Von Münchhausen II

Turn 120 125 AD adopted
I steal a worker near Coventry and set Si Satch on growth at the cost of gpt and a slight hit in production, but we get a massive food boost for that. Now it's time to get some pop for specialists. (I disbanded that worker next turn, could have made a road to Coventry but its only 2 pop and we can connect it later)

Turn 121
Golden Age!! We've gone from +1 to +31 gpt inclusing the new market in Sukhothai. > PT. 9 turns now the mine just finished. Yay.
And a lot of trading to do. All the horses are back.

I put 250 in Sydney before I forget, was 62/60.

NE situation actually isn't that bad. I will push on York.

2 iron for 2 horses from Catherine. She also has our other 4 horses for 130 + 30x1. The other civs are quite broke. I will let US save soem money for our marble. Although I don't like Washington already (he killed Cape Town!!)
Spoiler :


I sign RA with Suleiman.
Spoiler :


Turn 122
Policy is in. Legalism and we get 4 wats. Machinery drops a turn from 5 to 4.
I kill an archer around Muang with a NE that I am conservatively leaving there in case of counter attack. Probably not needed but anyway.

Muang Circus > catapult 5 turns

Turn 123
Elizabeth enters renaissance. How, Astronomy? I hope, don't wanna see longbows at all. She throws a coupel of archers and a pike our way.
Marble is back. I can't really sell it for anything good, and it's our only copy. We maybe might need it when we take England anyway but we are 23 happy now.
Si Satch has grown to 7. 7 turns til another.

Turn 124
Washington wants us to declare on Catherine in 10 turns. I say no. I fear he will take over her lands.
England and Egypt sign a RA. Too little too late lady.

Turn 125
Scout notices Suleiman has many iron units. There are more in the fog around Istanbul.
Spoiler :


Englands has some small resistance. I think I've got it covered. Oh Im going for it!! bit risky but Liz now only has archers guarding her core towns and weakened pikes near our borders

Egypt and Ottomans are now friends

Turn 126
Ramesses builds Angkor Wat. Ottomans and India sign a RA. Hastings grows to 4. Hastings finishes Market > Granary
Machinery goes to Metal Casting.
Some more pikeys pop up but my NEs are pretty tough. 3 have attacked York now and done major damage.
Hastings is cultural expanding in stupid places. I'm tempted to buy the river grassland but it's 130 gold. So I build a lumber mill around Hastings for want of something better to do

Turn 127
Washington builds the PT!!! bah.
We have 2 Xbows now. 1 defensive and 1 on the front but the defensive 1 can move up to Canterbury later.

Muang catapult > catapult
Sukhothai goes on granary then and quite growth oriented. I put 2 guys in Wats.

York is ours :clap: puppeted.
Spoiler :


Turn 128
Ghandi wants in on Elizabeth too the cheap skate. He declares.
Scout sees Grand Mesa down near Ottoman lands. Sydney will like that.
Spoiler :


Lots of XP for our elephants, 3 upgrades this turn. Naresuan geezer :cool: I never really know what to get but I will stick to the line we chose before. OK 2 x drill II and 1 x Drill I + medic. Earlier I made a shock II.

I was an idiot and overextended my catapult thinking it was on the safe side of the river. A pike hit it, but it survived. That pike lost his life to a Xbow, but the cat had to pull back to Muang. to heal.

I'm healing up ready to hit London.

Metal casting is done and we go physics. Chemistry bulb soon.

Granary in Sukhothai is done. I don't know what to build. I'd get an aqueduct but that is more of an economy game, so I build an Xbow instead. We can build Oxford Wat, but maybe we want to use it later.

Si satch. market > water mill.

Turn 129
Met Lhasa. Cultured, Hostile, Ottoman.

Liz offers everything for peace. I say no. I hope Egypt doesn't sneak attack us. But it seems like he's going for Canterbury.

Our catapult gets promoted after his run in with the Pike. I give him siege.

Turn 130 375 ADmy games getting well buggy. I cant see tile icons and popups arent occuring.
But what I can see.
Muang, Sukhothai and Si Satch all grow.

Hastings finished granary and goes onto Water Mill.
Si Satch puts guys in the Wat and goes back on CdP after the growth. This can all be changed of course for the next player.
Sukhothai is still on food.

There are some elephants that can get within ranged attack of London that can still move. It depends on the next if they want to or not or move all at once.

The front.
Spoiler :
 

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Good going! I like the screenshots as well.

I had a look at the save, but it's pretty straightforward, not an awful lot to discuss.
Personally I would have engaged our scout-archer in the war as well, let him get XP for extra range and logistics.
Maybe I was a bit misunderstood with my 'slow grind' remark. In part it was meant about getting the crossbows XP, as a ranged unit with extra range and logistics is very useful in Civ 5. In a one unit per tile system it makes a difference to get an extra attack in from the same tile.
A road to York would be useful. It would also connect London, I have no doubt we'll get that city soon. I believe it's Gozpel next? Yes, it's you, Gozpel.

Does anybody know why it says on the diplo screen for India that they backstabbed America? I thought backstabbing was war?
 
Nicely done Brichals.

Shame about the PT but I'm not that bothered to be honest. I didn't particularly think we'd get it anyway.

I'd advocate workshops as the next build in some of our cities at least. notably Muang and Sukho. Sukho could also get an Aqueduct and the GP boost buildings IMO.

Hastings should stop working that sheep and work the much better deer tile (+1:c5food: +2:c5gold:).

We get our next SP in 7 turns. I see 3 options.
1. Landed Elite for increased growth in our capital.
2. Monarchy for more gold and :) from our capital.
3. Open Patronage for better value CSs.

Patronage is really good if we plan on using more CSs and our UA. I guess we probably want to decide if we plan on finishing Tradition. I would say no. No point in using SPs up just to get the finisher (Oligarchy and Aristocracy leave me a little cold).

I would also like to say that the vanilla GUI is rubbish. Really really rubbish.
 
It's looking great.

So we are researching Physics, aiming for Chemistry, so we need Steel and Gunpowder too before bulbing?

Next SP could be any of those grandad mentioned or even Reformation in Piety, I like golden ages.

I'm going to try to take London before Ghandi gets there. Our cities can build workshops or stables, what do we want first? If there is missing a granary somewhere I slot that in too.

A couple of deals will finish during my turns, I try to renew them. We are close to getting another Great General 320/400, what are the plans for him?

Optional, yes it's funny how Ghandi backstabbed America, Cathy has that too.
 
Maybe they have signed a 10 turns to DoW deal? Didn't think that counted as a backstab and also I don't think Gandhi would be up for that. Could just be a bug.

I'd only build stable if a city is going to get at least 2 hammers from it. Hastings should I guess.

Its occurred to me if we bulb Banking or whatever we'll open up Freedom as an SP choice. We get a GSci in 14 I think so thats not a huge delay on Chemistry. With all our Wats Freedom is quite attractive.
 
I don't understand this backstab thing in this case. I'm not even playing Civ 5 that much, but when I do I often see things I can't make heads or tails of.

We are drowning in scientists! We definitely need a bit more planning. We can build Oxford, I think we overlooked, so I'm bolding it. Oxford gives a free tech as well, remember. We still have a scientist hanging around the ladies toilets at Sukhothai and another on the way?
I recommend we make a plan for using them, that's what they're there for.

Also we can build the Great Treasury or whatever it's called for extra gold. Both Oxford and Great Treasury should be built with priority, before any more generic buildings.

Also Gozpel should have a look at our trading opportunities. We have 2 gold luxuries, Suleiman is friendly and has the money, so that should work. Luxes we only have a single of we could also look into, if somebody's willing to pay the full whack.
 
The National Treasury is ok, but when the cost gets real high I tend to pass on it. The national wonders I almost never pass on are NC, Ironworks, and Oxford, but I know there is a lot of different opinions about the values of each national wonder. Whatever national wonders we want though should be a priority right now 'cause of the +30 hammers tacked on with each new puppet and the opportunity cost with regard to annexing. I like whipping out workshops right now.

I'm going to cast my vote for happiness oriented social policies. I like Honor and Monarchy right now.

I don't know what's up with the back-stab stuff. My guess would be that Gandhi befriended Washington (like he did with every other civ) and then denounced him after the Cape Town incident?
 
So we have weird backstab notifications. Maybe washington asked Ghandi to make peace with Elizabeth then he broke it? Or maybe the game has screwed up?


I would also like to say that the vanilla GUI is rubbish. Really really rubbish.
I must say in my game the last 3 turns were weird. Tile yields were bizarre, popups were not showing. I don't think I got fail gold for PT, it certainly didn't indicate in the popup that I did. I think Si Satch grew slightly faster and has more production than it should. Strange things. I couldn't see the tile yields in my citizen management screen. (but i normally play epic speed so maybe I was just surprised by the pace here. Maybe I was paying too much attention on the war).

I'm just saying in case this problem carries over in the save. I've never seen this before and I assume it would be fixed with a restart.
 
Perhaps you just had some weird glitches. Grandad was probably talking about something different, like meaning the interface is unhelpful with information. That is simply true. I sometimes play with 'Smoothpack', which makes slight interface modifications, like in the top bar it will not say +32 :c5science:, but Chivalry 6 turns, which is much more helpful.
It probably won't get better much with Gods & Kings, looking at the preview shots, they've added some Jugendstil curls to the corners and made some more graphical tweaks, but I didn't see signs of the interface becoming more helpful. Do the people who design the interface play the game at all? Maybe not.
 
Do the people who design the interface play the game at all? Maybe not.

I'm going with no. Why for example does the SP counter in the top bar not say the number of turns till the next policy? Why is there no counter till the next GP in the top bar? Why is there no easy table to see who has what to trade and will buy our goods?!

Luckily I have a group of mods I use that address these issues.

Back to the game in hand.

I would hold off on Oxford till we want it for something like Rifling or Dynamite. It could be combined with the upcoming GSci to get to Rifling pretty quick actually.

As for the plan with our GSci we have at the moment, I thought it was for Chemistry? Or did you mean all our future GSci. I really depends on our VC. If its Science then I would hold them to blast through the last few expensive techs. If Domination then to get the key military techs sooner than the AI to leverage that advantage.

So what I'm saying is should we vote on our VC?
 
I think of the nearby techs chemistry makes most sense as that actually improves our empire with hammers. Fertilizer is another one but then there are some other techs around there which are good. That's how I normally play anyway.

I would think we go for domination. Just because it will be faster. I think science would be more fun but maybe a snoozefest. Really only USA and Ottomans have any chance of challenging us now it seems.
 
I would probably go domination as well. Without Rationalism and the PT for RA spam, science will be a bit slow. If we play this right we can role in to India then Egypt in short order.
 
Ok, domination it is then.

How about this techpath: Physics 4t - Steel 5t - Gunpowder 9t - bulb Metallurgy - bulb Chemistry - time Oxford Wat with the finish of Metallurgy and then take Rifling as free tech? Atm Oxford will take 12 turns. This could be done in 18 turns.

So I will finish off the crossbow in Sukhotai, then start Oxford. The other cities should go unit - building - unit and so on, then we get both in due time.

Monarchy as the next SP? I do like Reformation, but we can save that to when we have more cities.

I'll play in a few hours and if noone objects, I play it this way. After all, it's mainly for me to focus on London right now, and Monarchy as SP is almost never wrong.
 
Always forgetting the time-differences, I leave my turns until tomorrow.

Better get some input, but I do think my plan is pretty solid. Noone but me wants Reformation, it's really a good time to get some extra money and faster workshops/stables?

So, wake up, you lazy buggers. :) While I'm off to bed.
 
I would think Reformation also. Monarchy is nice but I don't think we will get Sukhothai so big if we are going for domination.

The tech plan looks good.
 
I'm glad Grandad brought up the victory question. I've always found the victory conditions in any game of Civ pretty uninspired, most of them lead to the same type of strategies, the route to the finish is always a very long one and with a good start the late game often lacks a challenge. I'd love to be able to start with a seafaring civ and go for an 'own all whales' quest and claim victory that way, but Firaxis are probably not going to spice up the game with more inspired options like that.
I've only played one solo game of Civ 5 to an end myself, a game as Korea where I never expanded beyond two towns and settled for a diplo victory. It was fun, but most games I don't play further once I've taken out a few neighbours and I feel I'm on a safe route.
So I'm not an expert when it comes to victory conditions, I have little clue about 'saving scientists' for science victories and that type of thing. It sounds boring to me, I wouldn't want to do that in a solo game. Succession Games I find a bit easier to stick to, without them I would hardly finish any game.

I think getting some high value techs on that lower tech path now with our scientists/free techs to chose is a good plan. For later techs we'll have more scientists then, if I'm not mistaken we have both Great Library and Oracle in our capital, + the possibility to put citizens as scientists in our Wats, so the first few scientists will come really fast.

I'll need another look at the save before I can speak about policies, but I'm unlikely to have a strong opinion one way or the other.

We can maybe leave Canterbury and hope Egypt will take that at some point. They've been very interested in Canterbury all game, it's unclear why, but there are always Egyptian units around it. So if that's the English town we are leaving on the map there is hope Egypt will eliminate England - that would be one civ less to hate and denounce us, as that's the only thing Elizabeth will do to us as long as she's still alive.
Why is there no counter till the next GP in the top bar? Why is there no easy table to see who has what to trade and will buy our goods?!
I believe the turns til next SP are showing if you hover your mouse over it. The resource situation I find very difficult to make out. It gives your 'available resources' somewhere, but I never know whether a lux is a spare one or not. In a solo game I often just sell a lux and then I see happiness going down or not and then I know, but it's difficult to make out before that with all the CS's and deals I've got going on all the time.
 
Plan sounds good gozpel? What units you going to build? Pikes would be good for upgrading to rifles.

I don't really see Reformation as all that great. Ok the GA is nice but we only have wonders in one city so the 33% culture boost isn't all that. Ultimately I won't mind whatever SP you choose out of the ones mentioned.
 
I have played through 7 turns, which took me over 2 hours...with notes and screenshots and all that.

But atm, I can't get the damn stuff uploaded.

So sorry guys, we have to wait another day.

"teaser" We are good!
 
Preturn: I wish we could've kept those 2 abandoned workers for a couple of turnsets, so much to do.
Rearrange some citizens in our cities,
Sukhotai growth in 10 instead of 15
SiSatch will get watermill in 3 turns, grows a bit slower so Muang can borrow a farm and Muang go 15 to 10
Hasting will lose one turn on the watermill, but will grow in 5 instead of 15. Good call of me there. :)

Move Muangs crossbow towards the front, will take him a few turns to get there, we need a road to York.

Most units are out of moves, move the couple of NE's closer to London.

Check trading, Suleiman buys Gold for 240g.

Turn1: Move units around closer to London. Warzaw wants a Great Artist.
Muang catapult -> granary.

Turn2: Suleiman wants to be friends, I decline.

Move general into my pack outside London, kill a redlined pike with NE.
Crossbow and 2 NE'S takes out half of Londons health. One NE is in a bad position, we might lose him as a hidden archer came and took out 2 points. But, ah well.

AI is either poor or guarded, so no deals. I rather keep the happiness we have now.

Turn3: Physics -> Steel, one turn faster than when I started, dunno how that happened?
Crossbow and 3 NE's takes London.


Move slightly hurt units towards Nottingham, the NE next to the city is our Medic,
fantastic move...or maybe not.

Lissy will give us Canterbury and Warwick, apparently an island city and everything else, so if we take Nottingham we might get Warwick and everything, while Egypt take her new capitol. Wouldn't that be nice.

Then I see this:



"This is the wrong way to Tipperary, it's the wrong way to go", so I see what he give me for our extra Gold. Hmm, straight cash 189g or

177g plus his OB?
Weird deal, but I take the latter. I send down a catapult towards Canterbury and buy a crossbow in Muang. I'm not taking any chances, better losing 460g now than 5 units later or even a city. So Canterbury is protected for now I hope and we still have 855g in the bank. And 460g is about what I earnt these few turns already, so we haven't lost any.

Getting closer to another SP, I'm going to take the Golden Age. Noone really objected and since we will need money for upgrades, I think this is the best way to go. Almost thinking of buying walls in Canterbury, but I believe we're safe.

Almost afraid of pressing enter. :) I like it when it happens though, you never know...

Turn4: Egypt was trying to backstab us, I think, but our 2 units in the area made him decide to walk north again, losing like 5 turns? Clever AI to know when he's outmanouvered.

IT Ghandi wants to be friends again, no thanks.

And as I said, we have a new General. Getting pinged IT, got us just over the points, next General is at 3/600 atm. As noone said ANYTHING about the general, even if I mentioned it twice, I might use him for an 8-turn golden age. We don't really have the option to go 2-army against India, as they have a bucket full of Knights and pikes and the random rabble. I keep him for now, though.

Crossbows and a catapult kills a mindless pike, he should've been protecting Canterbury as a bunch of Egyptians are going there.
But no, he just wanted to mess with OUR plans. Units moves closer to Nottingham.

SiSatch finally made that watermill and starts granary. I'm not obsessed with units yet, we need infrastructure as we grow.

Turn5: Understand that my statement on Oxford was in golden ages, we slip 5 turns to 17! That can't happen and I sacrifice our General for an 8-turn golden age. Beat me with a stick if you want to, but this is an important decision and I made it.

I see an annoying archer near Canterbury and decide to kill it, just to help the Egyptians a bit and save my units IT.

Micro Cap to 13 turns on Oxford, still growing in 4t.

Sell OB to Suleiman for 50g, sell Gems to Cathy for 240g. We lose a bit of happiness, but that will change in 2 turns.

Smack Nottingham with what we have, they're down to 1/3 of their strength. Me gonna get it next turn, me thinks.

Muang granary -> workshop. Next player can build the units.

OK, here's the situation, can I take it?



Turn6: Well, I did.



I ask Lizzy for peace and take what I can get:



We take the deal and sell Warwick to Japan:



If we take out India, we'll get a good score in science I think.



Turn 7: Hit the Golden age, we would get 5 happy from the other one, but stuff it we need money and we'll get
it NOW!

Intense turns and I go cruising now, it took me 2 hours to make this piece of dirt. So far.

We finished steel btw, so gunpowder in 8 turns.

Turn8: Oh my, Lizzy again...She never stops.



Gems to Suleiman and Washington ends, I don't know if we want to trade our gems for fur with America, I let
next player decide.

Turn9: We meet Budapest E of Russia.

Turn10: Cathy completes Machu Picchu and Japan denounces us.

That's it, not perfect timing but: Oxford finishes in 5 turns, Gunpowder in 4 and we get another GSci in 4 turns too.

Demographics last turn.

 

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