FFH -- We don't betray or kill all of our allies
- Thread starter UnforcedError
- Start date
UnforcedError
Settler
It's OK 
Good luck
Good luck A little tougher this time.
Got sailing from Garrim.
Halfway in Garrim was attacked by the Ljosalfar. Seems like on 10 units have landed. An asortment of units lead by the baron. Unless the Baron has mad luck Garrim should kill them all, but will probably loose a city. I made an open borders deal with Garrim when I noticed he was not the worst enemy of the Ljosalfar. Wanted to have the spying hawk there.
Lost one city to Illian Chariots so I had to reroute our armies. I think I lost one relatively good hunter and some warriors. took back the city and captured the body mana city.
Gostai is positioned to be taken next turn. Illians have started to field Royal guards. they are pretty strong.
Ljosalfar got Poison before we were able to.
Got sailing from Garrim.
Halfway in Garrim was attacked by the Ljosalfar. Seems like on 10 units have landed. An asortment of units lead by the baron. Unless the Baron has mad luck Garrim should kill them all, but will probably loose a city. I made an open borders deal with Garrim when I noticed he was not the worst enemy of the Ljosalfar. Wanted to have the spying hawk there.
Lost one city to Illian Chariots so I had to reroute our armies. I think I lost one relatively good hunter and some warriors. took back the city and captured the body mana city.
Gostai is positioned to be taken next turn. Illians have started to field Royal guards. they are pretty strong.
Ljosalfar got Poison before we were able to.
UnforcedError
Settler
This is a got it.
Losing a city is bad as it adds a lot to Auric's war success against us which will influence the peace deal we can make with him (I think that's actually the reason why he's not ready to give up yet), but it can happen. Little mistakes I noticed: I originally sent a lion towards Dunwich to build a lion's cage. Why did he end up in Thariss again? And why are Gereth Minar's tiles still unforested? The priest should have bloomed just about all by now. Also: we agreed on not taking Straatus, remember? We wanted to leave Auric with this city originally, as it is his least productive one (I assume you took it for the Body mana, which is fine, but we could have delayed it a bit). We have no other choice but to leave him with Gigno instead and so he will potentially be able to workshop all of it. I don't want to give him a chance to retake Straatus because of our war success rate. But navigating around Gigno will be a bit of a pita.
As the Ljosies have Poison we have no other choice but to get all techs Auric has in two sets. First we should take Gostal and Tolero and take peace, hopefully with all his techs we have the prereqs for. Then declare again after 10 turns and kill most of his units in Gigno until he's willing to talk. Make peace again for Sorcery, Construction, etc. Finish him off after another 10 turns. Will be a bit risky as Amelanchier likes him atm, but we have no other choice unless Garrim decides to like us. Maybe I should give him Poisons
(Was just a joke...)
If the Ljosies manage to take Garrim they'll trip dom, so hopefully he'll hold a while. They actually attacked much earlier than I expected. But every AI in this mod version does that so it's no real surprise after all
As for the tech path: I don't think we should tech Divination. Auric has it already, and we could do without it for a few more turns. How about... Optics? (Alternatively we should get Writing for libraries or maybe Way of the Wicked. Aurc has them both too, but they may be more important right now...) I'd say we go either Optics or Writing.
Losing a city is bad as it adds a lot to Auric's war success against us which will influence the peace deal we can make with him (I think that's actually the reason why he's not ready to give up yet), but it can happen. Little mistakes I noticed: I originally sent a lion towards Dunwich to build a lion's cage. Why did he end up in Thariss again? And why are Gereth Minar's tiles still unforested? The priest should have bloomed just about all by now. Also: we agreed on not taking Straatus, remember? We wanted to leave Auric with this city originally, as it is his least productive one (I assume you took it for the Body mana, which is fine, but we could have delayed it a bit). We have no other choice but to leave him with Gigno instead and so he will potentially be able to workshop all of it. I don't want to give him a chance to retake Straatus because of our war success rate. But navigating around Gigno will be a bit of a pita.
As the Ljosies have Poison we have no other choice but to get all techs Auric has in two sets. First we should take Gostal and Tolero and take peace, hopefully with all his techs we have the prereqs for. Then declare again after 10 turns and kill most of his units in Gigno until he's willing to talk. Make peace again for Sorcery, Construction, etc. Finish him off after another 10 turns. Will be a bit risky as Amelanchier likes him atm, but we have no other choice unless Garrim decides to like us. Maybe I should give him Poisons
(Was just a joke...)If the Ljosies manage to take Garrim they'll trip dom, so hopefully he'll hold a while. They actually attacked much earlier than I expected. But every AI in this mod version does that so it's no real surprise after all
As for the tech path: I don't think we should tech Divination. Auric has it already, and we could do without it for a few more turns. How about... Optics? (Alternatively we should get Writing for libraries or maybe Way of the Wicked. Aurc has them both too, but they may be more important right now...) I'd say we go either Optics or Writing.
Had no idea the lion was going to Dunwich. It was outside Gigno next to an axeman so I though you had used him to fight. But at least we have a tiger cage in Dunwich. We should get more carnivals as we have free tigers they add 2 happy.
There was no way I could defend Garduk. It started empty with my army hurt on the other side of the continent. Now we have two new hawks so we should not be suprised again.
Once I lost it I had to take my army there to fight his chariots. His shock promoted chariots would otherwise rampage against our warrior defended cities. Once there I continued south.
Optics does not give us much without iron working. I think trade or code of laws would be better. If we want boats we will need to do smelting.
I'm building a road to the east of Gigno. Walking around Gigno is not really a problem since they only have move 1 units and any units that leaves the city will get killed.
Why Gereth Minar does not have forests yet I guess is that I decided to move a priest south. I should have given priority to forest unhappy cities first with the priests I left behind.
Plundering the castle east of Gigno and expanding culture in Ashtuk will isolate Gigno. This I think we should do so that he stops building chariots and royal guards.
There was no way I could defend Garduk. It started empty with my army hurt on the other side of the continent. Now we have two new hawks so we should not be suprised again.
Once I lost it I had to take my army there to fight his chariots. His shock promoted chariots would otherwise rampage against our warrior defended cities. Once there I continued south.
Optics does not give us much without iron working. I think trade or code of laws would be better. If we want boats we will need to do smelting.
I'm building a road to the east of Gigno. Walking around Gigno is not really a problem since they only have move 1 units and any units that leaves the city will get killed.
Why Gereth Minar does not have forests yet I guess is that I decided to move a priest south. I should have given priority to forest unhappy cities first with the priests I left behind.
Plundering the castle east of Gigno and expanding culture in Ashtuk will isolate Gigno. This I think we should do so that he stops building chariots and royal guards.
UnforcedError
Settler
Welcome, Tasunke, nice to see you
I'd actually go with Optics as well. This is a tech we cannot get from Auric. Folket, is it OK if I dump EC beakers into it? (I agree with saving some money for upgrades.)
I actually made a comment about the lion being on the way to Dunwich in my previous TS report.
Will bloom the remaining tiles in this TS then.
I'd actually go with Optics as well. This is a tech we cannot get from Auric. Folket, is it OK if I dump EC beakers into it? (I agree with saving some money for upgrades.)
I actually made a comment about the lion being on the way to Dunwich in my previous TS report.
Will bloom the remaining tiles in this TS then.
Yes, you are right. I forgot about that. Easy to do when it is not part of my notes.
I think we should make peace with Auric when he has two cities left if he is willing to give techs. That way it will be a little easier to milk him of techs in the second war.
I think we should make peace with Auric when he has two cities left if he is willing to give techs. That way it will be a little easier to milk him of techs in the second war.
UnforcedError
Settler
Will try for it if he's willing to give in. But it's well possible that he'd only want to give us 1-2 techs in that case, and taking that option would be a waste. So far he doesn't even accept a simple Cease Fire, so it's quite possible that he won't be willing after I take Gostal.
Milking him for techs is easy even if he only has one city left. You have to kill all but one unit in the city and wait for him to talk and make peace (leave enough units next to the city to make him feel threatened). Not difficult at all. If we leave him with two cities he might even build 1-2 more chariots. Tolero's a nice production site.
I'll play tonight if the plan is otherwise OK.
UnforcedError
Settler
I want to tech Optics because after we dealt with Aurc we have to build a sizeable army plus privateers, cast our worldspell, sail the army over to the Ljosies and pillage every tile we can get our hands on, burn every forest we possibly can and kill every unit we sight. After that we will land our normal army and start taking their cities. We want their worldspell to be useless. We want their tech pace to plummet. We want their cities to be lightly defended. But we will need a big army with defensive units too, otherwise they won't hold.
I will actually start converting us to specialist economy now. (This is why I originally suggested either Optics or Writing. Writing is pretty cheap, we could possibly get it before we take Auric.) I think we want TGL if it's not gone yet (ugh, where's the wonder screen in this mod?), then Caste and Sholarship after we got Auric's techs. (Military State?) We will need the commerce to feed our army. We want Great Sages to bulb us Arcane Lore and either Pass through the Ether or Strength of Will, depending on what we take with the ToD. i don't see any other way ATM to get our tech pace up and still maintain a big army.
Let's hope Garrim holds for a while as this is vital for this plan to work
So, if you're OK with this, I just got home, I can play anytime now
UnforcedError
Settler
Alright. Played the TS. I'm sorry, Folket, but Tholal's current mod version is incredibly faulty and no fun to play. You will see what I mean.
T268 Ljosies build the Tower of Eyes and the Temple of Temporance.
T268 Ljosies capture Aborlenia (Garrim) and we capture Gostal.
T270 Alazkan is born
T270 This is the Ljosie's remaining stack over there:
T270 Hope there's no settler on those galleys...
T271 Our stack now moves towards Tolero and Auric feels threatened. He's actually willing to sign peace for the first time in the game
And this is utterly ridiculous. Auric started this war with 11 cities, and lost all but two. He lost tons of units. Besides, if the AIs decare on you on sight and aren't willing to sign a fair peace deal they are of no more use to you than barbarians. This game has no resemblance to civ 4 anymore.
T272 Arendel adopts Military State.
T272 We take Tolero without losses. I move most of the stack up to Gigno to kill all but one of his land units. I leave a hunter behind to capture that polar bear and a priest to start blooming.
T273 We pop gold in Idris.
T273 One of the Ljosies gets an engineer.
T274 Garrim wants us to join his war but we do no such a thing.
T275 Yes, we suck big time:
Nevertheless, I can at least queue in some libraries.
T276 Ljosies build Stigmata of the Unborn (had they used all their prophets for Altar levels they'd have won by now).
T276 Garrim has a bit of gold to trade so I gift him some more gold and sell him spare resources. Important: please cancel the gold gifts (but not the resource trades) on T286.
T276 Optics is in. We tech Message from the Deep because the Ljosies are edging closer and closer to a religious victory and we must rid some of our cities of FoL rather sooner than later.
T276 Our stack arrives at Gigno and kills all but one land unit:
So, will Auric sign a fair peace deal now, that he's one unit away from total elimination?
Alright, here's the deal: we should kill those few triremes of his roaming around. He probably thinks he's actually threatening our cities by bombarding them. I have no other explanation for this. Some triremes and privateers are already in build. I also queued in some more. If that doesn't help, I don't know what does, and I don't intend to find our ro be honest. I left two elephants and a healing priest at Gigno, they should kill the odd royal guard whenever he builds one. (He just popped one this turn, it is dead.) There's also a swordsman to pillage the hell out of the city. Nothing else can be done.
Our economy is getting better and better, we must settle the remaining space asap. (Some settlers already on the move or in build.) Please check the cities regularily and make sure the ones that can grow actually do grow, and let the unhappy ones starve. As we don't have Slavery we have absolutely no intention to feed and pay maintenance for unhappy pop. And don't forget to cancel the gold gift
EDIT: One more thing: please don't promote our units to Drill! Anything else but not Drill! Even Archery units are better with any other promo.
T268 Ljosies build the Tower of Eyes and the Temple of Temporance.
T268 Ljosies capture Aborlenia (Garrim) and we capture Gostal.
T270 Alazkan is born
T270 This is the Ljosie's remaining stack over there:
Spoiler :
T270 Hope there's no settler on those galleys...
Spoiler :
T271 Our stack now moves towards Tolero and Auric feels threatened. He's actually willing to sign peace for the first time in the game
Spoiler :
And this is utterly ridiculous. Auric started this war with 11 cities, and lost all but two. He lost tons of units. Besides, if the AIs decare on you on sight and aren't willing to sign a fair peace deal they are of no more use to you than barbarians. This game has no resemblance to civ 4 anymore.
T272 Arendel adopts Military State.
T272 We take Tolero without losses. I move most of the stack up to Gigno to kill all but one of his land units. I leave a hunter behind to capture that polar bear and a priest to start blooming.
T273 We pop gold in Idris.
T273 One of the Ljosies gets an engineer.
T274 Garrim wants us to join his war but we do no such a thing.
T275 Yes, we suck big time:
Spoiler :
Nevertheless, I can at least queue in some libraries.
T276 Ljosies build Stigmata of the Unborn (had they used all their prophets for Altar levels they'd have won by now).
T276 Garrim has a bit of gold to trade so I gift him some more gold and sell him spare resources. Important: please cancel the gold gifts (but not the resource trades) on T286.
T276 Optics is in. We tech Message from the Deep because the Ljosies are edging closer and closer to a religious victory and we must rid some of our cities of FoL rather sooner than later.
T276 Our stack arrives at Gigno and kills all but one land unit:
Spoiler :
So, will Auric sign a fair peace deal now, that he's one unit away from total elimination?
Spoiler :
Alright, here's the deal: we should kill those few triremes of his roaming around. He probably thinks he's actually threatening our cities by bombarding them. I have no other explanation for this. Some triremes and privateers are already in build. I also queued in some more. If that doesn't help, I don't know what does, and I don't intend to find our ro be honest. I left two elephants and a healing priest at Gigno, they should kill the odd royal guard whenever he builds one. (He just popped one this turn, it is dead.) There's also a swordsman to pillage the hell out of the city. Nothing else can be done.
Our economy is getting better and better, we must settle the remaining space asap. (Some settlers already on the move or in build.) Please check the cities regularily and make sure the ones that can grow actually do grow, and let the unhappy ones starve. As we don't have Slavery we have absolutely no intention to feed and pay maintenance for unhappy pop. And don't forget to cancel the gold gift
EDIT: One more thing: please don't promote our units to Drill! Anything else but not Drill! Even Archery units are better with any other promo.
Hey guys, a bit of an off-topic question--I saw that you set Grand Menagerie and Aeron's Chosen as part of the victory conditions.
How do you know if some other player beats you to Aeron's Chosen? If that happens, do you have to scrap the game and stop playing?
And Grand Menagerie is the hardest wonder to get in this game. Only tigers and maybe wolves are reliable; what happens if there's no animals left by the time you get animal husbandry? Do you have to quit?
How do you know if some other player beats you to Aeron's Chosen? If that happens, do you have to scrap the game and stop playing?
And Grand Menagerie is the hardest wonder to get in this game. Only tigers and maybe wolves are reliable; what happens if there's no animals left by the time you get animal husbandry? Do you have to quit?
UnforcedError
Settler
Welcome akatosh
I assume your question was rather in general and not concerning this particular game
Other players cannot beat you to Aeron's chosen. Your first assasin getting to level 5 will become Aeron's chosen automatically. (On rare occasions -- at least in the vanilla version -- the event doesn't trigger. Did you mean that?)
The Grand Menagerie is indeed the most difficult wonder to build. We chose a tropical map and went with Living World and Wildlands because we wanted more animals to spawn and more events to happen. There is a hunter event that lets you buy animals. I frequently got that in vanilla but never since I started playing with Tholal's mod.
Tigers are the easiest. Wolves are easy because you can get them very early. Bears are actually not as hard either, as they're strong enough to survive the AI and also because they do frequently spawn with Nature's Revolt. Lions are pretty frequented in the early game as well and easy to catch (wolves and lions can potentially be caught with scouts). The gorilla is really the hardest thing of all (and ours was killed by Auric before we could do something about it). Next time we should really go with tropical Terra and gun for AH and Optics
UnforcedError
Settler
On a second thought: I'd say we're better off killing Auric right now and forget about the techs. I don't think he'll give us Sorcery, Constuction or Currency with the second attack. There's something seriously wrong with the mechanism here. Howerver, our cities have 6-7 unhappy due to war weariness now and Auric's ex-cities have an extra 4-5 guys with motherland issues. FotL happiness is huge but not that huge Maybe we're better off looking at this as a non tech-trading game from now on (maybe sell something to Garrim as soon as he has money).
Maybe we're better off looking at this as a non tech-trading game from now on (maybe sell something to Garrim as soon as he has money).I do not agree with you regarding drill. Drill 1 is not good. But drill 2 and 3 are fine and drill 4 is really strong. Drill is a really important promotion on our strongest units since it allows them to fight battles without taking any damage.
UnforcedError
Settler
Units are just units. You won't keep them for life. If they die then they die. And not taking damage could be great before you have any medic units but becomes less and less useful afterwards. Rather have them kill more units as long as they live and take some damage. Besides, FfH didn't scale Drill properly, I feel. It's still closer to BtS,
Good, let's kill Auric then
I'd say we finish teching OO then get Divination for Sun mana to finally make use of Auric's cities. Then probably head towards Taxation and then to Sorcery. Maybe Elementalism first? We have a GP due in Thariss shortly which should become a golden age.Similar threads
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