radiohodet
Chieftain
- Joined
- Oct 14, 2010
- Messages
- 25
Apparently a lot of people have problems with the diplomacy in Civ 5, and I don't think there's a thread in the Civ 5 forums where someone doesn't complain about how bad, hopeless and broken it is.
This is of course nonsense. I also think it's strange to hear such claims when you think about how simplistic Civ 4's diplomacy was, where the Diplomacy game didn't really start until Free Religion, and by then it was already too late.
So I decided to play a game, and take a couple of screenshots along with it to explain how to successfully use diplomacy. The approach is a peaceful game.
Setting:
- Emperor difficulty
- Civ: Inca
- Standard map size, 8 civs
- Continents
- Standard pace
- No mods
Goal:
- Don't start any wars
- Don't get attacked
- Don't use "Research Agreement blocked path" exploit
- Win a science victory (Since it's my favorite)
- (After starting the game) Don't build a single military unit (Yep, I build 0 - zero - nill - nothing units the whole game, not counting the initial scout of course and a caravel to explore)
AI Civs in Civ 5 can be categorized into 3 different categories as I see it. The crazy ones (Think Monty in Civ 4) who -will- attack you no matter what, the ones who might attack you unless you play the diplo game well, and the ones who you have to do something really strange against to get into trouble. (Ghandi comes to mind)
The basic thing people have to remember in Civ 5's diplomacy (Besides religion is not going to save you) is to find a common enemy. Find an AI Civ you can persuade other AI Civs to regard as their enemy as well. That way, you will not be their enemy. Pretty easy.
Now let's see how we do this.
I'm not going to explain too much about how I play the game, because it's not important regarding diplomacy, but I'm a builder at heart, and don't like wars until the modern ages where I like to crush civs I don't like with my technologically superior units.
But, anyway, here is my starting location.
After a while I meet my first neighbor, Greece. Apparently he falls into the crazy category in this game, since he is hostile already the moment I meet him. He isn't this crazy normally, so I guess the flavors in Civ 5 has flipped him over the hedge this game. This means Greece will go to war against you, it's just a matter of time.
This on the other hand makes it pretty easy to find out who is going to be the AI to be picked on. It will be Greece. Which is good, because Greece is one of the AIs which can get you into trouble because they tend to run away, and try to win a diplo victory.
It doesn't take too long before he denounce me. I do the same to him.
It's around this time that I decide to try to play the whole game without building a single military unit, because I clear a barbarian camp for a militaristic city states, which gives me ally status with them for just 250 gold, which means I will get units at a pretty slow, but steady rate.
I have at this time already met my nemesis from Civ 4, Montezuma. He wants to have open borders with me, but I refuse. I always refuse open borders. Maybe it's just paranoia, but I think war is more likely with open borders signed.
Montezuma is friendly against me though, which is good. I'm going to use him against Greece.
It doesn't take long before Montezuma offers me a Declaration of Friendship. I gladly accept. Now the thing about DoF is that they can be quite expensive if you are a rich civ, since you always have to give in to their begging, and the richer you are, the more they want. So make sure you don't have too much gold in your "bank" if you sign a DoF.
The AI begging would be alright if I could actually get something from AI Civs if -I- was begging, but that seems to be impossible. I really dislike this, but I don't think an AI has ever given me anything in any of the 5 Civ games.....
It doesn't take too long before I hear from Greece again. It's time for war.
I've received a couple of units from the militaristic city state I'm allied with, and me and Greece also share a border with another city state, which I quickly ally for 500 gold to help me in the war. I try to persuade Montezuma to join me in the war against Greece, but he is too weak, and refuses. His joy will be short lived though, because Greece declares war on Montezuma as well.
It doesn't take long before my upgraded city state units, plus my city state ally pushes back the initial attack of Greece, and he offers peace. Normally Greece will not give me any more problems in the game, and if I play my cards right, I will not have to be at war again in the game.
And here comes the begging.... I accept with a sigh. I would still say the DoF was worth it because it created a conflict between Monty and Greece, which was exactly according to plan.
In the meantime I've also met Spain, who is friendly and has a DoF with Monty. The interesting part is that she is willing to go to war against Monty, which means she is likely to backstab. Will have to keep an eye out for her. I do not accept. I want her to go to war against Greece, but she doesn't want that yet.
I research astronomy, and explore the world and find two Civs on the other continent, England and Arabia. Both are neutral.
This is the standings and score so far. Interesting that the units I've received from the city state is enough to keep me in second place in the military standings. Probably because I'm number 1 in science and have upgraded the units. I have five cities, which is normally the number of cities I manage to build on a standard map before running out of space.
Small overview of my land.
Then it happens, Spain is finally willing to go to war against Greece. I pay her right away. Now the hate between Spain and Greece will grow, making an effective alliance between me, Monty and Spain against Greece. It's in my interest that Greece lives though, so I let Spain and Greece battle it out.
Arabia then approaches me and wants a DoF. I decline because I don't know enough about the diplomatic situation on the other continent.
This is of course nonsense. I also think it's strange to hear such claims when you think about how simplistic Civ 4's diplomacy was, where the Diplomacy game didn't really start until Free Religion, and by then it was already too late.
So I decided to play a game, and take a couple of screenshots along with it to explain how to successfully use diplomacy. The approach is a peaceful game.
Setting:
- Emperor difficulty
- Civ: Inca
- Standard map size, 8 civs
- Continents
- Standard pace
- No mods
Goal:
- Don't start any wars
- Don't get attacked
- Don't use "Research Agreement blocked path" exploit
- Win a science victory (Since it's my favorite)
- (After starting the game) Don't build a single military unit (Yep, I build 0 - zero - nill - nothing units the whole game, not counting the initial scout of course and a caravel to explore)
AI Civs in Civ 5 can be categorized into 3 different categories as I see it. The crazy ones (Think Monty in Civ 4) who -will- attack you no matter what, the ones who might attack you unless you play the diplo game well, and the ones who you have to do something really strange against to get into trouble. (Ghandi comes to mind)
The basic thing people have to remember in Civ 5's diplomacy (Besides religion is not going to save you) is to find a common enemy. Find an AI Civ you can persuade other AI Civs to regard as their enemy as well. That way, you will not be their enemy. Pretty easy.
Now let's see how we do this.
I'm not going to explain too much about how I play the game, because it's not important regarding diplomacy, but I'm a builder at heart, and don't like wars until the modern ages where I like to crush civs I don't like with my technologically superior units.
But, anyway, here is my starting location.
After a while I meet my first neighbor, Greece. Apparently he falls into the crazy category in this game, since he is hostile already the moment I meet him. He isn't this crazy normally, so I guess the flavors in Civ 5 has flipped him over the hedge this game. This means Greece will go to war against you, it's just a matter of time.
This on the other hand makes it pretty easy to find out who is going to be the AI to be picked on. It will be Greece. Which is good, because Greece is one of the AIs which can get you into trouble because they tend to run away, and try to win a diplo victory.
It doesn't take too long before he denounce me. I do the same to him.
It's around this time that I decide to try to play the whole game without building a single military unit, because I clear a barbarian camp for a militaristic city states, which gives me ally status with them for just 250 gold, which means I will get units at a pretty slow, but steady rate.
I have at this time already met my nemesis from Civ 4, Montezuma. He wants to have open borders with me, but I refuse. I always refuse open borders. Maybe it's just paranoia, but I think war is more likely with open borders signed.
Montezuma is friendly against me though, which is good. I'm going to use him against Greece.
It doesn't take long before Montezuma offers me a Declaration of Friendship. I gladly accept. Now the thing about DoF is that they can be quite expensive if you are a rich civ, since you always have to give in to their begging, and the richer you are, the more they want. So make sure you don't have too much gold in your "bank" if you sign a DoF.
The AI begging would be alright if I could actually get something from AI Civs if -I- was begging, but that seems to be impossible. I really dislike this, but I don't think an AI has ever given me anything in any of the 5 Civ games.....
It doesn't take too long before I hear from Greece again. It's time for war.
I've received a couple of units from the militaristic city state I'm allied with, and me and Greece also share a border with another city state, which I quickly ally for 500 gold to help me in the war. I try to persuade Montezuma to join me in the war against Greece, but he is too weak, and refuses. His joy will be short lived though, because Greece declares war on Montezuma as well.
It doesn't take long before my upgraded city state units, plus my city state ally pushes back the initial attack of Greece, and he offers peace. Normally Greece will not give me any more problems in the game, and if I play my cards right, I will not have to be at war again in the game.
And here comes the begging.... I accept with a sigh. I would still say the DoF was worth it because it created a conflict between Monty and Greece, which was exactly according to plan.
In the meantime I've also met Spain, who is friendly and has a DoF with Monty. The interesting part is that she is willing to go to war against Monty, which means she is likely to backstab. Will have to keep an eye out for her. I do not accept. I want her to go to war against Greece, but she doesn't want that yet.
I research astronomy, and explore the world and find two Civs on the other continent, England and Arabia. Both are neutral.
This is the standings and score so far. Interesting that the units I've received from the city state is enough to keep me in second place in the military standings. Probably because I'm number 1 in science and have upgraded the units. I have five cities, which is normally the number of cities I manage to build on a standard map before running out of space.
Small overview of my land.
Then it happens, Spain is finally willing to go to war against Greece. I pay her right away. Now the hate between Spain and Greece will grow, making an effective alliance between me, Monty and Spain against Greece. It's in my interest that Greece lives though, so I let Spain and Greece battle it out.
Arabia then approaches me and wants a DoF. I decline because I don't know enough about the diplomatic situation on the other continent.