New NESes, ideas, development, etc

I disagree. As a player, I save all my stats, so I can watch them (as a representation of my hard work) expand, flourish, diminish, split into multiple nations, et cetera. I do this after an NES has died to try and see if I can get such a result again, in a different game, to test myself.

The most labourious of these I think will just be the tax rate, but I really, really want to implement that. The 'factions' look a lot more complicated than they actually are. The way I will handle those is simple reactions to what the player has implemented. It makes it easier for me, as a mod, to do it on paper, than in my head.
 
I prefer a nice balance; stats that show as much information in the most concise way possible. They are easier to manage as well.
 
The most labourious of these I think will just be the tax rate, but I really, really want to implement that.

I hope you feel the same way about it after a month or so, but in my experience a passion for complicated stuff tends to be shortlived.

The 'factions' look a lot more complicated than they actually are. The way I will handle those is simple reactions to what the player has implemented. It makes it easier for me, as a mod, to do it on paper, than in my head.

So, I understand what you are saying about trying to find numerical values for the sentiment of the internal population. It isn't like I'm opposed to that sort of thing, you might be familiar with Social Cohesion.

Which isn't to say that Social Cohesion is a perfect system, I have learned that the scale I used just isn't nearly big enough, but it's the stone age still so I think that having corruption maxed at 2 and cohesion maxed at 10 works for right now, although I'm definitely going to start expanding both of those maximum values as soon as everyone hits Bronze.

Now, you have a similar sort of value there as I do with Social Cohesion, except it is divided into various sub-genres where each faction can make their desires known in specific ways. I can understand the advantages there, in some ways it expands "player choice" because instead of having one set "moderator's challenge" like I would do ("Your wealthy citizens are adopting foreign habits" sort of thing, or "Your farmers want you to pick a new royal dynasty from their clans") your system allows the player to chose from a list of different internal sectors where they can curry favor.

But, personally, I think that the idea that this actually gives players more choices is illusory, in the end you are making a list and allowing them to select options. I would rather just let them do what they want, by being looser my system is designed to let me react to player actions rather than letting my players chose from options.

If you are using them for yourself, to keep track of plotlines, I'd advise you just to skim the relevant parts of your own updates.
 
I'm going to be running a NES myself - starting early next year, when I should have less commitments - based on the concept of city-states, rather than nations. The working title is "CityNES: Art of Living", and the basic concept invovles two different types of player working in pairs in each city; only one type of player sends orders, but the other gets more input into them. Do people think the idea has merit? I do have other ideas on how I could run the NES so if that's not a good one I'm perfectly happy to scrap it. :D
 
Eltain,

I like the factions inside a civ system a lot personally.
However, the stat system you propose with size/confidence/power is unclear.
Confidence and power are mostly redundant. A powerful faction with little confidence will be unable or unwilling to use its power, ergo it is not powerful. The loyalty/satisfaction with current government doesn't appear at all. The system as you describe it (The larger, more confident, more powerful factions you have in your nation, the more unstable it is) means one wants to have many small factions rather than one big, but this can only lead to internal strife and jealousy. I also wonder whether factions that are not confident in themselves can be easily influenced by outward powers, making the whole nation more unstable?
Anyway, I'd scratch the (internal) confidence and put some kind of loyalty instead.
 
I had this idea of something slightly based out on the Viva Trópico game, but with only five factions per civilization: Merchants, Soldiers, Mages, Labourers, Sages. Each of them would worship a certain god, and depending on how much those gods were worshipped, they would create several miracles, whose power would depend on how much they were worshipped by a certain group. Say, there is a war between two nations, and one of them has a lot of worshippers of the God of War, the other not so much. The God of War would then probably do things to help those that worship him. Could be better weapons for them, put the wind in their favour to make their arrows go further and faster, maybe even join the battle.

I do not have everything detailed, in fact there are few things in my idea, but I wanted to know your opinions. Thoughts?
 
SKILORD: Damn server, now I have to retype all this. While I don't think it will give them a set of options, I kind of see what you're saying. I think of it like Tabula Rasa - I am currying favor with the Religious caste, literally giving them all the control over everything. It is powerful, it is small, and it is confident. If I do something that they wouldn't like, then they'll try and stop me, I presume. Likewise, the Everybody Else faction is huge, powerless (shackled to work and given gruel at certain breaks in the work day) and probably have no confidence in themselves. (Brainwashed by the Stones religion)

All this is doing in my mind is putting that down somewhere for me and them to see. I know there are pluses and minuses to doing that, but I want to start small, and I want my workspace ordered. That's pretty much it.

LDiCesar: Some good points. As for confidence, I was actually intending that as sort of reflecting their confidence in the government. Confidence actually reflects their confidence that they could rule themselves better than you currently are, so it is sort of a gauge. The more confident they are, the less confident in you they are. I should include that in the rules.

As for the second point, I was thinking, in my all-knowing wisdom, "Divide and conquer, Eltain, That is how you keep a strongarm on your nation," but I realize now this can also lead to high instability, as in the Balkans*. Perhaps what I will go ahead and say is that you should have few, relatively weak factions, and keep them all happy.

Actually, factions that are More confident are more bold, and willing to do something to upset their government, to get what they want. Less confident factions are either scared of or happy with the government.

*I mean no offense to anyone who is from the Balkans reading this. The Internet tell me there is alot of instability in several Balkan nations.
 
Attican Empire! MilarNESII! I want!
 
I'm starting to take renewed interest in NESing, and was thinking about maybe having another go at a fantasy NES. It would be somewhat like the Sekai ones, in that players would be allowed to play as countries, groups (ranging from a guild spanning multiple countries to a small band of adventurers), and perhaps individuals. I was thinking updates that cover one month, so that smaller-scale players aren't overwhelmed and larger-scale players can still not go at an awkward pace.

I'd probably make a Pre-NES where players help shape the history of the part of the world we'll play in. This will mainly be done so I'm not working with a completely blank slate when working with the world's history. It'll help determine where certain races are located, where particular artifacts can be found, and other neat details. Plus I'll just try to make it an overall fun experience :p

Opinions or interest?
 
Sounds great! I'd be interested :D
 
I'm going to be running a NES myself - starting early next year, when I should have less commitments - based on the concept of city-states, rather than nations. The working title is "CityNES: Art of Living", and the basic concept invovles two different types of player working in pairs in each city; only one type of player sends orders, but the other gets more input into them. Do people think the idea has merit? I do have other ideas on how I could run the NES so if that's not a good one I'm perfectly happy to scrap it. :D

Because no one responded, and I HATE when no one responds, even if to say (won't play, but nice idea), to my ideas, I shall respond.

I'm guessing one player would be the "Lord" of the city, and the other player would be the "Nobles"? The Lord would send the skeleton orders and the other would send the fluff? If then, let me propose a very fun and dangerous alteration.

Spoiler :
Have 3 players per city state, three factions whose loyalties from minor factions are constantly shifting, given one or the other "Lord" status. The Lord will be limited to, oh, say 20 clauses of actions so he must be brief. Maybe he will set a budget for a certain project, claim one of his rivals the sole controller of a adventure, and inituate new ones.

Then, you can split up the 20 events among the two Nobles, perhaps letting the Lord house pursue 5 actions for himself. The two nobles, unless specifically assigned one, will write up each action: which member in their house, how they will use budjeted or household money, and hoe they will try to benefit.

The Lord of the Citystate gets to do direct diplomacy, and must use a city-state action to affirm diplomatic agreements (and a Noble gets to say how they intend to seal the deal- will they send an obnoxious fellow who will cut it off, or someone to gain them points in a faction).

All Nobles and Lord households gets household actions. This will be any city-state actions with details, along with personal deviousness. The Lord will have fewer Household actions, as they will be busy.

Example with 10 city state orders, 2 Lord Household. 3 Household Each+any random Citystate orders

City State Orders for Sarkov
1. We shall invade the city of Thloryn
2. No more than one half of our army shall follow.
3. Our Casus Belli is the poisoning of crops near our common border
4. We shall hunt down the pirates of Saltholm Islands
5. House Skorpio (InsertPlayerNameHere) shall lead this fleet
6. We will crack down on Bandits
7. We will sign an alliance(linky) with the City of Umbar
8. We will sign an agreement with the Watchmaker's Guild
9. House Tatius(INSERTPLAYERNAMEHERE shall oversee this meeting
10. We will save X amount in the Bank of Sarkov

Lord Orders: House Blackfyre
1. We will plan to assassinate the Tatian diplomat on the way to the Watchmaker's Guild. then send our own some hours late and say that the Tatians feel that they are above workers like the Watchmakers, and refused to come.
2. We will continue to build our fortified villa.

Noble Orders: House Skorpio
Recieved:
1.3.4.7.
1. Our general shall be Skorpio Exellentus, blah blah tactics blah blah go gentle
3. We will only send a messanger, appologizing for our assignment, to declare war. We want to retain our friendship with Thloryn's Watchmaker's guild
4. Our Admiral shall be Skorpio Darius, blah blah tactics blah blah capture and make part of household fleet
7. We will send Skorpio Loquatious, who will also get us more merchant contacts in the south seas
House Orders
1. We will try to gain influence among the Black Powder Guild blah blah
2. We will try to assassinate whoever gets to gather the troops for the thloryn war, so that we can delay the march.
3. We will secretly marry Skorpio Heleniscus to the Lord of Thloryn. If we can get their army to invade Sarkov we might become the next lord!

Noble Orders: House Tatius
Recieved:
2. 6. 8.10.
2. We really want to take that fertile borderland, since ours got poisoned. Along with half of our troops, raise 200 Umbarian mercenaries to help. blah blah.
6. YES! We will make a tactic seemingly defeating them, but instead we will make a secret agreement. They will march on Thloryn according to X pm agreement.
8. Meh, don't really care about them. Let them visit in our villa, so we can at least be safe from traveling assassination! Oh, there's a war? Too bad, maybe they want to assassinate one of our high-ranking diplomats traveling through a WaR ZoNE!
10. Secretly store it in our high-interest fund in the Crusades, and shift our own bank account to match, which will allow us a lower balance than they want, but still get us interest.
House Orders
1. We seriously need to blow up the Black Powder Guild, or else my heavy cavalry will be useless
2. We will try to assassinate that Skorpio Loquatious, becaue he's so good at making allies for the House Skorpio
3. We will sign contract X to get 1000 Umbarian mercenaries, 200 to go to plan 2 and 500 to hunt the bandits.


As you can see, I am enjoying myself already. :p. Is this sort of what you want?
 
The above idea has merit. Sounds a lot like a small-scale version of Realpolitik.
 
That's awesome. I think I might just have to use that. :goodjob:

Now we're cooking with, um, er...

what did they cook with in the Renaissance? :D :)p)
 
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