SGOTM 12 - ChokoMisfits

Sun Tzu Wu · Dec 3, 2010

JerichoHill said:
Agreed. having now looked over the save, beakers are the limiting factor for us. I like the thought of switching to OR for .... even more beakers!

You probably meant Caste System; we already running Organized Religion.

JerichoHill said:
Moai would pollute the GS pool in the capital...do we need to risk that?

Wall Street in the Capital would be a much better choice. Great Merchant pollution is much better than Great Prophet. We will need to keep a Great Merchant to incorporate Sid's Sushi in any case, so the Great Merchant pollution would be actually be desirable. Any excess Great Merchants can conduct Trades Mission to City containing The Temple of Artemis.

I prefer Moai Statues in Paris, since it will have more water Tiles and could really use the extra Culture to keep De Gaulle's Culture in check. We just need to build a few Workshops to build Moai Statues in Paris at a reasonable rate.

Sun Tzu Wu

Sleepless · Dec 4, 2010

Would be a bit worried about Paris's ability to build Moai plus don't think its worth changing its town to workshops atm. Does need lots of other things to build as well but pretty easy either way.

Ianw1610 just wondering when you will be able to play as time is getting pretty short and still lots more turnsets to play.

JerichoHill · Dec 4, 2010

Sun, You're right, I meant Caste. I still think that's a smart move. I'm typically not in favor of a wonder-focused strategy, so if Paris needs other crud, I prefer that.

If we can fit Wall Street in to get the $$$$$$$$$, that would be fine in the capital

ianw1610 · Dec 4, 2010

My apologies for the delay. I'll aim to play in the next 12 hours.

ianw1610 · Dec 5, 2010

Again, sorry for the delay, but I was able to play 15 turns.

We were first to Economics and got the free Great Merchant. Also, a Great Engineer was born on the same turn in Capital. Both are currently sleeping in Capital.

I researched the path as discussed, and stopped 6 turns short of Communism. Also we traded Replaceable Parts from Churchill in exchange for Astronomy plus some Gold. We got Music in a trade from Roosevelt also, that also brought us a lot of cash.

We know a lot more about Stalin. His capital has 7 Tactical Nukes and 7 Grenadiers. Remember we must kill Stalin to win the game.

Settled 3 new cities. The vineyard to the North, plus the two cities on the SE landmass. The first city on the other landmass cost us just 2 gold net as the intercontinental trade routes paid for it. The second city on that landmass cost us 14 gold net.

I built National Epic in SugarPig and have started building Mausoleum of Mausollos in Capital.

JerichoHill is up next.

Here is your Session Turn Log from 1330 AD to 1490 AD:

Spoiler :

JerichoHill · Dec 5, 2010

I'll take any ideas. I have a final exam for PhD Metrics tomorrow, so I won't really be doing anything tomorrow. Planning on getting a turnset plan in on Tuesday, revise Wednesday and play Thursday.

Ozbenno · Dec 5, 2010

Do we save GE and GM for Sushi/Mining? Probably best I think but a trade mission would also be good for GM.

Main issues to my mind are 1) cleaning all the fallout, 2) eliminating Stalin and 3) launching. 1 and 2 have to be done before 3 and I imagine 1 is the main bottleneck we have. How are we faring with the fallout scrubbing??

ianw1610 · Dec 6, 2010

I'd prefer to save the GM for Sushi... we are only 6 turns from Communism and State Property anyway (although of course we will switch back out of that when it is time to found our Corporations).

Fallout scrubbing is a big challenge. We are progressing well with fallout in our lands... but we need to scrub all the tiny landmasses also (some of which we may not yet have discovered). Also, the AIs seem less keen to scrub fallout in their lands. Given that we don't have Open Borders with all AIs, it may be difficult to scrub all fallout in rival lands.

I'd stay in Serfdom as this helps with our scrubbing effort.

Sleepless · Dec 6, 2010

Nice turnset ianw1610. :goodjob:

Glad Stalin only has Tacs so an easy amphibious attack on him and he shouldn't cause any real problems.

One thought though was Churchill pleased or cautious with us when he went into WHEEOH mode? If its us don't fancy lots of redcoats coming at us at the moment. If its DG we will have to bribe him into peace. I can see us having to do this all game actually to keep DG alive so something for JH to be very careful of if he sees a big stack from Church coming through our lands.

I'll try and post a few more thoughts when I can look at the save but don't see much point starting off with courthouses now we are so near State Property.

haphazard1 · Dec 6, 2010

Looks like a nice turnset, ianw1610! :goodjob:

I note from the log that Roosevelt has adopted Emancipation, causing us unhappiness.

Not much we can do about it, since I think we will continue to want Serfdom to imrove our worker speeds.

Note also that he got a GE the following turn -- I thought he might use it on Statue of Liberty. But the log shows him as completing the Parthenon and Sistine Chapel immediately afterward. It is possible he was already almost done with both, but odds are he used the GE on one of them. Statue of Liberty would certainly be nice to have, but it seems unlikely we will get it.

On courthouses, we should be building them. State Property only affects distance maintenance and not number of cities maintenance, so we still get some benefit. And if we switch back out of SP later for corporations we will definitely need them, especially with corporation costs added our cities will get very expensive. Wall Street is an absolute necessity if we plan to run corporations, so we need to make sure we have enough banks early enough for it to be built in time to be useful.

Also, courthouses will give us more EP, which are always handy to have.

Sounds like we have gotten most of the benefit of off-shore trade routes for now, although if more AIs switch to Mercantilism (how many are already in it?) we will lose more foreign trade routes and off-shore will become more valuable. We should at least settle all the two food sites; weaker sites can be discussed.

Can we hit Stalin with an amphibious attack from beyond his tac-nuke range? If so, we can avoid being nuked. Seven grenadiers is a pretty good force, though -- taking it out in one turn from sea will require an impressive force on our part. Fortunately we are in no rush, and can take care of Stalin later with more advanced troops.

Good luck with your final, JH!

Ozbenno · Dec 6, 2010

I'd say we need artillery and infantry (marines better) to take out Stalin. We should be able to hit him same turn we declare though. If we have enough troops, no nukes...

Sleepless · Dec 6, 2010

Some thoughts.

Especially as we are going for State Property. First builds in our new cities to me should be granaries after our first priority which should be improve food resources. Copper/Corn I would get 2 workboats out very quickly and mine the hills. This should lead to a much faster build of all buildings in current and new cities.

New cities unless it has 2 food resources or a resource we don't have like the spice island near Ghandi's new city. Settle for the 2 spice crab should be an aim in the next turnset. Sheep/Clam as well wuld be nice but we are racing the AI for the good spots now.

Great people. I would send the GM to London for a trade mission. No point in ToA city as we have Sci Meth and its now obsolete.

As much as it pains me I think we should burn the GE on a golden age. We need the boost to our cities when we next change civics.

I would suggest Rep/FS/Caste (during GA and pop some GS's from Sugar/Pig) State Prop and Free Reg.

Start watermills/workshops in a few cities which have no or little production.

Probably an idea when we have a spare worker (if that could be possible :lol:

) to start cleaning up the AI lands for them. Just one in each country should be able to clean most of the fallout.

As for Mao/DG we'll just have to declare on them for there own good and just protect the workforce with military whilst there cleaning up. Thats if you can? I played a game recently where I couldn't build railroads in an enemy country but perhaps thats because the workforce doesnt have access to iron/coal in enemy territory. Could be a big problem otherwise.

Trying to work out how Roo can have Democracy without Nationalism. Guess its one of the techs given out free at the beginning.

Note. Mao's favoured civic is State Prop so FR and Fav civic might get him to open borders. Doubtful but you never know.

Bribing Churchill to stop war against DG (when he starts still hoping it isn't us!!!) I would give him economics if possible and he might change to Free Market to boost our trade routes.

Worker actions. I would clear fallout then improve the tile before moving on to the next tile. E.g Ivory Town has 2 unmined hills and working a 2f tile and a 1f1h tile. I think it would be better in cases like this to run 2 citizen specialists until it has improved tiles to work and obviously no specialist slots available.

Ozbenno · Dec 6, 2010

Do we know if the Great Spy is available for Communism. If it is we should burn that on a Golden Age, rather the GE.

Sun Tzu Wu · Dec 6, 2010

Just wanted to say:

Great Turn Set ianw1610!

Sun Tzu Wu

ianw1610 · Dec 7, 2010

We are safe from Churchill, as he was Pleased with us when he went into WHEOOHRN, and he doesn't backstab. His target could be De Gaulle (again)... he could also be targeting Gandhi.

I'd wait for M of M to complete before deciding on a Golden Age, and also wait to see whether or not we get the free Great Spy.

I think it would be a big waste to use a Great Engineer on a Golden Age. Maybe try to swiftly generate a Great Scientist in SugarPig for our first Golden Age?

From the start of the game, we never took a peace treaty with Stalin... maybe we might want to take peace with him now, until such time are our amphibious forces are in place, in order that we can DoW him and start our attacks on the same turn.

PS - @Ozbenno - has there been any... um... sporting events in the Adelaide area in the past few days?!?!! :mischief:

Sleepless · Dec 7, 2010

No great Spy otherwise it would be on the screen as first to. So guess its been deleted when Mao was given State Prop.

Don't think we are allowed to make peace with Stalin. Will check and make sure and change this if needed.

Of coure if it hasn't been built and we can get Nat in trade the Taj Mahal (don't think so) hasn't been built yet so a possibility for the GE. As we haven't had many GPs shouldn't be any problem in getting another GE along the way.

JerichoHill · Dec 7, 2010

Notes for Turnset

Stay in Serfdom to help scrub the fallout. Prioritize this over other improvements.
Save the GM for Sid's Sushi.

Watch Churchhill to see if he DOWS on DG. If so we need to bribe him into peace (Econ?)

Prioritize Courthouses.

I'm supposed to get 2 new cities, and copper/corn builds 2 workboats and mines hills
One should be near the 2Spice Crab, maybe also Sheep/Clam

Revolt Rep/FS?Caste/SP/Free Reg during GA.

Prioritize watermills/workshops in places with no production

Worker- Clear tile, improve tile, etc.

GS in Sugar Pig for Golden Age

Sleepless · Dec 7, 2010

Note. Make sure you improve the tiles as well. Better to run specialists or anything than unimproved squares imho.

If were not going to run a golden age I would suggest just changing to State Property when it comes in. Would prefer a big change of civics but we can't afford 3 turns of anarchy. Tbh I'm not keen on one if we can avoid it. Not sure how long the next GP will be coming from Sugar/Pig and we can't really delay taking State Property once it's in.

Ozbenno · Dec 7, 2010

ianw1610 said:
PS - @Ozbenno - has there been any... um... sporting events in the Adelaide area in the past few days?!?!!

No, none that I'm aware of

ianw1610 · Dec 7, 2010

Ozbenno said:
No, none that I'm aware of

mwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

SGOTM 12 - ChokoMisfits

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