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Old Sep 07, 2010, 06:37 PM   #21
Ahriman
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I think you need to edit it some more, for clarity.
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Also if you get to -5 gold and have 0 or less income per turn you will have a unit disbanded.
Make that "0 or less research income". If you are saying 0 or less gold income, then this does not appear to be correct.

If you have zero gold in your treasury, 11 research income, and -5 gold per turn, you will *not* have a unit disbanded. Instead, you will only get 6 research per turn.

And your post seems off: in Civ5 as well as Civ4, negative gold income can be made up with the loss of science. Civ4 makes you move the slider, Civ5 deducts it out of your science income directly.
The core mechanic is the same; making actual bankruptcy (forcing unit disbandment) a rare occurrence that only occurs when your expenses are greater than the sum of both your gold income and your research income.
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Old Sep 07, 2010, 06:52 PM   #22
lemmy101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahriman View Post
And your post seems off: in Civ5 as well as Civ4, negative gold income can be made up with the loss of science. Civ4 makes you move the slider, Civ5 deducts it out of your science income directly.
The core mechanic is the same; making actual bankruptcy (forcing unit disbandment) a rare occurrence that only occurs when your expenses are greater than the sum of both your gold income and your research income.
My point is that the two systems are separated by the removal of the sliders. I wasn't aware of the deducting from science aspect that was news to me, but the point of my post still remains, that your only way of manipulating how much money / science you get is by increasing those directly, not by just reducing the other.

And to clarify further: If you get to -5 and you're still in deficit (apparently taking into account science which I wasn't aware happened) THEN you disband a unit.

My point was mainly that disbanding of units did happen, which the poster I quoted said it didn't... as I say I didn't know about the science thing when I originally wrote the post.
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Old Sep 10, 2010, 02:39 AM   #23
remconius
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Updated the first slide with some more details.
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Old Sep 10, 2010, 03:30 AM   #24
Auncien
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bjbrains View Post
The removal of the slider definitely adds strategy and choices to the game- gold and science are no longer two sides of the same coin, but separate resources that you need to manage. It's the same reason that I love Social Policies - they make culture something with real value outside of border popping/border wars. I mean, stonehenge only does two things now: +8 culture, and +1 GE point (subject to change). To summarize: The removal of the slider is a good thing.
Agreed.
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Old Sep 10, 2010, 05:59 AM   #25
beestar
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Did you include the mechanism where surplus happiness generates Great People? That's the benefit from small empires, vs. using the happiness to grow population and empire size.
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Old Sep 10, 2010, 07:58 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by beestar View Post
Did you include the mechanism where surplus happiness generates Great People? That's the benefit from small empires, vs. using the happiness to grow population and empire size.
Happiness does not generate Great People, it generates Golden ages.
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Old Sep 10, 2010, 08:13 AM   #27
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A problem in essentially all previous civ games is that whatever uses they give you for gold are always outweighed by spending it on science. The only times when you could realistically consider using gold for anything other than pure research were when you got a huge amount of it (e.g. Great Merchant in cIV) and could max out science for a long time. You could then do fun things like, um, buy techs from the AIs? Disconnecting the two (so you CAN'T just spend it on science) means spending it on more minor things is feasible, and making that feasible means that its worth the developers time to make more of those minor things for you to spend it on.

Good all around, I'd say.
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Old Sep 10, 2010, 08:36 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by Krikkitone View Post
Happiness does not generate Great People, it generates Golden ages.
Oops, thanks for the correction.
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Old Sep 10, 2010, 11:15 AM   #29
Pazyryk
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Well, the game designers clearly read my post on this topic and responded appropriately .
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