[MOD] Fall from Heaven II

Argpmait said:
Let me rephrase my questions. I like to play games where the victory conditions is set to building the Tower of Mastery. However, most of the time I am unable to complete the game because the AI workers build a lot to mana nodes of the same type (instead of building 1 of each type). This include AI workers from the other AI players as well. So, when I finally explore the entire map, I found out that I am missing a few critical mana types (not found in the entire map) and hence I cannot build the tower.

Kael, perhaps we should allow a mana node to be destroyed, and let a different mana node be build in the same spot. This was possible in earlier versions. What do you think?

Thanks a lot. BTW, thanks for making such a fun and addictive mod.

We need an AI fix that will cause it to diversify a bit better (yet stil have some chance of duplicate nodes). And a AI change that just causes workers of human players to leave mana nodes alone entirely. That the real fix we want to get in.

I wouldn't mind a workaround until we get there but I dont want to make mana nodes "resetable". If we do that we open up a lot of exploits. Players could build fire, then get the eternal flame and destory the origional node. Even worse they could set all of their nodes to one type to get the free sphere ranks on creation, then reset the nodes so they can pick other nodes as they level.

I know its up to the player if he wants to take advantage of these exploits or not but I try to avoid that kind of logic because the optimal way to play the game shouldn't include un-fun steps like this. Its also intended for multiplay so I dont want people in games having to do this stuff to stay competitive or be put at a disadvantage because they arent doing it.

Nodes of your opponents shouldnt matter much because nodes always revert to base mana on cultural conversion. So whatever your opponent makes it into you will get to reassign it if you take it over. But we do need to do some work to keep automated workers from messing with the mana.
 
Kael said:
I know its up to the player if he wants to take advantage of these exploits or not but I try to avoid that kind of logic because the optimal way to play the game shouldn't include un-fun steps like this. Its also intended for multiplay so I dont want people in games having to do this stuff to stay competitive or be put at a disadvantage because they arent doing it.

In my opinion you right Kael.... its making the game more balanced and hard.
..... so im standing y your side )))
 
@Kael

You probably don't remember but about a week ago I asked what would happen if you researched the Ashen Veil and you already had the Order established in all your cities. No one was really sure. Well I did it and the Ashen Veil holy city is founded and that city keeps the Order also. See attached save showing a Savant appearing as the Ashen Veil religion shows up in the city. I tried to build Purge the Unfaithful in order to wipe out the Ashen Veil but another civ beat me to it. I haven't tried an Inquisitor yet.

My 2 cents on the mana discussion...I'm playing on a normal sized map and mana nodes are relatively scarce. It's pretty hard to do anything with them. Maybe that's the intent and I don't get it.
 
I still don't think tower of mastery is a feasible victory condition. I think the tower should be like a cultural victory, a condition for more peaceful, builder style players. As it is, it's almost impossible to get a tower victory without eliminating at least one rival. and on smaller maps you're likely to get a domination victory before you can get all the mana sources.

I think it might help to have a world wonder tied to each type of mana that will provide one or two mana of that source, and does not have a mana pre-req. If they all come within a tech or two, or perhaps on several different paths of the tech tree you wouldnt have to worry about one civ being able to builder the majority of them and it would allow you to plan ahead to know what wonders you'll need for the mana you lack.
 
I agee with Good Sauce. I try to play a peaceful style but find it very difficult when I try for a tower victory. I usually end up going for a cultural victory. More mana nodes would help.
 
Ankhman said:
More mana nodes would help.

I don't like the idea of having more nodes, as they are 'dead squares' since nodes provide no bonus. a mana node is essentially a tundra square in your fat cross.
 
Its not like we are talking about doubling the amount of nodes. And even if Kael did, that would mean like ~7 more "BARREN" fields on a map with like 500 fields all together.
 
Something else I'd like to see implemented, but I am unsure how feasible it is, when a race ask you to break diplomatic ties with another race and you say no you take a penalty for doing so. I'd like to see you getting a bonus with the race you chose not to break ties with, It makes sense because the aforementioned race would be just as appreciative you didn't break ties as the one is mad at you for not doing so.
 
With the tower victory I recently won I game with the Tower and I still hade about five opponents left. The main way to win this way is to take Holy Cities and trading with the computer.
 
There are 9 buildings that provide mana (not including the palaces). If you somehow manage to get all of them and you have 3 from your palace that only leaves 2 nodes left. There is also a ritual that creates more mana nodes in the world.

Now thats extremly unlikely. Some of those buildings are extremly hard to get at and they are all wonders.

What I may do is increase some of those buildings to give 2 of the mana type so you have one for you and one for trade. Hopefully that will open the AI to a bit more trade too.
 
Something else I'd like to see implemented is a "patrol" button. Exact same as explore but only within your cultural borders
 
thomas.berubeg said:
I fell stupid asking this, but how do i get divinity promotions?

If by this you mean the "Divine" promotion, AFAIK you cannot promote units to have them. The only way they are available is by building a unit that starts with it. Such units include all of the priest units for different religions (Research Priesthood), and possibly a few heroes.
 
Fireballs & Unit Lost Statistics ...

I love playing with Archmages who can cast 3 Meteor Fireballs, that can be hurled at enemy stacks in town to cost large collateral damages. However, there seems to be a problem with the new statistics package with respect to fireballs. Each fireball is considered a "Unit" and each time the Archmage cast 3 fireballs, he chalked up "3 unit lost". So fighting with the archmage will increase the "Unit Lost" statistic, although in actual fact no real unit is lost. Fireball should technically be considered as a spell, and not as a unit lost.

I know we incoporatre a separate mod for comuting and displaying the stats. However I wonder if there is a way to define fireball, so that it is not a unit.

Thanks.
 
Theoretically, I could exclude summoned units from certain statistics, but I don't know which. Should battles fought by summoned units be tracked at all? People might be interested in knowing how long their Host of the Einherjar has survived so far, thus I think combat tracking can be useful for summoned units. Another possibility would be to track the unit statistics of summoned units, but prevent them from updating the player statistics. Any thoughts?
 
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