Peace with the Aztecs?

I think this is a terrible idea. Here are the pros and cons of peace:

Pros

We get a bunch of techs this turn rather than next when the Great Library supplies them.

We get to taunt them and possible use them as a great leader factory later.

We can start attacking someone else a little earlier. However, I don't think they have much fight left in them.

We get their world map, which is probably not much better than ours, and this information can be obtained through other means.

Cons

They will start expanding again immediately, taking some of our territory.

They will probably join in a war against us later for a pittance.

We get one less city.

We have to look at a blotch of dark green in our sea of blue for awhile.



So, I move that we annhilate...err...assimilate the Aztecs rather than signing a peace treaty. The 1st and 4th reasons under Cons are the main factors in my opinion.

This discussion will last at least 24 hours, and a poll will be posted afterwards if there are dissenting opinions.

as I have said before:
KILL ZEEM!

Or.. we could get everything from a peace treaty, THEN declare war again (out side of their borders)...

Originally posted by Chieftess
Or.. we could get everything from a peace treaty, THEN declare war again (out side of their borders)...

Click to expand...

That would still ruin our reputation, and wouldn't really accomplish anything...

I say we make peace, take all we can, then destroy 'em later. They probably won't catch up for a long while, so we shouldn't have to worry too much. I could be wrong though.

I thought our reputation was ruined only if you were inside their border. I'm talking about being just on the edge (outside).

I suggest that we use them as a GL factory now... we have elites to use for the purpose, and little advantage to be gained from making peace except for the acquisition of their World Map. Equally, I don't see that we have a huge amount to gain by annihilating them. We can surely afford to keep 3 units away from the front line in the name of increasing our GL generation chances.

Culture flipping may also be more of a factor if we leave them around. Especially if they have much accumulated or a chance to accumulate much more.

Culture flipping shouldn't be too great a risk. We swiped the GLib from them almost as soon as they'd built it, and few of their cities had serious cultural value. Only Tenochtitlan, IIRC.

I think this question gets a lot easier with the GL now in our hands. There is no reason for us to make peace with the Aztec, and good reason to eliminate them.

Eklektikos is right, the difference in culture is not significant, but I do fear that as long as they exist, there is a chance of flipping. I say do away with them, and recharge our batteries for an assault on Japan.

I say wait a turn. See if the Aztecs are left with any techs the GL doesn't give us, we may decide we may not want to wait for the other 2 or the other 1 civ to get that tech before we want it. I know this may call for a shortened turn chat. Also, I think the Map offer is too great to ignore, what if we're underestimating the map the aztecs have?

well, we get anything they have anyways. so why dont we do the following:

* take all from them for peace
* wait 20? turns until the peace deal runs out
* declare war the official way and finish them off

in between, we could at any time threaten them for techs we dont get from the GL

and we could build up for a us or jap war. if we continue to split our power into this now useless war, we may end up streched too far over our landmass to be effective.

I agree that this is the most viable option, dis. Glad to see you're posting in the Citizen forums again.

btw:
eyrei: isnt the thumb-down-icon for a thread titled "peace..." a bit of prejudice? you should delete the icon to be fair and open to all options in this discussion ;-)

Keep the icon eyrei. Tlacopan is definitely in our way if the plan is to go up river. So Tlacopan has to go. I don't see any real problem with Eklektikos' plan. As we have 8 Temples being produced, the attack on Japan will have to wait. We might as we promote some units at their capital (where ever that is) while we take out Tlacopan. Once we get them down to their new capital, there won't be much of a culture threat. At that time, I say arrange a peace treaty. We may need to feed off them later.

I reckon there is no real value in letting the scum survive. They will just be a thorn in our sides later on. But there may be some value in waiting a turn or two to finish them off - as Ekleltikos and Falcon point out.

So I think no peace for a turn or 2, but if we dont swipe another tech from them by then - just finish them off.

It would be a turn or two before they were finished off no matter what. Our swords need a few turns to heal and get into position. The Azteca assault force was fairly depleted taking all of their other cities. I'd want 3 undamaged swords to take the expected 2 spear defenders out.

I'd recommend wait one turn to reap the Library benefits, make peace for everthing they have, prepare a new assault force. In 20 turns, finish off the Aztecs and move immediately upon Japan.

It's also likely we would be able to take them out sooner than 20 turns by getting them to declare war on us. They have a spearman separated from their homeland by our newly captured territory. As soon as that spear steps on our soverign soil we can demand they leave or declare war. As eyrei has said before, the AI will often declare war when it's not in their best interests, especially when they really dislike you.

This would propably be the best way, shaitan. At least as far as i believe.

The Great Library significantly reduces the spoils of this war. Most of what the Aztecs could have offered us for peace went out the window the moment they built that structure on their front lines and subsequently lost it to us in battle. I propose throwing a parade in Monty's favor as soon as we have him in custody.

Having said that, I must, nonetheless, respectfully disagree with my superior, eyrei, and support the proposition of peace. The Aztec capitol appears to be rather remote with respect to our occupied territories, so the risk of flipping is likely similarly remote, and they still have their world map, which I'd still wager is much better than ours, even now. Furthermore, is there not a diplomatic penalty for being viewed as conquerers?

Besides, we still know nothing of the Japanese homeland. An Aztec world map could prove invaluable in evaluating the potential threat that they pose as well as determining a suitable plan of attack (ie. strategic city locations, eliminating access to resources, etc.).

Our forces need and deserve rest after such a valliant campaign, and our cities should spend some time concentrating on cultural improvements to not only fill in the gaps in our borders, but to reinforce those border towns near America lest they suddenly flip!

I agree with Shaitan... we can get their Map, any techs that haven't yet been triggered with the GL, and a peace period for reinforcement and infrastructure (hopefully).