This is my first foray into Succession Games. I don't have a ton of time, so I created this Succession Game for the more casual or time consumed Civ gamer out there. It has slightly looser standards on returning games.

This game's roster will be 5 players. Discussion of rules and settings will be open until August 2nd, when I play the first round. Turns rotation will be 20 for Ancient Era, 15 for Middle Ages, 10 for Industral Revoluation, and 5 for Modern. Players have 36 hours to confirm they have the file/pass control or play automatically defaults to the next player. Players have 7 days to finish their session and post.

Roster:
1) sir_schwick
2)King Alexander
3)Mauer(Current PLayer)
4)Misfit
5)bed_head7

Settings:
Version: C3C Unsure about patch.
Difficulty: Monarch
Size: Large
Landmass: Continents
Sea Coverage: 70%
Temperature: Cool
Climate: Normal
Barbarians: Raging
Civilization: Carthagians
Enemy Civlizations: Random
Victory Conditions: Domination or Conquest
Special Conditions: Normal

Current Game Status:
Well it appears that I have a mutinous crew, so I am just screwing it and doing the settings I got votes for. Here is the results of the voting, we are playing Carthage Large and no special settings. It will be a couple days before I will have the next save-game ready.

Hi, sir_schwick. I'd like to join, if you still have places.

I wish I could join, but I have a vacation soon.

I'm in the roster! Thanks, sir_schwick.

I'd prefer standard map, pangea or continents - 70% water, temperate, wet.
Victory conditions: qonquest or space win.
Civilization: let's see.. I have played in SG's: Greece, Egypt, Germany, Rome, Russia, so, I'd prefer another civ, maybe China. I leave it open for discussion.
Enemy civs: random.

Edit: I have the patch 1.22f for C3C.

Maybe we'd go for a new civ: I haven't played C3C so much.

I would like to play as well sir_schwick

Version: C3C 1.22
Difficulty: Monarch
Size: STD
Landmass: Continents
Sea Coverage: 70
Temperature: Random
Climate: Random
Barbarians: Raging Agree
Civilization: mayan
Enemy Civlizations: Random
Victory Conditions: 20k/100k culture, too many dom/con
Special Conditions: ?
Just ideas

Add me in as well, if you have a place for one more

Version: C3C Unsure about patch. I only have 1.22f
Difficulty: Monarch
Size: ? STD or Large
Landmass: ? Random
Sea Coverage: ? Random
Temperature: ? Random
Climate: ?Random
Barbarians: Raging Agree
Civilization: ? One of the New ones
Enemy Civlizations: ?Random
Victory Conditions: ?
Special Conditions: ?

Of course these would be up to debate but are my pref's

Edit:
It has slightly looser standards on returning games.

What does this mean?

Player Vote

and this?

I'd like to play. I am at the point where Monarch is starting to feel comfortable, and it might be fun to try a succession game on my own skill level (Jumpmasters C is my first SG). And if I end up on the roster, I am fine with all random. Any civ is fine with me, as long as it is not one of the ones we have done recently in GOTMs (edit: Hittites and Dutch in the COTMs, Greeks and Aztecs in Classic). One of the best aspects of succession games is seeing other people's perspective of a game and a civilization as well as playing styles, but that is also true of GOTMs.

Just wondering when this thing is gonna be starting?

Well we could discuss who we want to play. Below is a list of Civ's that I have not played.

Sumerians - Sci & Ag - UU = Enkidu Warrior
Potrugese - Sea & Exp - UU = Carrak
Byzantines - Sci & Sea - UU = Dromon
Dutch - Ag & Sea - UU = Swiss Merc
Arabs - Rel & Exp - UU = Ansar Warrior
Carthaginians - Rel & Mil - UU = Numidian Warrior
Americans - Ind & Exp - UU = F15

Any of these are O.K. with me, I will also play any Civ but I prefer to try out somthing new.

Sumeria, Carthage, Byzantine. Those sound like good ones to give a whirl. But like Mistfit, I would be willing to go with any. I think I might favor Sumeria for this one though.

I agree with the Civs, Mistfit has proposed: I haven't played them, except the Americans(only in epic games I've played them).
I'd like to try Sumerians, Dutch, Arabs and Carthaginians.

It's kinda silly but the reason I've never played the Dutch is because William is so femmy.

I'll finish up the settings tomrrow, so make sure and post. I'll start either Friday or Monday, although I am having people over on the weekend so I can't play then. I'll definitely have the next savegame ready by Tuesday.

Make some suggestions though, casuse I'll just list what seems to be popular suggestions. LIke I said, I'm compiling and posting the choices tomorrow in the top post. Also, until we start, please try to just edit your posts. That way the thread doesn't start to grow until game-time(it'll get plenty big).

@sir_schwick - how do you plan to make the start? 1st time up? get a couple and post - em so we can choose? any more concrete plans for who, what type, and the such one civs land and settings?

@King Alexander - Your Av is one of my Favorites, Lyonesse is a goddess when it comes to Av's.

- Your Av is one of my Favorites, Lyonesse is a goddess when it comes to Av's.
Thank you, Mistfit. I tried to make the photo resized(my favorite canarin) and still look good(tried to be under the rules for custom avatars) but failed, I haven't work that much with paint programs; Lyonesse did a great job. (btw: I like her avatar, too!). Your avatar is very good, also.

EDIT: I'd prefer to play standard or large map.

@ Sir_Schwick: Have you ever looked at using Towlie as a Transperancy?

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/towlie2.gif

If you still had the original file I could clean it up for you if you liked it this way. (not that there is anything wrong with him the way he is)

@ Sir_Schwick: Have you ever looked at using Towlie as a Transperancy?



If you still had the original file I could clean it up for you if you liked it this way. (not that there is anything wrong with him the way he is)

Funny enough, I found it on the internet this size. I'll still post the original, because the transparent version does look better. Thank you misfit.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/Towelie1.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/Towelie1.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/tow2.gifhttp://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/tow1.gif

These might be a bit better than my 1st atempt. If you find the full size version of it let me know. It kinda looks like they are holding hands :lol:

Edit: found another one to try out

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/new_towel.gif

I think I like this one the best

Victory Conditions: Domination or Conquest
Special Conditions: Pre-emptive wars can only be started to aquire a second or first source of a resource or in response to espionage.

How are we going to win by conquest or domination if we can't declare war on someone?

Victory Conditions: Domination or Conquest
Special Conditions: Pre-emptive wars can only be started to aquire a second or first source of a resource or in response to espionage. RoP violation can be considered and acceptable cause for war, althought you have to be able to convince the rest of us they(the AI) were planning a pre-emptive strike and not just be smacktards.
This sounds like it may turn into a cow game, not a Dom/Con. :confused:
Sorry mistfit, didn't read your post. :crazyeye:

After reading your posts I am redefining the special rules:

Our object is to hold monopolies on resources. Here are the reasons you can declare war:
1) In order to prevent another player from owning a certain luxury or strategic resource locally. This means you have to try and capture the all target resources then get to a peace state. You must have all of the target resource to accept peace. You can still keep invading if they refuse to settle. Acceptable peace demands are resources and gpt and techs.
2) Player is caught doing espionage against you. This means stealing techs or maps or anything else that is not passive.
3) Player declares war on someone you trade resources with.
4) To prevent other players from doing pre-emptive strikes. They must be violating your territory and you must be able to convince the rest of us they were planning a sneak attack.

I'll have to think on that. I was kinda hoping to start a non-variant SG. My mind is in a twitter from SGOTM3 and Jumpmasters with the diferent variants there.

We'll see what the ohter players decide, since it is unlikely I'll get involved in a war in the first twenty-turns. I'm not really a rush person.

Does anyone know why the pics I used are showing up as URL links? I used the mini-uploader to get the links to the site and then copy-and-pasted the shortcut using the tag.

I want to play this game, I'm just not so sure about the variant rules either. The rules might work out since it is monarch, but if we play by these rules I don't think dom/con would be our most logical choice. I think the only way to acquire a good chunk of land under these rules would be to mass large amounts of units on all borders. Wait for a civ to default one of the rules, and make a mad rush on their cities. Just my initail thoughts though.

I've see no "movement" in this thread for a while; we're still going to play it?
We could try to keep the "basic" rules, like respect the 20 turns of peace treaties, and RoP's/MPP's, etc...

@King Alexander :rotfl: "Best Thread Ever"

If this is the level of communication that we can expect from this thread I wonder if we will ever get it off of the ground.

Also, until we start, please try to just edit your posts. That way the thread doesn't start to grow until game-time(it'll get plenty big).
If this is the level of communication that we can expect from this thread I wonder if we will ever get it off of the ground.
:confused:
I was coming to check and see if anybody edited their post, but nothing. I was wondering about this too. The name of the game is "Casual", but this might be a little loose for my taste. I think there is less anticipation with one of ainwoods GOTM's :lol: !

But if we are going to get started. What about moving the worker one step south to get a wider view? It looks like the forest there SE will block our view a little. For Mil/Rel, this doesn't look like a good spot. This is Monarch, so maybe a prebuild of War, war, gran prebuild. What do you think?

What map have we decided to accept? Nobody told me.

It is in post #1. I think it is the Large/Carthage.

Actually, I am kind of short on time right now, so I am passing my turn to King Alexander. Here is the save-game. Just use the normal rotation.

I agree that moving the worker 1st is a good plan. Our capital does not look like a great spot for a settler factory. But with a bit of movement we might see somthing further south that would warrant a move in that direction. (cow, river)

Edit: How many civ's are on a large map? I normally play standard size. My suggestion on the research is to dial up the space race screen to see who were up against, and make a judgement call on what their starting techs are. Then start on somthing else for trade

Edit: How many civ's are on a large map? I normally play standard size. My suggestion on the research is to dial up the space race screen to see who were up against, and make a judgement call on what their starting techs are. Then start on somthing else for trade
I'm not sure how many. I usually play standard as well. That sounds like a good idea though. Just waiting for King Alex to fill us in.

I'll look at the save, some time today and say what I'm thinking(at work now).

I agree to move the worker 1 east-west.
I'm not sure that the F10 works in Qonquests(to see your rivals). So, with what tech we'll begin? Pottery, max?

Build order: warrior, couragh, warrior, settler(or one more warrior before the settler)?

I believe, if not tomorrow, Suturday I'll post the save.

have fun. I look forward to a couple of screenshots (hint, hint)

Note: I have trouble uploading screenshots: I never manage to upload one, no matter how many times I try(and I need at least 10min for each try).

>>SAVE<< (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/Casual1-CarLarge_3050BC.SAV)

Ok, here we go.

I move the worker, south-west to the BG, we spot spices and 2 more BG’s.

4000BC (1)
Settle on spot, and Carthage is founded(start warrior): we have tundra and 2 more spices at north.

It’s not the best area to settle, but we’d lose valuable moves, and I don’t see any cattle/wheat around.

Start on writing, minimum: I hope, someone will trade BW with us.

3950BC (2)
Worker starts road.

3900BC (3)
zzzzzz

3850BC (4)
Worker finishes road, starts mine.

3800BC (5)
zzzzz

3750BC (6)
Carthage: warrior => warrior.

3700BC (7)
zzzzzzz

3650BC (8)
worker finishes mine, goes to road another BG. Keep exploring.

3600BC (9)
Keep exploring. Worker starts road in another BG.

3550BC (10)
Carthage: warrior => warrior.

3500BC (11)
Our borders expand, worker finishes road, starts mine. I won’t pop the goody hut south of Carthage(barbs roaming). We spot pink borders, east of Carthage.

3450BC (12)
We spot a choke point, west of Carthage.

3400BC (13)
Carthage: warrior => settler.

3350BC (14)
I enter inside the pink borders, on a hill, as I want to have contact(they didn’t contacted me when I was outside).

IBT
Our neighbours are the Incans.
They know Pottery, WC, and CB. I’ll trade: I offer Alphabet for Pottery + 35g(all they had). I could also buy WC, but they wanted all our gold(63) + 1gpt, and I don’t want to begin gpt deals so early. Anyway, if you wish, you can make the deal on next player’s turns.

3300BC (15)
Nothing.

3250BC (16)
An Incan settler/warrior pair, goes towards north-west(to our side, I bet). We still have 4 turns, before our settler is “ready”.

3200BC (17)
Keep exploring.

3150BC (18)
Nothing.

3100BC (19)
I forgot to tell: I didn’t popped up a goody hut, south of Carthage(barbs roaming, and we have only 3 warriors.

IBT
The Incans settled south-east of Carthage, at the spot I wanted to settle.

3050BC (20)
Settler is due the next turn. 1 warrior should escort him.

Summary
We started right next to Incans, as it seems. They got a good spot for their 2nd city, before we could finish our settler, as we haven’t a cattle or a wheat nearby, and I didn't find any on the nearby area. Maybe we'll find one,who knows?
After the settler, we could make a few more warriors; 1 should explore the area after the choke point, definetly.
South of Carthage, there are 2 sugars and 1 oasis.
We should try to settle the are south of Carthage, before they cut us(we weren’t lucky at our starting point).

EDIT: I somehow, started to wish an early war with Carthage: be it with archers or swords (probably with archers, after 1-2 more cities?).

Ok, I got the save. What kind of setup are we looking for. We don't have to follow RCP in conquest right? Sure wish we had a better spot for Carthage than that. We'll probably be looking for a palace jump right. If I'm wrong, C3C is pretty new to me.

Since we are on continents, how about a curragh for exploration?

Pre-turn: Noticed 2 warriors were pulling MP. Since this is Monarch, I went ahead and sent one scouting south. Not sure if I would have built a settler first, probably granary considering the slow growth start we have anyways. Also changed research from 20 to 10%. Same amount of turns.

3000BC- Build settler=warrior. Move the settler to the choke area. So far not many good spots, but that looked the best to me :confused: .

2950- Just moving

2900- see above

2850- Found Utica set to warrior. Incas have BW now on top of WC and CB. Won't trade either one.

2800- Carthage builds a warrior=granary. get 25g from GH.

2750- not much

2710- Our warrior scout sees a blue line.

2670- Contact the Mayans. They are up BW,CB, and WC. we trade Alph+128g for BW and WC.

2630- Utica builds a warrior=barracks?, send him west.

2590-not much

To the west we have some wheat. Still shouldn't help much though. However, just a little S-SE there are flood plains. Just a guess, but we'll probably be considering a palace jump right? Wasn't sure about the barracks, maybe another worker or something? Feel free to critique and/or change. http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/mauercar.JPG
EDIT:Maybe a save would be nice as well.

@Mauer: the second warrior wasn't acting as a second MP. I had him there, so he would escort the settler. If we had sedentary or no barbs, I wouldn't care, but we have restless barbs, and also, Carthage is nearby(they could have been tempted to attack an undefended city). Just wanted to explain my moves. I reported that on my last turn.

We could now build the granary, if we want, but the first thing with Carthage so close, was to find a second city ASAP. A granary takes some time to be completed, and a second city before it, offers great help. I generally go with a settler(when the city's pop is closing 3 or 4), before I build a granary.

Our worker is fast enough, and we should be ok with 1 worker for 2 cities so close. Utica should build the barracks, and begin with many archers. As for the granary, it really depends on our situation, I think. If we're going for an early war, barracks, a and another settler(maybe a couple of archers before, so our capital doesn't drops to pop1 again) would be best. I'm reffering to archers(maybe we'd buy the WC from Incans), because I think it woudn't be the best choice to have our GA so early(if we built our UU, the NM).

Anyway, that's only an idea: I'll go with what the team decides.

Turns rotation will be 20 for Ancient Era, 15 for Middle Ages, 10 for Industral Revoluation, and 5 for Modern. Players have 36 hours to confirm they have the file/pass control or play automatically defaults to the next player. Players have 7 days to finish their session and post.

Are you going to play the other 10 or no? Let me know. I would get a curragh out as soon as possible , we need to meet more people. Also we need to but the fog to the south of us to see where we should be settling. I tend to build a bit tighter that what you have started. I like to have my early cities go city-tile-tile-city. This makes it possible to defend the cities easier if they can make it there in one turn. If we are going domination/conquest we will not likely ever need more that 12 tiles for any city to use. This of course is my humble opinion. Feel free to argue with me :D

Are you going to play the other 10 or no?
Sorry, missed that one, will play them right now.
I tend to build a bit tighter that what you have started. I like to have my early cities go city-tile-tile-city.
Well, I wasn't really sure about this. I think you are right, and all the consequences will be blamed on me. Sorry.
Feel free to argue with me :D
Not a chance :p . I have read your gamepost before, and have alot to learn from you.
@King- Sorry didn't mean to sound snotty. Just comes across that way as type and no tone of voice :lol: .

Sorry about the lapse. Here is the rest.

2550BC- nothing but exploring

2510- Just find a barb camp

2470- Barb attacks southern warrior and it loses. Build a curragh in carthage, set to barracks. Contact Babylon via a bab warrior. They are down alphabet and up CB. Trade staight up.

2430- Southern warrior attacks a barb, losing 2hp and wins becoming a veteran. Inca have a worker for sale, but they want 101g + 1gpt. Think it is too much so I don't push it.

2390- Spot a good hut

2350- zzzzz

2310- Inca and Maya have the wheel. They both will take 113g + 4gpt. I think we can catch up in some of these techs once we get writing, and it won't cost near as much.

2270- zzzzzz

2230- pop a GH and get 25g

2190- nothing

Carthage grows in 1, barracks in 1
Utica grows in 4, barracks in 3.
Didn't know what else to build, growth is too slow for a settler right now. maybe build a settler from carthage next. Like Mistfit said, expansion to the S, SE is probably the best way to go. Would force the Incans and Mayans to settle some unpopular territory.

Sorry about the lack of exploring to the direct south, got tied up with some barbs down there. Barbs are infesting the western peninsula, the south, and the north east Tundra.

Being the casual game that it is I may not play until wed or thurs of this week so if Sir Schwick wants to pick up the save in the interum I'd have no problem with that. Just let me know.

A little note about myself: I have a lot more time on-line (at work) than I do for playing at home. I am at the office 60-70 per week and I do sales so I have quite a bit of down time. That's how I am able to post here so much. It is also why this SG was appealing to me. I enjoy the discussion of playing as much as the playing itself. I have found that since I joined CFC my game skills have improved immensely. I went from a struggling regent player to a fairly confident Empreror player in a matter of months.

If I am talking to much let me know. Also I agree that :
@King- Sorry didn't mean to sound snotty. Just comes across that way as type and no tone of voice
Please never take offense to what I say unless I specifically tell you to take offense to a comment :lol:

Please never take offense to what I say unless I specifically tell you to take offense to a comment
For example: Mistfit, why don't you pipe down and let the rest of us get in some ideas! JK! actually I like alot of posting. Check out my SGOTM3 teams thread count, and at 300 and something, I have about 1/3rd of them. Reason I wanted to play this one too is time. A wife and 2 kids, and 50 hours a week. So if we want to use the amount of time alotted by Sir_schwick, that is fine. Just give everyone a timeframe like you did Mistfit.

Exactly! Or actually I can even make it better:

Take Offense To the Following

Bite me Mauer

Exactly! Or actually I can even make it better:

Take Offense To the Following

Bite me Mauer
HHMMMmmm. Seems we have a rebellious and offensive poster amongst us :lol: .
EDIT:When our fearless leader returns, me thinks he will not care too much for our CASUAL spamming :mischief: .

HHMMMmmm. Seems we have a rebellious and offensive poster amongst us :lol: .

That's why I like him :goodjob: Keep up the good work, Mistfit :)

Back on topic: I don't know about you, but I think, we shouldn't play before sir_schwick posts his suggestions/comments. After all, this is his SG. The rules are clear, and we're in no hurry to play. I enjoy to discuss about strategies a lot.

@Mauer: I don't mean to offend you; it's not my thing to do. I was just explaining my suggestions. I don't like "wars" with my SG-mates. We can all be benefitted from SG's, at least that's the reason I participate.

We should discuss about our strategy, as we're waiting sir_schwick to post his suggestions.
As I said, I think that we won't be benefitted much from granary and settler factory from our current position.
The best we can do, IMHO, is to get ready for war. Barracks in both cities, have them build many archers. Carthage could begin to build another settler, when it goes to pop4: until then, it could help with building units.
A tighter city placement is good for our current position.

If you have the save look at it and possibly suggest the next couple of city placements. I'll do the same if I have time today. IMO I think that we should stop trading for techs until we meet a few more people. Then we can play them between each other and get the techs cheaper. I also like "pointy-stick" research but that will not come into play until later. I'm currently playing 2 no research variants where we can never research anything. Both are on Emperor and in both cases we have been the tech leader through the game so far by good trading and good war mongering. :hammer:

Edit:Here are my initial thoughts

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/casual.jpg

1st off: This is pretty crappy lands around us. A whole lot of white and brown tiles. We will need to find somplace to put our FP that has a good food/shield potential. In a conquest or domination game we will need settlers through-out the game. For now we will need to pull them from where ever we can.

2nd: I believe that the lake to the NE of us is fresh water so we need to use that to our advantage.

3rd: my oppinion is to head for A, B, and C first. But that may change as the fog is busted.

4th: When we do choose to go to war with our neighbor if Tiwanaku razes when we take the city we may want to settle it one tile north. If not no big deal.

Much of this is a bit early to talk about but I thought I'd throw some of this out there for discussion. Let me know what you think.

Sorry for the delay.

I usually try to take a single or couple enemy cities with my first couple warriors. This is usually crippling to most opponents. Of course I have never played against the INcans so I don't know how well they do early. I'm guessing our window may have passed, if it hasn't try to get the techs they wouldn't trade in peace.

As for city sites, I have a preference for A(as do everybody), mostly b/c it is on fresh water and I can see the terrain. F does not look bad, since it could have good production, and slow pop growth could be handled with workers or a harbour.

Of course I am a relative newbie, so remember that if you decide to take any of my advice.

@Sir_Schwick: Do you want to pick this up and run with it or would you prefer to wait till after I get to it (prolly tomorrow night or thurs) Also please consider using one of the other Avatar's that I cleaned up. The one you have right now is dithered quite a bit around the edges so it looks a bit blocky.

Ok, Mistfit. First you call me stupid for my city placement, then you say sir_schwick is ugly, and then you say King is a nancy boy, will it ever stop :lol: . J/K, actually you didn't call king a nancy boy, just thought I would throw that in there :p .

Well, the land is crappy! I wish I could have gotten that warrior to explore more of that southern area. I think (hope) there is better land down there to get us rolling along. All of the games I have played with or as INCA/Mayans they really sucked. Except for culture anyways. At least there production isn't really any better than ours. Also I agree with A and B being the best to go with.

@sir_schwick-I am actually fairly new to this as well. So we might be depending on Mistfit and King for most of the opinions and outlooks. And I don't think our window has passed necessarily, as far as an extremely early war. If that's what is decided. Just my one cent. The wife has the other one.

We might be in trouble if we are depending on me :eek:

then you say sir_schwick is ugly
I did not! I had turned his avatar into a transparency for him and my 1st try was not as good as the second attempts. :ack:

I did not! I had turned his avatar into a transparency for him and my 1st try was not as good as the second attempts.
Ok, I may have thrown that in there too. But the fact remains that Mauer is still stupid for his city placement. Hey wait a minute :eek: .

Really it is all a matter of preference. Some like to place 'em close others prefer the OCP. I have seen the power of tight city placements. This is a pic of our homeland from Jumpmasters 1B: Power is Knowledge (Vanilla, GOTM mod - Emperor - No research) this is the no research SG I'm in as a "silver wing" (student) and I have picked up lots and lots of great ideas here
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/WOW2.JPG
We went ring placement of 3 - 6 - and 9.

I was under the impression, maybe wrong though, that RCP wasn't a factor in Conquest :confused:
And now I suppose you are gonna tell me I'm ugly too :cry: .
300 post! 300 post!

We might be in trouble if we are depending on me
I really haven't any choice but to say, "Mistfit, we're depending on you! You're our Great Leader, guide us wisely, so our Empire will stand the test of time!!!"

I like your dot map, especially the lake with fresh H2O. I say, let's get them now! Let Utica build it's barracks, crank out archers like crazy, and go after them. Their UU, is 1-1-2(good that it has a 2 movement: it can flee easier from our *future* mighty archers!).
Maybe we'd built a 3rd city, settler when our capital has pop 4, and have a spear in our cities: they will be history in no time.

EDIT: 1-2 spears combined with our archers, and the Incan UU wouldn't touch us.

btw: for a moment I thought that we were 4 players in this SG, but I looked at the roster. bed_head7, where are you?

I like the lets crank out archers idea. I'm really not a big spearman builder though. IMHO defensive units, are pretty much just a waste of shields unless you are on a really tough map settings. No spoiler info here for SGOTM3, but I know we didn't build one single spearman, and we didn't miss them one bit. Why not just build the att units and make them build the def units. Just my opinion though.

Spearmen in the cities are always discouraging sneack attacks in the higher levels.
btw: since the legionary is 3-3-1, why to bother to build spearmen?

Archers have 1 defence: the Incan UU has also 1 defence, but 2 movement, so it can attack and retreat(if losing). That's why we should have 1-2 spearmen with our SoD.
If they build many spears, we're in trouble: we'd need MANY archers to get them.
Right now, they don't have a major force, and they're busy, trying to settle the land, which means, they will not be prepared for an attack.

EDIT: btw: it's not much fun to lose our archers from enemy warrriors: spears are very useful to protect our SoD(so they'd not kill our half SoD until we're in position to strike).

Good point there. I think you are right. But also remember that the AI views our military strength pretty much the same way we view theres. Like att+def+experience=strength. At least I believe this to be true. If I am wrong, feel free to correct me.

I don't know if the AI only views the just the number of units and/or what type of units the player has.

Anyway, if we have a spear in every city, let them to attack it with many warriors: we may get a GL, who knows?

EDIT: I forgot!!!! :eek: Our UU is the NM, so we can't build spears(like Greece can only built hoplites). That's changing our plans. DON'T build them(not now, anyway: we want to avoid a despotic GA). We could go as soon as we have 6-8 archers, while our cities would constantly built units.

Your probably right, besides, your turn is before mine and we'll probably get them then :)

Can you get GL's from defending? I never have.

IMHO a few spears is not a problem especially for a SoD. I do not like paying for lots and lots of them though I'd prefer to go the warrior to sword upgrade.

Can you get GL's from defending? I never have.

I have gotten a few, but the attacking unit should be weak(warrior) or obsolete, and the defending unit should hold for 5-6 successive attacks. Ig you noticed, when you lose many units to get an AI city with tough defenders(infantries, mech infantries), there's always a GL that you destroy when you get the city.

IMHO a few spears is not a problem especially for a SoD. I do not like paying for lots and lots of them though I'd prefer to go the warrior to sword upgrade.
I like to upgrade my warriors, too.

Good point on the GL in cities I have attacked. I always figured they came from somwhere else. Where? I never put to much thought into it.

@Misfit
I just need to go back up and find the 2nd version of the Towelie avatar.

@Everyone else
Warriors are 20 shields less then NM, and 10 shields less than Archer. I think we can possibly build a few warriors and rush a couple archers in the next 10-20 turns. This would allow us to take one, maybe two cities from the INcans. It would at least cripple them and provide the cities we would lose from not building settlers. We could also get a couple techs out of it. But lets vote on how to handle an early strike. BTW, continue on the rotation.

These might be a bit better than my 1st atempt. If you find the full size version of it let me know. It kinda looks like they are holding hands :lol:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/tow1.gifhttp://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/tow2.gif
Edit: found another one to try out

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/new_towel.gif

I think I like this one the best

Which one? :lol:

I like that bottom one there better.
I don't know. I think our #1 priority needs to be finding a spot that can build us some settlers at a decent rate of speed. I guess this would also be a good point for an early attack. Were hampered by slow growth, so hamper them by giving 'em a beating. So I vote to agree with going with what the outcome of the vote is. bedhead huh? where did he go?

@mauer: A good spot to have a settler factory would be nice, but in our current situation we can wait. I don't think that our #1 priority is a settler factory at this situation.

@sir_schwick: are you suggesting to attack with warriors or upgrade them to swords? It can take some time until we could connect the iron(which we don't have a chance to have, with our current land), and it could be late by then. Archers can bombard in C3C: we should take advantage from it. Also add, that they can be upgraded to longbowmen later.
The Incans are trying to settle the land right now: they're wasting their strength and they need some time until they can connect their iron and make enough swords. We'd just have to keep pumping archers and go after them, when our SoD is outside their cities(if we enter inside their borders the turn we declare, we'd not spoil our reputation. After all, archers, don't have 2 movement and we can't attack immediately, even if we wanted to).

Anyway, I'll go with what the team decides.
Does anyone know where is bed_head7? We haven't heard of him yet.

EDIT: Important: don't build NM's yet. We can defend our cities with offensive units(archers), if you know how to take advantage from it(attack first, don't wait to defend).

What are NM's?

What are NM's?
Numidian Mercenaries, Carthage's UU: 2-3-1. See it as an Hoplite with offence, and the same cost(30 shields). BW is required.

Cool I told you I had never played as Carthage

This is my first game with Carthage, so I'm also "rookie" with this civ!

After some persuading by King I am convinced. I say we start preparing to get at them with archers. That's my vote. just waiting for schwicky and bed head. Read in another SG that he hasn't been online since the 6th or something. RL probably.

@King Alexander
I do not remember the exact population-shield number for C3C. If I'm right, after one turn of building you can use 1 citizen to pop rush an archer. What I am saying is build a couple warriors until your citiesa are pop 3. Then rush an archer. Then build archers normal or work on possible expansion. This will allow us to have a couple archers and plenty of warrior to get beaten up. According to my timetable, it sa max of 15 turns or so until our entrie force can go out. I do not want to wait till Iron, but rather rush while they are focused on expansion.

BTW whose go is it?

@sir_schwick: I don't think it's good to pop-rush any unit at this stage. Archers cost some shields, and if our pop is high, the city could built them quickly every time. We'd severe cripple our growth if we rush units, at the cost of citizens.
If we decide to go to war, we should focus on high shields, so we can produce archers faster, otherwise, if we rush units, we'd be at an even level with the AI who's trying to make settlers(loosing it's power from growth).
We could start building a settler later, when our capital has high pop, like 4-5 or more, if we can afford to raise the lux. By then, we should have taken the first Incan city.
What do you think of settling near the wheat at some point and build a granary?

I still don't understand the value of attacking with warriors. The AI would have spears, why should we attack with warriors? If you think, that we'd upgrade them later, i'd like to upgrade our warriors later too, but there wouldn't be any warrior left to be upgraded, if we go against spears.

Archers haven't good defence, but they have 2 offence, and they can "behave" like a catapult, if attacked. Better have our cities with high pop and shields and build them quickly and in sufficient numbers.

6-8 archers should be enough to take at least the Incan city close to us, move forward, while our cities keep sending reinforcements. Gather them together, and be outside their borders, when we'll declare, then enter inside and step on that hill.

btw: team-mates: nobody forces you to accept my plan, we could decide another approach to the game. I just made a judgement that we should go to war early, because we have crappy land for a settler factory(but with high shields for our current cities), AND(more important) we have an AI right next to our starting position.

I'm still not familiar with C3C and it's gambits, because I haven't played so many games in C3C. I've read about this "Republic gambit", where you get a free tech if you research CoL and Philosophy first, and then you get to choose a free tech. We should run the highest science we can afford every time, so we get that advantage?
Suggestions?

EDIT: The Incan UU is 1-1-2, which means, can kill and go away, or retreat if losing. At least, archers would "bomard" first.

Really, feel free to suggest another plan or approach to the game. I think, each of you has a plan in his mind. Just tell it. sir_schwick stated some thoughts, that's good. We have enough time to discuss.

@sir_schwick: I don't think it's good to pop-rush any unit at this stage. Archers cost some shields, and if our pop is high, the city could built them quickly every time. We'd severe cripple our growth if we rush units, at the cost of citizens.
absolutely, with our slow growth as it is anyways, we certainly don't want to kill them off for a unit or 2
What do you think of settling near the wheat at some point and build a granary?
Sounds good.
I still don't understand the value of attacking with warriors. The AI would have spears, why should we attack with warriors? If you think, that we'd upgrade them later, i'd like to upgrade our warriors later too, but there wouldn't be any warrior left to be upgraded, if we go against spears.
Your'e both right depending on when we go to war. If an early war, which I am more inclined for now, then we need archers. I think he was talking about a later war in which case we would need more warriors to upgrade.
6-8 archers should be enough to take at least the Incan city close to us, move forward, while our cities keep sending reinforcements. Gather them together, and be outside their borders, when we'll declare, then enter inside and step on that hill.
I agree here as well, with luck 6-8 might even take his other one as well ;) .

btw: team-mates: nobody forces you to accept my plan, we could decide another approach to the game.
I guess I shouldn't tell anybody about the threatening PM you sent me :lol: .
We should run the highest science we can afford every time, so we get that advantage?
Suggestions?
I hate to sound like I don't have a mind of my own and am just agreeing with everything. But some good advice here, and I agree with this as well.

I guess I shouldn't tell anybody about the threatening PM you sent me :lol: .

Ok, I admit it :mischief: Sometimes, the "little" Goebbels that's hiding inside me, takes control over things! :scan:

I hate to sound like I don't have a mind of my own and am just agreeing with everything. But some good advice here, and I agree with this as well.
But you don't have a mind of your own! That mind belongs to Sid(M), a fine tactician, and game developer, and a gentleman as well! It's good that we have such a fine and noble warrior to our team!

back on topic: So, bed_head7 is on vacation?

BTW whose go is it?

I beleive it is mine. I plan to play my 20 tonight or tomorrow. I doubt that I will go to war in my turnset unless you really think it necessary. I will however try to set up the next player to do some :hammer: 'ing. Let me know.

Mistfit, how about you prepare the next player for some Injan hunting. If somewhere IBT your 20 turns you feel the opportunity is ripe, then let her rip. :)

Sounds like a plan. I may play over a couple of days if I get tired tonight so I may give updates. Or I may just playit all tonight. Early games go fairly quickly for me.

Sorry about no response. You guys talked a lot the last few days! I was unexpectedly without internet access, but I am definitely still here and playing. I will read through all your posts, and maybe chime in somewhere.

That's alright bedhead. Remember the name of the game is Casual.

The Save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/Casual1_1550__BC.SAV)

PreTurn:
Ok everything looks good
The Myan and the Incan want our whole treasury for the wheel...nah, as much as I'd like to see horses I wait.
Our island has at least 3 unique lux's on it which bodes well for us in the future. Silk, which we are connected to, wine and fur.
The water to the NE is indeed fresh as it offers 2/0/2 instead of 1/0/1.
Writing due in 11
8gpt
Our grand army consists of 1 worker, 6 warrior, and one curragh
Everyone we know is annoyed with us. Oh well it will get worse before it gets better.
It is nice to start with masonry as it gives us a good pre-build with the pyramids

IBT
Carthage builds Rax starts on an Curragh in 3 (we really need to know more people)
Utica gets hooked

Turn 1 (2150BC)
vWarrior kills barb camp -2hp no promo gain 25 gold
rWarrior kills barb camp flawless no promo gain 25 gold
Wake both warriors out of our cities and send them exploring in the south, no need for MP yet happiness is fine, we need this map exposed

IBT
Northern rWarrior gets attacked twice and promo's twice to Elite
The people admire my ability to be attacked so they expand our cave. I have them install underground sprinklers so I have someplace to chip and putt.

Turn 2 (2110BC)
Busting the fog
zzz....

IBT
Utica Rax to Archer in 3
The Incan are building the Pyramids for us. How Nice of them. Less units

Turn 3 (2070BC)
The Incan have learned IW, still no deals
The Babs will sell HBR for 180, I accept
Two horses in site one directly to our North and One further to our NW. We prolly won't be able to expand over the second one Quick enough to keep it from the other civs.
Pop Goodie hut in the NW and gain 25 gold

IBT
Carthage Curragh to Archer in 3

Turn 4 (2030BC)
Busting the fog

IBT
Get attacked by Conscript Warrior no promo to vWarrior

Turn 5 (1990BC)
Moving fort wounded Warrior on southern hill

IBT
Zzzz....

Turn 6 (1950BC)
Zzzz....

IBT
Carthage Archer to Archer in 3
Utica Archer to Archer in 4

Turn 7 (1910BC)
Zzz...

IBT
Zzzz...

Turn 8 (1870BC)
Zzzz....

IBT
Myans learn Mysticism

Turn 9 (1830BC)
How did the pink Scout get past our block of the island to our West?
Finding lots of furs in the cold North

IBT
Carthage Archer to Archer in 3 Last one then Settler

Turn 10 (1770BC)
Move one rWarrior into Carthage for MP will grow to 4 next turn

IBT
Zzzz...

Turn 11 (1790BC)
Zzzz...

IBT
Pachacuti wants 26 gold or else...I cave in but add him to the top of the list to kick from the planet
Writing comes in and we start on Lit
We Can do Embassies, so I do.

Incan for 35
Cuzco is size 3
9f/7s/7g for the city
Pyramids in 46
Have 2 spears MP
No Rax
100% to Science


Maya for 44 gold
Chichen Itza size 1
5f/2s/5g
Spear in 5
One spear MP
No Rax
100% to Science

Odd I cant build an Embassy with the Babs. Map Stat does not pick him up either eventhough I can trade with him. We must not know where his city is yet

Utica Archer to Pyramids - GL prebuild (Vetoable)

Turn 12 (1750BC)
Incans now know HBR
Take out barb camp on W Isle -1 hp no promo gain 25 gold
Ok Trading time:
Maya Writing for Mysticism - Iron Working and 100 Gold
Incan Writing for HBR and 50 gold
Babylon Writing for 125 Gold
Sell HBR to Myans for 40 gold
3 techs for one and 315 gold...Not bad.
One iron sourse way way to the north, and one in the Incan city of Corihuayrachina (the reason I don't play the Incan in a SG) not hooked

IBT
Western 2hp rWarrior dies to 2nd barb attack

Turn 13 (1725BC)
Start to move the troops back to base for the comming offensive

IBT
Carthage Archer to Archer in 3 (next growth not until 8 turns so 3 turn Archer then 5 turn settler)

Turn 14 (1700BC)
Veto my own build in Utica and build archer. This is Monarch level we don't need no stinkin' GL we need units cause those Incans are ticking me off. We can always use "pointy stick" research if needed.
Find an island to our far East I think its just off of our main island. This thing is huge.

IBT
Maya building the Pyramids

Turn 15 (1675BC)
Zzzz....

IBT
Utica Archer to Archer in 4

Turn 16 (1650BC)
Nope not an Island just a strange shape off of the mainland, see gems...good more lux

IBT
Carthage Archer to Settler in 5 Growth in 5

Turn 17 (1625BC)
Setting up for the attack
Cross Maya lands for more exploring

IBT
Get asked to leave from Mayan lands, sure, sure no problem...

Turn 18 (1600BC)
Zzzz....

IBT
Zzzz.

Turn 19 (1575BC)
Zzzz...

IBT
Utica Archer to Archer in 4

Turn 20 (1550BC)
Set up complete for the start of the war

Hand Down Report:
Carthage is size 4 settler in 2 growth in 2 we will have to play with it I think if we alternate Archer with Settler we should be able to keep it at this size.
We only have one worker but I hope to get some slaves
The archer between Utica and Carthage can get to either city in 1 turn
There is a stack of 6 archers on the Mtn 2 SW of Tiwanaku
S - SE of the stack of archers is a Incan Warrior and Settler
Keep Exploring
Have fun.
I think we can talk about battle plans
I normally do not go to war this early but if you guys are up to it I'm all for it
My plan would be to take Tiwanaku and head for the capital Cudzu or what ever it is, then sue for peace if he is willing to give up a town or two. Unless things go very well, if so keep it up till he's gone.

Sorry for no Pics. You will have to wait until Fri in the A.M. for them because I can't stand waiting for dial up. I'll post them here in this spot.

Next better Player

Ok one tonight:

My war plans are pretty simple:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/War_Plans.jpg

Note the one Archer S - SE of Carthage can be sent towards the front for reinforcement. I've kept one at home for defense just incase the Aztec actually gets a unit near our towns. If you are feeling bold take the two archers in our territory and head south to take the city that the Incan will prolly settle with in the next two turns. It should only have the one warrior in it.

@Mistfit: about the fresh water; what does 2-2-0(instead of 1-1-0) mean? What are you putting first, food and then gold?

We can begin with our war now, I think. 6 archers are enough to take their first city. Wait a little fortified(1 turn) if you have to(so our archers could heal), and marsh towards the Incan capital. If you have less than 6 archers at that point, wait for the reinforcements.
Keep building archers in Carthage(after the settler), and in Utica.

I haven't seen the save . I'll post more suggestions later. After all, we have enough time to decide and discuss.

Im pretty sure it is food-gold-shield, although seeings that the 1st two numbers are the same it could very well be gold - food - shield. Not that it would make a bunch of difference. 2 - 2 - 0 looks a lot like 2 - 2 - 0 even though I switched around the 1st two numbers. :D

The save is posted at the top of the turn report.

Ok, thanks.

Good turns. We have a fine tactician here!

Okay, a few random little questions or answers or whatever that I can remember from reading through the past few pages in no particular order.

If we are still going roughly by the dotmap, and I am not completely sure since I haven't seen a screenshot since (or have I?), why isn't E next to the coast? We are seafaring, so we get extra gold, and being able to build harbors is always a nice boost to growth. It does mean we have to wait on the wheat, but I think that long term emphasis on coastal cities is very important to us.

Leader generation is twice as rare defending. So 1/32 on defense and 1/16 on offense, and with Heroic Epic 1/24 and 1/12, respectively.

I like the idea of an archer rush, even if a bit late. Taking out an agricultural enemy might give us a bit more breathing room.

I think the order is generally (food/shield/gold) when it comes to what a tile produces. At least that is how I always interpret it.

I don't know that you can build an embassy if you haven't actually established contact, even if it is available. I am not sure if we had talked to Babylon, but maybe that was it?

Lakes are fresh if they are twenty tiles or less, or maybe it is twenty one tiles or less.

And finally, am I up now? Sorry this was so out of order, I just addressed what I remembered and scrolled through the recent posts shown at the bottom of the replying page. Oh, this is also my first try as Carthage, so this should be a real adventure for the whole team. Thanks again for not minding my absence. I was almost replaced in another SG that was just starting up, but then again, it wasn't casual. Which makes this SG rather nice.

Missing one town on the coast should not effect us that much in the long run. Although now that more of the map is busted we can get a much better look at where to settle. I think an updated dot map is in order.

You are correct on the food/shield/gold I typed it wrong I should have said "2/0/2 and 1/0/1" my bad.

I think we will be doing the archer thing for a bit until we can get some more cities up and running. We will not have iron for quite some time. It is way up in the north or inside one of the Incan boundries. This is a town we should shoot for if we decide on peace. I typed the name of it once, I hope to not have to do it again anytime soon.

I talked and traded with the Babs but they are nowhere to be found. This is why I thought this was strange.

I'm not sure of the up rotation, we'll wait for SS to let us know.

Edit I posted one screenie a couple of posts up. More will follow on friday

1) I don't remember exactly, but in C3C(I'll have to look it in the Civilopedia), something is prequisite for establishing embassies.(and I haven't played many games in C3C).
2)It's wrong to say that we don't have iron... Of course we have, but just now, the Incans "borrowed" it!!! Soon, we'll take back what belong to us, that is...
3)Prepare for war.

Well, in the original, I came after Mistfit, and somewhere sir_schwick said to follow the original order. So I will play sometime soon, unless I hear otherwise.

That was a good 20 Mistfit. Um, I don't really have anything else to add cause I think you all covered it mostly. Just checking in so you don't think I disapeared. And yes, Schwicky said to stick to the order so it is your go bedhead.

Pre-turn check - I establish an embassy with Babylon, will attach screenshot. Since Utica is just building archers, I move a citizen from grassland to forest, so we grow half as quickly but build an archer in 3 instead of 4. We are also on turn 58, so I will play a couple extra to even it up.

1525 BC (59) - We are now at war with the Inca. I send two of the six archers after the warrior/settler pair. I realize that I shouldn't split my forces, but I can't foresee more than two regular spearmen, and four vet archers should be able to handle that.

IT - Babylon and Inca sign a military alliance against us. wow, that was fast!

1500 BC (60) - Carthage finishes settler, and I start on a granary, which will finish in 9 while growth is in 10 turns, which works out nicely. It might have to switch to something else if circumstances dictate a change. And now the attack on Tiwanaku. First archer loses without taking an hp. Uh-oh! Second makes up for the failing, and wins while losing one hp. This reveals a newly built spearman, meaning unfortified. Third archer wins, this time losing two hp, and we capture, yes, capture Tiwanaku. We can always abandon later, and it is relatively near the capital. For this reason, the settler heads for location B. gpt also jumps up with the added city and lower unit support costs.

1475 BC (61) - Worker finishes chop, I send him to do another because it will speed granary by two turns. Vet archer defeats regular warrior, and they are headed for Ollantaytambo. Another vet defeats the fortified conscript, although he lost 3 hp before doing so. Huamanga also founded interturn, will be destroyed soon. On second thought, B seems a bit too close to Utica, closer than any other two settlements, so it goes one east.

1450 BC (62) - Huamanga destoryed, after the vet archer flawlessly defeats the warrior. Coastal waters across a sea are also spotted southeast of Chichen Itza. Leptis Magna founded, starts on archer (worker is next on queue).

IT - Regular archer comes out and attacks our elite warrior fortified on the hill outside Ollantaytambo, and the warrior wins.

1425 BC (63) - Not much to report here.

1400 BC (64) - Archer in Utica, another archer.

1375 BC (65) - Another uneventful turn.

IT - Maya demand 39 gold. I figure, what is one more faraway country. Nah, Smoke-Jaguar, if you want some cash, you'll have to get it elsewhere. He is annoyed now, but doesn't declare.

1350 BC (66) - Granary completes, start settler. Two archers outside Machu Picchu, three outside Ollantaytambo, but it is on hills. Probably should wait for reinforcements on both, but I am sometimes reckless. Lose one archer but kill a spear in Machu, and redlined spear shows, but no one to fight it. Damn! So I am cautious on the next, and wait for one more archer and 4/5 hp warrior.

1325 BC (67) - Utica builds archer, but needs it for MP. I continue being reckless near Machu Picchu and it pays off, as the archer wins, we destroy the town, and pick up three slaves. At Ollantaytambo, first redlines but wins, and promotes to elite. Second takes two hp off spear but loses, and the spearman promotes. Third archer fails to do a thing, but at least no promotion. Fourth takes one hp off the spearman and dies, and the spearman promotes. Aargh! Well, maybe the elite warrior can do the job. It did! Ollantaytambo is gone, and we net 2 gold. But no great leader. Well, we need to gather forces at this point, and I imagine Cuzco is somewhat better fortified, though it is working on the Pyramids (if it finishes the Pyramids, that would be another plus). Peace gets us 11 gold and the crazy name town that scared someone, I can't remember who. Apparently, the Inca had just finished the road to the iron, as I recieved the "Congratulations, you have completed a road that brings Iron into _____. Now we can build Swordsmen!" First time I have ever seen that. Now we just need a road all the way back to Carthage.

1300 BC (68) - Worker is roading towards iron, slaves are coming up to help.

1275 BC (69) - I forgot about Babylon! A warrior is headed to iron town (actually, I think I will rename it that), so I get peace from Babylon. In fact, they are willing to pay 40 for it.

1250 BC (70) - Tiwanaku and Utica both build archers. We need more (or another, at this point) worker, so Tiwanaku gets started on that. Utica is size 5, so I might as well build a settler.

1225 BC (71) - Settler from Carthage headed to the cow.

1200 BC (72) - Spot yellowish border, but no contact yet.

1175 BC (73) - Contact Mongols, who have a LOT of cities but are relatively backwards. I guess they must have popped a couple settlers, because they have three more cities than the agricultural Maya. They pay 83 gold for the Alphabet.

1150 BC (74) - Settler in Utica, who will head for the coast to the west. Preparing to war against Inca again when turns on peace are up.

1125 BC (75) - Theveste founded next to cows, starts on granary since it will be our only current settlement with food bonus. Lots of Incan units wandering about, but they can't do much. Archer in Carthage finishes, and starts on settler.

1100 BC (76) - I guess nothing happened, because I didn't write anything down.

1075 BC (77) - Barracks are started in Leptis Magna, Hippo founded next to wheat on the coast. I decided that since the land was marginal and far from fresh water there was little reason to crowd in cities.

1050 BC (78) - More new colored borders. Contact next turn.

1025 BC (79) - Babylon picks up Map Making, so I see a trade opportunity. I give 310 gold to Inca for Math, hoping that we can get it all back when we take Cuzco in a few turns. It still takes 155 gold plus Math to get Map Making, but we seem to be falling a bit behind in tech. Literature (and the Great Library? I don't know the plan here) will be awhile before it comes, since I have been researching it a minimum the whole time. Pop a goody hut down near Babylon and disturn Gaul warriors. Forgot about the curragh, and met the Byzantines. Trading before meeting them was really stupid, but I don't know if it made a difference. They were well behind in tech, so I gave them Masonry for 35 gold.

IT - Our brave warrior survives and promotes to veteran, and the Gaul warriors also display the barbarian bug that I just learned about in COTM3.

1000 BC (80) - My last turn. England finishes the Colossus. This reminds me of another wonder we want, so I decide to waste some gold and see Cuzco's progress on the Pyramids, since it might influence our decision on when to go to war. 65 gold tells us that the Pyramids will come in 6, and I really meant to take a screenshot but accidentally hit enter. This reminds me that we need embassies with two new contacts. Coincidentally, it also takes 65 gold to get the embassy with the Byzantines. 73 gold gets the Mongols. I did remember to take the screenshots for the embassies, though they were less important. Tiwanaku starts on a catapult, with our newly learned knowledge and lack of mountains/jungles/marshes it seems like a good idea, but it can be changed. Everything else I think is as it should be, but I suppose I might have overlooked something. I guess that wraps up my 22 turns.

Will post a screenshot of the empire after dinner. The embassies are attached.

Great looking turns bed_head While you are at it post the save as well. :goodjob:

Great turns there bedhead.

Oops. Meant to do that with the screenshot, but forgot all about doing both. But I remembered the save this time.

I whipped up a quick Dot map for discussion purposes. Please do not take these placements as written law. I put them up here so we can talk strategy and tactics.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/casual1.jpg

Now that I look at it on the screen #1 might be better 1 tile NW (still on the river but able to incorporate the hills) I think this city might make a good settler/worker pump

Nice turns b_d; Looking good.

I think, we should sent a unit to Theveste: undefended cities are a temptation for the AI. Also, the other city (with the iron, very hard name!) should work the iron hill: the archer will be produced in 4 turns instead of 7, and there is no change on growth.

Theveste will be our settler factory, when improved. Better let the other cities to keep producing archers and swords(when the iron is connected). I have bad intentions for the other civs(who knows, maybe they'll never get to do anything...)

Just my opinion here, but you seem to have a pretty liberal spread there on those city suggestions mistfit. Maybe we can try and work on a little bit tighter city placement. I'll open it up and plot some suggestions for your review in a bit.

Unless I am just being airy, and your suggestions are initial sets.

Ok first I get chastised for suggesting cities that are to close now to widely spread. Hmm..

Just suggestions. Feel free to shoot holes in it. I placed no order of importance on it because I thought we could have some feed back first.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/Casual.JPG

I guess Mauer and I just have different styles. Your city placement looked pretty good to me, though moving #1 one NW wouldn't get a hill unless I am seeing it wrong. As I sort of explained before, I generally don't crowd cities too much except when the terrain is really nice or there is a river. When it is plains and desert, no real reason in my opinion to crowd until we run out of room elsewhere and/or have the ability to railroad for extra food. Later on, we can plop an extra city down on the coast between 1 and 5, and on the hill between 2, 6, and 7, but for now, we probably don't need any tighter placement. Then again, I never score all that well even if I do manage to win on Monarch, so perhaps I have been doing it wrong.

Ok first I get chastised for suggesting cities that are to close now to widely spread. Hmm..
You have a point, maybe I should think more clearly before I comment :crazyeye: . Remember, you didn't get chastised earlier, I just made a blunder :spank: .
Mistfits reasoning for the closer cities (I think) was for A)easier to deploy and defend, B)not as many citizens in the early game, so plenty of tiles free. (About the time we are building up our army).

PS- I didn't say it looked bad, just bringing up some discussion. Tell me I'm stupid if you think so. Well, don't tell me, cause I'm sure you think so. :lol:

No those are good dots to discuss. We have been given a repreive from the early settler problem We have gained "free" cities from the early war. IMO we can be a bit more liberal at this point taking up city spots. If you look at your map look at Lepsis Magna. If we were to put all of those cities around it it could theoretically have 0 tiles to work.

I think we could look at the next 3 or 4 spots to settle to cover us for the next turn set by Sir Schwick I believe.

I like the two towns that you have proposed in the SE one in the 10 ring and one in the 12. These may not be immediately productive towns but it would help wall off the other civs and set-up a line of defense. I also think that we should plop a city down directly to the north of our capitol pretty soon. The AI puts huge priorty on settling towns on resourses and luxes. we could have one town with a temple that covered both. other than that any city on a river that has good growth potential is a good choice at this point.

If you look at your map look at Lepsis Magna. If we were to put all of those cities around it it could theoretically have 0 tiles to work.
Hmm, your right. The 7 and 10 to the SW could be deleted. The spot East of Lepsis Magna on the 7 could be moved 1 tile SE. That would probably be better. And the 9 to the S could just be moved 1 tile W. And the silks to the north, how about on the tundra 3?

EDIT: I just read this post, and it is pretty confusing :confused: . Sorry, did you understand?

I understood it...believe it or not. I will sleep on it and look closer tomorrow. Right now it is time for :beer:

In this game, we can go for a more liberal placement: Having 3 tiles distance between cities, like city-3tiles-city, is better.
It all really depends on the game, but, in this game we haven't made a settler factory yet. If we go for a tighter city placement, the AI will grab much more land than us, IMHO. Anyway, I haven't a problem to adjust in styles. The AI will be crushed no matter what.

I have to say, I am a little baffled right now as far as where to plop the next settler. We really need to get a settler factory, or as close as possible. I really don't see a good spot though, that will not be too corrupted. The only half way decent spot is the southern marked tile 12. I honestly don't know :confused: . So we need somebody to take charge and pick a spot. Schwick?

Actually, I was looking at the mini-map, and I was going to make a suggestion of a whole different type as far as where to go. I'd like to get horses relatively soon, even if the terrain isn't ideal. Unless I missed a herd, our nearest and most accessible source is just to the north in the useless tundra.

Sir Schwick was on-line last night but not in here so I guess it is his next turns so we can wait until he arrives. For now I'm just going to be Casual :smug:

For now I'm just going to be Casual :smug:
Sounds like a plan. I got 2 other SG's coming up on me next day or 2, and a spoiler 2 for sgotm3. So take your time schwick.

Wow, is it my turn already? Well, if it is I'll get started ASAP, but I am a little short on time till at least Tuesday. Hopefully I can pull a long session then.

Sorry guys. Lots of stuff has been happening at work and I have had very little time to even sleep. I'm gonna have to work through the weekend too. Pass on to the next player, I'll make sure I can play whenever its my turn again. Game slooks good though.

Ok then, this is my "got it", but I have time to play(casual play)!.

EDIT: I'll play at the weekend. Don't worry; I haven't forgot that I'm playing in this game!

Sorry for the long delay, team-mates. This week is going to be busy, so Mauer can take it.

I think it would be safe to say, that this game has pretty much died. Even if it hadn't died, I would play it but.... I have recently had to drop out of all of my games, due to the fact that I don't have Civ 3 anymore. Circumstances, and unmentionables are the cause of it. I do apologize and wish you all good luck should you decide to continue.

It'd be nice to continue, since I am pretty sure we'll get the Pyramids from the Incas, but it does seem to have died. If ending it is the way the team wants to go, though, I am okay with that.

This month I have also exams to take and I must pass it. I also won't participate in any SG's until things are ok. Sorry guys; you can always post that you're looking for 2 players in the SR thread.