Nations:
Japan (The Team)
Korea
China
Portugal
Spain
England
Netherlands
Aztecs

Barbarians: RAGING.
Climate: NORMAL.
LandForm: ARCHIPELAGO.
Map Size: STANDARD.
Ocean Coverage: 60%.
Temperature: COOL.
World Age: 3 BILLION YEARS.
World seed: 42776459

Variant Rules:

Arathorn's Defiant Variant with the added requirement of only Despotism, Feudalism, and Fascism for governments.


Defiant Variant: You must never give in to a demand from an opponent, that is, you always reject demands for tribute. You may never ally, sign a Right of Passage, MPP, or embargo with another civilization. You may never pay for peace (a peace treaty must either be straight-up or the opponent gives a concession to you. A deal where a tech costs 20 gpt normally and you pay 10 gpt for that tech as part of a peace treaty is fine). Any troops on your soil must be given a boot order every turn. No capturing foreign cities or demanding them in diplomacy. No foreign workers merged into existing cities. If an AI razes one of your cities, that civ must be eliminated.



Roster Complete

SesnOfWthr
Sir Bugsy
DeceasedHorse
SirLenTaft
Bede
scoutsout

Start Position:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02TheStart.SAV

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02TheStart.jpg

Strict 24hrs to post got it/24hrs from got it to post log and save/48hrs total. All requests for skips automatically honored. (Please include an order of go at the end of your turnlog).

Thanks to LKendter for developing definitive rules of non-exploitative play:


The following tactics are PROHIBITED:

RoP Rape - if you have to ask...

RoP Abuse that includes things such as irrigating all tiles with a city building wonders, denying resources with a RoP, putting a unit to block a land bridge, etc.

Scout resource denial - parking a scout on a resource, as the AI won't ask scouts to leave. The same scenario also applies to workers.

False Peace Treaties (must wait for the 20 years to end).

The negative science exploit - you can run a huge deficit (-250 / turn) of negative cash with a token penalty of one lost worker / cheap building. If cash will go below zero, the research level must be dropped.

Ship chaining exploit - you can move a ship, unload troops to another ship, move that ship, etc. This allows you to ship an indefinite distance, and that is why I consider it an exploit.

Resources disconnect / connect exploit - I consider most resource tactics fine. Delaying to hook a resource, trading it away etc is fine. The exploit is to do this every turn. Build a stack of horses, connect saltpeter, upgrade to cavalry, and disconnect.

Palace Jump - You abandon the capital city to move the palace to a new location. If you want to move the palace, build a new palace.

House rules:
1) Worker automation of any kind is prohibited.
2) No worker purchases during the first 50 turns to avoid civ crippling.
3) Declaring war / demanding leave solely for the purpose of getting out of trade deals. This includes nonsense spying simply to force a war. Stealing techs is fine.
4) Even if not covered under exploits listed, please try not to use tactics that take advantage of holes in the game design.
5) Our trading reputation is golden - please respect it.
6) Complete your turn. It is frustrating to get a 1/2 completed turn.


Bede's reminder to the scribes: All of us here are sufficently familiar with the mechanics of the game that detailed turn logs are not necessary. Report significant events like trades, wonder starts, wars(!), peace treaties....The reasoning, the whys and wherefores, IMNSHO, makes more interesting reading than the detailed steps of execution.

So, who wants to go first? (20 turns the first round of play, ten thereafter)

Checking in. Subscribing. Not all that anxious to go first, but I'll take up the gauntlet if no one else will.

I wouldn't mind a casual start, not LeMans, so we can wait for the rest of the team to check in, I think.

I'll go first if you wish honorable Bede-sama. I can play during lunch tomorrow. Looks like a settle on the spot. Shall I go pottery at max?

Btw, What level is this?

Domo arigato, Bugsy-san.

It's Demigod.

Samurai need cups for sake and cha, go for it.

Has anybody considered ICS and Feudalism?

Feudalism is one of our three allowed governments (Despotism, Feudalism. Fascism).

So ICS is definitely the way to go (thematically flavorrful as well).

Order of go
Sir Bugsy-Samurai prime-playing now
SirLenTaft-European, no? So if you play after SirB, that will support an east-west rotation-on deck
SesnOfWthr-NY
DeceasedHorse-'Bama, no? so you're CDT
Bede-EDT
scoutsout-EDT, in this slot by request

If somebody with a more graphic imagination can put together an order that works better, please go ahead

SesnOfWthr-NY


I have no gripe with your roster, other than the two letters next to my name.

Come on Bede, you're capable of a far better joke than that one. :p

Sesn - I live in Washington state and am an avid Sox fan (OK, I spent a great deal of time in Maine). Red Sox nation is everywhere. Yes, even in NY. :hatsoff:


BTW- I got it. Expect the first dispatches on the new Nippon in about 4-5 hours.

Don't get me wrong, I know the believers are nationwide (case in point: recent series against Colorado and SF where Sox got bigger cheers than the hometeam), but I'm far too brash and outspoken in my support of the Sox to last more than a week or so in NY.

No matter, I'll stop the threadjack here. :)

Playing on 1.22. Shogun Bugsy ascends the throne. (well not really a throne, more like a piece of rock that isn’t quite level and it makes your butt hurt if you sit on it too long.)

Move the worker to the wheat, then settler in place. I place the citizen on the BG to get a warrior in five. I go pottery at max, due in 23.

First warrior is produced in 3800 BC, he is named Ichiro. He runs up the wheat road to the hill and sees a great body of water about five tiles away. Shogun Bugsy calls it the “sea.” “Such wisdom,” the people say.

In 3550 BC, Ichiro, who has been traveling north, sees some rolling hills north of our city. That year also see the graduation from our Boot Camp of our second warrior. Our expanding boarder pops the hut and disturbs some yokels. The new warrior, dubbed Nissan, fortifies in the capitol for defensive purposes.

All three barbs head our way, and then threaten our worker. The worker is recalled from the fields for protection.

In 3400 BC – a third warrior is graduated from boot camp and the barbs start destroying improvements. :cringe: The new warrior is named Mitsu. He attacks the pillaging barb and is slightly wounded while removing the barbarian’s head.

On the next turn, brave Mitsu sustains another more severe wound, as he collects the heads of the remaining barbarians. Shogun Bugsy rewards Mitsu with elite status for his courage. With our city safe, Bugsy sends Nissan to explore the uncharted western lands.

In 3300 BC, a fourth warrior is produced, named Shigo. (yes, I’m trying to use Japanese numbers). Pottery is due in eight turns, I decide to build a barracks. It appears we will be able to set up a five or six turn settler-warrior factory. The barracks will help us there.

Shigo is sent to the east, Nissan to the west reports a coastline quite close. Ichiro finds a northern coastline. Could we be all alone?

Ichiro finds some horses along the northwestern coast.

In 3100 BC, our new barracks is completed, and the foundation for a new building is begun. Shogun Bugsy tells the Shinto priests that they are building a temple, but he has seen the work of his scientists and plans on making the new building a granary when the new pottery technology is announced.

It appears there won’t be anything but water to our east.

After Action Report: Switch over the temple to a granary when pottery comes in. It appears we will probably need go for Alphabet next and settle on the coast for a curraugh. I would then go towards Philosophy and get Map Making as the free teach and try for the lighthouse since I think we are all by ourselves. There is a chance to the southwest for a land brige, but I’m not holding my breath.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede_02_3000_BC.jpg

Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02,_3000_BC.SAV

Roster Check:

Sir Bugsy - Just played
SirLenTaft - Up
SesnOfWthr - On deck
DeceasedHorse
Bede
scout

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede_02_3000_BC_dot_map.jpg

Some early dot map ideas. I would use red dot for a curraugh/lighthouse/galley production center.

Blue dot can probably build workers, we'll need a lot up in our northern hills.

Yellow and green dots would grab the wheat and the water.

Wheat, water, and sugar...Suntori!

Hills and mountains for iron and other goodies and an island to ourselves...nice beginning I say.

'Twere I, send the curragh out of yellow dot, as red dot is near the bottom of the map and there is a warrior that will open that area for us shortly. We seem to be bang in the middle of the map, so I guess it's really a horse apiece.

Nice go, Bugsy

Given my first experience with a hut, I decided not to pop the two to the south. In my experience, demi-god huts are next to worthless. Maybe go down there with several units to whack the barbs when they pop out :hammer:

Wheat, water, and sugar...Suntori!
Fish & whale => sushi & kujira!!

Fish & whale => sushi & kujira!!Hey - is it too late to add the GOTM Squid unit?

It looks like we've got a little breathing room to start with, which is nice...

@ Bugsy: Do you see any way to tighten the build a little bit? IIRC, towns give us more support than cities under feudalism... a nice tight build with lots of little bitty towns might give us some decent unit support...

Oh, yes! a tight build is what we want. I just thought we would want to nab those spots first and fill in the rest later. If we are by ourselves, then the spot on the southern coast would be good for the lighthouse.

Ok, I'm finally here. :)
European as said, Swede to be exact. I'll play it tomorrow, a bit to late right now.

I would go for the the yellow dot as the second city, building the curragh if we're alone. The red dot will likely need more military protection, but there's always a small chance for a goodie! ;)
Still a good spot that should be settled early...
If we want to tighten the city placement, we could move the green dot to steps NW, fit in one city on the hill south if the current green dot and put another city two steps NE of the green dot. Not as good, but if we want it tight...

I actually live in Southern California, so I'm on Pacific standard time.

Oh, checking in. And tight builds or no, we need to get a city down near that lake ASAP so we can get some fresh water over to that wheat and down south to the plains.

DH - it's hard to see with the location of the name bar on the screen, but there is a lake one tile south of Kyoto.

Beyond the next city, I wouldn't worry too much about a dotmap until we can see the rest of the surrounding area.

The only thing I'm a bit concerned with is the location of luxes, if any. Well, the only thing I'm worried about so far, at least.

@ DH - Sesn is right, Kyoto is built on a lake.

I hadn't noticed this before Sesn's post... have we not discovered a single lux yet? :eek:

Nope, yep, whatever, there are no luxes in sight.

Another reason to make a beeline to map making. Stick a settler and a warrior on every galley.

Ruling over the Japanese reaches in a 1000 years, the descendants of the clan Bugsy is force from the throne of the Shogun after a civil war lasting the 50 years following the year 3000 BC. After a bloody war, leaving no damages to Japan, Shogun Len Taft takes control over the to-becoming-empire of Japan. At least that's the vision of this great man, which ascendence(sp?) lead to a breakthrough for our scientists, the art of Pottery is finally known.

The Temple-in-construction is changed to a Granary, which will help fed our people and let them grow in numbers. Shogun Len Taft commands his scientists that he need a system to deliver messages in other forms than speech. In his enormous wisdom, he predict that the product of the scientists will be know as an Alphabet. Our western scout, Nissan reports back sightings of large mammals with huge tusks roaming the plains to SW (finally a luxury, one Ivory!), and the shogun wonders if they might be used to entertain the people?

In 2900 BC, Nissan sends reports that beyond the mountains at the end of the Plains of the Elephants, there seems to be more land for us to settle, but also of babarians with hostile intentions. Nissan is ordered to avoid these hostile men and follow the mountain reaches south.

By 2750 BC, our glorious capital has reach a greater size than ever before, and shows now signs of slowing down.

After action report: As said one ivory was found to SW, just below the oasis. There seems to be a rather large land mass beyond those mountains, maybe as large as our current land. I also think there is three babs in about the position of Nissan after Bugsy's turn, coming towards Kyoto.
Anyone that could recommend a good snapshot program? Print screen doesn't work on my new keyboard, so I can't provide anything visual right now.

SAVE: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02,_2550_BC.SAV

So we're not on an island. That is good news. It also means we have a very defensible position from which we can be defiant as we wanna be. That would make a good song
scout => :band: <= bugs (That's Bede singing)
We're defiant as we wanna be!
You can stick your demand
Where the sun don't shine
We're the Japanese and
We're doin' just fine.
WE'RE DEFIANT AS WE WANNA BE!!!

That reminds me of a joke my kid brother once told me... what do you call a guy with no talent who hangs around with musicians? The drummer.... :rockon:

Having lost a drummer in our band, and having a less than optimal replacement, I shall never say drummers have no talent. A good drummer is worth their weight in gold. They can make or break you.

Solid beginning.

Burning question: after Alphabet, Writing, then Map Making, or the top of the tree?

Map Making will improve our research abilities (more contacts, though with three seafarers in the fog and the minimum water I would expect to see wandering dinghies pretty soon) while the upper tier just might get us to Ancient Cavalry.

How long to get two more towns down?


Roster Check:

Sir Bugsy - Samurai Prime
SirLenTaft - Samurai Secundus
SesnOfWthr - Samurai Terce UP *************<
DeceasedHorse - sharpening the war axe-Fourth Samurai
Bede
scout

If we start a prebuild for the Statue of Zeus not too far down the road, I would go towards math, and then towards currancy.

Got it. Will play very shortly.

That reminds me of a joke my kid brother once told me... what do you call a guy with no talent who hangs around with musicians? The drummer.... :rockon:

Hey, I know some drummers, and they have talent. I'm not one myself; I'm a percussionist. I'm too talented to be a drummer. ;)

okayokayokay - my kid brother was a no-talent drummer...

For the record, I'm more of a logical person, so my creative writing is boring, at best. Forgive me if I pull a Joe Friday.

The first thing I notice is the granary and growth both happening in 2. AFAIK, this is a :nono:, as the granary should be done the turn before to get the benefit immediately. Best I can do is slow growth till the third turn.

As for Bede’s question regarding the two settlers – I’ll get one city founded during my turns, but definitely not two, another 7 turns maybe for that?

2510 bc (1) – Since there are two warriors there, I pop the SW hut. We get barbs. Surprise!

2470 bc (2) – Kyoto starts settler. Ichiro gets rl and promotes.

2430 bc (3) – I have the honor of making first contact. Meet Portugese scout:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_Henry.JPG

2390 bc (4) – Ichiro and Shugi finish the barbs, with Ichiro getting a second promotion. :D

2350 bc (5) – Nissan freezes exploring the tundra, hoping to find some furs.

2310 bc (6) - :sleep:

2270 bc (7) – Kyoto finishes settler, starts another.

2230 bc (8) – Shigo helps the settler towards our next encampment.

2190 bc (9) – :sleep:

2150 bc (10) – I found our second future metropolis, named Osaka. Really torn on the build there so I set for barracks. I imagine this city will be a military city, as we can already make a 5 turn factory in Kyoto, assuming we can keep the people happy.

Recap: Met Henry, he’s way ahead as should be expected. Another MP and a temple would be enough for a 5 turn factory in Kyoto. I would probably recommend sending one of the next couple settlers down to the hill SW of the ivory, as this also gets us some extra horses for trade. The mountain range along that area will give us an easily defensible border.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_map.JPG


>>>SAVE<<< (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_2150_BC.zip)

Query:
Where was the Portugese scout?

We may want to settle in that direction.

We are not alone on the island, both good and bad.

Roster Check:

Sir Bugsy - Samurai Prime
SirLenTaft - Samurai Secundus
SesnOfWthr - Samurai Terce Met the Portugese
DeceasedHorse - Fourth Samurai - UP
Bede
scout

I met the scout on the eastern edge of the tundra to the south. He was headed our way.

I would definitely start sending settlers towards the southwest. The portuguese are seafaring so they'll be able to send settler pairs in our lands. I would start at the mountain range with cities and work backwards.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_map_-_2.jpg

Here are some ideas for securing the western range. Red dot will grab the whale and oasis. Blue gets the ivory. Yellow dot - the cow and the fish and pink dot will forever be pop 2, but it does grab the southern portion of the range. We're going to need a LOT of workers. With all those hills to the north and these mountains to our southwest, did I mention we're going to need a LOT of workers. :D We are looking pretty good.

Got it. Will play later.

Strict 24hrs to post got it/24hrs from got it to post log and save/48hrs total. All requests for skips automatically honored

Sir Bugsy
SirLenTaft
SesnOfWthr
DeceasedHorse-skipped?
Bede-will play this save if DH does not post by 8:00 PM EDT
scout

Red dot will grab the whale and oasis. Blue gets the ivory. Yellow dot - the cow and the fish and pink dot will forever be pop 2, but it does grab the southern portion of the range. We're going to need a LOT of workers. With all those hills to the north and these mountains to our southwest, did I mention we're going to need a LOT of workers. We are looking pretty good.

Thanks to Bugsy's planning these were the fastest turns I have played in my career.

Not much to report other than the Spanish(?) started the Colussus and the Portugese the Pyramids. Our warrior scouting south was killed by a barbarian whose composure had been ruined by an erupting volcano. Ichiro found the Portugese border on the other side of the boomerang curve and is poking around out there. Osaka built its first warrior and I built a warrior out of Kyoto because of lurking HsungSu tribesmen. Henry's scout has been popping huts to the south of Kyoto and got at least one warrior out of it.

Henry is not being a good neighbor. He is not interested in anything for his monopoly technologies.

I keep wondering where our fellow Asians are...

I set Tokyo to a barracks build until it grew to pop2 then swapped to a worker (wasting a shield) then set it to another worker. Let Osaka build another couple of warriors for MP duty and barb protection then switch to worker production for awhile.

Here are a several of settlement ideas after Bugsy's pink dot (Bugs and scout will tell you my next worst thing is urban planning so take 'em with a grain of salt)

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/1500Dotmap.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_1500.jpg

Strict 24hrs to post got it/24hrs from got it to post log and save/48hrs maximum. All requests for skips automatically honored.

Sir Bugsy-skip requested through the 27th June
SirLenTaft-on deck
SesnOfWthr
DeceasedHorse-skipped
Bede-played the plan
scout-up

Looking over the logs, "got it", etc.

I'll play this no sooner than tonight, to let the team weigh in with any thoughts they might have.

@Bede: I like your dot down there by the sugar a little better than Bugsy's... Didn't he say something about a Colossus/Lighthouse build down there?

Edit: @Bede: Where's the save?

Looking over the logs, "got it", etc.

I'll play this no sooner than tonight, to let the team weigh in with any thoughts they might have.

@Bede: I like your dot down there by the sugar a little better than Bugsy's... Didn't he say something about a Colossus/Lighthouse build down there?

Edit: @Bede: Where's the save?

Looking at the pictures in the light of day....

Sugar spot is pretty good, yellow by the two oases is semi :smoke:, should be on the coast, red dot to the north is :smoke: as it misses the lake to the north. On the other hand, given the government options, freshwater access is less important (Feudalism and Fascism optimize for pop6 or less).


Right here

Okay - just to prove I "Got It", here's a little urban planning for the team to mull over... (I have finished milking COTM1, and am trying to get back into my usual SG/spamming form...)

The sugar site will need a temple to capture the whales. I've been tinkering with some ideas for sharing the two oasis tiles between two cities...and the northern sites will need harbors and lots of worker turns to even get to size 6... There are some horses up there we need to claim, but much of the stuff NW of the lake can wait...

Red dots are tiles that would be wasted. There appears to be a lot of open land NW of Kyoto in this plan, but there is less waste than it appears...

In looking at this, I wonder if Sugar couldn't be moved 1 SE to make room for a city on the red dot where the warrior is...we might also consider moving the southerly oasis site 1 SW...

I dunno...just a starting point for discussion. Have a look.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/bede02_1500bc_DOTMAP.jpg

Scout - I would think we could still make that a bit tighter. Remember that we'll be stuck with Feudalism for quite a while, and by the time we get out of it, we should have rails which will make food production increase. Realistically, I wouldn't worry about each town having more than 8 or so tiles to work for a wahile, especially if they're grassland that can be irrigated later.

I'd probably like to see a city on the warrior/red dot, and move the east yellow dot one SE, onto the forest. I'd also move the dots N, and NE of Kyoto 1 S each. Move the NW dot onto the horses (they only give a gold bonus, right?), and the put another city 2 NE and 1 N of Osaka, on the lake. Undecided if I'd move the yellow dot W of Kyoto one tile N.

But there are two problems with my placements:
1. I'm just one guy among many with an opinion
2. I've never been mistaken for an expert anyhow :rolleyes:

I agree that we need to place the cities a bit tighter, we don't want/need large cities.

In general I go with Sesn, the yellow dot W of Kyoto should be one N, IMO. City on horse and another city W of the lake would also be better, and moving the dots E of them one tile S. On the suger I haven't really decided, the question is if we want both the red dots W and E of the suger or only one of them. If two we should keep the suger city where it is, otherwise one SE.

That's just my opinion. Unless DH checks in, I think that was everyone.

Oh hell. I'm a moron.

<commits Seppuku>

Bede doesn't have to do any city planning :yah:


Scout - I would think we could still make that a bit tighter. Remember that we'll be stuck with Feudalism for quite a while, and by the time we get out of it, we should have rails which will make food production increase. Realistically, I wouldn't worry about each town having more than 8 or so tiles to work for a wahile, especially if they're grassland that can be irrigated later.

I'd probably like to see a city on the warrior/red dot, and move the east yellow dot one SE, onto the forest. I'd also move the dots N, and NE of Kyoto 1 S each. Move the NW dot onto the horses (they only give a gold bonus, right?), and the put another city 2 NE and 1 N of Osaka, on the lake. Undecided if I'd move the yellow dot W of Kyoto one tile N.

But there are two problems with my placements:
1. I'm just one guy among many with an opinion
2. I've never been mistaken for an expert anyhow :rolleyes:

I'm with SirLen and Sesn on this one and would move Sugar 1 SE.

@DH, As Bugs and scout and Sesn can attest the moron on city placement is mine host, c'est moi, so put the sword back in its scabbard ;)

Here's another one for you guys to look at... I think if we go with something like an ICS build up north in all the hills we'll have a bunch of size 2 towns that won't be able to grow even WITH rails... but each one can have 2 citizens working a mined hill... happiness shouldn't be a problem...

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/BED02_1500bc_dotmap2.jpg

We now have a plan that takes us out 100 turns. ;)

Has anybody looked to the plains to the west yet?

IIRC there are some very productive grasslands that it would be a shame to lose to the Protugese

We now have a plan that takes us out 100 turns. ;)

Has anybody looked to the plains to the west yet?

IIRC there are some very productive grasslands that it would be a shame to lose to the Protugese

We should at least try to get that wheat quite early, other than that I don't really remember the outlay.

Here's another one for you guys to look at... I think if we go with something like an ICS build up north in all the hills we'll have a bunch of size 2 towns that won't be able to grow even WITH rails... but each one can have 2 citizens working a mined hill... happiness shouldn't be a problem...
[/img]

Those town will at least give quite a good unit support. :crazyeye:

EDIT: I like that planning better scout, that's a lot tighter, and should be better for feudalism.

@ Bede: um... "West" is now something of a problem... we should probably escort any settlers that we want to send west of the mountains.... :shakehead

Pre-flight, change Osaka to settler. We're going to need more than one city making settlers if we are to claim all these hills...

IBT - Kyoto equips a settler
=====
Turn 1 (1475) not much... move an elite warrior homeward for barb control near Osaka...
=====
IBT :sleep:
=====
Turn 2 (1450) Our veteran warrior chases our auto-moving settler...something Brother Bede loves to do to me... :p
=====
IBT - nada
=====
Turn 3 (1425) Found Satsuma
=====
IBT - Not much
====
Turn 4 (1400) Moved some stuff
=====
IBT - 3 barb horses show up outside Edo, Osaka outfits a settler, starts on another
=====
Turn 5 (1375) Kagoshima founded
=====
IBT - Kyoto equips another settler, starts a worker. Madrid completes the Oracle
=====
Turn 6 (1350) Nara Founded
=====
IBT - nada (?) Barbs don't seem to be moving...
=====
Turn 7 (1325) not much...moved some stuff...
=====
IBT - Barb horses move west....
=====
Turn 8 (1300) move some stuff around, get a warrrior out to find the barbs threatening Osaka...
=====
IBT - Someone kills a barb in the mountains on our western frontier. Osaka equips a worker, starts on a settler. The Portugese start the Great Lighthouse.
=====
Turn 9 (1275) Nagoya founded, start roading the Ivory (we need SoZ...)
=====
IBT - Henry shows up demanding 22g. I can't remember if it's this game or Bugs1 that's "defiant"...thinking it's better to ask forgiveness than permission, I tell him to stuff it. The Portugese Declare War on us!!! 3 Portugese Warriors show up on the mountain W-SW of Tokyo. Tokyo equips a warrior, starts another. Kagoshima equips a warrior, starts on another.
=====
Turn 10 (1250) - Get a couple of warriors "Headed that way", but we need some roads headed west in the worst way...

Our World:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_ourworld_1250.jpg

After Action Review:

The good: I got us... I think 4 towns founded... which is pretty good.

The bad: We're at war with Portugal.

The ugly: We really, really need workers...

Thoughts: There is a worker roading north of Osaka. When that road is complete a settler out of Osaka can move to the jungle and found a town on the lake, instantly clearing a patch of jungle.

Important Tactical Notes:

There are some barbs up north... I whacked one (note 3/5 warrior) but I did not find the camp. There is also a concscript Portugese warrior and a scout up there somewhere, so don't leave anything completely undefended in the north...

Tokyo has a regular warrior. It might be possible to whip a second. Edo has a warrior that could make it to Tokyo in a turn. I just hope there aren't large numbers of Portugese units nearby...

For the next better player: > > The Save < < (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_1250BC.SAV)

...and Good Luck!!

Sorry for the double-post - but I see an interesting little thing that might buy us a tiny tactical edge...

Consider the hill S-SW of Nagoya. Put a settler on that hill (instead of the one to the SE) and you've got an "instant road". When our worker finishes roading the Ivory, move him to that hill, then move him to the plains tile NE of that hill. It will waste 1 worker turn, but when a town is founded on that hill, we'll have a road there.

The other worker is roading the forest tile SW of Kyoto. Those two workers could then start roading towards each other, and we would have something that resembles a connected empire....

Got it, and will play tomorrow morning (it's soon 2:00...)

Those Portugese warriors doesn't look nice...We can't whip yet, it seems, to small population and production. Hmm, currently we can have 1 fortified regular warrior and one veteran unfortified (I think, if I counted right?) against the three warriors attacking from the hill. One possiblity is to switch Edo's Barrack to a warrior, which would mean a loss of three sheilds, but that might be necesarry if we're to defend Tokyo. If there are more Portugese military showing up soon, we have some major problems...but Satsumas warrior is due soon, which will help.
Kagoshima will have to produce a worker next, which more town? We really need workers and more now when we need roads to the western towns.

Scout, in that little trick, did you mean the actual hill S-SW of Nagoya or the one in your planning? The original would mean one more plain to work, but in the long run placement might be better?

Going to bed now, hope there's some good discussion when I've woke up. :)

EDIT: A curragh would be good for some contacts...

Nice.

A little war to wake up with....

@scout, Bugs1 was over a long time ago...you may be thinking about Bugs2, but you got the variant right in this one.


@ Bede: um... "West" is now something of a problem... we should probably escort any settlers that we want to send west of the mountains....

The master of understatement...why did I get this little chill when I read those words....

@Sesn: If you look at the planning dot on top of the Warrior (the one directly south of Nagoya) and move that site 1 NW, the new city will really only lose one plains tile... and that plains tile will likely be needed by Edo anyway...

...and a city on that hill would be a HUGE help in getting some roads going westward.

I think if we can hold Tokyo and get some warriors on the mountains, we can hold Portugal off. We've got a few more towns than we had 10 turns ago, and Warriors are cheap...

@ Bede: You're right - I was thinking Bugs2 and typing Bugs1. I think those last seven turns I played in Bugs1 left permanent emotional scars on my psyche. :crazyeye:

Quoth Bede: ...why did I get this little chill when I read those words....

I guess that's what happens when you let a Ronin sit in the Shogun's chair. :D Look at the bright side of it. I haven't said "I have an idea" in some time. ;)

Ok, played it now, here's the log:

Preturn: The Barrack build in Edo is changed to a warrior to defend against the Portugese.

1225 - We got three warriors in Tokyo, one fortifed reg, one vet and another reg, both unfortified.

1200 - One of our reg warriors is killed, one reg Portugese is killed. Ivory is connected to Tokyo. Kyoto finishes settler and starts worker.

1175 - Warrior produced in Satsuma.

1150 - Another of our reg warriors is killed, and another Portugese as well. Tokyo switches Warrior build to Barrack.

1125 - Portugese Elite Warrior shows up east of Osaka, barb warrior SE of Kyoto, Barb Horseman W of Satsuma. Barb camp to the north dispersed (sp?).

1100 - :sleep:

1075 - Portugese Eilte next to Osaka is killed, regular gets promotion. Izumo founded.

1050 - The last Portugese Elite in the west finally falls to a regular, after taking down to regulars before. Osaka finishes Settler, sent north.

1025 - Two more Portugese warriors shows up in the west, one Eilte and one vet. Nagasaki founded next to the lake. Barb horseman seen in the south, there's a camp down there that needs to be taken care of.

1000 - Settler finished in Kyoto, yet to decide where to be sent. Ivory connected to Kyoto.

After turn report. We should now be able to handle the Portugeses to the west, though we still need more defenders, and we still need more workers. Masonry is due in two turns, and then Mathematics, I presume?
I was unsure what to do with the latest settler, so I leave it to the group or the next player to decide. It might be good to get it by the oasis, but there's a barb horseman down there. Or is there another spot to settle before? The hill S of the lake could be possible.

Our World:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/bede02_1000.jpg

>>SAVE (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/bede02_1000BC.SAV)<<

My initial reaction is to take one of the warriors nearby and escort the settler E-SE (to the hill SW of the southerly oasis). I'd escort him just long enough to get the city founded, then withdraw. I would rather have the barbs raid that town than pillage improvements around Kyoto.

Edit: Alternatively, you could send the settler straight north to the hill. Again, I'd escort it just long enough to get the town founded...

Sir Bugsy - out until 27th
SirLenTaft - played
SesnOfWthr - UP
DeceasedHorse - on deck
Bede
scout

I can jump in whenever you gents would like.

If you'd like to sneak in now, that would be fine by me. I wouldn't get to it till tomorrow evening anyhow.

Roger that. got it.

:whipped:Strict 24hrs to post got it/24hrs from got it to post log and save/48hrs total.:whipped:

:bump: Sir Bugsy-swapped, now skipped
SirLenTaft-played
SesnOfWthr-UP========================<
DeceasedHorse-on deck
Bede :whipped: for being late on the bump
scout

This is my "got it" but no turns till tonight if Bugsy just forgot to post.....

Ahhh! The turns are in progress. Dispatches shortly.

Oh man - got the whip cracked with turns in progress... but I think I know the cause for Brother Bede's quickness with the lash...

@Bugsy - how close are you to finishing your turnset?

Pre-flight – 1000 BC – Settler unmoved, head him towards the SW mountain range.

Henry will talk to us but wants 80G for peace. Ha! We’re defiant as we wanna be!

Kyoto needs some population. Swap build from a settler to a warrior.

We’re in serious need of both military and workers. Since most cities are pop 2 or less, we’ll concentrate on military for now.

IBT – The Portuguese that were west of Tokyo head south.
Edo, Kagoshima: Warr=>war

1. 975 BC – About five units were on go-to. Dudes, that is not cool in a SG. Things changed and I lost a movement point on a warrior that should now be going to Edo instead of Tokyo.
Masonry due next, but science has to stay put.

IBT – Masonry comes in. Normally I would go for something that the AI doesn’t have, but we are in some serious need of archers right now so I select WC, due in 6 at 80%.

2. 950 BC – The Portuguese are moving towards Edo. I take the warrior out of Edo and place him on the mountain to the west. Another moves into the city with a third and fourth nearby.

The price of peace has gone up to 100G.

IBT – Our dude on the mountain flawlessly kills two attacking Portuguese warriors and is now a veteran. The protecting spear moves toward the flatland.
Kyoto, Satsuma: warr=>warr
Nara: curraugh=>curraugh

3. 925 BC – Our wandering dude in Portugual, Ichiro, climbs a mountain and sees:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede_2_Ichiro_View.jpg

…China. Mao is up BW, WC, writing, Myst and has 122G, 11 cities, and incense hooked up. He won’t sell us anything.

Peace has dropped to 80G.

IBT – Nagoya: warrior=>warrior

4. 900 BC – Maneuvering to get the Portuguese spear on flatland.

Peace drops to 60G.
Mao will sell us WC for 84G. Since I need some archers right now, I take the deal.
Select math at minimum.
Swap Kyoto and Kagoshima over to archers.

IBT – The spear moves to flatland. A warrior in the east defends against two barb horses.
Tokyo: war=>archer

5. 875 BC – We lose three warriors, but the spear is dead. Our curraugh is making its way west along the coast.

IBT – The Aztecs build the Pyramids.

6. 850 BC – Our curraugh spots a pair of Portuguese archers walking across the western desert.

IBT – Kyoto: archer=>settler
Izumo: war=>archer
The Portuguese complete the lighthouse and start building the mausoleum. The Spanish complete the Great Wall.

7. 825 BC – Hire a tax man in Nagoya. Send several warriors towards the front. Found Yokohama on the southern end of the mountain range. Check out my old house and some of my haunts.

Henry still isn’t reasonable.

IBT – Nara: curraugh=>archer

8. 800 BC – Now that Nagoya is hooked up, fire the tax lady. Peace drops to 60G. We’ll probably fight some Portuguese archers on the interturn. Lux to 10% to keep Kyoto happy.

IBT – Our warrior on the mountain is killed by a Portuguese archer.
Nagasaki: war=>war

9. 775 BC – The archers on the mountain are going to be a pain in the neck. Move some units into our cities. Lux to 20% for Kyoto. Peace is back to 80G.

IBT – The Portuguese split their forces. One attacks a barb to the west, the other attacks our warrior and loses a HP in killing him.
Kagoshima: archer=>archer
Nagoya: war=>archer

10. 750 BC – We kill the wounded acher with a warrior.

Peace is back to 60G.

After Action: With a couple of more archers we’ll be able to hold our mountains against all comers. Probably need to start settling our eastern and northern lands. I’d start with the hill country first.

Situation:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede_2_750_West.jpg

Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede_02,_750_BC.SAV

Apologies to the team, and to Bugsy, especially.

Sesn-take it away from Bugsy's save.

No apology necessary. I really was late getting the game completed.

Didn't get to this last night. Going to see Harry Potter now, and will definitely play sometime after that. :)

Pre turn – Everything looks pretty good, but it’d be nice to connect those horses. Also pretty low on workers.

730 bc (1) – Ichiro valiantly slays an archer in Henry’s back yard, but gets critically injured doing so.

IT - Lose a vet archer on a mountain. Ichiro is instantly surrounded.

710 bc (2) – RL archer defeats our vet warrior. Ichiro runs for cover, but it doesn’t look good…

IT – Ichiro falls, without a struggle.

690 bc (3) – Shimoneski founded on the northern horses. We finally kill that stupid archer.

IT – Henry signs Mao on against us. Henry also drops an archer off next to unguarded Nara. Unfortunately, the archer for defense is still a turn away from completion.

670 bc (4) – 4/5 warrior RL the portugese archer. No one can quite reach him. Try to bait him for a turn with a worker…

IT – Portugese do take Nara. :wallbash:

650 bc (5) – Dispatch a couple archers to take it back. Mitsu wins vs archer, no leader. I use the whip in a couple towns.

630 bc (6) – Can attack nara next turn. Couple more reinforcements arrive at the mountains.

IT – We lose one of our archers at Nara. Portugese reinforce it with two more archers.

610 bc (7) – Withdraw other archers, we’ll need a few more now. Use the whip a bit more. Archer kills spear near the mountains.

IT – This is not good. Two more archers arrive at Nara.

590 bc (8) – By my count, there is at least 1 spear and four archers in Nara, along with another one running around. In two turns I can have seven archers available, at best. At worst, I lose another city.

IT – Reg warrior wins on defense, no promotion. The Portugese drop off two more archers.

570 bc (9) – I have no doubt this portugese SoD is coming out of Nara soon. The results will not be good for us. I don’t dare attack anything for fear of winning and leaving a unit exposed.

IT – Our vet archer wins on defense, -1 hp. Henry unbelievably drops two more archers off in Nara. Either Henry has about nine archers in there, or he’s moving the same ones in and out.

550 bc (10) – We disperse a Hsung-nu encampment in the south.

Recap: I obviously screwed this one up pretty well. I left a two turn window when that could have happened, and of course it did. This could very well be a back-breaker. If there really are nine or so archers in Nara, we don’t have enough units to stop them, regardless of the direction they move in. I have been using the whip pretty heavily, but even with that, I couldn’t produce fast enough to be able to make a move when two more archers added to the problem every turn.

I’m not sure what else to add here. [pissed] :suicide:

>>>SAVE<<< (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_550_BC.zip)

Sir Bugsy
SirLenTaft
SesnOfWthr-Ouch
DeceasedHorse-UP==================<
Bede-on deck
scout

Do we need a meeting of the Council of Regents?

I think the situation is dire but not hopeless. Is it possible to buy our way out?

I'll take a look in the dawn's early light and post some thoughts....

Peace can be bought with Henry for all our gold (293) and 2 gpt. We currently make 18 gpt.

I had not mentioned that we have yet to see a Chinese warrior, and they will not even talk.

Peace can be bought with Henry for all our gold (293) and 2 gpt. We currently make 18 gpt.

I had not mentioned that we have yet to see a Chinese warrior, and they will not even talk.

One problem with that: the defiant variant rules won't allow us to buy our way out....:wallbash: :spank: (read your own posts before posting a crack-brained idea, Bede)

I'm gonna sleep on this one...

One problem with that: the defiant variant rules won't allow us to buy our way out

Which is exactly why I feel I screwed this up so bad. We need to put enough of a hurt on him to get peace for free, at the very least. The real problem is the lack of a defensive unit here. Hopefully we can find someone immediately and buy BW. Might be too little too late though. :(

Opened up the 750BC save just to satisfy my curiousity.

Looks like neglecting the trading opportunities with China created the problem. We could have bought Bronze and Iron Working for gpt which might have kept Mao on the sidelines and even if it didn't we would have had the techs at a discount.

It does not look like Henry will offer a tech at a discount in the negotiations, so that option is out for now..

Military response: pull troops out of the towns around Nara and on to the hills surrounding the town. If there are no horsemenin Nara Henry can't reach any other town and will waste his forces attacking the hills, or put them in the open where they are more vulnerable. Once his bolt is shot we can take back Nara then see what the potential for peace might be. I didn't see any Porutgese troops in the western plains so pull back into the mountains there.

Comments from any of the master tacticians?

When Henry loses Nara, it will cause enough pain that he will be reasonable at the peace table. I wouldn't worry about peace right now.

Additionally, I wouldn't use the whip too much more. The short term gain will cripple our long term productivity.

Remember that Nara is built on a hill. Figure we're going to take some loses recapturing the city. How many archers do we have available for an assault?

@Sesn - What is with the Sox' fielding? It's feeling like '86 all over again.

Are we now obligated to Erase Henry? Or would that only be required if he had sacked Nara?

Probably need a review of our variant. Originally Posted by Arathorn (from Bede's opening post)
Defiant Variant: You must never give in to a demand from an opponent, that is, you always reject demands for tribute. You may never ally, sign a Right of Passage, MPP, or embargo with another civilization. You may never pay for peace (a peace treaty must either be straight-up or the opponent gives a concession to you. A deal where a tech costs 20 gpt normally and you pay 10 gpt for that tech as part of a peace treaty is fine). Any troops on your soil must be given a boot order every turn. No capturing foreign cities or demanding them in diplomacy. No foreign workers merged into existing cities. If an AI razes one of your cities, that civ must be eliminated.

So far Henry has kept himself alive.

Yup, no razing of Nara means we don't have to eliminate Henry....yet.

We could probably scrounge together 8-10 archers in the next couple of turns, but that would leave cities undefended again.

If the rng continues it's trend, we'll take several losses. It was something less than kind to me.

I think I used the whip once in most of the cities.

I have no clue what is going on with the BoSox. I thought the game Tues was as frustrating as it could get, but leave it to the boys to go one better. Ortiz is my all-around "Goat of the Game". He whiffed on bases loaded, and had two fielding mishaps (though only one error was charged). However, he has gotten enough "Hero of the Game" awards to offset this one....as long as it's not a trend.

When Henry loses Nara, it will cause enough pain that he will be reasonable at the peace table. I wouldn't worry about peace right now.

Additionally, I wouldn't use the whip too much more. The short term gain will cripple our long term productivity.

Remember that Nara is built on a hill. Figure we're going to take some loses recapturing the city. How many archers do we have available for an assault?


The short-run intent on surrounding Nara was to blunt Henry's attempts to move out of the town as we build the force necessary to take it back. The whip is no longer an option, I think, so we will just have to wait for another hlf dozen archers and trust that the Navigator will use up his troops against the bastions on the hills. As I don;t think there are any fast movers that can get out of Nara to threaten the rest of the towns, pulling the defenders is not too big a gamble, but Bugs well knows I have sometimes thrown that set of dice and lost big time (A French knight and a weakly defended settlement comes to mind)

:cringe: Yes, I remember. I think it is worth the gamble. Surrounding Nara is a good idea.

Sir Bugsy
SirLenTaft
SesnOfWthr-Ouch
DeceasedHorse-:bump: skipped
Bede-up
scout-on deck

Will play today

:cringe: Surrounding Nara is a good idea.While you're cringing... do your remember "the hug"? :D

Bede-up / scout-on deck / Will play todayI guess I know what I better do tomorrow if I don't want a :spank:

@Bede: That's the last time I dig on you for that, I promise. :mischief:

*anxiously awaiting to see if Bede can clean up the mess*

Just a quick update before I insert knife into my entrails:

We would be hanging by a silk thread if we had any. Tokyo burned, Nagoya captured. One hitpoint away from losing Kyoto. Still no give in Henry or Mao.

@scout:

You don't have to play tomorrow just pick up the save....you can have until Sunday to play. :D
Should go quickly as we have hardly any towns left and very few citizens left to manage.... :crazyeye:

...Tokyo burned...I guess that does it. We are now obligated to sack Henry.

550-450
Build defenses in the west against Portugese archer/spear stacks but are forced into a Russian gambit of trading territory for time as the forces are slowly forced back towards Tokyo and the Portugese breach the mountains. but lose 1/3 of their forces. Meanwhile the archers and warriors at Nara are absorbing archer hits with a 3:1 kill ratio in our favor. By 450BC there are enough archers at Nara to attempt to take the city. Henry will talk but offers no concessions.

Mao will also talk but won't offer anything either.

The Battle for Nara goes badly. There are two spears left in the garrison. One is killed but the second defeats our archers and reaches elite status.

A wounded archer from Nara takes Nagoya.

In 430BC the Portugese forces in the west are reduced to seven archers and a spear.

Meet the English in the west and spend most of the treasury buying Bronze and Iron. There is a source of iron outside Nagasaki.

Whip a couple of spears in the west and an archer in Kyoto.

A wounded Portugese archer takes Tokyo and burns it.

From 430 to 370 reinforce the west with spears and the Portugese forces spend themselves against Edo and Izumo. There are two wounded archers and a spear left

In 370 the Portugese reingorce Nara and march an archer out of Nagoya toward Kyoto. Forces besieging the two cities are pulled back to garrison duty in Osaka and Kyoto.

The Portugese attack Kyoto and cripple the defending archer. There is no follow up so the town is still in our hands.

In 350 kill the threatening Portugese archer in the west and reveal two more Protugese archers on the mountain above the rubble of Tokyo

A Chinese galley approaching Osaka has turned north.

A scan of the map reveals that the Portugee have expanded onto the plains west of our mountains.

I am expecting the next attack to come from Nara at either Osaka or Kyoto. Henry still lacks iron and horses. Our iron will connect in five turns. It is going to take veteran swords to turn this around. Nagoya does not have enough force to threaten Izumo, I think.

We have all of eleven units for garrison duty and protection against the Portugese.....There is a crippled archer in Kyoto and a spear due on the interturn. Osaka is garrisoned with a regfular warrior and a wounded archer with another spear due on the IT.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_350BC01.jpg

This is going to be a fun challenge... but it looks like Brother Bede was good enough to set some things up for me. I might just concede to whatever's in that chinese galley, and deal with them later...while I dig in my heels and see what I can do about getting us one of our cities back.

"Got it"

:cringe: I don't know about "fun" but it is a challenge. Glad to be in a game that isn't decided in the first 100 turns. :D

:cringe: I don't know about "fun" but it is a challenge. Glad to be in a game that isn't decided in the first 100 turns. :DI think it is appropriate that we're playing as Japan. I can't remember if it was Musashi, or someone/something referenced by Musashi who wrote "The way of the warrior is death"... or maybe it was "resolute acceptance of death". Put another way, once one accepts death, one begins to truly live.

I leave the good Brother Bede with some 20th Century "Pirate" poetry from one of my favorite minstrels, to lighten his mood as a Ronin takes the game:

(Spoken)
In days of old, when knights were bold,
And journeyed from their castles,
Trusty men were left behind,
Knights needed not the hassles.
They helped themselves to pig and peach,
And drank from king’s own chalice.
Oh, it was a stirring sight
These gypsies in the palace.

And some things never change. hit it boys!

(Sung)
So long boss, knock ’em dead, don’t worry ’bout a thing
Wish that we could come along, we’d love to hear you sing
Limo’s here, your bags are packed, the list is by the phone
Me and snake will watch your place and treat it like our own

Look at all this liquor
Look at all this food
It’s only gonna go to waste
We’re not really being rude
But the good stuff’s in his closet, I swear he wouldn’t mind
Hell we’ll just shoot the lock off, I do it all the time

We’re gypsies in the palace, he’s left us here alone
The order of the sleepless knights will now assume the throne
We ain’t got no money, we ain’t got no right
But we’re gypsies in the palace, we got it all tonight

I don't know about the song, but I do agree with the "once one accepts death, one begins to truly live." Let's assume that we're going to lose this game and play like madmen. Sort of like the Soviets expecting the American military to read their tactics manuals.

Death is as light as a feather, duty as heavy as a mountain?

Can I get a different slot in the order? I always seem to be coming up at inopportune times.

Welcome back.

Want to take it after scout?

We could use some of that good ol' "Horse Magic".

I like that idea. The horse will :hammer:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Footersm.gif

The Portugese Killer Spearman gazed out his window at the Japanese citizens in his courtyard. He hardly noticed the bedraggled traveller who had arrived in the night. With unkempt hair and a slight air of Guiness on his breath, there was little cause for notice. Had he known the traveller, he would have understood that this was no mere traveller, but a Ronin; a warrior without a master. This particular Ronin once fought the Japanese under the guidance of the Great Khan. He fought them well enough that the Great Khan kicked him out of class, thereby leaving him without a master.

The traveller moved quietly among the citizens, softly telling them a story of 47 Ronin, whose master was wrongfully disposessed and forced to commit seppuchu. Dispossesed were the Ronin, much as the citizens of Japan now were. As the story goes, the 47 dispersed, to gather their strength...to await the right moment to avenge the death of their master. The Ronin urged the people of Japan to exercise patience and perserverance.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Patient.gif

The Ronin wandered about the lands, quietly training warriors the art of spear, bow, and sword. He taught them to choose their moments to attack. Soon, the screams of dying Portugese archers were heard coming from the lands south of Nagoya.

In the tenth year after the Ronin's arrival, the city of Nara was retaken. Although the citizen of Nara rejoiced, the Ronin had made a tactical blunder at Kagoshima, and had also deliberately permitted Kyoto to be sacked by barbarian horsemen from the east. The Ronin was ordered to Kyoto to commit ritual seppuchu, and pass his sword to the next better player.

Prince Henry received the news of the loss at Nara, and the news of the passing of the Ronin. He was glad that the Ronin was gone, but something disturbed him. The winds, which normally blew from west to east, had shifted. His soldiers had reported hearing hoofbeats, and stories of a Japanese rider, and a dark horse....

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/samurai_main1.gif

Pre-flight check...Putting a citizen on the forest in Osaka gets it to +5spt

IBT - 4 Portugese archers show up in the west, galleys shuffle in and out of Nara, I think he dropped 2 more archers off in Nara. One archer moves south from Nara, another moves south from Nagoya, threatening Izumo.

Kyoto trains a spear, starts a Warrior
Osaka trains a Spear, starts an Archer
Yokohama trains a spear, starts another
Matsuyama trains a spear, starts another

Turn 1 (330)
Hire a Scientist in Kyoto (No dif between 7spt and 8, gets some science going again, Math in 24)
Move the spear North out of Yokohama.
Oh man - we've even got a Curaugh with a single hit point remaining...
Regular archer from Izumo kills Portugese archer on hill flawlessly, promotes

These portugese units look like they're in the mood to pillage stuff. Take a small risk... fortify the spearman on the mined oasis West of Izumo (hoping he'll kill the 2 archers) Move the spear out of Kyoto and send him westward.

IBT - Portugese Spear moves onto our Ivory. This is going to hurt...

Turn 2 (310)
I put a spear on the hill south of Nagoya. If Henry wants to continue advancing archers in that direction, it will cost him. Move the spear out of Osaka to go to Kyoto.

IBT - The Portugese do in fact pillage our Ivory. I should have converted that stupid scientinst into a clown. A portugese Archer attacks our spear flatfooted on the road to Kyoto, our spear wins 3/4.

Kyoto and Nagasaki Riot.

Turn 3 (290)

Let's see... Henry has managed to place 4 archers within striking distance of Izumo. This is not good... Izumo is now our gateway to the mountains.

Kagoshima is changed to an archer.
The spearman makes it to Kyoto
I take the spearman off the oasis and fortify him in Izumo. I take the spearman on the hill and place him in Izumo. I take the archer and kill one of the portugese archers on the desert tile, promoting him to Elite (4/5). March a spear to Edo.

IBT - 2 Portugese archers fall to a spear in Izumo, promoting him to Elite in the process. The Portugese Galley shuffles up the coast towards Shimonseki. Kyoto trains a warrior, starts another. Kagoshima trains an archer, and I wish I could spare the turns to build a rax there.

Turn 4 (270)
Change the queue to Spear in Shimonseki, and whip it.
Change the queue to Archer in Izumo...
Our Elite Archer in Izumo gets redlined killing a Portugese Archer in the desert. I'll give you a name and a rest next turn little buddy.

IBT - Enemy galleys shuffle... The Portugese pillage the irrigation SW of Izumo. I see 2 chinese galleys to the east now, and I bet they contain settler pairs. Just as well, we need some cities.

Osaka trains an archer, starts a Sword. Shimoneski trains a spear, starts a warrior. Elizabeth establishes an Embassy in our capitol.

Turn 5 (250)

Regular archer kills Portugese archer (2/3) move a spear from Edo to cover.
Changye Kyoto to settler. I'd rather have another town than another clown.
Wake Shigo, and send him south. Fumble a move with a curraugh, but get it back to coast... I spy a dark green border to the Southeast. (Fortunately, this is the healthy Curraugh)

IBT - Portugese archer kills our spear. Portugese advance on Edo. Portugese spear advances to road N of Edo. Nagasaki trains an Archer, starts a sword.

Turn 6 (230)
There are 4 Portugese archers in the mountains west of Edo, only one in striking distance of the town. I wake the warrior in Satsuma and send him to Edo (simple math, he can't kill 2 units with one archer...) Change Edo to Sword, and Whip it. Whip a spear in Satsuma.
Archers in Izumo are too banged up to do us any good this turn.

IBT - the Portugese archer kills one of our Warriors at Edo. Enemy Galleys shuffle, a stack of barb horses show up outside Kyoto.

Edo trains a sword, starts a spear. Satsuma trains a spear, starts another. Izumo trains an archer, starts a Sword.

Turn 7 (210)

Let's see... I've got 4 Barb horses outside Kyoto, and 3 units. Change Kyoto to Sword.
Yokohama was connected in the IBT... maybe I can get our Ivory hooked back up...

Here's a vexing little problem. I've got 5 Portugese units outside Izumo. To the SW is an Archer/Spear combo. To the NE is a pair of archers, and a 2/3 archer in the North (not really worried about him).

Scout's little buddy takes the defensive free shot of the archer, and kills that Portugese spear that has been running around our rear area since I got this game. Scout's Little Buddy is now 1/5. Our Regular Archer kills a portugese Archer, now 1/3.

I guess skirmishing with archers is what Demi-God is about, huh team?

IBT - a 2/3 Portugese Archer does us the service of promoting our sword in Edo to Veteran status. Portugese units shuffle in the mountains. Kagoshima trains an Archer, starts a sword.

Great, we just got a report of a massive uprising near Kyoto.

Turn 8 (190)

"I have an idea".
Change Kyoto back to settler.

Regular Archer out of Kagoshima whacks the Portugese Archer that advanced to the hill SE of Izumo. Izumo is fast becoming a graveyard for Portugese Archers.

The only healthy archer I have in Izumo whacks the Portugese Archer that advanced to our Ivory. I'm gonna get it back.

There are 3 Portugese Archers on the mountain 2 SW of Edo. They can be in striking distance of Edo or Satsuma next turn. I wake the Elite spear in Izumo and dipatch him to Edo post haste.

A barb galley is "in the six" of our 1 hp Curraugh.. but in 2 moves, we meet the Aztecs.

Montezuma is polite, which immediately tells me that something is very, very wrong with this game.

IBT - The Portugese archers advance on Edo. Two Portugese Archers advance south from Nagoya, one S from Nara. Our Curraughs are in similar exploration lanes with Aztec galleys, who absorb the brunt of the barbarian galley attacks for us. A good-sized stack of Barb horses appear from the fog east of Kyoto. Kyoto equips a settler, starts a sword.

Turn 9 (170)
Our sword kills 1 of 3 Portugese archers that threaten Edo. Sword 2/4. One of our Archer dies to a portugese Archer at Izumo.

Another vexing problem I've got 12 barb horses 3 East of Kyoto, and 4 more E-NE of the city. I wanted to put the settler on the hilltop E-SE of the city, but the barb horses are within striking distance of that tile. Taking a small gamble here, and wake the 2 warriors in Matsuyama and pull them out of the town, hoping (praying) to draw the barb horses away from the core.

Send the Settler and a Spear W-SW out of Kyoto. Maybe we can re-claim the Tokyo site.

IBT - It didn't work. The Barbarians clearly sense blood in the water, and advance on Kyoto. Osaka trains a sword, starts a spear.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/bede02_130BC_02_BARBS.jpg

Turn 10 (150)
If we are to take Nara, the time has come. We have 2 Veteran Archers, a Vet Sword, and a couple of warriors. As much as I would prefer to upgrade the swords, our treasury is about to get emptied by the barb horses, and we're only at 49 gold.

In the most unbelievable RNG roll I have seen in a while, our Veteran archer absorbs a free-shot from a Portugese Archer, and kills the Elite Portugese Killer Spearman. He's redlined now, but SO WHAT?!?!?! [dance] Regular Archer relines Portugese Regular Spear before dying. Veteran Archer kills Regular Archer. Our Sword is redlined, kills Portugese Spear, Captures Nara, and Promotes!

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/bede02_130BC_01_NARA.jpg

In one of the dangdest moves I have ever made in a game, I empty the garrison at Kyoto. The only way those units will survive is if I withdraw them. Hopefully the barbs will simply be absorbed by sacking the city. But before that happens, I buy a shiny little sword for Shigo (because the barbs are about to empty our treasury anyway).

Scout's Little Buddy takes out a Portugese Archer South of Nagoya. The spear from the settler pair moves to cover my little friend, while the settler moves westward (uncovered) to the former site of Tokyo.

I simply cannot force the next better player to endure the barb horsemen. This was my doing, and I accept it.

IBT - Montezuma complains about a trespassing Curraugh. Mao drops a single warrior off next to undefended

Aside from 4 Barb horses that weren't near the city, all of those Barb horsemen near Kyoto raid the city, doing various things I don't approve of... but at least they are gone now. Consider it a form of "aikido" guys, and please forgive me - for this and for pressing <Enter> at the end of my turns.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/bede02_130BC_03_BARBS.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/bede02_130BC_04_BARBS.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/bede02_130BC05_BARBS.jpg

Matsumaya trains a spear, starts another.

This will be a beginning-of-turn save.

After action review:

The good: I got one of our cities back, and seemed to be able to "toe the line" with Henry. I didn't keep score, but I'm pretty sure that I killed more than I lost.

The bad: Well... those infernal barb horsemen really weren't all that bad. I think in all they killed 2 citizens, emptied a build queue that was actually fairly fresh, and carried away a chunk of our treasury (which was only 13 gold to begin with...)

I also hope you guys don't mind me hitting <enter> at the end of my turns. I just couldn't bring myself to force the next player to watch what I knew was coming...

The ugly: Just when I thought we were ready to turn the corner, Mao outflanked me badly at Kagoshima IBT. Had I moved one lousy unit south when I emptied the garrison at Kyoto, the next better player wouldn't face the rather vexing tactical situation in Kagoshima and Izumo. :wallbash:

About the best option I can think of is to wake up the veteran spear in Izumo and attack the regular Chinese Warrior. Though there's an archer in Izumo, he's 1/3 or 1/4... The spear and "Scout's Little Buddy" (Elite Archer) can really go nowhere but Izumo - and there are 3 Portugese archers in position to attack Izumo. IIRC, there is a sword in Edo that (with the spear) should be able to hold off 2 archers. I think there's a warrior that could be used to reinforce Izumo...together with the wounded archer, and the spear/archer now south of Nagoya, we should be able to hold the town by simply outnumbering the Portugese archers...

Given the choice, I would rather lose Kagoshima than Izumo... if we manage to keep them both, we will have turned the corner.

Here's a screenie.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/bede02_130BC_06_SOUTH.jpg

Mercifully, the situation in the North isn't quite so bad.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/bede02_130BC_07_NORTH.jpg

So... for the next better player... the long awaited > > 130 BC Start-of-Turn Save < < (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_130BC.SAV)

Nice write up scout and well played turns.

The thing I don't like about the barbarian horsemen is their symbolism, not their actions: somebody is now in the Middle Ages and we have a runaway freight train out there in the fog!!

Roster Check :)
DeceasedHorse- UP :wavey:
Sir Bugsy-on deck
SirLenTaft
SesnOfWthr
Bede
scout-reversed the tide of war :worship:

Thanks Bede. I still think we can dig our way back into this one. Granted, being an age behind isn't fun... but...

If we can "hold what we've got" for about 2-3 turns, maybe re-take Nagoya in 3-5, we can end the nearly constant flow of (enemy) archers from these two towns. This would allow us to move more units westward... and maybe own those mountains again...

I daresay we might want to build a few more settlers. More towns, more units... even if all they can do is pop out 3hp archers... "Quantity has its own Quality..." or something like that.

The next better player might want to play carefully with the sliders. Once I got the Ivory hooked up things started to look just a little better. I used the whip, but sparingly. We might be able to get our research going again sometime in the next 10 turns...

I Got it, I got it!

Actuslly there are at least two runaway freight trains out there. Way to go scout. We have an uphill battle, but you are right. The wind has shifted. This wind is going to blow right into Lisbon, and we're going to watch that city burn!

In the dark days of the Portuguese occupation, a young Japanese villager fled the city of Nagoya. Upon reaching Kyoto, the great capital city, he sought to gain an audience with the Emperor, but was rebuffed. Emperor Scoutsout, it seems, blamed himself for the reversals of fortune suffered by the Imperial Army of late, and had lost himself in Ivory, uh, snorting, or eating it, I guess, or whatever it is you do with Ivory that makes it a luxury. Anyway, as I was saying, the young villager, thrown out by the Samurai guardsmen- Samurai could not take the field of battle because they hadn’t been invented yet-went and wandered the streets of the capital. After taking a turn down a particularly dark alley, he found himself in a tomb of some sorts. A horrific specter materialized in front of the young villager. The apparition wore the uniform of an Imperial General, his abdomen split open and his bowels spilled out. Puss and rancid blood dripped from the gaping wound. The villager shrieked, and turned to flee, but was paralyzed by the unholy speech of the ghost:

“STOP”

The villager stopped.

“I AM THE GHOST OF CHRISTMAS PAST!”

The villager was confused, “What is Christmas?”

“WAIT. I MEANT TO SAY ‘I AM THE GHOST OF BRIGADIER GENERAL DECEASED HORSE. I KNOW WHY YOU HAVE COME TO THE CITY, FARMER. FOR GENERATIONS MY SOUL HAS BEEN TRAPPED IN THIS HORRIFIC STATE. I AM FOREVER CONDEMNED BY MY INABILITY TO SHOW UP ON TIME FOR BATTLE AND MY GENERAL PROCRASTINATION.”

“Wow, that kinda sucks.”

“YOU ARE A MASTER OF UNDERSTATEMENT, FUNNY GUY. NOW IS THE TIME FOR MY REDEMTION. THE EMPEROR REFUSES TO COMMAND THE ARMY. I HAVE FINALLY SHOWN UP ON TIME.”

With that, the ghost possessed the poor farmer. Marching back to the Imperial Cave, the ‘farmer’ laid waste to the Samurai guarding the Emperor. Bursting in the front door, the possessed fiend faced down Emperor Scoutsout XI.

“Who-Who are you?”

“REDEMTION. GIVE ME COMMAND OF YOUR ARMIES, AND WE MAY YET DEFEAT THE ACCURSED NAVIGATOR AND HIS MINIONS!”

“Why do you talk like that?”

“BECAUSE I AM AN UNHOLY WRAITH TRAPPED BETWEEN LIFE AND DEATH, AND ALSO BECAUSE I SUFFER FROM VOICE IMMODULATION DISORDER…”
(SNL reference)

And so it was that the ghost of General Deceased Horse took command of the Emperor’s legions.


Preturn: Not really applicable

Turns 1: I send the vet spear in Izumo to attack the Chinese warrior. He redlines, but manages a victory and even gets promoted to Elite. The 1/3 regular archer in Izumo can now actually reach Kagoshima, and moves in to defend the city. The veteran spearmen and Scout’s little buddy move off the hill and garrison the now-vacant Izumo. Move a regular archer and veteran swordsmen out of Edo to Izumo. The settler follows. Once Nagoya has been dealt with, I will be able to muster sufficient forces to begin extending the depth of our frontline, but not before we deal with the Portuguese incursion. Furthermore, a good long-term goal would be to get spears into every mountain square, but I figure that would require a good dozen to do so. Edo itself could theoretically fall; but it has a fortified elite spear on a mountain, so it should hold against two regular archers. Lux tax to 40%.

IBT: The Portuguese decline to challenge our dung-in defenders along the mountain range, which I have christened Bede’s Bane range because it sounds cool and we need a common frame of reference. The Portuguese now have 7 archers and 1 spearmen in the foothills of Bede’s Bane. The archers near Nagoya retreat to the city, except for one that remains on a hill outside the city. Mao shows up and will give us peace for our new 9gpt income. Send his ambassador back to him sans head. In his fury, Mao orders an amphibious landing to the west of Izumo. The Portuguese land two archers nearby. The crew of our brave curragh, the IJN Yamato, spots a yellow galley. The Chinese and Portuguese galleys will have to contend with a trio of Uzbek triremes which just sailed out of the fog to the south. The remaining barb horsemen head west, almost certainly targeting Osaka.

Turn 2: The Yamato makes contact with William of the Dutch. We could actually afford Mathematics; it would take almost all of our income (9gpt) however. I make the trade-we need catapults on-line immediately. Slay 3 of the 4 units landed last turn; one archer promotes to elite.

IBT: Lose an exposed archer to Portuguese marines. Three Portuguese archers leave Nagoya and head north. Two additional Portuguese archers show up. The Yamato witnesses an epic battle between a lone Aztec warrior and a massive SoD of Barbarian horsemen. The regular warrior fends of at least a dozen if not more barb horsemen, promoting all the way to elite before finally falling. The barbs kill the settler he was escorting. The Chinese slug it out with Uzbek galleys, but are unfortunately victorious.

Turn 3: Elite sword defeats one of the Portuguese archers in the hill of Nagoya, other units are set to pounce on them once they leave the hills. Scout’s little buddy loses 4 straight hp attacking Portuguese marines (regular archers, in the open…) but manages to win, barely.

IBT: Scout’s little buddy falls. Lose one archer; kill one archer in the battles outside of Nagoya. Portuguese archers continue to stream across Bede’s Bane. I screw up majorly and leave a worker exposed, and the barbarian horsemen destroy it

Turn 4: Shigo defeats the last of the Portuguese archers in the northern hills around Nagoya, losing 2hp but promoting to veteran. There are four archers in attack range of Izumo, covered by a spearmen. No, there are 7 archers in attack position. Vet sword kills a spear. Regular sword dies trying to kill the now-exposed archer stack. Bad choice on my part. Pull the Elite spearman out Edo and move him to Izumo. We are so short on troops that I am forced to use a newly-produced spear to attack a barb horsemen who could disconnect our Iron from most of our cities if he pillaged the road he was standing on. Spear wins, barely.

IBT: Lose the spear to another barb rider. The Portuguese bypass Izumo and continue moving east. I may be accidentally guilty of pulling the AI’s “Puppet Strings” as I had left Nara defenseless last turn. Kyoto riots somehow; I check the city on the following turn and it has 1 happy, 1 content, and 1 unhappy citizen. Very strange.

Turn 5: Scout’s other buddy defeat the Portuguese archer in the outskirts of Kyoto. Shuffle guys around, trying to contain the damage.

IBT: Portuguese troops continue to stream towards Nara. Lose an archer outside of Kyoto. Barbarians pillage our Íron road.

Turn 6: Lose one warrior killing that damned horseman. Two horsemen still fortified directly south of Nagasaki, but seem to be just hanging around right now. Our first catapult comes online, lobs rocks at Portuguese archers passing by Izumo.

IBT: Lose yet another warrior to the barbarians. The Portuguese, perhaps no longer willing to attack Nara now that it is defended by an Elite Sword, turn and attack Izumo (Thank God, it is probably our best defended city at this point) Our veteran spearmen promotes to elite, and our two elite spearmen kill a total of four Portuguese archers. The Portuguese start on SUN TZU’S ART OF WAR. Ugh.

Turn 7: Whip walls in Izumo. Whip spear in Edo. Found Sapporo, out in the desert. Elite sword moves into attack position outside of Nagoya; mostly to whale on any archers heading north.

IBT: Portuguese archers attack Izumo; since it lacks a barracks, our still-wounded spearmen are not at their best and one elite spearmen falls, taking three Portuguese archers with him. Portuguese spearmen will likely pillage our ivory next IBT. A Portuguese galley sinks IJN Musashi.

Turn 8: Shuffle defenders around

IBT: Portuguese keep up their assault on Izumo. Their offensive force is decimated, but they move yet more reinforcements out of Nagoya. The Portuguese do indeed pillage roads and disconnect our precious, precious Ivory, and Osaka riots despite my premptive raising of the luxury tax to 50%.

Turn 9: Catapults go 2 for 2 bombarding the Portuguese besiegers outside of Izumo. Defeat the two spears defending Nagoya, but the city is still held by Portuguese archers who retreated to the city to heal. Osaka has to hire a specialist; we would need to run 70% luxury taxes, which would bankrupt us in a couple of turns. Even with a taxmen, we are still losing money at 50%.

IBT: The Portuguese throw a couple more archers against Izumo with no effect. They rush another Spearmen in Nagoya.

Turn 10: Veteran sword based out of Izumo raids Portuguese positions, dispatching an archer and promoting to elite with no damage incurred.

Notes: We are way behind tech-wise, have no strategic resources or luxuries available. Nevertheless, I think we have turned a corner in the war with the Portuguese. The tide of spears and archers has tapered off and we should be able to finally re-capture Nagoya fairly soon. I’m just glad the Portuguese went after Izumo and decimated their offensive army for us.

The Save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/BEde02_50AD.SAV)

Note: I will be out of town for the next week, so consider me autoskipped until I get back.

:rotfl:

I got as far as "GENERAL PROCRASTINATION" and had to find a new keyboard. I spilled a perfectly good glass of merlot into the last one. I am now going to finish reading the log. (But I need a :you_owe_me_a_drink: smiley)

@DeceasedHorse: Nice turns - I had no idea the Portugese Archers would keep streaming across the mountains like that.

This is a rough little game we've gotten ourselves into, but hey - we're still in it!

I've got it. Expect dispatches by tomorrow evening.

Nice resurrection, DH.

We may be around the corner but what, or who, is lurking in the shadows of the wall?

Nice of the English and the Dutch to sell us what we needed.

Wow, a lot happened in the couple of days I wasn't around, huh?

Looks like a couple of better players saved me the shame of losing the game in the AA, but we certainly have some catching up to do. :(

Pre-flight – 50 AD – Well we’re not in as much as a pickle as we once were. Mao wants a city for peace HA! So does Henry. HA! Double HA!!

We need some positive cash flow very soon.

IBT – A couple of Chinese galleys sail by. Sapporo would be easily sacked if there were any units in those galleys. :cringe:

1. 70 AD – Cats go 2 for 3 bombarding units in the open. A spear next to Nagoya which is redlined by the cats and flawlessly killed by an elite sword. Since we have to get positive cash flow, I drop lux by 10%, and hire a tax man and a belly dancer.

IBT – Henry just about empties Nagoya. Five archers and a spear step out and next to Izumo. A SOD of barbs (33 horse & 1 warrior) come out of the fog south of Yokohama.

2. 90 AD – So there are 7 archers within striking range of Izumo. Oh, did I mention the archer that was dropped off next to Kagoshima. I decide that we need to keep Izumo, so I move our elite archer back into the city. Oh, and our curragh is being chased by a Portuguese galley. I send a warrior out of Edo on a suicide mission and he kills one of the archers around Izumo. This game is by no means out of the woods. The IBT will be telling.

IBT – No attack on Izumo. We lose the curragh. No attack on Kagoshima. 8 barb horses move next to Yokohama. The rest move towards the west.

3. 110 AD - Sapporo is now hooked up. Move the workers off towards the iron. Scout’s other buddy takes out an archer. Our elite sword in Izumo takes out a spear. I step out of Yokohama and allow the barbs to have their way with our city.

IBT – Henry wants something ridiculous for peace. We lose 8G to the barbs and a citizen. Henry moves the archers back towards Izumo.

4. 130 AD – Start to threaten Nagoya again. Move lux to 50% and fire the specialsists. We’re break even right now.

IBT – We kill two archers attacking Izumo and lose our elite sword. Izumo riots even though there are two content citizens there. :hmm: Barbs sack Yokohama again and steal 15G. I think they’re done.

5. 150 AD – There are at least three defenders in Nagoya as all three spears are wounded by our cats. Kill a wounded archer trying to heal. Start hooking up the ivory. Move to hook up the iron.

IBT – An archer attacking Izumo dies. The Chinese drop off an archer and a warrior next to Kagoshima.

6. 170 AD – Assault on Nagoya next turn. Scout’s other buddy takes out a spear in the open. Hire some specialists due to the movement of some MPs.

IBT – Our spear in Kagoshima defeats both Chinese attackers. England and Azteca start the Library.

7. 190 AD – Cats go 3 for 5 at Nagoya. We then kill all four defenders and the city is back in our hands. The Portuguese citizen is resisting.

IBT – A volcano SW of Yokohama erupts. Cool video. I have the save if anyone is interested. A single archer counter attacks at Nagoya and dies.

8. 210 AD – Our iron is hooked up again and we start producing swords. We bombard to red and kill a spear and an archer outside Nagoya.

IBT – Our spear guarding the ivory workers is attacked and barely survives

9. 230 AD – We bombard down the last spear and Scout’s other buddy clears our land of Portuguese units for the first time in a long time. Move to secure our frontiers and heal.

IBT – Since no one is building Zeus right now, I decide to start it in Kyoto.

10. 250 AD – Maneuver and heal.

After Action – I have some archers around the countryside for homeland defense. All our cities are now garrisoned. Time to start a road over the mountains and start building cities again. We’ll probably start seeing MDI soon. Cats are very helpful. Are we allowed to make peace with Henry, or does the variant say we have to stay at war until he is dead for his poor decision to raze Tokyo. I wouldn’t mind going to AW with Henry.

Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02,_250_AD.SAV

It would be really, really nice if we got SoZ. :need_a_fingers_crossed_smiley:

I can't remember the name of the town offhand, but it's the one with the wheat. We could pop the occasional settler out of there while Zeus builds. If we could get combinations of archers and swords into those mountains, we might be able to put more resources into settling the area east of the mountains.

I vote AW w/ Portugal. Not for sacking Tokyo, but for killing my Little Buddy. His death must be avenged.

Edit: Nice job getting Nagoya back for us Bugsy! :thumbsup:

Our hilly land makes it very difficult to recapture our cities. We need to keep a garrison on all the coastal cities. It seems Henry has actually figured out how to transport units in his galleys.

What are our chances of getting horses connected? A quick reaction force of 4-5 horses would be nice to have...

Do either horsemen or swords upgrade to Samurai? (It's been a while since I've played Japan...)

Horsemen upgrade to Sams. Do we have horses near by?

Horsemen upgrade to Sams. Do we have horses near by?IIRC, they're only a few tiles from the Ivory, claimed by one of our cities in the mountains. Therein lies the rub - it's a dangerous place for worker turns.

:worship: Well done all!

From the variant rules:
If an AI razes one of your cities, that civ must be eliminated.

Doesn't say anything about AW, but since Henry appears to be the only troublemaker actually on the island, and he qualifies for elimination, let's finish the job if it doesn't set us back even farther than we are. Another question of balance.....

Who's up?

Roster Check
SirLenTaft-over to you
SesnOfWthr-on deck
Bede
scout-reversed the tide of war
DeceasedHorse-rolled them back
Sir Bugsy-reclaimed our lands

We should already have horses hooked up, under Shimonoseki, IIRC.

It would be nice if we can finish settling our area so we don't have to worry about barbs anymore, but of course that means we'll need more MP's.

If we can SAFELY move on Henry, then my vote goes for that, FWIW. I'd like to be able to give him a little back, if you know what I mean... :evil:

IIRC, the variant also calls for us to raze the foreign cities. We'll need to bring some settlers along on our rampage.

I know you guys are probably REALLY anxious to let me at this again, but I think Sir Len is on vacation until sometime around the 8th. If you view his public profile his sig indicates that day, but he must not have enabled his sig to show.

He's in another SG with me, which is the only reason I knew.

Sesn - I have complete confidence in your abilities. You'll do great.

Sesn - I have complete confidence in your abilities. You'll do great.

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Bugsy. :)

IIRC, "all requests for skips are automatically honored", so this is my got it, but dispatches will probably be very late tonight, or possibly tomorrow even.

You've got my vote also.

Anybody who can find Salamanca and a horde of Byzantine cavalry can deal with Henry.

So take it away and have some fun with sharp weapons.

Give 'em hell Sesn! :hammer:

***
He barely recognized these lands, it had been so long.

As Sesn walked back through the streets, fully 30 days removed from his summons to the council, he noticed common traits in all the faces he saw. They were determined and more importantly, they were unafraid. Though these peasants had suffered the agonies of war for quite some time, their spirits would not be broken. Indeed, they had better be strong, the decree to destroy the heathens in the west meant that they would be put to the test for even longer still.

The council had summoned him to answer for his errors, and these people were the reason why. He knew his fate was merely a grain of sand crushed under the wheel of destiny, but the power that was hidden within these people was much greater. One day, they would rule this world, he knew that, and he merely hoped to be around to enjoy it.

Sesn was bothered by his presence here. He had been given a reprieve in a very unforgiving society. Mistakes like his were usually remedied in only one way. He guessed it was due to the aptitude his fellow commanders showed, and they no doubt argued in his favor. One thing was sure though, there could be no more mistakes.

Having reached his headquarters, he set his jaw and went to work….

***

Initial assessment:
We’re down all visible techs to every one but Aztecs. Dead last in score, with less than half of China’s. We’re weak compared to all. Henry is willing to give us HBR, Myst, or writing for peace though. That is surely a good sign.

The good news is, of course, that we have all our cities back, with a modest amount of forces to defend with. The cats would be nice to start moving on the Portugese, but we’ll need a mountain road first.

There is a stack of barbs south of Yokohama. Since we only have 24g, they will probably be allowed to do their damge, but I could also get three spears there before they arrive….

It will also be difficult to peel off any settlers with the current production we have. Workers are actually the biggest problem. I am able to MM five turns off the SoZ (now 20).

IT – Dutch declare on English. Let’s hope they beat on each other for a while. Liz starts Sun Tzu’s. Willie starts Great Lib. (<-- Maybe we could consider a GL slingshot…) five archers move towards Edo.

260 ad (1) – Move MOST of our troops towards Edo to secure the mountains. Evacuate Yokohama.

IT- See an Aztec galley on the backside of our continent. Dutch build Tillburg on SE tip of our continent. Barbs in Yokohama only take 1g each. :D

270 ad (2) – Cats go a healthy 4 for 6 outside Edo. Elite sword kills reg archer, but gets redlined. Vet sword flawless and promotes vs 2/3 archer. SOB (Scout’s other buddy :lol: ) kills 2/3 archer, -2 hp. Vet archer wins vs 2/3 archer, - 2hp.

280 ad (3) – Fortify/heal troops, as I watch the next wave archers approach Edo. A trade must have ended, since we’re suddenly making 12 gpt. I decide to try to buy HBR so we can start making horses, that we can upgrade instead of archers. The best I can do is 8 gpt and 18g, for a net of 178g. We currently make 12gpt at 0 sci, and can research HBR in 6 at 50%, with a surplus of 1 gpt. I decide to research.

IT – Chinese and English start Sistine’s. English may be the runaway, as they’re the only civ that is a republic. Aztecs are in anarchy, and everyone else is a Monarchy.

290 ad (4) – Cats go 5 for 6 outside Edo. These things must be blessed, or something. Elite sword (-2) beats 2/3 archer. SOB flawless vs 2/3 archer. Vet archer loses 2 and promotes vs 2/3 archer. 3/5 sword (-1) wins vs 1/3 archer. Vet sword promotes and disperses Scout’s Aryan camp.

IT – Potugese found Guarda on northern tip of continent.

300 ad (5) – Cats go 3 for 6. SOB flawless vs 2/3 archer. Vet archer (-1) promotes vs reg archer. 3/5 sword flawless vs 1/3 spear.

IT – lose reg spear to reg archer (-1).

310 ad (6) – Cats go 4 for 6. Elite archer (-3) wins vs 2/3 archer. Elite archer (-1) wins vs 2/3 archer. Vet sword wins flawless vs 1/3 archer.

320 ad (7) – I get a 1 turn respite to heal troops and regroup.

330 ad (8) – Make that a 2 turn respite. I would like to be more aggressive, but I can’t take the cats with me and they have been the equalizers thus far.

340 ad (9) – Cats go 4 for 7. Elite sword (-4) wins vs reg archer. Elite sword (-4) wins vs 2/3 spear. SOB loses to a 2/3 archer (-1). Sorry Scout. :( Elite archer loses to 2/3 archer. Vet sword wins vs 2/3 archer. After beating me over the head with a brick this turn, the rng decides to settle up with me:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_MGL.JPG

I will leave the leader for the team to decide his fate, as I won’t have any more leader chances this round anyhow. Reg spear flawlessly disperses an Uzbek encapment.

IT – Dutch and English make nice. Chinese found new Canton on our island. Might be able to talk peace if we can raze it….

350 ad (10) – Regroup my units, fortifying them in Satsuma and Edo. Notice I can afford to upgrade a vet warrior in kagoshima. And so I pass it to the next better player, Brother Bede.

Recap: there is a settler headed for the hills next to Izumo, at least that was my intention. The MGL is waiting in Kagoshima, I might suggest that a sword army could make a big difference for us. As noted, most of our troops are in Edo and Satsuma. Henry originally was focused on Edo, but now seems to be trying to pillage the horses that aren’t hooked up. I was support a large kill ratio until I got burned a bit on turn 9. The MGL kind of makes up for it though. We really need a road over the mountains so we can bring the cats in an advance on Henry. Also, there is still a resisting citizen in Nagoya.
EDIT: Forgot to mention SoZ is due in 9.

***

And thus, Sesn handed the reigns back to his compatriot, feeling somewhat satisfied. He had not fully atoned for his previous transgressions, but it was a beginning.

In the Land of the Rising Sun, there is always tomorrow.

***

>>>SAVE<<< (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/Bede02_350_AD.zip)

Lookin' good! :thumbsup:

My vote is for a sword army. They get an extra move in C3C, and are absolutely deadly.

Oh man - if we manage SoZ... We'd have 3/2/2 AC and a Sword army that could keep up...

Henry shall wear his crown upon a troubled brow.

Sword army! Sword Army! Sword Army!

Pillage! Pillage! Pillage!

Great playing Sesn!!

Let's resettle the Tokyo spot.

Swords and cavalry, swords and cavalry. Nice job, Sesn.

The Navigator shall rue that day....

And now the monk emerges from his mountain hermitage, having exchanged his bright orange robe for sword and buckler...

Ariving in Kyoto by dawn's early light: 'tls only fitting

As the rising sun illiminates the dusty lanes of Kyoto a tall and emaciated soldier slips quietly through the clots of early risers. His sword needs sharpening and his breastplate polishing before he can continue on his way to the meeting place of the Council of Regents. His arrival is unremarked by all but one Daimyo recently arrived from the western battlefields.

Apologies to the team for delay, both Bede and Dell needed defragging...Playing now.

terminator voice/ I'm back /end terminator voice

After a long, hot bath in the volcanic hot springs at Yokohama, Bede collects his armor and sword (all sharp and shiny) and pays his first call on the Council in Kyoto. The Regents have been heartened by the recent victories in the west, but perturbed by the recent arrival of the Dutch and the attitude of the Chinese, who seem determined to poach our territory in the north. The warrior-monk moves quietly among them, engaging in polite converstaion, guaging attitudes, offering words of encouragement. His message is a simple one: "Patience".

He points out that the Portugese lack the resources to build horsemen and swordsmen, that the Dutch offer opportunities for learning the use of new tools, and that the Chinese settlement is small and weak.

"There is a man in Kagoshima who can build an army of swordsman to punish the Portugese. Henry is already tired of war and will offer many concessions for peace, including Guarda in the north. The Chinese were hoodwinked to join in the war against us and will soon grow weary of carrying it forward. A successful attack on New Canton will bring them to their senses. Defend the mountains, and we shall prevail."

To prove his point the monk sends a messenger to the Dutch and buys knowledge of Writing from them. It costs 13gpt but the security it affords is well worth it. Soon the Protugese archers in the mountains will destroy themselves against the bastions at Edo and Satsuma, Tokyo will be rebuilt and we will have might mounted warriors.

The citizens of Kyoto agree to forego their noon meal in order to build the monument allowing the training of powerful horsemen.

1-360AD
Catapaults, archer and swordsmen eliminate the Portugese forces approaching Satsuma and reveal a Portugese Longbow on the plains.

After a long, hot bath in the volcanic hot springs at Yokohama, Bede collects his armor and sword (all sharp and shiny) and pays his first call on the Council in Kyoto. The Regents have been heartened by the recent victories in the west, but perturbed by the recent arrival of the Dutch and the attitude of the Chinese, who seem determined to poach our territory in the north. The warrior-monk moves quietly among them, engaging in polite converstaion, guaging attitudes, offering words of encouragement. His message is a simple one: "Patience".

He points out that the Portugese lack the resources to build horsemen and swordsmen, that the Dutch offer opportunities for learning the use of new tools, and that the Chinese settlement is small and weak.

"There is a man in Kagoshima who can build an army of swordsman to punish the Portugese. Henry is already tired of war and will offer many concessions for peace, including Guarda in the north. The Chinese were hoodwinked to join in the war against us and will soon grow weary of carrying it forward. A successful attack on New Canton will bring them to their senses. Defend the mountains, and we shall prevail."

To prove his point the monk sends a messenger to the Dutch and buys knowledge of Writing from them. It costs 13gpt but the security it affords is well worth it. Soon the Protugese archers in the mountains will destroy themselves against the bastions at Edo and Satsuma, Tokyo will be rebuilt and we will have might mounted warriors.

The citizens of Kyoto agree to forego their noon meal in order to build the monument allowing the training of powerful horsemen.

1-360AD
Catapaults, archer and swordsmen eliminate the Portugese forces approaching Satsuma and reveal a Portugese Longbow on the plains.

The Aztecs are building the Statue of Zeus and the Chinese have started Knights Templar.

3-380AD
Attack Guarda and eliminate the defensive garrison, leaving a longbow in place. The Chinese land two warriors between Yokohama and Satsuma, which are easy prey for the cats and swords at Satsuma. A Chinese MDI sorties out of New Canton. A veteran sword out of Nagasaki kills the MDI. Mishandle the garrison at Izumo and it riots. Two Portugese archers and a longbow are approaching Bede's Bane at Satsuma. A Portugese spearman is in the desert between Edo and Izumo. The cats cripple him but he almost kills an elite sword out of Edo.

4-390AD
Destroy another short stack of archers and longbowmen in Bede's Bane and gain one promotion to elite and another to veteran. Henry will now make major concessions for peace, various combinations of cash, technology and Guarda.

5-7 410AD-420AD