Civilization 5 Steamworks questions/concerns for inclusion in the FAQ

As far as regional restrictions with Steam.

Well the only thing I have ever heard on restricting outside the country it was brought in was this tid bit.

Last Friday, Valve began preventing retail copies of their Source (i.e. post-2004) games bought in Thailand and Russia from being played outside their country of origin. The internet has exploded the story in the way only the internet can, and it’s high time for some rationality.

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This was because people were buying boxed Steamworks Games from Russia and Thailand much cheaper than buying on their regional Steam platform or retail shops. Whether or not Steam still has these restrictions in place I'm not sure, but their certainly aren't any others I'm aware of. So if you are planning on buying your copy of the game from a Russian/Thai store and then exporting it or leaving that country and playing Civ5, you might encounter problems.

The only other Steam related regional issues I am aware of is...

German's get "censored" versions of games if they are too "hardcore" / gory and so on. Not going to be a problem with Civ5 though.

Australians have the same sort of issues with strict anti-violence editions of games. Again not much of an issue with Civ5.

Not sure if thier is any other regional concerncs,

Theirs Regional Pricing, but i'm fairly sure if you "trick" Steam by letting say an American buy and gift Civ5 to you, you can still install and play it in say Australia, just make sure you don't do this with someone you don't trust because if they use a stolen credit card your account will get banned.

The Publisher can sell to only specific regions, so you may want to check with 2k to what Regions they will be releasing, I haven't heard any information that they aren't planning on releasing it to X region.

12agnar0k said:

As far as regional restrictions with Steam.

Well the only thing I have ever heard on restricting outside the country...

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Thank you for your response as well and again as I posted above I wish no offense, but why can't we hear an answer from someone official? I'm not the first to ask this question and the prolonged silence from the 2K corporate PR reps is absolutely deafening.

July 26 - Original post on the first page of 2K Greg's Official Civ5 Steamworks FAQ thread.

August 15 - Repost to 2K Greg's thread.

August 17 - Left a message on the account page of 2K Greg.

Should I post my question over at the 2K Games forum on their Civ5 Steam FAQ thread? Should I send a PM to 2K Greg or 2K Elizabeth?

What value is a "Community Manager" that starts a FAQ thread and then doesn't answer (or respond in any way) to the posted question?

Sahkuhnder said:

Q. Are there any regional restrictions, or can I purchase Civ5 from anywhere in the world and still be allowed to play online/get patches from Steam/add mods/etc. from anywhere in the world?

This question should be relevant not only to those of us who travel, but to the Civ players in places like Australia and New Zealand as well. Link Link

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Wezqu said:

What? You do have the freedom of choice but there is just two options either play the game with steam or don't buy it. As you see there is choices but you just don't like the choices. So you decide there is no options.

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12agnar0k said:

Yeah, got to love those opinions.

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- nothin more to say about that...
And if you read my post - those ridiculous options (which in fact ARE no options - This is EAT or DIE and that's exactly what I'm complaining about!) are exactly the ones I'm thinking about.
- not buying it is a pity for a longtime Big-Fan of the series as I am - but actually I'm really really seriously thinking about it...

Stilgar08 said:

- nothin more to say about that...
And if you read my post - those ridiculous options (which in fact ARE no options - This is EAT or DIE and that's exactly what I'm complaining about!) are exactly the ones I'm thinking about.
- not buying it is a pity for a longtime Big-Fan of the series as I am - but actually I'm really really seriously thinking about it...

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My point stands still. Whining about that person can't play Civ V without steam is quite frankly same as person whining that he can't drive a car without a licence.

Your "EAT or DIE" statement doesn't make your choices vanish. You still have choices and even if you keep on claiming you don't doesn't make it so.

Yes 2kGreg, can you please check and give us an answer? Sprinkle a little of that sweet knowledge of yours to us poor civ addicts so we can go and decide where to get our fix from...

I'm hoping for an answer to it as well. The D2D deluxe offer is IMO the best preorder option available but, by the wishes of either 2K or Firaxis, D2D are not allowed to sell it to anyone in Australia.

An answer to Sahkuhnder's question would help me know if I can just get someone in another country to gift the game to me.

Wezqu said:

As said earlier if for some reason steam would go down permanently. 2k Games has stated that they would release a patch that would let you play without it. Also once you activate the game you don't have to activate it again as its tied to that account you used to activate it. So with steam you only have to remember your account info and if steam is still around in 18 years the game will still be there to be downloaded under your account. You would not even need the disc.

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That assumes 2k / Firaxis is also still around....

zorven said:

That assumes 2k / Firaxis is also still around....

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Well I know there would be a way to play the game as you still can play games that are old as hell.

Wezqu said:

Well I know there would be a way to play the game as you still can play games that are old as hell.

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Well ... yes, because those games don't require any remote activation to be installed. As said before, I can (and from time to time do) run 17 year old games like MoO1, and older ones as well. I install and start MoO1, answer one question that the game asks me, and am good to go. The companies that developed and published MoO1 are long gone, but I can still happily play the game, because whether or not I'm able to install the game is entirely under my control, as it should be.

With Civ5 on Steam, as far as I can tell (I still haven't gotten any official answers), this is different. Steam keeps control over my purchase. When I change my hardware, or when i install the game years from now on a new machine, I have to rely on Steam still being around in order to let me activate and play a game that I purchased. And I resent being at the mercy of a publisher to play a game that I paid good money for.

As far as I can tell, if Steam goes down (and don't tell me it's too big or too successful to ever go down, just have a look at the history of video gaming companies and how many of them went from going strong straight into bankruptcy pretty quickly), then I have no legal hold to have them make my game playable. I know that Steam claims to "presumably" remove their DRM in such a case, but as far as I checked, this is not part of their license (why not?). So if Steam goes down, I have to rely on a then-bankrupt company, which already has my money, to keep a very vague promise to "presumably" remedy the situation, although they are legally in no way obligated to do so. That doesn't sound pretty.

I still wonder why this removal of customer's rights is so eagerly accepted by many customers. Perhaps they can't imagine a seemingly strong company going down (but then they'd have to be pretty inexperienced frankly), or perhaps they don't care about old games becoming unplayable. I, however, do care and decided not to buy Civ5 under these circumstances. I still hope for an alternative release sooner or later.

I'd also still like an official answer to my question, i.e. whether Steam is legally obligated to remove my DRM in case they can't or don't want to maintain their validation servers any more, and/or if they acknowledge that in their license.

Mercade said:

Welcome to CivFantics, Antilegend.

This question has been raised several times, but unfortunately there's no definitive answer. It is very likely that you'll be able play the game in English even if you buy it in Germany, but it's not a 100% given. Whether the DVD contains files for both German and English is not known. There are several options for buying the game from international sources in Germany.

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I'd say it's highly likely that each version is going to have all languages. If it's using XML like civ 4 did then it's pretty much definite.

Psyringe said:

I still wonder why this removal of customer's rights is so eagerly accepted by many customers. Perhaps they can't imagine a seemingly strong company going down (but then they'd have to be pretty inexperienced frankly), or perhaps they don't care about old games becoming unplayable. I, however, do care and decided not to buy Civ5 under these circumstances. I still hope for an alternative release sooner or later.

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same here (as you might have noticed) - maybe it's a german problem - Data privacy and protection of customer-rights are more aware to us, it seems... And Agreed on both: I finally decided NOT to buy ciV (first time ever!) unless there's an alternative distribution... (So, wezq, I took my "option"... )

Mercade said:

Welcome to CivFantics, Antilegend.

This question has been raised several times, but unfortunately there's no definitive answer. It is very likely that you'll be able play the game in English even if you buy it in Germany, but it's not a 100% given. Whether the DVD contains files for both German and English is not known. There are several options for buying the game from international sources in Germany.

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If you look here http://store.steampowered.com/app/50100/ under "Game Details" it lists English, French, German, Italian, Spanish as Languages. While that's no proof, i think it's a very strong indication that you're not bound to one language, at least not when buying from steam (what I probably will do).

Btw, for your "versions" post, this http://store.steampowered.com/news/3792/ contains a short description of the "Cradle of Civilization Map Pack: Mesopotamia" bonus content.

AntiLegend said:

If you look here http://store.steampowered.com/app/50100/ under "Game Details" it lists English, French, German, Italian, Spanish as Languages. While that's no proof, i think it's a very strong indication that you're not bound to one language, at least not when buying from steam (what I probably will do).

Btw, for your "versions" post, this http://store.steampowered.com/news/3792/ contains a short description of the "Cradle of Civilization Map Pack: Mesopotamia" bonus content.

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You're very right that it's a strong indication, but unfortunately it's not a 100% confirmation and people have been burnt with German-only titles in the past, so I'm careful not to give a false guarantee.

Thanks for the reference to the Mesopotamia description. I've added it.

Mercade said:

You're very right that it's a strong indication, but unfortunately it's not a 100% confirmation and people have been burnt with German-only titles in the past, so I'm careful not to give a false guarantee.

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So how about it 2K? Can one of your official reps please take a moment and answer the customer questions here on the FAQ thread your company started?

Seeing as newer steam threads get closed so fast, i guess i have to reply here?
Particularly this thread: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=376292

People are quick to say 'its only a one time connection to steam to authenticate, then go into offline mode!'.

Yes, this would be a great solution for keeping the game from knowing when a new patch is ready for download, and having a chance to break mods. Also for the people who just dont want to deal with Steam, or for bandwidth purposes, or for Whatever reasons. But as of this posting, Steam still attempts to 'call home' if there is an internet connection. This is why i think some people have different experiences when concerning Steam Offline mode and updates, and games not running in offline mode until theyre updated.

Note in this screenshot Peerguardian blocking lots of steam activity while in offline mode.


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I guess to keep with this threads topic...

"Why does Steam attempt to go online, while in offline mode?" is a good question for a SteamFaq.

Wardancing said:

Seeing as newer steam threads get closed so fast, i guess i have to reply here?
Particularly this thread: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=376292

Yes, this would be a great solution for keeping the game from knowing when a new patch is ready for download, and having a chance to break mods. Also for the people who just dont want to deal with Steam, or for bandwidth purposes, or for Whatever reasons. But as of this posting, Steam still attempts to 'call home' if there is an internet connection. This is why i think some people have different experiences when concerning Steam Offline mode and updates, and games not running in offline mode until theyre updated.

Note in this screenshot Peerguardian blocking lots of steam activity while in offline mode.

I guess to keep with this threads topic...

"Why does Steam attempt to go online, while in offline mode?" is a good question for a SteamFaq.

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That's actually a very good question. When the game and/or Steam are in off-line mode, I expect it to be off-line and not try to connect to the network for any purpose until I tell it to do so.

You should've blurred your steam user account.

if you are not using valves anticheat system, why are you using steam at all? it makes steam absolutely pointless.

Not trying to defend Steam here but we don't even know if that log is taken when steam was on offline mode as we can't see the time anywhere.

As DRM goes, I find Steam to be one of the least intrusive. It's certainly better than those that install to the boot sector of your hard drive, or give you grief if you happen to install the game more than x number of times. While I'm a firm believer that DRM only punishes honest people and that pirates will always be less inconvenienced than paying customers, Steam seems the least malevolent of these "necessary" evils.

Moderator Action: 8 posts moved from the FAQ to here.

AntiLegend said:

If you look here http://store.steampowered.com/app/50100/ under "Game Details" it lists English, French, German, Italian, Spanish as Languages. While that's no proof, i think it's a very strong indication that you're not bound to one language, at least not when buying from steam (what I probably will do).

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In the version at the gamescom, you could choose the language.