The UU-A-Day Countdown

Eagle Pursuit said:

The War Chariot really excites me. I hope there's a promotion that allows it to move after its ranged attack. That would be so badass.

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I don't think we've seen any such promotion, but that's not to say it doesn't exist of course.

From how it looks to me, the War Chariot is going to be the new Quechua, although that honor may end up going to the Jaguar. Still, be-lining Wheel (lol ) isn't going to be too hard, and having a 5-move resourceless Chariot eek at that early in the game could be devastating. And since they're ranged, they take a little of the oomph out of spearmen, since they can get in their first vollies without reprisal.

Also of note: it looks like the Greeks will be pretty impervious to Egypt, more or less. Having an extra 2 strength on their spearman will help them make quick work of the Chariots unless they manage to swarm all the Hoplites down with sufficient numbers (which will be tough at a 3 strength disadvantage). Plus, unlike normal Horsemen, Companion Cavalry can keep pace with them and have an enormous strength advantage (3 melee 6 ranged vs 14 melee ) and only require one more tech to get.

Plus, Monument Builders isn't going to help much if someone comes by, counters your advantages, and crushes you in the ancient age. So if I were an Egyptian player and ran into an early Alexander, I'd be nervous.

I wonder if that was intentional.

Lyoncet said:

I don't think we've seen any such promotion, but that's not to say it doesn't exist of course.

From how it looks to me, the War Chariot is going to be the new Quechua, although that honor may end up going to the Jaguar. Still, be-lining Wheel (lol ) isn't going to be too hard, and having a 5-move resourceless Chariot eek at that early in the game could be devastating. And since they're ranged, they take a little of the oomph out of spearmen, since they can get in their first vollies without reprisal.

Also of note: it looks like the Greeks will be pretty impervious to Egypt, more or less. Having an extra 2 strength on their spearman will help them make quick work of the Chariots unless they manage to swarm all the Hoplites down with sufficient numbers (which will be tough at a 3 strength disadvantage). Plus, unlike normal Horsemen, Companion Cavalry can keep pace with them and have an enormous strength advantage (3 melee 6 ranged vs 14 melee ) and only require one more tech to get.

Plus, Monument Builders isn't going to help much if someone comes by, counters your advantages, and crushes you in the ancient age. So if I were an Egyptian player and ran into an early Alexander, I'd be nervous.

I wonder if that was intentional.

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There's a ranged promotion called mobility.

Schuesseled said:

There's a ranged promotion called mobility.

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Then that would be must for War Chariots especially when facing Alexander the Warmonger.

The War Chariots won't be obsoleted by Horsemen like Chariot Archers are. They have a ranged attack instead of melee and they don't compete for a resource that will still be fairly hard to come by when you only have a handful of cities in the beginning. There will actually be a bit of synergy there.

Think of a Horseman/War Chariot high speed task force. Brutal.

They have a ranged attack instead of melee

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Chariot archers also have a ranged attack.

But yes, it would be much easier to create a war chariot/horseman force, since they don't compete for a resource.

Ahriman said:

Chariot archers also have a ranged attack.

But yes, it would be much easier to create a war chariot/horseman force, since they don't compete for a resource.

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Right, I meant in contrast to the horseman not Chariot archer in that detail. A mixed bag of attacks that can reach distant places in a hurry is very cool.

The point is that Horsemen don't necessarily obsolete Chariot Archers either.

But the 'no competition for a resource' is important.

Excellent points on combining War Chariots with Horsemen; I hadn't considered using them as a very fast two-line formation, moving at twice the speed and a bit more power than a traditional Swordsman/Archer front. You can try to do that without the War Chariot, but resource competition's going to be a huge crunch in the ancient era, when you'll only really have one or two resource tiles. A 4/4 line will hurt approximately twice as much as a 2/2 line, or it may push you over their defense threshold and hurt infinitely more.

For the 20th day left, we'll go from a a unit that embraces maneuverability to one that sacrifices it: the Siamaese Naresuan's Elephant. This unit asks the Siam player a simple question: at what price power? This unit has some truly impressive bonuses, starting with 4 (!) extra strength (22) over Knights (18), a bonus against mounted units, the ability to move after attacking, and to top it off, requires no resource.

So, it's the best comparative UU in the game, right? So far, so good, but it comes with a hefty penalty: one less movement point than Knights.

This might be the most interesting UU to discuss because of its penalty to movement. Whereas other UUs open new combat strategies (Legions and frontier expansion, Foreign Legion and forward defenses, etc), Naresuan's Elephant closes them in exchange for sheer strength. Each pre-industrial age's units follow a pattern: one weak ranged infantry, one strong heavy infantry, and one swift mounted unit. The medieval Siamese instead lose their swift cavalry in exchange for a second heavy infantry. Thus, while the Elephant may be incredibly powerful in combat, the loss of one movement point robs the Siamese general of his quick mounted troops. Naresuan's Elephants will tear through Knights...but the Knights can outmaneuver them all era long. No flanking, no behind-the-lines pillaging, no emergency support...the Siam leader will have to seriously adjust his operations around the limitations of the Elephant. The general that can do so, however, will be richly rewarded: in terms of sheer strength, nothing beats Elephants until Riflemen*, three tech levels away. Chivalry is a really bad tech to beeline (lots of two-requirement techs), but a rush towards it can make Siam the lord of the battlefield for centuries. If your combat plans don't require swift Knights, you can rule with Siam. If they do...you're in for a rough time, as entire strategies become non-viable.

Father Governs Children is nice, but with this UU, it becomes Elephants Govern You

(Does anyone else feel taunted by the "move after attacking" ability? Unless it's an invitation to promote the UU with Mobility...)

*Lancers have the same strength, but Lancers are mounted, so the Elephant's bonus kicks in.

I think the elephants will do nicely in a pinch. Literally. If you have something to back your enemy against, like say a mountain range, a penninsula, one of your cities, or some of your troops fortified in hills or forests, it negates their movement advantage. The elephants will be great on snakey continents and islands where manueverability is limited.

Egyptian Chariot: This is an extremely interesting unit for the Egyptians, imho more than anything becase of the potential shoot and retreat thing they have going on there. That and you can get them out extremely early, which means that you can build a decent empire from the start, clear out some rivals, etc. What you can then do is sit back and start to pump out those wonders they're so renowned for in the following bunch of years. Yes, that might include the Pyramids, but the early gains made with the chariot should really help in the long run.

As a result I see the Egyptians taking advantage of one of the best units towards the beginning only to play fairly peacefully the rest of the game. Real interesting mechanic there, so much so that I'm getting tempted to play the Egyptians right off the bat!

Naresuan's Elephant: Seems like less of a finesse units compared to many others we've covered. I see it as throw them towards your enemy who then proceeds to get trampled into the mud (literally ). I think too that with the option to attack and then retreat you can save them when injured and allow your army to maintain a number of veteran units. Perhaps the most dangerous thing is that they require no resources; you can just keep pumping them out until as someone else said riflemen enter the game. And I'll gladly let the horsemen gain the flanks, with a 25% bonus (plus strength to boot!) the elephant can take on all comers. Just point them at what you want to die, and, well, they should.

Hmm, I never thought of the vs. mounted bonus being used for defense.

Put em on the flanks and among your melees and go slowly over anything in your path. Its a Juggarnaut unit.

First, a brief trip back in time...I really like the minuteman. With one unit per tile, decent terrain and the right promotions, a pair of minutemen can stop a major army at a good choke point. That could be fun and useful. Especially if you're rebuilding your economy after a bout of pointy-stick expansion.

Regarding Naresuan's elephant, just wow. I expect they will do a wonderful job against a city, and will double nicely as retribution for any units stupid enough to get too close. Haven't thought up any really good specialty cases for this one yet, but you never know.

Eagle Pursuit said:

Put em on the flanks and among your melees and go slowly over anything in your path. Its a Juggarnaut unit.

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This is it I think. Instead of a main force of longswords and pikes, you can do longswords and elephants. Really more of an uber, city-assaulting pikeman replacement than a knight replacement.

CleverFool said:

Egyptian Chariot: This is an extremely interesting unit for the Egyptians, imho more than anything becase of the potential shoot and retreat thing they have going on there.

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Know we're technically off the War Chariot now, but figured I'd point out that, at least according to Arioch's site, War Chariots cannot attack after moving. The only ranged unit listed as being able to do so is the Camel Archer. It's possible that a promotion exists that allows movement after attacking, but the War Chariot wouldn't get that much more benefit from this than a normal chariot (apart from being more of them, and being able to get one tile further away).

Naresuan's Elephants are going to be great. They would crush everybody with their sheer strength. I like that. It would be an interesting scenario when Siam & Arabia would be at war with each other. Both have resource less units & are going to be great. Naresuan's Elephants will form the front line while Camel Archers will fire from behind.

The elephant will basically be just another infantry yup, just have your line of infantry and archers move slowly against your enemies, the line will not crumble, all enemy units will crumple beneath the Elephants 2 movement charge, and then you can after attacking move another hex, which is cool .

I think that the best thing about this unit is that its basically a super pikeman, except its also weak against regular pikeman. But this unit will completley replace pikeman, for some reallly good anti-horse units, but you only have regular horsemen as fast moving mounted units.

That moove after attack is really really strong. If you have a line of 2 elephants, you can let the first line attack, swap with the second line and let the second line attack again. This makes it the ideal choke point buster. If you have open terrain, you can just build a lot of them, with no extra resource required. Strongest unit by far, unflankable, unattackable, unstoppable. I think its a great UU. And it requires the enemy to put his pikes in the frontline which can be used as a great trap if Siam has some mixed in.

Semmel said:

That moove after attack is really really strong. If you have a line of 2 elephants, you can let the first line attack, swap with the second line and let the second line attack again. This makes it the ideal choke point buster. If you have open terrain, you can just build a lot of them, with no extra resource required. Strongest unit by far, unflankable, unattackable, unstoppable. I think its a great UU. And it requires the enemy to put his pikes in the frontline which can be used as a great trap if Siam has some mixed in.

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Even if it is "weaker" against Pikemen, it still has greater strength than a Pikeman, even with the modified strength v. mounted (22 v. 20, I assume). It appears to be a very strong union at least on paper. But we don't know how central mobility will be with the new hex-based 1 UPT system.

The Elephants seem interesting because instead of replacing the Knight, they are effectively replacing the Longsword+Pike (because they are better than both of those).

Siam may be able to use them as a Juggernaut.

The vulnerability will be to Crossbows/Trebuchets. Since Siam loses its Flankers, the Elephant will have to go Straight through the frontline instead of trying to go around it. The Strength and the Move after attacking helps with that (2 lines of Elephants sounds like a good idea)