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You need five minutes skimming Venice's history to see that it doesn't work at all with a city-state. On the other hand, the UA is...interesting, but way too weak. The Merchant of Venice should have been a part of it, seeing as now Venice gets a lot of money in change of being half a OCC...

The problem is defining WHAT makes a civ "worthy" in Civilization: it always was not so constant on the defining rules and requisites. I can say that Venice started, in effect, as a city state, and it was from 700 to around 1000 AD; in that time, however, it planted the seeds of that trading...

Except that, as a city-state, Venice is unrepresentable. You would need to allow them to expand, make war, complex diplomacy, trade...and WHOOOPS you got a normal civ then.

To the ones telling that Venice was no match for Hungary, I will remember that the former bludgeoned the latter and absconded with Dalmatia. So we DO know who would win a war between them, because it happened. Venice. :D

Depends on the period, though. Go more towards the 18th century, and Savoy is called the Prussia of Italy. Go back to the 14th-15th, and Milan is mauling everyone in sight. It changed quite often.

The problem is that Genoa was crushed around the 14th century and was ofttimes a vassal of Milan, if a quite rebellious one. Milan that was, between the 14th and the 15th century, THE powerhouse in North Italy, almost unifying the kingdom of old before its rules fell to the plague, leaving a...

The problem with such a scenario is that it is quite simplistic and quite wrong as well - many of the regional powers of Italy were not trading republics (the Duchies of Milan, Savoy, Tuscany, Ferrara, Mantua, Montferrat, the Pope and the Kingdom of Naples/Two Sicilies). As a matter of fact, the...

No they were not. Seriously, I could rattle out at least a dozen city names for each of the states cited - that stopped being city-states somewhere a century after becoming independent from the HRE.

Anyway yes - if we go for the "important predecessor in the same area, divided in small principalities and a short history as an unitary state", we would have the Holy Roman Empire as a civilization, with city-states to represent the various polities before 1871.

By the time the Golden Bull rolled in, the Empire as an unitary state was done for - attempts would have been made later, but the Imperial authority was defied more than once. And the last attempt to rein in everyone (the big chaos between the Schmalkaldic League and the Thirty Years War) ended...

Wouldn't Germany be well represented in the same way, though? A really short unitary history, preceded by literally hundreds of so-called "city-states".

The "less impressive-ness" of modern Italy is mostly legend, though (sono il primo critico dell'Italia, ma è vero. ;) ) - Sardinia-Piedmont was referred to as the Prussia of Italy and got a fair share of praise during the Crimean War, and Italy as an united nation got a wobbly record that is not...

The main point is, you continue naming "city states" - but the period of city states in Italy was remarkably short, more or less from 1150 to 1250. After that, the Communes congealed in republics and princedoms and dukedoms and kingdoms, which waged war between themselves and others. I see...

It is the truth, though - Hungary dominated the area for half a millennium, from the settlements of the Magyars to the Battle of Mohacs. In the middle there have been kings of Naples, Archdukes of Austria, Kings of Bohemia and Poland...a powerful player, ended for a dynastic mishap not unlike...

Ouch.

...so. One month, 2 days. Is the situation this critical? °°

"Meh. I will have to find a patron...these guys are simply no fun anymore." The first thing you could see, from a distance, was the smoke. A black cloud that slowly soared above the trees, marking a place that, probably, was not even there anymore; if anyone had been there, he would have seen a...

I'll get it, while Forest is incapacitated. >>

Mh! I briefly intervened in the ancient times of DI the First...I finally came back, my good sir! I shall wait for your save. :3 ----------------------------------------------- There are Deities, up in the skies, that watch upon the men and their deeds; those with perfect features and strong...

Uhm. I'd change the Appennines to hills: the only high mountains in Italy are the Alps, the higher of the Appennines is around 1500 meters...