New NESes, ideas, development, etc

Knives and Spoons. Forks are the "Things of the Devil" :D

You'll probably have to define very carefully what a "City-State Action" limit is. It might be one sentence, only to face giant sentenses. You might want a combination of a hard cap on the number of words and some set actions. (i.e. signing a treaty is always one action, which can include such minor side trips as X in city-state action)

Just would be very fun. You will have Three Houses: two can unite, but only one can take Lordship and thus control of the Armies, Navies, Diplomacy and Secret Police.

Not sure what will happen if a Noble House is exterminated (will take several turns of investment, I guess, to just get prepared), if a city state gets conquered, not subjugated in favor of another more friendly Noble House; and other fun stuff.

Maybe, if there are only a handful of city states (Say, 5), let players play guilds and mercenaries too!!!

Sounds like Nessos now, a bit. :p
 
I'm starting to take renewed interest in NESing, and was thinking about maybe having another go at a fantasy NES. It would be somewhat like the Sekai ones, in that players would be allowed to play as countries, groups (ranging from a guild spanning multiple countries to a small band of adventurers), and perhaps individuals. I was thinking updates that cover one month, so that smaller-scale players aren't overwhelmed and larger-scale players can still not go at an awkward pace.

I'd probably make a Pre-NES where players help shape the history of the part of the world we'll play in. This will mainly be done so I'm not working with a completely blank slate when working with the world's history. It'll help determine where certain races are located, where particular artifacts can be found, and other neat details. Plus I'll just try to make it an overall fun experience :p

Opinions or interest?

:goodjob:
 
I'm starting to take renewed interest in NESing, and was thinking about maybe having another go at a fantasy NES. It would be somewhat like the Sekai ones, in that players would be allowed to play as countries, groups (ranging from a guild spanning multiple countries to a small band of adventurers), and perhaps individuals. I was thinking updates that cover one month, so that smaller-scale players aren't overwhelmed and larger-scale players can still not go at an awkward pace.

I'd probably make a Pre-NES where players help shape the history of the part of the world we'll play in. This will mainly be done so I'm not working with a completely blank slate when working with the world's history. It'll help determine where certain races are located, where particular artifacts can be found, and other neat details. Plus I'll just try to make it an overall fun experience :p

Opinions or interest?

Including individuals would be cool. :)
 
Knives and Spoons. Forks are the "Things of the Devil" :D

You'll probably have to define very carefully what a "City-State Action" limit is. It might be one sentence, only to face giant sentenses. You might want a combination of a hard cap on the number of words and some set actions. (i.e. signing a treaty is always one action, which can include such minor side trips as X in city-state action)

Just would be very fun. You will have Three Houses: two can unite, but only one can take Lordship and thus control of the Armies, Navies, Diplomacy and Secret Police.

Not sure what will happen if a Noble House is exterminated (will take several turns of investment, I guess, to just get prepared), if a city state gets conquered, not subjugated in favor of another more friendly Noble House; and other fun stuff.

Maybe, if there are only a handful of city states (Say, 5), let players play guilds and mercenaries too!!!

Sounds like Nessos now, a bit. :p

This was the map,
Spoiler :

so I imagine guilds and mercenaries won't be needed given the number of cities. I must admit the idea was one I entertained for a while though. Maybe NPCs.
 
Having small 'teams' of NESers in each city is a very intriguing idea that I like quite a bit. :D I haven't been in a 'team' NES since the aborted WW1 NES where I was a Hungarian Field Marshall serving under Emperor Symphony D.
 
I was Field Marshal Conrad von Hötzendorf, not Franz Joseph I.
 
I express interest on behalf of myself and Luckymoose. We know Lucky wants in on this. :D

Lucky clearly hates me... But I guess I could let him in whenever I decide to start this :p

Interested. Will it be entirely story based, or will you have number crunching involved?
Haven't decided details yet. For countries and city-states stats might look something like this example
Name / Dol'hima
Government / Magocracy
Culture / Dol Dwarven in cities and mountains, Harraresh Humans and Giants in the lowlands, tiny Barbeng Merfolk minority in coastal towns
Military / Heavy Dol Infantry make up bulk of armies, advanced siege engines, ancient Ghizraheth Automatons, Enslaved Giants, earth-mages supplement armies
Companies: 35
Money (-military upkeep): 15,000 (-8,000)
Projects: Hellforge (3,000/20,000)
Description:
Spoiler :
Long ago Dol earth mages settled near Delheim Pass, feeling an odd energy there. After much effort, they unearthed great beings of iron and bronze, composed of gears and machines of unimaginable complexity. Amazed by their discovery, the mages established fort Dol'hima to protect their new treasures and tinker with them in isolation. However, as dragons and beastmen ravaged the region, immigrants streamed into Dol'hima, seeking refuge and a means to take back their lands. Finally, High Mage Urist Khrastgem agreed to go forth to meet the invaders, bringing with him a small army of experienced mages, and their towering automatons. The beastmen proved to be no match for the combined magical and physical force the Dwarves brought to the battlefield, and only the hottest dragon fire could melt the automatons. Eventually the Dwarves of Dol'hima found themselves in possession of a vast empire, having pushed out the beastmen and secluding the remaining dragons to the most isolated and high peaks. Some humans believe they may have traded one cruel master for another, but their fellow Dwarves love the change, preferring to dwell on matters of profit, magic, and industry while the humans dwell on agriculture and other "unimportant" arts.


I could definitely tweak it, and I'm open to suggestions. Religion would definitely be included, if I had any random ideas to throw into the example at this time :p Factions could also be a possibility. Companies would be approx. 1,000 individuals each, although depending on the nation it could vary. Composition could also vary. A kingdom ruled by..lets say Ulgaf The Giant might have companies of only 250 men, but would be comprised of heavily armored giants who bring with them giant man-eating boars. On the opposite end of the spectrum, the Merfolk Republic of Koralintis might be able to hire companies of 3,000, equipped with hastily scavenged armor from sunken ships.

And yes, I'm pulling these example names out of my ass :p

Interested.. but a bit miffed since everyone wants to start a fantasy NES up.
This always seems to be the case. I've just gotten sick of waiting.

Including individuals would be cool. :)

I'm glad you think so! For individual stats I'd probably just have

Name
Age
Race
Religion
Magic Ability
Inventory
Description

I could add something like "Renown" or "Infamy", depending on how your character is viewed in certain places. For instance, a traveling monk who blesses those he comes across while in a predominantly halfling region and fights off various beasts could become very famous in that area. But when he ventures into a kingdom of beastmen, he could be very infamous, becoming a harbinger of death to the locals.

Edit: Damn it, of course I need a map for all of this...
 
As I said in #nes, I'd be interested Ninja.

You should have a dedicated team of people (no more than 5-6) to work on the pre-NES. (And it looks like you already have one!) If you don't want to player-limit the main NES that's fine, but you should actively encourage less-confident writers to post their story materials in the Creative Writing thread for comment and criticism (or privately review them yourself) before dumping them in the NES thread.

Nothing ruins a fantasy NES more than bad writing.
 
Nothing ruins a fantasy NES more than bad writing.

That is not fair to the less competent writers out there. A storyNES at its core is an environment for nurturing the growth of creative writing on the forum, not shunning it. That being said, I would gladly offer my services as a co-moderator in so far as helping newer players develop their writing and critique their work.
 
So, my idea for a possible, new MilarNES.

We would start with three turns of Boring Times, because that way I would be sure that we can ACTUALLY reach the Classical Age.

There would be three resources: Population, Money and Research Points.

Population would determine (at least, partially) how much Money you earn in a turn, and also how many people you would be able to recruit for the army.

Money can also be earned by trade (I have yet to determine how to do trade), plunder and other methods.

Research Points would be gained by having people working on that. The amount of RPs gained will depend on the number of people working on it (which won't be able to work on gaining money by trade), projects done, culture and other methods.

Other stats would be:
- Stability: I think it is not required to actually say what this means.
- Living Quality: May or may not be, but it would measure how well your people live.
- Happiness: Could be, but it might be used as a way to attract people. The happier your people are, the bigger the chance of migrants coming and increasing your population. Remember, a stable nation does not mean a happy nation (would you say that North Korea is actually a happy nation?).
- Culture: depending on how much culture you have, it will make research easier, and might also make it easier to attract other people.
- Army/Navy Quality: guess what?

Also, getting a line out of EQandcivfanatic, there would be some basic units that all nations would be able to use, but the good units would be developed by the different nations. How powerful those units are will depend on the Army/Navy Quality (which will determine how many stat points the units will have at maximum) and the Research Points spent. Technologies would determine the maximum points each stat would be able to have.

Army units would have four stats: Melée, Long Distance, Mobility and Discipline
Navy units would have four stats: Power, Mobility, Armour and Transport

Of course, not everything is done. Any ideas you may have in this, I'd love to hear.
 
If you ask me, the real trick to keeping a fresh start (which is what I think you are talking about, although I admit I'm not sure) going is to have a clear and straightforward tech progression. People get stuck in the Stone Age and they get bored, even if you do make it into the classical age here you want to be sure that your players sense a way out of the classical age. So, I'm not sure that BT's are really going to add to the longevity.

It's like growing a rosebush, if you want it to live you are going to have to water it and tend to it there is no cheating that system. But if you want it to grow and reach it's full potential you have to have posts and other stable, well thought out support systems to lead this plant in an upward direction.

I'm not saying you need to force your players in that direction, and of course, you have to be prepared for your players to want to do things in the here and now, this turn, instead of just preparing for the next turn. I'm just saying that straightforward rules for tech advancement are more important than which stats you use.

- Stability: I think it is not required to actually say what this means.
- Living Quality: May or may not be, but it would measure how well your people live.
- Happiness: Could be, but it might be used as a way to attract people. The happier your people are, the bigger the chance of migrants coming and increasing your population.
Remember, a stable nation does not mean a happy nation (would you say that North Korea is actually a happy nation?).

In an NES, would you consider it a stable one? I think all three of these stats are redundant and say the same thing, I think you can at least cut out "quality of life." But I still believe that stats are for the mod, not the players and I don't think that having three different measurements for social stability would help when you could just have one stat and allow the other two to work inside of it. Your social stability is threatened because your people don't have enough food, or because your people aren't happy, instead of giving each a stat of it's own that you have to update for every player every turn.

-

I know I'm a hater, but I'm not trying to hate. I'm just trying to look at your rules and think about them the way that I think about NES rules.

With the RPs it is cool, you have a system for generating research, but what are you researching? Are you just letting everyone decide their own projects? If so, how do you tell when a standardized age has come or pass? Even if you just make it a system where every 5 research projects advances your age that might very well work.

Again, no offense, one love.
 
I've never used hard and fast rules for tech advancement. They tend to make no sense, and having a vague sense of technological progression has never bothered my players -- at least, they never voiced it as a concern.
 
I mean, nobody ever talks about it. It's my theory of the "secret problem" of fresh starts, I mean, something has to be working wrong. Tech progress is what moves a game forwards if you ask me, if it works right nobody notices.

But I've seen many a fresh start circle the drain because no one had a clear idea of "what comes next." Tech is designed to provide that. I'm not saying that you shouldn't allow players to add techs or to do their own thing. I believe that players should have a lot of control over the game, I want open-ended. But the problem I've always seen was "what comes next?"
 
I have literally never encountered that problem in my [numerous] fresh starts. The only problems have really been lack of mod interest, and sometimes just collapse under its own weight. But tech problems? You have a very odd (or metagamey) playerbase.
 
If you want to do a fresh start NES with weird tech things, why not do an Alpha Centauri-esque NES starting off with a botched colonization attempt?
 
I have literally never encountered that problem in my [numerous] fresh starts. The only problems have really been lack of mod interest, and sometimes just collapse under its own weight.

We're just talking about the same things Interest and Rule complication.

For the first one I think that clearly understood parameters for tech progress (and with it game progress) helps maintain interest on both the moderator and players' parts. If you keep doing the same things then it WILL get boring, if you establish parameters for change it will keep things interesting.

For the second, that's what I was saying in my first post here, simple rule sets. It also helps conserve mod interest to keep them from having to manage overly complicated stats and rules.

If you want to do a fresh start NES with weird tech things, why not do an Alpha Centauri-esque NES starting off with a botched colonization attempt?

I tried something like that once, it was like the Challenger. Everyone really wanted it to get into space. It had a lot of the parts associated with space travel. But the higher it got into the atmosphere the more it seemed like it wasn't airtight.

I could have done more to think about space rules beforehand, obviously I should have, but it hit that atmosphere and... kablam.
 
I don't have any problem with you making them work for it, they should have to work for it. All I'm saying is that there has to be some sort of finish line where everyone can agree "and now we move on to this."

It isn't like everyone is bronze in Absolution, it's still only one guy. And that guy went all out for science to the detriment of his economy, infrastructure and various other things. It's been an effective playstyle but no more or less effective than, say, trade magnate, economic expansion obsession or hard religious focus, all four of those work differently and it's fun to see the different ways problems get solved.
 
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