gravity
880AD: Mongols give peace for 3gpt; workers are moved to the front; towns are built to fill gaps and to get better attack positions
IBT: nothing
890AD: caravel is on its way to Santander
IBT: nothing
900AD: AC is used to run around an quell resisters, I am still confident to hold all Spain cities till we can raze Santander
IBT: nothing
910AD: more troop movement - we are ready for America soon
IBT: nothing
920AD: we land at Santander; war with Abe: raze Buffalo, Chicagoa and Huston - start to resettle
IBT: we lose two cavalries and kill a knight; magnetism researched - we enter the industrial ages
930AB: we raze Santander and remove Spain from the game; we raze Boston and get Seatle down to one archer
IBT: nothing
940AD: we raze Miami and Seattle
IBT: nothing
950AD: movement

America is down to 3 cities on the mainland and 3 other on an isle southeast. We have 3 cavalries on that isle. In theory it might be possible to completely destroy them in our 10 turns - though it will be close I would definetly go for it. We have a second caravel in Tatung, but no troops near (I could not spare any). I built as many settlers as I could in the north to resettle, you will find 3 or 4 of them left. I did not start The Pentagon - another army might be more usefull (with the added movement point they are really a great help in this variant). Abe has no troops left to counter.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/mic2-950ad.jpg

Good job grs :)

preturn: we are really stretched too much..too many towns are empty. We should stop research after Steam and use the gold to rush units.

IBT American knight loses to our cav.

(1)960AD: Single cav autorazes America. 5 cavs attack Washington, 3 win and two retreat. Still at least two musket in it.

IBT American knight loses to our cav again.

(2)970AD: Rider army kills two musket and we capture Washington. We now control JS Bach's.

IBT we lose a couple workers to American cav. Military Academy completed.

(3)980AD: AC kills cav and promotes. Autoraze Baltimore.

(4)990AD: Cav army and an elite cav capture San Francisco. Rider army and an elite cav capture Atlanta but we lose an elite cav. America is OCC.

Move units toward India territory. It has Nationalism!

(5)1000AD: Autoraze New Orlean, America is destroyed.

(6)1010AD: trade TM with India. Rush two musketmen.

(7)1020AD: I start min research on Medicine.

(8)1030AD: Rush two more musket and a temple.

(9)1040AD: I declare on India.

There are a lot of rifles in Madras. We lose 3 cavs, retreat 5, but kill 4 rifles and an MDI then capture it. So much for this turn.

(10)1050AD: I abandon Madras and found New Chinan to replace it. It's mostly a healing turn.

I left some money to the next player. I suggest we rush some cavs in the front cities.

Note:

Rifles are quite tough. I doubt we can get rid of India within 10 turns. India has almost 3 times our culture so we need to raze its cities.

During the play I met one problem: are we allowed to found cities inside AI territory? I didn't do it, as I think it would make the variant less relevant, because then you can move cavs next to AI city and just settle there and attack. What do you think?

Also, when we get another leader, I'd suggest using it to rush Pentagon, so we could load cavs into the rider armies. A healthy rider army isn't safe to attack fortified rifiel in a big city.

We have a caraval in the north that can pick up a settler and send it to the island to settle.

Roster:
microbe -
gozpel - up
grahamiam - on deck
Aggie -
grs -

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/MIC2-1050AD.jpg

Very nice microbe!

I dont think we are allowed to found inside. I just founded the towns directly on the border to the AI, but never inside and think that is closest we should do.

Edit: If you try to destroy India, don't forget the Indian town on the small isle, the cavalry should still be there.

Is this game still running? We are already on the finish lane. Gozpel should be up, IIRC.

i probably can't play till tomorrow night (gotta finish digging a ditch and tree planting) so, imho, gozpel can have 1 more day if he wishes.

Take it when you have time.

I'm up everywhere, can you take this one grahamiam and I play after you?

i'll try to do it tonight as i'll probably be up in a couple tomorrow. due to rain, the shovel and pick had to rest for the afternoon so i should be able to give this a good shot.

making progress (Karachi and Lahore razed, Dehli down but not out) but out of time tonight. will continue tomorrow night.

Preflight check: war started in 1040AD so I will declare peace on or before 1130AD.
We have 1158g and make +676gpt so I’m gonna rush granaries/muskets to speed the cav builds. We only have 22 right now and probably could use about 10 more very quickly. I also rush 3 of the cheaper temples. I really need cities up to 20spt for this to work well so I will focus on getting the core RR’d as well as lines to the front.

Find some fortified workers around Beijing. Wake them and start building RR’s on the BG’s there.

Wake an elite Cav in New Chinan and kill the longbow next to the city with an elite cav (3/5). No MGL.

We are at 34% land and 54% pop.

IBT: a stack of 2 indian rifles and 2 mdi move between New Shan and New Chinan; 2 cav’s are completed.

T1: 1060AD Cannon misses Indian rifle outside New Chinan; Take Indian town of Jaipur with an elite cav., getting 3 more workers. New Chinan’s cav’s are very hurt so I won’t instigate from there and our cav corps are very thing so I’ll hold tight this turn.

Find a caravel in Tatung and send it to gather our long lost cav on the mongol island to the East.

Leader hunting: Attack Indian stack with healthy rider army in New Shan., killing both rifles (7/14). Use the elite AC in New Shan to attack the reg MDI and it redlines it but then loses 6 straight and promoting the MDI (2/4); elite cav from New Chinan attacks MDI and kills it (3/5); another elite cav attacks 2/4 MDI and kills it.

rush a temple in San Fran to try to pinch some resourses

IBT: 7 new cav complete, Indian rifle near New Chinan moves onto our iron.

T2: 1070AD Near New Chinan: cannon misses rifle.
Attack on Karachi: Cav army kills vet rifle (8/14); vet cav kills reg rifle (2/4); vet cav retreats from vet rifle (2/3); vet cav retreats from reg rifle (2/3); vet cav kills 2/3 rifle (2/4); vet cav retreats from 2/3 rifle; vet cav kills 2/3 rifle and promots (2/5); vet cav kills MDI flawlessly; elite cav kills longbow and we take the city + 2 slaves
Move settler and Crusader from New Chinan up and will have to settle NE of Karachi to get access to Lahore.

Elite cav kills a longbow outside New Chinan.

Rush the army in Nanking for 934g.

Pick up 2 cav and a worker from the island.

IBT: Indian rifle pillages the iron near New Chinan, not that we really care.


T3: 1080AD Sell improvements and abandon Karachi, found New Kaifeng. Notice that the Mongols have moved a nice sized SoD to their wines, east of Washington. Load 3 vet cav’s into our new army and move it N.

IBT: a war elephant cruises S from Dehli. Mongols re-up peace treaty which I reluctantly accept. In a separate deal, I sell them spices for WM, 8gpt, and 2g. In a 3rd deal, I sell them Ivory for 9gpt.

T4: 1090AD Attack on Lehore: Cav Army kills 2 rifles (8/14); vet cav retreats from rifle; vet cav kills elephant; Army kills 2/3 rifle (5/14) and we take the city.

Attack on Dehli: cav army kills 2 rifles (11/13); vet cav dies to rifle (2/4); vet cav retreats from rifle (3/4); vet cav retreats to rifle (2/4); vet cav retreats to rifle (3/4); vet cav redlines but dies to rifle; vet cav redlines but dies to rifle; vet cav retreats from rifle (2/3); vet cav dies to rifle (2/3); vet cav dies to rifle and promotes it (3/4); elite cav retreats from rifle (2/3); elite cav kills ¾ rifle; elite cav kills elephant (2/5); elite cav kills 2/3 rifle; Rider Army kills 2/3 rifle; Rider Army kills 2/3 rifle; 2/4 rifle left on top. Attack stalls.

Near New Kaifeng: ¾ cav kills longbow flawlessly and promotes
Near New Chinan: Rider Army kills War Elephant

IBT: Egypt and India sign a trade embargo against us. Indian request an audience and offer 20gpt + 79g for peace but I tell them to hold that thought. Didn’t look like any reinforcements made it to Dehli. Palace gets a west wing. Rut-row, volcano next to Knossos becomes active and starts smoking.

T5: 1100AD Attack on Dehli: Cav army kills a rifle but is hurt very badly and loses 10hp (1/13); vet cav redlines but dies to vet rifle; vet cav retreats; elite cav redlines but dies to vet rifle; elite cav dies to rifle; RR