Shoshone starting_defense_units are...pathfinders. Overpowered?

Tatran · Jan 4, 2016

At King level and higher the AI gets extra starting units, 1 or 2 defense units and 1 exploring unit.
For the Shoshone all units will be pathfinders which means 2 pathfinders at King, 3 at Emperor and 4 at Immortal and Deity.
Spoiler shows 3 pathfinders at Emperor.
A lot of stuff in civ5 is imbalanced (starting locations, natural wonders, etc.), but this is imo clearly overpowered.

Spoiler :

Aea · Jan 4, 2016

Would rather have Attila as a neighbor then Shoshone on Deity TBH. But yeah that's pretty broken.

Sclb · Jan 4, 2016

Except Shoshone is nowhere as aggressive as Attila.

Aea · Jan 4, 2016

Sclb said:
Except Shoshone is nowhere as aggressive as Attila.

I find military aggression a bit easier to deal with then Pocatello taking every usable inch of land. Might just be me.

joncnunn · Jan 4, 2016

Remember that the AI doesn't really take advantage of the Pathfinder's ability to choose a specific item, but just picks one randomly.

It's basically merely starting with Warriors that ignore movement cost.

Illianor123 · Jan 4, 2016

joncnunn said:
Remember that the AI doesn't really take advantage of the Pathfinder's ability to choose a specific item, but just picks one randomly.

Pretty much this, they just start with X number of warrior strength scouts.
The main annoying thing is just the border explosion from founding cities.

Thormodr · Feb 3, 2016

joncnunn said:
Remember that the AI doesn't really take advantage of the Pathfinder's ability to choose a specific item, but just picks one randomly.

It's basically merely starting with Warriors that ignore movement cost.

I am not sure that is much better. I'd rather see the AI play intelligently and leverage its special ability correctly.

fyar · Feb 4, 2016

Aea, no it's not just you. I also would rather spawn next to Attila than Pocatello for the very same reasons. Especially in Deity, where he might have 3 cities encroaching on my turf by the time I'm settling my 2nd city.

Chum · Feb 5, 2016

And yet people manage to win vs pocatello quite handily, so it must not be too overpowered.

Although, honestly, at the levels you're talking about, you're going to be behind in military within 30 turns anyway, so there's really no point in sweating the small things like what scouts they start with.

beetle · Feb 8, 2016

joncnunn said:
Remember that the AI doesn't really take advantage of the Pathfinder's ability to choose a specific item, but just picks one randomly.

I thought it was actually worse than that! I remember reading here that the Shoshone AI has no idea how to navigate the choices -- so the Pathfinder never gets anything! They still eat up the huts like any AI.

ShakaKhan · Feb 8, 2016

joncnunn said:
Remember that the AI doesn't really take advantage of the Pathfinder's ability to choose a specific item, but just picks one randomly.

It's basically merely starting with Warriors that ignore movement cost.

But does the AI treat their units defined as scouts differently than those defined as military units? In other words, if Pocatello starts with more "scout" units, will they not have a higher tendency to favor hut-popping as opposed to map revealing and making contact with civs/CS's? I don't play with huts on, but have noticed that Pocatello is considerably less likely to declare war in the very early game, even when they are in a favorable position to do so. Is this completely due to his war flavoring, or does the fact that he doesn't recognize his UU as military potential factor in?

Chum · Feb 8, 2016

ShakaKhan said:
But does the AI treat their units defined as scouts differently than those defined as military units? In other words, if Pocatello starts with more "scout" units, will they not have a higher tendency to favor hut-popping as opposed to map revealing and making contact with civs/CS's? I don't play with huts on, but have noticed that Pocatello is considerably less likely to declare war in the very early game, even when they are in a favorable position to do so. Is this completely due to his war flavoring, or does the fact that he doesn't recognize his UU as military potential factor in?

That could actually be on to something.

Ever notice how your workers are ALWAYS safe from enemy scouts? Ever notice how a scout's only recourse to getting attacked is to fortify immediately and take the beating when they could VERY easily run away from most units?

The AI may not consider it's scout units to be actual military. Military units sure do not respond like that.

beetle · Feb 8, 2016

^^As I understand it, there is a “war stance” and “explore stance” and that Pathfinders, unlike scouts, can go into war stance. So while other AI will never poach your workers with scouts, Pathfinders will. That said, I have never seen Pocatello attack cities with Pathfinders.

Shoshone starting_defense_units are...pathfinders. Overpowered?

Tatran

Deity

Aea

Prince

Sclb

Emperor

Aea

Prince

joncnunn

Senior Java Wizard

Illianor123

Warlord

Thormodr

Servant of Civ

fyar

Prince

Chum

King

beetle

Deity

ShakaKhan

King

Chum

King

beetle

Deity

Similar threads