[BTS] Which is the hardest civ to play (on continents)?

[Handel]

What the longtime player will say - which combo civ/leader is the hardest to play on continents (large landmasses but navy warfare too)?

[Keilah]

well, i always found boudica to be pretty awful

[ecuwins]

Charlemagne on any landmass is craptastic.

[i_imperator]

Toku is pretty bad imo but his rifles can be really powerful in the industrial era and early modern

[DMOC]

Originally Posted by ecuwins

Charlemagne on any landmass is craptastic.

One of the few exceptions to this, of course, is if you're playing crowded deity pangea with aggressive civs such as Shaka and Montezuma. Then Charlemagne goes from worst to near-best, allowing you to get that crucial plains hill center + gold + corn spot before the nearest rival can get it with its third (first self-produced) settler. And of course, there's the Protective trait, useful in that regard.

[Mylene]

Id have to say Toku
Either prot. or agg is fine for defending/rushes, both traits together are very bad.
+ horsies dun benefit at all, Boudi has Cha and even Charly's Imp is more useful.
Samurais are okay but Maces have fierce tech requirements.
I also dislike starting without either hunting or Agri, takes too long improving pigs or sheeps if they are your only good food.

[Archon_Wing]

Saladin! His starting techs are lolwut and well... he has nothing besides that culture library. :S

[cbucks]

Charlie. If you play toku and can survive until rifles, then you should be golden. See latest az video

[coanda]

Both Toku and Charles have hilarious pairs of starting techs, given their general strength otherwise. They're the sort of starting techs you'd want to stick Hatty of Egypt with for balance reasons. Starting techs was obviously an area the devs chose based on historic / style considerations rather than game balance.

I don't really mind Saladin. SPI + PRO lends itself pretty well to an espionage economy (cheap castles, easy civic and religion swaps), plus SPI is just generally a very useful trait. The Madrassa makes it easy to bulb a religion tech like Theology for your own holy city, and to generate a great prophet to shrine that city - further synergy with espionage. Camel Archers I haven't seen much use for except as variety units and his starting techs are god-awful, but he's got reasonable potential.

[Zx Zero Zx]

None of the leaders are the hardest to play with. If you get good land you will do well regardless. But personally I would say Boudicrap is pretty awful.

[TheMeInTeam]

Sid, but he's not available typically (he has no traits, no uniques). Needs an xml edit to use him.

I vote for boudica too although she starts looking better than toku or charlie if resources are scarce. The mysticism + hunting tandem is just so awful and the UU/UB are pretty lackluster. She can take off later or do silly things like massed commando gunpowder with far less xp than anybody else, but it's not enough.

Toku's draft rifles are absolutely sick and he has some leverage in the medieval era. The biggest problems are IMO his starting techs and obviously long-term econ. Shale plant is an ok boost for later eras. What I like about him is that he's kind of like sitting bull in that he can claw out of those really rough starts sometimes. Those rifles are SO good though. In some capacities they beat out redcoats...probably one of the only civs where rifles are competitive with cavalry (partially because he has nothing to boost cavalry)...that is of course assuming you can even make cavalry and that there are enough cities to whip them in a timely fashion (drafting has a fixed cap; whips do not). Then again the reasonable course is to just draft rifles and whip cavalry...but toku's rifles are AMAZING.