New idea for a civilization

[MynameisOda]

Hey everyone! This is my first post to this site, though I've played Civ and perused the site for many years. I just downloaded G&K and I'm loving it!

I don't know how to mod, so before I even attempt to learn, I figure I'll throw an idea I had out and see what reactions I get. I enjoy learning about history, and one of the more intriguing civilizations I have come across was the Sea People. There are a number of theories about them, but not much is known for certain. What is known is that they terrorized early Mediterranean civilizations, especially Egypt, and likely led to the downfall of the Hittites (another civ I know many people think should be added) and Mycenaeans.

This is what has not been discovered about them (though there are plenty of theories):
-How they coordinated
-Where they originated
-How they managed to constantly fight and defeat large empires
-Who their leader/s was/were

You might wonder how such a civilization might be incorporated, but I've got an interesting idea.

Civilization: Sea People

Leader: Unknown
*Diplomacy may still be conducted, but the diplomacy screen will remain blank except for dialogue

Start Bias: Coastal

Capital City: ? (to the SP) or ??? (to everyone else)
All other cities: ??+ (to the SP; ?? for second city, ??? for third...) or ??? (to everyone else)
*City names may still be changed from their default, but the ??? will remain for other civilizations

Unique Ability: Unknown Origins

1) City information is initially unavailable to all civilizations.
*City names, statistics, graphics, and status cannot be seen by other civilizations. Only city locations, health bars, and garrisoned units are displayed. The other information may only be discovered through espionage, embassy creation in the capital, or conquering a city.

2) Demographics for the Sea People are not displayed
*The Sea People may see their own demographics.

3) The Sea People gain the immediate knowledge of all coastal cities established during the first turn.
*Only the city tile itself is revealed. The Sea People still must "encounter" any other civilization or city-state before engaging in diplomacy or receiving any benefits associated with their discovery.

UU1: Sherden Guard (Replaces Spearmen)

1) Starts with the Embarkation and Amphibious promotions

2) Starts with the Destroyer of Chariots promotion: Receives +100% combat strength during attacks on chariot units and +100% defense against ranged attacks by chariot units.

3) Starts with the Seafaring promotion: Sherden Guards are invisible to other units while embarked.
*To prevent issues, while not at war, units from other civilizations may share tiles with them; when at war, enemies units (not cities) may attack them, but the units themselves and their damage meters will remain invisible to the enemy.

4) Starts with the Amphibious II promotion: Receives a +10% combat bonus when attacking cities from the sea.

5) Starts with the Defector promotion: Defeated units have a 75% chance of defecting to the enemy. These units lose their Seafaring promotion upon defection.

6) Costs 70 production

UU2: War Ship (Replaces Trireme)

1) May be constructed from the start. Sailing does not have to be researched

2) Receives the Naval Scout promotion: +1 movement and +2 visibility.


My logic:

1) I thought it would be great to include the Sea People, despite the lack of knowledge surrounding them, because they played an important role in early history. If anyone doubts me, please look them up.
2) The Unique Ability seems accurate given that to this day, nobody knew where the Sea People came from or what happened to them (though there are plenty of theories).
3) The Sherden Guards seem like a proper inclusion. They were considered to be so powerful, that Ramses II actually employed captured units in his royal guard. They may be the reason the Sea People were able to fight so well, possibly contributing to the downfall of a number of civilizations.
4) Though they have no formal name, the Sea People did have a common ship depicted by other civilizations. Not too much is known, except that these ships were fairly powerful. I gave the attributes to this ship that seems most logical given the nature of the Sea People.


Anyone have any thoughts? I don't know if I'll ever get around to making a mod for them, and it would probably be way more difficult than most typical mods for new civilizations, but eventually I might give it a try.

[Andulias]

Welcome and congrats on your first post

1. Wrong forum. There is a special Ideas and Suggestions forum, including a Civ5 Civilizations/Leaders Wanted! thread.

2. From a historical point of view the Sea People haven't exactly done anything meaningful, and are of unknown origin. But whether they were Phoenicians or came from a branch of ancient Greeks, again, from what I remember they never appeared to be much more than sea pirates, hardly deserving of a place in this game. One can argue that they should be even considered a civilization.

3. We already have FIVE more or less seafaring people in CiV - the Ottomans, Carthage, Polynesia, England and Denmark. Do we honestly need a sixth one?

4. The proposed civ is terribly imbalanced. Not being able to see their demographics is a really bad idea, CiV is suffering from a sometimes severe information obscurity, we don't need more of that. Knowing where all coastal cities are right from the start means a stupefying amount of cash just for meeting CSs when playing on certain maps. The unique units are just freaking terminators: the 100% against chariots renders that the Sherden Guard has renders the Egyptian UU completely useless, so if you are Egypt, you are screwed. And on top of that, 75% chance to capture any defeated unit?! D you realize how ridiculously powerful that is? The War Ships are almost as ridiculously powerful, tying in well with the idea of meeting all CSs and getting all the money from them, and you can spam them without even researching Sailing?

It's some nice thinking outside the box, but I'm sorry, I just don't see this working . And I don't feel the Sea People need to be in the game in the first place. In a way, they already are, in the form of

Spoiler:

barbarian ships.

[The QC]

It does look too strong - from what I've seen, people usually have a tendency to propose overpowered uniques to the civilizations they would like added.

But Andulias, note that Defector doesn't do what you think it does - it is about Sea Peoples units that are defeated - they can go the enemy. It's the opposite of the German ability.

That aside: in my view, historically speaking, the Sea Peoples (while indeed a fascinating topic) are not much more than a powerful barbarian group. The fact that we have no city or leader names says a lot.

[The_J]

Originally Posted by Andulias

Welcome and congrats on your first post

1. Wrong forum. There is a special Ideas and Suggestions forum, including a Civ5 Civilizations/Leaders Wanted! thread.

Moderator Action: this, please use the later mentioned thread for civilization suggestions.
Thread closed.